ITT /co/ characters who became flanderized over time

>>91268516
Literally all the heroes.

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All four of them, watch the eddisode Spares and compare it to how they act in The End

Lisa. Went from voice of reason, to the epitome of annoying liberal.

Same with Brian.

Ned Flanders.
I wonder how they called that trope before the Simpsons, because it always existed in fiction.

Ned Flanders!

Every character on Archer.

>>91268609
Doesn't modern Bart have no balls and exist just to get shit on?

I mean its not like he's a 'rebel' or a 'menace' anymore, no one thinks he's cool and the stuff he ever did is pretty tame compared to modern characters.
Kind of like US vs UK Dennis the Menace

Cosmo and Wanda.

Tootie.

Fuck, every FOP character to some degree.

How did this get pinned to Ned Flanders, anyway. He wasn't a complex character who was boiled down to a single trait, he was a one-dimensional character whose one-dimension changed from one thing (neighborly one-upsmanship) to a different thing (religious obsession).

>>91268516
Fuck off tvtropes

> tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WebOriginal/KeitAi

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She used to be strong and smart. Now she's all about science.

>>91268664
>Cheryl at one point was actually sane
>Pam was normal

It's weird as hell watching the first season, it's almost like a different cast of characters populates it.

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>>91268801
It's the
>I'm going to pretend the rest of the internet doesn't exist
episode

Most shows that have been running for a substantial amount of time suffer from this. Homer is the most egregious example to me on a personal level.

His defining trait was being so lazy (both physically and mentally) it bordered on neglect. However, when it came down to it he always had a big heart. Homer's antics were funny because you could tell how much he'd rather be at home watching garbage daytime television and drinking piss beer.

Even during the end of the Golden Age his shtick seemed to turn into him constantly looking for wacky high stress situations to get into so he could pratfall for 20 minutes.

>>91268609

It works for Brian since he acts like a cunt and everyone calls him a cunt.

>>91268827
Modern Pam is way better than original Pam.

The point when she was bad was during the one season where she became an insane coke addict and it was super obnoxious where it became all she was.

>>91268805
I really loved Patrick's original characterization. He was Spongebob's older mentor figure who thought he had everything figured out. The joke being (of course) that he was just as naive as Spongebob if not more so. The dynamic between Spongebob and Patrick was really fun, you got a sense that Spongebob really treated Patrick's ridiculous "words of wisdom" with a lot of reverence.

Turning him into a bumbling blithering idiot is the best example of new writers not "getting" a character I can think of.

>>91268764
pretty sure it was coined when he started to only appear in episodes to say "howdee doodeldy doo" and then homer shut him up and he's out of the episode.

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>>91268749
UK Dennis is best Dennis

>>91268764
He was an annoyingly great neoghbour, who was, among the things, a devout Christian. This was the originally minor trait that grew out of control and eclipsed his character.

>>91268909
>marshmallows

Everytime I see shit like that I assume some higher up bitched.

>>91268909
UK Dennis would beat the shit out of the American pussy

>>91268516

What's this artist's problem?

>>91268851
Even the murderers and rapists.

Not /co/ but that image screams Dwight Shrute.

>>91268805
She was also orignally going to be Spongebob's love interest

>>91268755
The others youre not wrong... but Tootie how? In the first and last episode she was in she was pining for Timmys dick, probably one of the few on that show that remained at least somewhat tame and consistent otherwise.

>>91268890
Ay caramba, man.

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>>91268879
All she had going for during that season was her slimmer, but still deliciously thick figure.

>>91268925

For any other person it would be rocks. The joke is that Walter in the glasses over there is such a softie that marshmallows do the job just fine. It'd be a waste of good rocks.

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>>91268664
dropped the show because of this. season 1 was perfect

Peridot or pretty much every character in SU except based Greg

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Everyone in this photo.

Most regular characters in The Boondocks.
I still love all 3 seasons, but on rewatches, 1 just hits that perfect note of ridiculous yet tame the others don't.

>>91268883
Agreed, never liked what Patrick became in the post movie seasons.

>>91268987
Really? Huh, wonder how that would have worked out?

>>91268909
>>91268936
What's the story on how there are two versions of Dennis anyways?

>>91268924
>This was the originally minor trait
Nah, it was a big aspect of his character.
But it used to be a positive aspect. Then the writers decided to use it as to comment on the abuse on religion by bad people.
To take a good hearted character and transform him into a WBC stereotype is just awful. It shows how the times change too.

>>91269835
Somehow two different people managed to come up with concepts with the same name at pretty much the same time

Except ones a bitch and the others a fuckin hardcore nutter

>>91269564
New Lapis is literally fanfic-tier
The fans gave her a completely different characterization through fancomics than what she was originally presented as, and the writers of the show just got very influenced by that
now she's a snarky piece of shit

Why is it that characters always seem to lose their character as their series goes on. I can't think of one thing where a character has stayed the same without being turned into 1 or 2 things about their character

>>91269897
Difficulty in communication between writers copying each other imperfectly.

Or sometimes, just refinement of traits writers think work.

>>91269869
Lapis died when they dedicated an entire episode to tell her to stop whining about being raped and she should just swallow i t up for good because it made the fat kid sad.

>>91269897
Marketing polls shows that people adore a few lines/traits of a character, and tell the writers to push that aspect more.

>>91269897
Sometimes it works for comedy because the character is going beyond what's expected from him. Then it starts to escalate.

>>91269921
Don't get me started on how preachy and self-centered Steven became, most episodes are formulated to always place him in the right and have him hit the moral as hard as they can on everyone's noses.

Pisses me off more than Garnet turning into Fusion the Character, aka two midgets in a trenchcoat.

Karkat.

Fuck it, every goddamn character from that webcomic.

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>>91270043
If we enter webcomic territory, Kat lost most of her subtlety and appeal the day she became lesbian. Even if she does science, it's off screen, because on screen she must show that she is in a happy love relationship, always.

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>>91268516
well

>>91268577
It's Tom's fault, it's almost always Tom's fault

>>91270155

>hiring literal tumblr fanfic authors to work on your show

Sugar screwed the pooch big time. Zuke is ruining the show.

>>91270212
Were Sugar born later she would have been one of the tumblr fanfic girls

>>91269800
It's pretty obvious when you look at episodes like "Ripped Pants", and some old tie-in books are pretty explicit about SB having a crush on her
But I think it was changed when they realized the show was too loose, episodic, and silly to support a romance with any kind of weight, and also because Spongebob transitioned to being more of a dumb, asexual manchild than he was in the first seasom

>>91270212
Zuke doesn't work on the show anymore anon

>>91269800
Remember her introduction episode, when Spongebob goes to Patrick looking for advice because he's going to drink tea with a girl

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>>91268516
All of them

>>91269921
Sometimes I wonder if SU haters even watch the show. They're clearly alluding to specific plot points, but their knowledge of them tends to miss the most obvious and common things that would be clear to anyone who saw the episodes they're complaining about.

>>91270279

Has it gotten any better? I dropped it a few months ago.

>>91270279
I think he's talking about how we have at least 5 more Zuke episodes left in the season, also it was never comfirmed if she was fire or not

>>91269966
Garnet has more personality now than she did before.

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He kinda became Kramer after a while.

>>91269434
>season 1
>not seaons 2-4

pleb

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this guy turning into doctor rape in the mid 00s

>>91269921
He was not raped. She was the rapist.

