Bravo Waid!

https://twitter.com/thebigbang_/status/795713333265625089

Based Aquaman

>>87540438
The Hell it has to do with him?

People liked Avengers though.

>>87540438
It's just normies buying shitty story because it has Batman on cover. People who are interested in actual fun story bought Avengers. And it'll be even better when they add Doom.

>>87540489
Waid wrote said Avengers issue.

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Mfw in these threads

>>87540438
Batman selling more than Avengers what a shocker, call me when some indy comics sells more than a important marvel book

>>87540438
Shit outselling shit. I don't see the cause for celebration.

>>87540438
Oh great, guess it's time for Big Bang Comics to shill their Twitter on 4chan again now...

>>87540546
Marvel damage control spotted

>>87540531
This dude twitters has been him shitting shitting on Marvel since they sell like shit in his store.

>>87540499
That's actually true. They did say this a few tweets earlier:

>AVENGERS (Volume 37ish) #1 did well, 92% first week. But we ordered a really low number for an AVENGERS #1, desu. And only 20% sold from the shelf, the VAST majority were pre-orders. That weren't _really_ pre-orders, but orders carried over from previous ANAD AVENGERS.
>Also, no one gave a flying fig about the variants for this. If it's not a Skottie Young variant, no one cares here.

>>87540572
And last year someone posted a tweet from them where they were complaining of how low DC was selling. So?

>>87540572
Aren't marvel comics selling shit all over the world and dosen't surprise me they're horrible outside a few i hope they start backpedaling with Bendis story and someone besides slott start writing spiderman

>>87540628
Spencer please

>>87540572
He hasn't been shitting on Marvel, it's not the shop's fault nobody is excited for MARVEL NOW 2

a year ago he was taking about how shitty DCYOU was selling

>>87540499
It was all right, so far I like it better than ANADA and it's miles better than Champions.

I just can't bring myself to give a shit about that Avengers roster, at least switch Whor for someone else.

I am honestly looking forward to Waid's Cap and Kooky Quartet comic

>>87540585
A 20% increase over the #15 of the last volume is terrible for a relaunch.

>>87540508
avengers are the lamest team ever

>>87540438
How can famous writer with great stories in the past be that salty and pathetic?

>>87540508
If they were interested in a fun story they wouldn't be reading Marvel.

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>>87540572
>>87540546
Yeah, it's totally Big Bang shitting on Marvel and shilling their store, and really not Marvel reader dissatisfaction guys!

>>87540438
>sexy doesn't mean sexy
Disinterest.

>>87540703
That's not O5.

>>87540719
he was always like that

he's still salty over x-men and lobdell drama that happened 20 years ago

tfw nobody read's Herc's book, again :(

>>87540737
they're at least Original, instead of assemble, b-listers!

>>87540742
Should have kept him with Van Lente and Pak, dude.

>>87540742
Herc has another book?

>>87540826
Well he's in the Avengers the tweet is talking about

>>87540848
I actually have no idea what the roster for Avengers is

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>OCCUPY AVENGERS #1, 28% first week. I dunno, would it have done better if it was just called HAWKEYE instead?

>OH, OH, MARVEL! NEXT DO A COVER WITH HAWKEYE AND A T-SHIRT SAYING "ASK ME ABOUT MY SJW AGENDA"!

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>>87540765
Would you prefer this version of Avengers? They even had their own fake Thor.

>>87540869
Spidey (Peter), Whor, FalconCap, Herc, Wasp, and Vision

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>>87540650
>a year ago he was taking about how shitty DCYOU was selling

This. Posts like >>87540572 are just sad damage control.

>>87540885
Avengers are lame. Mighty Lamevengers

When did Waid become such a colossal bitchboy?

>Marvel is lying to comic book stores, telling them their shit will sell, making them waste money on floppies no one buys.
>Meanwhile, DC books are actually selling, literally keeping these stores open.

Okay, it was funny before, but really, we need good Marvel books again that pander to people who buy comics. This is just pathetic.

>>87540438
>its another DCfag sales circle

Keep on making this place more and more like /v/

>>87540929
>>87540719
Huh? Waid didn't make the Tweet in the OP's screencap.

>>87540946
You're the main part of the problem.

>>87540946
How about YOU get onto Mousevel en masse and then there won't be anymore sales threads

>>87540977
pointing out console war shit is the problem? No, it's these threads that are the problem

>>87540438
>Batman outsells a non-Batman comic

WHO WOULD HAVE GUESSED!!!

>>87540985
>pointing out

That would be true if that was all you did in these threads

>>87540739

Say what?

>>87540885
Why does Black Knight look like Chinese knock off Dredd.

>>87540999
certainly not mark waid

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Go ghost cyclops go!

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>>87540999
Didn't used to be that way.

>>87540438
>>87540734
Marlel BTFO

>>87541056
>Fathom is #1
It's funny, when you google "fathom comic" all you get are covers, little to no panels from actual comic.

>>87540999
>Batman NUMBER TEN with a writer who hasn't been propped up to the heavens like Snyder was outsells Avengers NUMBER ONE with one of the highest profile writers in capeshit and one of the best capeshit artists
Yes, this is legitimately surprising and sad, since those sales will almost only decrease over time.

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>>87541056

>>87541056
>2 x titles in the top ten.
And then marvel gave it awful writers 10 years after and X-men is barely in the top 50.

>>87541056
What made Batman such a consistently high seller?
The consecutive momentum of Hush->Red Hood->Morrison->Snyder?
Movies?
Both?

>>87541090
>that many people buying ASBAR #7
Gross

>>87541113
Robins.

>>87540881
It's because Occupy Avengers is a good back to basics Hawkeye book with a horrible name and marketing.

>>87540894
Sounds a bit underwhelming

>>87541081
Batman's been over 100k for like five years straight. I just don't understand what joy you guys get out of watching him occupy half the top ten.

>>87540885
We have our own progressive fake Thor now, nobody cares about her, but its still a thing.

