Are sommeliers just bullshiters or what?

>>7573226
I don't know. But it seems reasonable that certain types of flavours would pair well with others.

>>7573226

they literally pour $2 oak creek into fancy bottles and sell it as top shelf

What I've recently learned from Mario Batali is that when you drink a wine, say whatever flavor it reminds you of. If it tastes like that, then that's what it is to you. There shouldn't be any snootiness to it.

That said, some wines pair very well with other foods. They complement each other.

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>>7573226
What is Franzia Sunset Blush, because it's literally the best wine of all time?

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It's much easier to bullshit an idiot.

>pic related. it's a bold red that stimulates the palate

No, but that table is full of it, no real Sommelier would make such broad statements.

Could you guys just forget about those crappy infographics about wine? They're *all* shit.

>>7573226
Depends. Some types of wines clearly don't fit with certain types of food; red wine & fish, or a dessert wine and something like chicken.

When wine snobs start trying to claim they can separate out "complex" tastes (you know the ones "Oh I'm getting raisins and broccoli and a hint of oak and the air from a tractor tire...") that's roughly 80% bullshit. It's been shown, time and time again, that even professional wine tasters struggle to tell similar wines apart in blind taste tests.

>>7573226
A REAL sommelier pretty much lives wine. There's much more to that job description than just "These cabernets would be good with your steak, sir" 80% of them have a college degree of some sort, 55% being bachelor's. They manage the entire selection of wine the restaurant carries, probably tastes every bottle that gets added, etc.

>>7573226
A good somm maintains a great list. That list ought to have wines that will pair well with everything on the menu, plus bottles that can pair OK with random assortments of dishes on the menu (hence the popularity of Pinot Noir) and still have some values and surprises for the real wine nerds who hit that restaurant.

It's a legit job that requires knowledge, experience, keeping up with the industry and changing tastes, tasting new vintages as they become available, making smart selections to maintain the list, knowing your customers well enough to keep a few off-list selections available and be there in person to assist the punters with their choices. That last one requires a deferential tableside demeanor where you pretty much have to use psychology to read the minds of potentially ignorant but very fussy customers to guide them to pairings they'll be happy with.

In addition to that you have to make sure your list generates a decent profit for the restaurant while still maintaining a selection of prestige bottles, many of which are likely to outlive the restaurant itself.

Is it a fluffy job? Compared to a line cook it is. But you do have to know your wine, your customers and (if you want to be successful) be able to maintain a list that's not just profitable for the restaurant, but part of why people choose your restaurant over competitors.

>>7573718

>hey jim make sure you push the cabernets we got them really cheap
>no problem boss

>>7574228
You're underage, right?

>>7574261

You're in denial right?

It;s a fucking business and in the end the only thing that matters is making money. They are going to mark up the bottles 500-1000% and they are going to suck your dick and tell you about how you are such a beautiful rich smart guy that deserves such good wine and you will buy it with a smile on your stupid fucking face while they count the money.

>muh restaurant treats me so good
>muh sommelier is so educated
>muh wine pairings were perfect no other wine would have been as good as that wine

>>7573226

No, but their opinions are completely irrelevant for someone who doesn't drink whine often.

No whine goes best with whatever I eat.

>>7574291
I'm not even going to bother to read that post because I know you're most likely some 16 year old who hasn't ever drank wine. It just makes me laugh that people in this board get downright furious if you tell them Coke and Pepsi taste the same, but no, wine ALL tastes EXACTLY the same and anyone saying otherwise is an idiot tricked by advertising.

>>7574307

want to know what the best pairing is with your meal nigger? water.

drink the booze before or after the meal (whatever the fuck you want) and drink water with the fucking meal instead of trying to find a wine that doesn't mouth rape you.

>>7574291

You're underage and a fucking retard, right?
Right.

>>7574321
Have you never been told that you shouldn't talk about things you know nothing about? Already gave enough (You)s in this thread in any case

>>7574327

please explain how drinking whatever your favorite bottle of wine is while you prepare a meal and then having the meal with water is in any way inferior to drinking a bottle of wine with the same meal

i would love to be educated

>>7574291
A good somm usually marks up bottles 400% above the wholesale price. Part of the challenge is finding wines that are under valued enough to not seem outrageous at that level of markup. If the meat and potatoes of your list is bottles you sell for $40-$120 you're spending a lot of time looking for exceptional wines that would retail in the $15-$40 range.

But a really good somm uses the list to subsidize a few values on the list that real wine lovers will appreciate. The other day I was out to dinner and spotted an oddball favorite of mine on the list, Massaya le Columbier from Lebanon. This is a bottle that retails for $15, but obviously a fave of the somm, because it was on the list for $26, well below the standard markup. I showed my appreciation by ordering two bottles, and was not the only table doing so. If you make your customers feel like you're giving them a break they'll show their appreciation, and you'll still make money.

>>7574342

http://www.wine-searcher.com/find/massaya+cls+le+colombier+rouge+bekaa+valley+lebanon

$10.

Still nearly a 300% markup. What a great deal should have gotten another bottle.

>>7574354
Point is you expect a bottle to be marked up 400%. The rule of thumb for by the glass wines is that the price of a glass is the wholesale price of the bottle. Anyone who knows wine knows that.

As I said, a big part of the challenge is finding bottles that are so good they won't seem overpriced at that kind of markup. Offering something interesting for less than standard markup shows you give a shit about customers who are into wine.

And yeah, if you give me a break on standard markup I will be much more likely to order a second bottle.

>>7574379

>i expect to get raped by over 400%
>if i only get raped by 350% it shows they care
>it just tastes better if you have a servant bring it to your table than if you open the bottle yourself at home

>>7573226
More like somali gays amirite?

>>7574409

26 is 260% of 10.

>>7574419

>they paid 10

even i can get a discount buying 4 or 5 bottles jesus i bet they get that shit for nothing buying as much as they do

a study has shown they couldn't even determine when they were drinking the same wine after being told it was different

in fact in a side by side comparison between a white wine and the same white wine with red coloring added, they thought they were drinking a red

>>7574419
But that's retail. And the actual retail number is more like $11 if you look at the list of retailers. That means the bottle retails for about $7.33. 400% markup on that would be $29.33, rounding up to $30 a bottle. So seeing that bottle on the list for $26 is indeed giving the customer a break.

Finding an interesting bottle that pairs well with the food you serve, then giving the customer a break on it is a sign the guy doing the list really gives a shit. That, combined with good food and service means it's a place I recommend to people. And I tell them about the wine, because it's off list, making it even more special.

>>7574435
I have read those studies, and yeah, it shows that somms are FAR from 100% accurate.

They are, however, more accurate than random chance.

>>7574435
Then these fucks haven't been trained in wine in any way, probably amerifats or some cucks pretending to be somelier. If you can taste blindly what you are drinking your are a complete niglet that belongs in the hands of boko haram.

>>7574307
>wine ALL tastes EXACTLY the same and anyone saying otherwise is an idiot tricked by advertising.

Confirmed for troll. Please disregard.

>>7574460

They white whine with food coloring experiment was performed with French Oenology students.

>>7574228
Anywhere that's paying a sommelier has customers that:
Order from the left side of the menu.

And managers that:
Mark up the wine so that it doesn't matter what a customer orders.

>>7573226

yes

>>7574228
Kek