Retailer gripes about Marvel

>>86740233
That dude is a dcfag to be fair all you need to do is just try listening to his awful podcast

>>86740304
He is, but he's in business to make money, he's going to sell Marvel comics as best he can

>>86740233
Don't just post twitter screencaps to make a thread.

>>86740304
being a dcfriend has nothing to do with Marvel solicits outright lying

>>86740233
Are people really planning on buy Iron Heart or whatever it's called?

>>86740364
I'm just he won't miss a chance to shit on Marvel

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>>86740233
>But the Marvel Universe will NEVER BE THE SAME AGAIN
It's like a parody at this point. Marvel is a complete parody of themselves.

>>86740422
I don't like JAV so no.

>>86740405
Solicits lie all the fucking time. This isn't new

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>>86740422
She's called Iron Heart, but the book will still be called Iron Man. Go figure.

>>86740449
Whilst this is true, it doesn't really excuse the practice.

>>86740402
This is relevant you retard.

>>86740474
Then link it or quote it you retard.

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>>86740402

>>86740566
see >>86740588

>>86740304
>This retailer who is trying to sell Marvel comics is clearly a DCfag because he's upset that what he bought isn't what was in the issue so he'll lose a lot of money not being able to sell it.
Marvelfags everyone.

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>>86740588
Sure I am.

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>>86740856

>>86740866
>>86740856
mate marvel is fucking dead

>>86740856
Big Bang has also stated that while Ms. Marvel continues to do well with its demos, sales have dipped as fans want nothing to do with CWII

All these press releases about variant cover incentive must be adding to the frustration

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>>86740856
>>86740866
Speaking seriously, if Champions flops at the retailer level then retailers are going to slash any and all orders of Marvel NOW(er)! and it'll basically be DCYou 2.0. It'll probably be much worse because of all the variant and sales gimmickry that Marvel is employing in order to get Champions 1 sales up to insane levels. There'll be a lot of heavily burned retailers out there looking at it and looking at how Rebirth is doing along with the returnability factor.

>>86740679
It's funny because if you read that guys tweets he actually was okay with Civil War II's story back around May or so. He just reports back the sales aren't good.

>>86740979
There's an increasing number of retailers talking specifically about how Marvel practices are squeezing them instead of working with them.

>>86740856
>>86740866
This is worse than the New 52.
They actually did it.

>>86740856
>>86740866
This is what Waid deserves.

>>86740979
Where were you when Marvel killed Kamala?

>>86741003
It's entirely possible that most of the fans for it have moved to Ditigial, or buy in trades primarily.

That's what I do, and I'm at least interested in the title.

But appealing to trades and digitial ghost sales isn't that strong an argument.

>>86740364
Well hopefully not for long.

Serious question, is Marvel trying to crash the industry for some reason? Like wtf is actually going on?

>>86741115
I pity young Kamala fans
They are naive of the bullshit

>>86740866
From that guy's site:

http://pittsburghcomics.com/2016/06/20/is-marvel-even-trying-to-be-my-friend-anymore/

>Now I know I often talk about Marvel Comics in less than glowing terms. As always, it is not because of the books. I love the books they put out. I love the characters. I love the writers and artists. I want to sell lots and lots of Marvel Comics.

>I just don’t like how they do things. Such as shipping Deadpool 3 consecutive weeks. Or having 2 $10 Deadpool issues in one year. Or having Amazing Spider-Man #1 and then Amazing Spider-Man #1.1 the next week, but it doesn’t actually have anything to do with #1 even though is has the same item code implying I should order it the same as #1 because it is part of the same series. Or overwhelming the formerly successful Guardians of the Galaxy book by giving every character their own series as well. They are doing the same thing with the under the radar Squadron Supreme book by coming out with Hyperion and Nighthawk solo series before Squadron Supreme hits it first trade paperback.

>That’s the stuff that drives me nuts. Having to order Civil War #1 well before the #0 issue because it had a “Power Metallic” cover that has a much longer production time. Did you even notice the “Power Metallic” cover. I didn’t think so.

>Back in May, Marvel announced a Civil War II Ulysses special giving you all the info on the new Inhuman around whom the entire event revolves. The event also began in May. But this was only available as a digital comic. We will be getting a print version waaaay after the fact at the end of August, sometime after issue 5 (of 7). Well isn’t that special.

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>>86741003
>Doom Patrol is outselling X-books

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>>86741024
>>86741003
there's a lot of simmering discontent about the variants.

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>>86741003
>>86740866
>>86740856
>>86740233
Most of the books I'm reading right now are Marvel, I got into comics because of Marvel and they've always been my main company, but hearing all this news of them loosing sales left and right brings me EXTREME pleasure.

>>86741176
>Pittsburgh
>Jim Shooter's hometown
OH SHI--

>>86741136
Hubris

>>86741188
What do the %'s mean? Like, 300 percent more than your last order or something?

>>86740233

>THE MARVEL UNIVERSE WILL NEVER BE THE SAME AGAIN

Holy shit they still say crap like this?

>>86740233

it's almost like the entire business of LCS's is a fucked up barely sustainable enterprise

>>86741275
yes. like if you ordered 30 copies of extraordinary x-men then you'd need to order 90 copies of whatever book they're shilling and then they let you order variants on top of that

>>86741275

correct

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So who's going to take Marvel's spot in the big two of comics now?

>>86741031

New 52 sold really well initially. This is more like DCYou

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It truly feels good to be a DCfag

>>86741348
Valiant or Dark Horse.

I hate that this industry guilts you so much for not buying singles.

>>86740233
>>>86740233 (OP)

>>THE MARVEL UNIVERSE WILL NEVER BE THE SAME AGAIN

This is a parody, right?

>>86741316
>>86741275
someone post that arcane diagram of what you had to order for hip hop covers

>>86741376
It does, but I also feel bad when looking at Marvel.
>>86741031
Didn't New 52 do well for the first few years?