>>87541023

kek

>>87541056
What the hell is Fathom?

>>87541113
Hush was the starting point, and a bunch of popular runs and movies helped

>>87541131
*sad because
Not sure how I lost a word, but it still works.

But Batman is hot garbage right now

>>87541189
Damifag get out

>>87541125
That's retailer preorders

>>87541183
>But Batman is hot garbage right now
No. Duke is garbage.

>>87541111
Marvel altogether is barely on top 50. Not just the X-Men.
DC dominates since last summer.
September was the worst, top 50 had only 10 Marvel Titles, 39 DC and 1 from Image.

>Catwoman murders muslims outsells SJWaid
This is the future they doubled down on after it failed the first time.

>>87540881
You can't call it Hawkeye because Kate Bishop is Hawkeye now, you misogynist Trump voter!!!
Ugh, I can't even... Could you please just not?

>>87541236
>not insane
>put in Arkham anyway
Guess Blackgate went to Shadow Realm.

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Why are we talking about Batman when there's a REAL problem at hand

>Sell outs on GREEN LANTERNS #10 and HARLEY QUINN #7. Kids being off school this week really helped there!

>>87541263
>>87541238
Damifag get out.

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>>87541281
>Sell outs on GREEN LANTERNS #10
We're gonna make it bros :)

>>87541090
Hopefully we get another JLA Wedding Special soon...

>>87541090
>dark horse in the top 10
Huh

>>87541113
Hush was the first thing that increased Batman's sales, then there was the whole Red Hood thing. But at the time Bendis was also starting off his Avengers run so it outsold Batman for a long time, even when Morrison took over the book.

However when Morrison started Batman and Robin, it was getting higher orders than Bendis' Avengers. Then Bendis' Avengers relaunched into Avengers and New Avengers, and his relaunches had higher orders than Morrison's Batman and Robin.... up until like the fifth issues and then they went below B&R. But then Batman Incorporated happened and Finch's Dark Knight happened and they outsold the Avengers only briefly because they got plauged by delays, for starters.

But it's Snyder and Capullo that had Batman's sales be as high as it is. Sure, you could argue that Batman as a character is why people are buying it, but looking at the past it generally sold consistently, but not always a top seller.

I hope comic stores didn't place big orders on Marvel titles cause they're gonna have to eat them.
Well, that'll be a lesson for them, not to trust Marvel.
Marvel Now's #2 orders ought to be down more than 50% after this fiasco.

>>87541316
Wrong GL book.

BASED BAZ FTW!

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>>87541318
>Implying it won't be a Harley & Ivy Wedding Special

>>87541337
>However when Morrison started Batman and Robin, it was getting higher orders than Bendis' Avengers. Then Bendis' Avengers relaunched into Avengers and New Avengers, and his relaunches had higher orders than Morrison's Batman and Robin.... up until like the fifth issues and then they went below B&R. But then Batman Incorporated happened and Finch's Dark Knight happened and they outsold the Avengers only briefly because they got plauged by delays, for starters.
Batman and son.

>>87541360
I know, I just want GL as a whole to be sell well and it's the first pic I saw

>>87540438
>Batman selling more copies than X comic

N-NANI?!?!?!?!?!

>>87541383
A #10 selling four times as much as a #1 of another big title with a well-known name is a big deal.

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>>87541353
Supposedly it's happening to a lot of stores.

>>87540438
BASED BBC. MARLEL BTFO!

>>87541373

So that's the magic formula. Let's give all the heroes babies!

So he's not trying to seduce Batman #10? I'm disappointed.

>>87541437
These are old already.
Get the new ones about how Champions doesn't sell shit or such.

>>87541494
What an unfortunate acronym

>>87541626
>These are old already.

Don't be stupid. It's a retailer outright saying that even his Diamond rep is also aware of the problem too, from hearing other stores. Usually Tweets get dismissed from idiots like >>87540572 because of excuses like >one store

>>87541669
I know, I know.
I mean he's made more tweets since then.
These ones have been going on around for a while, but go and read the new ones too.

>>87540508

>Stories where talking heads just throw internet memes, tons of pandering towards Tumblr

>fun story.

Kill yourself.

>>87540885
This is the same squad, just with more Black people.

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jaj

>>87540531
Outselling it yes. But outselling by 400 percent?

>>87541785
FOC means.... Free of Charge?

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>mfw Big Bang moved to the other side of Dundrum shopping centre

They may have more space but they moved to a fucking dead zone.

>>87541376
I think HJGLC has been doing decently too

>>87541866
Final Order Cutoff

Basically it's the last chance to have to change your orders

>>87541866
Final Order Cutoff. Basically it's the last minute for retailers to reduce orders if they have second thoughts about it selling.

>>87541866
FOC means last second adjustment to your order number.

>>87541866

Final Order Cutoff. Basically it means last second adjustment to your order number.

>>87541947
It's five mins away you fucking pleb. And you saw how small it was previously, couldn't swing a dead rat's cock in it

>>87540438
I love seeing Marvel reap what they sow, but I actually quite enjoyed Avengers #1 Much more than anything out of King's Batman run, unfortunately

>>87542341
Eh. There's been some debate on the Bleeding Cool Bestseller list about how well the writing on Batman is so you're not alone.

I'll never understand why retailers will tweet about not being able to sell books. It's partly their fault

>>87542404
Is this one of those "a good salesman can sell ice to eskimos" things?

>>87542404
That's the attitude that made me stop going to comic shops and switching to digital completely. What's funny is that these guys are tweeting about not being able to sell Marvel titles and you're saying they're not doing a good job of selling them but what made me never step foot in a comic shop again was an imbecile trying to shove any shit with the marvel logo he had in the store.

>>87542404
Sounds like they are just bad at their jobs.

>>87542404
>>87542575
Is this the new excuse now?

