Iron FIst

>>91539312
It just wasn't. I'm sorry.

I thought it was better than Luke Cage, about on par with Jessica Jones.

>>91539347

Luke Cage was cringe all the way through

>>91539312
How you gonna have the king fu themed hero have such shit choreography?

Story was all over the place.

Damn shame. I'm a big heroes for hire fan.

>>91539468
I don't know what was cringeworthy about Luke Cage I just thought it was boring. Jessica Drew was fun for me cause if there is anything more in character for Jess than constantly fucking up I don't know what it is.

>>91539312
Both LC and JJ had way better moments than this show though. You could argue that they had worst moments too, but I'd personally prefer a show that does some things almost perfectly and some badly than one that does everything slightly bad.

>>91539312
>way better
No, is the same shit, Cage is boring and I hate the cast of JJ, Iron fist have a horrible script and horrible fight scenes, the only good is Daredevil, I hope they don't fuck the Punisher

>>91539312
lol no. It was the one show I was actually hyped for the most, and it ended up being the absolute worst. The fight choreography was inexcusably horrible, and it definitely showed, and the main actor has absolute no charisma and comes across like a petulant brat. Also he had no physique at all. The entire thing felt really rushed and also felt like the martial arts was like the 7th most important thing to the show runner. I didn't give a fuck about jessica jones at all, but it was absolutely better by virtue of having decent actors. Luke cage definitely had a few cringey moments, like when he's lecturing anyone, or the hoodie thing and the trayvon martin song, but over all, it was better due to the music and the actors, not counting luke cage. Also, luke cage's actor could at least pull off cool and calm and collected, it was just every other emotion he couldn't pull off. Finn couldn't pull off anything and it was pretty apparent he was only selected because of game of thrones.

Iron Fist didn't have even a single scene in Kun Lun. all we got were two or three flashes that were seconds long. One third to a half of the show should have been about Danny's time in Kun Lun.

>>91540034
There was a compilation of all the times he actually used the iron fist and it came out to be 3 minutes and change in total. The moment the dude making the show said he wanted to make it grounded and gritty, I knew the show was going to have problems. I also like how they explained not giving him the mask and costume by saying he didn't need it, which makes absolute zero fucking sense.

I agree with you, OP. It started slow as shit but became progressively good. I liked it better than LC or JJ.

>>91539312
I dont know anything about marvel or iron fist but I didn't care for this show

It starts out alright but it goes full retard after episode 3
>suddenly black girl
>shes a doctor
>wait no a FORMER doctor
>"youre the best student ive ever had"
>also she lost her job because of ninjas
>send by the hand
>suddenly drugs
>everyone fucking knows about the hand even though theyre supposed to be some secret organization??
>suddenly character takes drugs for no reason
>kicks him out of the building
>WOOPS LOL SORRY ABOUT THAT WE ARE BEST FRIENDS NOW
>nobody in the hand seems to care that their nemesis is meeting with the dad
>they can just have a casual conversation in the middle of the day with no consequences
>main female lead has no tits

Dropped after ep 5

Its just Suits but with Kung Fu sometimes

>>91540378

You're supposed to have watched the other Netflix shows first. This was really The Defenders: Season 5.

>>91540499
Having watched all the other shows, iron fist was definitely and easily the worst of the bunch.

>Lets make a show about a man trained to become the ultimate human weapon....and then focus on boardroom drama for 85% of the entire show.

>>91539312
>it's pretty obvious that the low Rotten Tomatoes score is due to the made-up "white-washing" controversy.
True
>This was way better than both Jessica Jones and Luke Cage
Not true

>>91539312
Iron Fist was fucking terrible.

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>>91539312
>kung fu superhero
>kung fu in show is atrocious
>danny couldnt even cause daredevil to break a sweat in this universe

>>91539312
no, it actually just sucks ass. thats all there is to it, get over it.

>>91539312
No it simply sucked. I gave up on the fourth episode. Terrible writing, characters, fighting scenes, etc. By far the worst marvel netflix show.

>>91542315
I got up to episode 10 and just lost interest. I was waiting for it to get good and it just never happened.

>>91542586
Small paki davos annoyed me.

