decoding Legion's pilot episode

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>>89841603
>Just before David hang’s himself, the man with the yellow eyes walks by in the background.
>The television in the Clockworks mental institution always seems to be showing some kind of black and white synchronized dance number, reminiscent of old Buzby Berkely movies.
>There’s a shot where Lenny seems to be sitting with older inmates that could be read as dopplegangers for David and Syd, as David and Syd walk by in the background.
>When Syd sneaks into David’s room, we see the door open and close, but it appears no one enters, however when the camera pans up, Syd is standing over David. We should have been able to see her feet.
>In the same scene, when Syd lays next to David, their cylindrical pillows form a kind of crooked cross separating them. This same image is echoed later just before Syd is released, when she sits on the her bed awaiting the psychiatrist- the pattern on the wall recreates the same crooked cross.
>When David is being grilled by the interrogator, this scene is juxtaposed with a counseling session with the psychiatrist. There are moments when we hear the psychiatrist speak, but do not see his mouth move.
> Why the fuck are the interrogator’s technicians wearing pink hats? That seems more befitting and institution than a military technician.
> There is a recurring motif where Syd is backlit by a golden light.
> There is a recurring motif where Syd and David’s faces merge through camera trickery, despite the fact that they cannot touch.
(continued)

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>>89841641
> When David shows up at his sister’s house on halloween, the races and genders of the two children trick-or-treaters standing at the door could be read as corresponding to the race/gender of the two pursuers/rescuers who accompany Syd at the breakout scene.
> After David sees Lenny and breaks the lamp and his sister comes down to check on him, Lenny’s reflection can be seen in the mirror even though she no longer appears to be in the room.
> Sydney Barret is an obvious reference to Syd Barret, from Pink Floyd, who was institutionalized for severe mental illness and unable to stay with the band and share in their eventual success. The album Wish You Were Here is said to be about the band’s sadness over this.
> There are a two different moments where the camera seems to be moving through a building’s duct-work, but those shots also seem oddly evocative of the cranial pathways that wind like ropework around the human brain.

That’s most of what I can recall off the top of my head. I’m sure I missed some, so I’d love it if any of you anons could help fill in the blanks. Screenshots/images to help illustrate your point are definitely welcome. I would have included some with my ideas, but there’s just too much here.
(continued)

I say it's still too early to try and decode Legion. Too many red herrings and such without context.

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>>89841683
Here’s my operating theory at the moment (potential SPOILER here as I am drawing on Si Spurrier’s X-Men: Legacy v2 to inform my reading):

The Clockworks Mental Institute is this show’s stand-in for the Qortex Complex from Spurrier’s Legion run (a prison in Legion’s mind in which he locks his competing personalities). All of the inmates, Syd and Lenny and the shrink included, are just personalities in David’s head. Making skin on skin contact with one of them is the means by which those personalities come to the forefront and take control of David’s body (I believe the only people David touches throughout the entire episode are Syd, possibly his sister, and Melanie Bird at the very end). This would help explain why every other inmate save Lenny became inexplicably locked in their cell’s without doors while Syd was in control of David’s body - if David is the only one with the ability to select personalities, this ability would be cut off while Syd is “driving” his body. Everyone who helps David escape is a personality, and all of the powers they display are actually HIS powers. When he takes Melanie Bird’s hand at the end of the episode, she will become the “driving” personality when the show resumes in episode two. Finally, the spidery-thing we see silhouetted behind the opaque glass when David has his bed-levitating nightmare is actually The Weaver personality from the comic. And the frequent use of orange (especially on Syd, but throughout the episode as well) is a reference to the orange pants that are a consistent part of Legion’s comic book outfit.

That’s all I’ve got. It’s rough, it’s sketchy, and I’m sure some of you will argue that it is dubious for one reason or another, but I’d like this thread to be a place for that kind of discussion. I’d love to hear more hint-like details I may have missed, as well as competing theories.

Have at it, y’all.

>>89841691
True, but it's fun to try... and fun to see how much you can get right with the limited info we have.

I really enjoyed it

>>89841683
>>89841641
ive seen the next two episodes, you are over thinking things. They will explain what they need to soon.

>>89841715
I can tell you that you are wrong

Thank you anon, hope you can do the same when ep 2 come out.

>>89842986
cool for you, man.. what were the circumstances that let you see them in advance? Are you a journalist?

nothing wrong with being wrong... as I said, the fun is in the theorizing.