>136 variants in the new Previews, not including the 53 USAvengers state variants (Canada, DC & Puerto Rico are the extras).

https://twitter.com/PghComics/status/783066905330483201

>>86740866
>>86740856

I'm glad Marvel's Teen Titans is DOA

>>86741394

i learned long ago to not give a fuck and enjoy the what we get. buy how you can/want to. company wars are the dumbest thing

anything else is asking for trouble

>>86741449
I'll be shocked if the drop from #1 to #5 isn't like 80% at least

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>>86741197
Same.

>>86741430
Please tell me the states are not incentive and you can chose to buy them at regular price like what DC did for JLA

>>86741427

It did, didn't dip until DCYou

Mostly because despite questionable changes and butthurt fanboys not reading the fucking comics a lot of quality stories came out

Sure there was garbage here and there too but that was DC before the reboot as well

Also helped that DC advertised the New52 in commercials on tv. My LCS attracted so many new customers since then it's not even funny. He would always tell me how many new people started coming back every week and he was able to afford a completely new store about a year into it.

>>86741394
Fuck that noise. I ain't got time to pity people making a living outta funny books. There are things they could do to make the whole situation better, but that takes risk.

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>yfw Marvel isn't hyping NYCC because Now preorders are so bad that they are rushing the next status quo

>>86741400
>someone post that arcane diagram of what you had to order for hip hop covers

I wonder if they're doing that again for the next round of hip hop covers.

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>>86741400

>>86741469
The #1 numbers got massively inflated to 400k or something by Scholastic, so that's certain.

>>86741394
The creators who do it are worse than when it's just the company. I remember Peter David blaming readers for X-Factor

>>86741348
Young Animal or the revived Wildstorm.

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>>86741491
>many new people started coming back every week and he was able to afford a completely new store about a year into it.
PRAISE HIM

>>86741394
yeah it sucks that singles are still the determining factor, even though there are clearly a number of new readers who find digital and trades more appealing in comparison.

and you can't blame them, floppies are just disposable magazines

>>86741376

Yeah because Rebirth is great. I get no joy from Marvel crashing. I just want good comics all round

>>86741488
I'd be surprised if they are open order, that's not the Marvel way

>>86741469

It's going to be funny seeing the sales for Guardians 2 be lower than TT 2

>>86741197
Same here.

I'm buying Spidey/Deadpool, Deadpool, Carnage, Venom: Spaceknight, and Spider-man 2099. Probably will be picking up renew your vows, Venom, and Nova.

Some other great titles that I just can't afford right now are Ultimates, Vision, Uncanny Avengers, New Avengers, and Moon Knight

There's also some decent smaller books like Moon Knight, Ms Marvel, Gwenpool, and Hulk, but the majority of what marvel is putting out right now ranges from "meh" to garbage.

Marvel needs a good kick in the behind.

Get rid of Slott, put someone good on cosmic, and stop pushing the inhumans so much.

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>check my pull list for tomorrow
>a gorillion indies
>18 DC
>0 Marvel
I think there's a lesson for all of us.

>>86741546
>>86741491

Inb4 I get trashed for anecdotal evidence

I'm sure the New52 didn't have major profits for every goddamn LCS I'm just sharing a cool story about mine

New store is beautiful too, not too big, but it's clean, has anything you can think of, the employees are helpful, and people of every race and age buy shit in there. I've barely experienced any cringeworthy shit there too

>>86741505
Embarrassing.

>>86741600
>Marvel needs a good kick in the behind.
Not with suckers like you buying everything from them.

Unfortunately my LCS is run by the exact kind of millennial children that promote Champions as the greatest thing ever.

>The U.S.Avengers #1 already has 53 variant covers, one per state, aligning a Marvel hero with every state in the USA, plus Canada and US principalities.

>You might expect stores in specific states to go in heavy on their own variant.

>But if a store orders one copy of all 53 state variant covers, they can order one copy of a Top Secret variant, the artist to be revealed at a later date. It’s meant to be impressive.

>>86741600
>Probably will be picking up renew your vows,

You would have to be a cuck to buy this. That comic is Marvel laughing in your fucking face

I wonder how Marvel Comic employees feel right now?

>>86741600
Also forgot: Take Bendis off basically everything. Let him have Miles and Jessica if he stays far away from anything else. It will at least quarantine him.

>>86741566
>I get no joy from Marvel crashing.
I on the other hand get plenty of joy. It's the kind of satisfaction one feels to see a bully get his comeuppance.

>>86741564
>floppies are just disposable magazines
and they're marketed and priced like collectibles.

>>86741491

My comic book guy basically said that DC is selling really well now and "Civil War is ending soon"

He's a Marvel fag and loves Bendis, so that's saying a lot.

>>86740304
>>86740427
Not buying your excuse. Not when a lot of retailers have been reporting similar problems. Let's face it, between the retailers in the tweets, the retailers that reported to Rich Johnston on BC, and Brian Hibbs saying that his second store had high gains on DC but a 20% drop in Marvel purchases, you'd have to be willingly blind to deny that Marvel's having major issues.

>>86741639
What the fuck?

>>86741600

>Buying all that shit but not buying vision

Characterfags are the worst

>>86741671

>major issues

i guess it depends on your def of major.

>>86741678

>Vision BUT WITH A FAMILY

Oh God who gives a fuck

>>86741601
>TFAW doesn't even mention the creators of this week's Marvel books
What's happening here?

>>86741491

It started off super strong then trailed off. Then everyone thought DC was rebooting again so DCYou failed.

Rebirth is bringing back the old characters so it's succeeding.

>>86741707

Having to compete with DC through excessive variants and dirty underhand shit like outright lying with your solicitations is major

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>>86741600
>I'm buying Spidey
Spidey was a good surprise. It's a better version of that Byrne's Spider-Man: Chapter One

>>86741623
I'm going to buy the books of stories I genuinely enjoy and want to support.
I'm only currently buying 5 books. How is that everything?
>>86741640
I'm just desperate for a married Peter with MJ. And Conway and Stegman are both great.

>>86741720

I own a signed copy of Tom King's Vision, but that was total fucking character assasination. Great book but too weird for most people,and Vision fans would hate it.

>>86741720

>Spider-man BUT WITH A FAMILY!

Oh God who gives a fuck?

>>86741625
I hope your LCS goes out of business. Find a better one, anon.

