Roy Thomas on the Iron Fist controversy

As an Asian, I am far more annoyed at the bad combat choreography than anything to do with skin colour.

Iron Fist is a bad show, and it is horrible that skin colour debates are hiding the real problems. I am here for good fights and they failed to deliver.

>>90932093
As a white person I agree with this guy. The criticisms about the character being white are being used to mask the actual criticism that the show sucked and the lead actor was terrible.

>>90932040
Thank you, Roy, for being one of the few voices of sanity in an industry (and probably even a society) going batshit crazy.

>>90932040
Based Roy

>>90932040

Absolutely based.

>>90932093

The only good argument for Danny being asian is the fights would have probably been better kek.

>>90932040
Roy for me is one of the best adapters of scripts , from books or short stories to comic books
Example almost all the numbers that involve him in conan the barbarian series and other series like savage sword of conan etc.
But as conan roy has no place in this world full of SJW BUT I'm glad he told the truth about iron fist

>>90932040
What is his fucking problem?

>>90932502

He's white.

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>>90932040
Dayum.

>>90932502
I think he stated it already.

He should come back to Marvel with Shooter and replace everybody currently there.

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>>90932040
>that Iron Fist isn’t Oriental, or whatever word? I know Oriental isn’t the right word now, either

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>>90932040
>Don’t these people have something better to do than to worry about the fact that Iron Fist isn’t Oriental, or whatever word? I know Oriental isn’t the right word now, either
madman

Britfag here. Why do Yanks have a problem with Oriental?

>>90932764
They're retarded and want to get offended by everything. They think Colored people is offensive while People of Color isn't

My Jap mother and my asian co worker use the world oriental when talking about asians. When did it become the wrong word if asians use it

>>90932764
It's racist ;)

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>>90932764
>>90932868
At some point we decided it was a flavor instead.

>>90932093
>>90932168
As a half-breed slope/cracker I gotta say I couldn't give less of a shit if Danny was white, the story was boring and was poorly choreographed.

>>90932764
Oriental refers to objects, not people. Ramen noodles are "oriental." Chopsticks are "oriental." Ching-Chong Lee, the owner of your local laundromat, is not "oriental."

>>90932764
Carryover from when Americans thought all East-Asian culture were interchangeable. It goes hand-in-hand with our contempt for underpaid Asian railroad workers in the 1800's.

It's really only considered offensive over here.

>>90932040
Roy Thomas is associated with literally 0 good Iron Fist comics so it makes sense that he'd defend a bad show as well. A legacy of mediocrity.

>>90932418
>The only good argument for Danny being asian is the fights would have probably been better kek.

How is that a good argument? The lead being Asian wouldn't have stopped the choreography from being shit

https://www.bleedingcool.com/2017/03/21/iron-fist-co-creator-roy-thomas-complaining-culture-appropriation-crap-like-makes-furious/

Even the comments section is getting into a fight

>>90932948
But it just means from the orient, whether it's people or objects. Like European, or African.

Asians refers to people from India and Pakistan in the UK anyway, so we need another word for Chinks.

Why is it alright to make a character black or asian or a girl or gay or whatever the flavor of the month is but make them white and then suddenly everyone shits their britches

I mean I think it's retarded either way to do that kinda thing but if you're gonna change a character's race whenever it's convienent at least don't have a double standard about it.

>>90932987
Mediocre attempt, anon

Why aint anyone have a problem with Doctor Strange being a Chinaman when he did the exact same thing as Iron Fist and went to some Chinese country and learned some Orietal mystic arts kung fu shit

>>90932040
Luke cages first half and the first half of DD S2 are the only good things about Marvel shoes. Iron Fiat is junk

>>90933039
The reason it's "ok" is because historically most characters have been white, and changing them to something else is "refreshing" and "tolerant"
but changing something not white to white is "oppressive" and "whitewashing."
It's pretty dumb. I especially thought the whole Tilda Swinton being the ancient one in Dr. Strange controversy was ridiculous, because the original character was nearly racist, stereotypical old asian master fu manchu buck teeth caricature.

>>90933039
>what is might whitey
>what is great white hope
The people really raising a stink about it had the concept of the white guy coming in and mastering "the thing" better than anyone fromt hat culture ever has.
And I'm sure some of the Asians just want to see some representation on screen that isn't a Chinese exclusive extra scene.
End of the day though, finn is a bad actor, the show runner mad fucking Dexter and the fight scenes are awful.
This Iron fist couldnt beat Matt Murdock in a fight let alone a dragon.

>>90933039
>It's okay when we do it
That's pretty much it.

>>90933149
Phone posting, are we?

Isn't the showrunner also working on the Inhumans TV show/TV-movie-in-IMAX?

>>90933242
He is also known for Dexter seasons 6-8

>>90932093
>bad combat choreography

Aw man I was so looking forward to IF... but if they fucked up the most vital part of it I'm probably not going to watch it.

>>90932040
Roy truly is one of the greats.

>>90933149
>Iron Fiat is junk
I agree. They haven't made a good car since the X1/9.

>>90932948
Oriental means they're from the east you tard since it comes from the Latin word oriens. A person from the far east is, thus, certainly an oriental. Maybe you should just go back to calling westerners occidentals if you're so butt blasted about it though.

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>>90932420
>roy has no place in this world full of SJW

He is, but he's an SJW in the best possible way. He saw that there weren't any black superheroes in golden age DC, so he took matters into his own hands and made Amazing-Man. He didn't bitch at someone else to do it, he did it himself because he decided to be the change he wanted to be.

>>90933021
I was expecting it to be either Rich (master shit stirrer) or that chick who seems to exist only to turn everything into a social justice issue but I guess I should've expected it to be written by that faggot Jude Terror too. He's like the worst qualities of both of them combined into one person.

>>90932948

Orient just means east, its no different when Americans are called occidentals

>>90932764
To Americans, Asians are the almond eyed yellow folks, not the brown subcontinentals you're more likely to call Asians.

>>90933760
Brits call Middle Easterners Asians for some odd reason. I suppose it's because it's all in Asia, but that would also include 75% of Russia and all of Israel. So that would make Russians and Jews Asians as well.

>>90933634
Excelent roy is even better than i think

Based Roy.

I hope Stan doesn't consume you yet.

>>90933666
No one is called Occidental. People take the time to acknowledge western races and cultures by saying American, Canadian, Mexican, etc. When you say "Oriental" it means you don't actually give a shit about who you're talking to and just want to lump them together because you can't be bothered to figure it out.

I mean, who really fucking cares but if you're gonna be a lazy offensive shit just admit it. Everyone here says nigger because they want to be offensive and don't care. Trying to justify it otherwise just makes you look like a tool.

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>>90934129
>When you say "Oriental" it means you don't actually give a shit about who you're talking to and just want to lump them together because you can't be bothered to figure it out.

>When you say "Asian" it means you don't actually give a shit about who you're talking to and just want to lump them together because you can't be bothered to figure it out.

>>90933878
It makes sense enough.
Asia was- to Europe- Anatolia, the Levant, Arabia and Persia for like 2000 years before they could make regular direct contact with even India. Asia as "the Middle East" makes sense.

It also makes sense that Britain would think of South Asians as "Asian" because they owned ALL of India for centuries, and therefore had much more contact with them than East Asians, who ended up more common in the Americas because they ended up being a replacement cheap labour after slavery ended.

>>90934129
>No one is called Occidental.
Maybe they should. Fair is fair isn't it my oriental friend?

>>90932093
Supposedly Jones only had three weeks to train, so hopefully it'll improve with Defenders and season 2.

>>90932168
>criticisms about the character being white are being used to mask the actual criticism that the show sucked
That would imply that the SJW types actually watched said show when, in actual fact, they were bitching as soon as the casting was announced.

Also if you look up reviews of either Dark Matter or Into The Badlands you'll find these same self-righteous twats bitching about "yet another Asian male who uses martial arts, that's like, SUCH a racial stereotype man!"

They're literally just looking for an excuse to bitch.

>>90934310
I just wish the would shave the damn pubic hair stubble and straighten his hair. Would look so much more like Danny. Besides, I think the actor who played young Danny had straight hair.

>>90934129
The same happens with South Americans and you don't see them bitching.

>>90932764
I've always preferred Celestial.

