Batman #12 Preview

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And that's it til Wednesday

>>88189983
Oh I really like this.

This is actually really well written.

Is this gonna be one of those arcs where it keeps alternating between absolute crap and really great? That's almost worse than if it was just bad the whole way through.

>>88189944
>>88189964
>>88189983
This surprisingly not bad and I'm actually excited now to read this issue.

>>88189964
The lettering has been fucking shit in this arc.

Deciding whether or not to get this trade is going to be really tough

>issue #9: great
>issue #10: shit
>issue #11: shit
>issue #12: great(?)
>issue #13: ???
>issue #14: ???
>issue #15: ???

>>88189944
>problematic fave
>>88189983
Cutting incoming.

It's still too fucked that they made Catwoman a mass murderer for me to give a shit. A damn shame too, because Batman opening up like this is fucking rare.

>>88190330
What are the odds at this point that King backtracks/says it was all a ruse?

Holy shit Janin just set the standard on how Poser Artists should work these last few issues. No fucking obscuring shadows, that's my problem with the guy who draws Wacky Raceland and Deodato, they always try to hide the fact that they're using models by covering it up with too much shadows

>>88190348
The same odds as him backtracking on Vision going nuts and nearly trying to destroy the world if not for his wife taking the blame and committing suicide.

>>88190493
It still looks obvious computer shit. I'd take Sorrentino over him. Or almost any other poser artist.

>>88190533
>Missing the point this much

>>88190330
there's a difference between assassin and mass murderer, and we've already learned her motive and it wasn't that unreasonable.

Get over your waifu not being squeaky clean anymore.

People like janin and deodato should be banned from the industry. Modellers make the art look like tacky shit desu. Gross

>>88190348
80%
But I don't know, king has played it straight all the way so far. Personally I'm going to stay with him for this arc and the I am bane arc. If there's no pay off I'll decalre maximum butthurtius and walk away.

Why do those guys wear a mask? No, seriously.

>>88190652
Yeah, me too. I am Bane arc will be King last chance before I drop it.

>>88190756
So Janin doesn't have to bother with faces.

>>88190757
kek

I am Bane is his last arc. You're literally saying you'll drop it if you don't like it by the final issue.

>>88190599
Do the people who keep saying this not understand that writing that she's willing to personally assassinate 247 people drastically changes her characterization? Does who Catwoman is begin and end at "she wears a cat suit"?

>>88191037
Good, then he can come back and make Dick Grayson great again.

>>88189920
>none sexy Catwoman

no interest at all

>>88191170

She's a villain, villains kill people.

>>88191308
That's insanely reductive. Never write stories because you're clearly terrible at it.

>>88191037
>I am Bane is his last arc
Wait, what? When this was confirmed?

>>88191335
http://www.newsarama.com/30875-tom-king-on-how-gotham-girl-leads-batman-to-bane.html

>King has also said that the superpowered character, who just lost her brother in issue #5, will be an important part of his three-part run on Batman over the coming months - helping to link together King's first arc, "I Am Gotham," with the second, "I Am Suicide," and third, "I Am Bane."

>>88191170
>Does who Catwoman is begin and end at "she wears a cat suit"?
Yes. I shall take great glee in telling you that your waifu is bland as a cardboard. Despite having popularized the sassy thief lady archetype, she's one of the weakest examples of it. Killing a bunch of people is the most interesting she's ever been.

>>88191388
We don't know for sure that means it's his last arc, just that these are the three planned for the moment.

>>88191170
It was ok when Morrison did it, at least King isn't giving Batman a kid

>>88189983
>the "just a crazy guy dressed like a bat" meme

Oh boy, breaking new grounds here

>>88191410
Ok so you just don't read the comics. Got it.

>>88191504

Waifufags would love if Catwoman told Batman she's expecting his baby girl and that's why she can't go back to jail.

>>88191703
Might as well bring Helena in the main canon

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>>88191848
She was for a bit

>>88189964
>>88189983
these pages and the pipe one with catwoman and ventriloquist are fucking awesome. big fan of the art so far this arc.

>>88190209
I thought eleven wasn't bad. 10 was a bit absurd and I think its going to ruin the story as a whole even more in the trade. It's just to fucking stupid to happen so quickly in the story.

>>88189964
>>88189983
why didn't he assault the prison from the start
what's even the point of the entire suicide team
and this is right after he got beaten by Bane

>>88190006
>>88190083
>>88190092
>Batman writing a love letter talking about how laughable his life-long crusade is
>Bruce Wayne is a mask and his true identity is a 10 year old child
>Great writing

Just give it up guys. This is the worst Batman has been in a long time

>>88189964
>>88189983
The art for this run has been on point

>Yeah, I do, yeah. Batman readers are the smartest readers in the world. I don't have to hold their hands.