>>91270362
The whole "you don't get it" excuse doesn't work. That episode had no redeeming value it's the epitome of "making Steven sad is the worst crime and it's always your fault because he's always right" plot garbage that make everybody drop that show.

>>91270391
more lines != more depth.

>>91270391
A shitty personality. Old Garnet was better

>>91270439
Well, you don't. What you're talking about never happened in the show. Whatever you're trying to reference, you've distorted it so badly that I can't even tell what it's meant to be.

>>91269921
>being raped
>being
Lapis apologists are so fucking stupid holy shit

>>91270391
>>91270456
She has the exact same amount of depth. Before the reveal she was just the mysterious aloof mystical guru. That's not depth, that's an archetype that HINTS at greater depths. She gave the impression of having depth without actually revealing any. Now she's just two retarded midgets constantly having sex. Her depth is revealed, and she's as shallow as a puddle.

>>91270435
It was more like a hate fuck, but tumblr decided to blame everything on Jasper even after the episode says that they were both toxic for each other

>>91270395
to be fair, every character in KOTH became a wild caricature of themselves in the later seasons, it was just worst with Dale since he was already a little less grounded than the others

>>91270487
>>91270500
At no moment she was agreeing with the fusion. The whole "I asked for it" falls into the show telling us Steven was right to tell her to shut up.

>>91270500
It's like when you pressure a girl into prom sex and then she inverts her vagina into an eight foot cock and starts ass raping you, shouting "ARE YOU ENJOYING YOURSELF?". And then she blames you for being the one who started the rape train when she just took the brakes off and kept pounding away for months until you were both so violated you both started enjoying it.

Really not sure what Sugar was going for by calling Malachite an example of bad relationships when Jasper just treated it as a battle tactic and Lapis was the one who went through with it for incredibly retarded reasons.

>>91270554
She did agree to it. Right next to the very same ocean people like to forget she stole and tried to kill all the main characters with. The ocean she then used to trap Jasper in the fusion.

She was in power pretty much the entire time.

>>91270507
Garnet is smug, self-confident, self-absorbed, and self-righteous. She likes to think that she's better than people, and generally doesn't bother to engage with people unless they're personally important to her. She's struggling with her role as leader after the loss of Rose, and wants to appear stronger and more unfazeable than she actually is, for the sake of her team. She is prone to immediate, forceful action; she favors simple and direct solutions to problems even if they aren't the most practical, and she also tends to lash out at people or things which annoy her.

A lot of her feelings are related to fusion, because fusion is important to her. That doesn't mean her personality consists of one word; it's not just what she's about, it's how she's about it.

>>91270525
dunno, some characters were one note from the start and didn't change much imo, like bill, boomhauer, or Luane. Hank didn't feel too flanderized either, more like victim of character change to fit the plot at time. Bobby was probably the worst there for that matter, but it's kind of the opposite of Flanderisation.
Peggy evolved to be annoying too but it doesn't feel like flanderization nor inconsistency to me. They just wanted her to be like that.

>>91270525
Hank was actually less reasonable and humanized early on though. He became much more someone you're supposed to relate to and root for instead of the satire he was used for early on. So in that way his character actually grew, reverse flanderization if you will

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>>91270391
She feels like less of a character knowing now that she isn't really real
She's just a fusion of two other characters that we don't get enough screen time for and only personality trait is that they really love each other and really like fucking.
Knowing all this, knowing Garnets feelings and personality isn't real and just the projection of what ruby and sapphire feel takes away all of the characterization she once had mute and pointless

>>91270353
How so?

>>91270554
Jasper offered to fuse with Lapis, and she agreed under false pretenses. Jasper tried to escape, but Lapis forced her to remain fused, dragged her to the bottom of the ocean and tormented her for several months straight, while she was struggling to escape the whole time.

There, that's how THAT really happened. I have no idea where you got that weird part about Steven from.

>>91270611
That's the thing, Mike Judge's characters for the most part are all so simple conceptially that it's hard to water them down much (how would one fladerize Beavis and Butthead?), and in KOTH's case the writing was consistently solid enough that they all actually got a fair amount of development over the years. Luanne, Peggy, and Dale all drifted the most (Luanne especially got noticably dumber) but it held up better over 13 years than almost any other show has managed. It only took Chowder a season and a half to ruin all the characters.
Though Bob's Burgers has been on for 7 and I've noticed no real difference at all since season 2. It has been exactly the same thing since then and I enjoy how comfy that is

>>91270639
>they can't even stand to be away from each other
>Hit the Diamond proves they can't keep themselves from fucking even when someone else's safety relies on a successful ruse
>lowkey flirting in the Zoo too
>the one time they actually willfully spend away from each other is because Ruby was mad Pearl tricked them into sex but Sapphire was willing to let it go for the sake of group unity

Ruby and Sapphire are useless horny rocks. It's a wonder Garnet was as good as she was when those made up her whole.

>>91268883
Definitely. Patrick is a completely different character now.

>>91268618
Don't know what they'd call it, but you can honestly recreate OP's image with Link's de-evolution into Toon Link.

>>91270353
I disagree, honestly. The only place I see this is on /co/.

>>91268982

If so, you'd need to add a fourth arrow leading from the bottom-left to top-left since paradoxically as we reached the end of the series he started getting really grounded and well-rounded and respectable as a character again.

>>91270701
>lowkey flirting in the Zoo

When was that?

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>>91270099
but anon gays are so interesting

>>91270736
Gumball started out very naive but cute and evolved into a know-it-all asshole
Nicole was a hard working, exhausted but caring and capable mother who became a ball of firey rage
The rest of them really are pretty much the same though

>>91269897
I could be wrong, but Friendship is Magic from what I've heard has stayed largely consistent.

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>>91268516
Every single character in this highly overrated show

>>91270639
I think you're putting her in a Catch-22 situation. Garnet isn't a character because she's just a fusion and not her own person, and any traits she displays are actually those of her components. But Ruby and Sapphire don't count as characters because they have so little screen time and the only trait they display on their own is wanting to be Garnet again.

But consider this. If Garnet displays a personality trait, whose personality is it? Hers, Ruby's, or Sapphire's?

It's unfair to say she's not a character because she's a fusion. Technically, that would make her two characters, and in practice she's entirely capable of being characterized. Everything she does is something that Ruby and Sapphire do together. Her pride, her anger, her love for her friends, her dry wit, the way she handles her powers, the pressure she feels as a leader, those are all part of them and their relationship.

Garnet being a fusion means she isn't just one character, but she's definitely more than zero.

>>91270720
But Toon Link is just one of the many Links in the reincarnation cycle part of third timeline even there like 3 Toon links, but at the sane time Link dosen't have much of a character

>>91270165
Explain, please

>>91270802
Purple Smart got worse, Crusty Cunt Flakes is a bigger cunt. The baby dragon is useless. All the main cast otherwise stayed fairly consistent.

>>91268664
Id argue that season 1 archer was before the characters found their voices. The show kinda needs them to seem flanderized because the world itself is a flanderization of ours.

>>91270838
Zuko started off as a Saturday morning cartoon villain and had an actual character arc. Sokka grew a bit but was usually relegated to being the wacky guy. Katara got worse. Toph started off basic and got worse and worse and worse. Azula was pretty much the same until she went REALLY nuts, and aside from being rushed it wasn't much of a stretch. Aang did grow but it was less pronounced than Zuko.

