/co/ advice

Make her a villain first, woman second.

>>78033242
Vagina dentata

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Femme fatale is a dumb character archetype.

Sympathetic female villains are over done.

Former lovers are another one that's overdone.

>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?

Same reason it's hard to find a MALE villain scary, it's only entertainment.

>>78033242
Instead of spending time trying to make a character seem like a badass, spend more time making the potential victims into people that the reader would not want to see harmed. Then harm them like a badass.

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All the same things that make a male villain good.

See Azula. I'm sure you'll get a bunch of contrary shitposters saying otherwise each time she's mentioned here, but she was very well received and I think she was one of the best animated villains in a long time.

Her plans were clever. I'm thinking particularly of her wearing Aang and the others down. Her best moment was probably at the end of season 2, where she nearly succeeded in permanently killing the Avatar and her actions led to an Empire-esque down ending.

Also, she lost due to a realistic (considering what she'd gone through) mental background and no because she inexplicably became an idiot as happens with a lot of villains.

By contrast, her dad was really forgettable.

Another good female villain that comes to mind off the top of my head is Medusa from Soul Eater. Smart and really evil.

In Azula's case, the fact that she was conceived as a male villain and then swapped probably has something to do with it.

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>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?
It's not hard, feminists have made it hard. They have made women into an untouchable group that can do no wrong. As such women are uninteresting villains as they either need to be blameless or redeemed and can never be irredeemable assholes or tragic characters. This also means female heroes are difficult to write: women may not be subject to ("too much") suffering.

Compare Japan, possibly the most patriarchal nation on the planet and one that does not give a fuck about feminism. As such, anime is a medium where teenage girls are routinely depicted in borderline stripper outfits, women can get raped and vaginally shot by high caliber weaponry and a lot of shows have a "shut up woman, the men are talking" moment. Conversely, there are also anime where the woman is the knight in shining armor, defending her helpless man.

If you wondered why an anime character is the only interesting female villain you can think of, that's why. The best authors are those with the freedom to write what they want to write. Western authors have lost that freedom a long time ago.

Of course there are exceptions on both sides, but this is only a general trend and not a scientific fact.

>>78033242
have her drive to suicide any man that tries to give her a dicking.

>>78033242
it impossible. americans are too hypersexualized in their perception that any even slightly feminine creation will be neutered, sanitizied, tamed and trained to serve in the eyes of every guy that likes her character, while the ones that don't like the character will dismiss her as being a weak woman that needs to be put in her place, no matter how competent she's depicted as.

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>>78033394
>Femme fatale is a dumb character archetype.
Stop being such a nigger. Overdone? Yes. Dumb? No. It's overdone for a fucking reason, and that is because sex is literally the only leverage women have over men. Keep in mind that, until the rise of civilization, women survived almost exclusively by sucking the dicks of men powerful enough to guarantee a somewhat steady supply of meat.

The femme fatale makes perfect sense, which is why the most powerful and dangerous women in actual fucking history fit this archetype. Hell, just flip open any given Bible and tip your fedora with moderation and you'll see tale after tale after tale warning young men about the dangers of seductive women. People wrote these warnings for a reason, and not because their knees were soggy.

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>>78033788

Listen Europoor, Americans can either be hyper-sexual or puritans, not both. Stop fantasizing about Muhammad sodomizing you and make up your mind.

>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?

It's not. You just don't try. That's your fault. Fuck off.

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>mods deleting replies that state an opinion they dont like
>no nsfw image
>no naughty words
>no memes

>>78033676
>Western authors have lost that freedom a long time ago.

More like gave it up. Assuming one does not work for the "Big Two" they can portray characters however they want to. Look at Bomb Queen! A female character that /co/ has hated with a passion for years. She's a complete piece of shit and damned proud of it. Then there is Zii who routinely engaged in near Panty and Stocking levels of sluttery and gave no fucks.

Seems like if a writer wants freedom they can have it, so long as they stay far away from Mahvel and DC?

>>78033394
>Femme fatale is a dumb character archetype.
Explain yourself.

>>78033596
Agreed! Azula was great and seemed a much more dangerous threat than Ozai himself. She was a sadistic, psychotic cunt and i loved her!

Kuvira by contrast could have been great but there was just so much wasted potential. BRYKE likes Miyazaki so much, if only they had taken more inspiration from characters like Lady Iboshi and especially Princess Kushana for Kuvira.

>>78035325
This place is becoming more and more like Neogaf everyday

>>78033850
A Femme Fatale can't exactly be the Big Bad of a story though. On some level, offering sex kind of lowers your manipulator a bit. You'll never see Moriarty, for instance, get people to do what he wants by having sex with them. I know he's not a /co/ character, but his kind of Master Manipulator is the only way you can get even close to making that kind of character intimidating, and even then, it doesn't seem to work.

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>>78033242
Does it count if she scared your penis stiff?

>>78035650
>Look at Bomb Queen! She's a complete piece of shit and damned proud of it.

