Toph

>>77385802
Bryke don't like Toph, she was added by other writers, they hate her but since she's popular she was brought back so cocksuckers will pretend the season was good.

>>77385802
Toph is a worthless shit and a terrible mother

>>77385802
Nah, she was just a bitch.

>>77385860
>Bryke don't like Toph, she was added by other writers,

Well to be exact, (s)he was gender-bent by other writers who also removed what would have been a cringy love triangle

>>77385802
turns out behaving like a ten year old is only really cool when you are ten

>>77386252
Other writers were the only reason the original show was decent, Bryke are basically George Lucas split into two separate hacks.

>>77385864
>a terrible mother

This is actually a good thing. At least, an interesting thing. Ficiton is full of good guys who happen to be shit dads, but there aren't many women shown to be good people but failures in their parental role.

The Oblongs did a good job with it too.

I'm willing to bet that Toph (or more specifically her feet) were a major reason why the show rebounded in popularity during Book 2 after the somewhat tepid response to Book 1.

It would have been awkward admitting that Lin and Tenzin were half siblings.

>>77388190
Except its not like she really got real trouble for being such a shit mother, and its not like her criminal daughter for shit for being such a horrible person

>>77388490
That and she showed obvious favoritism to SuYin.

>>77388232
The show was always popular
But whoever led programming at Nick shat on Avatar and it's airing schedule so people could never really tell when new episodes were going to come out and never really could watch whenever it played

Avatar was an amazing idea with still amazing execution

>>77388490
>muh ficcional world has to be a perfect place, and every Main character must have a relatively perfect home life, and every mistake should be punished by the world, just like ALWAYS happens on real life amIright?

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>>77385802
Guess Toph doesn't see the point about storytelling

Bitch was busy connecting to the whole world and preparing to hangout with Aang and Iroh in the spirit world.

>>77388550
more like
>my fictional world should be realistic to the fiction it surrounds, people's actions should have consequences and people should actually care about one another
why exactly did Lin forgive anyone?
she's holding onto a grudge, sure, but it shaped her adult life and turned her bitter
nobody ever actually came to her and apologized, they just fucked off to their corner of the earth kingdom and did whatever made them happy
the only reason they even come into contact is because of the avatar, and even then, nothing feels sincere or is resolved properly
>try to make a more mature sequel to your show
>glosses over the feelings of non-essential characters and basically just forces drama for sheer drama's sake

>>77386275
I don't understand why they were so sketchy and inconsistent about actually aging characters. Aang acted like a 40 year old, but apparently Sokka was still obsessing over the stupid boomerang he had as a kid well into his adult life. Katara acted like a grandmother but Toph got stuck as a geriatric preteen.

>>77385802
She had plenty but they all involved a competent avatar and she wanted to avoid Korra killing herself in the middle of her swamp.

Toph was brought back in a shameless effort to try and make the Legend of Korra seem good

There was the time the rest of the Gaang spent a day using her as their personal fuck toy, but that's personal.

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Why was ATLA so good and the Legend of Korra so bad?

>>77388232
It could also have something to do with the vastly improved quality of writing of season 2 compared to season 1 (or 3), but no, you're probably right, it's just the massive hordes of pedophile footfags flooding to a preteen kids cartoon at the first sign of underage feet that gave it huge ratings.

>>77388641
>Personal
>Implying she didn't tell Korra that story right after she woke up.

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That's true, even in ATLA.

How do you Toph react to SuYin running away from her grandparents after sending her there for punishment? Did she even give a shit at that point?

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>>77388637
I think them dragging Iroh back from the dead to tell Korra what a great person she is and what a good job as the avatar she's doing, is the point where the show shat on what little tiny fleeting shreds of hope I still had for it.

>>77388662
Good writers at the helm of one and hacks with almost no restraint at the helm of the other.
>>77388725
Holy fuck, was that cringe inducing.