>>91270099
>Character enters a lesbian relationship
>Instantly becomes boring, every scene is about their lesbian relationship, somehow gets a shitload of spotlight where nothing really happens
>Fans practically drown themselves in their juices gushing about how amazing their horribly bland relationship and devoid of chemistry their relationship became when it became romantic
>But who cares about good writing. Lesbians, amirite?
Happened to Homestuck to.

Worst part is that Kanaya and Rose's relationship is treated as working well despite the fact that it wouldn't without serious character development. But seeing as that would be interesting and imply that lesbian relationships had to deal with the same issues are mere morals it couldn't happen.

>>91270736
Are you kidding me? There are 3 different Gumball.

>>91270890
The biggest change is probably Cyril who they kind of retconned in Season 2 from being a schlubby underdog who was genuinely in love with Lana to being every bit as pathetic and as terrible a human being as everyone else in the show. In Season 1 they tried to make him the "normal" one.

>>91270943
We're talking about flanderization, not character development. It may shock /co/ to learn this, but they're not mutually exclusive.

>>91270611
Leanne had it the worst probably she was originally mildly ignorant white trash that was secretly more like a daughter to Hank than him than he cared to admit. Then she became a redneck too stupid to walk and breath at the same time.

>>91270865
Not that guy but Tom is just pretty unfunny as a writer and would resort to flanderisation for his comedy. Also he used a friend of Ed's that he didn't like as a metaphor for the cancer that killed him on the last episode of Ed's show.

Tom's kind of a massive prick.Always blame Tom.

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Fucking everyone

>>91271075
They ruined Stan. He used to be my favorite.

>>91269897
A lot of times, especially with comedy shows, they just realize that a character either isn't funny enough or is too hard to write for, so they give them a new characterization (usually by emphasizing something minor about them, so it feels more natural). Zoidberg from Futurama is a good example. The writers have outright admitted that they were having trouble figuring out what the hell to do with him, so they made him more pathetic.

>>91270849
That's what makes her feel like she isn't real
All those emotions, everything she does, that's not her but the decisions of two other people. She's two people strapped together, she's not her own character, she's everything someone else is doing.

That thing you mentioned about who's personality is she displaying just furthers that she's not real.

I get what you're saying about how two characters adds to her and everything but I'm not paying for all that

>>91270876
>Crusty Cunt Flakes
Who, Celestia?

>>91271002
>S1: competent enough to fix Hank's truck
>S3: brain-dead
There was a fan theory that the Mega-Lo Mart explosion gave her brain damage and desu I'm inclined to believe it.

>>91271152
No, Sanic Spindash.The one everyone wants to cum inside of.

>>91268805
Every Spongebob character got flanderized post-movie.
I remember hearing Hillenburg was back on the show. Was this true and did anything change because of it? I cant seem to find anything on it besides that he is back, but not sure how big his role is.

>>91268987
Well the porno is canon, isn't it?

>>91270353
Some of the characters yes but I would say some of those flanderizations helped the show overall.
Originally, Richard was not only an idiot but a douchebag who was a danger not only to himself but to everybody around him (not did-similar to modern Peter Griffin), an issue when the show wanted you to feel sympathy for him. Even though he still had likability issues to this day, he is just a general idiot these days and in some ways a kind idiot which is much easier to stomach than a douche idiot.

>>91270391
Before:
>As the leader of the Crystal Gems, I..."
After:
>"As a Fusion, I..."

Suuuure, more "personality".

>>91270876
Shit so it's true? Even MLP isn't safe from the "multiple seasons" curse?

>>91268618
That's litterally where the name came from.

>>91272766
Well, yeah, but he was wondering what they called it before Flanders, and thus before the term was coined. "Caricatured de-evolution" isn't quite accurate but even that's too wordy.

>>91270943
A-fucking-men

>>91272766
Writers didn't wait the 90's to make characters become caricatures of themselves.

>>91271687
>The one everyone wants to cum inside of.
that doesn't exactly narrow it down

>>91270605
This, very much. But I think Garnet favoring direct solutions is mostly due to Sapphire's tendency to overthink and complicate on the spot, forcing Ruby to make a call on her own. Garnet is much more reliable if she has time to go over possibilities. In Room for Ruby she predicted successfully where Steven and the barnmates would land, narrowing the context down to two options.
Garnet is only looking cool while she has time on her side. She proved that she can be a total wreck in the moment when Priyanka called.
That was mishandled as mishandled gets.
Which might give us another derived trait: Garnet is shit at lying because both constituents are bad at it. Ruby lacks in calculation and Sapphire stands without her frame of reference and ability to choose outcomes by probability. That's why she froze before the Diamonds but ultimately could choose with some confidence because she was able to fall back on court protocol to mask an obvious lie just enough so Blue could take the room with her melodrama.
Had that not happened, Yellow might have prodded and come to find out what's up.

>>91269564
At this point the only character i still like is Amy

>>91272589
Not him, but one aspect of herself doesn't cancel out the other.

I'm not really sure anyone from Adventure Time got flanderized. Maybe Ice King when they doubled down on him being sad, pathetic and ineffectual and he lost the threatening villain spark he once had but that's about it.

>>91272999
No, this is the one EVERYONE wants to cum inside. Not the one a large majority of people want to cum inside, which is all the other ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXt5VQiM-Co

>>91272975
I think Flanders was just the first character the phenomenon was studied on.
Most early cartoons were either too jokey and inconsistent or not worth paying attention to for long enough to notice any loss of depth. Simpsons was a breakout hit and initially so compelling a large number of learned critics would talk about for long enough to notice how Ned changed and that there is no word for it.

>>91269566
You know there is a 4th season, right?

>>91268516
Basically, every major character in a show with more than 2 seasons.

>>91269921
>>91269869
>>91270500
will lapis discourse ever match vriscourse?
probs not

>>91272589
Her personality isn't just what she's about, it's how she's about it.

Here's a thought. If you think a character's personality can be summed up as "X: the Character", compare them to another such character and swap their values for X. What would it be like if Garnet cared about Rose Quartz instead of Pearl, and Pearl was the one who was all about fusion? They all have something that means a lot to them, but they handle them in their own unique ways.

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>>91269564

>>91272313
>Originally, Richard was not only an idiot but a douchebag who was a danger not only to himself but to everybody around him
So is current Richard. He is even worse now. Remember shit like the Diet.

>>91270353
Richard has at least remained consistently shit

>>91269897
Metalocalypse has stayed largely the same overtime. The minor change I remember is that they made Toki a little more childish, but that's about it.

>>91268925
>>91269390
if i remember from watching a video, marshmallows can be pretty painful when shot out of a blowgun

>>91273434
Kek

>>91269564
Connie is now the only good character in the show

>>91273246
It's hard to flanderise people who are only ever in weird places, facing madness.
There is so much that is just "stuff happens" and inconsistent reactions, nobody ever got nailed to something.
Princess Bubblegum is so wildly, violently inconsistent between episodes, you just can't tell where her net movement goes.
>mad scientist with no morality
>cute girl who wants to escape the weight of the crown
>accomplished diplomat
>quest giver
>action girl who does shit by herself
>has mild erotic tension with Marceline
>absolutely is a lesbian in a difficult relationship
>despotic monarch who rules as an absolutist over her less-than-people
>political aggressive realist sabotaging an ally before she even asks for a disarmament treaty
>approachable teacher
>distant, vilified ruler
This shit just doesn’t add up to one person!
She could be several (2-4) distinct characters with the extremes she is taken to.
So she's too little (or maybe too much?) of a person to get to be flanderised.