>>87542404
partly, yes

but the other, arguably bigger part, is when a publisher isn't putting out comics people are drawn to buy

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THE DC TRAIN HAS NO BRAKES

>>87540531
Walking Dead and Saga regularly outsell A-list Marvel titles

>>87542404
I partly agree with you but media isn't appliances and I know a lot of people who have stopped going to comic places because of overbearing salespeople

Isn't Waid the owner of a comics shop too?

>>87540531
You mean like Walking Dead regularly outselling 95% of the big two?

>>87542680

he co-owned one, but I think he sold his portion due to conflict of interest or something stupid

>>87542740
"Why aren't my books selling ,it's your fault order more"

>>87542740
Why am I not surprised?

>>87542782
To be fair owning a shop is kind of a conflict of interest in an industry where a few thousand books is a big deal. He could take his pay from the issue and just preorder 5k copies and artificially inflate his sales and ask for more money

>>87542404

Probably because Marvel keeps giving them false information on the sales figures. At some point the bubble has to burst and people have to come to terms with reality. You cant forever pretend your shit is going to sell when it is simply not.

>>87542832
Fair point.

>>87542202
Still a fucking dead zone. There's zero foot traffic.

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>>87540485

>>87540734
I love this graph, even if it's a tad confusing if you aren't paying attention.

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>>87540438
GOOD! I may not like Batman that much anymore, but marvel deserves all the shit they get after losing their way!

So, just to be clear, Civil War 2 was suppose to end at the end of the year, but was delayed till the SUmmer of next year, but there are books talking about the events AFTER Civil War 2?

>>87543173
I've seen marvel lackeys satisfied with the products Marvel is publishing right now so...

>>87543178
This shit happened with Secret wars too.

Is Marvel Now even out? I'm so confused.

>>87543203

So what? Clearly theres not enough of Marvel fanboys out there to keep from failing.

>>87543203
believing you're on the right track is almost mandatory to lose your way

it starts with Brevoort and trickles down

>>87543226

yes.
all the new #1s that Marvel has had over the last month or so, and will continue to roll out over the next three.

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>>87540438

>Leave Marvel to me.

>>87543271
Don't flatter yourself, King. People would buy Batman if it were written by a raccoon.

>>87543300
People would buy MARVEL'S THE AVENGERS too even if written by a toad.

>>87543350
A toad would write them better than any current Marvel writer.

>>87542601
What do you expect from Marvel Shills? They're backs are up against the wall since they know their days are numbered. At this rate, Marvel will be shutting down their comics division within the next year or two.

>>87543224
>>87543178
This shit happened with Civil War I too.

>>87543350
>People would buy MARVEL'S THE AVENGERS too even if written by a toad.
Not really. Amazing Spider-man, yeah, but not Avengers.

>>87543300
Except in this thread it got proven that wasn't always true.

>>87543226
Yeah, it's been happening since last month. Champions is their flagship, Infamous Iron Man is already out.

>>87543260
Alonso you mean
Brevoort is a just an attack dog, tell him to shill SJW shit and shit on DC he does it with gusto.

>>87543178
Summer of NEXT YEAR?

How long is this fucking event? Does Bendis have another eight issues of people standing around and talking to write?

>>87543178
>but was delayed till the SUmmer of next year,

I think it's supposed to end this year or early next year. Not summer, though.

>>87540438
>selling 4 times more

except when the actual sales figures come out, it'll be stuck where it always is around 130k nationally (about 2.9x the #14 of ANAD Avengers), and the last Avengers relaunch (ANAD Avengers #1, last November) sold 129k

i can't help but notice this BBC thing keeps coming up, and I'm wondering if that's because you're into that acronym, OP

cause the guy's a fucking imbecile

>>87543816
>cause the guy's a fucking imbecile

Why? He's saying what sells at his store.

>it'll be stuck where it always is around 130k nationally (about 2.9x the #14 of ANAD Avengers), and the last Avengers relaunch (ANAD Avengers #1, last November) sold 129k

Yeah, and that's preorders, not sales to customers.

>>87543816
Ah aye? Well, yer luk loike a Sasanach langer.

>>87543816

>cause the guy's a fucking imbecile

Except its not just him but plenty of other retailers. And Marvel's sales to retailers dont count for shit if the retailers then cannot get the books off the shelves.

>>87543816
>and the last Avengers relaunch (ANAD Avengers #1, last November) sold 129k

Yeah retailers ordering 129k copies of ANAD Avengers #1 sure meant that 129k customers bought ANAD Avengers #1 and 2!

Oh wait, they didn't.

>23- ALL NEW ALL DIFFERENT AVENGERS ($5)

>11/15 ANAD Avengers #1 - 128,570
>12/15 ANAD Avengers #2 - 67,154 (-47.8%)

>Clearly, after X-Men, the Avengers franchise has lost its #1 appeal.

>>87540508
Now this is true butthurt.

>>87543226
Started last month. Standouts are:
>Foolkiller
>Avengers
>Mosaic
>Cage!
I also liked Great Lakes Avengers and Occupy Avengers well enough.

Solo is already going to be cancelled at 6.

>>87544089
It's worth noting that Cage! was made years ago, but Marvel shelved it until now for some reason.

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>>87544145
>for some reason.

>Luke Cage show gets released
>Genndy set to release new Samurai Jack

>>87544178
I get why it's being released now, but not why it was shelved in the first place.

>>87542404
That's not how comic book shops operate. most core consumers have a pull list or know what's considered good or bad. Its not their job to sell a shit comic because a shit comic that turns consumers awayeans lost revenue. If they think a costumer will like it they'll recommend it but shilling a book that's awful does more harm than good.

Its possible that tastes differ but acting like a used car salesman isn't the way to operate a comic book store. A car salesman only needs to sell a few cars to different people every few months and never see them again. A comic book store relies on regulars.

>>87540438
This store is in Ireland. How much stock do companies put into foreign sales?

>>87543669
No, Brevoort, notorious Fat Fuck, was there doing his thing long before Axel became EiC.
Brevoort is the problem.