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>>77388725
Reminder that Mako was named Mako in honor of Mako and has forever soiled the name Mako

>>77388613
This is why pandering is bad

They're certainly have the modicum of writing ability necessary to transition an child character to an adult one as shown by Aang.

>>77388725
God, that was so bad.

>>77385802
>/co/ in season one
FUCK I CAN'T BELIEVE ONLY KATARA SURVIVED
>/co/ in season 4
FUCK I CAN'T BELIEVE KATARA WASN'T THE ONLY ONE ALIVE

>>77388757
>>77388725
Anyone have that picture with Bryke and Force Ghost Iroh?

>>77385802

most of her lines were ''I'm old and sassy! I sure don't like young people!!''

>>77388613
I think it showed that Sokka and Katara actually had their lives together, meanwhile the stress of being the Avatar and trying to recreate a entire race made Aang a lot more reserved and the whole SuYin incident made Toph realize she should just travel the world for awhile and not give a shit.

>>77388609
not gonna defend Bryke or the complete lack of catharsis or anything resembling verisimilitude in LOK but IRL plenty of families splinter never to reform. Contrary to what siblings who are on good terms with their siblings will tell you plenty of people grow up with nothing but contempt and scorn for their blood relatives.

LoK is shit but the situation between Toph and her kids is hardly unusual.

>>77388856
I think people are annoyed by it because family issues in LoK is the most common thing to create drama. By the time SuYin was introduced, we already had Aangs kids being fucked up and Korra not trusting her parents.

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>>77388818
>Sokka and Azula are long dead by the time Korra begins
>Sokka is featured in a flashback but he's still funny and reasonable
>Ty Lee is a rotting corpse
>Same with Mai
>They're all sealed away safely beneath ground, Bryke can't rape them

>>77388894
>We never found out if Sokka had kids.
I mean, we were introduced to 2 of his bastards, but still.

>>77388725
This bullshit annoyed me so much.
They had the perfect opportunity to have an Old Zuko offer tea and advice to Korra, showing that he eventually grew up to become wise like his father-figure, but no, he just relays the problem to upper management and doesn't even try to go with her to see the arguably most important person in his life.

>>77388950
I know it's a cliche but much like George Lucas, I don't think Bryke understood their own characters.

Remember, Bryke wanted Iroh to be evil originally, working with Ozai and training Zuko the wrong way.

>>77388980
I think you're completely right and i think they show they don't understand their characters plenty of times throughout LoK, most notably for me with Korra herself.

>>77388950
Zuko never struck me as someone who would ever become particularly wise. He seemed more likely to turn out like Roku, who just faked it because that was the role he was filling but didn't really know the first thing about anything he was doing, than anything else.

>>77388892
there were elements of it in ATLA but unsurprisingly they were balanced out by shit like Iroh being Dad of the Fucking Century with Zuko and the Gaang forming a surrogate family. Also Toph's parents caring about her in their own (selfish) way.

>>77389074
But then Bryke have to make Toph into such a shitty mother her spawn causes a second world war

>>77389074
It worked in ATLA because it was balanced, but there is no balance in LoK. I legitimately thought SuYin pulled a Dai Li on Lin since Lin forgave her so quickly.

>>77388818
>/co/ in season one
Wow, it really sucks that all but one of my favorite cahracters are confirmed dead. I really wish I could have seen them all again.
>/co/ in season 4
WHY THE FUCK ARE ANY OF THEM ALIVE

>>77389203
Katara and Toph have an excuse since Katara ain't dying until her third great grandchild is born and Toph is just a girl Bumi.

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So...Sandbenders.
are they Earthbenders? or Airbenders?
or are they both?
discuss.

Well, let's be honest. We all loved Toph because she was a force of nature and contrasted with all the up-its-own-ass empire versus self-righteous rebel bullshit played with a straight face it was fun to see someone more powerful than almost anyone on either side who just doesn't give a fuck about any of it. But she was emotionally stunted, obstinate, and irreverent to a fault. I don't know how that goes with the unseen "uptight image-concerned police chief" and "objectivist city-founding" phases of her life, but Old Crone Toph is a pretty natural conclusion.

