supes such a dick in this episode

Luthor's plan in this was as stupid as BvS's.

>everybody, especially Superman, acted in these exact, specific, irrational ways
>all according to plan!

>>89337530
He didn't actually intend for that fight to happen, but it worked out perfectly in his favor.

>>89337530

>implying the plans were dumb

>>89336861
It was a good episode, it's a shame we didnt got more cap marvel

>>89336861
To be fair, so was Billy. It was basically a jousting match/sword fight.

>>89338193
he was a naive 10 year old

>>89337530
It wasn't Lex's plan. He just to fuck with Superman and make him look paranoid. He wasn't expecting Supes to go batshit and wreck the place while fighting Cap Marvel.

>>89337530
Lex's plan in BvS was fine.

Billy lost the fight, but his speech afterward permanently BTFO'd Superman.

>>89338238
*Rips light off a police car and throws it at Billy from a distance*

Who will never become a man.

Did the Justice League ever fight Zod and his crew, or has Superman only had them in his book?

>>89336861
Superman seemed more stressed out and angry than an outright dick.

Superman was a giant dick in this episode, but man that fight was so fucking hype... like 10 years ago now?

I can't forget that shit, I had the biggest autism grin the next day at school, couldn't stop thinking about it

>>89338238
He has the Wisdom of Solomon.
The age card doesn't work here.

>>89338301
It was better than fine. It was ingenious. Lex knew his opponents even better than they knew themselves. Almost.

>>89339094
Ingenious except for the part where he couldn't get the Kryptonite past customs and when he snuck it in it was simply stolen from him.

But I guess his ingenuity is apparent because he rolled with the punches and instead of killing Superman himself he just let Batman do it for him.

Wasn't the episode about how Superman was right but everyone else insisted that he was wrong?

>>89340420
NO

>>89337530

Not really. Justice League and STAS did a good job of humanizing Superman. He gets upset, and angry. He tries to not let it show, but he's not perfect. He knows Luthor better than anyone and expects there to be some kind of plan, and so he goes into things expecting there to be something shady. And while he was wrong in that instance, he was right overall. It helps to humanize one of the hardest to humanize fictional characters in history, helps to move the two main plots of the season along(Luthor/Brainiac ruling everything, the government's distrust of a superhero army.)

>>89337530
Luthor's plan was act shady and feign being charitable to win hearts and minds. Supes flipping out and beating down a 10 year old was just a happy coincidence.

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>>89336861
>yfw after this fight, he interrupts Superman and proceeds to shut him and the JL the FUCK down

goddamn, Billy was too good for JLU.

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>>89341392
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqfNRrcFNVM

forgot the link, fuck you supes

Not trying to derail the thread, but why is it okay when Supes destroys buildings and makes collateral damage fighting a being of equal or greater power in the comics/cartoons, but people complain when he does it in the movies?

>>89338238
Well then he also probably shouldn't be a superhero, but fuckin' wizards, what can ya do.

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>>89341461
Because not only is he not a mopy asshole about it, it's a fucking cartoon. It's not trying to be realistic and it gets handwaved away like a motherfucker. This has been answered countless times, the DCEU is shit. Get over it already you retard.

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>>89336861
what the fuck did you just say to the emperor?

>>89341461
The movies presented themself as more grounded when it comes to the consequences of the characters action, so that's the standard it's judged by.

I was really hoping Billy would show up in the last episode & help Supes with Darksied.

>>89340420

The exact opposite. This is from the arc where Lex gets released from Prison and is gearing up to become President. He invested a boat load of money into apartments for the poor that ran off of a sustainable power source.

His plan was to announce it with Superman there, and for Superman to find the device that look like a bomb and was shielded with lead, preventing Supes from seeing it past that. Superman would then freak out and assume its a bomb and look like a total fucking idiot when it was proven otherwise.

