marvel economics

>>89612478

It doesn't matter

Bendis, Waid, Spencer will keep writing for Marvel. Sales drops will not interfere with their message

>>89612478
DC did what Marvel is doing now with DCYou in 2015. Rebirth is their way of reclaiming lapsed readers they alienated in the past.

Marvel is no real rush to win back readers because they really care about LCSs anymore. they're trying to build up a portfolio of kid friendly books and Star Wars they can sell in Disney Stores and other outlets

>>89612796
>Sales drops will not interfere with their message
but are sales actually dropping?

>let's talk real numbers
Marvel's sales are a disaster on the direct market, but they claim to be selling well on the digital market.

However, the digital market doesn't release numbers.

So we will never have an informed conversation on /co/ about how well Marvel's strategy is paying off, because we honestly don't know and we're only guessing.

Anybody that gives you an answer is a liar or a fool.

I'm six months behind on Marvel, who the fuck is the top left guy?

>>89613738
Mosaic. New character they were trying out. Nobody have a shit.

>>89612921
I do hope Marvel Rebirth is around the corner since everyone is dead or in a coma, it's super easy to bring them all back as a big (Actually impactful) event that could get readers back in with this soft reboot style like DC Rebirth

>>89613546
Yes, they've actually resorted to overshipping just to fluff out the Diamond numbers and it's pissing retailers off, since while it sounds free they're actually still stuck with the shipping bill, and they're left with books they have no space for because they can't move them. Champions is hurting the retailers because of this.

We can't know how digital sales are doing, aside from the fact we can see top-10s and DC has been doing better since rebrith with those, but we do know that on the physical side they're really getting reamed.

>>89612478
Is that Riri in the front? Isn't she supposed to be 15 years old? She looks like 50.

>>89614581
My LCS had so many issues of Champions that they're overflowing on the shelf. I won't be surprised to see them being given away like candy since I'll doubt they'll sell by the time FCBD rolls around.

>>89614649
Cause Deodato is really slipping.

>>89613698
op here, thanks for the answer anon

>>89614581
>ey've actually resorted to overshipping just to fluff out the Diamond numbers
holly shit i didn´t know that, they`re really desperate

>>89614581
>We can't know how digital sales are doing, aside from the fact we can see top-10s and DC has been doing better since rebrith with those

I remember years ago, when "Injustice" was on his first year, and in digital sales ALL top 10 was just "Injustice.

Then in 16º you would see some random Wolverine digital comic. It was crazy.

I really doubt that Marvel do better in digital sales than DC.

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>>89613546

>>89613766
Remember how they use google traslator for his spanish dialogue

>>89612796
I'm completely okay with that because Bendis is the only one that doesn't have a way out.

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>>89612478
Is that a paladin from the Brotherhood of Steel in the middle there?

>>89614949
It's obviously a gundam.

>>89612478
We'll have a better idea when we get Jan sales. When do we get those?

>>89614719
...into tracing territory.

>>89613766
>Mosaic. New character they were trying out. Nobody have a shit.

And now Marvel is going to replace even more classic characters with diverse replacements. You say you hate Marvel's legacy characters and want new original diverse characters instead but I guess you couldn't put your money where your mouth is. Thanks a fucking lot, /co/.

>>89616914
Well sorry for not giving a shit about yet another gas mutant.

I like my superheroes to get their powers via accidents, aliens, or just plain bad luck, fuck the x-gene and fuck magic mutant gas crystals.

>>89616914
good writing would have made him make a difference. He didn't have that and died. really pretty simple

>>89612478
Stop shitpushing this same memethread every day.

We all get it, "DURR, Marvul is going bankrupt becuze they ern't Nazis! Muh poor white rase needs hulp!"

It wasn't anything but your shit-stained headcanon two years ago, it's still nothing but that today.
And FYI: DC is already copying everything Marvel's doing in their half-assed poorly thought out way.
Or did you not read any comic-books recently?

>>89616914
The fuck is that line of thought?

Now are we supposed to buy a bad comic of a new character because otherwise Marvel will kill a classic character and publish a bad comic of a legacy character? How about NOT buy what is bad?

Fucking Marvelfags and their Stockholm syndrome.

>>89612796
Hail hydra to you too buddy.

>>89617215
Marvel interns are getting more and more violent.

>>89612478
I hate Marvel too but you made this thread earlier, /pol/tard?

>>89616914
If Blacks can't buy white characters then why do you think whites should buy black characters?

>>89612478
Is Ms. Marvel the best newcomer in that image?

>>89617215
Oh boy the Disney shills are really out for blood

>>89619789
Her comic is currently undergoing a free fall.

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>>89614965
It's an AV-98 Ingram from Patlabor colored gray.