>>77389292
Earthbenders using a waterbending style maybe?

>>77389293
Her being a police chief was just odd to me. I feel like Aang only assigned that job to her because of the fear factor that her name creates.

>>77385802
There was that time she sucked a whole lot of dick.

Did anyone else get annoyed when Toph just casually revealed who Lins dad was? I feel like she just gave out a random name and is still keeping the answer a secret.

>>77389292
they're swamp benders that adapted their technique for deserts

>>77389508
not enough moisture in a desert for it to be waterbending.
although I do like the swampbender comparison because I could see them being an equivalent to them only with airbending

>>77389430
SHE REVEALED IT WHEN?

>>77389430
I will continue to believe it was Sokka in various disguises and Toph just keeps it secret because the kyoshi warriors have very draconian laws on adultery.

Here's how you do it. Or rather, here's my crappy fanfiction I made up in fifteen minutes

>Change up Suyin and Lin's relationship. Instead have them competing for their mother's attention and approval.
>This competitive nature comes to a head when Suyin joins the police academy as soon as she can, following after Lin in an attempt to get closer to their mother
>The two butt heads several times during the academy and afterward, and it becomes clear to Toph that nothing good comes of having the two together, so she assigns them both different precincts.
>However, around two years later, there's a massive siege or triad war, or something. Whatever the case, it requires massive police manpower from all over the city, and inevitably, Lin and Suyin meet up and begin immediately butting heads over what should be done, tactics, etc.
>Eventually the situation becomes desperate enough that Suyin is forced into a position of responsibility, like a battlefield promotion. She's under enormous pressure, and lacks the necessary experience to make the right calls.
>As an indirect result of her actions, the situation spirals out of control and erupts into violence. Toph is killed and Lin is scarred. Although the triad/siege/fuck, I don't know/Die Hard plot is eventually resolved, the Beifong family has been completely torn apart.
>Obviously, Lin rejects her sister immediately, and swears to do right by her mother and become the new chief. She dedicates all of herself to her job, becoming the hardass we see in LOK.
>Suyin leaves the force in disgrace, struggling with her own guilt as well. She travels the world as in canon, trying to cope, and eventually manages to. Along the way, she also meets Bataar, and is inspired to create Zaofu.
>Since Lin couldn't give a spiderrat's ass about money, Suyin takes Toph's sizeable inheritance that she herself inherited from her loaded parents, and uses that to help found the city.

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>tfw LoK had so much potential

>>77388190
As a feminist, this is what I want in my media. Female characters being treated exactly the same as male. It's like they wrote a misunderstood antihero and made him female. It's awesome. Toph is best girl

>>77389650
Maybe he's SuYins dad.
But, if you ask me, its pretty obvious Wang Fire is Bumi and Kyas true dad.

>>77389665
(cont)
>By the time Book 3 rolls around, and Lin comes to Zaofu along with the others, it's not a matter of pressure points and acupuncture and whatever the hell that was, it's Lin struggling with the fact that Suyin is truly repentant, and has moved on with her life, while Lin hasn't. She begins to question if she's wasted her life trying to live for her dead mother instead of living for herself.

Toph contributes to LOK's flimsy characterisation better by being dead.

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>>77389131
>LoK is a story about the importance of balance
>has no balance of its own
It's like poetry.

>>77388846
Katara and Sokka were always the most normal members of Team Avatar (which is saying something)

>>77389109
Honestly, I think Toph being a terrible, selfish Mother is fairly in character for her.

>>77389203
Katara being the only member of the original Gaang still alive worked perfectly.
She was Aang's wife and Katara's mentor. In the first episode, she was the link back to the old series but encouraged Korra to go out and make her own stories. It was a perfect role for her.
Then they kept bringing back Zuko and Toph and Iroh and Zhao and it was obvious that LoK was stuck firmly under ATLA's shadow and couldn't stand on its own two feet.