However, Billy/Marvel was there and stopped Superman from digging down to it. They then proceeded to fight and Superman went full Snyder and destroyed Luthor's buildings in the fight. Eventually Marvel uses his transformation lightning to hurt Supes, since its magic and all, and ends up accidentally reverting to Billy.

After disconnecting the device and calling in the Atom to have a look at it, Atom determines that Luthor wasn't lying and had actually built a device that uses Kryptonite to create electricity. This is, of course, all caught on camera, including Superman half ass apologizing.

Later Marvel kicks the shit out of Superman using words and promptly leaves the JLU. It was a great episode.

>>89341461

Comics and cartoons build up characters a hell of a lot better then a movie ever could. When you spend an hour building up a character who's suppose to be the greatest person ever who can do no wrong, only to spend another 30 mins in a slug fest knocking down buildings and generally being an asshole, it takes away from it. Comics and Cartoons at least have the time to show how destroying a city affects the hero to some degree and can present WHY they did it outside of "I had no choice".

>>89338762
The Wisdom of Solomon would technically make him extremely cynical if it worked like that. His childish purity and outlook on life is why the Wizard gave him the powers in the first place since Black Adam burned him too hard.

Why is captain marvel so underused?

>>89344215
You're not including that Lex built it to look like a bomb purposely to fuck with Superman.

The more stupid thing is that Batman can casually cover the costs of rebuilding the city. No like seriously

>>89338470
Zod wasn't in the cartoons

SHAZZAM

>>89342964
Lois

>>89345949
Batman has always been as rich as the plot needs him to be.
I mean when he funds the Watchtower which is a gigantic space station, partially rebuilding a city is spare change

>>89346589

So who pays for Watch tower normally/in most canons.

Him and Ollie?

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>>89346510
NYAAARGHHHHHHHHHHH

>>89336861
Man if I got superpowers when I was ten years old I would have immediately used them to spy on the girls changing room

>>89346330
I know, I meant the comics.

>>89346589
In the cartoon Batman said his company paid for the original Watchtower, hidden under aerospace R&D. Not his own personal money.

>>89338762
wisdom doesn't equal maturity. dumb fuck.

>>89347243
Wouldn't that fall under embezzlement?

>>89347612
No if its a donation.

>>89347612
Pretty much.

http://dcau.wikia.com/wiki/Watchtower_I
>Batman seized on this remark and contributed the Watchtower, which he called a "blind item in the Wayne Industries R&D budget." In other words, it was a secret from Wayne's stockholders.

>>89338762
Fuck this is worse shazam bait than calling him Captain Marvel.

>>89336861

Fucking amazing fight, though.

>>89347537
Yes it does, that's exactly what it means.

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>>89347826

>>89337530

His plan in that episode was basically "never stop trolling Superman", nothing is as stupid as the plan in BvS.

Not even Silver Age ones like "Go back in time to Krypton and marry Superman's mother so he has to listen to what I say" at least that has consistent INTERNAL logic, even if it's fucking stupid.

>>89347947

I feel you didn't understood Lex's plan in the movie.

>>89347966

Explain it to me, please.

Superman was being a bit of a dick, but I don't think Billy has any right to say the league doesn't act like heroes anymore. They've been in the game for a long time, and shit was getting complicated.

>>89347913

>johns bullshit

He didnt had the power of the gods, so his personality wasnt affected by the transformation

>>89347999

Just let me finish a movie here right up, and i'll try. Just 10 min.

>>89348013

I'll check back.

>>89348007
I forgot the >inb4 shitty writing, oh well. Bt seriously that's the weakest argument ever, especially for DC, plus the athument if about the definition of wisdom and maturity. That's Shazam being immature as fuck. We all watch cartoons and read comics for fuck sakes, so by your definition because we're all a certain degree of immature none of us must possess much wisdom.

>>89339138
>Ingenious except for the part where he couldn't get the Kryptonite past customs and when he snuck it in it was simply stolen from him.

His plan WAS for Batman to steal it you idiot, thats why he let Bruce steal the shipment information and Meta info from his charity ball.