>>87545117
Marvel didn't go full diversity at the expense of core readers until a few years into Alonso's reign. Quesada didn't do this.

>>87540508
>fun story
I spit my coffee

>>87545053
It's not just this people are looking at, it's this and other tweeters and sites.

>>87543350
Bruh, no one cares about the avengers.

>>87542404

Nothing would turn me off physical copies than the owners annoying me while I was trying to browse. They should be able to answer questions if I ask but entertainment media is down to individual taste so nobody can actually tell you what you will enjoy

It's not like appliances when there usually is a product that is clearly superior

>>87543966

>Dat drop

Reminds me of all the retards saying Rebirth titles were dropping hard

>>87544089
>Solo is already going to be cancelled at 6.

I could see it being stealth cancelled at 3 if I wasn't 100% sure about the real reason Solo was released

>>87541014
he was going to do X-Men with Lobdell but right out of the bat disagree on the direction and the whole Onslaught clusterfuck
only managed to co-wrote 3 issues with Lobdell before he was fired
plus he got screwed on Captain America twice because of Heroes Reborn

the man does have reasons to be salty but not as pathetic to hold a grudge for all these years

>>87541056
>Fathom selling that high
>that issue is now butchered in reprints because of Turner's fall out with Top Cow and the Tomb Raider rights
doesn't help that the guy died and Aspen barely has money to pay their creators, less to make deals with licenses

>>87545147
True, the Korean has exacerbated it, the foundation and environment has always existed. That's on Brevoort.

>>87541046
The fact that one of their few comics that is going up in sales in the one starring someone they specifically killed off and left out of nuMarvel is pretty funny.

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>>87541171
The last "artist driven blockbuster!" book of the 90's.

>>87541056
5 of the top 20 are X-Men based.

>>87547179

based Lobdell

>>87541316
You are truly the filthiest of casuals.

>>87547569
Between this and Wolverine they really did squander the popularity of the X-Men.

Giving Cyke to Bendis after AvX was a mistake

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>>87547179
What the fuck I like Lobdell now...

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>>87541056
>UXM #381
>X-men #101
>Wolverine #151
>#29
>#42
>#97
I miss this.

>>87548852
This was a fun Twitter thread

>>87540913
That thread is fucking hilarious.

>>87548555
>Between this and Wolverine they really did squander the popularity of the X-Men.

Well they couldn't really do anything because Perlmutter was having a fit over Fox having the X-Men film rights.

>>87540438
This will probably make DC fans more mad than the Marvel fans

>>87544089
Oh, also Unworthy Thor. Unworthy Thor was good and featured much more shirtless Thor than the cover would lead you to believe.

>>87548852
Noice!

>>87543350
Well, obviously they don't buy the Avengers anymore.

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>>87543271
No, leave me to me.

>>87540508
I'll believe you for the Mundo art but please.

>>87548852
Lobdell has never done anything wrong besides not appeal to characterfags
all of his stories are either batshit insane silver age antics or just genuinely fun stories

>>87555421
Nah, his writing can be subpar at times.

But to be honest, if I had to reread their X-Men runs, I'd rather reread Lobdell's over Bendis'.

>>87541113
>Hush->Red Hood->Morrison->Snyder?
I thought Morrison wasn't a big seller on Batman?

Hush was definitely the start. I remember someone saying that the issue Jason Todd appeared in it sold so fast and even some hardcore marvel fans picked it up.

Red Hood arc was just a big seller and exceed expectations.

Snyder's first arc on Batman was extremely popular and many new fans picked it up because of the N52 reboot.

The Dark knight trilogy also helped in making Batman the number one seller.

>>87555421
I have read his run on F4 & Red Hood and I have honestly enjoyed his writing.

I'm also planning to read Generation X hopefully soon.

>>87555840
>I thought Morrison wasn't a big seller on Batman?

See >>87541337

Also, if you were wondering how well Morrison's run sold:

07/2006: Batman #655 -- 113,567 (+48.4%) [123,903]
08/2006: Batman #656 -- 95,982 (-15.5%) [ 99,024]
09/2006: Batman #657 -- 91,357 (- 4.8%) [ 96,127]
11/2006: Batman #658 -- 94,349 (+ 3.3%)
02/2007: Batman #663 -- 83,167 (+14.7%)
03/2007: Batman #664 -- 80,497 (- 3.2%) [82,107]
05/2007: Batman #665 -- 80,122 (- 0.5%)
07/2007: Batman #666 -- 83,781 (+ 4.6%)
08/2007: Batman #667 -- 78,578 (- 6.2%) [82,418]
08/2007: Batman #668 -- 76,962 (- 2.1%)
09/2007: Batman #669 -- 73,471 (- 4.5%)
10/2007: Batman #670 -- 76,890 (+ 4.7%) [86,049]
11/2007: Batman #671 -- 76,764 (- 0.2%)
12/2007: Batman #672 -- 71,189 (- 7.3%)
12/2007: Batman #672 -- 71,189 (- 7.3%)
01/2008: Batman #673 -- 69,234 (- 2.8%)
02/2008: Batman #674 -- 68,208 (- 1.5%)
04/2008: Batman #675 -- 71,138 (+ 4.3%)
05/2008: Batman #676 -- 105,039 (+47.9%) [122,877] (beginning of RIP)
05/2008: Batman #677 -- 96,116 (- 8.5%) [111,065]
07/2008: Batman #678 -- 103,213 (+ 7.4%)
08/2008: Batman #679 -- 103,588 (+ 0.4%)
10/2008: Batman #680 -- 103,941 (+ 0.3%)
11/2008: Batman #681 -- 103,151 (- 0.8%) [114,657]
12/2008: Batman #682 -- 93,469 (- 9.4%) (Last Rites; FC tie-in)
12/2008: Batman #683 -- 90,272 (- 3.4%) (Last Rites; FC tie-in)

There's drops but it's not as bad as you've been led to believe (sales on Batman in the late 90's, early 00's before Hush was like around the 50,000's).