>>89617215
Nice bait and as much as you want to disagree with how marvel is doing, they are doing poorly but its bit because of diversity, its their shit writers and seemingly lack of editors. DC is still going strong if you actually read the comics, Jl vs Ss was great and and old concept but the writing made it good, the current superman arc is awesone, the longer king does batman the better it gets over time, nightwing just got real in the last issue, the phantom lantren was a cool as fuck new character

>>89614784

Someone needs to post the fucking maths test required just for comic shops to get rare variant covers. It's literally homework.

>>89619871
Thats crazy, i knew some 1/100 or 1/1000 variants were hard to get in for small shops but i never knew there was a fucking equation

>>89617215
Congratulations, you display exactly as much intellect as violent antifa protesters.

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I think there wouldn't be a problem if the new diverse heroes had better stories and had more character to them. New ghost rider has been pretty cool. Silk started off pretty bad, but once she was out of Slott's hands, her character improved dramatically. I don't think Marvel is completely beyond hope but they do need to rethink their priorities.

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>>89619895

It's crazy.

(Sorry if this is a picture for ants. I'm on mobile)

http://m.imgur.com/vrqwK6r?r

>>89619992
yep, they do the same thing with skottie young "Young" variants. once you meet the quota you can order as many of the variant as you like though. unlike 1/100's which is self explanatory. the latest walking dead had a 1/50 variant, I think my local guy bought like 5...

>>89620049
And what would a a lcs owner need to do to get varients for DC
Probley somthing 100 times worse
So shut up about it

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>>89612478

Is not diverse, there's nothing diverse about the characters outside of kamala. The rest are just "something"-american.

Just like with Johns OC lanterns, they offer NOTHING that can't be done by white characters, they all shart, they all clap and they all eat burgers.

Diversity is about STORYTELLING. That's why the first BLACKWING or Nightrunner in Morrison's Batman inc were diverse characters, their background was actually different. Meanwhile 90% of marvel's colored guys have the same background: slums from new york.

It's Pandering, not to the fans, but to the SJW of the internet: it's about free publicity, it's about using them to get attention, they know this will not last, A white guy from Moldova? that's diverse. A native american character from a small town in alaska that has to deal with drugs and weird forest monsters? that's diverse, A russian soldier that has to protect a syrian city from the bombings of the americans and the rebels backed up by the americans? That's diversity. Some Indian superhero that has to deal with poo in the loo?
That's diversity. There's nothing diverse about Maria America or riri. Moon Girl, Jaime Reyes and Kamala are actual diverse characters, even if they all suck, they AT LEAST offer something interesting, The rest are just mouthpieces.

>>89620512
>And what would a a lcs owner need to do to get varients for DC
>Probley somthing 100 times worse

With DC you literally just tell them what variants you want. They only do free to order ones.

Stay mad, Disnigger.

>>89620512
One guy already told you but the current state of DC variants is that there is always one extra variant for every rebirth title and they're standard order stuff.

>>89617054
isn't that also true for characters getting other characters identities?

>>89614852
>hurrrrr this is bait

The anon was asking a fair question you memetard

>>89617215

Nobody is saying Marvel is going bankrupt, the MCU has made sure that's not happening anytime soon. Just that the comic side is suffering.

>>89620512
>And what would a a lcs owner need to do to get varients for DC

>Retailer: I'm ordering fifty issues of this DC title, I'd like ten of those as the variant.
>DC Diamond Rep: Sure, you can have as much of your order as variants as you'd like. They're free to order after all.
>Retailer: ... I love you, man.
>DC Diamond Rep: Uh... I... I love you too sir. Have a great day.

>>89620686
>Jaime Reyes
>suck
He's one of the few minority legacy characters done right.

>>89622657
The MCU side is with Disney proper now, anon. It's as much a subsidary as Pixar. Marvel just has comics, TV/Netflix and licensing to merchamdise companies. Marvel could safely die or be shuttered, with the TV and licensing business moved to Disney as well and the movies would continue to come out.

>>89616914
It's their job to make new minority characters that attract readers. Don't blame the fans if they're not interested in shitty characters.

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>>89623016
>Marvel comics are shut down
>the movies start using OCs
>they hire Bendis

>>89623016
>disney in charge of making good original content

oh boy

The diversity isn't the issue, it's just poor writing. Diverse legacy characters are great if they are written well.

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>>89617215
>And FYI: DC is already copying everything Marvel's doing in their half-assed poorly thought out way.