She's also a poorly-written cardboard cutout with no depth that exists purely for trite shock value in a really, really bad comic. Bomb Queen's production team can do whatever the hell they want because the book is so fucking bad that nobody reads it but edgy 12 year olds and barely anyone outside that niche even knows it exists.

tl;dr they have freedom because they suck and nobody gives a shit about them.

Or should I say had freedom? That can't possibly still be making that drek.

>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?
'Cause for some reason a lot of people go full retard when writing women.

>What qualities does a genuinely scary female villain need and why do so many lack those qualities?
What makes a male villain scary? Going female isn't much of a difference unless you fixate on making sure she perspires femininity - or conversely that she not so feminine that she becomes a stereotype or something.
As for the second half of that question, I think I already answered that with my first response.

>>78036417
However you feel about it, they couldn't pull that shit working for the "big two" which was my point.

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maleficent

>One of my favorite villians
>Didn't need a reason to be evil
>Have her get back stabbed by a man she loves
>Now she has a reason to be evil

She was one of the best Disney villians until that damn movie

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>>78035939
>You'll never see Moriarty, for instance, get people to do what he wants by having sex with them.

Not /co/ either but it's kind of funny that Elementary's Moriarty does a bit of something like that. The thing is, this is just a component of how she deals (effectively) with a very particular threat, and is far from her only or main skillset. She can be whatever she needs others to be to manipulate and then discard them. Her amin weapon is of course her intelligence.

I think she works pretty well. Although she's captured right now, she still feels very much in control.

>>78037701
is that smirkfu?

>>78033676
So true. This is probably like anime. Creators don't give a fuck if it's PC.

>>78037701

Yeah where Joan's boyfriend was murdered and she went out of her way to kill Joan's rival just because she didn't want anyone to interfere with herplay things

I'm honestly waiting for her to come back in a reason or two

>>78033676
So true, remember the blowback Gone Girl's writer suffered from dumb tumblerists? Fucking ridiculous.

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>>78038600

Yep, mai GoT waifu Natalie Dormer. She's pretty damn awesome as Moriarty. She really blows Sherlock's Moriarty out of the water, too, in terms of competence and how scary she is. And I don't dislike Sherlock's Moriarty, but she's way damn scarier.

Because they're all annoying seductress-types that rely on the heroes being morons rather than winning legitimately.

>>78035939
Confirmed for never viewing any noir media

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>>78033596
>Another good female villain that comes to mind off the top of my head is Medusa from Soul Eater.

She's great.

Because authors are retards who either want them to use sex as motivation or give them "le tragic abuse related backstory". It's not very hard, Cerebus, written by an admitted woman hater has some amazing female villains, who don't fall into any retarded stereotypes. Just don't try to put women into a box (whether it be the negative stereotypical one, or the retarded STRNG WYMN one)

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A few good ones from Western animation:

Malicent from the ORGINAL animated

Sleeping Beauty, not the retarded Jolie piece of crap

Ursula from The Little Mermaid

Cruella da Ville from the original 101 Dalmatians

Azula from Avatar: the Last Airbender

Hexadecimal from Reboot

Magica de Spell from Ducktales and the Unca Scrooge comics

Demona from Gargoyles

Not a good villain really, but a good character: Harley Quinn from B:tAS, really well written and interesting character overall.

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>>78040628
>Not a good villain really, but a good character: Harley Quinn from B:tAS, really well written and interesting character overall.

Most comic villains are not scary in the least. They're usually toned down as hell. Doesn't matter what gender they are, they will become total fucking idiots when the time comes for the hero to win.

>>78033371
WHAT A WONDERFUL PHRASE!

It's because not many people know how to write compelling characters in general much less villains. Also, Balalaika isn't really a villain, she's never really that big a antagonist for the lagoon company. She just sort of exists in their world. She's a shit person but everyone is in that series.

She's an absolute badass though and one of the best female badasses of all time because her intimidation was due to her tactics, wily and ruthlessness.

Good villains aren't hard to write, absolute pieces of shit that you want to see get taken down are pretty easy yet people seem to even fuck that up. Great villains are the challenge. A villain that is hate-able yet you understand them and how their mind works. They're still a terrible person but you can see why they are the way they are even if they'll never be different, is a great villain. Most female archetypes are shit because they rely on stereotypes that aren't necessarily bad but are almost always poorly written like the Femme Fatale character, it never normally goes beyond sex and normally falls into a redemption arc instead of the sexyness just being one facet of the character it becomes the entire character.

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>>78040697

Despite the ridiculous things that have been done with her character since then, B:tAS Harley exploded in popularity to the point that they added her to the canon for good reasons. It wasn't her sex appeal, either - honestly all the female characters on that show pretty much looked the same.

She was funny, fun, and also had a lot of pathos. Like all the villains on B:tAS, she was a classically tragic character, damned and doomed by her own character flaws. Unlike a lot of female characters in the 90s, there was no attempt to make her a "role model" - she definitely isn't. Might be one reason she and her popularity are so enduring.

