Why aren't you shitlords buying Secret Empire?!

>>92208906
I'm not buying Secret Empire because they wasted 12 issues of Thunderbolts building it and the team isn't a big part of the actual event while Champions and nuWasp are.

Because I'm not stupid enough to buy a 9 part event + tie-ins when I can wait for the hardcover.

I'm pretty fucking stupid, but not THAT stupid.

>>92208906
Because I hate event comics

>>92208906
Because I would rather read a comic where Batman has a button.

>>92208906
Isn't this that DC blowhard, who is always looking to talk shit about Marvel? He's obviously biased.

>>92208906
I don't think calling me a shitlord is gonna convince me to buy your book Nick

>>92208906

Cause Marvel is dead to me

>>92209065
No, he told the truth when DC wasn't selling during DCYou.

Retailers in general are upset with Marvel because they're publishing trash. Fucking Amazing Spider-Man only sold 62k last month. That's awful.

I'm too busy spending all my money on old paperbacks.

>>92208906
more people are buying it more than they are The Bottom

Biggest reason is that it hasn't given me a reason to give a fuck. It's about as by the numbers predictable as it gets.

The most interesting thing so far was some dude spitting up an entire lunchbox.

>>92209065
But is he wrong?

>>92208906
I don't buy floppies+I didn't fall for Spencer's clickbait writing

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>>92208906
>Civil War II #0 (Marvel) - 177,283
>Secret Empire #0 (Marvel) - 162,718

>Batman #21 Lenticular Ed. (DC) - 130,216
>Batman #21 (DC) - 89,256
>Total - 219,472

>Flash #21 Lenticular Ed. (DC) - 107,037
>Flash #21 (DC) - 67,766
>Total - 174,803

Why didn't you protect his smile, /co/?

WHY?!!!!

>>92209021
I'll add that generally I'm not crazy about it becoming a big event and that has killed a lot of my interest. The Steve ongoing was good, but for the ending of this saga they really don't need to have fucking Champions and all this other shit I just have no interest in. I don't care about those characters. I just like Steve and Zemo being gay and keikaku. It should have been a small ending crossover to mirror Standoff.

>>92209004
I honestly feel bad for Thunderbolts fans. That entire volume was completely pointless, the inclusion of Songbird and return of Jolt were completely pointless and all it did was put Moonstone, Atlis and Fixer right back where they were in Pleasant Hill being villain army blob. It all went nowhere

>>92209296
don't take this bait, children

>>92208906
Because i dont buy comics im not interested in. Whsts the point when Marvel basically damaged controlled saying everything wont matter.

>Reading Marvel events
>ever

>>92209438
I don't understand people like you. He was always going to get zapped back. The point is seeing how he'll lose (probably just Zemo betraying him tbqh).

>>92208906
why should I buy comics from a company that's trying to force sjw shit down my throat

>>92209470
knowing how it's going to end ahead of time, shockingly, does not make people more interested

>>92209732
I guess that's my point. You already knew it would end that way because of common sense and the fact that they were releasing Legacy news that made it clear the status quo was the same. Why would them announcing it as well change anything?

>>92209297
Don't be, as a fan of Busiek/Nicenzia/Ellis-bolts, I can honestly say I didn't even touch the book mostly because of the art and story (not to mention Brevoort idiot comments about the original run). I just pretend this debacle doesn't exist

>>92209816
I dunno, maybe people just don't get hyped up for predictable stories anymore
>inb4 some snide comment about the MCU

I avoid events.

I did decide to read it because of the drama though. It wasn't that bad. I really like the art. Though the idea of using a shield to keep people in space out doesn't make a lot of sense to me when they have a space and time teleporter.

>>92210190
>America can teleport
>Monica is literally made of light so light-permeable force fields shouldn't stop her anyway
>the Ultimates have Galactus on speed dial

>>92208906
Because it's boring.

HydraSteve took over America with no struggle or troubles whatsoever (Just like Hitler and Trump! So deep! XXDDD). The universe bends over backwards for this plot to work. At this point, Steve losing would make no ass sense since he managed to flawlessly takeover and brainwash the ENTIRE Nation.

Plus the whole event is just the minority and legacy heroes (like Sam Wilson and Miles Morale) teaming up to take down Captain America. The whole event is made to shill a bunch of failed shitty heroes that no one loves. NO ONE wants Sam Wilson as Captain America. But Spencer and is so butthurt that he wants to make Steve look bad to shill Sam. Which failed because people prefer a Hydra to BLM.

>>92209138
See>>92209219

>>92208906
events are dumb and spencer isn't that good a writer

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>yfw it was the rest of the Inhumans dragging down the sales

>>92208906
Because I'm a tradewaiter and only buy floppies for things that need the support like Nova ;-;. I might get the hardcover collection for it down the line if it turns out good overall. I like Spencer's Captain America run, but it's got the same problem as Hickman's Avengers/New Avengers. I like it, but it's just too decompressed to justify buying it. I wasn't going to buy like 4 volumes of omnibuses for one long, drawn out story for Hickman, and I'm not going to buy 4-5 trades for one long drawn out story for Spencer's Cap.

>>92210301
How would it make no sense? Zemo's just going to betray him and steal the cube once he accepts his husbando doesn't really love him.

>>92210460
Steve doesn't have the cube for Zemo to steal

>>92209219
Hey, I've bought every issue of The Fix, bought the hardcover for Superior Foes of Spider-man, a couple trades of Morning Glories and most of the issues of his Ant-man run.

Sorry Spencer, but I don't buy event comics on principle.

>>92210476
Aren't the pieces getting gathered? Eventually that will finish and Zemo will take it.

>>92209219

Because he's a nasty snide prick.

>>92210476
He has 7 of the 8 pieces, and like half the event is going to be about Steve trying to get the last piece from Pymtron before the Underground can get it.

