Neat, BvS took a lot of elements from Superman: Peace on Earth,

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>>89922481

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>>89922481
>BvS took a lot of elements from Superman: Peace on Earth

>>89922574
have you ever read Peace on Earth?

>>89922481
>religion
/co/ is gonna freak

>>89922686
the issue is whether you did because it seems not

>>89922689
I mean, I dont think she is wrong. I took a religion class once, and there is/was a core "need" in humans that religion fulfilled.


I personally believe things like superheroes, and other universal symbols in pop culture, can fill that same "need"

>>89922726
Idk how you can't see the parallels. Its about Superman over extending, trying to fix all the problems, and people reacting in a multitude of ways as a result. Some people hate him, some love him, and ultimately it results in the unintended consequence of a country poisoning the food.


Its like almost the exact same thing thematically, they even stole that hero montage/saving the child from the fire scene.

>>89922574
You're forgetting "posed like this one panel" or "ripped a single page out without heeding context" counts for the DCEU.

>>89922790
>DCEU
Nah that's pretty much all comic movies.

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>>89922481
Oh my god, shut the fuck up. Its pretty well known at this point that this movie did on-set rewrites which speaks volumes about how much of a mess this movie is going to be.

>>89922790
read
>>89922767

It borrows the same thematic core, about why Superman doesnt just fix all the world's problems and how the world reacts to Superman.

>>89922825
>stop talking about comics and comic based movies because I dont like it REEEEEE

newfag leave

>>89922790
This x1000000

>>89922790
>Marvel names a movie after Civil War
>has nothing at all to do with the Civil War comic
>gets 0 flack
>Warners actually makes nods to comics and borrows heavily from them
>IT DOESNT COUNT BECAUSE I SAY SO


come on, you guys are starting to sound insane

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>>89922845
>OMG the director posted a panel of wonder woman hugging a child
>THIS MUST MEAN THE MOVIE CONTAINS ELEMENTS OF THAT STORY
no, fuck off.

>>89922862
Idk how you can't see the parallels. Its about Superman over extending, trying to fix all the problems, and people reacting in a multitude of ways as a result. Some people hate him, some love him, and ultimately it results in the unintended consequence of a country poisoning the food, something BvS was all about, unintended consequences.

>>89922884
>I wonder

I know reading comprehension is hard, but OP was literally speculating. You fuck off when you learn to read newfag

>>89922727
>I personally believe things like superheroes, and other universal symbols in pop culture, can fill that same "need"
And I personally disagree with you. Superheroes and other universal symbols will never fill the spiritual needs in us humans no matter what.

>>89922968
Thats a bit of a blanket statement, I've definitely used mental images of Flash and Batman to help push me further when running or at the gym.

>>89922874
You think you're pointing out a hypocrisy but they're entirely separate issues.

One recognized the source material as an outdated zeitgeist a decade old that wasn't even good to begin with, so it did its own thing.

The other tears out iconic storylines for the sake of marketing cinematic moments for trailers creating a shambling Frankenstein of a movie. Or do the themes and characters of the Dark Knight Returns flow nicely with those of the Death of Superman?

You could make the argument that the Dark Knight is guilty of this, but it's not a strict binary. There's an unquestionably better combination of source material and original material to make a cohesive whole.

>>89923059
>One recognized the source material as an outdated zeitgeist

Man you dont even know what words mean you pretentious teenager. That is not what zeitgeist means or how one uses it in a sentence. A comic cannot be a zeitgeist. LEARN ENGLISH NEWFAG.


>The other tears out iconic storylines for the sake of marketing cinematic moments for trailers creating a shambling Frankenstein of a movie. Or do the themes and characters of the Dark Knight Returns flow nicely with those of the Death of Superman?


How did it, in anyway, market itself as the death of Superman or as Peace on Earth?
Also if you noticed, it doesnt really use any of the themes from the Dark Knight Returns outside of Batman being too old for this shit and having lost his way. There is none of the 80s reaganomics commentary in there. It also doesnt really use the themes of Death of Superman either.


If anything it flips those themes around, while those are both deconstructions, it uses them to be a reconstruction of the Superhero.


So if anything, it too is realizing what parts are outdated and updating them for their story.
>You could make the argument that the Dark Knight is guilty of this


I mean it didnt really take anything from the Dark Knight comic at all. The Nolan Dark Knight was all about surveillance state and terrorism, while The Dark Knight Returns was about Batman (read: Frank Miller) taking on what he felt was a drying society under an apathetic and greedy government.

>>89923267
>How did it, in anyway, market itself as the death of Superman

When it shoved in Doomsday into the trailers, and third act, and the entire film in general. Doomsday's only notable appearance was in Death of Superman. That is the only connection fans can make to it. Or did you think it was adapting 2015's Doomed storyline from DCYou?