>>89612478
>let´s talk real numbers

real numbers 2016 year started out slightly worse month-for-month on 2015, which is far from unusual in comics; but by the end of the year iirc they were making more money and printing fewer comics, which is less of a bad thing than you'd think

DC meanwhile doesn't appear to have shifted underlying sales from where they've been the past two years or more despite a huge relaunch

the problem with trying to pander to existing audiences, especially if they have polarized views of what the product should be, is that you risk failing to please them in the short term while driving away new readers in the long term

basically, even if the younger readers have less money and buy fewer comics per head of population, they're also less likely to die in the next few years than the older readers are, so it actually makes more sense for the long-term preservation of a business to go for younger audiences; that may be a relative term (a company that produces incontinence underwear for geriatrics is obviously going to go for old people as a primary market, but again - it'll be the younger ones who become the longest-term customers)

whatever Marvel/DC do in the next few years, if they do end up pandering exclusively to the whims of older readers, it means they're not planning on staying in publishing: the way things have been going for DC for several years now, I can honestly see that happening and their IPs being shifted to merch-only, with DC becoming a reprint line as part of that, producing nothing more than trades of classic stories (classic stories as defined by the WB marketing division, based on upcoming movie offerings)

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>>89623171
>the way things have been going for DC for several years now, I can honestly see that happening and their IPs being shifted to merch-only, with DC becoming a reprint line as part of that, producing nothing more than trades of classic stories

>>89614707
That means the LCS think they can sell them. They're free (or paid for, however you want to argue it). There's no reason not to try and sell them - it makes money for the store. If it didn't, they'd just throw them away.

>>89614581
Again, the publishers can't force the retailers to display or sell titles.

Personally, I don't know why Marvel is doing the overshipping thing. Maybe they're just proving a point to DC/their own board - you can't just flood the stores with cheap/free copies like Rebirth did and have an effect on your sales. But then the question becomes why do it now, after DC has already proven that as its own sales remain unchanged from pre-Rebirth levels, now that the sale or return promo has ended?

The answer to that: Marvel planned it during Rebirth's early months without trying to analyse what the underlying sales figures were like, and didn't understand that Rebirth was simply massaging the Diamond shipping figures without affecting readership sales.

>>89614949
For real, it a Power Armor model someone ported to Poser that the artist used to make the comic.
Some times he added a Labor head to it for the scenes she was with her helmet on.

>>89623265
>The answer to that: Marvel planned it during Rebirth's early months without trying to analyse what the underlying sales figures were like, and didn't understand that Rebirth was simply massaging the Diamond shipping figures without affecting readership sales.
Marvel interns getting into the "alternative facts" business.

>>89612478
Sure thing, let me just pull out Marvel's marketing data and... well, would you look at that? I don't actually have it!

>>89623358
Probably because if it were subjected to rational scrutiny by the thinking public they'd be the fucking laughing stock of the corporate comic books industry.

>hockey stick
>hockey stick
>graph dated from 93
>charts upsidedown

>>89623016
Comics are source materials for the movies, though. Disney won't shut down their "House of Ideas".

>>89623386
Who cares? They are a triple AAA corporation who can issue their own credit. They'll just get a bigger bank loan.

>who do jewdo?
>you do jewdo!

>>89623396
Considering the only thing Age of Ultron and Civil War had in common with the comics is the title, it's pretty easy to shut down Marvel publishing.

>>89623449
It would be a mistake. Look at Guardians of the Galaxy. That came from a fairly new, mostly obscure comic.

>>89623767
>Guardians of the Galaxy
>fairly new

>>89623767
>1990
>fairly new
Casual much?

>>89623822
>>89623839
The non-30th century version is fairly new, and it has almost nothing in common with the original besides the name and the occasional appearances by Major Victory and Starhawk.

>>89612478
Whor did pretty good numbers for a couple of years so you have to assume they get some amount of new readers.

>>89623839
Isn't that just the first issue of their series? I think the name and Yondu appeared as far back as 1969.

>>89623942
Yes. Therefore the GotG aren't new at all, and >>89623922 is a complete faggot.

>>89623942
So they share the same name that makes the story in the two series the same? No

26 years is new comparing to the real shit

>>89624201
>26 years is new
You refuse to be wrong, huh?

>>89624229
Not the same anon, mate.

Only saying that comparing with the AAA-Heroes that have +40 years of existence, GoA is a newer IP

You know math right?
40 > 26

>>89612478
It might have worked better if they didn't constantly relaunch and clutter the books with crossovers.

>>89624275
>comparing with the AAA-Heroes that have +40 years of existence
You didn't say so before. Too late, casual.

>>89624350
>26 years is new comparing to the real shit

You sure can't read "hardcore"

>>89612478

No, their comics havent been doing this bad for decades. Disney will keep the ip intact with both movies and toy merchandise, both which amusingly have nothing to do with the new "diverse" Marvel comics.

Look at the Marvel toys Disney sells and its the classic Spiderman, Hulk, Thor and IronMan. No Riris, Miles Morales or Whors in sight. And there wont ever be. This is a gimmick which will eventually die out.