>>92209065

You can take some comfort in the fact that all other comics media is bias in favor of Marvel.

>>92210540
They already have all but one of the pieces. The problem is that Pym has the final piece.

>>92209855

The fuck did Brevoort say now?

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>>92209219
>fucking FLASH sold more than Marvel's last attempt at comicbook relevance

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>>92208906
One More Day. I will never EVER buy a Marvel comic for the rest of my life.

Frankly it's Spencer. I will not buy a single issue writen by this piece of shit of a person anymore.

>>92210850
The thing that gets me here is that it really did not need to be a huge event and I have no idea how they are supposed to fill 9 issues with the story we've been getting. It has been nice as a single plot in a single book. Let it be that while you push something bigger like the X-Men Revival as the main thing.

What the fuck is wrong with Marvel that they did not for foresee this?

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>>92208906
I have grown to distrust Marvel's event comics. These events are all billed as huge world-changers that change the Marvel universe as we know it. A classic character will be killed of, then they'll get a successor for a while. But eventually they'll come back due to high demand by fans and the new title selling even softer than what it was before. The plot is usually full of holes, and it's a cluster of trying to get some page time for all the characters involved. And don't forget about all those new #1s. What a great starting point for new fans to dive into Marvel, after the status quo has been changed and it's so easy to follow.

>tl;dr
Marvel events are overhyped, uninteresting to follow, and change things needlessly.

I haven't bought a Marvel title since Doom War. Anything I've read has been story-times on /co/

>>92210913
>Issue 1 as is
>Issue 2 check in with the heroes stuck in New York
>Issue 3 what's going on in space
>Issue 4 get the last cube piece from Pymtron
>Issue 5 Steve starts enacting his final Cosmic Cube solution
>Issue 6 Hydravengers shake off their brainwashing/mind control and go have words with Steve, Thor picks up his hammer again before they get their asses kicked
>Issue 7 Natasha kills Steve, Miles takes the blame
>Issue 8 THINGS FALL APART because Hydra is still in control but now they don't have the moderating influence of Steve
>Issue 9 final battle with cosmic-powered Madam Hydra, Cosmic Cube rewrite at the end, things would've been fine if we just talked things out with Steve
there you go

>>92210223
I mean tbf, teleportation would be one of the first things I would want a defensive shield thats primary function is to stop alien invasions to do. No point in a wall if the aliens just pull a >teleportsbehindyou bullshit.

I wonder what stops them from just blowing the moon up though.

>>92210850
Looks like it's time for Marvel to start sending out "free" overships then. How will they blame DC for this one?
>if other publishers didn't put out books people want to read more then out events would sell more

>>92211239
maybe Spencer will just go off the deep end and start blaming Alan Moore and returnability

>>92208906
First of all, it's five bucks. I ain't paying five bucks for a shitty event just to read about Captain Trump vs the Minority Revolution that will be retconned after. I'd rather read about Superman vs Manchester Black.

>>92209219
>Lenticular Ed.
The fuck is this?

>>92211489
An image that changes when you look at it from a different angle.

>>92211489
Holographic cover

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>>92210973
>mfw I was part of that collage

>>92211489
It has an effect where when you move the cover the picture changes. Sometimes it's called 3D or holographic.

>>92211500
>>92211506
>>92211526
>DC thinking they can boost sales with this kind of gimmick
They're absolutely right, I already want one now.
I fucking loved that 90's comics that had holographic covers.

>>92211526
>>92211506
hory shit that sounds cool

>>92211632
it was pretty neat, it goes back and forth between Batman and Flash holding Comedian's button

>>92211660
man, no wonder people were picking that up instead of Spencer's bullshit. I would pick that up too.

>>92211620
I had one in my hands, it was the same price as the regular one, and I bought the regular one.

>>92211660
The new Batman one is also pretty rad. It's E2 Batman looking over a dead Martha and Bruce, but it switches to Reverse Flash standing over a dead Nora and crying Barry.

. I have a short list of comic creators and editors so toxic I refuse to support their work ever again. Nick Spencer has quickly climbed to the top of that list. Even ahead of the dyke who writes America and the muzzie who writes Ms Marvel. Waid's social media is moving him closer to that list as well.

So far, the top dick wads on my Never Buy list are Spencer, anything edited by Tom Breevoort and anything published by Avatar. That's mostly because of that cuck Rich Johnson whose gossip site they own.

Why give those fuckers money? I'd donate it to the NRA or a Trump PAC in their name first.

>>92211620
I'm cheap enough that the extra dollar made me go for the normie one, but most of the market does agree that it's pretty cool

>>92211694
I thought the lenticular one was a dollar more

>>92211752
It is

>>92211725
>anything published by Avatar
but that means you missed out on Providence

>>92210973
Oh fuck I remember the thread where that was made.

>>92210973
the Age of Ultron one was better

>>92211725
I think Waid quit twitter. I feel you, though personally I don't really care a lot though what they do in real life as long as they're not actually a monster. Like I'm not buying Gerard Jones stuff anymore.

>>92211752
I'm guessing he means his store set its own price for either of them.

DChads win again!

>>92211725
>I care more about a writer's political opinions than the quality of the story they produce
You're just as bad as the people you hate, anon.

>>92210365
And it sold more than GotG

>>92211940
not that anon but I probably wouldn't buy from the artist that drew antisemetic stuff in his comics and got fired, though that's not really a political opinion.

>>92211940
I'm a bleeding-heart progressive liberal and I still think Nick Spencer is an insufferable twat on Twitter

>>92211725
I'm the same way, I'd add Dan Slott to that list too.

Fucking guy bullied a little girl because he's an insecure asshole.

>>92212033
>Fucking guy bullied a little girl because he's an insecure asshole.
What!?