But I was more referring to the Dark Knight Returns Batman suit, which was used in the teaser trailer nearly three years before the movie was released and in every other piece of promotional material up to its release. Oh, and the actual title of the film itself. And Zack Snyder continually citing it as an inspiration for the film.

>Also if you noticed, it doesnt really use any of the themes from the Dark Knight Returns outside of Batman being too old for this shit and having lost his way.

That's exactly my point. All it does is adapt surface level elements, creating a disjointed mess of tangled plotlines and themes.

>If anything it flips those themes around, while those are both deconstructions, it uses them to be a reconstruction of the Superhero.

What? You actually have to explain this one to me.

>I mean it didnt really take anything from the Dark Knight comic at all. The Nolan Dark Knight was all about surveillance state and terrorism, while The Dark Knight Returns was about Batman (read: Frank Miller) taking on what he felt was a drying society under an apathetic and greedy government.

You can't possibly think it didn't crib a shitload from Long Halloween and Killing Joke.

>>89922996
That's called inspiration.

They will never fill the spiritual needs in you because we needs religion. It's in humans nature.

>>89922481
Disgusting symbolism.

>>89923738
>All it does is adapt surface level elements, creating a disjointed mess of tangled plotlines and themes.

Nah not really, I mean I don't find it tangled. The plot is pretty easy to understand, and almost every single superhero comic movie takes visuals/surface level elements, like Iron Man 3 and its "extremis" or its "mandarin" or Winter Soldier and it only taking the broadest strokes of the Winter Soldier comic itself.


BvS actually did, in my view, manage to utilize its source material pretty well while still being new and different.
>What? You actually have to explain this one to me.


Okay so please bare with me on this and read the whole thing before disagreeing or agreeing with me.

The Dark Knight Returns is all about Batman disrupting the status quo, with Superman being an overreactive stooge who tries to protect it at all costs, but eventually realizing that Batman is right.

Batman's "death" is also the catalyst for the creation of the Bat-gang at the end.

Batman also starts to go over board with his violence, due partially to the death of a robin, but is kept in check by Carry Kelly's faith in him as a hero.

It is also set in a world where the rest of the heroes disappeared/retired.


Batman V Superman has Superman as the disrupter of the status quo, with Batman as the overreactive stooge who realizes that in the end Superman is right.


Superman's "death" is the catalyst for Batman to create a gang of heroes, this time the Justice League (in contrast to the underground Robins in The Dark Knight Returns)


Batman again goes overboard with his violence, but has no robin to keep him in check, no one to believe in him. Like how in The Dark Knight Returns Superman no longer had any Lois to keep him in check, and thus he was abusing his power in the name of the government.


It is set in a world where superheroes have yet to appear.


If you'll allow me another post I will expand

1/2

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>>89923738
On top of the basic themes contrasting in the two movies, The Dark Knight Returns is a story where Batman is the only one left who "makes sense". While BvS is explicitly the opposite, Batman is completely wrong about everything and its Superman's ideas of hope and man's ability to be good that "makes sense." They even directly quote Batman from TDKR with his "dying in the gutter" speech but completely makes it seem crazed and misguided, while in the comic it is meant to support his point.


There is also very specific imagery lifted from The Dark Knight Returns whose meaning is flipped to add to this.


For example pic related is, on top of being a Superman Returns homage, is referencing that part in The Dark Knight Returns where Superman gets nuked. In TDKR Superman is mistakenly nuked because of the government controlling him. In BvS Superman is nuked willingly in an attempt to save humanity, and in cooperation with a government that truly regrets doing it.
As mentioned earlier, the entire key Batman v Superman fight is flipped on its head. Batman wins instead of Superman, Superman has the human ally (Lois) instead of Batman (Green Arrow).


They even use the sniper rifle bit from TDKR but instead making it shoot a tracking beacon instead of an actual shot, again keying us into this flipping of the source material.


DKR uses the same news media exposition as BvS, but while in DKR its all about Batman, BvS has all about Superman with Clark asking why there isn't more coverage on Batman.


Lastly, the opening is a direct 1:1 recreation of the death of the waynes in TDKR with the addition of Thomas Wayne trying to attack the mugger, making Batman more violent from his origins as he is more violent throughout the whole movie.


Also I attached pic related for the first post in this one, my comp fuck up.


>crib a shitload from Long Halloween and Killing Joke.

Oh it definitely did, I thought we were just talking about the movie's namesake

>>89922829
That's literally every Superman story.

>>89922874
>>Marvel names a movie after Civil War
>>has nothing at all to do with the Civil War comic
>>gets 0 flack
To be fair it helps that the civil war comic was dogshit awful.
Whereas I actually like Superman, but not when 5 different conflicting versions of him are forced together.