Goddamn, watch the movie.

>>89347947
what do you think his plan was in BvS?

>>89346330
>>89338470
It had Jax-Ur who was basically Zod but he's trapped in the Phantom Zone when JLU happens.

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Supes being a dick thread?

>>89341461
Bcaue MoS critics were just being nitpicky and wanted Superman to be perfect even though it was his first day of legit superheroing and other incarnations have caused collateral damage.

>>89339138
>hurrr I'm dumb

>>89348003
Plus, Billy fucked up just as many buildings as Clark did. He even used a bus as a weapon.

>>89348389
>Justice League vs Teen Titans
>The two teams never really fought

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>>89348003
He had every fucking right to say so. He is a child who became a superhero because not was it the right thing to do, but because he looked up to the league just like everyone else. They were his idols, his role models, and they ended up being a bunch of dicks who didn't believe that the status quo could possibly change. It just raises the questions like why guys like Batman keeps people like the Joker alive if he doesn't truly believe he can turn things around, or why they would need to sacrifice their morals to win when they are practically walking gods. They completely forgot why they became heroes in the first place, to give people like Billy hope and to give them something to look up to.

>>89338301
What would he have done if Batman killed Superman or if Doomsday had not died but Superman had?

Why did he use specially made bullets that allowed shit to be traced back to him when regular bullets have been killing people just fine for ages and would have made him completely untouchable legally?

>>89348389
Holy FUCK dude Barry's never gonna run the same after that shit.

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>that part were billy picks up supes and keeps saying shazam shocking him with the lighting bolt

>>89349737
>Why did he use specially made bullets that allowed shit to be traced back to him when regular bullets have been killing people just fine for ages and would have made him completely untouchable legally?

If you listen to the movie, the reason he used them was because they had a low melting point and were all destroyed when "Superman" burned the bodies. The only reason they were able to trace any bullets is because Lois accidentally got one stuck in her journal which they didn't burn. Next question fuckwad?.

I'm just pissed that Billy's only appearance in the show was just a fight with Superman.
It's complete bullshit.

>>89350182
Seriously. I was waiting the whole season for some Captain Marvel and all that we got was this episode.

>>89350132

Even then Lois couldn't do shit about the bullets, because the US was in cohorts with Lexcorp in arming and training the rebels in that country's civil war.

>>89336861

Thats the point

>>89351285
Yeah, he was woefully unter utilized here. Thankfully Action seems to be giving him tons of love this time around.

>>89336861

I really loved this episode, favorite moment was when Batman calls Captain Marvel a boy scout near Superman

>Batman: You were a little hard on the Boy Scout, don't you think?

>Superman: I thought I was the Boy Scout?

>Batman: I did too, 'til I met Captain Marvel.

It showed how much Superman had changed over time in DCAU itself

>>89338762

Just because one has wisdom, doeesnt mean they always exercise it

>>89336861

Bruce Timm will never pass up a chance to piss on Supes

>>89348242

Not him but, Batman not recognizing that it was way too easy is what bothered me

Also I am gonna give BVS another chance when I get time to watch the extended cut

>>89345948

Thats kinda obvious

>>89337530

Luthors plan was really simple though. Steal some kryptonite so shoddily that Superman finds out. Make the energy converter look like a bomb. Superman losses his shit and destroys it taking away free energy from poor families making him look like a dick. The fight with Captain Marvel was just lucky for him

>>89348161
>none of us must possess much wisdom.

If anyone posting here had wisdom, they wouldnt be posting here

>>89348003

Its as if Billy was acting like a naive little boy or something

>>89336861

Superman's character arc over the course of Superman the Animated Series, Justice League, and then Justice League Unlimited was basically him becoming more and more jaded by his experiences. By the time the latter rolled around he had grown uncomfortably close in some respects to his Justice Lord equivalent.

>>89351647
>way too easy
>guards have rocket launchers AND machine gun cars

it really wasnt easy at all, and Batman has no reason to suspect Luthor of anything since he just worried about killing Superman.