>>92211940
As a Liberal, I don't mind political commentary as long as it's not forced. If it is, it's just annoying. Take Alan Moore, as a good example of how to write political commentary right. It's because he's pulling in 3 different directions and actually giving the other side a voice.

Nick Spencer is like, LEL THESE GUYS ARE THE BAD GUYS AND THEY ARE RIGHT WING, RIGHTWINGERS ARE THE BAD GUYS.

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>>92210850
>The #1 of Marvel's new Big event selling 81% less here than part 3 of a DC mini-crossover.
HAHA

>We sold 73% of what we ordered of #1 but we sold almost 600% more Batman...
HAHAHA

>It's less than Secret Wars II #8 and just shy of Original Sin #1.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA

And people still think Spencer isn't going to get thrown under the bus by Marvel as a scapegoat before their Legacy relaunch. De Campi was right.

I also hope Legacy crashes and burns. Fuck Marvel. Those faggots can't even admit they're wrong and reach out to retailers and fans to say they're sorry for how things are now. Legacy is just the most half-assed and insincere version of Rebirth. And nothing's going to change until the entirety of Marvel is restructured, starting with pic.

>>92212062
Some girl on twitter had some commentary on Dan Slott, didn't even @ him, guy searched out to find it. Essentially found out her blog and went to essentially tear this girl apart, all because this girl had something negative to say about his shit book. It's fucked, he's so insecure.

>>92211262
>Nick Spencer tries to learn Chaos magic to fight Alan Moore and Grant Morrison.
>This will lead to the two getting along to hex Spencer for eternity.

>>92209065
You're thinking of the other comic store owner that gets posted here. Big Bang has always been pro-selling comics regardless of the company.

>>92212206
You talking about Higgins? I thought he was mad at DC to during DCYou.

>>92212206
That's all retailers. Their business suffers when a company underperforms. Higgins says his DC sales have been suffering because his Marvel customers don't come in anymore (because they'd also buy a few DC books)

>>92212178
>implying Morrison wouldn't teach him all he knows and they wouldn't defeat Moore and Millar for good
>implying Johns wouldn't then welcome him back to DC with open arms

?

>>92208906
I am not buy another Marvel comic, until they can go two whole years without a company-wide crossover.

>>92208906
I don't read big company comics anymore. With the exception of SJW bait, freelancers make the best comics right now.

Isn't this a store by store thing?

I bought the last copy of secret empire #1 At my LCS

>>92212276
He's a DCfag but he's also a retailer who is unhappy when books don't sell well regardless of what he prefers

>>92212465
I thought that was just the reading checklist

>>92212487
yeah more or less

also worth keeping in mind that Big Bang is an Irish store

>>92212465
Nice try, Marvel.

>>92212487
Given the preorder numbers already being much lower than past Marvel events it seems like this will probably be the case everywhere. Just not a lot of buzz for this.

Your shop might just be better at estimation relative to demand though. Or it might genuinely just be popular where you are unlike everywhere else.

>>92212536
You are right, I'll delete that in a second

>>92212355
Why would Johns welcome Spencer back to DC? Spencer isn't that big of a name and did nothing of note at DC. He's also talked massive amounts of shit about them during his time at Marvel. DC would be more inclined to welcome Waid back, since that fucker is a bigger name and would likely literally prostrate himself before DC if given a chance to in order to write the characters he loves again.

>>92208906
Honestly, CWII was so bad I'm not reading an event comic for a long fucking time.

>>92212605
Didn't Waid talked mad shit and threw a fit when leaving DC because he wasn't allowed to write Superman?

>>92208906
But I did. And I enjoyed it too. I suspect people got the free comic book day issue and felt invested enough in the story to pretend they care on social media so there was no need to purchase it.

Why are faggots (not just here all over the internet) whining and bitching about Hydra Cap? It's not like he literally was Hydra all along waiting for his Vince McMahon reveal after 75 years of fighting on the side of good. His history was changed by cosmic cube shenanigans. The whining makes no sense.

>>92212605
He's a good writer and everyone deserves to be forgiven eventually.

Also we're talking about a magical duel here. Deserves a happy ending.

>>92212695
/co/ doesn't like Nick Spencer because he's a twat on Twitter

also personally I just think the story is bad

>>92212355
The magicks would consume him, he would die before he acccomplished anything of note

>>92212655
Yes, but Waid is basically a smitten lover scorned. He'll flail out in autistic rage (which multiple creators have already said he's prone to do) because he still harbors a deep affection for DC. He had lunch with Johns a few months ago and was crazy excited they published his Flash collection.

>>92208906
>Why aren't you shitlords buying Secret Empire?

Because I don't want to give Marvel money anymore. I support my LCS by buying more DC and indies

>>92212742
It's not perfect but Marvel's events are usually literally unreadable shit. Civil War II was a joke. This is actually readable.

>>92212742
Then you got shit taste.

>>92209138

They literally aren't though

>>92209470
>The point is seeing how he'll lose

Then read the last issue

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>>92212806
Everyone needs to know the Gary Groth story because it's just insane.

>>92212874
I really don't. The whole fucking thing is contrived to hell and back, it's predictable as hell, and what isn't predictable is pointless clickbait shock value. It's a poorly constructed story that bends over backwards to make the villainous protagonist still seem like he has a core of good, to the point where he's saved from being a cold-blooded murderer by narrative contrivance.

I guarantee he's going to be at least partially absolved of being a villain when he dies in Secret Empire #7 by being revealed to be a moderating influence on Hydra and that things get so much worse without him.

>>92213003
What?

WHO THE FUCK BUMPED THE THREAD

YOU FUCKING AUTISTIC ASSHOLE FUCK YOU

>>92213178
probably one of the almost 60 people who replied, ding-dong

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>>92211620

Damn fucking right you want it

>>92208906
because it's a secret

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>>92213164
More context.
Waid's legitimately autistic and has autist tantrums.