>>89924541
its literally not, I can name three that arent that


Ending Battle
For The Man Who Has Everything
Whatever Happened To The Man of Tomorrow

>>89924576
but thats not what happened in BvS, make your case on how there are 5 conflicting versions. Everything Superman does in BvS seems pretty true to the version of the character they have chosen to go with.

>>89924517
>While BvS is explicitly the opposite, Batman is completely wrong about everything and its Superman's ideas of hope and man's ability to be good that "makes sense
This is supposed to be the case but in execution it's because of Batman's paranoia that the day is saved and Superman is just a blunt instrument that does invite more disaster than his presence has made up for.

>>89924613
What version did they choose exactly?

>>89924215
>>89924517
Are you that fucker on the dc_cinematic subreddit who tried to argue that Batman Vs. Superman was a German Expressionist film?

>>89924613
>Everything Superman does in BvS seems pretty true to the version of the character they have chosen to go with.
I've already spotted the logical trap here. The version they decided to go with *is* a gestalt, so naturally they can't not remain true to it because they're only true to themselves and use extraneous media for validity.

Nice try tho. It would've gotten me a year ago.

>>89922481
>neat

>>89924638
> Superman is just a blunt instrument that does invite more disaster than his presence has made up for.

Not anymore than he is in the comics

>>89924653
their version, the one who struggles with doing good and ponders if his presence and actions do more harm than good. The one that carries the weight of the world on his shoulders. The one that loves Lois Lane and is always willing to give a person a second chance.

>>89924659
nope, but there is definitely german expressionist influence in the dream sequence (which makes sense since Finger drew heavily from german expressionism with his Batman stuff)

>>89924707
Let's count the lines and see.

>>89924678
>The version they decided to go with *is* a gestalt

How so? How is it anymore a gestalt than any comic version of Superman and how is it a bad thing?

>>89924785
wat?

>>89924757
Well, this version is utter shit and has nothing to do with any good version of that character. Literally no one loves him, except edgykids, and his "death" was less emotional for people than death of fucking ant in trash antman movie.

The only thing BVS did to Superman was rape him

>>89924816
man that was such a great analysis and point you made there, really made me think, you sure backed up your opinion with facts citations from the movies.

>>89924816
>trying to do the best possible amount of good has nothing to do with any good version of the character


read more comics kid

>>89924796
>How so?
Earth One + Birthright + TDKR + Peace on Earth + Miracleman + Watchmen = Kino
>How is it anymore a gestalt than any comic version of Superman
Comics are self contained by writer and run.
> and how is it a bad thing?
Lack of motivational consistency, but you're not going to be able to see that.

>>89924816
shit, better tell that to the decades of superman comics that do the same thing

>>89924869
But you are just stating comics for no reason. This Superman has nothing to do with Earth One Supes as a character nor Miracleman nor TDKR Superman.


Also where are the motivational inconsistencies? Like Superman in the comics his motivations are doing good, Lois Lane, and his familia.

>>89924808
If Clark weren't a plot device in his own film franchise then he'd get to have some more dialogue.

Bitch is trying to soften the blow of critics shitting on her flick.

Nice try skag.

>>89924869
Dude tons and tons and tons of comics homage and mix parts of earlier Supermen. I mean thats the whole point of super her comics, lots of writers take on the same character keeping the parts they like, and shedding the bits they dont.


Like you might as well say any version of Superman is the same thing.


How about you use an actual example of a Superman you think is completely self contained with no influence from past runs.

>>89924932
>This Superman has nothing to do with Earth One Supes as a character nor Miracleman nor TDKR Superman.
You could at least do something other than I said you'd do.

>>89924816

Antony ;_;

>>89924932
>>89924980
>What's wrong with mixing day 1 character with year 10 character? they're the same character! experience> that's just a buzzword!

>>89924946
Well first off the movie is called Batman v Superman, Batman's name even goes first.


But he is the driving force of the movie. Everything Luthor and Batman does is a reaction to something Superman does/did/fails to do.


Also you dont need lines to do things in a movie, Groot has exactly one line thats repeated and does plenty, and one of the main themes of this movie is Superman influencing the narrative more through his good actions, than Lex or Batman do with their words.


Batman spends a lot of the fight justifying his hatred of Superman with words, and it only takes a few from Superman to get him to start questioning things.

Less is more.

>>89924989
where did you say that?

>>89925030
You arent actually bringing up examples or proving anything using citations, just keep spouting the same opinion over and over again as if that somehow means you are right

>>89924862
>do the best possible amount of good
Can't even save his own dad from a tornado because that'd require running at a light jog.