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I wanted it to be good, but it wasn't, it was a really bad show.
What kills me is fucking Meechums and his stupid rich kids that own the company. That whole situation was stupid and I couldn't care less about them at all. Hardly any martial arts and the martial arts in it was stupid, they didn't even have a final boss that was cool.
Daredevil had Kingpin, Luke cage had Cotton mouth, Black mariah and Diamondback, Jessica Jones had Purpleman. Iron fist had.....Daddies evil business partner??? Fucking retarded
AND he didn't even use the fucking power of the iron fist at all really. The one and only thing that was Decent at best was he did a ground slam and fuck all it was dumb.
Give me the Iron fist that was in that short clip that was shown to danny, that guy had a costume, both fist's glowing and was actually kicking ass.
Hopefully Defenders and a future next season can potentially make the Iron fist better.

>>91539312
It was bad. It's not a conspiracy. It's okay if you liked it, you don't have to justify liking bad things by pretending there was some secret SJW conspiracy to give it a low score. It's okay to like bad things, it's what we call a "guilty pleasure".

The important difference is that people with guilty pleasures are usually well-adjusted people who have friends and rarely shit themselves in public, and people who believe their favorite show was sabotaged by the tumblr illuminati are the type of people that don't get invited to parties. You get to decide which one you are.

I like all Netflix shows and I'm super hyped for the defenders and the punisher.

I like some more than others though, I think Daredevil S1 and Jessica Jones are the best so far.

>>91539312
you only think that because the character is white CIS male like yourself.

i only like DD best because i'm a blind catholic named Matthew.its actually because he beats the shit out of russians

>>91539312
The only part that was good was the Chinese recording of Iron Fist.

>>91539312
There's a scene from Iron Fist that really sums up how the show felt to me, and I really hope someone has a gif of it. During the scene where Danny is getting chased through the parade/festival whatever, he punches someone into an open doorway, and they fly back about three feet, and then he front flips after them to continue the fight. So like, instead of walking three feet forward, he front flips three feet forward. It's the slowest, dumbest and most tiring option, and literally all of that would be excusable if it looked cool but it looked FUCKING TERRIBLE I just started laughing and closed my netflix tab.

Season 2 renewal when?

>Final fight in a martial arts show is a pair of guys awkwardly flailing at each other with pipes.
>Joy Meechum is one of the single most inconsistent written characters I've ever seen.
>Someone literally says: "If we kill him we will be just like him"
>Plot twist with Coleen being part of The Hand makes little sense.
>Show wastes way too much time on resolving the initial conflict of people not believing that Danny is who he says he is.
>No Kun Lun

The show had a lot of issues. I'd still say that I like it more than JJ, though.

>>91542754
JJ started out strong but lost steam really quickly.

>Retarded subplots like the mentally handicapped incest twins and the lesbian love triangle.
>Plot relied on everyone being complete idiots at every possible moment.
>Plot structure quickly turns into a merry-go-around of Kilgrave being captured only to escape and kill more people, followed by him being captured only to escape etc.
>JJ had the amazing super powers of JUMP GOOD and lockbreaking.
>All the parts that tried to be mature and dark were trying too hard. The sex scenes were too common and cringeworthy, the violence too sadistic and the characters too unlikeable.

>Y'know what would have made a better ending for the Winter Soldier? Instead of a multi tiered battle across exploding helicarriers where every character is shown contributing and playing to their strengths and Cap's need to redeem his friend contrasts with his very real and deadly battle with the Winter Soldier, Cap should have had a slow clumsy fist fight with Robert Redford in an office building.

>>91539312
Iron Fist was a shit show with terrible pacing, boring story, terrible cut-heavy cringe-inducing slow fights, and a shitty main character. I was cheering for DeVos the entire time he was on screen. Compared to all those things, whitewashing is pretty much a non-issue considering how badly they fucked everything else up.

>>91539312
There was nothing in this series to latch on to. None of the characters are worth a damn, there's no cool villain, there's shit-tier martial arts, the soundtrack is bland, and the superpower is boring.

The show makes it seem like all he can do is make his hand light up and punch things really hard. So, the rest of him is a normal guy who works out a bit. That's hilariously un-impressive. This series made him look weaker than Daredevil and Hawkeye. A drunk cop could've killed him by firing more than one bullet.

