Tell why Spider-man 3 is bad without resorting to MUH DANCING

Too many villains, more Mary Jane will-they-won't-they drama, muh goblin

>>86741339
I actually liked Venom, with what little of him there was, I don't see why Rami didn't cut out the Sandman shit.

>>86741339
i can't explain it but i know it's bad in my gut. sort of an objective thing anon

>>86741531
Because it was the movie he WANTED to make

>>86741339
Its unfocused, has poor pacing and forced drama, and little payoff for all of it in the end.

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>>86741339
I KNOW THAT FACE!

>>86741577
And honestly, muh dancing was the best scene in the movie.

Resolving the MJ romance thing, having three villains all with their own story arcs, and closing the Osborn/Goblin plot is way too much to take care of in one two hour movie. Couple that with very little real payoff and poor pacing and you have a recipe for a disappointing end to an otherwise decent trilogy.

This may fall under NOT MUH, but Venom should have been the sole villain of a movie after 3, not a shoehorned into the last act and taken care of in five minutes.

>>86741339
The pacing is a wreck and the tone is all over the place.
There's some really strong moments (Sandman origin, subway fight, birth of Venom sequence, moments of Spider-Man acknowledging that he's been a hero for a while now, etc.), but overall it's just pretty mediocre (which makes it look terrible considering it's next to Spider-Man 2).

>>86741339
Pretty bloated and would benefit from an extra 30 minutes. I think they could have pulled off two villains (one of which needs to be venom) but the sudden turnaround with Harry at the end was a bit head scratching (I get why he did it, I just thought it was hamfisted). Also Gwen contributed nothing of importance and that is truly a waste of Bryce Dallas Howard.

>>86741531
Rami blatantly wanted to make a film centred around Sandman going between good and evil, it's the best fucking part of the film. If I were to guess, I'd say he wanted to have the film centre around Sandman, with Spidey v Goblin as a backdrop, then the studio forced him to include Venom in the mix.

>>86741339

>tell me why something is bad without using the reasons why it was bad

You stumped me op, good job.

>>86741339
The tone was all over the place, even for a Raimi movie.

Venom was clearly an afterthought, as was Gwen.

Sandman killed Uncle Ben, more or less negating the whole power and responsibility thing.

Climax was Mary Jane being kidnapped again.

Butler conveniently explaining to Harry about his dad being a fucking nutbar and making Harry forgive Pete.

Sandman just fucked off and the other villains died.

The romance was weak despite 2 damn movies of build up.

Sandman's motivation being muh daughter but we see her once.

The fights were less memorable compared to Doc Ock's elaborate brawls or Green Goblin's brutal ass beating.

>>86741694

It would have been nice if they let Raimi close this trilogy like he wanted them let Venom/Symbiote shit be the focus of a second trilogy. But hindsight etc etc.

>>86741339
>muh dancing.
Do you mean the actual dancing scene with Peter and Gwen, or Peter walking down the street? 'Cause I thought both were pretty good.

>>86741339
I personally liked this movie a lot

But then again I was maybe 12 when I last saw it

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>>86744356
Nailed it.

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This would have been much better.

>>86741339
The studio forced him to make an overstuffed movie. He had to make a cohesive movie that.

>Handled Harry vs Peter

>Symbiote Storyline with Black Spiderman

>Sandman's story.

>Intro to Gwen and Eddie Brock.

>Venom

>Peter and MJ love issues.

Now im not saying it cannot be done, but if you know Rami he's not one for having hanging plot threads, so instead he solves that with trying to connect LITERALLY EVERYTHING on nothing but sheer coincidence and retconning.

Basically we go from a relatively simple movie in Spiderman 1 and 2, to this super complex for all the wrong reasons movie that the studio fucked with.

The movie is still MILES AHEAD of ASM1 and ASM2, and far more memorable, but its at best a 6/10, which makes it look like shit coming off of arguably the best spiderman/superhero movie ever made in Spider-Man 2.

>>86744899
seriously, how can people hate watching Pete acting like some alpha cool guy and coming off like an creepy asshole? That was the high point of the whole movie for me.

>>86741339
Too much drama, overcrowded cast, going back to Spidey 1 for "not finished storyline" yet

muh-dancing was actually somewhat entertaining, but they dropped the ball hard on Venom.

>>86741339
Sandman was a boring villain

tragic conflicted villain for the 3rd time in a row is stale

Because it was a Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies, and all of them suck....this movie just sucked worse


>Harry tries to kill peter the whole movie
>We're supposed to believe Harry is hurt by Peter...hurting him

Stupid

>>86741339
I'll tell you when you FIX THIS DAMN DOOR!

>>86741339
It's pretty poorly paced with too much crap shoved in.

With that said it's not as bad as people say it is, it was just such a huge disappointment after how great Spider-Man 2 was.

Rewatching it in the last few years there's some good stuff buried in there, but it's a 6/10 compared to Spider-man 2's 9/10, and that's being kind of generous.

>>86747647
Shiit, raimi's vulture could have been GOAT, even played by john malkovitch no less

>>86741339
Because it was 6 hours long and was completely incoherent both tonally and from a characterization perspective

>>86749220
Call it NOT MUH or whatever, but I'm very against the idea of Sandman being Uncle Ben's killer. It just cheapens the impact of one of the most emotionally powerful scenes in the first movie.

>>86741438
Spider-Man 2 was nice when they resolved that at the end, and then 3 just kind of caused a rift between them because I guess they felt their wasn't enough drama. I dunno.

>>86741339

People say too many villains, but I'm pretty sure there would've been enough time to develop them if you cut muh dancing and melodrama.

Muh Daughter

>>86749166

Fuck off moviebob

>>86751049
The melodrama is the real villain

>>86741339
Spider-man
1>3>2

>>86741339
Turned MJ into a turbo cunt.

>>86751444
>Turned
Raimi's MJ is fucking unlikable in every movie.

Wasn't there a deleted scene where the butler conversation was apparantly in Harry's head only, symbolising that he always knew what actually happened but didn't want to believe his dad was a psychopathic villain?

That probably would have salvaged the scene somewhat.

Only memorable scene was the Sandman, literally, getting his shit together through sheer force of will
Memorable as in "good"

Rewatched is recently. I can see why they had Sandman take that role, having Peter forgive Bens killer is a mark of his growth through the three movies, it works as part of a movie trilogy arc. Venom was largely uneeded, but the dancing scene so derided is actually really funny when you don't let it trigger you and just take it as it is. You can tell what a blast Toby had filming it