>>89924847
Superman is a nigh incorruptible paragon of good and virtue, and tries to inspire hope and a feeling of safety in people, even if it makes him look cheesy or "old fashioned". But THIS Edgelord hates humanity, doesn't believe in good and thinks that Superman was never real.
>>89924862
He wasn't trying to do best possible. He literally caused EVERY bad thing in DCEU and tried to fix it really bad.

>>89925057
Yes, that is what you're doing. 10/10 movie. Kino masterpiece.

>>89925058
His dad told him not to to protect his secret. Now you are shitting on a Pa Kent that tries to protect his son? Jesus christ, the edge on you.

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>>89924121
What?

>>89922481
You can't even really pull that "we drew tons of inspiration from the comics" for Wonder Woman because she's got so few of them that ever meet with tons of acclaim.

Having said that, I guarantee that six months from now, at least one DCEUfag is going to say they reference the Hiketeia because Batman cameo.

>>89925088
>His dad told him not to to protect his secret.
What secret? The one that's easily figured out with even a tiny bit of leg work, the one Jonathan himself endangered multiple times, or the one that stops existing for plot convenience because otherwise Bruce looks lazy?

Oh wait those are all the same secret.

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>>89925064
>Superman is a nigh incorruptible paragon of good and virtue, and tries to inspire hope and a feeling of safety in people, even if it makes him look cheesy or "old fashioned"

Not really, that is some interpretations of him, but there are lots and lots that show different sides of Superman. This Superman struggles with what it means to do good since a lot of his actions end up having unintended consequences. This kind of stuff can be seen in Ending Battle and throughout a lot of the post-Byrne era.
> hates humanity, doesn't believe in good and thinks that Superman was never real.

He had a single moment of doubt and then reconciled it via meditation and remembering a fable his father told him. If you think Superman never ever doubts himself you REALLY need to read more comics.
>He wasn't trying to do best possible. He literally caused EVERY bad thing in DCEU and tried to fix it really bad.


No, Zod came to earth because the scout ship was here so he could have come to earth regardless if Clark was here. Unlike in the comics where Zod literally only comes here because Superman is here.
Also there is the whole host of other things Superman did to save people that he had no connection to:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K0lQxUqmnfU

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>>89922968
You are "personally" free to do that, but you will be objectively forever -
*leans into mic*
WRONG

>>89925181
>The one that's easily figured out with even a tiny bit of leg work

Only two people have been able to figure it out, Lois because she got lucky and followed a hunch, and Lex because he has near limitless resources.


>the one Jonathan himself endangered multiple times

Nah that never happened.
>or the one that stops existing for plot convenience because otherwise Bruce looks lazy

What do you mean? Clark telling Bruce who he is is a bad thing? Trying to get Batman to trust him is a bad thing?

>>89925085
>ask for examples
>cant bring up examples
>resorts to shit flinging


good job there m8

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>>89925094
here Amanda

>>89925192
>Not really, that is some interpretations of him, but there are lots and lots that show different sides of Superman.
But he inspires hope and believe in humanity no matter what.
>fable his father told him.
Magnificent story about the dead horses?
>If you think Superman never ever doubts himself you REALLY need to read more comics.
Just picreleated. Author who hates capeshit heroes showed Superman much better than Hack who pretends to love character.
>No, Zod came to earth because the scout ship was here so he could have come to earth regardless if Clark was here
He come because Clark activated it. And even if it was accident, Clark still lets them ladning and thousands of people dies because of battle and terraforming. Clark could prevent them from doing that and you know that.

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>>89925192
>>89925329
forgot pic

>>89925228
>and Lex because he has near limitless resources.
Bruce doesn't?
>Nah that never happened.
>Jonathan never left Clark in school even though he's had at least one documented case of superpower freak out
>Jonathan never takes alien artifacts to get studied by scientists.

>What do you mean? Clark telling Bruce who he is is a bad thing? Trying to get Batman to trust him is a bad thing?
By now you've probably already tried pulling the "Bruce didn't find out because he didn't want to" so I'll just remind you that's bullshit and there's no reason he shouldn't have stumbled across it just like Lucky Lois and Limitless Resources Lex did. With ease.

>>89925329
>Just picreleated. Author who hates capeshit heroes showed Superman much better than Hack who pretends to love character.
You know what's amazing? You forgot have your pic and I think I still know which one it was. It's the Hitman page, right?

>>89925329
>He come because Clark activated it. And even if it was accident,
Reminder that Clark is willing to let his father die because something bad *might* happen if he acts, but when it comes time to start poking 1000 year old frozen alien technology that nobody knows what the fuck will happen? Damn the torpedoes! Full speed ahead!