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>>87540438
Is Big Bang Comics not a comics store that sells both Batman and Avengers? What is with the boner for one book selling more than another?

>>87541046
Why Marvel thought half of Deadpool's squad of hired lackeys deserved their own books, I will never know.

>>87555899
For comparison, here's Winick's run. Keep in mind he also had two advantages--He brought back Jason Todd, which was considered unthinkable at the time, and Infinite Crisis was running at the time which boosted interest in a lot of books because people wanted to find all the hints and connections:

11/2004: Batman #634 — 63,767
12/2004: Batman #635 — 60,901
01/2005: Batman #636 — 58,513
02/2005: Batman #637 — 58,060
03/2005: Batman #638 — 59,723 (this was where the Jason Todd reveal happened; IIRC retailers didn't know it at the time)
04/2005: Batman #639 — 62,333
05/2005: Batman #640 — 66,629
06/2005: Batman #641 — 67,208
07/2005: Batman #642 — 65,435
08/2005: Batman #643 — 66,396
08/2005: Batman #644 — 65,128
09/2005: Batman #645 — 65,984
10/2005: Batman #646 — 69,975
11/2005: Batman #647 — 69,718
12/2005: Batman #648 — 63,151
01/2005: Batman #649 — 62,379
02/2005: Batman #650 — 66,447

Winick did get boosts in his run, but strangely it didn't go into the 70,000s.

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>>87555999
Because they'd rather have three flopped books instead of giving it to one character that would actually sell well.

>>87541046
Why Marvel thought half of Deadpool's squad of hired lackeys deserved their own books, I will never know.

>>87555899
>>87556014

And for further comparison's sake, here's Brubaker's run on Batman from the early 2000's. I forgot that around this time Batman was consistently selling around the 40,000 levels, which is really weird to think about now. It was also still a time when X-Men titles were still selling 100,000+.

Batman #582: 45,734
Batman #583: 45,797
Batman #584: 44,898
Batman #585: 44,422
Batman #586: 46,424
Batman #591: 43,333
Batman #592: 43,944
Batman #593: 49,277
Batman #594: 49,196
Batman #595: 43,850
Batman #596: 46,090
Batman #597: 43,663
Batman #598: 43,524
Batman #599: 50,673 (I think this was the Bruce Wayne: Murderer crossover)
Batman #600: 57,113
Batman #601: 51,647
Batman #602: 48,220
Batman #603: 55,685
Batman #604: 48,734
Batman #605: 56,367
Batman #606: 47,202
Batman #607: 46,527

>>87555999
>>87556110
>1 away from getting double trips with the same post

So close and yet so far.

>>87556110

So they could point to Solo and say "See white characters can also fail. We're doing nothing wrong with thee minority pandering"

>>87555944
See >>87540913 and >>87541437
If retailers are having trouble selling one company's books then it's a worrisome problem. But if both have serious problems then there's major trouble. Aside from sales tweets they do plug a lot of Marvel books.

>>87556110
Because Fox has Deadpool.

>>87555421
Nice revisional history.

>>87555840
Hush/UtRH/COO are the arcs that brings in many new fans and made Batman a big seller.

I wonder if King will able to make an arc as memorable as they are.

>>87556252
Probably not but he'll crash the biggest amount of Batplanes xD

>>87555899
I think Morrison got a big boost from Nolan's movies..

>>87555840
Do you know how well did DITF do?

>>87556281
>I think Morrison got a big boost from Nolan's movies..

His boost later on came from the Batman RIP arc because it got rumored to have the death of Batman. If there was any boost due to the Nolan films I don't know if it would've affected much.

I remember someone on /co/ complaining about how Morrison's Batman wouldn't be reader friendly because the Dark Knight was out that year and then tried to argue that Fraction's Invincible Iron Man did a better job synergizing with the film.

Ironically though Iron Man was still getting outsold by Morrison's Batman and Loeb's Hulk (which killed off the main villain of the Hulk film right at the start).

>>87547600
Top Cow carried Image's torch in the late 1990's and early-to-mid 2000's after Rob Liefeld left and eventually lost his luster. Then Michael Turner set out on his own... affecting Top Cow's overall sales.

>>87556322
>His boost later on came from the Batman RIP arc because it got rumored to have the death of Batman. If there was any boost due to the Nolan films I don't know if it would've affected much.
I pretty sure that it did have some affect and helped in boosting the sells, anon.

Morrison problem is that his stories aren't new fans friendly and can be quite hard to follow.

>>87556368
Also forgot that Wildstorm joined DC effective 1999 so Top Cow titles (later joined by Devil's Due's licensed ones until their breakup and self-publishing) were Image's top-sellers for much of the early 2000's.

>>87556231
I got into reading comics with his X-Men tenure
plus his Superman wasn't bad at all and Bunker is the first not insufferable Teen Titan ever made

>>87556399
I never thought Lobdell as bad as fans made him out to be and most of the hate he gets is definitely because of "muh x character".

His books are fun and there is some serious smart writing in them sometimes. He also one of few writers who was able to create a new characters that does not make you groan.

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>>87556374
>I pretty sure that it did have some affect and helped in boosting the sells, anon.

The thing is that the only times film/tv greatly affected comic sales were Batman 1989, Spider-Man 2002, Walking Dead, and Watchmen. A lot of times comics don't really get much of a boost from films and usually when they do it's usually sales on the TPBs.

Do you remember this comic? It was a comic by Bendis and Bagley that launched a few months before the Avengers film was out. The cover is also evocative of the New 52 Justice League #1's cover, too. Not only that but it also had Thanos as the villain, obviously because the movie hinted at Thanos being the next villain.

Avengers with a budget of $220 million got a worldwide $1.52 billion. But the Avengers Assemble comic?