>>91543281
I think that as a thriller it worked well enough, I'm just worried about season 2, because Killgrave was more than half the reason why I liked the show and now he's dead

>>91539312
I can't see how anyone can say this when the show has nothing going for it

>no novelty of being the first comic show
>no real good action sequences
>no really big name actors
>no phenomenal music scores

The best part about it is that it doesn't even use New York as well as the other shows did or Kun Lun. We're constantly stuck in offices or old warehouses which have like zero character.

I mean Daredevil, Cage and Jones would all be much better if they cut like half of their episodes and cut a few scenes from the remaining ones but Iron Fist is just so lame.

It was hilariously disappointing, I have no idea how anyone could come out of it thinking any higher praise than "that sure was a tv show!"

It would have been forgivable that they'd butchered the Iron Fist mythos like Ed Blumquist, if the acting or writing had been halfway decent. But they weren't.

>>91540632

Fair, the RT score should have been more like a 50 than a 15.

>>91544871

>We're constantly stuck in offices or old warehouses which have like zero character.

The whole aesthetic of the show is like someone watched the EvilCorp office scenes in Mr. Robot and tried to replicate it for everything.

Which is clearly the proper aesthetic choice for a fucking kung fu series.

people talk shit about the choreography, which isn't great, but say the other marvel shows have it better.

Luke Cage had some of the worst choreography I've ever seen. The part where he storms the building with a car door was some of the most hilarious shit. He'd just press it against guys and they'd act like they're being electrocuted.

Anyone who thought this show was better than the other two shows is flat out moronic, and this is coming from someone who didn't like JJ that much.

>>91542586

It got better, but it never got good.

>>91539312
I loved how it had these really cliche and campy scenes. Like when Harold drops the glass when the Hand show up in his apartment and when Colleen and Danny fuck for the first time.

Or the fight scene in the hospital record room and when Ward dumps Harold's body in the swamp and he drives away smiling and they decide to show us a shot of his car.

I maybe nitpicking but those shots made me giggle partly because they were so dumb and partly because someone thought it would be a brilliant idea to write AND keep them in the final cut.

>>91542719

>and his stupid rich kids that owned the company

My favorite part was when the board kicked them off the company as if they were publicly traded, because that's how businesses work.

>>91539312
The reviews didn't cover all the episodes

>>91545079
That's one scene. A bunch of other scenes do a better job of showing action without one million cuts. It helps that things don't need to be as complex (Cage is a juggernaut while Rand is a kung fu master) but they're still more competently shown.

i.e. The fight at Connie's Restaurant vs. The fight in the Truck where the Chemist is at or the infamous hospital scene.

ayy

>>91545218

>My favorite part was when the board kicked them off the company as if they were publicly traded, because that's how businesses work.

At least in batman Begins they explined that when Wayne Enterprises went public Bruce bought the majority shares.

I have no idea how Rand Enterprises. Danny owns the majority but the board can still kick him off somehow? What did Ward and Joy do exactly? Was it publicly traded or not? Why the fuck does that matter in a magic karate show?

>>91539312
It would've been better if he fought more mystical opponents. If Daredevil can fight undead ninjas why can't Danny fight people who also use chi or some sort of magic?

yes there's Gao but he's fighting security guards and guys with hatchets and knives half the time.

>>91545308

>yes there's Gao but he's fighting security guards and guys with hatchets and knives half the time.

>the "big fights" at the end of the show were against Rand security guards and teenage Foot Clan members

Truly the master of the martial arts.

>>91545270
i dropped cage after cottonmouth died so i wouldn't know if it got better, but that car door scene was baffling bad to me.

>>91545420
The show takes a nosedive after Cottonmouth, who was Marvel's best baddie so far. Diamondback is alright but he feels like he came straight out of an 80s blackpolitation flick. Like Sho Nuff from the Last Dragon.

The final fist fight isn't all that great but it's still way better than most of Iron Fist's shit which is terrible.

>>91545295

I feel like they made it pretty explicit that the Meachums owned the company before that had happened... I also loved how when Papa Meachum came back from the dead, he just became head of the company again, no questions.

>>91539312
They should've made a Shang Chi show focused around/near Chinatown with his dad being a super evil head Hand guy or something instead.