>>90934310
>Supposedly Jones only had three weeks to train, so hopefully it'll improve with Defenders and season 2.
That only absolves the actor, but pushes the blame onto both the director and the producer instead. As in the studio never planned to have good fight scenes to begin with. That is arguably worse than just having a bad actor.

>>90934310
>>90934356
Aside of Finn's lacking fighting skills he should've lifted more, or tone up at least. I can't take his twink body seriously.

>>90932040

Based. He doesn't give a fuck.

>>90934381
The funny part is that they could've avoided if they given him some sort of costume and have the double do the fighting.

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>>90934410
Iron Fist had been pretty skinny before. Perhaps the collar would make him look bigger too.

>>90932093
As a Gelgamek I agree.

>>90932560
This plus Steranko. He's great too.

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>>90934464
Yeah, I get IF isn't jacked up ala Captain America but he was Cucumberbatch tier.

>>90932093
As Finn Jones I agree.

If they had cast the black guy they were originally considering everyone in this thread would be bitching just as much as the "SJW"s

You're all bitches

>>90934570
Two niggers are too much.

>>90934129
>No one is called Occidental.

in latino the cartoon American Dragon is called Dragon Occidental

>>90934129
They get called Westerners which is pretty much the same.

>>90934590
>thinks he's gonna be in the Race War
>can't handle seeing even two blacks

Hope you've been preparing your anus, fuckmeat

>>90934670
At least you tried.

>>90934310
>season 2
I'm gonna say the chances of this happening are low.

>>90934353
This.
I dont know why anyone would listen to these people when theyre are clearly insane

>>90933184
>The people really raising a stink about it had the concept of the white guy coming in and mastering "the thing" better than anyone fromt hat culture ever has.

What if they switch the Kung Fu to 'boxing'? Will everything be alright then? I mean, they're both martial arts. One just happens to have developed a sportive culture around it and the other devolved into a sort of high impact dance.

>>90934715
5 stars in Netflix ratings. If they get him right in Defenders then a S2 is more than secured. Although, personally I'd prefer a Heroes for Hire show instead.

>>90934353
>Also if you look up reviews of either Dark Matter or Into The Badlands you'll find these same self-righteous twats bitching about "yet another Asian male who uses martial arts, that's like, SUCH a racial stereotype man!"

Shouldn't you screencap reviewers who complained about Iron Fist's lead and complained about Dark Matter or Into The Badlands for comparisons?

>>90934129
Shitty anecdote trigger warning. Some arab/middle eastern families I know use the Occident and the West synonymously. Nobody else says that though. They must've had a weird English teacher or something. It's a bit novel, though, being labeled a member of "The Occident."

>>90933021
>I am a super lefty, sjw, bleeding heart, cucked, liberal snowflake

I don't think he knows what he just called himself.

>>90934570
That would fuck up his dynamic with Luke.

>>90934745
>suggesting that Kung Fu isn't just Chinese Boxing by another name.

>>90934464
To be fair, a lot of traditional training in older martial arts tends more towards calisthenics exercises. So he wouldn't necessarily have to be bulky.

>>90934129
I wouldn't give a shit if you called me an occidental.

>>90933039
Logic is literally unknown to these kinds of people save for the rare occasions that it furthers their world view.

>>90935722
I doubt any American does.

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>>90932040

the absolute madman

>>90932764
>implying America has a problem with it

Try asking your relatives from the world's biggest penal colony.

>>90932652
>>90932677
Yeah that's not going to help him much but I fucking laughed ast well.

>>90932764
It's out of date and out of fashion like colored people and the word "occidental" or "octroon"

>>90937045
What is the right word to use here? And why do people say only a certain demographic can practice martial arts?

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>>90932040
OP you need to put a trigger warning when you post things like this, it took me an hour to calm down after reading it because I couldn't even

>>90934129
newfag leave

>>90932040
Sounds perfectly reasonable.

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>>90932040
>All those snakes in the grass turning on him on plebbit and facebook

>>90933184
>And I'm sure some of the Asians just want to see some representation on screen that isn't a Chinese exclusive extra scene.
It's not like there aren't already a good number of American movies with Asian leads doing Kung Fu. They'd have more of a point if it wasn't a Kung Fu show, because aside from Harold (and Kumar) and (technically) Tommy Chong there really haven't that many Asian leads that aren't there for kicky punchies.

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>>90933184
>coming in and mastering "the thing" better than anyone from that culture ever has

Where's this outrage towards Samurai fucking Jack? You either go all the way with your standards or admit that you're racist.

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>>90934356
I'm not very good at photoshop, but I tried to take away the beard and give him straighter hair. Also inverted the colors of the robe.

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>>90934129
The Japanese are even less specific than that.

>>90932418
>>90932278
Doesn't take much to impress you faggots.

>>90934812
We use "occident" and "occidental" in French, we don't have another equivalent for western. In French "western" is exclusively a genre of movies.

>>90937750
That is so much better.

>>90934812
>It's a bit novel, though, being labeled a member of "The Occident."
It reminds me of in highschool, when many people had no idea what "Caucasian" actually meant. Because they are too used to use "white" to describe themselves.

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>>90932040
>hiring Scott Buck
As a former Dexterfag, I can tell that this was Iron Fist's real downfall and true root of all the problems with the show.
Actually, you had it relatively easy IF-fags.

This is the man who thought that that the related clip is a good way to create drama.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=txRys6Vw2OM

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>>90933184
>mightywhites
Speaking of that.
You know what I really hate? Wannabe comedians that write shit like this.
They're obviously trying to make a point, "oh your racist show is so stupid and racist look how goofy this premise is if you think about it."

And all I can think of is "This would be fucking awesome, I would totally read it/watch it".

This is recent, for Iron Fist of course, but I remember the same thing was said for season 2 of Daredevil, when he fought The Hand, and the usualy poeple started ditching about "oh ninjas, how medieval, think if a japanese dude came here and fought an ancient order of zombie cowboys, would that make sense?"

That would be fucking awesome.
I'm pretty sure it was Kate Leth that said it that time. Like, bitch, instead of writing about fucking bed bugs, how about you pitch this idea?!

>>90937513

Asian would be the catch-all, but something a little more specific - e.g., Japanese, Chinese - would be better.

And it isn't about how only "a certain demographic" can practice martial arts. It is about the idea that "Iron Fist" was originally created to capitalise on pop culture's martial arts craze in the 1970s, but rather than use an Asian character, Iron Fist was a Mighty Whitey who ended up being soooooooooo much better at martial arts than all those "Orientals". When the time came to adapt "Iron Fist" for Netflix, people wanted to see an Asian(-American) actor in the Iron Fist role to help balance out all the "Mystic Orient" tropes that the show was going to use. It also would have been somewhat more compelling to see an Asian-American man be the "fish out of water" in both the "Mystic Orient" stuff (a man born in American discovering his ethnic roots) and the "Boardroom Danny" scenes. But rather than even consider the idea of making Iron Fist an Asian-American character, Marvel went with a white guy and turned Danny Rand into another badass billionaire (only this time he's a martial artist). The casting was seen as a poor choice because it steered right into all the problematic bullshit that were the very basis of the "Iron Fist" comics in the first place - and neither Marvel nor Finn Jones seemed to give a shit.

>>90937750

...Brian Kendrick?

>>90938151
I would actually watch that show. Throw in a turn of the century/steampunk setting and I am sold. Even a western might work or a modern superhero with the right writers

>>90937740

In regards to "Samurai Jack", Jack trained with peoples from all over the world, taking a little bit of training and knowledge from each and working that into his own personal fighting style.

When it comes to "Iron Fist", Danny trains with one select group of people and bests them all to become the Iron Fist, then returns to America and acts all Super King Big-Nuts about being the best martial artist in the world. It could be seen as an implicit form of "White people are better at everything". Compare that to Jack, who became a skilled all-around warrior by learning from multiple cultures, but never acting as if that made him superior to the people of those cultures.

>>90938187
At least you put some effort in, 3/8.

>>90938349

Not a troll. I was 100% sincere in what I said. I know 4channers are not used to seeing actual sincerity, though, so I can understand why you thought I was trolling.

>>90938374
It's not the sincerity that's a problem, it's the tumblrfaggotry.

>>90938411

Now now, no need to lie. 4chan is the home of Weaponised Insincerity, where everything is a joke and caring about things is a sign of weakness that must be purged.