>>89925228
>What do you mean? Clark telling Bruce who he is is a bad thing? Trying to get Batman to trust him is a bad thing?

Well I would've loved to see Clark try that instead of introducing himself by crashing the Batmobile and throwing out threats.

>>89925253
Read the thread and then do the thing you always do and say >Example don't count, nitpicking, it's fine the movie was great you're biased not muh.

>>89924757
>is always willing to give a person a second chance.
What? Where did you get that impression from this iteration of Superman? If anything this one seems a bit cold.

>>89925604
You don't get it! He learned from Zod that people only respond to force! Which he supposedly regretted because he a good boy! You just don't get it! I'm smart! The movie was smart! You're not smart! Kino!

>>89925645
Also black woman who tells him that people like Batman understand ONLY FIRSTS MAH GOOD BOY HE DIDNTDONUFFIN AN SHIT

>>89925645
Clark in this series is a fascist and emotionally immature dick. He's like the one organism in this universe that doesn't have to worry about sticking his neck out and being compassionate and yet he never is.

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>>89922481
Everything points to WW being garbage.

So what is the point if they reference a comic? It will be shit anyway.

>>89925697
Because they might come after his loved ones!
All two of them!
That were in danger anyway because they're fucking stupid and plot contrivance.
But fuck you the movie is brilliant!

>>89924757
>the one who has hallucinations and became a murderous dictator when Lois died.

>>89925727
If they reference a comic their legion of redditors can go SO ACCURATE THEY UNDERSTAND NOT LIKE MARVEL 10/10 MOVIE THEY TOTALLY GET THE CHARACTERS YOU JUST WANT QUIPS AND FUN

Because context, charisma, and coherency are all unnecessary and plebian.

>>89925618
but where is the example? All you did was list comics without actually explaining how BvS takes inspiration from them for their Superman

>>89925862
So DCEUfags DO need spoonfeeding and "watch the movie" is a bad argument?

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>>89925329
>But he inspires hope and believe in humanity no matter what.
Right, and all of BvS is him believing in humanity. He has a moment of doubt about himself, but he definitely inspires hope pic related


>Magnificent story about the dead horses
Yeah thats the one, it teaches him that you gotta do the right thing even if there are unintended consequences, you just gotta keep doing the right thing no matter what.


>If you think Superman never ever doubts himself you REALLY need to read more comics.
You still didnt address this point, you brought up a single comic, but that doesnt discount the stories where he does doubt himself. Like Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow which is literally about him retiring as Superman because he thinks his presence is doing more bad than good at this point.
>He come because Clark activated it. And even if it was accident, Clark still lets them ladning and thousands of people dies because of battle and terraforming. Clark could prevent them from doing that and you know that.

How could he have prevented it? He barely learned to fly by the time they landed. And the second the appear hostile the first thing he does is turn himself over to try and get them to leave.


>>89925564
His dad told him to. He didn't let him die, he complied with his father's wishes, because Pa Kent knew that Superman was bigger than him. To risk upsetting the entire world just to save his life was greedy and Pa Kent knew it. He went out like a hero.

>>89925501
>Bruce doesn't?
Not on the level of Lex, Bruce has become a social recluse so he sure as shit doesnt have the government access that Bruce does. This should be obvious from the fact that Bruce has to steal most of his data from Lex.


>Jonathan never left Clark in school even though he's had at least one documented case of superpower freak out

Just like in the comics

>Jonathan never takes alien artifacts to get studied by scientists.

Just like in the comics.


Neither of these are as risky as Superman actively using his powers though.
>By now you've probably already tried pulling the "Bruce didn't find out because he didn't want to" so I'll just remind you that's bullshit and there's no reason he shouldn't have stumbled across it just like Lucky Lois and Limitless Resources Lex did. With ease.

How about you say why he should have stumbled upon it? Lois wouldnt have found out if Clark himself didnt decide to reveal his powers to her.


And why is it bullshit if Bruce doesn't believe Superman has a human side?

>>89925604
>Batman is doing criminal activity
>Superman responds to a criminal with force
>Superman, knowing his past as a hero, gives him a chance to just go back to being a normal guy


So you dont want Superman to stop criminals and you dont want him to give people a second chance?

>>89925633
Well at first he is willing to believe Zod and him can rebuild Krypton peacefully and is proven wrong, and this is after finding out the history of his planet.


The government is spying on him and he gives them a second chance by being willing to work with them if they dont spy on him.
When Batman starts doing criminal stuff, Superman gives him a second chance to retire as Batman since he knows all the good he did previously.
Superman even gives Luthor the benefit of the doubt until Luthor makes his evil apparent and undeniable.
At the end of the movie he gives Batman yet another chance after he tried to kill him.
He even lets the US government nuke him to save all of humanity.