>>89336861
It gave us this awesome scene so it's ok in my book. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqfNRrcFNVM

>>89341392
Billy's too good for everything. He's always been a better Superman than Superman that's why DC harassed Fawcett for years and eventually bought him just to never use him right

>>89349774
Sure he will because speedforce.

>>89338419
It's too bad Superman was right.

>>89342964
>It's EDGEMAN! And he's got a GUN
All he needs in that pic is some pouches, spikes and a wayback machine to take him to the 90s.

>>89352668
>All that cockblocking Johns has been doing regarding a Captain Marvel ongoing
He's the worst.

>>89336861
Supes was in the right, Billy was too naive.

>>89351285
Even Stargirl got more screentime than Captain Marvel.
I don't think he even got to appear in hero crowd shots, did he?

>>89347913
Holy shit this is good.

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>>89352893
No he wasn't, because the Captain already had an alternate solution to actually check out what it was. Supes just chimped out because he was paranoid. I get that it's Lex, but if he doesn't believe that anyone can change their ways then what is he even fighting for at this point?

>>89352497
>>guards have rocket launchers AND machine gun cars

way too easy to steal the data

>>89353376
>No he wasn't,
Billy's point was that Lex could change and could be telling the truth. Clark'a point was that, no, Lex doesn't change, and his actions were part of some larger scheme.

Had Lex changed?

>>89353376

Just jumping in here's, but this was arguably at supermans low point in his character arc. DCAU is one of the few times heavily "humanizing" him has worked out and been actually compelling, for me, anyway.

>>89353376
He does believe people can change, just not Luthor. And guess what, Luthor hadn't changed.

Would you be so willing to back Billy up if it took place in 2016 and Billy backed Drumpf?

>>89353640
>Would you be so willing to back Billy up if it took place in 2016 and Billy backed Drumpf?

I would. Make DC great again. We're gonna build a wall, and make Marvel pay for it.

>>89353568
>Had Lex changed?

Of course not, but did he place a bomb there? No, and that's the point. He effectively became a puppet to Luthor because of his paranoia. He's so used to sacrificing his morals for the greater good that he completely lost sight of actually giving people hope, and Lex took advantage of that.

>>89353590
I know that, never said I hated it. I'm just saying Billy was entirely in the right here.

>>89353640
I'm not even going to bother with your shitty bait.

>>89353697
>Of course not,
So Billy was wrong, and Clark's mistake wasn't "not giving Lex a chance" but instead it was not being able to predict the full scope of the plot.

>>89353568
BIllys solution was to get the atom to see if luthors device was dangerous but super was too paranoid to listen

Seriously freaked out as a kid while this was happening

Such an epic fight, such a twisted good move from Lex and damn what a dick move from superman

>>89353816
No, Clark's mistake was not thinking through things rationally. Billy literally said they can get the Flash and Atom over there in am instant to check out the situation, but Clark freaked out regardless. He acted more like a child then the ACTUAL CHILD.

>>89338301
His plan was retarded, if it worked the way he wanted it to Doomsday would have killed everyone on earth after Batman killed Supes.

>>89348419
Try to defend Superman hopping over that truck and letting it explode on a building. Just try.

>>89337530
The plan worked brilliantly.

"I spent 75 million dollars on a fake presidential campaign, all just to tick Superman off."

>>89354413
Come on, now. Would he really activate Doomsday if Supes hadn't been spared?

>>89354430
Something something water truck.

>>89338419
Except Billy was 100% wrong. Supes felt bad but ultimately Lex was actually playing him and the rest of the world.

>>89354844
The only one Lex was playing was Superman, and it was solely because of his inability to trust him.

>>89354773
Doomsday was already being made before the fight even started, he didn't need to do anything else, also he didn't know Supes was spared until like a minute before Doomsday popped out.

It's too bad that they only had Captain Marvel for one episode. There should have been a follow-up episode where Supes and Cap patch things up.