03/12 Avengers Assemble #1 - 100,883
04/12 Avengers Assemble #2 - 53,024 (-47.4%)
05/12 Avengers Assemble #3 - 43,886 (-17.2%)
06/12 Avengers Assemble #4 - 43,022 ( -2.0%)
07/12 Avengers Assemble #5 - 38,951 ( -9.5%)
08/12 Avengers Assemble #6 - 36,131 ( -7.2%)
09/12 Avengers Assemble #7 - 36,259 ( +0.4%)
10/12 Avengers Assemble #8 - 36,453 ( +0.5%)

Yeah, I'd say the movie really didn't help sales on this.

>>87540508
>fun
That's always the word that you fags resort to.

When a good comic written by a smart writer who's actually fucking talented sells better than typical garden variety capeshit trash, you whine that it's "not fun".

I had a lot more "fun" reading Batman than fucking Waidvengers.

>>87556498
How can a movie help the comic sales, when you have Bendis writing it?
It's a feat even, that the comic did not hurt the movies.
This guy is so toxic, reading one of his comics could give you cancer.
How can you those fucks in Marvel not see this?

>>87556498
It Helped Flash, Harley and Supergirl (the only reason why the rebirth issue sold 100k was because of the show).

And the Avengers become Marvel flagship thanks to the movie (and Marvel pushing them hard) and Black Panther also got a big boost thanks to CW.

And the GL movie almost killed the GL franchise.

Movies, Games, TV shows...etc do have some affect, but they are not always positive.

>>87556555
>and Black Panther also got a big boost thanks to CW.
Not because of variant shenanigans?

>>87556178
Now you're just being paranoid

>>87556555
>And the Avengers become Marvel flagship thanks to the movie

What the fuck are you even talking about, the Avengers became Marvel's flagship long before the movie. Or did you forget that Bendis' New Avengers sold high in the 00's despite being really shitty?

>>87556508
>capeshit trash
All Cape books are trash and the only reason why I read some of them because they are fun.

>>87556579
X Men were Marvel's flagship before they killed the franchise because muh movie rights.

>>87556606
Marvel doesn't deserve X-Men anymore.
I wish they would sell the comic rights too to another company.

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>>87556555
Harley was a top seller long before the Suicide Squad movie came out

Supergirl didn't have a comic for quite some time so it's hard to say if it really got a boost because of the show or because of the Rebirth banner, but if I'm to look at the other titles that didn't have a movie and just relaunched and the fact that they're doing better, well...

Black Panther sold because of variants and aggressive marketing. It's been bleeding sales for some time now.

New52 happened after the GL movie and when New52 launched, the Lantern line had 4 ongoings.

>>87556566
Wasn't Black Panther one of the few marvel books that did not fall hard after the first issue?

>>87556626
>Harley was a top seller long before the Suicide Squad movie came out
He wasn't only talking about the movies, anon.

And SS was the reason why Harley Rebirth sold 400k.

>>87547600

Looks sexy, what's it about?

>>87556606
>X Men were Marvel's flagship before they killed the franchise because muh movie rights.

X-Men were already being diminished after Bendis started working on Avengers. Go look at >>87541090

New Avengers was already outselling Uncanny X-Men and X-Men in 2007. And X-Men's sales were often diminishing, maybe once in a while during the late 00's they got 100,000 in sales but it didn't last long like in the 90's.

>>87555667
>his writing can be subpar at times.

And the understatement of the year goes too...

But in all seriousness there have been a bunch of Lobdell stories I've enjoyed; even if I hate Red Hood as a character.

>>87556649
>X-Men were already being diminished after Bendis started working on Avengers. Go look at
You do know they were planning to do the MCU before the Avengers movie come out, right?

>>87556643
>He wasn't only talking about the movies, anon.
Her pre new 52 ongoing did not sell nearly as well.

>>87556628
Are you kidding???
1 Black Panther 1 $4.99 Marvel 253,259
9 Black Panther 2 $3.99 Marvel 77,654
27 Black Panther 3 $3.99 Marvel 75,037
36 Black Panther 4 $3.99 Marvel 72,302
22 Black Panther 5 $3.99 Marvel 83,756
34 Black Panther 6 $3.99 Marvel 58,746
It didn't just fall hard, it fell off a fucking mountain.
Still did good but only comparison to other Marvel titles. But that was quite a drop.

>>87556643
>And SS was the reason why Harley Rebirth sold 400k.
>implying relaunched titles don't always get a big boost
>implying Rebirth banner isn't a big boost
>implying a title that regularly sells 80-100k won't get a massive boost when relaunched

Top lel, anon.

it must suck being a Batman writer people will just claim that no matter what your work will sell and you have no merits in it

>>87556696
The fat paycheck makes up for it.

>>87556672
>You do know they were planning to do the MCU before the Avengers movie come out, right?

You do know that >>87556555 was claiming that the Avengers became a flagship thanks to the Avengers movie, right?

>>87556688
....

No one denying that Rebirth event helped in raising most of their books sells, but the movie was the reason why Harley did 400k instead of just 100k.

>>87541947
Its actually much easier to get to now getting off the Luas

>>87556725
>>87556688
I'd say that the movie did factor into that particular case (DC purposely timed the launch of Harley and Suicide Squad Rebirth issues to be out the same month as the Suicide Squad film). But returnability (and Rebirth's success) are major factor. I think that if it didn't have returnability they might've done maybe 100,000-200,000.

>>87556725
>but the movie was the reason why Harley did 400k instead of just 100k.
Really? So a title like Nightwing that struggled to keep 40k manages to get 110 k just because of Rebirth hype but Harley Quinn that could hold two titles over 50k at the same time and regularly made the top 10 would only sell 100k with the relaunch. Okay, bud.

>>87556719
It did not officially become the flagship until the movie come out.

And he's right. Movies, shows and games do have affect on sells.

>>87556686
Jesus, people kept buying BP after the first few issues? That book was terrible and disjointed.

>>87556762
>Really? So a title like Nightwing that struggled to keep 40k manages to get 110 k just because of Rebirth hype but Harley Quinn that could hold two titles over 50k at the same time and regularly made the top 10 would only sell 100k with the relaunch. Okay, bud
Do even know how to read?