>>91271072
He also likes ska.

Everyone on It's Always Sunny.

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Is there a single long running comedy series where the main characters didn't turn into parodies of themselves?
The only one I can think of is The Venture Bros.

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>>91273606
>Connie "mastered swordsmanship in a couple of months" Maheshwaran
>good character

No, she became a flawless mary-sue who acted "woe is me, I'm just misunderstood" when she broke a kid's arm and ran away. Hell, her biggest development as an assistant of the Crystal Gems has been made off-screen, she only now exists as a literal plot-device so she and Steven can turn into Stevonnie.

Doesn't help that she's considered the smarter of the two and Steven acts like a retard around her only to have her give the moral instead of him, she's like the perfect child to the writers, they don't want to be harsh on her with any form of consequences or mistakes.

>>91273696
Joseph and Dio got flanderized pretty hard

>>91273621
You're definitely right to some extent but I feel like a good amount of those traits could work together if you try hard enough to squeeze them into place. And they did that thing where they sort of retconned her earlier personality out of existence y making her someone who was always a badass ruler lady who defended her land with everything she had. If you really want to give them credit you could call that character development but that makes no sense because if she was always like that she didn't develop into anything new, she just had a different personality at the start of the show that got erased when they came up with stuff they liked better.

I feel like people consider PB to be really multifaceted when it's more likely that she's just inconsistent in places, but she still works enough for me I think.

>>91273724
JoJo is neither /co/ nor comedy

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>>91270802
>>91270876
>>91271152
>>91271687
>>91272999
>>91273266
People. In this show, there are some secondary characters whose personality has actually developed more than the main cast; overall, there are less secondary characters who have been flanderized than the protagonists.

>>91268883
One other thing: Patrick was the big guy to Spongebob's little guy. He got shrunk down to be another goofball with Spongebob, losing the dynamic you mentioned.

>>91271096
Stan was Trey's self-insert.

He's probably the smartest of the four (Cartman included) but his ethical choices lead him to problems. He loves being popular and having status; he's also an 8 y/old boy with the mind of a cynical, bitter 50+ y/old Man. People like that are rational but naive and, unlike Kyle, he doesn't like to grandstand or flaunt his moral superiority.

Early on Stan was nearly untouchable because Trey wrote pretty much everything. He became self-aware a few seasons back and started to add in some character flaws outside of a kooky Dad.

>>91273357
We don't like to talk about it here. It sucks. Everyone knows it sucks. All discussions begin and end with that consensus.

>>91268801
>WebOriginal
But this aired on Tokyo MX

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>>91274124
>It sucks. Everyone knows it sucks.
Incorrect.

>>91268883
I never really noticed this but now that I think of it it makes sense
>Showing Spongebob how to be mature in Grandma's Kisses
>Patrick helping Spongebob pass his driving test
>Spongebob runs to Patrick to ask about air and Patrick confidently explains to Spongebob that it's just "fancy talk" (putting on airs)

>>91273606
>not Greg

Wrong opinion, bud

>>91274250
He also explained what "sentence enhancers" were.

>>91273459
Toki was also origionally the member of the band who blew off practice constantly because of 'motivation' issues. They kept him being less a part of the creative process but Murderface really took over that role.

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>>91268516
The characters in this show, namely the secondaries. They go from dimwitted assholes to downright evil and blind.

>>91273701
She was great early on, Stevonnie kind of ruined her because she doesn't have to DO anything to help and her unique ways of helping and interacting with Steven have been lost to that weirdly designed thing.

>>91270943
Zuko was the worst handled character in the series.

>>91274377
Explain to me how you could possibly think this please

>>91273724
Joseph got old and DIO was 200 years alone, that's enough to change someone

>>91270353
for Gumball himself it was an overall improvement(he was originally too nice and naive for the whole "everyone and the universe taking turns crapping on him" thing that was one of the main sources of comedy in the show to work properly, it's why they made him more self aware and more of a jerk)

>>91270395
well at least with Dale there's a decent enough excuse for it, what with him starting out as being kinda crazy, one can see it as him just getting crazier over the course of the series, also his was a rare case of actually becoming more complex due to said changes

>>91270525
honestly the only characters who really got negatively afflicted by it were Peggy and Bobby, and in the former's case they actually backpedaled on her flanderization a little, and with the latter they actually occasionally managed to make it work in their favor

>>91273246
well there was Finn for a while being a useless depressed sadsack

>>91273357
>Boondocks
>4 seasons

Nah m8

>>91270720
What? It just kind of jumped from the OoT/MM style right to the toon style, there was no change over time. That's why there was such a harsh initial reaction to going from the darkest game to the lightest. Then it's followed by Twilight Princess, so I have no idea how you're putting these thoughts together.

>>91269564
>Original Steven: Heart of the team that had to learn to grow into his leadership role
>Current Steven: Retarded kid that cries about fucking everything

>Original Pearl: Perfectionist and worried, dotting motherly-type personality
>Current Pearl: Neurotic lesbian that constantly obsesses over muh Rose

>Original Garnet: Strong, stoic, and cool-headed leader of the group
>Current Garnet: Muh fusion

>Original Amethyst: Laid back slacker
>Current Amethyst: Garbage personified

>Original Peridot: Analytical scientist and fish out of water
>Current Peridot: A wacky green dorito buttplug

>Original Lapis: Another fish out of water that just wants to go home
>Current Lapis: Constantly in bitch-mode

I don't even know why I watch this show anymore.

>>91269897
I think it's more that the writers find what everyone likes about a character, latches on to it, then makes that thing their defining trait.

>>91274474
Finn's thing ain't flanderization, him being a mopey sadsack wasn't a part of his original characterization at all. Just character development.

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>>91270412
>Some hack writer will never mistake the two Dr. Lights and write Kimiyko as crazed rapist

>>91271075
>>91273998
I just hate what Cartman has become.

>>91274572
So Steven, Pearl, and Amethyst, and Peridot are the same they've always been?

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Season 4 can suck my dick.

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>>91270959
>>91270752
>>91270099
I hate lesbians so god damn much.
Most authors write them out of wank material and few can even write good heterosexual relationships, let alone tackle a lesbian one.
And compound that with the fact that lesbians are so "safe". Every pleb loves them. Guys love them because >muh dick and girls love them because it's progressive and tolerant and cute.

Labeling any character in any kind of story is a narrative death sentence. It becomes taboo to treat them as actual characters that have flaws because now everybody just wants to watch them have dyke sex.

happened it Kat, Rose, Garnet, Marceline and PB. Every goddamn character that's be touched by this wave of shitty writing.

>>91271689
He's been involved day-to-day overseeing the production for season 10.
The animation is without a doubt improved over other post-movie years, and the writing marginally better. I wouldn't say it's "good again" though, just a little less awful

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>>91268883
>I appreciate SpongeBob on a much deeper level than you do
Kidding. You raise a valid point. But still.

>>91270701
They absolutely have a co-dependent relationship that's insanely unhealthy but the show treats it as the epitome of one.