>>86741745
>Spidey
Wasn't this by the writer who salvaged Silk from Slott's Korean fetish fantasy?

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>>86741745
>that art

>>86741740

The solicitation fuck ups i'll give up but is that beyond Bendis occasionally?

Variants are just the game, sorry.

>>86741768

>Batman but with parents

Oh god who gives a fuck

>>86741501
>>No Civil War II panel
Gee, whoda thunk?

>>86741197
It's always fun to hear that Kamala's sales have gone down.

>>86741751
>I'm just desperate for a married Peter with MJ.

Then pay for it when that's actually what Marvel gives you. Not some elseworld scrap. What you think if you buy it that Marvel will listen to you and give it back in the 616? Are you also an X-fag?

>>86741766
>total fucking character assassination
That sure would bother me if I cared about a shard universe and not just reading the individual comics that have good writers/artists

>>86741751
>I'm just desperate for a married Peter with MJ
Read the dailies, you doofus.

>>86741751
Yeah, this being written by Conway gives it more legitimacy then Slott's slop in my mind.

>>86741766
Well the entire premise was that Vision had deleted his emotions, so of course his character is radically altered.

>>86741720
This. Look how many fucks I give about Vision with a family that kills themselves:

>>86740449
Dc has not had a solicit fuckup this bad in all of rebirth except for blue beetle: rebirth.
And i doubt that hurt sales much.

>>86741786
I have no idea, I saw some pages from that artist on twitter and went to pick up the issue.

>>86741740
>like outright lying with your solicitations is major

In some cases, both Marvel and DC (and even Image) missolicit stuff. Sometimes it's because the actual story is delayed and they need a fill-in, or creative teams changed, or something else.
The biggest problem I see here is that they said that Riri would be in the book and had hyped her up to make retailers order more. If it's true she doesn't appear in the book, then Marvel would have to make up for that in some way.

Not legally so, but that certainly feels like fraud if you suggest there will be a first costumed appearance and change it to a different book. Was the solicit updated at least before the order adjustment time passed?

>>86740449
That's the point, though. It's a problem because of the way Marvel handles it.

>Marvel fags itt hating the best comic Marvel has made in years

Guess you have all lost your minds to ass pain, huh?

>>86741851

>DC didn't fuck up except when they did and also that doesn't count because reasons

>>86741791
What would you prefer some bland house style? I'd rather see Humberto Ramos on a book than Ivan Reis

>>86741850
>companyfag

>>86741813

That's the biggest book he's been for more than a decade.

It's like not caring that Pym nearly beat his wife to death in Ultimate because "shard universe"

>>86741833

Yes, it's justified in story. A writer could clean it up pretty easily, or just ignore it. It's not like Vision blew up the sales charts though.

>>86741786
Yeah.

>>86741777
While I partially agree with you they have been good for buying variant covers I like for cheap. Like 1:50's for $10, or the 1:100 Miller variants for DKIII for $30 (which I flipped for 100)

They also provide a bag and board with every issue and 10% discount.

>>86740449
>Solicits lie all the fucking time
They mislead, this solicit straight up says a character is in the issue that is not present. A character Marvel has been marketing like crazy hoping to get new reads to buy the issue

>>86740233
At this point i genuinely belive marvel did this on purpose so they could get that first apperance money in 2 seperate issues.
Here in australia im pretty sure the courts would require marvel to allow returns on it im not sure how u.s consumer law is though.

>>86740449
This is true, but promoting an issue as a really hyped up character's debut and then it turns out she's not even in it ensures that a lot of retailers over-ordered the book for no reason

>DC Rebirth
>Titles feature established and popular charachters
>strong creative teams
>newer and OC characters being slowly introduced and built up in the same manner that legacy characters were introduced in the past

Shockingly, this dominates the sales charts. When is Marvel going to rip off Rebirth so I can go back to reading their comics?

Waid is and has been carrying the baton with Vision's plot along with King in Avengers fwiw. /co/ doesnt read that tho

>>86741872
I haven't seen anyone hating on Ultimates.

>>86741897
>1:100 Miller variants for DKIII for $30 (which I flipped for 100)

That's clever but kind of dickish anon.

>>86741678
Vision is great, but I just missed the first couple of issues. I might pick up the trade.
>>86741745
I'm not buying Spidey. I like Robbie Thompson, but I really don't like it. The retcons for no reason, and the artist is also just changing things about the characters for no reason. Flash has black hair, Gwen is in high school, and the Osborns look like completely different people. And the artist in your pic is terrible.
>>86741805
I like alternate universe stuff too though. But yes, we really do need Peter and MJ back together in 616.
And no, I'm not an X-fag. I think I might have killed myself by now if that was the case. They are getting totally shit on.
>>86741818
Is there a place online that has them? Canada doesn't get Spider-man newspaper strips.
>>86741825
Exactly. He's a classic Spider-man writer, and he's knocking it out of the park with Carnage.

>>86741923

Next year when they relaunch again

>>86741889
>It's like not caring that Pym nearly beat his wife to death in Ultimate
That's easy to not care about, it's The Ultimates

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>>86741876
>there are only two styles: house style or webcomic tier

>>86741876
>I'd rather see Humberto Ramos on a book than Ivan Reis
Oh god is it possible to contract cancer from an anonymous post?

>>86741397
nope http://marvel.com/comics/issue/55535/invincible_iron_man_2015_14

>>86741926
My biggest complaint is that I like New Avengers better.

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>>86741876

>>86741957
I hope so then people who like Reis or Geoff Johns could get it

>>86741936
>Is there a place online that has them?
http://comicskingdom.com/amazing-spider-man

>>86741876
>I'd rather see Humberto Ramos on a book than Ivan Reis
I like Marvel, but I hate your opinion.

>>86740233
Ouch, that's gotta hurt....

>>86741934
They made the money they want, I made the money I want and helps me support my comic purchases. How is that dickish?

>>86741942
>Next year when they relaunch again
>Implying Marvel won't just triple down on the diversity pandering and garbage writing

>>86741925
>/co/ doesnt read that tho
Yeah I don't read Waid's Avengers. I only read good books.