>>89843005
are you the same dude as this guy?:>>89842986

if not, how do you know? do you have an argument or are you just saying that to say it?

So far the only good part of this show was the cute blond chick dancing in the dream sequence. Apart from that it just seems like a load of jerkoff bullshit. I wonder who's gonna turn out to be a hallucination, piss off.

>>89841641
>>89841683

At last, we have finally been given KINO

>>89843488
if you like her, check out Fargo... she's cute as hell in that. Might be more your speed since you were apparently pretty turned off by Legion.

>read thread
>absolutely no mention of Mojo
Casuals.

>>89843789
Is he mojo though? I would love to see some Longshot live action... but he could also be the evil professor x construct from Spurrier's run... that guy is gold colored and bald.

Show felt like it was trying too hard to be artsy, likely to quickly drop down a "WE ARENT LIKE THOSE OTHER COMIC BOOK SHOWS" flagpole.

I initially didn't like it but am willing to watch more to see how it plays out.

>>89843916
I think there has been such an influx of comic book media, especially television and movies, that it creates a kind of pressure to differentiate new shows from the others. I've been enjoying all of it, but I'd still argue we are verging on over saturation. I'm glad this show took pains to offer a different aesthetic and and psychological drama rather than overt physical drama.

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>>89841715
So basically it's Kamen Rider Den-O - Mutant Edition, where multiple people with various personalities and powers have to share the same body, except this time it's actual multiple personality disorder and not demons from the future.

>>89844085
I don't know that reference, but yes, based on your description, that's what I'm arguing and that's basically how the character works:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legion_(Marvel_Comics)

>>89841683
>>89841715
It's all in his head! Or it's not! Deepest show ever!

>>89844085
>>89844185
except, and I don't know if this is true for Kamen Rider, there is a main or core personality that is David Haller that all of the other personalities compete with.

>>89844205
I don't believe I ever claimed it was deep, only that I was interested in it. But yes... it's mutant Mr. Robot.

>>89844238
Like Mr. Robot it does not warrant all this dissection because it fundamentally fails at telling a compelling story.

>>89844301
It doesn't warrant it for you. Luckily, you are under no obligation to dissect it.

I had fun thinking about it, so that's enough warrant for me.

>>89843488
>if it's not clearly explain like I'm 5 it's jerk off bullshit
I'd love to see you watch an expressionist or new wave film, you probably throw something at the screen. Stick to the MCU you mental midget.

>>89844301
also, how can you judge it's success at telling a "complete" story after one episode?

>>89844301
never mind, you said compelling... but still, compelling is subjective... I was quite compelled.

>>89844335
>>89844440
It's the same type of empty programming that is more concerned with appearing to have depth and bluntly presenting discussion points for blogging as Fargo.

>>89844301
In what way? I found the conceit of shifiting narrative perspective enjoyable, the mystery of Syd going missing intriguing and then I was very happy to see that they actually had a real superhero fight scene, going full mutant immediately with the telekinetic fucking all those people up at the end.

>>89844602
Your posts are the same thing you complain about, you emptily say things without pointing to examples to actually describe your issues with the show.

>>89844602
again, all of these statements are your subjective opinion that you are presenting as some kind of objective fact in the name of.... I don't know? Criticizing bloggers?

This is a discussion about a television show on a fox network. No-one is claiming it is Shakespeare or Ulysses.

I had fun thinking about it, and I'm not done thinking about it so I made a thread where other people could contribute more information.

If you hate it so much, there's a thing called not watching it you can do and your problems will magically vanish... one can hope.

>>89844623
Throwing a bunch of ambiguities at the wall from an unreliable protagonist's perspective and seeing what sticks is lazy at best when the presentation is the entire substance of the show.

>>89844344
Convolution and misdirection don't make a story intelligent. Legion is all sizzle and no steak, at least so far. Maybe it'll do something worth being called smart, but it hasn't done it yet.

>>89844811
That's one way to read the show. Another would be that it is a psychological drama about a man negotiating his own unreliable mind.

I doubt any of what we saw was so ambiguous as to be picked out of a hat. It seems to be moving toward something.

>>89844725
Matt could be in love with Syd, or she could not be real, or he could be have superpowers, or they could not be real, or he could be caught up in a government conspiracy, or that could not be real, and on, and on, and on. The show's not about anything, and praised as being smart when it's anything but.

>>89844908
so your issues is that some critics said something you disagree with?

