Which one, /co/? Which is the superior edgy grimdark 1986 comic?

They're both shit to tbhfam.

File: Marshal Law 1.jpg (79KB, 400x616px) Image search: [Google]

79KB, 400x616px

>>88220675
This one

>>88220675
Watchmen isn't edgy. It's a criticism of edgy.

File: 1468981149043.jpg (29KB, 378x361px) Image search: [Google]

29KB, 378x361px

>>88220675
>edgy grimdark

File: drax.png (214KB, 409x255px) Image search: [Google]

214KB, 409x255px

>>88220964
>one of the main characters is the product of superhero-on-superhero rape

>a major event in one of the character's lives involves a little girl being cooked and fed to dogs

>not edgy

edgy isn't necessarily a bad thing, both TDKR and watchmen are good edgy. but let's not pretend it wasn't edgy because the word edgy has recently taken on a negative connotation.

File: 1478128349382.gif (1MB, 500x213px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 500x213px

>>88220675
Returns, because it's actually enjoyable and not cynical trash

Watchmen. I own both and enjoy them, but Watchmen is simply better. Oh yeah Watchmen isn't some deep criticism of comics. It's just an elseworlds story. Alan Moore couldn't use the charlton characters

>>88220675
Not a big fan of Watchmen but it's technically very well put together and deserves most of it's praise. DKR is crap.

DKR

Take away the 80's trappings of it and you still have a story about a man growing old yet fully committed to the only thing he has left in his life

DKR is great, Miller is one of my favorites
I've never read Watchmen

>>88221177
It was only an attempted rape, plus the timeline doesn't match up at all.

>>88222196
>I've never read Watchmen

I thought the meme wasn't real.

File: IMG_0962.jpg (51KB, 300x455px) Image search: [Google]

51KB, 300x455px

>>88220675
Neither

>Reddit

Watchmen

>4chan

The Dark Knight Returns

>>88220675
I like both, but Watchmen is probably better.

>>88220809
Came to post this.

File: 1427962944902.jpg (39KB, 400x400px) Image search: [Google]

39KB, 400x400px

Watchmen is simplistic elitist lefty horseshit propaganda

>>88222432
The Patrician answer

>>88223020
Okay, I'll bite: explain.

>>88223144
it's just bait dude

>This is what Johns actually believe

>>88220675

Watchmen

>>88220675

I dunno about DKR but Watchmen doesn't seem edgy to me.

The movie was but the book, not really.

>>88223443
i direct you to this >>88221177

Swamp Thing

>>88223455

But wouldn't "edgy" connote violence and gore for the sake of it and shock value?

The two listed examples don't really qualify as edgy. For instance, besides the fact that the child murder is actually rather understated, it's also meant to make a point as well as to develop the philosophies of two characters. Also, Silk Spectre isn't the product of rape: she was conceived between a would-be victim and her potential-rapist, which is important later in convincing Manhattan of the beauty and worth of human existence.

No, I don't think "edgy and grimdark" describes Watchmen. A good example of that would be the movie, wherein ultraviolence and excessive swearing is employed in an attempt to make it seem mature while achieving the opposite effect.

>>88224043
>But wouldn't "edgy" connote violence and gore for the sake of it and shock value?

no

"daringly innovative; on the cutting edge."

watchmen is edgy, in the actual definition of the word, not the 4chan "anything slightly dark i don't like is bad" edgy definition

it was certainly edgy at the time to have such dark shit happen in a medium that was still broadly considered to be for children

>>88224195

I can agree on that defection but I'm not sure if it's the one OP meant.

Regardless, I'd choose Watchmen.

>>88224300
I'm OP, and yeah, that's what I meant

File: 1474376112939.png (234KB, 733x298px) Image search: [Google]

234KB, 733x298px

I don't know what's "better," but I certainly enjoy TDKR more. It's more optimistic, a lot more FUN to read, and it doesn't insult the idea of superheroes in the cynical stupid way Moore does.

Watchmen just comes across as "old man yells at clouds" to me, it's so out of touch and cynical and simplistic in it's political message and meta commentary on superheroes. TDKR has a more universal and nuanced political view, and I think has a better, more enjoyable, more realistic view of superheroes than Watchmen does.

I'd also say TDKR is a more influential book for sure.

I get why they're compared here but they're so radically different stylistically.

TDKR is so high energy and the paneling flows so quickly while Watchmen is clearly slower paced and intellectual. Not to say that they don't both take advantage of elements of the others style but they are just clearly different approaches to comic books.

I don't really like the influence these books had in terms of subject matter and think that a lot of writers since have mismanaged the tone of these stories.

Ultimately, I'd say I like TDKR more and find Watchmen overrated especially in terms of other Alan Moore works

>>88225418
yeah I agree

I think they're compared so often because they're both "dark" and they both came out in 86, but beyond that, there's not really much to compare

I also think the "darkness" of dark knight is overstated. It's really not that grim, it's pretty lighthearted at times and fun the whole time

>>88225588
also I would say that Watchmen is attempting a realism that is entirely absent from TDKR but I guess we've already agreed they're pretty dissimilar.

>>88224043
You have the 4chan definition of edgy. Edgy was trully something daring and vanguardist, before it became a meme.

>>88226478

Maybe but when the defense of "it's edgy" is "there's child murder and rape" it leans more toward the memetic sense.