>>89925934
So you cant even point to scenes that support your thesis?

>>89925760
but the movie is coherent and the context is fine.

charisma is subjective, and not every character needs to be charismatic. Superman being concerned at the results of his actions fit the movie.

>>89925979
>Right, and all of BvS is him believing in humanity.
>Nothing stays good in this world
Yeah, about that...
>You still didnt address this point, you brought up a single comic, but that doesnt discount the stories where he does doubt himself. Like Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow which is literally about him retiring as Superman because he thinks his presence is doing more bad than good at this point.
Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow is outdated and a really bad example to take notes from.
>How could he have prevented it?
Ask his goddamn alien father about Zod and find some ways to defeat him?
>He barely learned to fly by the time they landed.
And whos fault it that?

>>89926199
The nothing stays good in this world bit is from the one moment of self doubt he has, does context mean nothing to you?


>Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow is outdated and a really bad example to take notes from.
Its really not, and you still have yet to bring up a single comic.


>Ask his goddamn alien father about Zod and find some ways to defeat him?
He was talking to his alien father the entire time and he gave all the advice he could to defeat Zod. Why would the AI Jor-El know anything about how super powered kryptonians work when this is the first time they have ever been exposed to a yellow sun?
>And whos fault it that?
No ones.

>>89922874
The difference is that the Civil War comic was hot fucking garbage and a straight adaptation would have been even worse. The comics that the DCEU keeps "adapting" range from great to masterpieces though.

>>89926423
As stated earlier in this thread, they aren't really adapting the stories full on, but are taking the elements that work for the story they want to tell.

>>89926186
>but the movie is coherent
Not when it requires mental gymnastics of "He didn't want to find out Clair's secrets he just wanted to find out a way to kill him."

>>89926488
Which is even worse because then you end up with this fucking frankenstein monster of conflicting scenes.

>>89924048
Not everyone needs spirituality you dull cunt

>>89926512
come on, actually read the thread, they dont actually steal any direct scenes from these comics outside of stuff from The Dark Knight Returns and its done very purposefully


>>89924215
>>89924517

>>89926265
>the whole movie he is sad and angry about people discussing him on tv and internet
>one moment
Yeah, right.
>Its really not
It is, Everything from silver age is.
>you still have yet to bring up a single comic.
As do you. But my example is still relevant.
>He was talking to his alien father the entire time and he gave all the advice he could to defeat Zod.
Lies. Clark didn't talked to Jor-El after Zod's message, he goes to fucking church and government then. He talks with father only after kiddnaping and when everything goes to shit.
>Why would the AI Jor-El know
He literally said it at the begining of the movie while sending Clark from Krypton. You haven't paid much attention during movie, have you?

>>89926494
how is that mental gymnastics though? Show me where it says Batman even thinks he has a secret identity? If anything you are projecting that Batman should have knowledge he has no reason of having because you saw it in a comic once, a comic where other superheroes outside of Superman and Batman exist and secret identities are a normal thing, not something that only Batman and his Robins do.

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>>89922481
>Mamoa can't act
>Galdot is a manequin that walks, and is as expressive as one
>Cavil is forced to work with garbage direction and characterization
>Affleck just wanted to jump from this shot universe
>even ducking Zod hated the direction that they were taking with this universe (pic related)
>Flash is a complete mess, and is being rewritten again, I don't even know own if he has a director yet....and in JL he looks cringe as fuck

Who fucking cares for this thing at this point? It's obviously bad.

>>89926571
>secret identity

Why the he'll you think that "researching your enemy" MEANS "searching for secret identity"? Learning that he has one comes from the research.

It's get dumber when he was holding the hand of the pro Superman reporter that looks exactly like him. Even for an irrational paranoic man that act in stupid ways and is a horrible detective, it really seems patethic.

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>>89926545
>the whole movie he is sad and angry about people discussing him on tv and internet

He actually isn't, he flat out says he doesn't care about that but Lois tells him he should care. What he is sad about is the bombing that happens because, he thinks, of his very existence.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5APyiK_OKJY

"I don't care what they're saying" so you are just flat out wrong.


>everything from silver age

See now I know you are a meme spouter, because you cant site an actual comic, just an "age." You know what Superman did in the Silver-Age? He constantly lied and was petty as fuck. There was an issue where he gets jealous of the tiny Supermen he makes out of his own powers because they are better than him. There is an issue where he lies to Lois the whole issue because he doesnt want her to know about his cursed pictures of his past lovers. Also pic related, I guess you wanted Superman to be destroying whole solar systems?


>As do you
I literally just said Whatever Happened To The Man of Tomorrow, but if you want more examples, there are similar themes explored in Ending Battle.

