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In fact, Is Superhero Evil?

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Thread replies: 53
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I have read some comics which deconstruct Superhero like Watchmen, Marshal Law, Maximortal,etc.They are thought provoking and good to read.
But, According to them, Superhero is in fact evil and morally corrupted and harmful to society.
If we take Superhero seriously, Are they in fact self-righteous evil-doer?
What do you think?
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>>77921083
Is English not your first language?
>>
No, they're not "evil" because they're fictional and if the writer says they're not evil then they're not.
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Do you think that Superman is evil because he is violent vigilante who can't be restricted by law and Absolute power collapse absolutely?
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>>77921098
Yes.
In fact, I can't express what I want to say.
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>>77921083
Learn grammar, especially articles.
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>>77921102
So If We take them in real world morarity, Are Superhero evil?
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>>77921119
Then don't say anything.
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Marshal Law is satire and Alan Moore is just edgy. These writers don't like how prevelant the genre is that's all
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Super heroes are authoritarian enforcers of the post-WWII status quo in Western (American) comics. If that's evil, then yeah.
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>>77921133
But, I want to hear people's opinion about this article.
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>>77921083
Only read Watchmen. No, heroes in themselves aren't evil though there are evil heroes. It's just both how they affected the world and in turn it affected them. As well as an examination of what kind of people would be heroes
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>>77921131
Case by case basis.
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In my option, Superhero are;t heros: my explanation: 1) short heda; 3. they savages4. culture of cape.
Thats was my explaining as to why heros aren't super heors, extrapolate your option.
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>>77921141
that hasn't been true for a long time
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>>77921146
What article?
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>>77921083
>According to them, Superhero is in fact evil and morally corrupted and harmful to society.

I'm not sure that's the case with Maximortal. Brat Pack, sure.
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>>77921135
Moore isn't edgy as much as he's just a cranky old grandpa. He was, in fact, already cranky and old at the age of 30. It allowed him to write quite a lot of good stuff, but sumultaneously results in incredibly petty demeanor and a lot of dumb bullshit like fishman fucking and Lost Girls. Or the final arcs in LoEG.
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>>77921141
But, Doesn't even Superman often quarrel with goverment?
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What would Grant Morrison say about this?
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>>77921131
Depends but your typical heroes are good. They save lives and stop criminals with little loss of life, they're unreasonably good really. Get into types like Punisher then you can debate. Illuminati as well but for different reasons
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>>77921155
So how about Superman?
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>>77921083
Strictly speaking, in Watchmen the superheroes are not evil. They're just reactionary vigilantes who act more out of personal reasoning than from any moral or ethical standpoint. With Marshal Law the superheroes as a whole are simply an extension of the military industrial complex as a cultural institution overlaid with celebrity culture. It should also be noted that not only is Marshal Law presented from the highly biased viewpoint of Marshal Law himself, he himself is a product and part of the very system he criticizes with very little to distinguish himself from the other supers.
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>>77921169
He also made the Justice League fuck thier sidekicks in Top 10
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>>77921161
Article about that Are Superhero truly evil?
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>>77921211
Where did you forget to link it?
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I have heard Moore loves Superman.
Is it true?
Didn't Moore make Superman child fucker in TOP10?
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>>77921198
How is Superman evil?
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>>77921198
Depends on which version of Superman.
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>>77921222
Oh sorry.
I only want to hear people's opinion about theme that whether Superhero are evil or not.
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>>77921180
Superheroes are good, supervillains are evil. If a superhero is evil then he's actually a supervillain disguising himself as a hero or a hero who has been corrupted by an external evil and can be saved/redeemed.

Grant Morrison is heavily biased towards distinct moral binaries in his superhero fiction probably due to his adherence to monomyth, allegories, and a surprising amount of Christian theology in his works. I'm also pretty sure he has a corruption fetish.
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>>77921253
Link the article.
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>>77921238
>Is it true?

He does though he kind of denied it recently even though no one's really buying it. It's more of him still angered at DC and what it represents.

Top 10's Atoman was an analogue. Analogues don't always mean it's the same character. The Batman analogue was that bulldog guy and he was a reporter in Neopolis, something Bruce Wayne wasn't.
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>>77921253
"Topic", not "article" or "theme".

Also, "article" refers to words like "a", "the", and "an", which you really need to start using.
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>>77921180
Probably just something like "Moore is an old tool"

Where does their rivalry come from, anyway? Both have their merits (I like Morrison more, to be fair, because while he's hit and miss, his worst is nowhere near Moore's worst; however, Moore in his prime was better than anything by Morrison ever).
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>>77921275
Morrison is bald, Moore is pretty much made of beard
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>>77921083
It's extremely debatable based on what level of society you're viewing it from.
If their actions as a whole reduce a negative, whether or not a positive is produced, then in a way no the ends justify the means much the way warfare is often a necessary evil even if many individuals involved could be considered "innocent" of malice but were made the tools of those with power.