>No one denying that Rebirth event helped in raising most of their books sells

Harely become insanely popular because of the Arkham game. Media have an affect whether you like it or not, but no one saying there are the only reason why comics sells.

>>87541046
Fucking amazing. I wouldn't even say this guy is pro DC. He's just shitting on Marvel's betrayal and subsequent fall from grace.

God Bless Cyclops. Rip in peace.

>>87556806
>Do even know how to read?
You said Harley relaunch would bring in 100k which is not only objectively wrong, but also fucking retarded. When shit like Aquaman can barely keep one title at 40 and Harley outsells him twice every month and his relaunch can get, I think 90k(?) then how can you seriously come and say retarded shit like that? rebirth was financially a huge success, a lot of their titles went over 100k. Best case scenario, if the movie really did factor into sales then it made Harley go from 250k relaunch to 400k, and that's the best case scenario. To imply this juggalo trash would've relaunched at only 100k if it weren't for the SS movie is...probably the dumbest thing anyone's going to post on 4chan today.

>>87556764
>It did not officially become the flagship until the movie come out.

Bullshit, here's sales for Avengers and X-Men relaunches in 2010:

AVENGERS
05/10 #1 - 170,682
06/10 #2 - 98,788 (-42.1%)
07/10 #3 - 87,410 (-11.5%)
08/10 #4 - 87,333 ( -0.1%)
09/10 #5 - 82,411 ( -5.6%)
10/10 #6 - 73,258 (-11.1%)
11/10 #7 - 89,758 (+22.5%)

17. X-MEN
07/10 #1 - 143,167
08/10 #2 - 71,464 (-50.1%)
09/10 #3 - 66,549 ( -6.9%)
10/10 #4 - 63,772 ( -4.2%)
11/10 #5 - 56,651 (-11.2%)

>>87556764
>>87556881
Also

>And he's right. Movies, shows and games do have affect on sells.

Again, only in some cases, though. Like for instance it didn't do anything for Avengers Assemble: >>87556498 and Superman's books didn't increase due to Man of Steel, which was out in 2013.

http://www.cbr.com/digging-through-the-2013-bookscan-numbers/

>Finally, among DC’s top 20 is “Superman Red Son” at #17. This is the highest placing “Superman” title… in the year of a relaunched Superman movie in the theaters. It doesn’t even sell 10k copies through BookScan reporters. I’m not sure this is a surprise, as the tone of the “Man of Steel” film wasn’t remotely like any existing “Superman” comic book.

>>87556897
And this was the sales for the monthlies during 2013:

01/2013: Action Comics #16 -- 58,645 (- 4.3%)
02/2013: Action Comics #17 -- 57,189 (- 2.5%)
03/2013: Action Comics #18 -- 61,879 (+ 8.2%)
04/2013: Action Comics #19 -- 52,007 (- 16.0%)
05/2013: Action Comics #20 -- 48,324 (- 7.1%)
06/2013: Action Comics #21 -- 46,475 (- 3.8%)
07/2013: Action Comics #22 -- 44,861 (- 3.5%)
08/2013: Action Comics #23 -- 42,603 (- 5.0%)
09/2013: #23.1: Cyborg Smn -- 69,796 (+ 63.8%)
09/2013: #23.2: Zod -- 69,356 (- 0.6%)
09/2013: #23.3: Lex Luthor -- 67,621 (- 2.5%)
09/2013: #23.4: Metallo -- 51,807 (- 23.4%)
10/2013: Action Comics #24 -- 39,620 (- 23.5%)
11/2013: Action Comics #25 -- 46,550 (+ 17.5%)
12/2013: Action Comics #26 -- 37,489 (- 19.5%)

01/2013: Superman #16 -- 50,621 (- 1.2%)
03/2013: Superman #17 -- 49,666 (- 1.9%)
03/2013: Superman #18 -- 48,236 (- 2.9%)
04/2013: Superman #19 -- 48,598 (+ 0.8%)
05/2013: Superman #20 -- 45,458 (- 6.5%)
06/2013: Superman #21 -- 44,285 (- 2.6%)
07/2013: Superman #22 -- 42,961 (- 3.0%)
08/2013: Superman #23 -- 42,155 (- 1.9%)
09/2013: #23.1: Bzarro -- 59,589 (+ 41.4%)
09/2013: #23.2: Brniac -- 58,197 (- 2.3%)
09/2013: #23.3: H'el -- 55,069 (- 5.4%)
09/2013: #23.4: Prsite -- 59,811 (+ 8.6%)
10/2013: Superman #24 -- 39,580 (- 33.8%)
11/2013: Superman #25 -- 39,295 (- 0.1%)
12/2013: Superman #26 -- 36,877 (- 6.2%)

Remember, this is the sales on the two main Superman comics the year Man of Steel was out.

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>>87556881
Did both of Bendis' Avengers titles sell really well?

It can probably be chalked up to Spider-man and Wolverine being in both books, but it always impressed me how well those books sold considering Bendis could barely get through an arc per year before he had to start devoting issues to a Big Event that Changes Everything.

>>87556847
I literally just stop there for a minute wondering if your post actually worth replying to you or not and I decided to humor you.

Movies, shows, games have affected on comics and some characters become insanely popular because of them.

Harely is the worst example to prove that they are not because Harley got a solo book because of her popularity in the Arkham game. She sold around 40k before rebirth and suddenly sold 400k in August and did better than Batman. Suicide Squad movie was the reason why she did much better than usual in that particular month because of the movie hype and she falls to 80k in the following month.

Movies, shows and games AREN'T the only reason why some comics sells big and the Rebirth relaunch played bigger factor in the raising sells of most of their books. I'm not denying that.

>>87556927
Yeah, I still have no idea how they sold as well as they did. I mean for the early issues you could try to claim it was variants, but New Avengers was still a high seller up until the 10's. I think by the early 10's more people were getting disenchanted with it, though.