>>92208906
>$4.99 issues for a series that will inevitably be mediocre and add nothing of value to the Marvel Universe
Also
>event comic books

>>92213178
>REEE! Why are you guys talking about Marvel's declining sales due to reader dissatisfaction instead of just ignoring it and pretending everything's alright?! REEE!
Some of us want Marvel to get fixed so we can have more good comics and an overall healthier industry. Blind loyalty to any corporation helps no customer.

>Spencer is the king of shitting in everybody's breakfast
>Crashing the plane right into the mountain
>And laughing while marvel ties a huge stone around his neck and throws his ass into a pool of rabid 'fans'
Fucking brilliant.
This has changed my view of Spencer, a total 180º
Shine on you glorious gold basterd.

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>>92208906
Why spend so much money when you can download the whole thing and buy something else. I'd rather buy a frozen burger than spend anything on Marvel.

>>92211239

Probably say DC fans are sexist or something.

>>92212305

>Marvel doing so bad that even DC suffers because comic book readers quit their hobby in disgust entirely.

Jesus. Thats a whole new level of failure, when you manage to drag down your competitors with you.

>>92214907
this is the second time they've done this, too

>>92208906
Cause they took away Tigra's bikini! Just like they made Namor put on pants.

I'm tired of it!

>>92214947
When was the first time?

>>92211707
Fuckin metal

>>92214966
in the 90s, they crashed the whole market by catering to speculators. It's why they had to sell off the movie rights of their big characters.

>>92214966
90s

Image did their far share tho

>>92211620
As long as it remains a gimmick and only happens once in a while

It's when shit happens constantly we got a problem

>>92212695
I personally just find the story to be pretentious as all Hell and would've been glad had they just made the story a crossover of the books that were tied into its plot

>>92215047

It was Valiant and they don't get enough shit for it

>>92208906
I read it on /co/

I have a longstanding policy of not paying for Marvel

>>92212695
On /co/, it's more hating Nick Spencer because of his tirades on twitter

Normies and tumblr hate it because they think Marvel turned Cap into a nazi

I think it's fine. I liked Standoff so I'm willing to give SE a chance.

>>92212355
>implying Johns wouldn't then welcome him back to DC with open arms
No fucking way he's allowed back at DC anytime soon after the hissy fit he he very publicly threw on twitter about them

>>92212020
Me too.
Well, not as bleeding heart as I used to be.
Gets harder to be active when your guaranteed to run into a twatbiscuit in the process who you'll probably hate more than the people you oppose by the end of the day.

>>92208906
evil captain america no one wants this.

>>92208906
i don't give a shit. comicbooks are shit. Spencer is a nigger-loving hack that will most certainly kill steve rogers to replace him with niggercap

>>92210850
why do they always do this type of comparison? the two companies don't have an even number of customers and not everyone buys all books.

>>92215937
>evil captain america no one wants this.
/pol/ does. Where the fuck have you been? A fascist Captain America that not only advocates the ends justify the means but wins doing it? You could hear the panties dropping in /pol/ from space.

>>92211819
>Like I'm not buying Gerard Jones stuff anymore.

Give me a quick rundown.

>>92216361
child pornography

>>92216081
if a "big event" comic like Secret Empire isn't selling, it's a bad sign because it means regular Marvel readers will probably also skip tie-ins. That's a bunch of customers completely gone from the store for months in a business with razor-thin margins.

>>92216302
/pol/ is ALWAYS right

>>92216302

They don't count as people.

>>92213141
Cap ain't dying in #7.

More likely Black Widow will murder Miles because Miles has decided Cap must die, cause he's a white male while the rest of the OG Avengers scramble to restore Cap to normal.

Miles's head will be blown into a million fucking pieces to appease fans who hate the affirmative action gang by Black Widow, because they have to do SOMETHING to appease the non-SJW crowd since they can't put a bullet in Ms Marvel's head and then poor pig's blood onto the corpse so she automatically goes to hell.

The added bonus of punishing Bendis too comes into play, since his bullshit Civil War 2 crossover had as much to blame as the "fuck whitey" shit in terms of killing sales and driving away the fuck whitey crowd Marvel was desperate to use to replace the hardcore fans they wanted to get rid of.....

>>92217373
I'm sure

i'm gonna buy the hell out of the Secret Empire Omnibus tho

>>92217373

Edgy.

>>92217409
They can't do it.

Cap can't die because he has to save the day per Marvel's own statement. Killing Cap now would defeat the entire purpose of them saying it ends with him fixing shit.

Miles has to die. It breaks the chain of events established in Civil War 2 and gives the non-SJW fans a moment of cheer and joy by getting rid of at least one of the cancer tokens.

Plus, as stated, it sends a message to fans that Bendis is not fucking untouchable by breaking one of his toys and denying him a chance to restore him to life. After all, Bendis shares just as much blame if not MORE as far as Civil War 2's damage done to Marvel sales-wise.

Miles dies, Cap gets restored to normal and Bendis has to fucking deal with his being the one getting fucked in the ass by a poz rapist for one

>>92217574
I'm sure

>>92217574
It's more likely Black Widow will shoot Miles non-fatally than anything else. She'll shoot Miles so he can't kill Cap and in the process, be the moment in which Cap gets put right by the other Avengers reassembling the cosmic cube.

>>92210556
Exactly.

This pos deserves worse and he better hope and pray that all of the shady shit that he did in Ohio never comes out.

There is no way they will kill Cap during this event for three reasons:

1. They've already promised that "Cap will save the day" at the end of the series and if they try and bait and switch things, by having Sam save the day and hold off Steve's return until the final page of Legacy? They will burn pretty much what little remaining bridge they have left with their new audience.