She wasn't a good "villain" per say (generally not much of a threat) but a well done character. Using B:tAS in any argument is cheating, though.

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>>78033242
Make her ugly, and all the regular villain traits will do fine.

1.Because saying women can be evil or do or be anything without it being a man or anyone else's fault is impossible.

2.Because women can never be TRULY EVUL THEY ARE JUST MISUNDERSTOOD, look at the media in this country. That girl that lured a little girl into the woods and stabbed her 100 times? She was just a misunderstood girl who didn't understand what she was doing, this inspite of the fact that she was fucking enamored with gore and murder and death and had numerous pictures of her covered in blood an posing with knives and shit.
Women can't be evil, only the victims of men's evil in most western countries.
It's why no one takes women seriously. They have nothing that can be thought of as responsibility for their action or a will of their own.

3.The BLOGSOPHERE will destroy anyone who even attempts to make a self actualized female villian or just outright cunt of a woman who can't easily be called an innocent victim of men or some other bullshit.

>>78040983
>Great villains are the challenge. A villain that is hate-able yet you understand them and how their mind works. They're still a terrible person but you can see why they are the way they are even if they'll never be different, is a great villain.

That's not a villian. That's an asshole antagonist.
The kind specifically created specifically to add to the roster of whatever piece of media is created.

>>78033242
Balalaika is less scary when you realize that:

1. Chang is playing her like a fiddle. She's essentially a puppet.

2. She's not very high ranking in her own organization, and eats shit from higher uppers.

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>>78033242
>a female villain that's actually scary?

?

>>78039349

I really hope we get to see her again soon. She always kicks the show up a few notches.

>>78041678
>implying she was the villain
>implying it wasn't King's drug habit.

>>78041567
>antagonist
>not a villain.

What I mean is essentially Anton from no country for old men, you can see his reasoning and why he thinks the way he does but he's undoubtedly a villain.

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Pic related had a great chance for being a scary, smart and calculating villain.
Comic never updates and she wasn't that important, and cartoon made her a Captain Planet villain because it's for children.

>>78033242
absolutely zero mercy or empathy.
A way of thinking completely alien and incomprehensible
Sadism, but only when it doesn't get in the way of efficiency.
Genuine competence.

>>78033850
>sex is literally the only leverage women have over men
Please do not enter a career in writing, you are the problem.

>>78035325
Literally tumblr

Go report it in /qa/. People have been reporting /co/'s SJW infestation for weeks

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>>78033242
everything she had.

>>78039358
What were they bitching about? Salty cause she was cray?

>>78033242
Amanda Waller

>>78040450
So who would you rather be your mom?
Medusa, Ragyou or Ursa?

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>>78040983
>Most female archetypes are shit because they rely on stereotypes that aren't necessarily bad but are almost always poorly written like the Femme Fatale character


It's always funny how people shit on the so called "femme fatal" "trope".( not necessarily directed at you but in general) I guess if any woman has any display any sort of sexuality to get what she wants it somehow makes her less of a scary villain.

Which is funny considering some of the worst and most dangerous real life female criminals have done just that while still being evil and sadistic.

Off the top of my head
Grizelda Blanco aka Godmother. One of the most ruthless druglords of the 80's

Irma Grese, a female Nazi who worked in the death camps. A lot of the shit she did, she would make a great villain in one of those hentai movies from the 90's like Demon Beast invasion or Urotsukudoji.
Then there is (pic related) who was called the "Kim Kardasian" of Mexico. Was the head of one of the deadliest hit squads working for the cartels.

People act like they can't be cold ruthless as well as sexy.

>>78044284

Gillian Flynn don't give a fuck though. She writes whatever the fuck she wants to no matter how dark it is.

>>78044284

Basically. They argued that it was essentially MRA propaganda about how all women are sociopathic monsters who want to ruin your life, and writing in a false rape allegation to the story only added fuel to that fire.

Then again, the main male lead was a manchild mommy's boy who let his life fall to shit around him in his own little bubble and was too much of a pussy to actually confront his wife about their marital problems, and lets himself get destroyed at the end to fuel his own self-pity. No one is innocent in Gone Girl.

The bitch from Gone Girl was genuinely terrifying.

>>78044494
>Then again, the main male lead was a manchild mommy's boy who let his life fall to shit around him in his own little bubble and was too much of a pussy to actually confront his wife about their marital problems, and lets himself get destroyed at the end to fuel his own self-pity. No one is innocent in Gone Girl.

Yeah pretty much. Plus it's not like there haven't been movies about crazy women who accuse the MC of something, hell i guess they never heard of Fatal Attraction.

Ma Ma from Dredd was pretty fucking scary.

>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?

Because deep down you wanna have sex with her. Specially if you have a fetish for female bullies, soft femdom or shit like that.

>>78044542
Or Fatal Attraction Blacked Edition/Beyonce is taking this bitch over
>>78044559
R-right......scary....and not at all sexy.