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

>>90934129
"Western" is the commonly used equivalent, and even then "Asian" is used more than Oriental despite meaning the same thing.

Even then, a lot of the time when people talk about "Asia" or "The Orient" they're really only talking about eastern and south eastern asia, sort of ignoring central and western asia, which tend to either get lumped in with India or the middle east as their own sub continents.

>>90938459
Are you having a stroke or something?

>>90938480
Stop feeding it and report.

>>90938480

Am I not allowed to repeat the 4chan mantra?

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

Care about nothing and joke about everything.

>>90938461
Asian and Oriental don't mean the same thing
Pakistanis aren't Orientals.

>>90938499
>the 4chan mantra?
fuck off in the decade+ i've been on 4chan I've never heard of this bullshit

get the fuck over yourself

>>90938531
They're not Asians either Mr. Brit.

>>90938531
That's just a British thing.

>>90938499
the 4chan mantra is "The stories and information posted here are artistic works of fiction and falsehood. Only a fool would take anything posted here as fact."

The main takeaway is he doesn't care as long as he gets paid (which he now does, because the one good thing about the Disney takeover is that Marvel isn't as cheap as it was).
>>90932040
> On the other hand, if they had decided to make Iron Fist an Asian, that would have been fine with me, too. I wouldn’t have cared. I didn’t consider myself the safeguard of some kind of Caucasian literary standard or anything like that. But I would have found it easier to write about a Caucasian, so that’s one reason I probably did it. If somebody had suggested, “You want to make it so he’s Asian?” Well, we could have done that too.

>>90932764
It's just something that used to be PC and now isn't. Sort of like "Negro" and "colored" used to be PC terms.

George Orwell once went through an old book of his and crossed out every reference to "Chinaman" and replaced it with "Chinese." He explained "Chinaman" was PC when the first edition came out, but became "a deadly insult" by the time it was reissued.

A lot of it is just about staying hip, most of these words don't have any inherent insult value the way the n-word does.

>>90938555
>in the decade+ i've been on 4chan
If you'd been on 4chan for a decade+ you would have the basic cultural reading comprehension to understand that that post wasn't implying there was a literal repeated mantra, and was in itself making a statement about the cultural attitude and climate of 4chan, and the best way to interact with it.

That or you're a moron.

>>90932093
Fucking this. I'm white, but the show sucks because it's barely even Iron Fist. It's just some poorly made show that slapped the name on.

>>90934129
actually nigger is just an extremely thrilling word to say. you even got a kick out of it instead of saying n word.

>>90934223
It's also to do with which groups emigrated to the UK and USA to which groups "Asian" refers to.

The USA had a large influx of East Asian people, especially from China, during the building of the railroads. So that majority of people of descent from an Asian ethnicity are East Asian.

Whilst the UK has a large influx of people from former colonies during the 50s, especially Pakistan and India. So the majority of people of an Asian descent in the UK are from these areas. And since Pakistanis and lighter skinned Indians look no different to a lot of places in the middle east, Asian refers to them too.

>>90932764
Like people have said, times change, and what was once considered a PC term no longer is.

To get more specific though, it mostly happened in the 70s, it's actually kind of a result of the Cold War. There was a lot of anti-war movement over here, what with viet-nam and all that, and not too long after the korean wars, and the treatment of Japanese during WWII.

There was a sense of growing anti-easterness within America, having been engaged in pretty brutal warfare in the far east for the last 30 years pretty consistently, and it was felt that "oriental" was being used as a term to lump together all eastern asian peoples together into one, amorphous enemy, something inherently "other" and alien, a squinty-eyed foreign enemy.

There was pushback against this, and oriental has, gradually, over the following decades, fallen out of favor. It's still used to describe items, but it's essentially officially considered not okay to call people "oriental" anymore. This gets complicated when you're talking about culture and behavior, but generally speaking the rule of thumb is to play it safe and just say "asian" or "east asian" or the specific name for the country if you can.

>>90938774
jesus christ, it's just a word, calm down. Saying it isn't anything special.

>>90938797
>Asian refers to them too.
That's dumb though. So it would also refer ti whites from east Russia and Israel. And I don't know what the hell Armenians are with regards to race. Does this mean Kim Kardashian's an Asian now?

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>>90938774
>actually nigger is just an extremely thrilling word to say. you even got a kick out of it instead of saying n word.

>>90938843
Armenians are not human anyway.
P.S. Armenian genocide never happened but it should have.

>>90938843
>Israel
I'm Jewish. Does this mean I'm Asian now too?

>>90933184
>And I'm sure some of the Asians just want to see some representation on screen that isn't a Chinese exclusive extra scene.
Maybe they should watch chinese ,cinema then.

Considering white people are a global minority.

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>>90932040
>Orientation or skin colour doesn't matter
>Black batman
>Everyone is ok with it because it's "culturally diverse"
This is why I hate dumbasses like him. He's not a comic book writer, he's a "appeal to the current culture" instead of "Appeal to the fans of the comics" series. That's what Netflix should be about. People are still upset that the West's are black in the Flash. Lets not forget that Supergirl is on another Earth.

He doesn't get it. REAL FANS want this. Not your every day Jimmy Sprinkles who doesn't know anything about comics or thereof...

>>90932764
>Yanks
Nigger, I live in GA wanna try that tone again?
It's not that at all. /co/ would rather Ironfist or any hero or any character for that matter to LOOK the part. BUT lately, the people at DC/WB want to have some dude that isn't blond, isn't tall at all, looks nothing like the Flash and put him in a Flash costume and call him "Barry Allen the Flash!" If he does well in Justice league, I guess I'll let it slide, but considering there are FAR better people for it? You get the point.

Look at Marvel, AT LEAST they get it almost close enough to call it something.

>>90932922
Underrated post here my friend

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>>90938875
This has been a very reasonable discussion.

>>90934129
>When you say "Oriental" it means you don't actually give a shit about who you're talking to and just want to lump them together because you can't be bothered to figure it out.
But I don't.

>>90934129

>When you say "Oriental" it means you don't actually give a shit about who you're talking to and just want to lump them together because you can't be bothered to figure it out.

Isn't that the same thing as calling them "Asian"?

>>90938843
Call it dumb if you want, but the middle east is in Asia. And when you have the white people as pasty pale as the Brits, they can be easily told apart whilst not getting into an argument of if they're Pakistani/Indian/whatever.

There's also nowhere even close to as many Chinese or other east asians as the others. You can find a small ChinaTown in London and maybe 1 or two families in a large town, but the Pakistanis and Indians are everywhere in huge numbers.

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>>90934464
That isn't skinny, though. That's compact, and it's also only one example.
>>90934529
This is fucking skinny, and it shows that he has no fucking core muscles.

>>90938903
>This is why I hate dumbasses like him.

I'm not certain you understood the interview.

>>90938187
>It is about the idea that "Iron Fist" was originally created to capitalise on pop culture's martial arts craze in the 1970s, but rather than use an Asian character
Except Shang Chi, right?

>>90938903
>He's not a comic book writer
He created Vision, Conan, Red Sonja, Morbius, Valkyrie, Iron Fist, Ghost Rider, Carol Danvers, Quasar, Sauron, Doc Samson etc.

>>90938374
>I was 100% sincere in what I said.

So you really mean 50%

>>90933039
This goes back to a logical stand point I pointed out to some friends.
I get yelled at for shit they've done but when they do it, it's ok.
It goes back to "oppression" or "culturally diverse." Give it time, I don't know Marvel all to well but if there's not a black copy of EVERY hero at some point, I'll be fuckin surprised.

>>90933071
Was Strange EVER chink?

>>90933634
>Mama I got supah powahs! whad shood i cal maisef?
>THA'S AMAZIN HUNNEH!
>THA'S IT! ILL BE AMAZINGMAN!!
God, this is why I hate MOST black characters in a lot of these things. They have some of the lamest names (static is OG)

>>90934129
The initial problem here is that most people can't tell the difference from a Chinese, Japanese, or a Korean. There are Koreans living in Japan and most people only know they ARE Korean when asked. I'm Irish and Scottish for the most part, but you wouldn't know it if I hadn't of told you, so calling me that doesn't offend me.
We live in a nation (referring to the USA) where we are a melting pot. So how can we call each other what we are when there are in fact Asian American's with "American" children. If you're pandering so hard to a specific thing, you've already lost

>>90938971
Alright, No, I read greentext

>>90938987
OK so he created them, then he went down hill if he's trying to pander to the current generations cause "Wah Wah, we hate white people!!" Hell, most black people I know that are comic nerds, this also makes them mad.
I don't want my black characters white, I don't want my white characters black.
Hell, if they changed Catwoman BACK to black, I wouldn't complain.