>>86740233
>Here's us taking an explosive diarrhea on your favorite character. Yes, get angry and buy that shit to find out what happens next.
>Wait where you going, HEY we changed your hero with a black lady are you racist or something?

>>86742065

>a new black lady takes on a heroes mantle
>you consider it explosive diarrhea

yeah maybe you have a little bit of a race and/or women problem?

>>86742092
>YOU RACIST PIG REEEEEE

>>86741942
I mean, hopefully, but this scares me. Every relaunch, I drop more and more of their books. Right now I'm down to two fucking Marvel comics. And as a Marvel fanboy, this fucking hurts. Ultimates and Vision are both great and I pirate Totally Awesome Hulk as the death of Banner made this book get really good, but thats literally it for me right now. Meanwhile, I'm reading and buying almost half of the Rebirth titles. This is fucking retarded.

I legitimately miss Marvel comics

Marvels getting bodied bitch

>>86742092

>losing the argument?
>call them a racist!

>>86741994
Neat.
Come to think of it does supes still have a strip

>>86741639
Wasn't the "secret variant" for Venom a recolored McFarlane drawing?

>>86742120

Ultimates is a fun superhero book but I feel like it could be way more.

Also, I liked the real Ultimate universe.

>>86741430
>including Canada
The FUCK? The actual FUCK?

>>86742185
I think so, and the RYV one was a JRSR picture

>>86742185
Yeah, that was for the 1:1000 variant.

>>86742211

>not buying good books regardless of their origin

>>86742184
Strangely enough, no. I think the last time he was in a comic strip was maybe the 80's. Batman used to have a comic strip too but he hasn't had one since like the early 90's.

>>86742238
>buy 1000 copies to get a recolored 90's drawing
What the fuck?

>>86741745
That building must be very cheap if Spidey can pass through and not receibe mayor trama. Who draw that shit?

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>>86740930
Marvel has been dead for years. Dîsney is just puppeteering the corpse.

Only difference is people are finally starting to notice the stink.

>>86742193
Man, I wish I could find something from the past few years that made me miss the Ultimate universe, but it's been dead in the water for years. Secret Wars was a mercy kiling

As far as the current Ultimates, I think it's one of the best, if not THE best team book out right now. Civil War is dragging it down a bit but once that wraps up, it'll go back to being fantastic

CANADA IS NOT A STATE, MARVEL! YOU FUCKERS!

>>86741936
Conway has made a Carnage series one of the top books at Marvel right now. What about anything in that sentence is something anyone expected?

>>86742202

Literally just an excuse to put Wolverine on something

>>86742262
They're doing the same thing with Renew Your Vows, that 1:1000 variant is basically a recolor of the cover of that ASM Annual with Spider-Man and Mary Jane's wedding.

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>>86742355
>

>>86741639
Didn't DC do something like this for that JLA New 52 comic?

>>86740466
i unironically like that costume design, iron man mixed with kamen rider

>>86742472
yeah although they didn't do a special 1:53 variant on top of that

>>86742372
You know what? The current Carnage run is mid-tier at best. It's trying something new and not doing an awful job at it. But it's not really that great. And thats what makes you being right so damn bad. A mid tier book about Demon Carnage is one of Marvel's best right now. Fucking terrible

>>86740979
Fucking Marvel, they should know people like Kamala because her stories were SUPPOSED to be simple and underdoggy, and now because she got popular they make her appear everywhere, dilluting what makes the character appealing.
A friend of mine even dropped the book when Secret Wars happened. I haven't because I'm a waifufag since day 0.

>>86742512
What made carnage mid-tier for you ? the art ?
or is it because is slow ?

>>86741136
With Rebirth stealing all of their buzz, Civil War II flopping with fans and retailers, and the outlook for Marvel Now Again being pretty damn bleak, they're in panic mode. The problem is most of their talent's gone and the asshats in charge think they can save their ass by doubling down on practices that harm retailers, as well as the very things that have been driving readers away in the first place.

>>86742372
>Conway has made a series of books at Marvel
The writing was on the wall, Anon.

http://boooo.ytmnd.com/

>>86742635
It's not shocking that Conway would write a top book. Moreso that Conway would be writing a Carnage solo. Or that a Carnage solo would be a top book. Then again Axis Carnage was one of the most entertaining parts of Axis.

>Replacing beloved older heroes isn't selling.
>10 billion terrible variants isn't selling.
>Half a dozen boring super-events a year isn't selling.

How about trying to make more good comics, Marvel? Maybe that'll work. Then again, I'm not a comic publisher, so what do I know?

>>86742355
Not yet leaf
Not yet

>>86742717
When your top writer is fucking Bendis, a guy who doesn't understand story structure, you're fucked.

>>86742573
the slow pace and the art both hurt it, but I also honestly don't care for the writing. Most of the characters read the exact same. The plot and the fact that it's the first Carnage book that hasn't been dog shit in a while are what keep me checking it out. That, and I like reading about Eddie

>>86741566
I love Marvel, but they need to crash. The last few years have been full of bad choices.
Too many events, too many reboots, too many legacy characters replaced for diversity and controversy, too many Bendis books. Overall shit writing trying to appeal to "The modern MCU loving youth on tumblr! Memes!"

These variants are the tip toppiest of the iceburg. They need to crash so they have a reason to look at what theyre doing wrong. A company with no competition gets lazy and cheap, and thats exactly what happened to Marvel.

This is the best medicine for it to become readable again.

>>86742883
Marvel has the same problem Steven Universe has. There's a story there that people want to read, but there's so much bullshit that's just to entertain people who just like memes instead.

>>86742092
>Didn't mind it when it happened to CA
>Didnt mind it when it happened to Spiderman
>Was tolerant when it happened to Hulk.
>Thor was some bullshit
>Hawkeye was beyond bullshit
>By Wolverine I was so apathetic I stopped buying the comics

I'm not the one with the problem mate. All my favourites were replaced for diversity and controversy. Fucking all of them.

>>86742968
Except Marvel doesn't pull off enjoyable slice of life meme shit at all either. They're terrible at both storytelling, and meme filler shit right now.

>>86740233
>Promise IronLoli
>Don't deliever and don't tell anyone.
>Profit
Oh wow....hahahahahah, Bravo Marvel.