KEK

Tom, these "Batman readers" aren't the people who read Omega Men or Vision or Sheriff of Babylon. These "Batman readers" are the people who think the cringey narration boxes in Red Hood and the Outlaws is good writing

>>88192307
>>88192597
You need to go back.

>>88192747
>the people who read Omega Men or Vision or Sheriff of Babylon

that's because they almost don't exist

>>88192747
>I read Omega Men/Vision/Sheriff of Babylon so I'm special snowflake!
Top lel. Reading these books doesn't make you look smart, anon.

>>88192765
Back? I've been here for almost a decade. Nowhere to go back to.

>>88191388
Considering its been the highest selling Batbook in years to the point that the back issues hit the bestseller list, King is here to stay and I for one am glad. I will take anything over autistic solo Bruce.

the only people that defend this book are people that never read Batman and are only here following their meme writer

>>88193102
No the only people that hate on it are newfags that started with Snyders run or people that dont read comics

Best Batstuff since Mozz IMO. Do not understand the hate.

Well except for Finch and Janin's bad art

>>88192765
Do my people need me?

>>88189983

This is a cool page

>>88193110
>NO U

woah, epic argument

>>88193115
>best stuff since the second worst Batman writer

>>88193110
This. Snyder's run is easily the worst run of all time and anyone is better than him after 5 years of that trash.

>>88193141
>Morrison is bad

Get your bait out of here. What run do you like faggot?

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>>88193115
>finch is bad meme

he is bad in general but his art for batman has been good, the colouring and inking has made his art look pretty nice

>>88193157
the classics, stuff that you probably never touched because they were too grounded and didn't have Batman be a retard that can only express himself with "TT" and "HH"

>>88193193
>the classics

Name a run faggot. Stop just fucking memeing and trying to act like you know anything. What run.

>>88193219
O'Neil and Dixon

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>>88193256
>Dixon
>good

>>88191170
She only ever did good things because she was brainwashed by zatanna

Now in all seriousness, killing terrorists is what many would deem a heroic act. She's not superman, the fact that she doesn't regularly kill or is unwilling to kill doesn't mean that she thinks everyone deserves to live. No one is going to miss a bunch of lowlifes that blew up an orphanage and would have done more in the future.

>>88193332
I'd take Dixon over Snyder and King desu

>>88193256
What arcs specifically? Cause I love those runs and Kings Bruce is very much in line with classic Bruce.

Caring for his family the most but keeping them at arms length due to the crusade.

>>88193145
Snyder was fucking terrible and I think King is supremely overrated but was curious on his take and it's somehow even worse.

>>88193370
Yeah I love that classic O'Neil story where Batman tersely repeats himself constantly and then reveals that he thinks the mantle is a joke and he used to cut himself as a kid while Catwoman is off serially murdering hundreds of people.

>>88193375
Nothing will ever be worse than not Dick Grayson, autistic, quippy "darling" hates his family Bruce.

Why is this poser shit allowed?

Janin and Deodato make me cringe with their art as i just hate it

>>88193332
I guess Bane wasn't good until LE BASED KING turned him into a weak willed faggot that needs brainwashing to get over venom

>>88193401
When the fuck did Batman say the mantle was a joke?

>>88193408
>le Dick Grayson is the only one with one liners meme

yep, the kind of casuals that have only read Dickbats and think Bruce didn't use to make comments and is just constantly silent

>>88193408
Snyder's fingerprints are all over this run it's the same exact Bruce who eschews everyone except the brand new OC's and the only redeeming factor from the previous run, the bombastic camp that rarely worked but at least was comic booky, is gone.

>>88193332
Go eat a dick. Dixon was good and No Man's Land remains severely underrated.

>>88193426
>>88189983

>>88193445
To be fair Snyder's Batman went well beyond the occasional one liner into snarky flippant territory.

>>88193458
Dixon contributed to NML but that really was more of the Rucka Show since he wrote or co-wrote most of the important arcs.

>>88193445
Kek I am a Batgod not a casual. Bruce is not quippy unless hes pissed and then it is sadistic and short.

>>88193193
Did you actually read Morrison's run? Because your reading comprehension isn't all that great if you did.

>>88193528
exactly how he was in Snyder's run then

>>88193608
No. Snyder had him doing whole pages of quips.

>>88193448
are u a retard, this is much more bombastic and campy

hating Snyder is a meme

>>88192747
Did you read those? King had an unnatural narration and dialogue problem in two of those.