>>90939015
>then he went down hill if he's trying to pander to the current generations cause

I really, really don't think you read that interview or understood what he was talking about.

>>90939015
>OK so he created them, then he went down hill if he's trying to pander to the current generations cause "Wah Wah, we hate white people!!
Dude. That's literally the opposite of what he's doing. Read the article. He said the "cultural appropriation" is BS and if you want minority characters, just create them rather than coopting existing ones.

>>90937758

I genuinely can' tell if you're trying to argue that the Japanese aren't (often literally) comically racist.

>>90939024
OK skimming over it, is he on our side?

>>90939058
Yes. SJWs are pissed at him.

>>90939056
OK NOW I GET IT. Sweet. OK I Dumbed. I got it now sweet, I'm happier.

>>90939072
LOL. OK this is funny as hell. I wonder if they will "boycot" Netflix by canceling their subscription to them.
Oh boy

>>90939058
He was practically taking shots at the critics. He has no problem had the TV show decided to make Iron Fist Asian, but he also thinks the outcry about Iron Fist being white is stupid.

>>90939100
LSS
He's cool with it either way, but the fact that the SJWs are whining is what makes it stupid and he's annoyed

>>90939072
>>90939058
He's really just on his own side. He doesn't care if Danny is white or not, he just a) isn't ashamed of creating the character, b) wants his money.

In terms of preserving the original all he cares about is the dragon on the chest because he came up with that.

He must be really happy about the way his character The Vision was adapted. They got nearly everything from his comic design.

>>90939058
Roy Thomas is /ourguy/. Here's what he had to say regarding gay Alan Scott.

>Just learned of this this morning. I've nothing against gays, but I think the notion of making Alan Scott retroactively gay (even if this is a new Earth-2 version, an abomination of an idea in and of itself) is ludicrous and offensive.

>It is also a slap in the face to Dann, Jerry Ordway, Mike Machlan, and I, who co-created his children Jade and Obsidian... and of course Dann and I also engineered his fathership with Thorn and his later marriage to Harlequin... as it even undercuts the potential economic value of our creation.

>I believe this concept shows contempt for us and for long-time faithful readers. And I think we should return the favor. But, in the end, it's all just word and pictures on paper (or in cyberspace), and is no more valid re the original Green Lantern created by Mart Nodell and Bill Finger than was the retroactive continuity we did back in the '80s.

http://fourcolormedmon.blogspot.com/2012/06/roy-thomas-doesnt-approve-of-turning.html

>>90939140
IIRC he was okay with Obsidian being gay.

>>90939166
Just looked it up. He said he didn't intend for Obsidian to be gay, but he didn't really care. Alex Ross was the one who got pissed. He idn't create the character, but doesn't like people messing with the legacy of classic comics like the JSA.

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>>90932764
It's more racist than "people of color"

>>90939216
>Alex Ross was the one who got pissed. He idn't create the character, but doesn't like people messing with the legacy of classic comics like the JSA.

Arguably that's kind of what Thomas is doing in >>90939140 mainly because he didn't create Alan Scott and considered him a classic character. But he did kind of have a better perspective about it near the end.

>>90932040

Pretty much, these self righteous babies have never known real hardship in their lives and go after easy targets (childrens cartoons, shows, comics) to make themselves feel good.

I mean my god its a tv show about a crimefighting kung fu guy. Who GIVES a shit? It's not that important that it requires walls of twitter rants, activist campaigns and whatever the fuck else they're doing.

Get a goddamn LIFE.

>>90939140
>this is a new Earth-2 version, an abomination of an idea in and of itself

It's funny how several years ago, /co/ would have vehemently disagreed.

>>90939057
The argument wasn't whether people are racist, it was whether everyone always makes disctinctions between western countries. They do not.

>1970s
>Bruce Lee is popular
>Bruce Lee pitches a martial arts tv show for the West
>studio turns him down, turns around and steal the idea but make it star a white guy
>meanwhile at Marvel
>"We should do a kung fu hero"
>"But yeah make him white though lol"
.OH MY GOD ITS JUST AN ADVENTURE STORY

>>90939768
>forgetting about Shang-Chi who came before and pretty much is Bruce Lee

>>90939785
Where's the Shang-Chi show?

>>90939802
If they did it, SJWs would likely complain. "What? You think all Asians do is martial arts?" Also, he doesn't really have much of a connection to the states. Most of it would be in China, so the audience size would likely shrink. It probably would have been smart to put him in Iron Fist's show though. Maybe instead of Claire Temple, who really didn't have much business being there aside from helping that guy.

>>90938187

Mystical Asian here who immigrated.

If you sincerely believe Iron Fist is rooted in racism, slapping an Asian character in the title role doesn't change that. I don't know why you think that would make things better. It just means money continually pouring into the coffers of racists, and giving another easy, halfhearted virtue signaling progressive card for media companies to play without actually doing much. This superficiality is what's actually dangerous, and it annoys me that SJW are obsessed with it.

There are plenty of Asian-made action films and comics I can buy, such that there's no need to mess with someone else's creation. They may never get the recognition they deserve, but tough. What are you going to do, forcefully change tastes and human nature?

>>90939140
If a character is mean to be a certain way at the start, that's ok. but as character development proceeds, for all we know he could of ALWAYS been gay with hints here in there if that were the case. But going out of their way to say "This character is now gay" makes it stupid. Don't change a character just to pander to the current generation of idiocy. This is why I hate a lot of my generation. Millennials.

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>>90932040
Roy "Bad Goy" Thomas

>>90938986

Shang Chi was specifically created to profit from Marvel acquiring the Fu Manchu license, that's why Shang is his son. Initially they wanted to do a comic based on Carradine's Kung Fu show. The Fu Manchu angle is also the reason why they now always have to tiptoe around Shang's backstory when they use Shang in a way where he some actual agency and isn't just the cool Asian martial artist muscle.

>>90932948
Britbongs use asians for sandniggers and oriental for far-east asians

>>90934888
The ones who wanted Danny to be Asian-American (or any other race) don't care about preserving his dynamic with Luke.

>>90939140
>even if this is a new Earth-2 version, an abomination of an idea in and of itself
He will never be /ourguy/ for that and the rest of his post reads "me, myself and I" but he is not wrong. Making Alan Scott gay was fucking retarded and him being straight was actually integral to his character. Making him gay didn't bring anything new to the table, it was jut something they made for brownie points.

>>90938187
It /really/ angers me how people KEEP strawmanning Danny's origin. He becomes the best in his particular class, because he wanted revenge and to be seen as less of a "outsider" in K'un-Lun.

>>90940177
Why don't they just change his origin?

>>90932764
>Britfag here. Why do Yanks have a problem with Oriental?

Because what is an oriental in GB is a nigger in the US, I guess?

>>90932040
Good ol Roy

>Dude, the Western world is now a melting pot of cultures, you have to accept that
>REEEEEEEEEEE, a white guy can't be really good at mystical martial arts, that's only for Asians

>>90939015
>There are Koreans living in Japan and most people only know they ARE Korean when asked.

It's like how Africans usually point out that there aren't actually any black people in the US, just a bunch of coloured Americans.

>>90940444

I think they've kinda tried to do that once or twice, but since Shang isn't exactly a hot property, I guess it hasn't stuck. Plus when he's just a generic Asian criminal lord or whatever, it loses all its appeal.

>>90940749
Not change the character, just change his origin.

>>90940641
Which isn't wrong honestly. That would be like me saying "Um EXCUSE ME? Did you call me WHITE? I'm IRISH SCOTTISH AMERICAN! Please remember this!"

>>90940820
>IRISH SCOTTISH
Explains why you're a namefag scum.

>>90940851
Do you have anything else in your life besides shit posting and "calling people out" when they do something you don't like? Seriously anon, grow the fuck up.