>>89624414
Marvel's been killing it with the toys, honestly. I work retail and am always impressed by the Legends line and surprised at the characters I see people pick up. Just the other day someone bought the Shocker with Silvermane's head+R/C car.

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>Riri front and center
man the drop off from #1 must have really hurt his ego, huh

>>89624476
>"black"

>>89616914
fuck inhumans

>>89617215

Why are disney shills so sad and pathetic bros?

>>89612478
>ghost rider not pictured
CANCELLED

>>89623171
>DC meanwhile doesn't appear to have shifted underlying sales from where they've been the past two years or more despite a huge relaunch
>90% of the best selling issues are always DC with a few Star Wars shit in between

Keep trying man

>>89624476
It's crazy cause none of the people stated actually really did some cool shit like real darkies like that black science physicist who isn't the meme guy or the guy who made the super soaker (He also made a bunch of cool technology shit we never discuss.)

>>89625279

Not in December and January, even DC is failing now.

>>89625346
Sure, sure.

>>89625431
December
> 5 out of 10 are DC books
> 3 out of 10 are Marvel Heroes books
> 2 out of 10 are Star Wars Books
> 1 out of 5 of the DC books are #1
> 2 out 3 of the Marvel books are #1
> 1 out 3 of Marvel Books is the final issue

You know how many more #1 Marvel had in December? Do you want me to give you the numbers?

>>89625431
Actually it was not meant to you but to >>89625346

>>89625532
Sure. Earn your non-existent salary posting non-existent numbers.

>>89625532

Also in January wasn't like 7/10 DC books with JLvsSS crushing everything?

>>89625594
> 2016+1
> He doesn't know what is Comichron or where those numbers come from

Oh boi, don't talk about things you cleary don't know about casual!

>>89625617
I don't think Comichron as the numbers yet

>>89625654
>I'm so mad that I cannot even spell

>>89625704
> He thinks everyone has 10/10 perfect english

Sure dude keep being this little sad man that you CLEARLY are

>>89612478
I think Moviebob is on-point for once. Comics don't make shit regardless, they're just IP farming for when their real money maker needs new characters. Re-casting the old ones would be the living death of the MCU.

>>89624476
>man the drop off from #1 must have really hurt his ego, huh

How much did it drop?

>>89625704
>gets BTFO
>b-but dat typo though

lol

>>89625735
>>89625793
>little sad man
Like those interns at Marvel?

>>89625754
#1 - 97,713
#2 - 81,271

I dropped like nothing really, maybe because the sale numbers were not fuck up by free comics and Crate like Champions.

Only if he is talking about #3 numbers but those I can't find.

>>89612478
Is that Korean!Hulk there?
>giant slanted-ass monster eyes
Fucking brilliant!

>>89624476
>Superior
>mostly lists politicians
Really cooking my noodle

>>89624476
Why the ""?
Are they not really black?
Or because they are actually brown?

>>89612796
The clearer thing about Marvel is that they have a writing talent drought. You can see that from the fact that Waid is writing the Avengers. Waid is a good writer when he wants to be. But he's not a writer who can deliver best-sellers. He's reliable and he's a friend of the management and he's willing to work for the Big Two, and that's enough to get you Marvel's biggest assignments right now.

Through the 2000s Marvel had a sort of system for writing talent that worked pretty well. They would hire indie writers who would then bring in other indie writers and help them along until they were ready for the big assignments. Like Brubaker co-wrote Iron Fist with Fraction, who later co-wrote some stuff with Remender to bring him into Marvel.

But most of the writing stars left to work on their own stuff. Aaron and Bendis are willing to stay so they can have what they want, but nobody thinks they're doing their best work any more.

In 2012 the "Marvel NOW!" promotion was entirely built around having the star writers at Marvel switch books. That doesn't happen now because they don't have star writers. They have past-their-prime guys, a few talented people who don't sell great, and some women and minorities who are only allowed by editorial to write other women and minorities.

At this point if they chose some celebrity writer to write Avengers or Spider-Man I'd rather have that than what they're doing now. At least it could be excitingly bad.

>>89626921
Did Hickman mentor Spencer? I remember them writing Avengers World together in that way (where the junior writer writes most of it but the senior writer lends some name value).

It doesn't happen much now because the new writers aren't stars enough that their name will sell a book. (Slott co-writes a lot of stuff with Chris Gage but that's because Gage is there to finish anything Slott can't).

>>89627421
>(Slott co-writes a lot of stuff with Chris Gage but that's because Gage is there to finish anything Slott can't).

I remember sometime before One More Day when someone asked Brevoort why Slott doesn't get an a-list title and Brevoort explained that Slott often had too many delays on his scripts.