>>88193370
There weren't a shitload of fanfic bat characters during O'Neil's time.

>>88193818
vision had fantastic narration

>>88193744
No he just came in and shit all over canon and the Batfam so long time readers hate him and new readers dont know better.

>>88193876
>2
>a shitload

>>88193893
>MUH DAMIAN AND MUH DICK

Oh, so you are one of those

>>88193401
>Serially murdering

She killed a terrorist cell in order to exact justice. Nothing more, nothing less. That's not serial killing.

>>88193256
>>88193357
>Dixon
Yes, two decent issues out of the thousands he wrote.

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http://www.newsarama.com/32231-catwoman-s-claws-are-out-for-batman-in-12.html

>Nrama: She is unique, but I hear within your description that Batman and Catwoman are similar - and maybe that's where the attraction lies - even if they had to climb out of their childhood pain in different ways.

>King: Yeah, I think that's right. And I think what makes them just a perfect romance for the DCU is that, because they're similar in that way, they see through each other. They kind of see through the bullsh*t that everyone else sees.

>That's why I have them call each other "Cat" and "Bat" in this. It's sort of a tribute to the fact that, like, Selina's smart enough and she knows enough to know that Bruce Wayne and the whole act - that's all an act, that's all it is, and that what's at the core of Batman is Batman.

>Batman's smart enough to see that same thing in Catwoman. What's at the core of Catwoman is not this Selina identity she was born with, but the Catwoman identity that she adopted to get through the pain.

>And they see that in each other, and they respect that in each other.

>They're uniquely the only two people that see it in each other, that sort of see each other through the masks - that see the masks under the masks. I think that's the way I put it in this issue.

>And I think that's what makes great soul mates - it's the people who see all your faults and love you still. And I think that's what they have in each other. Someone's like, "OK, you see right through me. You see all the things that I'm afraid everyone's going to judge me for. They're out on the table. And somehow, you like that about me. And you even love that about me."

>That's what makes them unique, and that's also what makes them uniquely vulnerable and makes them fight - the fact that when they're standing in front of each other, they are so vulnerable that their defense mechanisms kick in.

>yfw King outed himself as the biggest BatCat faggot of all time
>yfw it's never gonna stop

>>88193141

lol wut. I thought Morrison has a top Batwriter was accepted wisdom.

>>88193172

Jordie Bellaire was a miracle worker on those first issues

>>88193913
If you dont think the Batfam is essential you are a casual.

>>88193713
Nothing screams camp like having Batman resigned to die in the first issue, have his back broken, and reveal he's a cutter by issue 12.

>>88193893
You forgot that his writing is terrible too.

>>88193991
they aren't, and you would know this if you actually did read comics

Alfred, Gordon and one random sidekick are essential

not the 15 random OC that are there just to make Bruce look bad, if you want them they all have other books

>>88193940
BASED KING, SUPPORTING BEST SHIP

I bet he's also a HarleyIvy shipper too

>>88193893
How did he shit on the Batfamily?

Why does /co/ seem to think that everyone has to be on either "team King" or "team Snyder"? It's retarded logic like that which gets us console/company wars. It's possible to have two completely independent opinions of the runs and saying you find one bad doesn't mean that you're from team B.

>>88194049
So Batman doesn't need a family but he does need a small tight knit group of people to rely upon and trust/love? And fuck Dick Grayson and the other characters that have been around for decades and have established ties to the character because Duke Thomas and Gotham Girl are better?

>>88194116

death of the family?

>>88193883
It was decent at best. His dialogue and narration have always been his weakest points.

>>88194128
>And fuck Dick Grayson

Yes? He has his own book and all his fans want for him to grow out of Batman's shadow so be it, out of the batbook. We don't need him to pop out in every issue to remind us how he is the nicest guy that ever existed.

>>88194116
Duke
Harper
Vagina Pennyworth

>>88194015
resigned to die while playing buckaroo with a fucking passenger jet

>>88194176
But we do need Duke Thomas to pop out every issue to remind us that...

>>88194176
Youre a colossal faggot. It makes no sense for Batman to not have his proteges that are operating in his city not pop up in his book.

>>88194116
he dared introducing new characters!!!
something no one ever did!

>>88194128
Have you even read older Batman runs?He didn't always have an army of sidekicks. It was mostly Robin and Alfred, and even Robin used to be sparingly used, depending how much the writer liked him.

>>88194224
It's a Batman book, go read Nightwing if you want Nightwing. Tec if you want all the others.

And they did pop out in Snyder's run, they just weren't the center of every issue as you "Batman fans" wanted

>>88194177
>>88194238
I didn't like him adding more characters to an already bloated family, but most people blame him for not using more of Damian, Dickinson and Tim in his Batman run.