>>90940866
I have superior British heritage, lel.

>>90940879
Good for you anon! Now go drink all the tea and fuck your cousin all you want!

>>90938708
Or you're projecting your skewed, Tumblrized opinion of 4chan as if it were a fact in a desperate ad-hominem attack to distract from the real fact, which is that your shitty virtue-signaling argument is retarded and shows an extremely basic knowledge of comics in general and Iron Fist in particular.

>>90932956
This. It's a thing because of the railroad days. We don't care if you guys say it, mostly, it's a local deal.

>>90933071
Strange's magic was never strictly Chinese folk magic, it was just taught to him by a tibetan guy.

Actually his magic is european as hell as it mostly invokes the summoning and binding of spirits to do his bidding-I mean all cultures had this to some extent, but the specific phrasing and techniques classic Strange did were so dead on some people thought Marvel had an actual occultist on staff.

>>90934129
I mean.

We call them Western.

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>>90941035
But there should be a word for people who have skulls shaped to make their eyes look a certain way. Mongoloid now has negative connotations because too many people used it as a synonym for retard and Asian isn't accurate given all the people who live on the continent of Asia who don't have those skulls.

>>90937758
Wolverine shorter then Japanese women. Hah.

>>90939802
I think a lot of these conversations are missing a vital fact- the main draw of an Iron Fist show that Shang-Chi wouldn't have is that Danny Rand is Luke Cage's best friend. The whole martial arts thing is fun and all but what the people want to see is the Heroes For Hire going all buddy-cop on the underworld, and if DD and Jessica wanna come hand out better still.

>>90936955
In Australia we just call em chinks

>>90933071
There were some complaints, but

>Benedict was cast fairly early, and was the leading rumor even longer
>A lot of the same crowd LIKE Benedict
>Iron Fist race-change discussion was going on well before Iron Fist announcement

So Iron Fist's race-change callers had longer time to ferment on the idea, and the final choice lacked the resistance that Benedict had

>>90938151
Yeah that sounds dope. She could have a grizzled old mountain man as a mentor and duel with an imperial guard from home so skilled he can catch bullets.

>>90933038
>Asians referring to Pakis & Indians

Why?

>>90938374
How would being asian american fit in with Luke Cage? Does Luke hate asian people now?

>>90934362
No one cares about South America.

>>90938903
>Nigger, I live in GA wanna try that tone again?
Outside of the US, yank is a catch-all term for the whole population.

You're all yanks
The English are all pomes
If you're from New Zealand you're a kiwi
If you're from Australia you're a cunt

People outside the US don't give a fuck about your internal bullshit

>>90941478
Then what are you?

>>90941503
irrelevant.

>>90941503
I'm a cunt. We share a lot of dialect with England for obvious reasons, which is why we both refer to people from the US as yanks.

>>90941503
a sick cunt

>>90940380
I mean from his perspective it's a damn good point, he can't get paid for his characters because those characters don't exist anymore because Alan isn't Alan anymore, he's a new gay green lantern with Alan's name and none of his supporting cast or relationships.

>>90941416
Because they're from Asia. It's a big place. The UK has never had many East Asians.

>>90941416
They're in asia

>>90938889
>Jews
>race
Not for a long time m8. Unless you're pure-bred Middle Eastern you're probably more likely to be a descendent of White Europeans or Slavs.

>>90932040
>>I just think some people have too much time on their hands
this. this right here.

>>90932040
>Don’t these people have something better to do than to worry about the fact that Iron Fist isn’t Oriental, or whatever word? I know Oriental isn’t the right word now, either.

Asian you moron, ASIAN! There, now you lose the highground and people can shit on you for that alone and not listen to anything else you say.

>>90932093
As a gay black man, I wanna be all up in Ward's butt

>>90941589
So is 75% of Russia and all of Israel. Your point?

>>90941784
>now you lose the highground
It's over Anakin!

>>90932040
We need another war

>>90932040
Though I take his point, a little honesty wouldn't hurt.

>We ripped off David Carradine's Kung Fu show because it was popular with the kids and he wasn't Chinese like all those guys in the kung fu movies he was ripping off, we didn't really feel like we were doing something shitty because he was just providing a racist audience what they wanted. Then we paired Iron Fist up with Luke Cage because he was also ripped off from films and they were kind of joke characters.

Funniest thing to come out of all this is the whole "Chinese billionaire's plane goes down over the Appalachians, 20 years later his son returns to China having learned the ancient Western art of getting drunk on antifreeze and fucking his sister" line of jokes.

>>90932093
That's your natural kung fu sense kicking in, obviously. It's inscrutable.

>>90942026
They're in Asia.

>>90932040
>instead of trying to change somebody else’s story, go out and make up your own character and do a good job of it.
YOU HEAR THAT BRIAN MICHAEL BENDIS!!!! STOP REPLACING CHARACTERS WITH THE RETARDED VERSION!!!

>>90942088
So? Nobody calls Canadians and Mexicans Americans even though they're in the same continent as the US. Asian really has come to mean an ethnic group rather than a people from a certain location. It's an ethnic group with many subsets, but share very similar traits and language if you compare them to other races.

>>90932868
Was your mom a mail order bride?

>>90941478
How can we be yanks if we don't drink tea hot and make it cold?
This doesn't add up anon?

>>90941524
>I don't want to admit I'm a "Pome"
I've never heard of any of those terms cept cunt

>>90941789
At least you're honest. I can respect that

>>90942146
Bendis? The comic writer Bendis?

Just wondering. How come SJWs haven't gotten all up in arms about Psylocke yet? She's literally a white woman living in an Asian body and "culturally appropriating" the hell out of it.

The funny thing is though. Lewis Tan, who played Zhou Cheng, the drunken master, was initially up for Danny's role. And he actually knows kung-fu. He would've been so much better.

>>90942223
This I wouldn't mind. Original Psylocke was much better. They could even bring back Kwannon to be the ninja if they want. Best of both worlds.

>>90942223
Because most SJWs that are technically men actually want to be woman and more than likely are like 3 different orientations.
It all falls down to hating yourself. Give it time and you will see them hate it cause of some sorta "Asiancution" I bet.

>>90932764
I don't get it either. During the 90's, I remember there being a bunch of commercials telling people to "come to the Orient" for their holidays, yet now you're not supposed to say that.

>>90942223
>>90942255
I remember a few years back on CBR, before the banned all non-SJWs and people were calling her Syroc. Then the mods forced people to stop saying it, the forums restarted because the feminist was harrassed and we were all banned.

>>90942283
What's really odd is that all of the SJWs say "people of color," which I ought would be completely off limits because "colored people" is. It's only a two letter difference.

>>90942331
PoC is way too confusing. You think they'd be talking about anybody with tinted skin, but it's only blacks. Should stick with black. The term African American is a total mess that was only shoehorned into the American PC dictionary by Jesse Jackson. Now you've got Chris Cuomo calling the black British Muslim terrorist who attacked the Kosher deli an "African American."

>>90942079
>providing a racist audience what they wanted
Oh fuck off.

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>>90942331

>>90939140
This is exactly the same as George Takei's reaction to making his old character gay in that one star trek movie as a tribute to him. He thought it was dishonest to Gene Roddenberry's original design. Pretty cool for him to say that. I also think it's a good point to make here as well.

>>90942238
Pretty sure he said on a podcast he was misconstrud, now he's backtracking again. Blerd twitter blew smoke up his ass.

>generalizations the thread

>>90932040
Fucking hell! From now on niggers and spicks aren’t allowed to do metal or pop songs since it would be cultural appropriation. Nor will the chinks be allowed to do anything but wire fu movies and blacks are only allowed shitty low budget comedies. And as for as video games goes that is only for whites and nippons.

>>90932040
Got to admit, the whole "cultural appropriation" thing is a weird one to me. I mean culture can't be stolen, it isn't a finite resource. You can eradicate culture, sure; human history has some fairly bloody parts about that. But people just emulating another culture because they love or admire what they see? Where i the harm? Culture is an ever evolving thing and sharing it, embracing it, is just about the most peaceful thing you can do with culture. And there's a lot of horrible shit you can do with it, too. People go to war over this kind of shit.

To deny sharing culture, to try to force cultures to remain separate, sounds like the kind of people who also talk about keeping the races "pure."