2. If they kill Cap off, then conservative fans and longtime fans of both political stripes, will be pissed because they murdered Cap to shill Miles Morales; a character no one likes and who is one of the chief poster children of everything wrong with Marvel. And most of those people won't come back for Legacy/Make Mine Marvel.

3. They absolutely have to wrap up the entire Hydra Cap storyline in Secret Empire and have Cap 100% back to normal at the end of it. They can't drag out Steve's return period; they can't afford the backlash poisoning the well as far as pissing off fans so they don't turn their nose up at Legacy/Make Mine Marvel. Even if they bring Cap back in Legacy, no one will care because the damage will be done then and there if they kill Cap in Secret Empire.

>>92217574
Aren't they doing a Miles animated OVA or something?

>>92217922
all of this assumes Marvel will make smart decisions

I'm just curious how much stiff had to be rewritten with Secret Empire.

The Iron Man stuff with the AI clearly was not planned. Bendis most likely fucked shit up with the way he "rewrote" the ending of Civil War 2; Tony going into the coma was never supposed to happen and Spencer had to rewrite things to make Tony not be the real Tony Starks but his AI.

Similarly, Pymtron probably wasn't part of the plot either and was tossed in for the sake of killing another bird with the same stone: IE undoing Remender's ruining of Hank Pym by splitting him and Ultron apart as a part of Secret Empire, so Pym's available for usage post-Secret Empire for the Avengers.

>>92216302
I doubt /pol/ gives that much of a shit about comics.

>>92218019
>undoing Remender's ruining of Hank Pym by splitting him and Ultron apart
that would just be spiteful on Spencer's part, Pymtron is the best either character has been in ages

Will #2 and #3 of SE be in gimmicky lootboxes? I wonder what the drop off is gonna be.

I can't imagine what is going on in the highups in Marvel right now, seeing all the numbers and how much this event is tanking.

>>92208906
I stopped buying marvel.

>>92218235
I don't think #0 counted the loot box, those numbers are worryingly low if it was

>>92218100
They care as much as the sjws. Just to moan and complain when something they deem offensice shows up. It doesn't help that most of the time, it's hack writers hiding behind socjus to deflect criticism.

>>92217373
>Black Widow will murder Miles
>Literally advocating black-on-black, bug-on-bug violence.
Slow down shitlord.

>>92218100
You don't go there often do you?

They don't care about nostalgia or debates about who the best X-Men artist was or how many types of kryptonite there are are.

But when something over here triggers /co/'s "SJW's are out to GET US!" anxiety they pick up on it like sharks with blood in the water.

>>92218310
#1 was too IIRC, it's just a way to inflate the numbers of comics sold. It's such a cheap gimmick, it's almost like they knew this was going to tank so they need to inflate it.

>>92218332
Two sides of the same coin really. Only /pol/ is objectively more funny, at least they are creative.

>>92218407
You're right, I don't go there too often, but really it just seems like your usually freak out. Kind of happy they have their own space they can freak out on, wouldn't want them in /co/.

>>92209065
He literally says he wants marvel to do well, dumbfuck

>>92218407
Best artist: Chris Bachalo
Best Kryptonite: classic green

>>92218407
Funnily enough they immediately picked up on the fact that the Bombshells were Spencer mocking SJWs while /co/ assumed he was being serious.

>>92218865

Because it felt like something /pol/ would make up

>>92217922
Spencer has already said in interviews that Marvel is letting him loose and do whatever he wants. Spencer said the ending of SE will be sad. Spencer also hates Steve because people prefer him over Sam "BLM" Wilson. He really really wants Steve to die.

That being said, rumors say that Marvel is letting Spencer have his Secret Empire and retconing it after with Legacy. And that they only told NBC that Steve would be fine to trick readers.

Why does Marvel hate mom and pop comic book shops by making bad books?

>>92217373
>>92217574
>>92217922
Yes Jesse Baker, I'm sure your conspiracy theories are for real just like your fake insider scoops

Why is Big Bang constantly used as a barometer for how things sell?

Aren't they just one store?

>>92220783
one of the few sources we have on in-store sell-through

>>92218865
>while /co/ assumed he was being serious.

You're confusing the crossboard posters with /co/ again

>>92217749
Do tell.

>>92220628
They want to have people stop shitting up the sales of their movies by saying the comics are better.

>>92210301
>NO ONE wants Sam Wilson as Captain America.
The problem isn't Sam being Cap, the problem is the writing is bad.

Sam taking up the mantle of Captain America is a logical choice on the level of having Dick Grayson take up the mantle of Batman.

It's just written terribly.

>>92221047
Actually fuck you racist shitlord. The comic book is fine and you are so hung up on your fuckfaced internalized racism that you cant stand to have your precious white heros replaced. Fucking white fragility.

>>92221047
The problem isn't that he's Captain America, it's that they pushed that shit so soon after Bucky was Cap.

>>92221047
This. Sam having a run as Cap is completely fine, hell an obvious thing to do after people liked Sam in Winter Soldier.

It's been horrifically mismanaged from day one. His first story arc was getting turned into an asshole by SIXIS

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>>92221132
>written by a white man
>acceptable
"No John you are the shitlords"
And then John was a racist.

>>92221132
Someone needs to be hanged from a rope outside their house after watching their girlfriend be raped and murdered in sadistic fashion....

The Remender SamCap run did well because it was apolitical. Everything turned to shit when Spencer was given the book and he suddenly had Sam spouting BLM/SJW bullshit.

>>92220574
That's suicide. Doing so would ensure Secret Empire flops as a TPB/HC and will create such a cosmic firestorm of hate and rage that no one will fucking stick around for Legacy.