I would've thought Wolverine would be a factor but after Old Man Logan, his title didn't sell that well (it ended up in like the 30,000-40,000 range in 2011)

>>87557035
>after Old Man Logan, his title didn't sell that well
A case of "Not Muh Wolverine", perhaps?

>>87557040
Not the current Old Man Logan, I'm talking about the the original Millar story. THAT actually sold pretty well. But I think the problem was that it got delayed so there was a second Wolverine title by Jason Aaron I think called Wolverine Weapon X or something like that. And then after Millar left I think they did a few more issues of the regular title and then relaunched it in 2010 (with Aaron as writer).

This was the sales on Jason Aaron's Wolverine:

09/10 #1 - 104,414 (+254.9%)
10/10 #2 - 63,210 ( -39.5%)
11/10 #3 - 51,600 ( -18.4%)
12/10 #4 - 52,812 ( +2.3%)
01/11 #5 - 46,920 (-11.2%)
02/11 #.1 - 44,332 ( -5.5%)
02/11 #6 - 45,932 ( +3.6%)
03/11 #7 - 47,337 ( +3.1%)
04/11 #8 - 47,010 ( -0.7%)
05/11 #9 - 44,635 ( -5.1%)
06/11 #10 - 42,677 ( -4.4%)
06/11 #11 - 41,813 ( -2.0%)
07/11 #12 - 42,110 ( +0.7%)
08/11 #13 - 39,296 ( -0.7%)
08/11 #14 - 38,869 ( -0.1%)
09/11 #15 - 37,951 ( -2.4%)
09/11 #16 - 37,796 ( -0.4%)
10/11 #17 - 39,405 ( +4.3%)
11/11 #18 - 40,170 ( +1.9%)
11/11 #19 - 37,997 ( -5.4%)
12/11 #20 - 37,360 ( -1.7%)
01/12 #300 - 58,681 (+57.1%)
02/12 #301 - 38,891 (-33.7%)
03/12 #302 - 37,213 ( -4.3%)
03/12 #303 - 36,368 ( -2.3%)
04/12 #304 - 37,836 ( +4.0%)

If you told me 20 years ago that Wolverine would be selling around 30,000 I would've called you a goddamn liar.

>>87557040
It's exactly why I at least am not buying.
That and Unworthy Thor, fuck them both.

>>87555455
This was more fun than Champions #1, I'll give it that much.

>>87557087
That's not because Wolverine doesn't sell, that's because he's written by idiots.

>>87557103
Easy, Champions is not fun at all.

>>87557087
Jason Aaron is a fucking terrible X-men writer.

>>87557143
What, not fan of irrelevant and FUN stories with characters who have five fans in total?

>>87557106
Yeah but usually conventional wisdom is that Wolverine or Spider-Man or Batman are popular enough to explain high sales.

But as this thread's been showing this hasn't always been the case. Batman used to sell below 50,000 and Wolverine sold below 40,000 at one point.

>>87557192
The shitshow that was Schism was an accurate vision of the quality of Aaron's WatXM run.

>>87557230
I bet Schism happens so he could have Wolverine and school book.

>>87557087
>Not the current Old Man Logan, I'm talking about the the original Millar story. THAT actually sold pretty well.

Also in case anyone was wondering, this was the sales for Millar's Old Man Logan:

06/08 Wolverine #66 - 112,469
07/08 Wolverine #67 - 96,651
08/08 Wolverine #68 - 97,325
11/08 Wolverine #69 - 93,914
12/08 Wolverine #70 - 98,915
03/09 Wolverine #71 - 91,229
05/09 Wolverine #72 - 91,333
09/09 Giant-Size Old Man Logan - 93,823

Also another interesting thing to keep in mind is that Millar was also doing other stuff at the time--Ultimate Comics Avengers, Fantastic Four, 1985.

This was the sales of the Millar/Hitch FF:

02/08 Fantastic Four #554 - 98,111
03/08 Fantastic Four #555 - 67,416 (-31.3%)
04/08 Fantastic Four #556 - 65,013 ( -3.6%)
05/08 Fantastic Four #557 - 62,736 ( -3.5%)
06/08 Fantastic Four #558 - 61,003 ( -2.8%)
08/08 Fantastic Four #559 - 59,791 ( -2.0%)
09/08 Fantastic Four #560 - 58,258 ( -2.6%)
11/08 Fantastic Four #561 - 61,331 ( +5.3%)
12/08 Fantastic Four #562 - 54,062 (-11.9%)
01/09 Fantastic Four #563 - 52,747 ( -2.4%)
02/09 Fantastic Four #564 - 49,520 ( -6.1%)
03/09 Fantastic Four #565 - 48,378 ( -2.3%)
05/09 Fantastic Four #566 - 46,653 ( -3.6%)
06/09 Fantastic Four #567 - 46,225 ( -0.9%)
07/09 Fantastic Four #568 - 45,828 ( -0.9%)
07/09 Fantastic Four #569 - 44,710 ( -2.4%)

>>87557294
I miss when books used to have big numbers like this.

>>87557087
>And then after Millar left I think they did a few more issues of the regular title and then relaunched it in 2010 (with Aaron as writer).


Oh wait, I forgot, I think they changed Wolverine to Dark Wolverine (staring Daken) after Millar concluded Old Man Logan. And then after Siege they relaunched Wolverine.

>>87557310
I think for all a lot of people defend renumbering by saying it's just a number, I think there's been some sort of devaluing that happens everytime they keep relaunching and then changing the numbers on a regular basis. I think we're seeing that effect happen with the All-New All-Different relaunch.

>>87557328
Yep, this. I totally agree. All those constant relaunches for short term gains has definitely hurt Marvel in the long run.

I'm glad at least DC let Action and Detective Comics get back to their original numbering though.

>>87556483
Calm down there Dark Tizitmine. He's still not going to tell you he loves you.