>>91274572
Ever since we got back into the cancerous filler Townie episodes after the disappointing Human Zoo mini-arc, I dropped it.

They're always used by the writers so they can have Steven preach about off-topic shit that appeals to them like "don't call them rock people, it's offensive!", instead of having magic and action infused to said Townie episodes like how Sugar envisioned in Season 1 so they can be entertaining while being "comfy", but we can't have nice things if Sugar doesn't put some stern rules for the storyboarders and writers to follow to reinforce quality, and that right there seriously harms the quality of the show.

Anyway, what you posted is exactly how I see the characters now as compared to their introduction and first arc, so thanks for putting it in a better format than I would've.

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These aren't the same characters anymore but that's because they've all genuinely grown. This show has so much development

>>91275008
Can you blame them? The fans eat that shit up so fucking much

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5x5BzSidf4

Why not do it when you are going to insane praise regardless of the content?

>>91275008
100% This

>>91274572
exactly how I feel and they are already doing it to the diamonds. The fucking blue diamond is literally Sad from inside out.

Personally I feel they really suck at character development and once the show stopped having a main antagonist (peridot then Jasper) the threat become just homeworld. A faceless threat. So with no current conflict they had to focus on all SoL character development and they just dropped the ball hard.

Peridot and Lapis especially are bad but I fucking LOVE how Steven's literally doesn't change. Like it's a plot point of how he doesn't grow or mature mentally or physically.

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>>91275006
Season 4 was kind of unwatchable
I'd always thought that due to the escalating absurdity s1 was like Black Peanuts, s2 Black Simpsons, and s3 Black South Park
s4 is like Black the Final Season of Roseanne

>>91268851
Stop using the c word in this board.

>>91275167
Final Season of Roseanne?

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>>91268516

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>>91270165
Even in Edds later animations Matt became more self obsessive and stupider

>>91275082
This is the literal opposite of flanderization. The Venture Bros. characters started off as Johnny Quest parodies and gained a healthy dose of character growth throughout the seasons.

>>91269564
Greg and Pearl are the only good characters left on this shit heap of a show.

>>91275343
You like Pearl? Most of her character revolves around loving and missing Greg's dead wife / Steven's dead mother.

>>91274572
Amy has always been a garbage midget though. Her room is literally a junkyard.

>>91275192
As in the last season of the popular sitcom Roseanne. Like all long-running sitcoms it eventually rotted into an unwatchable puddle of muck.

>>91268827
Even though Cheryl became flanderized, she was still kind of crazy at the beginning of the show, obsessing over choking

https://youtu.be/jiRfkmJapAQ

>>91274283
Greg is shit tier, he's a shit father that we are ordered to feel sympathetic with despite having not a single excuse for anything bad he did and still do.

>>91275343
Well, I agree with Greg being the only good character, but not Pearl.

Her character nowadays revolves around nothing but MUH ROSE, so much so that she was interested in a woman just because she vaguely looks like Rose and nothing else.

>>91270959
No the worse part was when Vriska came back to life and somehow stopped Rose's alcoholism and somehow fixed all of Rose's and Kanaya's relationship flaws by randomly swatting a wine glass out of Rose's hands.

>>91275561
I almost get the impression that her epic triumph over that stupid obsession isn't going to come until the end of the show. Like 80% of her character is just, "literally will not fucking develop". Except for the time she went full rebel, for yeah. notRose. Why else.

Moe and Principal Skinner
Randy Marsh and Mr. Garrison

>>91270987
he cheated on her in season 1, he as inept and jerk since the beginning. he just hid it more.

>>91275473
Such as?

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>>91275473
At least he's self-aware and tries to be better than most cartoon fathers.

>>91275561
She hardly even looked like her in comparison. What bothers me more is that they didn't even bother to give her a VA or a real name.

I think that episode was just a one-shot at this point with Pearl since the mystery dyke is NEVER BROUGHT UP AGAIN AFTER THAT.

>>91269062
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN1mlcA0AuM

>>91270353
Richard has stayed shitty since day 1 and with Darwin, he's always been the punching bag to Gumball, so the quality of his character is directly related to the quality of Gumball's.
The other three family members are awful, but the true cancer of the show is the use of the student characters.

>>91271099
I never forgot how in season 1 Zoidberg was supposed to be rich (he had a first class cabin in the Titanic episode) but from season 2 on he was the poorest member of Planet Express to the point that; in the post-revival episodes, he was literally homeless.

>>91272826
Character decay?

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>>91268755
Tfw I remember Cosmo was a reasonable and lovable character in the pilot

>>91268516
Ben Tennyson fits like a T.

>>91274572
Nice pasta.

Warden of Super jail became too much of a manchild.
But in the end the formula changes and Mike Lazzo's tightening constraints were what killed the show.

>>91270439
>making Steven sad is the worst crime and it's always your fault because he's always right
Reminds me of that shit episode where Steven mind swapped with Lars and suffered no consequences for it.

>>91276256
Wasnt he always one?

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>>91268609
After rewatching season 1 & 2 it's almost alarming how much of a cry for help Lisa was.
>Hey, Mom, these paintings are good. I know first hand how fragile young talent is. I’d love to hear the particulars of how your gift was squashed.

>Bart: Hey, Lis, what do you call those guys in chess that don't matter?
>Lisa: Well, a blockaded bishop is of little value, but I think you're referring to a pawn.
>Bart: Right, I am a pawn.
>Lisa: I know. It's times like this I'm thankful that Dad has little to no interest in almost everything I do.

A gifted kid with no one to nurture her. Ignored by family, shit on at school, already aware that she has no future but manages to love her shit family anyway.

How she went from that to an annoying over-confident liberal know-it-all so fast is anyone's guess, but I guess part of it was to focus more on the comedy and Lisa being on suicide watch didn't mesh with that.

>>91275008
of all the girls to be gay it had to be the better troll girl

>>91268516
Has there ever been a case where a character has actually reverted back to the original character personality? Like there's a Flanderized character that slowly becomes more reasonable and less stereotypical?

>>91275204
I want to say the moment his voice got really high pitched is when he became nothing but a retard

>>91276416
Archer kinda has. They're still flanderized compared to how the show started, but they've been toned down somewhat from the absolute worst it was.

>>91268516
The Guardians of the Galaxy after the movie came out were just turned into Flanderized versions of the movie characters by hack writers.

>>91276416
Some might argue John from homestuck

In the first acts of the comic, he was a playful, prankster-ish character who definitely wasn't above being an asshole.
Around them middle of the comic he became a friendly doormat to everyone else and he became quite a bit dumber in all his interactions with other characters.
Towards the end, he started acting like an asshole at times again and became a bit more at ends with everyone and everything.

But at the same time, the writing in the last legs of the comic was terrible and I don't think it was deliberate at all.

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>>91275204
i've stopped watching that since long ago, what did they do to the show? curious

Also, why has no one even mentioned family guy?

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>>91276553
the curse of john numbers affected all cosmos.