>cultural appropriation

Isn't is more racist that lefties think only Asian people can learn martial arts?

>>90944368

>To deny sharing culture, to try to force cultures to remain separate, sounds like the kind of people who also talk about keeping the races "pure."

Which makes sense in theory, but in the real world white people take from foreign culture, put themselves into it and then give the people they took it from table scraps in return.

Which of course gets you the "just make it in your own country" bullshit, because apparently the "nation of immigrants" idea stops at the exact point when those immigrants dare to speak up to mighty whitey.

>>90938224
That's THE Brian Kendrick to you, Tozawa

>>90944468
This post reeks of entitlement.

>>90942331
I've never understood the whole PoC label myself. You're just taking colored people and switching it around and adding "of" in the middle of it. And besides that, the only people who use that stupid term have been white people. I have never heard anyone black who uses PoC to describe themselves.
And honestly, Person of Color is such an arbitrary label to begin with. Technically we're all people of color but whenever I've seen the term used, it's always used in reference to black people. I've never seen PoC used in regards to Asians or Mexicans or Filipinos, etc, etc.

>>90944580

What entitlement? The idea that immigrants should be able to make stuff about their culture in the country they moved to?

Hardly burning down the fucking walls of society, man.

>>90944468
China and Japan are doing well for themselves. These days, blockbuster movies made in the US have to pander to Chinese audiences to make profits.

>>90944468
This makes no sense. Cultural exchange isn't like a monetary exchange. It isn't a tangible product to own. If someone starts using something from another culture they are merely copying it, they aren't ripping it from the original culture which now has less of that culture to own themselves. It's basically torrenting. You aren't stealing, the original is still there, it's merely a duplication. I can't say that humanity is designed for it, but at the last we seem a very imitative species. It's how we learn from each other and pass on language, tool use, valuable skills because we're intensely social creatures. How many cultures share root language? Or religious aspects? Even technology. It's not all peaceful. There is a lot of war and conquest that went into this kind of blending or "sharing". But then that's the point. Don't conflate cultural exchange with things like conquest when it is merely a possible byproduct, and not even exclusive to it. You can find bad examples, sure, but you can also find good ones. Much of our music, for instance, has come about through this kind of sharing.

If you want to see real harm done to cultures, consider what was done to the South American natives by the Spanish. Wiping out ways of life, religion, even language. Destroying their temples and burning their records. We're lucky anything survives at all.

>But then I really don’t have much sympathy at all to trigger warnings or any of that crap. I think it’s overdone and nobody but a baby needs it, an intellectual baby.

He's like the American David Cameron

>>90943972
>generalization the post

>>90944654
>What entitlement? The idea that immigrants should be able to make stuff about their culture in the country they moved to?
>Hardly burning down the fucking walls of society, man.
I think what the minorities concerned about, was that they somehow believe they should consider their cultural symbols as trademarks that should be under their creative control. That they should have a say in how their cultural ideas are used by media, if not outright get paid for usage.

That's retarded.

I don't see it as "cultural appropriation". I see it as the minority involved seeing dollar signs and wanted to profit from their culture without working for it.

>>90944736
>generalization the reply

>>90939015
Amazing Man doesn't sound any more cornier than Superman

>>90944654
You're a bit meandering in your points. First you feel that the cultural exchange is, what, too one sided? Or not fairly compensated, though I have no idea how that would even be done. What's the exchange rate on an idea?

And as for making their own migrant communities within a country, that happens all the time. Sometimes merely because people from similar regions group together and create something familiar in a foreign land, but sometimes due to the dread specter of racism where they are denied becoming part of the larger communities and thus band together as a kind of cultural outcast. And as often is the case the reason doesn't need to be one or the other, the pressures to form a Little Italy or Chinatown can come from many sources and for many different reasons.

>>90944368
Because there's hundred years worth of precedent where minorities did something that was their own and then the white majority stole it. You can go as far back as the minstrel shows.

And there's still a double standard at play. If you're not white and you do your special cultural thing, you're either too ethnic, urban or, and this is the best one, not "authentic" enough for the general public, allegedly. But if a white guy basically does the same shit, more than likely it's considered bold, new, different, exciting and exotic.

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>>90932093

They should have given him the mask. It would have been easier to use a stunt who actually knows how to fight and it would have made the fans happier.
But no, it must have "MUH REALISM".

>>90944871
You're curiously narrow in your views. All of human history has had cultures exchanging. Sometimes good things, sometimes bad. New words, new ideas, new methods of doing things. Rarely does anyone go out with the express intent to take something from another's culture elements (as opposed to taking land, resources, labor, etc). Oftentimes it just happens, people pick things up. Rather like diseases, in a way, because yes they'll be sharing a lot of those too. And vices.

Sure history is rife with bad examples of cultural exchange, often at the point of a sword because that's how humans tend to roll, but quite a lot of good too. But you have done absolutely nothing to show that it is bad. It doesn't have to come with a double standard because that is a separate thing, and hardly universal. And it sure as hell isn't an attitude that would be solved with less cultural exchange, but it just might with more, especially if it comes hand-in-hand with understanding and appreciation (a good thing to have but also not a given). Erecting walls between cultures (and presumably if you have a large enough army making the other cultures pay for it) is not only a horrible solution, a backwards solution, and frankly a damned insulting one. Isolation is rarely a good thing for humankind. It tends to weaken, promotes stagnation, and one day you'll find a culture that didn't isolate itself has grown stronger than you and maybe you'll be on the end of a little conquest.

>>90944871
>Because there's hundred years worth of precedent where minorities did something that was their own and then the white majority stole it. You can go as far back as the minstrel shows.
There is nothing wrong with it.
It isn't stealing. No more than the Soviet Union "stealing" jeans from USA.

Chinese food all around the world are rarely authentic Chinese, but you don't see the Chinese caring because the authentic stuff is still around. If you are not willing to let other people enjoying your culture, you are not saving it, you are killing it. Culture survives by spreading. Without all the "bad" Chinese food, the West would never have adopted to enjoy the good stuff.

You want to be authentic, that's fine. But you have no right to block other people enjoying your culture in their own way. They are not your people, they have no reason to obey your customs. They are not you.

>>90945181
>Chinese food all around the world are rarely authentic Chinese, but you don't see the Chinese caring because the authentic stuff is still around

Chinese people literally laugh at the shit that gets served as chinese food in the west.

>>90939768
The funny thing about this is that Bruce Lee himself had German ancestry and when his colleagues over at his Martial Arts school in Hong Kong found out about it they kicked him out. He also got into trouble with the Martial arts community back in Hong Kong when they found out he was teaching non-chinese students.

>>90945181
>If you are not willing to let other people enjoying your culture, you are not saving it, you are killing it.

Nobody is advocating that white men can't learn kung fu from Asia. It's about the execution and how you do it and in the case of Netflix's Iron Fist it very much falls into the old school white savior trope and does it horribly.

>>90945181
Hah, yeah, the bit from Iron Man 3 about fortune cookies being uniquely American. One of the few interesting bits from that movie.

Honestly from a historical perspective I think it's interesting. Danny Rand promotes a different culture but does so as a familiar face, which can make it easier for other people to appreciate what he's learned and see it as cool. Rather like how a lot of African American music was performed first by people like Elvis. Which is frankly a complex issue with a fuck ton of nasty elements around it. Racism, for one, lack of respect, lack of adequate or equal compensation (since in this case it was an actual product, a song, being played by someone else). Not always. Al Jolson made a career out of blackface and is a often notorious figure seen today but he was a rare figure in his time who walked in African American communities, ate with them, drank with them, shared with them. He had an intense fascination with the community that he put into his work, made a lot of friends and contacts and helped launch careers.

But this shouldn't be a huge shock to /co/. How many kids wanted to learn martial arts because they saw some mutant turtles on TV?

>>90944871
Thats a pretty bad example you picked there
>A minstrel was a medieval European entertainer. Originally describing any type of entertainer such as a musician, juggler, acrobat, singer or fool, the term later, from the sixteenth century, came to mean a specialist entertainer who sang songs and played musical instruments.[1]

>>90945315
Did you even watch the Netflix version? Because he very much did not, in fact very explicitly did not. He didn't become the Iron Fist because he was the bestest and superior to all yellow foreign extra-dimensional devils. He didn't even complete his damn training. From what the show gives us he got the power not through anything formal but because he snuck off and entered the cave, and it nearly killed him. We don't even know if he defeated Shou-Lao to claim the molten heart of the dragon or if he was merely chosen because, as the other series keep telling us, something is coming, Earthside, and may have been chosen by the dragon or fate or both to help deal with it. Might be a given because The Hand is certainly going to be involved, which will suck if The Defenders is just 13 episodes of more ninja bullshit that was already played out before Daredevil season 2.