I'm watching the show now.
It's not great. Like most the complaints in the thread, the action is super lacking, the business related stuff is lame, and the characterization and casting are pretty lacking and inconsistent.
I'm on ep 10 now and Davos just showed up and is already way cooler than Danny.
At this point, I'm finishing it just so I'm completely in the loop for Defenders and beyond. This is the first time I've felt like I've had to force myself through any MCU related thing, and that sorta sucks.
This is supposed to be THE Kung Fu blowout series and there's just none of that.

>>91545538
Cottonmouth was the only one who felt like a real person. When his loser cousin killed him it's was an automatic deal breaker.

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>>91539312
>good kung fu tv shows not starring white males

Nothing personal kid

>>91545694
I agree though I did like Black Mariah as well but only when she was supporting Cottonmouth. When she was doing her thing with Shades it wasn't as compelling but there is potential in the future...hopefully.

Still Cottonmouth is by far Marvel's best villain imo. They're dynamic felt like a very good way to handle the Businessman Luthor vs new kid on the block Superman that should've been the focus for MoS sequel

>>91545538

"Blaxploitation."

>>91540107
>There was a compilation of all the times he actually used the iron fist and it came out to be 3 minutes and change in total.
Absolutely embarrassing.

>>91545766

Man, I really hate that his name was Shades.

>>91545897
Why? It was an actual character in the comics when cage was starting out. I just didn't care for the actor portrayal, it was really hard to take him seriously.

>>91540107
>>91545806
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VjSJPBqRbvI

>>91539312
My biggest problem with Iron Fist was Danny's actor looked like a wimpier Hyde from That 70's Show and I couldn't take him seriously whenever he angsted out on somebody. He just looks so goofy. Maybe if he lost the hair.
Also, did they ever explain why Madam Gao went from fighting against The Hand in Daredevil to working for them?
I'd watch the shit out of a show that's just Ward trying to kill his immortal dad though.

I think the racial politics unduly dominated media coverage, almost as if some collections of critics were corroborating a narrative, and for those "journalists" it certainly affected their criticism.

But the show wasnt that great. I certainly didn't give a shit about the casting; I even like Finn Jones. But he was wooden. Maybe it was dealing with the accent. The fights were shit, a consequence of poor preparation. There's no excuse for the poor focus (too much Meachums, no K'un L'un) and pacing except to admit that it was just a poor production. Maybe it was time & money, maybe Scott Buck and the writers just didn't get it and bent to the execs way too much.

But, Colleen was good, the fights got better, and despite the flaws I liked it overall. I hope he's better in Defenders and I hope they manage to correct the inexplicable omission of K'un L'un.

>>91545925

Because it's a dumb name, same as I'm glad they just called him Batroc instead of "the Leaper."

>>91546156

Was also lost about Gao. They were pretty clearly different and distinct organizations in Daredevil.

>>91542752
>pretending there was some secret SJW conspiracy to give it a low score.

You're a fucking retard m8. It's not that it has a bad score, it's that it has an OVERWHELMINGLY bad score (17% on RT), which is so comically low that it could only be due to politics.

And I never said it was a "conspiracy", either. Critics tend to be a "type" of person, and moreover when there's a narrative at play they tend to propagate it.

>>91547882
I'll definitely admit 17% is comically low. But I still think you're projecting motive and intent onto people who were just reviewing the show because it's their job. Most of the reviews I read didn't mention whitewashing at all, they just listed all the legitimate criticisms that anons in this thread have already expressed.

It's okay to admit you like something that isn't particularly good. Hell, I like AC/DC and they're basically the Nickleback of the 70s.

>>91542719
I mean they had Madame Gao as a villain, who I think even with her limited screen time completely stole the show. She was basically the only part of the show I actually liked.

>>91545538
>80s blackpolitation flick
Is that a bad thing for a Luke Cage series?

>>91546498
>>91546156
In Iron Fist, Bokuto's faction of the Hand was fighting against Gao. The Hand could have a whole lot of infighting going on.

>>91548289
>Is that a bad thing for a Luke Cage series?
It's only bad when the rest of the tone is not even remotely the same.
Had the whole series been like that, it would have been okay, but as it stands, it was a huge tonal shift that didn't really work.