>>89844811
Please actually point to what ambiguities you're talking about, pretty much everything was explained clearly at one point or another in the episode. Nothing was "thrown at the wall [to see] what sticks".
David's delusions are not nearly as bad as he thought they were, he's actually relatively sane, he's just been gaslit to think his telepathy and telekinesis are delusions, from our perspective pretty much everything we saw happened in the episode. There were very few fake outs, maybe a dream sequence or two. Now for the character, this informs him as an unsure and nervous man, because he thinks almost everything is a delusion. None of thisnis very complicated nor is it lacking in substance like you claim. Are you below average intelligence or do you have a bad attention span? Serious questions.

>>89844978
>>89844908

>>89844908
>matt
Stopped reading there, you don't even know the characters' names fuck outta here

>>89844978
>None of this is very complicated
Correct
>nor is it lacking in substance
False.

The show might do something interesting with its premise but so far it just makes every scene seem like a possible misdirection, if you don't think the show will have a "It was actually a hallucination!" twist at some point I've got a bridge to sell you.

>>89845016
David, guess what I can google when I give a shit.

>>89844990
You didn't point to anything specific you just said "I DONT LIKE THE PREMISE OF THE SHOW"
Point me to a place where you think the narrative may be a delusion fake out, because every single ""delusion"" in the episode just turned out to be a manifestation of his or someone else's mutant abilities.
If your complaint is "WELL THEY COULD JUST MAKE IT ALL A FAKE OUT IN A LATER EPISODE" then you should have a problem with any series that involves a mentally unstable character, because that could be done in any series with one, hell or any series at all, there's that famous one with the "IT WAS ALL A DREAM" that was a normal sitcom for fuck's sake.

>>89845129
So your main complaint was that the show attempts to be needlessly complex but then agreed with my post where I said the show is not even attempting to be complex? And then you change your comaint to be "they totally will do a fake out (trust me my dad works at nintendo) so it's shit"? You are a special kind of retarded.

>>89845129
Keeping in mind that you are posting on a comics forum, and that comics are a medium where a fair percentage of the stories are about whether the good guy can punch the bad guy harder than the bad guy can punch the good guy, I think it is fair to say that a story about a man coming to terms with the extent of his mental illness and the nature of the reality it affords him is arguably pretty substantive.

>>89841603
Anyone else here want to fug Lenny?

>>89845317
One of the main characters is named Syd Barrett. Syd Barrett used to be the lead singer for Pink Floyd. But everything is straightforward and real and not a cutesy superficially complex wank off.

>>89845430
So now you're back to it being complex in any fashion? You couldn't argue your way out of a paper bag holy shit

>>89845330
As a show that is about a man coming to terms with his mental illness it failed on every level.

>>89845430
that's easily explained if she is a figment of his imagination. Why not name the girl you make up/ meet in a mental institution after an artist you admire who was also in a mental institution?

>>89845471
Look up superficially and get back to me.

>>89845476
how can it fail after only one episode?

>>89845420
yes... and Syd.. and the Native American girl who helps break him out... and the sister.

I have lust issues with this show.

>>89845502
Nice retort, but here >>89845129 you agreed it wasnt complicated, superficially or otherwise.
And wow it is weird that girl who is a part of a mutant hit squad has a weird name, I mean it probably should be something normal like Psylocke or Iceman....

>>89845593
I'm gonna blow your mind right now but there's more than one person who sees this show for what it is.

>>89845430
>>89845502
And i get what you're saying jf you're talking about the editing, that was a bit of a wank off though I think the terrific cinematography and set design softened the blow, but if you're stupid enough to conflate the editing being superficially complex and the narrative being superficially complex, your opinion isn't really worth much.

>>89844217
Yep, that's Den-O alright. There's a main personality (the actual owner of the body and main character of the show, Ryotaro, who's a total wimp) and then there's the Imajins, genies-like demons from the future that fight to take control of his body
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMo1p_sYeCw

>>89845668
The one drawback of the anonymous imageboard. But now I'm back to square one, without specifics your analysis is as superficial as you complain the show is.

Anyone else think the yellow eyed guy will be the Shadow king

>>89841603
>>89841641
>>89841683
>>89841715

I don't think that everyone is a personality. That would be way too retarded of a twist to pull, we need SOME meaningful characters that aren't just personalities.

I wonder if, in this show, ALL of David's personalities are actually real people who were at some point or another sucked into David's mind, some mutants and some humans.

The villain is either the shadowking or Mojo and hell i want it to be Mojo