>>77385802

WHO WERE THE FATHERS!?

Toph's stories were too much for TV.

>>77390516
Sokka and Ash Ketchum

>>77390491
To be fair, promotional information for LOK from the very beginning indicated that Zuko was still alive, so bringing him into Book 3 wasn't really that bad to me.

I agree that Toph was a total cop out though.

>>77388490

Do you think in the real world people always "get in trouble" for being negligent parents?

Unless they beat the kid or get unlucky, most shitty parents get off clean and free.

When did Avatar become A World of Perfect Morals: The Show?

>>77385802
I doubt Nick would've allowed stories of her sucking dick and being gangbanged everyday. Why was she such a slut?

>>77389705

They will never understand that cartoon good responsible dad / stupid negligent mom is feminist in the true original meaning of the word.

>>77390948
>Unless they beat the kid or get unlucky, most shitty parents get off clean and free.
Shitty parents are usually pretty miserable themselves. All the time. Alcoholics, on anti-depressants, possibly suicidal. Also they end up dying hated and alone.

>>77391054

Unless they're a man and leave their family to live a care-free life and reclaim their independence. Then they usually die happy.

>>77391014
Well I mean there are different interpretations and different original philosophies. Most just saw female empowerment as a means towards female equality, but there have always been unsavory radicals. It's a shame that the term has become synonymous with the latter, but to be fair that's not entirely the fault of the radicals, but also of the moderate masses who, as Malcolm X said, prefer a negative comfort over tension.

>>77390544
>Let me just tell you Korra, doing it when someone is in the avatar state is the best.
>How would you know that?
>You know exactly how I know that.

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Compare Azula's Invasion of Ba Sing Se to Kuvira's invasion of Republic City

Azula
>Attempts a siege, doesn't work
>Switches tactics to use a giant drill, drill is defeated by the Avatar
>Shifts over to inflitration, and teams up with the secret police of the city to grasp complete control without destroying anything

Kuvira
>Spends half a season developing a super duper awesome spirit cannon
>Disregards her gigantic military to personally invade Republic City with a giant mech and the ONLY copy of the spirit cannon
>Gives up after the giant mech is destroyed

Were these shows really written by the same people?

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Toph really was the worst in LoK. Her presence was there because she was something people liked in ATLA so as to pander to people's nostalgia for the old show. But they didn't know what to do with the character, so they tried to write her the same way not stopping to think that being a snarky smartass is cute when you're 10 but when an adult acts likes that it comes across and immature and shitty.

So yeah thanks for ruining Toph LoK.

>>77389340
>>77389293
This.
They really fucked up Toph's development by having no idea what they were doing with her.
I don't find old Swamp Lady Toph to be at all offensive, I think it's a reasonable route for her character to take. She was her independence, she has her freedom, she doesn't have to deal with world affairs or the snootiness of nobility, it's all she ever wanted as a ten-year old. Yet she's alone, her family thinks she's dead and they hate each other, partly due to her poor parenting. Shit makes sense.
However, the show also asks us to believe that by her 30/40s she'd grown up to the point that she was taking the responsibility of running the police department for a bustling modern metropolis. She had become the rules and the authority that so starkly contrasts the freedom she desired as a child. She cared about things like her public perception after SuYin was caught stealing, things both young and old Toph would never give a moment's thought.

Either she grew up and matured, or she didn't. The show doesn't know what it wants and, as a result, wants both.

>>77388892
>>77388856
I'm not mad about their family being somewhat broken
I'm mad because they put it back together so effortlessly
I'm fine with Lin storming out of Zaofu never to return and bitch slapping her sister with some brass knuckles when she crawls back asking for forgiveness

>>77388894
Bryke is ruining them RIGHT NOW
don't you read the comics?

>>77393611
No, since all the comics that aren't about Mai being awesome are shit

>>77393611
None of those characters have been ruined by the comics. They're not nearly as bad as LoK was.