>>78044542

Fatal Attraction got plenty of flack in its day about how sexist it was. Adrian Lyne has never exactly been known as a filmmaker with a light touch, petty much the only reason that movie works is because of the cast.

Late 80's-90's were a good time for "Bitches be crazy" in Hollywood. If you guys want an excellent insane femme fatale, watch The Last Seduction. Linda Fiorintino will give you the most uncomfortable boner possible.

>>78044603

Obsessed is legit one of my favourite bad movies of all time.

>>78041246
Harley is interesting because she's a female version of the trickster archtype. She shamelessly breaks social taboos and hangs around with both heroes and villains, and so represents a perverse kind of freedom.

The Joker can never be the trickster because he's too tied into the role of being Batman's villain. Harley has more flexibility.

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>ctrl+F 'la dama'
>0 results

Come on, guys.

>>78041595
>Chang is playing her like a fiddle. She's essentially a puppet.
fuck, and I thought fry face was the smartest, not Jackie Chan.

>>78044603
Oh she was plenty hot. Until she gouges your fucking eyes out with her thumbs because reasons.

>>78033242
I'd normally say to do it by not making it all about them being a woman, but then you hit the question of "why even have it be a woman then?"

It's kinda a weird thing to think about when coming up with a character, how to balance the purpose of each decision with the overall character being built.
In the senior game project one of my friends was the character designer on, she made one of the characters this frumpy artistic type (basically tumblr incarnate, but it fit as their project was about different mental perspectives) and a false leg. During weekly reviews, they kept asking her why/how it'd affect the gameplay or story. First few weeks she didn't have an answer and just did it to add some ultimately pointless design.
Can't remember what they ended up doing to have it have some meaning without totally defining the character.

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>>78044468

Huh, you know I actually didn't think of this before, but I think Ragyo from Kill la Kill is a pretty great villain and she's uh, "sexy," I guess? I find her really...really...disturbing.

And sex stuff with her is even more...disturbing. So...it makes her more scary, not less.

If course she's another anime villain, and honestly you can find lots of great female anime villains. But just saying I think a "sexy" female villain can be scary and is in this case.

>>78045561
You know, Ive seen good sons fight their evil fathers trope.
Ive never seen the good daughter fighting evil mother that often.

Reminder that the scariest female villain is a man.
I wish an actual female villain was that creepy, though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2W0htS9gCts

>>78044157
fuck off tumblr

>>78033336
Why are so many people incapable of understanding this

It drives me mad

Because females are inherently not scary and female villains are all awful.
>>78040316
This desu

>>78036638
Now you know what it feels like to like Hannibal Lecter.
Get ready, one day Maleficent will get a shitty TV series tumblr will love.

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>>78044157
nice attempt grrrrl

>>78033676
>interesting female villain
>anime
I want weebs to leave this board.

Why is it so hard to just clock a bitch on tv when dudes keep getting blown the fuck out left and right?

You're just rolling through the enemy stronghold with your squad kickin ass and takin names when suddenly you come across some female villain so your entire squad backs the fuck off until she eventually says something catty to the female on your squad and then they duke it out while everyone else watches.

>>78036146
Assault on Arkham was flawed but goddamn if it wasn't enjoyable

>>78044299

Medusa and Ragyou are utterly horrifying. I can't remember, did Ursa really do anything that terrible?

If there's something horrible I'm forgetting, I guess getting repeatedly raped by Raygou isn't too terrible.

>>78045972
>Medusa and Ragyou are utterly horrifying
Right. This is /co/, after all. A board that finds shitty capeshit villains terrifying.

>>78040628
>hexidecimal from reboot
mah nigga

>>78045972
>I can't remember, did Ursa really do anything that terrible?
Ursa's shittiness as a mother involved overt favoritism to the point of completely depriving one child of any affection and then abandoning both children entirely.

Kind of funny that murdering her children's grandfather is probably the only lasting good thing she did for them.

>>78045992

They're scary and uncomfortable because they're vicious child abusers. What they do is a little too close to reality.

They're also competent and clever villains but obviously no one in real life is going to use magical insanity gods/alien clothing to destroy the world in real life. But people do horribly abuser their children in real life and both shows are really brutal with the child abuse and showing how badly it fucks up their kids.

>>78046065
>vicious child abusers
That's not scary. In fact that's what makes me side with them instead. Kids need to toughen up and society needs to stop treating child abuse as something bad.

>>78046051

That's true, that's really shitty. I wouldn't quite put her on Medusa and Ragyo's level yet but that is not a compliment. I always felt sad watching Azula hallucinate Ursa.

>>78045601
Same as sisters being bitter enemies the same way that brothers are often shown to be.

Also:
>all these people saying Azula was a good villain
Her ending was crying and bawling like a baby while a character said they were a victim and they feel so sorry for them ;_;

No male villain would be considered good if they're shown like that.