>>86743027
>By Wolverine
this one was actually pretty ok, standard sidekick replacing the mentor shit, X-23 has been around for a while. I can see where you're coming from though and the current climate makes it obvious what Marvels real intentions probably were.

>>86742968
I dont even want to read this shit story they have, its the characters I'm attached too. Getting better writers should be number 1 on their list of improvements

>>86743085
If Wolverine was the only one I could deal with it. But no matter how "alright it is" its too many of my favourites gone for a fad.

I even forgot to mention Iron Man. Who the fuck is left?

>>86743158
Black Widow?

>>86743158
No one is left, that's the point.

Marvel want to make an all new "diverse" universe, and they'll crash the entire company into the ground to get it.

>>86743216
lel who cares bout dat bitch?

>>86743027
This, I feel like theres a gauge.
Some fans ragequit after one or two replacements. More tolerant people struggled when it hit 5 Legacy characters replaced.

At about ten replacements now how many people are still holding out? Most of the fanbase has a breaking point.

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>>86743232
>Hey Bob, why dont we make new characters?
>No no. Only legacy characters sell.
>Why not get rid of the legacy characters that sell for the new ones that dont then?
>Well I don't see a problem with that.

>>86743216
I'd honestly give Marvel a hand if they replaced her with a straight white man, just to mix things up for once.

>>86741745
Why is the guy in the dead center levitating next to his toilet?

>>86743439
I mean,
I'd fuck him but I don't think he'd want me to.

>>86743408
>he doesn't telekinetically perform his bathroom ablutions.
Get a load of this schmuck.

>>86743408
He's doing his wall-sits. Guess now they're floor-shits.

>>86740856
>>86740866
When you go after the online, MCU fan audience, don't be surprised when your viewers buy their comics through Amazon.

>>86741386
lol

>>86743408
my guess is that the artist and colorist had conflicting ideas.

>>86740233
People who voluntarily work in the comics industry deserve whatever shit comes their way

The missing piece from all these sales discussions in that we don't know the online numbers.

>>86744433
And we never will, so there's no point in bringing them up at all.

>>86744433

>Online number
>Meaning fuck all!

I'm pretty sure DC has been dominating those for the last few months as well

>>86741532
They don't have enough titles to grab the market share. Image would be more likely.

>>86741394
>I hate that this industry guilts you so much for not buying singles.
They don't make me feel guilty, just angry. I'll buy whatever the fuck I want. If I'm not buying floppies, make them better or shut up.

>>86741522
> I remember Peter David blaming readers for X-Factor
That REALLY pissed me off. Very stupid on his part, too.

>>86744451
Well, folks make comments like >>86741136 , wondering how Marvel can be so foolish, why they keep promoting progressive stuff, etc. My guesses are:

Online sales make up for the retail losses
Positive mainstream media is more valuable for building the IP than a 5K sales difference
Marvel is building the next generation of Netflix shows/movies

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>>86742262
>>86742423
>>86742238
>>86742185
Don't forget the 1:1000 variant for Civil War #0, which had nothing to do with the actual book and was just an ad for Agents of SHIELD drawn by Greg Land.

An ad homaging a classic Spider-Man cover and failing to capture what made the original cover good in the first place, at that.

>>86744596
Doesn't Marvel have a hateboner for Image?

>>86741671
I blame Disney. Other than the movies which they hand off to other people outside of their sphere of influence, all aspects of Marvel have been pretty shitty as of late despite the much needed universe reboot that happened some time back. As far as the comic books go, however, I think we can all agree that the issues can be traced back to He-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named.

>>86744631
Floppies and comic book stores are losing more and more relevance with each passing year and right now a lacklustre event is matched against DC's semi-regular universe reset sugar hit

It's not going to last. There was even an interview with some Marvel folks fairly recently where they answered the "Why?" question with what amounted to "Uh, do you think we'd do a thing, they continue doing it, if it didn't work?"

>>86744828
>all aspects of Marvel have been pretty shitty as of late despite the much needed universe reboot that happened some time back.

Marvel has never rebooted it's universe.

>>86744641
I just checked on eBay. People seem willing to pay $400 for that variant. That's fucking insane.

>>86744652

probably.
they do keep building up these big profile writers who then burn out/get tired of doing work-for-hire shit, so they go make their own books and not have to worry what 20 other people are doing at the same exact time.

QUICK, GET RID OF MORE WHITE MALE CHARACTERS.

THAT'LL FIX IT.

THAT'LL GET THE PEOPLE BUYING TICKETS TO THE MOVIES TO BUY OUR BOOKS!

YES! IT'S FLAWLESS!

>>86744934

is there a price listing it for 400, or an actual one thats being bid on up to 400?

because someone thinking he can sell it for 400 and people willing to spend 400 on it are two different things...

>>86744862
>>86744828
He must have meant the huge restructuring that happened with a lot of Marvel series years back when it was first bought out. It definitely wasn't a reboot but a lot of things got changed around, mostly just designs, lineups, writers/artists assigned, etc and then Marvel put up all of those new things like Howard the Duck, She-Thor, and fucking Gwenpool. Gwenpool is so shit, I can't believe it's still running.

>>86745012
Check "Sold Listings." Most of them ended--with green prices, so someone bought it--around the $400 range.

>>86740466
I thought the new Iron Man was supposed to be some black teenage girl who's super smart and super athletic or some shit like that.

>Angry fans buy comics!

Yeah, apparently not. Everyone told that cunt his brilliant plan would fizzle out eventually.

>>86745141

Gwenpoole is really good and has nothing to do with the usual "abloo bloo Marvel took away my white man" whining anyway

>>86740856
>>86740866
>>86741003
Maybe if people stopped reading/downloading them online for free on sites like this there wouldn't be such low orders for the new shit coming out. And people were wondering why print's dying out....

>>86745141
>fucking Gwenpool. Gwenpool is so shit, I can't believe it's still running.
But it's good
It's actually fun, interesting and relatable... You know, like pretty much what every shitty tumblr-esque book tries to be with all their "lel quirky! xP" bullshit

>>86745172

she is.
that asian girl is from a japanese iron man porn parody.
that Marvel happened to use the same name is "coincidental"

>>86741593
Fuck.
The pandering isn't working.
Quick!
Spider-Man is now a black lesbian single mother transsexual with one leg, self diagnosed autism from vaccinations and xe don need no man telling xer to get pictures.