They HAVE to restore Cap at the end, or else fans will just say "fuck you and die..." and effectively never come back to Marvel. Which is the worst fucking thing they can do given how they fucking are planning their entire company strategy around luring their angry long time readers back that they lost because of the SJW bullshit.

They gave Spencer his rope and giving him any more is going to result in him crashing the plane into the building and killing everyone as opposed to slitting his throat with a box cutters and crashing the plane on a field where only the people on the plane will die, not the people in the office building.

>>92218310
>I don't think #0 counted the loot box

We have nothing to suggest it didn't because they have counted those boxes in the past

At this point Marvel is fucked no matter what.

Spencer just can not be trusted. Period. They let him run wild and it backfired in horrific fashion. At this rate, he should have been fired from writing Secret Empire and the mini-series rewritten from scratch to minimize damage. And Spencer told, point blank, to shut his fucking mouth about being pulled from the book and the rewrites, if he ever wants to write for Marvel ever again.

Meanwhile their media comments paint them into a corner where anything short of an Age of Ultron style reset with Cap not being brainwashed during Stand-Off, is going to destroy their good will with the press and with fans who bought their bullshit that they were going to fix things.

Third, given how unstable the MMM relaunch is, how "Generations" got killed because people rightfully saw it as continuing the bullshit that drove off fans by the thousands, they can't risk letting Spencer kill Steve/have SE end with a downer ending that shits all over Captain America, because then the already angry as fuck existing fanbase doesn't trust Marvel to do right by them and ending Secret Empire with Cap being given the Scarlet Witch burial treatment, will only ensure no one buys MMM, because they will have zero reason to trust Marvel. Even if Marvel does bring Cap back in Legacy #1 in a manner that isn't a bullshit nonsensical manner, because the last remaining semblence of trust will be gone forever.

>>92221325
>>92221132
Do you keep arguing with yourself to keep yourself amused, or what?

>>92220967
From what I know about Ohio, his dad must be a serial killer, or have women locked in his basement.
I'm obviously not the same guy though

Because I'm too busy reading Bullseye and having fun.

>>92209219
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50rlHVe6g9Q
It's over, Nick

The only way they can dig out of a downer "Steve dies an unredeemed, hated, and reviled Nazi" Secret Empire ending, is if Legacy is a hard Flashpoint-stye reboot.

Because really, if they do the mentally retarded thing and let Spencer's hate boner go unchallenged, then nothing short of a hard reboot will undo the damage.

>>92220574
>Spencer has already said in interviews that Marvel is letting him loose and do whatever he wants

He's lying

>>92221480
Comichron usually marks issues with LootBox numbers in the past, they didn't with this one

Best case scenario is that Steve "dies" (Miles kills him or BW kills him as someone else has suggested) in #7 and gets resurrected either at the end of the issue or in issue #8, with the death/resurrection thing being the "reset" to bring the real Steve back.

It would be interesting though, if they end up going the Donna Troy route with Steve's restoration: Tony/Thor/Vision/Black Widow/Wanda/Sam/Sharon resurrect Steve based upon their idealized memories of him so that he's 100% good, with Wanda herself pulling off the resurrection (given that she's risen the dead before with her reality warping powers).

Of course, the fall out is that Steve has huge blanks in his memories just like Donna as well as the fact that he's soulless too since he died and was brought back through dark magic.

If they go that route, they might as well not even bother with the Miles/Natasha stuff.

Just have the Hydra gang turn on Steve and murder him in cold blood in a coup. Wanda and Vision steal his body and Wanda brings him back to life. Don't bother with the rest of the Avengers; just have Wanda play the role of Wally West in bringing Steve back as she remembers him, in terms of an idealized version of classic Steve Rogers.

Afterwords, the Avengers lie about mind control to the public to explain away Cap going evil.

>>92210365
Not going to lie, i've always liked the concept of Blackbolt, a guy who's power is so dangerous he needs to remain silent and in control.

The rest of the Inhuman stuff just put me off bothering to read some stuff featuring him.

>>92221325
They are hoping to gain more fans when they tease MJ/Peter in the Legacy special.

>>92220967
Basically some tea about his days back in Ohio.

He was a failed politician, had two campaigns that flopped hard and went against everything that he preaches now, a shitty possibly racist bar owner, and a bad booker who fucked over bands.

There are a few threads about it on twitter but I know people in Cincinnati who told me stories about him being a massive prick years ago.

At this rate, would it truly hurt Marvel to just say "fuck it", end everything mid-storyline (Secret Empire included) and go dark for a couple of months in order to expedite "Make Mine Marvel" coming out without having to deal with the mess they are making with Secret Empire?

Go dark, throw out a bunch of reprint books to remind people when Marvel was good, and cut your losses with a horrible storyline that is going to end horribly for the company any way you look at it?

Does Marvel have any fucking reason to humor Spencer like they have? Even John Byrne at the peak of his commercial viability as a draw, couldn't get away with what Spencer is doing.

>>92221692
I want Frank to kill him
I'm not a big fan of Frank but if he does I'd like him more, so I think he deserves this opportunity to impress me

>>92221922
>Does Marvel have any fucking reason to humor Spencer like they have?
He must have blackmail on someone.

>>92221922
Couple of reasons:

1. They basically bet big on identity politics and Secret Empire is supposed to be their big crossover that would be their crowning moment of awesomeness for the SJW era of Marvel: the complete destruction of a longtime Marvel icon in order to ensure that his affirmative action replacement will be the only Captain America allowed. They can't kill the event without admitting that identity politics/SJW pandering pretty much killed Marvel and destroyed the company. Which the SJW mafia will never allow, due to it creating a PR nightmare in that going 100% put Marvel Comics out of business.

2. Spencer was one of their "young guns" who they were grooming for greater things. Too much energy has been spent into making Spencer their next Bendis and Aaron, that they can't admit that they backed a guy who is more hated and revilved than Howard Mackie.