>>78046262
We weren't supposed to feel sorry for Azula in the: shit she needs help, wow I hope things get better for her. It was in the Bullseye: Shit she will never be sane, she needs to be locked away forever, that's one fucked up individual, way.
Only retards and waifufags think we're supposed to see a redeemable character there. Shit I feel more sympathy for Ozai than I do her.

>>78040837
I had a good laugh.

>>78033676
>women can get raped and vaginally shot by high caliber weaponry

Technically, that was a shotgun up her ass. Which sucked because she was the cute one.

>>78046262
>Same as sisters being bitter enemies the same way that brothers are often shown to be.
Weird, seeing as in my experience sisters tend to be a LOT more horrible to each other than brothers.

>>78033242
>slavs
>scary
Bydlo can't be scary. Bydlo is a cattle that deserves to be slaughtered.

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>>78035650
>Seems like if a writer wants freedom they can have it, so long as they stay far away from Mahvel and DC?
That's true, but that's also part of the problem. In the American comic book industry, generally you're one of three things:
>Marvel
>D.C.
>Literally who?
Two companies have the market pretty much on lockdown, and both companies suffer, to a greater or lesser extent, of tumblritis.

Again, compare Japan. Of course Shonen Jump is king (and even then only in the Shonen market) but then there are dozens of other magazines publishing manga (from the top of my head Gangan Joker, Good morning! and Ryuu comics are pretty big). This opens up the market very much, especially to younger and newer writers. Look at two of the most popular anime of this year: Monster Musume and One Punch Man. Say about their quality what you want, but both started out with guys in their basements drawing shitty webcomics and both ended up getting succesful franchises which even have high-budget TV animations.

This is almost unimaginable in the American market as it is today because Marvel and D.C. prefer rehashing their old franchises (seriously, how many reboots, retcons and alternate universes have there been?).

Literally all things that make manga better than American comics are related to the model of the market. This is why I can't understand authors who try to copy the "style": they only copy the most superficial things (which has a load of variation in manga already) instead of the underlying model. Then again, it's understandable that neither of the Big Two are willing to give up their comfy position of dominance. The closest thing we can have to that is a bunch of high profile authors leaving from both companies and starting their own (then again, isn't that what Image did? I'd argue they're in the "literally who?" category).

>>78033242
>What qualities does a genuinely scary female villain need and why do so many lack those qualities?
She needs to act like a man.

>>78033676
>Compare Japan, possibly the most patriarchal nation on the planet and one that does not give a fuck about feminism. As such, anime is a medium where teenage girls are routinely depicted in borderline stripper outfits, women can get raped and vaginally shot by high caliber weaponry and a lot of shows have a "shut up woman, the men are talking" moment. Conversely, there are also anime where the woman is the knight in shining armor, defending her helpless man.

I don't think you've ever watched anything from Japan or spent a moment in the country. You diminish your own point with this kind of nonsense.

>>78046696
http://chartsbin.com/view/2340
Going by the feminine-masculine culture dichotomy, Japan's culture is one of the most masculine in the world and far ahead of any Western nation in that regard, especially the "examplary" nations of Scandinavia and the Netherlands. Only Iraq and the Phillipenes are ahead of it.

>>78033676
>It's not hard
Yeah, it's straight-up impossible.
>women
>scary
The only scary woman to ever exist was Katherine Knight and a one-dimensional lolsocrazy piece of shit like her would hardly make a good character.

>>78046751
>women
>scary
You've never been in a relationship, have you? Women are defenseless, but they're scarier than any man you'll meet outside of prison. Just ask any man who has been married: either they're pussywhipped, or they're robbed blind in divorce court.

Of course, depicting female depravity will lead to accusations of sexism, so they end up having to be written like men. I know that nowadays this is a very controversial statement, but women aren't men.

>>78046301

I agree.

Somebody somewhere will always go, "this villain is hot, I feel sorry for them," hell that happens to every male villain who isn't completely ugly. But Azula's not a fucking victim, she is batshit. The nice thing her mental breakdown did, also, was that she didn't fuck up because she acted like an idiot, as so often happens to villains at the end of a story. She fucked up because sh lost her goddamn mind, and you could see why. That doesn't make her a victim. I can see feeling sorry for her, true, but it's not true that to be a good villain a character has to be a totally unsympathetic, alien monster with absolutely no human feelings or complexity at all.

>>78046790
Oh, fuck off. I was hoping you died.

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>>78046803
4chan is a free speech zone. Go back to your safe space if my opinions trigger you.

>>78046794
Please don't imply alien monsters with no human feelings can't have any complexity.

>>78046824
>le tumblr meme
I reiterate, fuck off. No one cares about the exact same bullshit you post in every thread, you whiny subhuman.

>>78046824
Follow your own advice

>>78033676
>Compare Japan, possibly the most patriarchal nation on the planet

Really? There are other countries were women aren't allowed to leave the house without their husband's permission or go to school. Pick a random spot in the middle east and it would probably make Japan look like Lilith-fest.