>>91545029
>Fair, the RT score should have been more like a 50 than a 15.
No, 50 would mean half the critics think it is worth their time. It is pretty obvious the majority of people think Ironfist is not up to par. 15 is about right for a bad show, because 15/100 people would still like any show no matter how bad. Ironfirst is not divisive, it is just badly made.

>>91547882
>You're a fucking retard m8. It's not that it has a bad score, it's that it has an OVERWHELMINGLY bad score (17% on RT), which is so comically low that it could only be due to politics.
That's not how it works anon. 83 out of 100 critics didn't like Iron Fist. That's all the score meant. Do you want to force 33% of them to like something they don't like? This isn't an out of ten situation.

>>91548289

Yeah, but Nobu was obviously the representative for "The Hand" as a whole... They really made it seem like Gao was something else entirely. I really thought she would be the Crane Mother. I suppose that's not entirely off the table, they already made Bride of 9 Spiders a member of the Hand, why not one of the dignitaries from a different city...

>>91548471

Its definetly not a bad show as far as production goes but i think what turned people off was the first 3 eps being Hobo Danny... the mental hospital ep was a void and lots of people probably didnt get any further, so its really more about plotting and the general arc of the show and the fact that your average person didnt really give a shit after a few eps.

Hell, critics reviewing it ahead of time may have only got 2-4 episodes to write about anyways... that happens fairly often.

>>91548777

It is a pretty bad show as far as production goes. I would not have minded the first three episodes being about Hobo Danny if they had been well done.

I cant bring myself to finish the last 3 episodes

>>91545617
His dad should be the Mandarin and he should take down the Ten Rings.

Actually, I'd prefer a movie that focuses on Shang Chi's espionage deal, going around the world and taking down the Ten Rings. It'll be the actual spy show Agents of SHIELD failed to be.

>>91539312
1st half of Luke Cage > Jessica Jones > 2nd half of Luke Cage > Iron Fist

I love Iron Fist, but good god that was a steaming pile of shit.

The fact that Iron Fist didn't have a fight scene taking place entirely in the dark except for the light from Danny's fists is such a crime.

You know it's a shit series when the best scene is a fake film reel from WWI of a real Iron Fist kicking ass.

>>91539650
Jessica Jones in a nutshell:
>How can we drag this out for the full order of 13 episodes?
>I know. How about we take our script which could have been wrapped up in six episodes or less and just stretch it out for the full thirteen?
>But how do we do that?
>Alcohol!
>That's good... but we may need something else...
>How about the villain just keeps escaping?
>Brilliant!

It was like watching Dude, Where's My Car for thirteen hours straight,

>>91550805
WWII, sorry.

i'm not a fan of any of the marvel tv shows but i thought iron fist was slightly better than the rest. yes that includes daredevil.

>>91539584
I don't get the hate for this series. My main reaction watching it was "finally, a marvel Netflix show with decent choreography".
The story WAS all over the place though.

>>91550940

Man, what?

>>91550940
>My main reaction watching it was "finally, a marvel Netflix show with decent choreography

Are you talking about Ironfist? What on earth makes you think that constant cutting every second so you can barely even see the actual fight is good choreography? Finn Jones even said he only spent about 15 minutes learning to fight before shooting a scene.

>>91548777
>Its definetly not a bad show as far as production goes but i think what turned people off was the first 3 eps being Hobo Danny.
If you can't make a compelling argument of making the audience want more after 3 episodes, you are doing it wrong. The audience had invested in a full film's worth of time by then, and if you still can't get people to like it then it is the studio's fault.

>>91544440
As a thriller it's downright incompetent and embarrassing. Almost as bad as Eli Roth's Knock Knock.

>>91550974
>>91551036
I'm not a good critic, but I thought the fight scenes in Iron Fist were good, at least compared to the other three. JJ and LC didn't really have fights beyond occasionally hitting someone really hard, and Daredevil was okay but got really repetitive, I found myself going "Okay now he's hitting these guys. Now I gotta wait until he's done so the story can move on."

>>91550705
Accurate. Both seasons of DD at the top.

>>91551449
Well JJ and LC have super strength which is difficult to make look interesting, they just punch people and not really anything else. But for a master of martial arts IF was pretty sloppy on the fights, DD had 2-3 fights that were really well done and shot in one take which is difficult to do. DD was able to have trained professional stunt double wearing his mask though so it was easier. IF fights were just really sloppy and poorly edited, the whole show was very rushed.