3. Pretty much all of Marvel editorial (Brevoort in particular) will be out of a job if they admit that they fucked up and have been running the company into the ground. Brrevoort and company are basically cowering under their desks, wanting Secret Empire to be over already but can't prematurely do so without making Disney aware of how badly they have mismanged things and then the SJW bitch they have on the payroll, Alsono, and Brevoort will all be fired and blacklisted from ever working at Marvel again.

>>92208906
I saw stacks and stacks of Secret Empite during FCBD no one was touching that garbage, I went to 5 different comic shops looking for that Star Trek comic and never found it.

>>92221692
That is somehow worse than Tony overwriting his personality with a backup every time he turns evil

>>92221930
>Frank has almost always refused to fight Cap because of respect
>ends up being the one killing Nazi Cap because he's been betraying that respect all along
>this then has ramifications as Frank becomes a little more unhinged, his only hero having disappeared, possibly causing him to start hunting Hydra sleeper agents instead of criminals

I like it.

I'd like Namor and Jim Hammond to be in on the finish, though.

>>92222045
>the complete destruction of a longtime Marvel icon

Calm down with the hyperbole, all they did was make him a Nazi, it's not like he anything forever irredeemable like kill Charles Xavier in self defense or anything.

>>92222276
>Calm down with the hyperbole,

He can't, just look at his posts:
>>92222045
>>92221922
>>92221796
>>92221692
>>92221505
>>92221325
>>92217373
>>92217574
>>92217922

>>92221602
>>92221480
>>92218310
>Comichron usually marks issues with LootBox numbers in the past, they didn't with this one

They did that with Big Trouble (which was from LootCrate), but they didn't do that with Doctor Strange and the Sorcerers Supreme (which was included in Funko's box).

If you look at its sales numbers:

10/16 Dr Strange Sorcerers Supreme #1 - 149,710
11/16 Dr Strange Sorcerers Supreme #2 - 29,349 (-80.4%)
12/16 Dr Strange Sorcerers Supreme #3 - 25,054 (-14.6%)
01/17 Dr Strange Sorcerers Supreme #4 - 26,098 (+ 4.1%)
02/17 Dr Strange Sorcerers Supreme #5 - 19,402 (-25.7%)

There's no way retailers would've adjusted their numbers for the second issue that drastically so quickly, so the Funko numbers had to have been included in that. This first issue only had three incentive variants but they weren't drastically crazy (just 1 for 10, 1 for 15, 1 for 25). Given all the talk last year from retailers about not being willing to buy variants, I have my doubts they'd suddenly up their orders this much even for the movie. Especially when their orders are so low with the subsequent issues.

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>>92223406
By the way, here's the run down of all the Marvel comics that got included in which Funko subscription box along with issues to compare their sales. In some cases, the Funko numbers wouldn't have affected the book's success (Black Panther, Secret Wars) but on others you can see a clear boost.

April 2015, Age of Ultron Box included Guardians Team-Up #1

03/15 Guardians Team-up #1 - 155,388
03/15 Guardians Team-up #2 - 38,390 (-75.3%)
03/15 Guardians Team-up #3 - 40,637 (+ 5.9%) B. Vortex
04/15 Guardians Team-up #4 - 28,877 (-28.9%)
05/15 Guardians Team-Up #5 - 25,093 (-13.1%)
06/15 Guardians Team-Up #6 - 23,004 (- 8.3%)

June 2015, Ant-Man box included Ant-Man #5

01/15 Ant-Man #1 – 73,370
02/15 Ant-Man #2 – 40,192 (-45.2%)
03/15 Ant-Man #3 – 37,139 (- 7.6%)
04/15 Ant-Man #4 – 31,637 (-14.8%)
05/15 Ant-Man #5 – 83,095 (+162.7%)

August 2015, Secret Wars box included Hickman's Secret Wars #1

05/15 Secret Wars Ltd #1 - 544,342 [+8,676]
05/15 Secret Wars Ltd #2 - 226,080 (-58.5%)[+9,540]
06/15 Secret Wars Ltd #3 - 224,067 (- 0.9%)[+5,931]
07/15 Secret Wars Ltd #4 - 221,041 (- 1.4%)

October 2015, Marvel's Villains box includes Bendis' Invincible Iron Man #1 (the ANAD relaunch)

10/15 Invincible Iron Man #1 - 279,514
10/15 Invincible Iron Man #2 - 66,664 (-76.2%)
11/15 Invincible Iron Man #3 - 59,069 (-11.4%)
12/15 Invincible Iron Man #4 - 57,639 (- 2.4%)
01/16 Invincible Iron Man #5 - 49,225 (-14.6%)
02/16 Invincible Iron Man #6 - 63,234 (+28.5%)

December 2015, GOTG box includes Guardians of Infinity #1

12/15 Guardians of Infinity #1 - 121,407
01/16 Guardians of Infinity #2 - 27,112 (-77.7%)
02/16 Guardians of Infinity #3 - 22,309 (-17.7%)

>>92223529
>>92223406

Marvels fucking dead

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>>92223529
Febraury 2016, Deadpool box includes Deadpool #1 (ANAD relaunch)

11/15 Deadpool #1 - 261,805 [+81,240]
11/15 Deadpool #2 - 92,008 (-64.9%)
12/15 Deadpool #3 - 72,357 (-21.4%)
12/15 Deadpool #4 - 63,149 (-22.7%)
01/16 Deadpool #5 - 59,645 (- 5.5%)

April 2016, Captain America: Civil War box includes Black Panther #1 (by Coates)

04/16- Black Panther #1 - 286,755
05/16 Black Panther #2 - 102,366
06/16 Black Panther #3 - 75,037 (-26.7%)
07/16 Black Panther #4 - 72,302 (- 3.6%)
08/16 Black Panther #5 - 83,756 (+15.8%)