>>86745172
There are going to be two Iron Man books post CW2

Iron Man - starring Riri Williams as "Iron Heart"
Infamous Iron Man - starring Dr Doom as "Iron Man"

>>86745214
>comic downloads get 3k+ on a single link for one book
>average book barely pushes 30k
If you assume that the 3-4 mirrors each book gets in the sharethreads here, ends up in some figure between 5k or so, you've got pirating pulling a fair chunk of their total numbers.

That's not counting crap like viewcomics and the like

>>86745214

print isn't dying out.

and the people who pirate aren't going to buy the books anyway.

these stores are saying that among their normal comic buying audience, no one is really pre-ordering the new Marvel stuff (meaning they have to guess at how much to order, meaning they'll under-order everything)

>>86740233
Did Marvel actually lie about the solicit or did they make a misprint?

>>86745220
>relatable
Yes I too find myself living in a comic book universe, and despite this knowledge still think the world doesn't matter, leading me to go on guiltless killing sprees.

>>86745214
Yeah, that's why DC rebirth is such a huge failure and no one is buying it. Because piracy destroyed DC Rebirth just like it destroyed Marvel.

OH WAIT!!!!

*slaps your face*

You're and idiot.

I've seen Marvel fans begging for a reboot of the entire Marvel universe.
That's how bad it has gotten

>>86745314

Marvel actually lied.

Bendis books for the past (at least) 2 years have been pretty consistent with the solicits not matching up with the actual events of the issue.

Of course, Marvel knows this stuff ahead of time and makes no attempts to correct their solicits by order cut-off dates.

>>86745314
>Read Riri Williams' debut!
>haha just kidding she isn't in this issue, she's in the next one

that doesn't sound like a misprint to me, how do you accidentally think the introduction for a majorly hyped up character is in the wrong issue

>>86745301
>Dr Doom as "Iron Man"

>>86745340
>being this literal
Autism, isn't it?

>>86745355

Wasn't that what ANAD was supposed to be? Except not? Except maybe? Except they still haven't fucking clarified any of it?

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>>86745354
>*slaps your face*
Well I see /co/ has given up pretending it ISN'T tumblr

>>86745305
>people who pirate aren't going to buy the books anyway.
Because they can pirate it. If there were no alternatives for them other than buying it then they would actually put the cash up front for it sooner or later. By having these storytime threads and spoonfeeding the content for others you are trivializing all the hard work that goes into making an ish.

>>86744828
>He-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named.
Perlmutter?

It sort of annoys me how /co/ has become such a DC Comics circle jerk now that Rebirth is a success

Almost makes me wish Rebirth wasn't so successful so that their wouldn't be so much shitposting about sales.

I mean it's not like Marvelfags (the comic book fans at least) shitpost any time Marvel outsells DC

>>86745355
I'm a Marvelfag and now I want the unthinkable with all my heart. But after a regime change.

>>86745355
I thought it already got a reboot. Wasn't that the whole point of Secret Wars?

>>86745314
>>86745360
It sounds like they solicit something, and then Bendis' pacing fucked things up and changes the content of the finalized book.

>>86745461
We /v/ now

>>86741505
Wow, that's ridiculous. You should be making it easy for people to buy your product, not need a diagram.

>>86743216
Is there a red widow are some shit.

>>86745461
Nigga /co/ has always been a DC circlejerk

>>86745413
ANAD is as far as you'll get to getting a full reboot. It wasn't really a reboot though, as mentioned before it was more of a general cleanup that led to current Ms. Marvel and other such changes made, including the decision to kill off Bruce Banner and make the Asian Hulk the one true Hulk from now on.

>>86740233
>we want to turn Tony/Iron Man in our new mascot/flagship character because the movies
>8 months later
>lolno you niggas better get ready for Iron Doom and Moon Girl 2.0: But with an Iron Man Armor Edition!

>>86745474

right, but theres a 3 month gap between solicitation and a book's release.
They know at least halfway through that time if the events they solicit and the events of the book don't line-up, and if they make no attempt to alert people to that, then they're actively deceiving the reading audience.

>>86745496
It's never been this obvious until now though.

>>86741505
>>86741622
>>86745482
The funniest thing is that not long after, Marvel released a hardcover with all the variants in it. And now they're doing another series of Hip Hop variants.

>>86745413
ANAD was a simplification of the "putting toys back in the box" part of ending a writer's run.

Basically, it let the new writers start where they wanted with what characters they wanted, instead of spending their first 6 issues undoing the previous arc.

>>86742279
>receibe mayor trama
anon please stop

besides, spidey has always been good at soaking blunt force trauma. It's sharp things and bullets that cause problems

Doesn't the relaunch start today? Why do I get the feeling all the Rebirth story times are still going to be done first anyway?

>>86745413
ANAD was just a relaunch.

Some people and journalists thought that Marvel was rebooting because of Secret Wars and how Marvel kept stating that it was Literally the End of the Marvel universe and that it would be no more!!!(not realizing that it was just a gimmick and that Marvel was just hyping their comic).

>>86740856
>>86740866
Marvel are still going to claim Champions is a massive success, selling more than 400,000 issues conveniently not mentioning that the majority of those were sold to Scholastic

>>86745488

has she appeared in anything besides those back-ups and the novel?

>>86745482

ha! you should see the diamond ordering catalog/website. they could teach entire classes on how to use that shit.

>>86745579
>Why do I get the feeling all the Rebirth story times are still going to be done first anyway?
Does DC still put their digital books up a few hours before Marvel or are they closer now?

>>86745543
Why tho. Why hip hop variants because its hip? I rather have famous album variants. Because honestly there are few good hip hop ones

>>86745512
They've been trying to make Iron Man a flagship comic for years and it's never stuck. This is nothing new. It kind of feels like they're making Iron Heart so they have a new character to replace Iron Man when RDJ retires.