The premise of Iron Fist was more interesting then the others though so it's understandable why people enjoy it, it's hard to relate to invincible black men from Harlem or bitchy rape victims.

>>91551590
>which is difficult to make look interesting
Buffy did.

>>91540550
>and then focus on boardroom drama for 85% of the entire show.
They barely showed boardroom crap.

They showed danny fucking things up for the board people one time, then there was a brief deal about ward and joy getting kicked out. It was like not even 2% of the show.

>>91551759
She did martial arts type stuff also though. And she was actually attractive.

>>91551590
I'd say Cage was more interesting because it dealt with his enemies having to attack him indirectly.

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>>91551887

the irony being that they also had chi-centering in buffy/angel too

>>91552059
Like using a rocket launcher?

>>91551449

The point of the really long fights was to show off how well-shot and performed the choreography was. Taking less time does not make it impressive choreography, it was just sloppily done.

DD>JJ>LC>IF

>>91539312
Welcome to modern media.

>Iron fist is one of Netflix's most binged shows

Doesn't matter what SJWs say, success is success.

>>91545981

Absolutely inexcusable.

>shit choreography
>incredibly loose adaptation of IF's origin
>doesn't wear the costume at all despite IF being the one character who it would make the most sense for him to start off with his costume
>literally no good characters aside from Ward

>>91540034
What annoyed me the most was how everyone reacted as if talking about Kun Lun meant Danny must be insane.

Hello?! Kun Lun IS AN ACTUAL PLACE IN CHINA. You can literally look on a map, buy a plane ticket and _go there_. Sure, it's not the magical Kun Lun, but how was anyone supposed to know he was taking about magic Kun Lun instead of actual Kun Lun, the very real place on earth where he could possibly have been after crashing in the Himalaya?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kunlun_Mountains

>>91554523
I think it's implied the magical one is the only one in marvel.

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>both JJ and LC are in the 90s on RT
>IF is at 17%
This is the real fucking issue with RT, Id say LC and IF are about the same in quality yet because LC promotes blacks it gets a free pass too the 90% zone while IF gets absolutely shat on because "kill whitey"
Same kinda shit happened with BvS, its not exactly a good movie but got trashed by critics because it was popular to do so.

Rotten Tomatoes is a cancer upon the film industry.

>>91554860
You realize RT doesn't review anything right? It just aggregates scores from various published critics to give a general impression of the critical reception something has. If RT didn't exist those bad reviews would still be there and you'd still be complaining about them. RT just makes it easier to gauge the general reception.

Ranking for me.

1. Daredevil S1
2. Luke Cage
3. Daredevil S2
4. Iron Fist
5. Jessica Jones

>>91554944
Switch Iron Fist and Jessica Jones and you have my opinion.
I don't even like JJ, but fuck Scott Buck with a rusty knife.

>>91554944
1. Daredevil S1 = Daredevil S2
2. Luke Cage
3. Iron Fist
4. JJ

>>91554828
... that would be the first time a comic publisher/network actively _deletes_ a real world political entity. Inventing new ones to not hurt any political feelings (like Sukhovia)? Sure. But deleting real-life areas with real-life people from their impression of the world?

>>91540550
>>91551883
I WISH it was boardroom crap. That would have made it entertaining - CEO by day, zombie-ninja puncher by night.

Have the storylines intersect in ways unknown to the protagonists but as part of Gao's plan - Danny sells their drug at cost, unaware it's laced with Gao's poison that makes it highly addictive, and that he's playing right into her hands. He apologizes to the media about his drug being harmful (not knowing it was Gao's fault for tampering with the formula) and announces his resignation, only to be replaced with Black Crisis Management guy, who's working with Gao and had nudged Danny to "do the right thing" hoping for this exact outcome. etc. etc.

Harold was the only one with any semblance of a thought-out plan and he basically lost his mind after being killed by Ward.

They could have made this into a House of Cards-meets-Daredevil show, which would have been refreshingly new and different.

But no, we got a few filler scenes and Danny never actually doing anything important in the company aside from unintentionally fucking up.

>>91539312
Yup, I agree.

I'd rate it the same as season 2 of Daredevil, but Daredevil has generally better fight sequences, even though S2 was a step down from S1.