June 2016, Marvel's Women of Power Box includes Civil War II #1

05/16 Civil War II #0 - 189,829
06/16 Civil War II #1 - 391,526 (+106.3%)
06/16 Civil War II #2 - 148,403 (- 62.1%)
07/16 Civil War II #3 - 185,949 (+ 25.3%)
07/16 Civil War II #4 - 126,865 (- 31.8%)
09/16 Civil War II #5 - 120,208 (- 5.2%)

August 2016, Spider-Man box includes Amazing Spider-Man (from ANAD relaunch) #16

06/16 Amazing Spider-Man#13 - 65,519 (-12.6%)
06/16 Amazing Spider-Man#14 - 65,646 (+ 0.2%)
07/16 Amazing Spider-Man#15 - 93,582 (+42.6%)
08/16 Amazing Spider-Man#16 - 185,342 (+98.1%)
08/16 Amazing Spider-Man#17 - 74,869 (-59.6%)
09/16 Amazing Spider-Man#18 - 71,159 (- 5.0%)

October 2016, Doctor Strange box includes Doctor Strange and the Sorcerers Supreme #1

see >>92223406

December 2016, X-Men box includes Champions #1

10/16 Champions #1 - 334,937
11/16 Champions #2 - 49,733 (-85.2%)
12/16 Champions #3 - 47,481 (- 4.5%)
01/17 Champions #4 - 34,969 (-26.4%)
02/17 Champions #5 - 31,344 (-10.4%)

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>>92223637
February 2017, Superhero Showdowns box includes Inhumans vs X-Men #1

11/16 Inhumans vs X-Men #0 - 84,161
12/16 Inhumans vs X-Men #1 - 167,703 (+99.3%)
01/17 Inhumans vs X-Men #2 - 62,723 (-62.6%)
01/17 Inhumans vs X-Men #3 - 61,638 (- 1.0%)
02/17 Inhumans vs X-Men #4 - 56,969 (- 7.6%)
02/17 Inhumans vs X-Men #5 - 53,348 (- 6.4%)

May 2017, GOTG vol 2 box includes Secret Empire #0

04/17 Secret Empire #0 - 162,718

Someone suggested that the number could be 100,000 but I'm not sure if that's the case for some of these. It could be at least 50,000 though.

>>92212605
>>92212655
>>92212806

Why are so many Marvel writers just bitter people DC rejected? In fact, isn't that exactly what happened with Jim Shooter?

>>92222045
>more hated and revilved than Howard Mackie.
I thought his Ghost Rider was good?

>>92223562
Even though I'm the one that made the list of the Funko box issues, I wouldn't count out sales on the first issue yet on account that it's a first issue of an event and those numbers would be higher than a #0's. It was also out the week of FCBD and so there's still a possibility it might've picked up interest.

>>92222045
>more hated and revilved than Howard Mackie.
Is he? I don't really visit comic book communities outside of /co/, but if there's one thing I know about 4chan it's that people here tend to pretend no one likes something because it's disliked here even though our opinions don't coincide with the outside that often

>>92209219
What happens if Legacy is another blunder?

>>92224143
Another event to boost sales

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>>92210824

Me too. The run had been so good upto that point, too :(

>>92224165
That will happen regardless.

>>92208906
Because I only read WW sometimes and I don't even buy those

>>92224165
Way Spencer acting on Twitter, Waid kissing DC ass, Feige's comments about tv tieing into movie; Disney going to crack down hardcore on there asses.

>>92224999
>Waid kissing DC ass

Wait, what? Last I remember he was bitching about Superman not being raised in a black ghetto or something.

>>92208906
Shadowland rehash with shades of Batman vs Superman
no thx

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>>92218395
10/10 post

>>92208906

Because it's a terrible dumb event like most of them are and I can't wait for it to be fucking over and forgotten?

>>92208906
Because it's politically offensive.

>write in a way that pushes away your old fans, just to attract the current "politically correct" crowd
>then write a story that pisses off exactly said "politically correct" crowd

Come on. This is a joke. No one can be that stupid. Right now there can't be a single potential marvel customer demographic that isn't monumentally pissed off for some reason.

>>92225362
He realizes now that Johns holds the strings to everything at DC and has remembered he is still friends with him.

>>92226042
I'm not.

>>92226080
I guess even the most loyal rats will damage control their way out of a sinking ship. That said I hope he stays the fuck away from DC, especially the female characters, else he'd turn them into political mouthpieces.

>>92220783
Cause not a lot of stores are really open and verbal about current selling trends

>>92209219
Does that include Loot Boxes?

>>92227078
historically yes, see >>92223406 and scroll down

>>92226042
Brevoort said that angry customers buy comics, cause they want to see whats happening. So causing controversy was a legitimate tactic and Marvel still does it

The problem is now, angry customers don't buy comics. If they don't like it, they just grab it online. Why pay for something you don't like?

Business has changed, Marvel's strategy hasn't

>>92227532

That only works for a while, you can't do it repeatedly because then the fans will simply stop caring about it entirely.

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>>92227532
I think that they really want Secret Empire to do well cause otherwise it is almost like >>92222045 said in #3 (except without the over-the-top parts)

Brevoort was the one who actually admitted publicly that when the fans are angry, the books sell. On top of that he is also the one who's editing Spencer's Cap and Secret Empire, Bendis' Invincible Iron Man and Infamous Iron Man, and edited Civil War 2. So there may be a lot at stake here considering what's happened last year.

If Secret Empire does well then it'll be business as usual. If not, then...

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>>92209004
>Thunderbolts
P-pls Boss. Don´t.

>the story
>the art
>the kubik
>the ending