Who is the best Batgirl and why is it Cassandra Cain?

>>88255545
I miss the mouthless fetish mask.

>>88255545
She was popular for a while right? What happened?

She is forever best.

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>>88255545

she had a real strong character arc and a team who got her. Also great costume that understood she was supposed to look like a crime fighter.

>>88255655

Short version is DC editorial went all "NOT MUH BATGIRL"

>>88255876
Couldn't they just... Give her her own original gimmick, like Nightwing?

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Cass/Steph/Tim OT3.

Only Batgirl ever worthy of the cape and cowl. Babs and Steph a shit. Cass could take over for Bruce and I wouldn't have a problem with it.

>>88255655
DC's way of dealing with characters often works like a person breathing, or the tides moving in and out. During high tide, they build up secondary characters and legacies. In low tide, they abandon these characters for the originals. Cass being a Legacy was no exception.

>>88256319
>>88255832
>>88255790
Self-inserting faggotry is how we got shitty Spider-Man. Stop it.

>>88256338
Steph was alright.

>>88256417
She was a silly dumb fun character, just like Babs. Cass actually channeled The Bat.

>>88256319
Why the shitty domino mask, though

The scary mask is literally the best part of cass

>>88256040

You mean, like say make her a communications, and information specialist? Someone who could through her own unparalleled skills coordinate and guide every hero in Gotham and even further out if needed to more effectively fight crime? Something that makes use of her own talents and allows her to contribute in a unique and clever capacity?

That's stupid. You're stupid. How is she gonna take cute selfies like that.

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>>88255655

A mad combo of DC Editorial who wanted Babs back as Batgirl and putting her in the hands of Adam Beechen.

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>>88256435

>>88255545
I like her, but can't stand her shitty fanbase.

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>who is the best batgirl?

>>88256338
+1

>>88255545
You misspelled "Stephanie Brown." Or "Black Bat." ;)

>>88258294
NOPE

>>88258294

It sure ain't her.

Because she encapsulated the terror of Batman with a kind heart and brought her own efficiency to it all.

>>88258294

Retard cosplayer

>>88258223
What issue is this from?

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>>88256319
It's curious.
Tim and Steph seems fine to me.
Tim and Cass makes my skin crawl.
But all three together is a-ok.

I still want Jon and Damien to run into Cass in the Batcave so Jon can get a crush on her.

>>88258523

#60 or 61.

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>>88258543
> But all three together is a-ok.

I know right? Exactly have the same thoughts. Yet.. when all three are together. It fits...

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>>88257181

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>>88255566
I think she straight-up found her current mask in a S&M store.

>>88256319
Best taste

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>>88258573
It seems like Cass would spend an awful lot of time keeping those two alive.

Maybe it is because they dated for maybe 2 issues, but I've always been interested in seeing more Cass x Kon.

>>88259481
Good taste anon

>>88258240
This.

She had a good character arc, but most people on /co/ seem to like her out of autism/yellow fever/fighter fetishism.

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>>88259669
>>88258240

What the fuck are you assholes on about? One thread in a blue moon and talking about her where applicable makes the fanbase shitty? It's not our fault the character has had near constant misfortune since her book ended and any reappearances end up being giant teases.

We'd like to have better things to say

never really liked Cass to be honest
being good at martial arts was the only gimmick left to Batman in the batfamily

>>88259481
It was the only time a SuperXBat pairing had a chance, and barely at that.

>>88256040
I was just thinking to myself the other day that Batwing would have been a more appropriate handle for Cassandra than Luke Fox.
Or the Silhouette.
Really anything, she doesn't have to be Batgirl if that's the problem, though if they could find a reason to have her keep the costume or a similar one that would be cool.
Hell, she could be a new Katana, or something not Bat-themed at all, that's basically what they were going for in Beware the Batman.

Sidenote: Does anyone else think Tim should be given a different name? Red Robin just sounds so... dumb, and lazy. It's kind of growing on me, but I mean they could easily just think up something new for him, like if they want to keep the bird motif just call him Cardinal or something.

>>88256382
describes Tim perfectly

>>88262761

I hope when Tim comes back that they spin Cass, Stephanie out out of Tec into a ongoing. Like Tim and STeph are trying to live outside the box but Cass lures them back. Throw in Lynx, Oynx, and.. Harper as the supporting cast.

Tim needs a new role.

>>88263372
That's a pretty awesome idea. Depends on sales, though.

>>88257181
>You mean, like say make her a communications, and information specialist? Someone who could through her own unparalleled skills coordinate and guide every hero in Gotham and even further out if needed to more effectively fight crime? Something that makes use of her own talents and allows her to contribute in a unique and clever capacity?

Isn't that kinda what Barbara does as Oracle? Or was that the joke?

>>88260633
Well, /co/ hates characterfans, so there's that. But I will say, as a Steph fan, I have both sympathy and frustration with most of the Cass fans I've met.

Sympathy because Cass was treated almost as badly as Steph (almost because 1) she did get her own series for 73 issues, instead of 25, and 2) she never died).

Frustration because Cass fans have a tendency to be SJWs (tendency - not all of them all, just to clarify) who make Cass all about race and disability, and saying anyone who doesn't love Cass as much as they do are racist and/or ableist.