>But my example is still relevant.
You havent brought up an example.


>Lies. Clark didn't talked to Jor-El after Zod's message, he goes to fucking church and government then.

Jor-El pops up right here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iuMxfyV3gsg

And he tells Lois everything it possible knows on how to stop Zod (the phantom drive). What else do you want? It should have taught Superman to fly and destroy Zod before he ever landed or made his presence known?


>He literally said it at the begining of the movie while sending Clark from Krypton.

Yeah that it would make him superpowered. I know that if I charge a battery it gains power, I dont know how that works though. Like should Jor-El just suddenly know every single thing about super powered kryptonians?


Stop being so pedantic

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>>89922727
>I took a religion class once

>>89926683
>Why the he'll you think that "researching your enemy" MEANS "searching for secret identity"?

Why do you think that? In no way did Batman need to learn his secret identity to kill him. And again, if there is no reason to suspect he even has one, why even bother? Like you are just projecting this onto Batman because you yourself know he has a secret identity.


>It's get dumber when he was holding the hand of the pro Superman reporter that looks exactly like him.

Just like in every single comic where Clark talks to anyone. Shit, in ASS why doesnt Luthor know Clark's identity? Clark is right there next to him doing super powere feats behind his back.


You are literally only complaining about this because its all you got, Superman's secret identity working is a conceit of the character, if you think its dumb then you think Superman as a character is dumb.

>>89926783
>I dont have an argument but you're wrong!

>>89926752
>"I don't care what they're saying"
>Yet he is angry and sad for the whole movie
He is simply lying to her.
>See now I know you are a meme spouter, because you cant site an actual comic, just an "age."
Don't be mad, anon, the whole your post about silver-age doesn't make sense. I'm saying that silver age is bad for adaptation because everything there is outdated and you starts to telling me what silver age is.
>What else do you want? It should have taught Superman to fly and destroy Zod before he ever landed or made his presence known?
Do you even remember the movie?
>Zod reveals himself and threats Earth
>Clark going to chrch to ask if humanity deserve to be saved (I don't even want to discuss this shit)
>Clark goes to military
>Clark goes to Zod.
He should go to his fucking alien father and ask how to defeat Zod, not visiting useless priest.
> Like should Jor-El just suddenly know every single thing about super powered kryptonians?
>He'll be a god to them.
It implies that Jor-El knew that he gonna be strong etc. And again, Clark could tell to his alien father that he HAVE that powers so they'll make up some plan with that. Or, at least, Clark could gain info about Zod to figure out how to defeat him himself. It would be much more useful than wasting time in church.

>>89926807
>why even bother?

Lex showed why, the USA governament tried to track him. Why the fuck do you think that knowing where your enemy live, go, who he talks to....isn't FUNDAMENTAL?

>>89926050
Crashing the batmobile was an incredibly dickish thing to do, he's Superman, he could have just fucking lifted it into the air with no issue, not to mention he let the guys shooting fucking missiles out of the back of their truck get away.

>>89926868
7+50+17+1+16=91.


What's going on here?

>>89926807
>knowing what your enemy does in his free time wouldn't be some incredibly useful information
This is basically what you're saying, hell, Animated Series Batman didn't even consider Supes an enemy but he fucking made sure to to find out what that fucker does when he's not Superman-ing after their first meeting

>>89927005
>Clark going to chrch to ask if humanity deserve to be saved (I don't even want to discuss this shit)

One of my favourite aspects of Superman's characterization in All-Star was the idea that with his advanced senses he's able to see all life as being literally interconnected. That version of Superman wouldn't even think to ask if humanity was worth saving, the value of all life on the planet would be dazzlingly obvious to him.

>>89927285
But, you see, ego-centric and self-doubtful Superman is more "realistic" in snyder's imaginary edgeworld. Elso superheroes are boring and should be raped in prison to be improved!

>>89927081
?

>>89927534
>I know opinions are subjective, but I don't see how someone who prefers Snyder Superman to Morrison Superman isn't just plain wrong.

>>89922481
Wondercuck

>>89922727
American education is a joke

>>89927285
>>89927005
>>89927534

>Yet he is angry and sad for the whole movie
But he isn't. And even if he was, it definitely wasnt for the reasons you brought up. Superman is angry and sad throughout all of Ending Battle, and for most of For The Man Who Has Everything, does that make them not superman comics?
>I'm saying that silver age is bad for adaptation

Okay so? What does that have to do with anything?


>Clark going to chrch to ask if humanity deserve to be saved (I don't even want to discuss this shit)
No, he goes to ponder if he should turn himself over, and he decides he should and does.


>He should go to his fucking alien father and ask how to defeat Zod, not visiting useless priest.
But he didnt want to defeat Zod at first, were you not paying attention? He turned himself over because he thought that would be the most peaceful way to solve things.