>>88194272
No, you go read another character if you want a vigilante that operates alone.

Batman hasnt been that in decades. His strength is his family.

>>88194356
>wanting the story to be about Batman and a few characters instead of an unfocused mess with thousand of characters is "wanting him to be alone"

Top kek, you guys aren't even Batman fans you just care about the various OC.
You already have Tec if you want Batman to constantly interact with the batfamily

>>88194267
Robin and Alfred are the original Bat-Family you fucking moron. The idea of Batman not working alone was introduced a mere year after his creation and is integral to his enduring success. How bout you actually read some fucking comics?

>>88194398
I care about Dick, Damian, Red Hood and Tim.

Characters that have been around forever and some are literally living at his house. Youre a fucking retard if you think the Batbook should completely ignore his entire family running around his city.

>>88194421
Yeah, nice reading comprehension and doubling down. You were totally talking about Alfred.

>>88194510
>waaaaaah they should be in every issue because I say so!!

Thank god Snyder proved you faggots wrong.
Those characters all have their own books, you can find them there. There's no reason for them to be constantly portrayed in a book that has the purpose of focusing on Batman.

Not that you actually care since you only read Batman for them unlike actual fans.

>>88189983
Say what you will about Janin's "art", at least he does good layouts

>>88194517
He's part of the Bat-Family you stupid fuck.

>>88194709
he has very good sensibilities and i think that when he gets a chance to do a comic where he has longer to work on the art he wont use the posers and will do something wonderful

>>88194629
Yes only true fans want to see Batman cavorting around with Duke Thomas and Gotham Girl.

>>88194769
yeah, true fans read Batman to read about Dick Grayson and Damian Wayne, right?

kill yourself already

>>88194913
You're right, Dick Grayson has nothing to do with Batman. I'm getting the noose right now. Think about me when you're sitting in class tomorrow learning about fractions.

>>88194913
>true fans read Batman to read about Dick Grayson
Well considering that Dick has been a part of the Batman mythos for literally 99% of his existence, yes. But please, tell me about how the only good period in Batman comics was Detective Comics #27-Detective Comics #37.

>>88195098
Kek, dickfags really are retarded

>>88195134
Such an epic and witty answer!
Let's ignore that Dick has been barely present since he became Nightwing, no you are right Dick Grayson was present in every single Batman issue in the last 30 years and should be featured as the center piece of every issue now too because the first moment the entire batfamily doesn't appear in every arc it's bad

>>88193940

Wow, no panels in Batman #12 huh? I though King was panel-sexual.

>>88195230
>should be featured as the center piece of every issue
I never said that. In fact that would be a horrible idea. Conversely, cutting Dick out of Batman stories entirely would also be a horrible idea.

>>88195340
and I never said that he should never appear

>>88189983
>the whole world should laugh
Shut up Joker

>>88193940
Jesus Christ, that's a LOT of hired guns.

>>88189983
>batman is not a hero
>just a manchild dressing like a bat

it's almost like /co/ was writing this garbage

>>88195230
You're a fucking moron. Keep moving those goalposts and defending terrible OCs while pretending that Batman has nothing to do with Robin and their fans are completely separate.

>>88195581
>things I never said

>>88195637
>>88194913
I hope someone stabs you in the eye with an ice pick.

>>88195402
>>88195637
This is one thing I hate about 4chan's anonymity. In arguments with multiple people it's impossible to know who has said what.

>>88195578

He's simply saying he's aware of the absurdity of the situation, nothing else. Batman isn't above a bit of self-depreciation.

>>88195699
No wonder you are a fan of Damian
speaking of which is also an OC that, if we applied your logic of never allowing new characters, would have never appeared

>Everyone calling characters they don't like "OC"

I don't understand this complaint. That's literally every bat character not made by Bob Kane and Bill Finger. Yeah some of these characters are shit, but if your only argument is that "a batman writer made them up" then you're an idiot.

>>88196917
whoever posted the preview, you left the two pages that addressed some of the problems in the fucking thread.

>>88196967
those weren't in OP's source

>>88196891
>>88196917
Just thinking about that makes me nauseous

>>88196891
>>88196917
Do you have copies of these that aren't so compressed and hard to read?

So happy to see Batman punch his way through 100s of armed men. The tension being dislocated from the action is ideal in status quo books

>>88197144

he got them from the newsarama King interview, and this is how they look there.