Frankly Danny has a shit understanding of his power and constantly needs other people to tell him. Not his own ingenuity, not using his white power to overcome. He's learned because ancient texts that talk about Chi gave other people insights (or that's a blind and it's really because they're Hand operatives). And Davos has a pretty damning case that at the first chance possible Danny stole the power and abandoned K'un-Lun along with the people who raised him just to return to his own world. It may later turn out he has some hidden purpose, perhaps something Shou-Lao imparted about coming events that will require the Defenders to form for the first time. But maybe not and he just saw a bird, shrugged, and decided to be a CEO instead.

>>90945553
>something is coming
Goddamnit fuck GoT with a rusty steel dildo.

>>90945323
The SJWs want non-white areas in colleges and cultures to stay where they started barring anime conventions. They want to pull us back to darker times under the guise of progressiveness.

>>90945553
Defenders is only 8 episodes.

>>90945745
A minor blessing, then.

>>90937168
That isn't what that word means tho
Colored=\=octoroon, that specifically refers to someone who is 1/8 black

>>90945224
Authentic Chinese food is pretty gross desu
No wonder they've taken so well to KFC.

>>90945224
>Chinese people literally laugh at the shit that gets served as chinese food in the west.
Remember that most of the people cooking the bad Chinese Food were Chinese too. One understands the need to have two separate menus with different items. One in English and a completely different menu in Chinese.

>>90945553
When it comes to Danny being a "White Saviour" people just like to parrot others without reading either his comics, or watching the show. Their opinion is already made up.

>>90942159
>Asian really has come to mean an ethnic group
Yes, it has. But different ones in different places due to different levels of immigration in the past. If you say "Asian" in the USA people will presume you're talking about East Asians. If you say it in the UK people will presume you're talking about Indians and Pakistanis. This is not a problem to anyone living in those countries, why are you so bothered by it?

>>90944947
I'm 99% sure that his costume in the Defenders will be a green jacket and DD's season 1 mask.

I really like the Iron Fist show.

>>90946257
Granted there are a lot of changes made for the Netflix series, and most of it makes sense as a distillation of the story. Still even if Danny was made an Asian American or whatever, I imagine there would still be a source of complaint because K'un-Lun is hardly the happiest place only occasionally on Earth. This version of Davos is certainly a kinder and gentler version, but appears set to prove he's very much a son of his city. The series pulled no punches in saying that how Danny was raised could be considered abuse. But they were training warriors, the best they could produce, not coddled children.

I wish the series had done more with this since Danny still came off as, well, a coddled child. Like the moment he returned to Earth he reverted to that kid playing Monopoly on the roof. Most we had was him knocking that kid on his ass and quickly learning the error of his ways, which was nice but we just didn't get enough of that. I don't know. The series wasn't horrible but it didn't really connect much with me.

>>90945224
In contrast to Italians, who laugh only figuratively.

>>90946588
Which would be a nice touch if it's the actual mask as opposed to just being similar. He can always get another, yellow one later if they choose. They'll probably stick with darker colors, though, for the "coolness factor". Dark greens and blacks and gold only for Danny's dragon. Or I could be wrong.

>>90945671
One mans progress in another mans regression. There's no such thing as objective social progress.

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>>90945224
Yeah, what fools we are for eating americanized Chinese food rather than authentic Chinese food cooked with Authentic Chinese Sewage just like they cook it back home. Boy I'll forever regret I can't experience literal death because of lack of food regulations preventing them from doing it to save money.

My life won't be complete, clearly.

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>>90932040
is anyone else pissed over the fact that people trash this because muh white male and not because for a show about martial arts the fight scenes are dogshit?

>>90946845
Don't be so harsh, the showrunners thought they were making an ABC mystery/legal drama.

>>90946899
Fucking what. How?

>>90946899
That's the opposite of an excuse. Adding kung fu to anything should make it more awesome, even Seasame Street (you reading this, HBO!? Finn Jones was practically an autistic muppet anyway!)

>>90945224
>Chinese people literally laugh at the shit that gets served as chinese food in the west.

Do you mean laugh as a negative or as a positive?

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/china-gets-american-chinese-food-at-restaurant-fortune-cookie/

https://munchies.vice.com/en_us/article/china-doesnt-understand-the-concept-of-american-chinese-food

>>90947078
It's a joke, but the plot and format of the show would fit right in. Tell me "Believed dead son of deceased controlling shareholders shows up at company headquarters, begins a campaign to reclaim ownership of the company, current owners start using criminal connections to stop him before he uncovers their illegal activities," doesn't sound like something straight out of Scandal.

>>90946794
>Yeah, what fools we are for eating americanized Chinese food rather than authentic Chinese food cooked with Authentic Chinese Sewage just like they cook it back home.
Remember that many famous Chinese dishes were literally imperial palace recipes. Food for royalty.

This really isn't that strange, as much of modern French cuisine was developed in their palace kitchens as well. The food you are most proud of is very rarely the stuff you can buy at a street corner.

>>90947430
>Remember that many famous Chinese dishes were literally imperial palace recipes. Food for royalty.
I plea of origin doesn't work when you look at the state of it now. If you follow this logic, 'authentic' chinese food no longer exists.

>>90947531
>I plea of origin doesn't work when you look at the state of it now. If you follow this logic, 'authentic' chinese food no longer exists.
What made you think that? All the authentic recipes are written down. It's not exactly that long ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manchu_Han_Imperial_Feast

>>90945465
Minstrel shows you retard. Pack up your extra chromosome and go.

>>90947624
I meant what is now prepared and served. Not what is preserved a historical fact. What is now considered Chinese in China is separate from ancient history even if it owes origins to it. When talking about Chinese cuisine, no one mentions ancient china specifically.

Not to mention China is a shadow of what it once was. Even less than a shadow, really, if you go by history. Which just serves my point more as a point of comparison for how awful 'authentic' china currently is. You have to reach back to find anything of worth.

> The food you are most proud of is very rarely the stuff you can buy at a street corner.
I'm also fairly sure this original claim of yours is plain bullshit. A great amount of modern recipes have origins as peasant inventions. Which then got claimed by royalty after the fact.

>>90940893
I think namefagging is retarded but I think thinking one flavor of west-european being slightly better than another flavor being good enough to boast on a fucking image board is even more retarded.

So I'll side with you.

>>90942079
Iron Fist wasn't ripping off Kung Fu, it was ripping off Bill Everett's golden age character Amazing Man. Roy Thomas freely admits it.

>>90932502
People like you.

>>90947947
Minstrel shows aren't an example of cultural appropriation. They were in the tradition of European variety shows and music hall that utilized racial caricatures.

>>90938708
faggot

>>90934362
I'm ever thankful to speak a Romanic language and thus not be subject to all this pathetic, yet self-predatory disputes among anglophones.

>>90933664
>to be written by that faggot Jude Terror too

back at the Outhouse I thought Jude was at least fair in his mockery but he's just being a pandering dick.

>>90947624
>Manchu
>Authentically Chinese

You do know that those aren't the same thing

>>90948494
>speak a Romanic language and thus not be subject to all this pathetic, yet self-predatory disputes

France has a language policy designed to eradicate regional dialects, variations, and languages, directly opposes loanwords, and makes it illegal to use anything other than French in all government and most commercial, educational, and occupational contexts. Anglophones ain't got shit on francophones.

>>90938187
>IF would be better if he was a completely different character that adheres strictly to my prejudices and socio-political orientation
Okay, buddy.

>>90948657
>You do know that those aren't the same thing
If you have no idea what I just posted, then don't pretend that you do.

Why didn't they snag Daniel Wu though? Would have been better than the stoner pussy they got.

>>90948685
That's more of an European thing, isn't it? I know that Spaniards are pretty stubborn about learning English or even using English loanwords.

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>>90932040
I feel like engraving my tombstone with this.