>It implies that Jor-El knew that he gonna be strong etc. And again, Clark could tell to his alien father that he HAVE that powers so they'll make up some plan with that. Or, at least, Clark could gain info about Zod to figure out how to defeat him himself.

Like I said, he knew it would give him powers, thats it. He does not know all the ins and outs of it, stop saying he should for no reason other than it would make the plot go quicker. The only plan the AI can come up with is the phantom drive and he does and it works for everyone except Zod himself. I would say that is a pretty good plan.

That whole trilogy is terrible, proof casuals will eat anything Alex Ross draws as EPIC and CAPE COMICS AIN'T FOR KIDS ANYMORE!

And yeah, BvS ripped of scenes wholesale from Peace on Earth, same with Birthright and ASS. But that was just aesthetic framing, none of the intention behind it, which makes sense, because that's how Snyder made Watchmen.

>a bunch of idiots arguing over these movies
>not just watching them and not giving a fuck about what other people think

You can read whatever you like and watch whatever you like and listen to whatever music you like.

Arguing about it, however, is just fucking dumb.

I want all the casuals have have only read Peace on Earth and ASS to leave, they're as bad as Killing Joke/DKR NOT MUH BATMANners in their dogmatic approach to fictional men in tights.

>>89924048
How is something we made up in human nature?

>>89925206
*quick draws his Desert Eagle and shoots you in the face* That's what happens when you fuck with me...

>>89927678
You think there's no merit to studying something that's been around for millennia?

For real?

>>89927811
People only say "not muh" when the thing in its place is fucking garbage. Just look at TKR Joker and Scarecrown, MCU Loki and so on.

Basically, people only say "not muh" when the thing in its place is not entertaining as "muh" on the first place.


Thing is, if these movies didn't had the DC brand on them and we're left intact, nobody would give a duck about them, they are worthless.

>>89927011
>Lex showed why

But Batman flat out says that he thinks Superman's parents are aliens and the is just an alien. Batman has no reason to think he has a secret identity

> Why the fuck do you think that knowing where your enemy live, go, who he talks to....isn't FUNDAMENTAL?

Batman managed to defeat Superman without that so it obviously wasnt.

>>89927021
>he could have just fucking lifted it into the air with no issue

And then what? Just let the mini tank go? You think it was dickish because you know Batman is a good guy, Superman does this kind of stuff to villains all the time. It makes sense to destroy the villain's mini tank.
>not to mention he let the guys shooting fucking missiles out of the back of their truck get away.

They were Lexcorp guards protecting their cargo from a crazed Batman. They were acting in self defense. At least from Superman's POV

>>89928097
You're wrong, these movies would be even better if they were about violent and depressed Luke Rayne moonlighting as Ratman manipulated by Tex Trudeau into figthing Larry Trent's secret alias Nukerman.

>>89927130
see
>>89928181

>>89927686
>No, he goes to ponder if he should turn himself over
Yes, because if he isn't - humanity will be doomed as he thinks. So he is in church to decide should he turn himself in to save humanity or not. Do I really need to exlain it to you?
>He turned himself over because he thought that would be the most peaceful way to solve things.
Well, because he is stupid and his stupidness caused thousands of deaths and billions of property damage.

>>89928219
>They were Lexcorp guards protecting their cargo from a crazed Batman. They were acting in self defense. At least from Superman's POV
MISSILES IN A CITY is not self defense, is Superman fucking brain dead?
>>89928181
But the point is that if you truly want to kill this person you'd figure out their schedule to see when they're most vulnerable, the fact that things worked out for Batman was pure luck, if Lex didn't send Superman to fight him that night Batman would have just stood their all night like an idiot.

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>>89928181
You learn and know about your enemy to avoid being caught by surprise. Turns out...he WAS caught by surprise, the entire movie depends of Batman not doing the obvious research that even the ARMY tried to do (and they have as many reasons as Batman to believe that his parents are aliens)...them you say that learning where your enemy lives...his routine...his...alies...is meanless...when the movie (and basic police procedure) show otherwise.


It is what we call plot induced idiotice. The entire conflict of the movie is based on Batman acting OOC and like an idiot.

>>89928219
Is this how YOU would have acted on his place? I just want to be duress if you are really autistic and has weird morals as you seem to have.

>>89928459
>if Lex didn't send Superman to fight him that night Batman would have just stood their all night like an idiot.

Fucking this.

>>89922481
How young is that kid supposed to be? He looks like a newborn compared to WW.

>>89928498
>them you say
pphhahaha

A lot of shit she posts she gets from fans who tweet images to her

>>89928604
He's probably a malnourished toddler.