Honestly, I don't mind Iron Heart. Maybe now Tony's old rogue's gallery has a shot of beating her. It always felt dumb to me that all of Tony's villains are tech-based and go up against a man who has them outgunned, outsmarted, and outfunded. It's like how the Riddler would be a top-tier villain if he wasn't pitted against The World's Greatest Detective app on Bruce's Batcomputer

>>86743216
I'm sure she'll get replaced by Red Widow the second Red hits comics proper. Red Widow's gay, right?

>>86745599
DC release them earlier. Think it's at midnight west coast time

>>86745607

the few really good hip hop ones got wasted on shit artists.

>>86741505
Someone should make a new one of these for the new Marvel Now variants. Just as many crazy hoops to jump through.

>>86745591
I thought she was gonba appear in the comics bimut i dont fucking know. Ive heard alot of shit but Marvel changes its mind at a drop of a dime.

>>86745512

RDJ ain't gunna be around forever

Also Tony isn't dead, Victor as IM (obviously) isn't going to be forever.

I'm expecting all the varient nonsense to blow up in their faces soon.

You don't tell retailers to order more when your direct competition is putting out higher quality stories at a cheaper price point.

>>86745395
Please keep defending your shitty book. Please.

>>86745650
That seems to be a theme in Marvel. The good shit gets horrible art and the bad shit gets own best.

>>86745474
I'd believe that, Bendis is terrible with pacing (amoung other things).

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>>86744828
OHHH, you mean Lord Moldybutt?

>>86745461
I'very been waiting for this moment for years. Because it's been years since Marvel has put out a decent book.

>>86745679

plus considering how many of their variants get announced as BY TBA.

like the final issue of Civil War 2 just says CLASSIFIED and the cover is blacked out, all the variants information says TBA (for the like 6 covers its going to have) the only information retailers and readers have about that issue is that its by Bendis and Marquez.

>>86744828
Will this soon be accurate?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uyYb_r4cZHE

>>86741197
Same

I can't wait for the company to get a reality check.

>>86741197
Marvel is a fucking shit show right now. Get out while you still can.

Honestly, I hope Marvel gets hit hard. They need a good swift kick in the ass and realize they can't keep getting away with some shit they've been pulling.

Pandering to the millennial and/or Tumblr audience just isn't a viable strategy in the long run. Especially when they are not buying comics. Replacement Theory just doesn't work when you piss off the rest of your audience.

Having competition would be a great thing. Let Bendis actually fear for his job if he keeps putting out the same horribly paced shit.

>>86745614
>Maybe now Tony's old rogue's gallery has a shot of beating her.

But she's even smarter than Tony, anon.

>>86745850
GET THE FUCK OUTTA TOWN!

>>86745461
>I mean it's not like Marvelfags (the comic book fans at least) shitpost any time Marvel outsells DC

They do. You just ignore it.

>>86744831
The more likely scenario is that the people in charge at Marvel are inept and are doing the same exact shit that crashed the industry and nearly put them out of business 20 years ago, but now they have Disney to fall back on so they won't change anything.

>>86745850
Wtf

Wouldn't it be a far better story idea if it was just a normal intelligence level individual having to deal with Iron Man level problems?

>Vision is literally only Marvel titles I'm reading
>1 issue left
>will be done with them and their shit
>remember that Renew Your Vows on-going starts soon
God fucking damn it. I was so close to being out.

>>86745849
AND FOR GOD'S SAKES, DROP THE PRICE TO $3!!!

>>86745914
No because then that would make the black teenage girl disadvantaged in a world run by straight white rich old men and Marvel obviously doesn't want that to happen :^)

>>86745849
>Pandering to the millennial and/or Tumblr audience just isn't a viable strategy in the long run

Yeah, they need to pander to the 35+ white male audience like DC, that's the long term winner

>>86745918

Marvel's book quality is already poor as shit, if they drop their prices, these things are going to be printed on fucking loose leaf.

>>86745913
Honestly having Disney as a safety net could very well be a factor.

Corporate has something to fall back on if profits tank. Plus, I'm sure many of the Marvel Comics executives would have golden parachutes effectively and transfer over to the movie section.

>>86745916
It's not going to be good so why are you bothering?

>>86745957

long term, probably not.
but at the moment, its the audience with the money and the willingness to spend it.

>>86745849
Somehow I feel that Brevoort, Bendis, and Slott are still somehow blissfully unaware about how hard they are being decimated.
Like, there's static in their heads

>>86745957
Well considering those people are the ones that actually buy comics I'd say it's a pretty good idea.

>>86745993
I just want happy, family man Peter. I'm hoping they'll Lois & Clark it.

>>86745957
When that generation is buying, hell yes you pander to them.

Used movies and TV to get the Next Generation after millennials.

Hell, the 30 to 40 year old age group has the most disposable income.

>>86745957
You mean the people that buy comics?

>>86745918
It needs to be expensive so they can pay for all those variant covers that retailers aren't going to stock because of how horseshit backwards it is to order them

>>86745620
>Red Widow's gay, right?
I thought she liked a guy in her novel. Could still be bi I guess.

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Hello darkness my old friend

>>86746105
That black guy has the "I've made a huge mistake" face going on.

>>86746105

who is the guy on the right?
because Coates is the only one in that group doing anything close to a decent job.

>>86746105
Shouldn't feel that bad. His Black Panther sells gang busters.

>>86745913
The Disney Juggernaut providing support is indeed a factor.

Disney is known for playing dirty and using almost Walmart esque tactics to dominate markets. I would not be surprised at all if some of the shit they are pulling at Marvel right now is to further their market share.

>>86746151

i think spencer

>>86746128
>"What am I doing here?"
>"My feet hurt"
>"I wish I was at home writing actual books"
>"Why is that fat fuck Bendis always so happy?"
>Why is everyone so white?
>Even the Muslims are white here.

>>86746188
*sold gangbusters

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>>86745607
>Why hip hop variants because its hip?

>“For years, Marvel Comics and Hip-Hop culture have been engaged in an ongoing dialog,” Marvel Editor-in-Chief Axel Alonso explained in a widely shared press release. “Beginning this October, we will shine a spotlight on the seamless relationship between those two unique forces.”