>>88263757
>Frustration because Cass fans have a tendency to be SJWs (tendency - not all of them all, just to clarify) who make Cass all about race and disability, and saying anyone who doesn't love Cass as much as they do are racist and/or ableist.
As someone that's brought up Cass's race and disability, I think you're misinterpreting that without context. It's not that Cass is great because she's asian or can't read, it's that if DC is going to go "Babs is so progressive! She' a GRRL! She has a trans roommate! She's best friend with a black girl with a side cut!" and then insist that Cass is toxic and needs to stay in limbo, that's kind of hypocritical. Even Steph (before Batgirl Steph where she was poor white trash teenage mom with a monther on drugs and a daddy in jail) would be worth more "points" than that.

This all comes down to Babs being awful nostalgia pandering.

>>88263871
I'm fully on board with hating the editorial mandate of Cass and Steph being toxic. But there shouldn't be "points" in the first place - all three (or four or five, but I count three) Batgirls are amazing characters, and have their place. You shouldn't have to like one more or less than the others because of their race or educational ability.

>>88263757

I love both characters, just a tiny bit more on Cassandra than Stephanie since well I didn't get onto enjoying the later until #20 and #26 of Cass's ongoing which focused heavily on her.

Then when she became Batgirl it was daunting because it took Cass away, but it made sense and it was better than Barbara being downgraded to it.

Now Barbara as a character just feels lost in this. The only comic I enjoyed of Barbara was the freaking one-shot from Endgame that was basically a "silent" issue and I would kill to see that approach taken with Cassandra.

Other than that, Burnside crashed and burned after the writers fell into the hole with them trying and ultimately failing in capturing that spark that Miller had with Stephanie. Simone fell into as well trying to be gritty, but fuck Barbara isn't that gritty and her run became a parody of itself. Even the current writer I almost feel is heading toward that direction with the next arc on Penguin Jr.

That there is the great ironic problem for me. Cassandra and Stephanie's shadows as Batgirl are far more memorable than anything currently Barbara has done.

It's just that all this feels like a downgrade for Barbara. After all the character's been through in Birds of Prey and her appearances in Batgirl comics of Stephanie and Cass. Her Batgirl adventures just seem superfluous.

It also doesn't help that while the upper management claim that, "MUH ICONISM." The only two major appearances people remember of Barbara are of 66 and TAS. Nowadays any major movie involving her barely resembles the character (B&R and who knows with what they're going with Lego Batman Movie, other than it's a better direction then what she's got in the comics).

Cass and Steph have had any major multi media appearances outside comics is even more disappointing because both deserve it. Though maybe Young Justice does something with Stephanie in Season 3 then a minor cameo?

Maybe that's the great fear they have. Too many characters "saturating" the well. Or worse one of them could upend Barbara.

I mean look at Cassandra. Put her character in animation, live-action, or a video game. People would be like, "Barbara who?"

>>88258294
I wonder why they chose to have her keep her thrift store costume.

>>88258796
They're doing such a shitty job with her atm.
She's literally just a beat everyone up character.
She has no story or character to her. She's just a good guy goon

I liked her as a mute kung fu supergenius.

>Dude, full-body costumes lmao

>>88263686

Tim has fans who will buy anything as evidenced at them buying the garbage that was Scott Lobdell's Teen Titans.

There are still fans of Cassandra and Stephanie as well. Hell put Conner or Connor Hawke. A capable artist and writer who knows these characters and the style that befits them. Fucking thing would print money.

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> Cass will never have a story where she storms a building filled to the brim with a variety of criminals to rescue innocents.

>>88255545
She and Hawke reinforced the martial arts side of comics that were in decline in dc and had only survived thanks to the bat books, she was great as daughter of batman and had an interesting background that didn't felt forced, good design etc

>>88264110
I agree that there shouldn't be "points" but the fact of the matter is that DC tried to make it out to be that there was and kept hyping Babsgirl as Strong Female Character (tm)

So if they want to play the game then I'm going to capitalize on the irony and use their rules against them. Same as I do when Marvel pushes Carol over Phylla and Monica.

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>>88264750
At least she doesn't take a turn bitching and moaning like everyone else does in TEC after Tim "died".

Whoever thought Orphan was a good code name deserves to be punched in the balls, forever.

>>88255545
Cass earned it.

Bruce trained for a lifetime to be a master of a billion disciplines.
Dick trained under Bruce for years, and was already an accomplished acrobat.
Jason lacked that training, and died. When he came back, it was only due to his willingness to use more extreme/letah force that he retains an edge.
Tim was smart enough to figure out Bruce's secret identity at the age of eight, and before he was even allowed to be Robin, he was sent on a training tour that included several martial arts masters, among them Lady Shiva.
Damien was a genetically engineered tykebomb raised by the League of Assassins from birth.

Cass fits in with them far more than Babs, a librarian that put on a costume one Halloween

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I have always loved Cass Cain, I bough No Man's Land hardcover becaus of her.

>>88264868
Explain this meme

>>88267081
The Raid was a good movie. It would have been a better movie if it featured Cass instead of a police task force.

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>>88267081
When Cass book was canceled and she was turned into a lame villain, fans lamented by thinking up all the stories they never could have because of it.

It became a huge thread.

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>>88267377
And then this was made.

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>>88267377
>>88267422

>>88267422
>dat back
>dat ass
>those fucking legs

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>>88267513

Then have this.

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Tis the season.

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Thread needs some more glorious psu-drawn Cass.

>>88268331
cute

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>>88268952

Momma Shiva got the treatment too.

>>88255545
>why is it Cassandra Cain?
this >>88255566 and big tits.