>>91274572
>Current Steven: Retarded kid that cries about fucking everything
The problem isn't that Steven is retarded, it's that as a protagonist he's become infallible. He's the good guy and everyone is either his friend or mortal enemy, no through any fault of his own though. He doesn't go to school but that's no problem because somehow his social skills are amazing and even if he did go to school he'd ace every test with no effort. Everyone he talks to will either have a change of heart or just straight disappear for long periods of time (Jasper). He's so pure of heart he feels guilt for character that have actually tried to kill him and he just defended himself (Eyeball and Bismuth) This shit has gotten ridiculous.
>>91270701
It vexes me that they have co-dependent relationship but none of the writers see this as a bad thing. Being lovey dovey with your girlfriend all the time and being incapable of leaving them for more than a moment is not healthy, it's downright detrimental to everyone around them. Is no one on the Crewniverse married?

>>91268883
OG Patrick was funny because his dynamic with SpongeBob is something you see IRL all the time. The pair of dorks where one deludes himself into thinking he's not a dork and the other embraces it is such a real thing.

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>>91276025
>the true cancer of the show is the use of the student characters
What

>>91276631
>implying co-dependence is bad

>>91276553
Forgone conclusion?

>>91276750
It's horrible. In real life it's suicide. In cartoons it's just lazy uninteresting waste of time. The characters had no reason to fall in love before that state was switched on on them, and since then, 0 evolution, and it's never gonna change because the writers are oblivious to it and see it as a perfect state only a nazi shitlords would criticize.

>>91276553
One thing I will say is I never got the whole Meg thing.

>>91276805
shut up Meg

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>>91268516
The entire cast.

>>91269859
When the American Dennis stared he was not a bitch,almost a psychopath. Calmed down later.

>>91276805
You know I was just thinking about that today. If the writers hate Meg so much, why not just have her ship off to college or something? Removing her really wouldn't change any kind of dynamic.

>>91269564
>mfw you're not wrong

>>91270865

Tom is a mentally and emotionally unstable manchild and libcuck who is only successful now because of his past associations with Eddsworld. He's notorious in the British Youtube scene for being unreliable and hard to work with, as well as being flaky when it comes to paying people he commissions on time and in full. He's constantly pissing other British comedy Youtubers off because on top of all of that he doesn't know how to keep his mouth shut and has burned countless bridges in the community over the years.

Edd died five years ago and Tom is STILL hung up on it. He tried to make it all about him when Edd died and continues to use Edd's death as a crutch and excuse for why he's a fat, immature piece of shit to this day.

>>91268664
but i liked flanderised archer

>>91276400
It's sort of stemming from the same area I feel.
Lisa's cries for help stem from the fact she's WAY TOO smart for a 7-8 year old and it would come out in different ways like her interests in things that someone like her shouldn't be interested in and also observations like
>Well, I wish that you wouldn't. Because, aside from the fact that he has the same frailties as all human beings, he's the only father I have. Therefore, he is my model of manhood, and my estimation of him will govern the prospects of my adult relationships. So I hope you bear in mind that any knock at him is a knock at me. And I am far too young to defend myself against such onslaughts.
That would warp itself into her absurd maturity becoming a know it all.
>>91276873
They probably don't, it's more she's their Zoidberg/Gil/Moleman but they're on a show that has become really malicious and bleak so it comes across as way more meanspirited
Like Meg before cancellation was just a whiny teenage girl who hates her family for embarrassing her not the most to take advantage of. So they just took the few jokes about her being the overlooked child and being ugly and pushed them to 11.
The writers are just lazy there's no personal spite against Meg, no more than towards the rest of the show atleast.

>>91268883
Yeah, Patrick went from your shitty advice giving friend who's a little lazy to an absolute buffoon. It's pretty disappointing.

>>91268516
>cast_of_archer.jpg

>>91268516
flander never really became "flanderized"

he was always that way.
you just didn't see him as much because he wasn't as big a part of the show in the early episodes.

>>91268749
Pretty much.

Bart is pretty pathetic

>>91275440
>she was still kind of crazy at the beginning of the show, obsessing over choking
and this had to be dropped for no other reason whatsoever beyond UK laws changing prohibiting the depiction of choking, spanking, etc. in media

>>91276873
They dont hate her, she's just the punching bag. There was an entire episode devoted to her actually being the one that holds the family together.

>>91275008
You've hit the nail on the head when it comes to describing the problem with pandering to progressives. You're forced the play it incredibly safe with the "diverse" characters or the readership will turn on you in an instant.

>>91268749
what's UK dennis the menace? does he trick women into getting abortions?

>>91276727
You think I want to look at the boring ass Cal-Arts bean faces that are the Watterson's when I watch this show?
I sure as hell don't. I want Gumball and Darwin to get into wacky shenanigans with the students.

>>91275902
>since the mystery dyke is NEVER BROUGHT UP AGAIN AFTER THAT.
Its been like what, ten episodes since then? Don't let the length of time between episodes confuse you when it comes to length of time in-show.

>>91268755
>Cosmo used to be reasonable, just not book smart
>Now he's a pants on head retard who can't tie his own shoes

>>91277269
But that anon was responding to the person calling the other students the cause of the cancer.

>>91275008


how does it feel to be such a bigoted faggot

>>91277298
he must have a huge dick to keep wanda around

>>91274283
Oh shit I forgot about him
He is the best tier character

>>91273433
You've forgotten about episodes like The Laziest (purposefully devises an elaborate game to get his children to do his work for him) or The Prank (goes full psycho on pranking Gumball and Darwin (tried to drop a brick on him) despite signs of legitimate fear and the property damage he seemed to intentionally deal to the house).

Has current Richard ever intentionally caused misery on his family members for his personal pleasure?

>>91269564

>What is character development?

>>91277150
Wrong; he was slightly better than Homer in every way; his wife was prettier, his kids were better-behaved, he made a little more money, his body was in better shape, and his faith was more sincere. The last one was only a single part of the picture.

>>91276111
Could work, but I don't know how accurate it is. Decay implies that they just "get worse" rather than being effectively boiled down into very particular traits that are then made more outlandish than they were previously. There's more to a character being flanderized than simple decay.

>>91268883
>>91268516
Is there a name for reverse flanderization?

I really liked how Venture Brothers made Henchman 21 go from a gag character, and turned him into a serious threat, even going so far as being able to fight with Brock, with what had happened to Henchman 24.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tE87hH8hdIw
https://youtu.be/RK1grk4yxcw

>>91277401
I won't argue.
I know I'm right.

also, later simpsons is alright.

there's a few diamonds in the rough anyhow. the show has actually changed very little. probably why it's still on the air.

>>91275019
Aaaaaand now he has ALS.
Unless that's a meme.
Please tell me it's just a meme.

>>91277442
It's called good character development.

>>91277442
we just call that character development.

>>91270412
>this guy turning into doctor rape in the mid 00s
He'd been a ridiculous Silver Age jobber for decades the way Captain Boomerang was prior to Legends.

In the 60s/70s, Arthur was literally beaten up by the Newsboy Legion who consisted of nonpowered under-12 kids, then Secret Origins painted him as a coward covering up his accidental murder of a shitbag partner (only interested in developing the tech so he could meet and fuck Donna Troy), then literally haunted by his partner's ghost in full Ghost of Marley chains regalia. Then, John Ostrander reintroduced Arthur as someone threatening to expose the Squad if they didn't let him in (as long as he didn't have to fight kids), got yelled down by Waller, then finally had a one-shot issue where a demon decided it would be funny to make him just immortal enough to die several times in the issue before fucking off.

IC's entire point was handwaving guys like this as being the victims of Zatanna's mindfuckery, so he was a perfect character to use.

Unfortunately like most things in IC it was handled hamfistedly and regrettably the Doctor Rape characterization stuck.