>>88195578
You know who else had Bruce point out the ridiculousness of his situation? Morrison is Arkham Asylum you fucking faggot.
>I sometimes... question the validity of my decisions. Sometimes I'm afraid that when I walk through the Asylum front doors... it will be like coming home.

>>88197144
This is considerably more clear than the one in the newsarama preview. It was literally impossible to read.

>>88191695
I don't need to read the comics. It's plainly obvious that she's a dull, uninteresting character. They tried to make her noble, and she failed to be interesting. They made her a mob boss, and she failed to be interesting. Why can't you idiots just accept that?

>>88197927
>I don't need to read the comics. It's plainly obvious that she's a dull, uninteresting character.

/co/'s new mantra?

>>88194356

Batman operated mostly alone during Morrison's run. You only had Dick and Tim in Batman and Son and RIP, and even then they were cameos at best.

>>88193940

Funny how the BatCat shippers has been hating his run and take on Catwoman despite the dude being a BatCat shipper.

>>88197963
>Batman Inc
>Operated alone
????????

>>88198063

Batman Inc isn't BATMAN the book, though. The Batman book always had Batman mostly alone.

>>88197927
Are you that autist who would rant in every Catwoman storytime during Valentine's run about how much you hated Catwoman?

>>88198085
"Morrison's run" has always referred to the entire epic from Batman and Son to the end of Inc

>>88198179

I said Morrison's Batman run.

>>88198198
you didn't tho

>Batman operated mostly alone during Morrison's run

>>88198240

Still, in the Batman book that Morrison wrote the focus was entirely on Bruce. Tim would only cameo sometimes.

>>88197956
>implying you need to read something to know it sucks
You're new here, aren't you?

>>88198240

Lol talk about being pedantic. If you are familiar with Morrison's run then you'd know he was probably referring specifically to his stint on the Batman title from the content of his post.

Since when Selina was a fake identity? Selina was always truthful and earnest about herself. The Catwoman thing is just a mask that she uses to have fun.

Well, in Batman Returns Pfeifer acted as if her old life had died and that she was not literally a cat, but other than that i've never seen her act as Bruce does.

>>88198343

Her Catwoman identity has come to define who she is as a person more than her life outside the mask.

Even if you disagree, that's King's interpretation.

>>88198393

Like i'm saying, that's his take and that's OK, i'm just asking /co/ in what others places was this ever true.

In my understanding in most takes the Catwoman thing is an outlet. Something she does because is exciting and fun.

>>88189944
>explains why she's at Arkham and not Blackgate
Thank god, this bothered me

>>88198563
Gotham really should have its own prison for women though, the concept of a mixed-sex prison is just too out-there for me.

I find kinda unappealing when writers try to push a romance by forcing similarities between characters when it's much more fun to see different people clashing and changing one another for the better or worse.

Like take Superman and Lois Lane. They couldn't be more different but somehow they work because it's fun to see their interactions. Even Superman and Batman are like that. They're day and night.

By trying to make Catwoman as autistic as Batman you kinda lose something. Kinda makes them look superficial. "Oh, i'm into Batman because we're kindred spirits".

In my opinion BatCat works better when they force each other to think differently about themselves instead of only reaffirming each other's way of thinking.

>>88198681

There's nothing wrong with drawing similarities between two orphans who spend their nights gallavanting across rooftops in silly outfits. Not to mention King has made a point to state that they are different in several key ways multiple times.

You people arguing writers are nuts. I've read Batman written by Moore, Miller, Morrison, Johns, Loeb, Tomasi, Tynion, Snyder and King. And I couldn't for the life of me tell you the differences in his characterizations under each of them.

>>88199889
Not a very perceptive reader then.

>>88198629

I imagine you're talking about Blackgate as opposed to Arkham as most mental health facilities aren't segregated.

>>88198681
>In my opinion BatCat works better when they force each other to think differently about themselves instead of only reaffirming each other's way of thinking.

The most important difference between Selina and Bruce is their class background. Bruce isn't only upper class, he isn't only a 1%er; he's part of a handful of the wealthiest people on the planet.

Selina on the other hand used to be a prostitute (I don't care what anyone says, Year One is canon and is pointed out as being canon with one of the final issues of Snyder's run, and obviously in Morrison's run; Selina was a sex-worker in Year One).

It's why I feel Batman tolerates Catwoman, she's basically just a thief, and can rebut Bruce by pointing out that he's a goddamn billionaire.

>>88196917
>Truly I am DC Comics™ Presents: Batman™ :I Am Suicide

Fuckin' really?

>>88201664
Be grateful the arc isn't called "I was in the CIA"

>>88202420
I'm still waiting for I am CIA. If King wants any kind of positive legacy, he better make Bill Wilson canon.