>>78046832
Even sociopaths have human feelings, they still feel sad and angry, they can be sympathetic (they didn't ask to be born that way, after all) so while a character who is say a literal alien monster with no emotions at all, I'd say it is pretty rare to find such a character who isn't more along the lines of a storm or a fire as a threat rather than an actual character. For example, people have made good arguments that Azula herself is a sociopath. Of course real sociopathy is very unrealistically presented in the media, but that's another matter.

To make a character no one would find sympathetic, they probably would have to be incapable of suffering and have no identifiable human traits.

>>78046938
>To make a character no one would find sympathetic, they probably would have to be incapable of suffering and have no identifiable human traits.
Does Michael Myers have any following? And I mean the original "no rudimentary sense of right and wrong, good and evil" Mike Myers, not Zombie's. Because that's the only character like that I can think of and he's more of a force of nature than actual character.

>>78047030

There must be, you know "something something misunderstood" etc.

>>78044468

You gotta make sex terrifying when it comes to woman villains. Like yeah she'll fuck you, but you don't want your dick anywhere near that.

>>78047030
Aku is not sympathetic at all but he has tons of human traits, just bad ones.
>Petty as fuck
>Short temper
>Double crossing
>Sadism
He's just evil as hell

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>>78046087

>>78046790
>virgin pretending he knows what he's talking about

>>78033676
moast patriarchal nation on the planet
>women control household finance

Japan doesn't fit into a western gender role paradigm. They're simply ahead in some aspects and behind in others.

>>78047100
That's kind of my point with that Michael Myers example. Even the likes of Hannibal Lecter, Freddy Krueger or Patrick Bateman have something human to them. Not GOOD kind of human but still, so I struggle to name many characters with no human traits at all outside of animals and alien species.

>>78047191
Freddy is completely unsympatheitc as well

>>78047191

The Terminator? Like in the original?

>>78047191
Well, plenty of people have found those three characters sympathetic, whether that makes sense or not. I do think the original Terminator is a good example of a character with no emotion, I can't imagine anyone feeling sorry for it.

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Every time I watch american films or cartoons there is a bunch of heroes crushing whole armies of evil scum and making them look like complete idiots.
Come on man. Can I find a cartoon where villain wins in the end and chaos reigns? Probably we will never see such thing.

I want to see cartoon glorifying isis and cute girls beheading other cute girls.

>>78044468
Because sex isn't threatening, no sane person will fear for their lives in the sight of a sexy woman by herself.

She may have the biggest tits and widest hips and also be a rutless killer who eats babies but if we don't see her covered in blood driving an axe on somebody's head then no-one is going to be scared of her.

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>>78033242
>Pic related is one of the rare exceptions.
I want /a/ to leave

>>78041595
Also is just a butthurt commie that needs Ronapeur as a comfort zone because outside in society she's worthless. The crimelords in Black Lagoon are kinda pathetic when you realize they don't have much power, that CIA bitch made that very clear to Chang.

>>78033336
Thread over in one
Dont focus on the lady part just the villain part
Have the hero rape her in the end

>>78033850
Hes right
Guess how john the baptist died.
A seductive femme fatale asked the king for his head and he cut it off right then.

>>78033850
There's no point in saying this in a /pol/ thread but that's bullshit, most of the sustenance for hunter gatherers comes from plants and band societies tend to be egalitarian. Inequality increases with agriculture and civilization.

>>78036638
I find it really funny that in recent reimaginings like Maleficent and Wizard of Oz, female villains are rewritten so they are the victims of a man.

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>>78048375
Womyn are strong and independent and don't need no man... unless something goes wrong. Then it's the fault of men and they need men to solve it.

>>78046790
>>78046803

You could actually make a very good female villain who uses the system combined with society's perception of female innocence to get away with some pretty heinous shit. Regardless of how much you want to cry fedora, it's not much of a stretch at all to imagine a female criminal who keeps pinning her crimes on her male accomplices simply because the justice system doesn't see her as much of a threat because of her sex.

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>>78046726
>Japan's culture is one of the most masculine in the world and far ahead of any Western nation in that regard

>>78048618
That's like posting a picture of Dolf Lundgren to prove that Scandinavia is supermanly.

>>78048618

> one picture is the entirety of Japanese culture.

Regardless, it's an interesting effect that in more masculine countries, guys actually seem to have much more broadly defined acceptable behavior for themselves, much more broad gender roles than what they supposedly have in modern non-masculine society

Examples:

1. In America a century back, close physical affection between male friends was common and considered unremarkable, nowadays you can only do it if you remark how big of a joke it is and how insincere you are about it, and even then you're probably never going to see two guys being as physically intimate as they could have been a century ago

2. In masculine ME cultures it's actually not that unusual for guys to care an awful lot about their appearance and wear the male equivalent of makeup

3. Japan's ability to joke around about male gender roles and honor comes from a place of security, unlike the west where such concepts either MUST be denigrated and mocked, or if you like them, they must be upheld all the time and always taken seriously

>"masculine" and "feminine" cultures
For fuck's sake people in the same culture can't even agree on what counts on masculine and here you are speaking right out your ass with this armchair sociology bullshit.