>>91273666
He loves ska SO MUCH, that he had a checkerboard pattern tattooed on his forearm

>>91273409
What they did to Garnet was the worst

>You know our cool, mysterious, leader? Turns out she's two worse characters in a trenchcoat so get used to it because "Garnet" is gone, there is only Ruby and Sapphire now.

>>91268749
because his VA is a Scientologist and gives most of her paycheck to that cult.

the writers aren't fans of that crap

>>91277568
>the writers aren't fans of that crap
>this completely explains why they rewrote the character

They aren't Trey and Matt, anon, they did their Scientology parody episode and the midget sucked it up

>>91270876
>Purple Smart got worse
This is almost a constant with characters that Tara Strong voices but I can't for the life of me believe it's in any measure her fault unless someone can prove otherwise.

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>>91275008
>Need some attention or a shield for criticism? Add lesbians!

>>91268516
Fairly Oddparents
Simpsons
Family Guy
Spongebob
Futurama

>>91275167
I can't imagine how bad season 4 is.
I truly love season 1, and season 2 was such a sharp decline I just couldn't watch it. I've seen the occasional clip of season 3 which is worse, and yet people seem to like those seasons. 4 must be truly unbearable.

>>91270943
Naming that show Avatar is like naming another show Madoka: the supposed deuteragonist's B plot turns out to be the actual A plot.

>>91272754
Of course not, it was only a matter of time after Faust left

>>91270155
>Your Pokémon Adventure Starts Now!

>>91272826
>what they called it before Flanders
nothing because no one actually needed TVTropes and no one does still

>>91270226
Sugar was born in the Live journal era.

Most of that generations work has been destroyed or lost due to the internet growing so fast.

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>>91277342
fucking good. Like 10 orgasms at once all the time.

>>91277342
he has not once objected to actual lesbians and nothing he said there re: fiction is in any sense inaccurate

stay upset

>>91277150
His roles were pretty different.
Compare him in the episode where he makes a BET with Homer and loser has to wear a dress.
In the end they both lose and he's cool with it saying it reminded of his Frat days.

Modern Flanders would girlishly panic about entering a bet because that's a sin and when they lost he'd panic about God sending him to hell for crossdressing.

Not to say flanderization is completely bad, it's more just something people latch onto when the writing is terrible overall but a lot of characters work better for comedy when they're kind of over the top. Like crazy Cheryl and slutty blob Pam are good in Season 2 and on of Archer, they become less fun when the quality of everything starts going down in later seasons. If they didn't go that route they'd be "receptionist who kept changing her name" and "pushover HR manager"
>>91277750
Poor Skinner, he's probably got this the worst of everyone.

>>91276631
>Is no one on the Crewniverse married?
I have a feeling most US/CA storyboarders right now are ugly gay men / future cat ranchers both of whom learned everything about human relationships from webcomics.

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>>91270155
When a fan artist can actually do this better, something is obviously fucking wrong.

>>91277845
>Poor Skinner, he's probably got this the worst of everyone.
>You just got an ex Green Baret mad.

>>91268618
>I wonder how they called that trope before the Simpsons, because it always existed in fiction.
The usual way, they didn't have a one-word term to use so they described it. "He/she has turned into a parody of him/herself" or something like that.

>>91270701
There relationship is really unhealthy, imo.

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>>91277880
>>91270155
>Haha I know better than the rest of the industry! Model sheets don't allow my BRILLIANT boarders any freedom to express themselves! After all this is their show, not mine

>>91269564
>>91274572
>/co/ doesn't know what static characters are
The only flanderized character is Peridot. And for some reason everyone for got that Steven is growing balls, half the shit he did in Seasons 4 and he would've never have been able to do in the first one.

Pearl had a boner for Rose since season 1, Lapis just calmed the fuck down, Garnet doesn't have to keep being a fusion a secret to Steven anymore and Amethyst's inferiority complex is just more obvious, and only comes up with it makes sense.

>>91277880
They're not actually using the proportions she's revealed to have(?) after they took her limb enhancers to make her 'smol' and 'cute', though. It looks better, sure, but it's not accurate.
Yes, I get the irony in that statement.

>>91277693
Most of the episodes that aren't season openers, finales or specials are just kinda "meh" now. It's not bad, but the formula of reforming villians to feel friendship or whatever can often easily lead to flanderization. I wonder if they'll ever make another episode featuring pink and silver bully girls now that their """""arc""""" is over. At least they sometimes still mix it up, like in the S6 finale, especially one scene at the end.

ok, here's one ive never seen anyone talk about.

grimes from ugly americans went from a hardass who bullied people due to some deep seated issues to a whiny bitch by thr 2nd season. the demon boss suffered from a similar issue. it was the reason i wasnt that possed when it was canceled.

>>91277464
Nope. He's as good as gone.

>>91277987
It would have been a better look honestly. I'm surprised TheBoogie hasn't drawn Peridot getting fucked yet seeing he has a thing for small women.

>>91277640
I miss Fitz.

He was too good for this world.

>>91278135
He's more into Sapphire since he has a thing for covered eyes and big lips

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>>91268664
Dick crazy masochistic firestarter Cheryl is the best. But everyone else is meh.

>>91278109
he'll be fine.

>>91274283
>Became a millionaire
>still lives in his van

Greg is shit

>>91277845
his character fluctuates actually. most characters in the simpsons do, since there's essentially no continuity and the writers don't give a shit.
look at all the times marge contradicts herself over the seasons.

it's laughably inconsistent. it's just lazy writing.

>>91276176
Eh, I disagree.

Ben has generally grown as a character throughout the series.

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>>91274124
it was alright.

>>91278328
I guess Omni Ben is a step up from AF Ben.
He went
>Bratty Kid
>Bland Dishwater
>Douchey Teen

>>91268755
>Cosmo was suave as fuck in the pilot
>Gave him an annoying high pitched voice instead for most of the series

It's not fair.

>>91270943
Sokka had almost as much character development as Zuko honestly. I remember his existence in season one was 50% being the butt of slapstick and 50% the victim of every "sexism is bad" moral lesson.

>>91276843
Mike, Sue, Jasmine, David and Paulo are the same.

In fact that's the main problem with Paulo

What if a character is actually intended to become more extreme in some of his views?
Does that tend to be confused with flanderization?
Because it's normal for people to change with time.

>>91278701
It's really hard to write it well, because you have to be careful to sufficiently justify it both in-universe and to the audience. I'm actually curious myself as to whether there are any examples of this.

>>91277970
I don't get that people want garnet to just stay mysterious and stoic. That just sounds frustrating, I don't want static characters in the main cast of a shoe like SU.

I feel like they write here as a pretty convincing mix of the two she's fused from. One is careful and can see the forest for the trees. One is quick to react, and sees it for the forest. At your best, you have a decisive leader. At your worst, you have someone who can barely act. But garnet keeps composure, and mostly stays the former. That's what makes her garnet.

>>91277686
This post is pure autism.
The Gaang's story got like 3/4 of the runtime, even excluding the later parts when Zuko joined them.
>But muh deep characterizashun
No.

>>91277721
Fuck you, TVT is amazing, even if a bit too autistic for my refined taste.
The site management really is shit though.

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>>91270720
So... starting with this?

>>91271075

In the case of Cartman it's on purpose. What they did to Stan and Kyle is fucking criminal.