However on a smaller scale of things sometimes someone really is just looking to take their anger and misfortune out on others and it has nothing to do with who benefits from it outside of that scenario so. I wouldn't say that's necessarily evil though but it certainly isn't good, it's just instinctual, base. An animal instinct for revenge or just general spite is not always virtuous.

The thing you have to grasp OP is that the subject matter depends entirely on context and how far the reader wants to read into it, just like a court case it's less to do with all the facts of someone's life (though those can commonly be used to sway views) and more to do with the facts the jury needs to know relevant to the crime or matter. Similarly the judge will rule guilty or innocent or whathaveyou based on a reduction of opinions, not always an absolute hearing.

Another thing you have to keep in mind is sometimes motivation for lesser evils is enough to prevent greater. If you ridicule a vigilante more often than an outright criminal just because you know your moral lecturing will get to them chances are people will to fight the good fight, whether or no they're good, will plummet while evil for the sake of evil has its own draw so there will never be a shortage of that. Suddenly you're left asking where help is when you're in a seedy place?
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>>77921253
Is the state inhrently evil? Is the police inhrently evil? Are courts inherently evil? Are garbage men inerently evil?

The answer is obviously not (unless you're anarchist or worse, but your opinion doesn't matter much if so), but misuse of the force the state or its element posess can in result make it morally dubious (if inaproppriate methods lead to a noble goal) or straightforward evil. It's not such by default, though, and there's a lot of shaded of grey between those options; a lot will depend on personal judgement regarding whether the end justifies the means or not.

By extension, same philosophy might be applied to superheroes and fictional protagonists period, after taking the rules of the setting into account. Hence the answer would also be negative when talking about most msinstream heroes.
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>>77921275
Read "supergods". Morrison actually has plenty of good things to say about Moore.
I don't buy for a moment that Moore actually hated the genre when he wrote Watchmen, Miracleman, Captain Britain and his other super hero entries at all, despite of what he will say.
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>>77921312
>Is the state inhrently evil?
If you are under a state that as a goal wants to diminish your individual rights while taking a huge tax over you and the population and return nothing to society then I'd say that state is evil as shit.
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>>77921107
>collapse

Is everyone retarded tonight?
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>>77921332
...do you know what the word "inherently" even means?

Get an education.
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>>77921332
...yes? That's what the post said?

You're either not a native spaker, a libertarian, an an-com, or some horrifying mix of any of the above
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>>77921351
You're talking about conceptually, he's talking about practice. Both valid points though neither rebuts the other argument.
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>>77921361
Yes, it would be horrible to be a non-native spaker.
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>>77921370
No, I'm talking about somebody not understanding the word "inherently". Nothing "conceptual" or "practical" about it.

And if you think that's how a state in practice works, well, I don;t even know what to do with you, you're that wrong.
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>>77921409
I'd say North Korea is a pretty good example of a state that diminishes individual rights, extracts massive taxes from the population and returns little to the society.
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>>77921409
But my extremist media news outlet of your choice told me it's true and that we need to rebel gainist Average Western Democratic Country because taxes are theft!

There's virtually nothing wrong with taxes in theory, the problems might only be not spending certain amounts of money acquired this way properly (it's never all of it, though, otherwise the state would collapse, as much as certain political demagogues on both sides want to believe) or unjust income tax tresholds, usually targeting the poor and lower middle class but offering many privileges to the richest and international corporations and so on. There's nothing wrong with using a certain amount of money earned by every citizen to fund public education, healthcare or just various infrastructure in theory used by all of them, not to mention public safety. However, since humans are only humans are we're failable, it never ends up as the ideal, but it doesn't make the idea evil by default.
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>>77921436
Too bad it has nothing to do with states being inherently bad and the original post was pretty straightforward about totalitarian states being evil
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I only wanted to know what people think about validity of SuperHero.
I don't have any political opinion.
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>>77921083
The difference between Good and Evil:

>Good sacrifices itself for the good of others
>Evil sacrifices others for the good of itself.

Now that we have a baseline for Good and Evil, we can see that most super heroes are definitely in the "Good" category. Very few fall in the "Evil" category.
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>>77921515
I don't doubt it.
But Hasn't Superhero criticized as violent vigilante or even fascist who has absolute power?
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>>77921541
Why would fascist with absolute power be evil? Because the fascist is sacrificing others for his own gains.

Is a violent vigilate evit? Not if he is protecting others from harm. Spiderman busting into a gang's headquarters, beating them up, webbing them, and then calling the cops on them while they can't hide the evidence, that's good, not evil, because he's helping his community and risking his own person to do so.

Spiderman gets drunk and beats up a guy cause the guy reminds him of a child rapists that fled the state while his case was being retried? That's evil, because the actual guy who resembled the actual criminal didnt do nuffin. So Spiderman is just sacrificing that guy for his own selfish ends.
Thread posts: 53
Thread images: 3


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