>>78048684
>In America a century back, close physical affection between male friends was common and considered unremarkable, nowadays you can only do it if you remark how big of a joke it is and how insincere you are about it,
What? Good lord, if you've never talked to another person in your life at least be embarrassed about how socially ignorant you are.

>>78033873


Actually Freud noted that Americans are usually one of those two extremes. It's one of the problem with the US, a lack of moderation.

>>78048512
That's not a good villain. That's a generic soap opera character.

>>78048163
>Cute little wigger girl
>Villain
U wot m8

>>78048512
Gone Girl

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>>78033873
>Listen Europoor, Americans can either be

Nigga, we're othering you there, so you can damn well be anything we want you to be.

>>78033873
>Americans can either be fat fucks too lazy to have sex or school shooters
FTFY

>>78050441

> If I just insult them, I don't have to acknowledge their point

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>>78044468
She's like a real life GTA character

>>78046938
Azula is like Kilgrave in Jessica Jones. The upbringings they had were pretty fucked up for sure, but still doesn't excuse their actions after the fact. I am one of the biggest Azulafags here but i don't see her as a victim at all.

Psychotic and egotistical.

>>78048367
>band societies tend to be egalitarian.

This is bullshit and the liberal version of the racist 'noble savage' archetype. Actual hunter-gatherer bands operate as patriarchies.

The powerful men have multiple wives who do the day to day work while the men spend their time hunting, fighting and relaxing. The young men try to become a member of the powerful inner circle.

The death rates for those young through accidents, murder and inter tribal war are through the roof.

>Expecting a thread of villain comparisons
>Everyones now a goddamn anthropolgist

>>78039371
Sherlock's Moriarty is way to hammy. The whole show is way to hammy.

>>78033371
Wow bel meme amico

>>78048618
I wish I had a Grandpa-chan to hang out with.

>>78033242
By nature women are life givers.

Men are life takers.

It's the simple poetry of form and function.

>>78056756

M'LADY *le tipping meme*

>>78044494
>was too much of a pussy to actually confront his wife about their marital problems
You sound woefully immature.

>>78044157
Give or take the last thousand years he's practically correct though and presents an interesting POV.
Historically, women have been barred from political power, and the only power they had was what their spouse wielded.

>>78056756
>By nature women are life givers
>Men are life takers
But this doesn't make sense as in nature you need both male and female to procreate and only symbolically are women truly "life givers" in full.
The idea that men are "life takers" has no real hard-set foundation and sounds fucking stupid on top of that.

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>>78045561
Ragyo was great.
We kept waiting for her to show a single redeeming quality.

Never happened.

But also what a great voice. Romi Park is a goddess.

>>78045561
Ragyou was a fantastic villain that was incredibly underdeveloped. She needed her own set of flashbacks and continuous presence and screen time throughout the series.

A view into the Kiryuuin home life would have been amazing. Small doses here and there as we learn how everything isn't quite so nice there with small hints of how messed up she is.

>Why is Satsuki pausing before entering her room
>Why does she keep having Satsuki trying on so many clothes?
>Did she just go in the same door? Wait do they sleep in the same room?
>Why'd she knock everything off the table at the end there
>She just got on her knees before that scene cut...

Best thing is that there would have been dummies saying nothing was going on for weeks too.

>>78057590
>But also what a great voice. Romi Park is a goddess.
Have s'more

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXHr4SznpV8

>>78057486
>The idea that men are "life takers" has no real hard-set foundation
Are you retarded or something?

You really think women were meant to go hunting when 9 months pregnant? Do you really they had the stuff to even fight things to the death when men still died when doing it and it was often incredibly hard for them? Not to mention women are more prone to flight than fight when fight is 100% necessary for survival.

>>78057486
>Actually arguing against science
Please stop. Women stayed at the encampment for tons of reasons in the dawn of mankind. You can't have the less capable hunting and dying when it impacts your population so incredibly. Women were for giving birth and raising children, they have a superior skillset for it given to them by nature. Men had a superior skill set for killing things and exploring. They were both vital to the survival of mankind.

>>78058384
He isn't arguing against science you fucking retard, he's arguing against the ridiculously broad generalization of "life givers" and "life takers"

Hunting makes men no more inherently "life takers" than giving birth makes women "life givers" because, as he noted, men were necessary for the life giving process as well, and you might as well classify women as "life takers" since they were largely the ones who 'disposed' of unwanted young before the advent of birth control

The point is you're looking at one fraction of the reality of life and then intoning "LIFE GIVERS LIFE TAKERS" like some cheesy overdramatic sap

>>78058726
Nah, you're just being an idiot and blowing up over something over so simple and true.

Men were the hunters.

Women had children.

Stop freaking out like a moron over it, you're honestly quite embarrassing and ridiculous.

>>78058726
Take your meds, you know the doctor said you had to, Charlie. I don't want to drive over there to make sure you do again.