Either this or the Steranko's meeting with Bob Kane story.

>>90938531
>>90938565
>>90933038
>>90933878
>>90934223
LOL. This was written today. Regarding UK views of "Asians: being cover for Islam. >http://www.dailywire.com/news/14688/british-parliament-terror-attack-underscores-ben-shapiro

>>90938774
You have to be 18+ to post on this site.

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The show needed a stronger theme.

Catholic lawyer struggling against themes of injustice & guilt.
Woman struggling with themes of helplessness and rape culture.
Black man struggling with themes of racism, gang-violence and corruption.
White dude struggling with themes of Kung-Fu and demanding people take you seriously despite dressing like a beach bum.

>>90948783
He's still in the Badlands somewhere.

>>90949583
I'm surprised that they keep coming to the same solution of calling throwing the evil undead ninja army in jail. Normal Yakuza or Mafia (okay, Maggia) or criminal Tongs, sure, lock 'em up. But I think super ninja criminals are a bit out of what the normal police can handle. Hell, Daredevil now knows that prison can't really stop Fisk who is practically running the place and, just as with real world examples, directing shit on the outside.

>>90932168
As a pure blooded kang I mup da doo didda po mo gub bix nood. Now, where da white wimmin at?

>>90933582
>if you're so butt blasted about it though
I don't give a single fuck what you call asians. I was just explaining why some people find it offensive.

>>90942213
>How can we be yanks if we don't drink tea hot and make it cold?
>This doesn't add up anon?
You're all Yankee Doodles

>>90946656
Yep. I personally would have liked to have seen more of his childhood/one origin episode, but I think budget was a concern.

(AA Danny would have changed the whole character, too.)

>>90951381
I'm not 100% convinced that being asian changes him too much (to an extent I'll remark on below). I'm reminded of Jim Morita in Captain America: TFA, when he said, "I'm from Fresno, ace." You could, arguably, take an Asian American Danny with heavy emphasis on the American aspect and throw him into K'un-Lun where he would be just as much a foreigner. I even like that for the irony. Sometimes a fish out of water story isn't about what kind of fish you are, it's the kind of waters you're thrown into. Either way American kid thrown into an ancient monastery, a very different world from what he knew.

The problem is when he gets back to the States. A white guy stumbling around quoting ancient pearls of wisdom and acting mysterious, dressed the way he is, is easier to see as a nut, a very strange nut when he busts out the kung fu. An Asian American Danny, regrettably, will just be written off as Jackie Chan minus Xena and Robin Hood. It still says something about how our perceptions shape, and even warp, reality. Two kids with the exact same background, upbringing, taste in music, thrown into magic monk land and then back into the "real" world - all of that can be the same from his perspective. But the characters in New York will perceive him differently, and so likely will the viewers.

Whether that's a core enough dynamic to matter...I guess that can be debated? Regrettably the Netflix series didn't do too much about Danny's fish out of water experience in both worlds. It was there, but almost incidental. Ultimately he was a guy with magic fists trying to solve the murder of his parents and come to terms with the duty that comes along with his powers. I'm not even sure the plot would have changed too much if you had Asian Danny since it wasn't just his behavior but who he was claiming to be, and getting on the wrong side of powerful people, that got him thrown in an the nut house.

>>90938774
fuck niggers

yeah

>>90948685
Eh, that got out of fashion since the start of the decade, loanwords are pretty common in reality including in state funded media. Québec still does it though

>>90932040
>>I just think some people have too much time on their hands, I guess. They have an infinite capacity for righteous indignation. By and large, that tends to be misplaced quite often because if you’re becoming all upset over things that are just stories, and if you don’t like it, instead of trying to change somebody else’s story, go out and make up your own character and do a good job of it. That’s just fine, but why waste time trying to run down other people’s characters simply because they weren’t created with your standards in mind?

He's 100% right, which will offend the SJWs even more.

>>90948414
>You knew he meant Blackface

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>>90932040
>why waste time trying to run down other people’s characters simply because they weren’t created with your standards in mind?

>>90939802
They don't like to bring up Shang-Chi because of who his dad was.

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>>90932093
gay nigger from outer space here, I agree.

>>90953820
But that's not what he said, he said minstrel shows, which are centuries-old Euro tradition. Adding blackface to it doesn't make is appropriation.

>>90954667
Can't they just change his name like they did in the comics?

>>90954667
Who?

>>90955974
Fu Manchu

>>90933039
Even worse when its a ginger character that gets turned black.

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>>90938151
I fucking want that show.

>>90944947
The other Iron Fist from the old footage had the mask. The guy who played him posted it online, but Marvel made him take it down.

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>>90958549
Found it!

>>90960093
I'd be cool if that becomes Finn's costume. Could be more refined and comics accurate, but it's better than what Daredevil's got.

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>>90938151
If anything, things like this prove Thomas' point: if you're so incensed about these characters, create your own. If you really want that story to happen, go out there and make it, one way or another. Sure, it's tough, especially if you're aiming for TV or movies, but it's still a better use of your time.

>>90960093
Rave Fist!

>>90944654
>The idea that immigrants should be able to make stuff about their culture in the country they moved to?

Who said they couldn't? They do. No one is stopping them.

>>90960395
>Rave Wrist!
ftfy

>>90961160
Too on the nose. I cannot imagine that as the real name of an Immortal Weapon.

>>90960395
>>90961160
He can channel his chi through his arms, and make them a thing like unto PARTY.

>>90932168
Why even state that you're a white person you inbred retard

>>90961219
>Iron Fist
>Steel Serpent
>Prince of Orphans
>Brother Dog
>Spitting Wang
>Gapping Anus, Hidden Crabs
>Madam Palm and her Five DEADLY Daughters

Truly the Seven Capital Cities of Heaven are glorious!

>>90934129
I can guarantee you that if I showed you a photo from some faggot in latinoamerica you wouldn't be able to tell me from where it is. Would you use Mexican then, or would you use latino, señor autismo?
It's the same with Asian or Oriental or whatever the fuck you want.

>>90932997
Yeah, but if Lewis Tan had been cast as Iron Fist instead of Zhou, we'd have had every fight look good and with a lot less cuts necessary.

>>90938151
Yeah, I hate the fact we are almost certainly in alignment with tumblr now, but I'd watch the shit out of Reverse Iron Fist (Iron Gun? Iron Sights?) and Reverse Daredevil fighting Zombie Cowboys (The Night Hawks, maybe)

>>90962854
Maybe once they get him a mask they can let the stunt double handle more.

>>90963280
That's a decent idea.

>>90934129

Asian is pretty non-specific and can be used to describe anyone from Pakistan to Siberia to Laos. Oriental at least conjures to mind east asia as opposed to India or Turkmenistan.

>>90951817
>An Asian American Danny, regrettably, will just be written off as Jackie Chan minus Xena and Robin Hood.

All you would have to do is emphasize how out of touch with the modern world he is, and contrast his eccentricity with normal people going "wtf is up with this guy?" You could even ridicule the wise asian guru trope, rather than straight play into it.

>>90944453
It's glorified racism anon

>>90948735
>Manchu
>Chinese

>>90932093
Where's Jackie Chan when you need him? His shit felt real, and most of it was.

>>90966342
>>Manchu
>>Chinese
Another one who has no idea what the Imperial Banquet is. Go be stupid in private, no need to announce it.

>>90966352
>Where's Jackie Chan when you need him? His shit felt real, and most of it was.
Jackie Chan already released videos of how he does his fights. There is no secret really; it is just about taking as many shots as it takes until the fight scene is perfect. Sometimes one shoot takes a whole day.

>>90932764
I think it's one of those outdated terms that aren't really seen as permissible these days, like "negro" or "redskin"

>>90938151
This actually sounds fucking awesome.

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>>90938774

>>90937750
Nice

>>90938187
I wish Lewis Tan got the role since he's an actual martial artist

>>90967500

Which is okay but the bitch fit is because he wasn't considered for Finn Jones role. Or whatever blind casting shit gave him a shot and they whined because they went with a guy that looked part of the character.

>>90966218
Not to knock Jackie Chan, especially if there is a ladder within a five mile radius, but he's emphasized more for high kicking acrobatics than the wise asian trope. Sure Danny quotes a lot, but I'm not sure he'd fit it even if he was asian.

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>>90937750