>>86745443
No this is a case of if they couldn't pirate it they wouldn't bother at all. People only pirate comics because it's accessible to go on view comics spend like 10 minutes and read something and go on with their day.

It really is crazy how Marvel has become the teenager company period compared to DC being 20+ and older adults.

Also insanely dangerous on Marvels part. The forthcoming generation after Millennials is going to be one of the poorest Generations in a very long time and won't have nearly as much spending money to put towards comics.

>>86746227
It's still generally high selling. The first issue's sales was overly inflated due to variants.

>>86745496
/co/ has never been a company wars circlejerk until some retard kept pushing it. DC and marvel are both shit companies but they used to equally churn out good and horrendous shit at equal pace. Then Marvel decided to go full tumblr as well as getting worse writers on the case.

>>86746243
>Hip-Hop culture
Is that a company or magazine or something?

How can they have an ongoing dialog with culture?

>>86746243
>“For years, Marvel Comics and Hip-Hop culture have been engaged in an ongoing dialog,”
What does that even mean?

>>86746341

Alonso just wants to seem cool.

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>>86745981
>Plus, I'm sure many of the Marvel Comics executives would have golden parachutes effectively and transfer over to the movie section.
Not when Fiege already threw them under the bus and moved the movie side fully Disney. Everyone at Marvel proper is on their own. Marvel Studios is completely it's own entity now and has nothing to do with Marvel but sharing it's name. They literally don't talk to each other anymore to the point that Alfre Woodard just played two different characters, one on CACW and another on Luke Cage, in what is supposed to be a shared universe.

>>86741651

Sorry to ask but I'm new to comics and marvel in particular since the lenght and there were so many titles that always scared me to start reading.

Whats the problem with bendis exactly? Everything I lurk in a thread somebody is complaining about him.

>>86746395
>Alfre Woodard just played two different characters, one on CACW and another on Luke Cage, in what is supposed to be a shared universe.
Something completely unprecedented in the MCU, of course.

>>86744641
To be fair, Lincoln was the one who died so it actually worked out in the end.

>>86744123
As if they buy comics.

>>86746272
>People only pirate comics because it's accessible to go on view comics spend like 10 minutes and read something and go on with their day.

vs spending the same 10 minutes on comixiology or amazon?

>>86745461
>I mean it's not like Marvelfags (the comic book fans at least) shitpost any time Marvel outsells DC

Yeah fuck off mate. I remember the first month Rebirth launched and Marvel outsold DC because of DC's really low volume of books and the OP used a picture of that giant celestial from CWII #1 and slapped Marvels logo on it with's DC on the tiny heroes

>>86746483
>Something completely unprecedented in the MCU, of course.
Yes...?

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>>86745461
Oh boo hoo, I'm so sorry the D*sney board dared to talk about something other than D*sney in positive terms for a change. Maybe when they put out something better than dreadful people will start kowtowing to the Mouse again.

Or after that hawaiian princess thing comes out and all the waifu spergs skitter out of the cracks like roaches. Either or.

>>86745902
MCU shitposting is not the same as comic book sales shitposting

>>86741851

What was wrong with Blue Beetle?

>>86746680

the couple months leading up to Rebirth/BatmanVSuperman those two things were the same.

>>86746601
>Yes...?
http://marvelcinematicuniverse.wikia.com/wiki/Category:Actors_with_Different_MCU_Roles
No.

>>86746621
>D*sney board

This is /co/, not /tv/

>>86746048
>I'm hoping they'll Lois & Clark it.

Lois and Clark happened in the DCU proper though. It's entirely different

>>86746745
This is a Disney board when a new movie is about to come out. Just wait a few weeks and you'll see.

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>>86746105

>>86746745
Does /tv/ have regular "marvel shipping threads?" Does it have a 24/7 D*sney Wars general for the godawful kiddie cartoon? Is /tv/ still talking about every MCU film in glowing terms?

>>86746533
>Buying digital
>Spending 6 bucks for a digital product
Yes. Most people don't want to spend money on comics. If they can't read it they won't.

>>86741505
So is this the Marvel equivalent of a Hypercrisis thread? In difficulty, I mean.

>>86746391
A lot of rappers seem to be into comics. MF Doom is the obvious example and there's a guy from Wu Tang nicknamed Iron Man. A lot of black youths in the 70s-80's read Marvel comics, because those comics kicked ass and were cheap, and it shows in their music.

>>86746708
I think they solicited issue 3 or 4, instead of issue 1...or they decided to nix a more classic introduction for a 'balls deep into the action' type of thing.

>>86746188

Shit writing, caught up with him quick.

>>86746105

>black guy
>white muslim lady wearing hijab probably thinks she is progressive
>non descript white guy
>fat chud bendis
>gay guys on the right

>>86746864
>being this triggered by the mouse
Walt rape your mother or something?

>>86746794
I thought we didn't know where the RYV was taking place? and it's not like being on a different Earth has stopped characters like Spider-Gwen.

>>86746901

That's a little different than this though, especially when you're taking about introducing a new character you've hyped for months.

>>86746943
Just made a lot of shit movies and shows that continue to pollute the collective consciousness thanks to lots and lots of marketing and virtue signalling.

Which is why certain individuals are so eager to leap to their defense.

>>86746743

the majority of these are essentially extras

>>86746942

>Alonso
>white

>>86746341

It's bullshit, pretentious PR speak for "we're kinda have the same fans sometimes".

Like whenever someone working on an adaptation says phrases like "the evolution of", "what works and what doesn't work".

>>86747036
But not all, which was the essential point. Alfre Woodard being cast as two different characters is not some obvious sign of the divisions between Marvel and Marvel Studios on its own, explainable only through that disconnect.

>>86746833
Kek

>>86746971
They said it's not the same Earth that the Secret Wars one happened, and it's basically an Earth where One More Day never happened.

>>86746876
Wu Tang is so into comics that Rza played a comic book character in GI Joe 2.

>>86747198

Wu Tang is so into comics that they have written their own, as well as getting actual comics artists to illustrate their albums

>>86746202
Bendis doesn't even look happy. He looks annoyed that someone pulled him away from the desert table.