>>77386282
They both had Dave Filoni as well. Filoni helped make Avatar great and helped redeem the prequel trilogy by creating The Clone Wars

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>>77388830

>>77385802
guess she didn't see much action

>>77388601
>preparing to hangout with Aang
not possible

>>77395905
Well, she never expected for his reincarnation to destroy all the past lives.

>>77396125
is this cannon?

>>77396358
Was it ever really resolved in season 4?

>>77396383
i didnt watch the show

>>77391082
How exactly is a lonely man gonna die happy?
There's a reason married men usually live longer than unmarried or divorced men.

>>77396438
It's canon that the past lives got destroyed for good. But wether or not Korra is to blame is debatable. She went into a fight and lost that fight resulting in the villain killing off the past lives.

>>77396489
did she lose in the avatar state?

>>77396533
Yes, but the villain also had Avatar state (which should be weaker according to ATLA because it didn't have past lives).

>>77396574
The past live just allow experience, the avatar state is still raw power.

>>77396652
I know, but experience means alot when you're fighting someone. With 10k years of experience there should be almost no situation the avatar hasn't been in. And thats not taking into account all the different styles and pretty much complete knowledge of bending that it brings aswell.
Essentially Korras Avatar state should make you a great fighter regardless of your own abilities and it gives you a power boost.
Unalaqs is just a power boost.

>>77392777

Azula was just great at what she did.

>>77396489
>wether or not Korra is to blame is debatable
no, it's not. She is.
She liberated Vaatu. She lost the fight. She basically gave Unalaq a power weaker than what she has (avatar power -past lives experience -3 elements) and still lost due to incompetence.

>>77396652
raw power minus three elements.

>>77398035
>at what she did.
at being evil?

>>77392777
Korra: U JUST INVADED REPUBLIC CITY BECAUSE OF MOMMY ISSUES

Kuvira: NO

Korra: YES

Kuvira: K

>>77389292
earthbenders as toph eventually learnt how to bend sand.

>>77401065

No at following orders.

>>77403313
and those orders were to be evil

>>77404198

Then that's not really evil.

>>77404519
except like you said shes good at it

>>77404619

She isn't evil though, she is being forced to do it because her father is manipulating her mind.

>>77404678
she wasn't actually forced
and regardless of her reasoning she is still evil

>>77404706

Adolescents cannot be deemed evil until they reach adulthood. Azula has a lot more to go through before anyone can say she is evil.

>>77404758
they can be deemed evil actually
you are thinking of psychotic
which is funny how you jumped to the conclusion that she was a psycho without anyone bringing that up

>>77404782

What the hell are you trying to imply from that? Azula doesn't know right from wrong, she only understands might is right. If given the choice she will choose good over evil which we will see in the next comic.

>>77404834
it doesnt make the things she did not evil
its just an excuse

>>77404861

The discussion is whether she is evil or not. Just because she did a few bad things doesn't mean she really wanted to do with them. We have to take into account what she is feeling at the time.

>>77404834
>Azula doesn't know right from wrong
Ergo, psychotic.

>>77404903
azula never implied that she didn't enjoy it though

>>77404706

May I ask what exactly Azula did that makes her evil?

>>77405011
everything in the series

>>77404954
>>77404976

But she was never taught what is right, therefore that is debunked.

>>77405042
except what she did was still evil
its still just an excuse

>>77405054

Again, just because she did "evil" things, doesn't mean the motive behind them were evil. That's why we investigate motives behind crimes and such.

>>77405054
Just shut the fuck up, dude, this is a fight none of us can win.

>>77405019

So when she had her servants brush her hair, that was evil?

>>77405093
>That's why we investigate motives behind crimes and such.
actually its so we can tie them to the crimes easier

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>>77388580

>>77405042
>But she was never taught what is right
Psychosis is more a psychiatric condition tho desu sempai, which means upbringing would only do so much before she actually has a break with reality and starts zapping everyone around her just to quell the stress caused by her delusions.