The reality is that Matt and Trey have gotten old. They're nearly 45 years old, now, still working on a show that they started when they were in their mid 20's just out of college. They used to be able to relate to childishly poking fun at the world and they used the kids to point out the absurdities. Now, they take everything way too seriously, which is really what the last season was about: It was about the death of satire and the inability for even them, the kings of satire, to keep things lighthearted.

>>91268516
What's the author's name? Actually, don't tell me. This comic is spot on but he's a fucking douche IRL and almost all of his other work is just awful. He has drawing skills, he just uses them to point out flaws in realities that he himself imagined.

>>91273835
>Patrick was a big guy
For you

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>>91277342
But anon, he's complaining about bigoted faggots
Literally

>>91278480
Sokka had actual character development.
Zuko went from being a whiny asshole son of the Fire Lord to being a whiny asshole Fire Lord.
Still better than most of the Gaang, though.

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>>91278828
>tfw no Shield to go with Sword

>>91278834
they're just going to work on south park until CC cancels it.

seems strange. how much money do you need? you'd think they would want to do something else now. same with the simpsons.

>>91275008
>It becomes taboo to treat them as actual characters that have flaws
>>91277342
>how does it feel to be such a bigoted faggot
Poetry

>>91268801
this troper thinks that your belief that the term 'flanderization' originated from TVT is wrong

>>91268883
>Turning him into a bumbling blithering idiot is the best example of new writers not "getting" a character I can think of.
one of Hillenburg's favourite episodes, Valentine's Day, is all about Patrick being a bumbling blithering idiot

>>91276805

Meg wasn't always hated by all of them though. In the original seasons, she was just a socially awkward teenage girl who tried new things and fucked them up because she was a teenager. One of the first seasons has Lois and Peter go to some event of hers and Lois is overjoyed at the fact her daughter is trying it, even if she is a wierdo about it.

The family guy character who got Flanderized is not Meg, it's Lois: She went from trying hard and actually caring about her kids to a selfish alcoholic slut who just goes along with Peter's retarded antics. I mean, it's a comedy show, it's supposed to be funny, but watching a mother shit on her kids isn't funny as much as it is unsettling.

>>91278882
Both get giant paychecks and no one left on The Simpsons at this point has any actual creative passion

>>91274250
it seems some of the post-movie episodes randomly kept this in. Squid's Visit, he's the one giving SpongeBob advice, too.

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>>91270230
>Spongebob transitioned to being more of a dumb, asexual manchild
>asexual
He has a thing for Squidward

>>91278882

Yeah, but Comedy Central will never have the balls to kill it. At this point, most of the long-running cartoons are declining in quality.

South Park peaked years ago with the World of Warcraft episode: http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0121955

Simpsons is still (somehow) declining and has been since season 8: graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0096697

Futurama is still going down: http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0149460

It's more a matter of time than anything else.

>>91268851
and then absolutely nothing changes so it might be character stagnation
maybe we should make a term for that too and name it after Brian?

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This asshole went from good friend to selfish prick from the pilot movie to the first episode of the cartoon. I don't even know if it's Flanderization since he didn't even possess those characteristics to begin with.

>>91279157
That's more obsession with a big brother figure than romantic or sexual.

>>91268883
fuck I never thought about it before but you really nailed it on the head

>>91270838
The Korra backlash has officially gone too far.

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>>91270395
>>91274474
mmm hol up tho

dale has the right to be crazy

there really was a plot against him

>>91276873
I've watched several S12 episodes recently and Meg was present for random episodic jokes but nobody really was shitting on her purposely moreso than on any other character. so the whole Meg hate thing seems kinda irrelevant, tho maybe later seasons feature it again?

>>91279235
That's my post, and I still think ATLA is the best cartoon ever made. I'm just unbiased enough to recognize its massive flaws.

>>91279163
>South Park peaked years ago with the World of Warcraft episode: http://graphtv.kevinformatics.com/tt0121955
Well, I mean they realized that they're becoming stale so they tried something new with an over-arching plot, and it was fairly well received at first. The last season turned out shit only because they were writing based on false prognosis.

>>91278438
Cosmo was supposed to be voiced by Phil Hartman. Then he had to go die :-(

>>91279285
>stupid muricans make their own typical shonen anime
>most shonen animes have better plot and characterization than most western cartoons
>stupid muricans start considering it the best cartoon ever because they finally got a glimpse of what quality is

>>91279285
>recognizing the flaws of a thing you love is the same as saying every character was flanderized
?

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>>91273666
Ska's alright, tho.

>>91279353
I'm sorry, what exactly is wrong with that? Unless you mean anime should be considered cartoons...
>>91279371
In this case? Yep.

>>91278839

Winston Rountree?

>>91277956
>After all this is their show, not mine
I think it's all but guaranteed at this point that Sugar regrets her "besties sleepover" methodology and given the chance won't repeat it.

>>91268755
>Tootie
lol wut? She and Katswell are the only Hartman females that DIDN'T get flanderized!

Vicky went from being mean to kids to wanting to take over the world, Trixie went from being a snob into being a psychopathic ex-girlfriend. I don't think Tootie ever did anything more over the top than just wanting Timmy to marry her.

>>91279954
I really don't know why she thought treating a massive network project as a social club was a good idea

They're there to work with you not be your friends that you never criticize or say no to

>>91278160
> hey remember all that awesome shit we had her learn that might even qualify as minor character development? Yeah she got hit on the head and forgot it all

All they had to do was make her decide she was tired of being a star esp. considering it was revealed that her entire success was one rich creepy fan who's dead now.

I mean I get that they realized how much of a shitshow S5 was and wanted a status quo reset, but they didn't even need to give her amnesia.

>>91278438
>Gave him an annoying high pitched voice instead for most of the series
>>91279315
>Cosmo was supposed to be voiced by Phil Hartman

Also it's not entirely coincidental that Cosmo/Wanda's VAs are also Timmy's parents' VAs so they kinda want to avoid highlighting that fact

>>91279163

futurama ended bud.

>>91280006
>I really don't know why she thought treating a massive network project as a social club was a good idea

Because she spent too many years living that experience under Pen Ward and didn't see a downside to it. Ironically had she stayed on AT she would have.

Pen gets props for being a Calarts grad who broke with tradition by NOT exclusively hiring fellow Calarts grads for his first show. Until you look at the results and realize that some of these closed-minded, incestuous industry practices had reasons for being there.

Sugar should have learned more from EE&E and less from AT. Look what AT did for poor Nat who threw herself into the deep end of the pool with Bee & Puppycat and took most of the blame for what happened (a large part of which was Frederator's fault).

>>91279202
Don't get me started on the episode with Mac's birthday.

>>91273679
It's kinda fitting in Always Sunny because all of the characters seem to be going mad in some way, reflected by how the episodes have been going

>>91268577
>Edd has been dead for 5 years

>>91278480
He grew out of that in the first five episodes. They had an episode planned that was in the pitch but never actually went into production where he met a bunch of Earth nation soldiers who quickly destroyed his illusions of battle being a glorious thing, that was another part of his character they dropped pretty early on. It still took him till Season 3 until he could really handle himself in battle without the others, before that he was just the snarky smart guy.

>>91274572
>Constantly in bitch-mode
I have clinical depression and was in bitch-mode 24/7, is kinda of realistic