>>78058930
Fuck you, Kyle. I don't need them, I'm fine without them you piece of shit. And don't use my fucking name on the board you asshole.

You're all so fucking stupid and I'm a genius that you can't recognize because you're so stupid.

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>>78058930
>>78058977

>>78058930

Seriously, go over there man, help make this board a better place.

>>78033242
>Why is it so hard to make a female villain that's actually scary?

why a scary woman villain is sexism

>>78052636

Did you actually study this subject at university? No?

You're thinking of tribal societies which are a fairly recent development. I specifically referred to band societies, the most ancient form of human social organization, and according to archeological record, the form in which humanity has spent most of its existence.

Band societies are essentially large families, and decisions are made via consensus, there are no leaders. The closest thing would be elders of either gender.

Commonly, women resume searching for plants that are edible and catching small animals immediately after giving birth and small children are often taken along with their mothers. Genders do have different roles, but are regarded about the same. Again, hierachy arose later.

Although there were plenty of accidents and plenty of murder, one thing absent was likely warfare, which doesn't seem to have arisen until much later on the record, perhaps owing to these groups being nomadic and different bands having a family connection; they are generally on good terms with each other to swap out for mates.

I realize that you have personal issues/emotions that you are projecting onto this but this is simply our current general consensus. You seem to be projecting an agenda onto what the record appears to show.

>>78033242
Boners don't know fear.

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>>78058094
Thanks for pointing this out to me.

Kuroko and Romi are a perfect fit.

>>78033242
>fryface
>villain

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>>78061009
Balalaika is cute! CUTE!

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Slav women are always scary.

>>78033242
Have a design that doesn't have men saying
>"I want to fuck that"
For one thing.

>>78061271
Slavs are subhumans

>>78050514
Anyone who embraces that poisonous "culture" is a villain.

>>78062414
I want to fuck Jeffrey Dahmer and he was scary as hell, desu senpai

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>>78035783
>Kuvira
Point of comparison, despite having less screentime than Kuvira, and being a hench+love interest, P'Li left a much stronger impression.

>>78041595
>>78048212

Essentially opens her up as a tragic villain. Considering all the background details they give you about her.

>>78035783

>Agreed! Azula was great and seemed a much more dangerous threat than Ozai himself. She was a sadistic, psychotic cunt and i loved her!


You didn't get the character. You were supposed to feel sorry for and wish her good luck for bad upbringing.

>>78046301
>she needs to be locked away forever

You are soulless if you don't think people can change, especially a girl who had nothing to begin with. You don't just lock up people because they don't come out perfect.

>She fucked up because sh lost her goddamn mind, and you could see why. That doesn't make her a victim

She had a breakdown because she had a neglectful mother and a psychotic father. What the hell do you expect from her?

>people have made good arguments that Azula herself is a sociopath.

Azula cannot be a sociopath because she is an adolescent.

>>78052448
> I am one of the biggest Azulafags here but i don't see her as a victim at all.

Because you are trying to force your views on morality on a poor girl who was never taught morals.

Why do I get banned for calling people niggers, but Scrapper keeps shitposting and getting away with it?

>>78069945

1. Opinions are not shitposting and 2. that's a highly offensive term and the moderators don't tolerate racism. Now please we are trying to have a legitimate conversation here.

>>78033242
Nothing fictional can ever scare me. The fact that is fictional, merely makes it amusing when it's trying to be scary.
So I go for well-written instead. A well-written character that's supposed to be scary, is at least enjoyable.
Now unfortunately, /co/-related characters are never well written, because they've suffered so many writers taking a crap at them (especially when they're DC/Marvel characters) that are inconsistent to say in the least.

>>78070004
Fuck off, Crapper.

>>78070097
>it's le fiction and I'm a tough guy
>/co/-related characters are never well written because I only know capeshit
And here I thought this thread couldn't get more idiotic and cancerous.

>>78033242
It's really not difficult to make an effective female villain, the problem is 90% of em are lame because they're too soft or are cliche femme fatales.

>>78046634
>This is almost unimaginable in the American market as it is today
Do you really think One Punck Man is even close to the popularity of The Walking Dead?
>Gangan Joker, Good morning! and Ryuu comics
Literally who?
How about Dark Horse, Oni Press, Boom, Dymamite, IDW just off the top of my head.

Kind of surprised no one has mentioned Professor Umbridge yet. She's often more hated than Voldemort.

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The reveal that Deathmonger was female didn't make her any less scary.

Sure, Willy Pete is more viscerally scary but he can only skullfuck you to death for a few seconds, DM would keep you as an undead slave until you wore out and even then would probably keep using you as an accessory or decoration. Very Bad End.

>>78070472
There are a lot of effective antagonists who happen to be female. It's odd how anons seem to forget about them. I think it's because when you say "female villain", people think of a woman who looks young and healthy- you know, standard- not a middle-aged sociopath like Umbridge. It's because they hear "female" before "villain".