>>77405156

If there was a good enough motive the charge is lessened or even dropped hence self defense and such.

>>77405210

There is nothing to support that claim.

>>77405224
>>There is nothing to support that claim.
there is nothing to support any of yours either

>>77405239

Except I have bryke's storytelling on my side. If Kuvira which was supposed to be Hitler can change so can Azula

>>77405105
Her servants were evil, and they were using an evil hairbrush.

>>77405304
>wanting Azula undergo the Kuvira treatment
you'd rather Azula's character be assassinated in a one-minute-long talk fu than admit you're in the wrong?

>>77405898

Hey they wrote both series. I have no control over that.

>>77405898
he admitted he uses azula as a self insert before so dont take anything he says seriously

>>77392777
>>77402205
>azula
>Dai Li listens to her for no reason
>Aang spends a fuckton of time charging the Avatar State despite using it instantly against Ozai

>implying Azula accomplished that on her merit and not the plot bending over backwards for her

>>77400964
>She liberated Vaatu
Not knowingly or willingly. First she was tricked into opening a portal, then she was forced to.

>She lost the fight
Yes she did, but it could also be that Unalaq got lucky or was just better (somehow).

You wouldn't normally blame someone for something they don't control. And it is far from certain that Korra should have acted differently than she did.

>>77385860
It doesn't make sense that they added her in. Didn't Katara say that everyone was dead and that she was the only one left that was part of the original series?

>>77404782
>they can be deemed evil actually
not him, but where i live they can't. They only need to be 'reeducated'.

>>77408377
>Not knowingly or willingly
the second time she could just Not open the portal.

>was just better
1 element. No past lives. Korra is just incompetent.

>You wouldn't normally blame someone for something they don't control
if they are imprudent, you can. Korra should never even go to the spirit world before harmonic convergence. She shouldn't condemn the entire planet to see if Unalaq is kind enough to let Jinora go. She is just retarded.

>>77388662

Because you're an edgy moron.

>>77395070
Giancarlo Volpe also was a reason ATLA was good.

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>>77408166
>>Dai Li listens to her for no reason

They saw that she was a strong alpha leader, and backstabed the Earth Kingdon. Its kind of simple.

>>77388190
It's too bad she never acts like she was one. She pretty much tells Lin to get over everything that has happened to her because of the shit that went on in their family. And that's it, Lin doesn't do anything and doesn't get closure for her character but HAHAH, THAT TOPH AMIRITE?! Seriously, fuck the writing in Korra.

>>77408166
>Dai Li listens to her for no reason
my headcanon is that she offered sexual favors. She domesticated them.

>>77408166
Or how Sokka and Aang gave her complete clearance to meet the Earth King and conveniently left before they could blow her cover.

>>77385802
Toph did, Korra writers didn't

>>77410802
>the second time she could just Not open the portal.
Well yes and no. It's true she could have not opened the portal, but to do that she would have had to let a child die and would probably have been captured herself afterwards. To be a "good" person you can't willingly let others die if you can try to prevent it.

>1 element. No past lives. Korra is just incompetent.
Or Unalaq got in a lucky shot. Or Unalaq was just a way better bender than Korra (who never seemed to be able to utilize the past lives in book 2).

>She is just retarded.
It was out of her control wether or not Vaatu was released and able to give Unalaq powers. She might not be the smartest person or maybe she is gullible, but i would hardly blame her for Unalaqs actions and intents. Especially because her intents were to help the world not harm it. (Doesn't justify keeping the portals open however, that was so bad i can only blame it on the writers).

>>77408166
Dai Li was corrupt as fuck, they were only in it for power and the ability to pummel the Earth Plebians.

Azula the Crown Princess of the Rape Nation comes in and offers them even more power. Now they can pummel Earth, Air, Water, and Fire plebians, and have even more power. Instead of being the elite vanguard for some shitty city, they're the elite vanguard for the world.

No shit they sided with her.