Capitalism made America great, not Socialism.

>>1104741
capitalism is a double edged sword my friend.
see the 1940s & 2008

>>1104741
socialism can work but only when the society is homogeneous

see: 50's argentina, the scandi countries, germany pre WW1

>>1104741

What made America great was unity and nationalism.

Not people giving away our jobs and charitable organizations going to OTHER countries when we have poor here.

>>1104741
Socialists suck eachother off and exist the tax payer to fund it. Fags.

>>1104741

Other than the roads, the education, the postal service, legal regulatory oversight of needed goods and services like electricity/water, cities subsidizing rural areas with the rural utilities commission, mortgage interest deductions subsidizing big house loans, and FHA subsidizing mortgages in general so that you only need 3% instead of 20%,

what did socialism ever do for us?

>>>/pol/

Can these fucking threads stay there please?

Reminder that buttblasted apologistfags are only creating these shitposts because people are finally starting to realize the inherent structural problems in our current system.

>>1104741

Actually killing and abusing people made America great.

> stolen land
> 200 years free labor

>>1104991
>Stolen land

When will this meme end? It was conquered and some of it was sold.

>>1104974

> what did socialism ever do for us?

Ended child labor
Ended poor work conditions
Ended overtime without extra pay
Gave workers breaks during a workday

But hey no big deal right?

>>1104992

> conquered

yeah they conquered the shit out of the native americans and then forced them off their land at gunpoint.

Me and Jamall are off to go conquer a liquor store later.

>>1104992
I'll be sure to cute this post when I tell the judge I was "conquering" from my investors.

Why do preople think ancient colonialism and slavery are arguments against capitalism? I don't understand.

>>1104997
>forced them off their land

Yes that is conquest, correct. It is how literally every country came to be. Do you think people were just born on pieces of land thousands of years ago and stayed there in their communities?

It's not like they even had an organized government. It was just various tribes scattered around.

>>1104999
It was a different time. What can be done several centuries ago is not accepted anymore. Are you this stupid?

>>1104993
Not until capitalism did it first

>>1105002
That's a weird way to spell labor unions.

>>1104741
>it's either black or white
Why must politicalfags do this? Without captialism we'd be poor, without unions we'd be working 15 hour days six days a week.

>>1105000
>I don't understand.

Probably because you're a stupid faggot.

>>1105005
>Why must politicalfags do this?
As an academic politicalfag, it seems to me people prefer simple narratives to complex realities.

>>1104743
Capitalism didn't cause 2008. Government did... through various agencies.

1929 was caused by federal reserve policies followed by tightening of monetary policy as well as tightening of trade due to international tensions.

>>1104743
Retard

>>1105088
10/10, quality rebuttal

>>1104741

If capitalism made America great, what will make America great again?

>>1104974
Capitalism...
>steel
>electricity
>gasoline
>the car
>the personal computer
...To name a few. But yes, 17% cheaper downpayments are the crux of civilization. Fuck off, Bernie

>>1104741
And the sky is blue

>>1104741
Capitalism is a system that helps the winners. Socialism is a system that helps the losers. Which one do you want to live in?

>>1104741
Imperialism made europe great and then democracy made europe great again

>>1105107
progress my friend, nothing less nothing more; give it the name you want but keep moving forward

>>1104741
And it certainly had nothing to do with having the world's largest supply of natural resources. :^)

>>1105094
Somebody already said it so I don't have to

>>1105119
The former because I'm a winner :^)

>>1105119
>poor people dont have electricity or telephones

>>1105122
Or having shitloads of high quality farmland and alliances with the other most-advanced countries in the world, virtually uncontested domination of the world's oceans, not having just lost like 20% of your best men to a brutal land war, etc. Nothing to do with that at all I'm sure.

>>1105083
This. They MADE banks accept those shitty loans because the government wanted everyone to live the "American Dream" and own a house.

Also, fuck the movie the big short. Hollywood liberal propaganda BS.

>>1105122
>And it certainly had nothing to do with having the world's largest supply of natural resources. :^)

There's plenty of countries with a lot of natural resources.

Venezuela has a shit ton of oil and yet they are a socialist disaster with 50% inflation and weekly riots.

>>1105520
>hurr let me place trade embargoes on you and launch CIA subversion campaigns of your society for decades so I can tell you it's all your fault

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Wrong OP capitalism has made the world great.

Every man is, no doubt, by nature, first and principally recommended to his own care; and as he is fitter to take care of himself than of any other person, it is fit and right that it should be so.
-Adam Smiss

>>1105517
> they MADE people accept those shitty loans

Oh for fuck sake. How young are you? You must be too young to remember the ENDLESS volume of commercials BEGGING people to apply for a home loan. You must be too young to remember the late night infomercials showing everyday Americans how to get rich quick by flipping homes.

But even if you're that young, how do you justify Moody's, Standard & Poor, and Fitch Group all rating EVERY SINGLE subprime mortgage MBS a AAA+ rating?

The 2008 housing collapse and subsequent recession was not unlike a great neighborhood becoming a crack cocaine infested neighborhood.

Yes, the crack heads are to blame. Yes, borrowers should have known better.

But the crack dealers are also to blame. And so were the shady lenders trying to boost sales.

And so are the lazy cops who look the other way. And so were the big 3 credit rating agencies.

>>1105537
And don't forget those other great things we have that can only be attributed to capitalism and nothing else:
>that warm fuzzy feeling when you hold your gf's hand
>grandma's homemade cookies
>butterflies
>the smell of fresh mountain air
>beautiful sunsets

Capitalism truly is great.

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>>1105548

The warm Fuzzies
are the reason capitalism exists. Most of Adam Smiths rationale for the existence of the invisible hand is the desire to be loved and to be lovely.


Be amiable and be meritorious; that is, to deserve love and to deserve reward, are the great characters of virtue; and to be odious and punishable, of vice. But all these characters have an immediate reference to the sentiments of others. Virtue is not said to be amiable, or to be meritorious, because it is the object of its own love, or of its own gratitude; but because it excites those sentiments in other men. The consciousness that it is the object of such favourable regards, is the source of that inward tranquillity and self-satisfaction with which it is naturally attended, as the suspicion of the contrary gives occasion to the torments of vice. What so great happiness as to be beloved, and to know that we deserve to be beloved? What so great misery as to be hated, and to know that we deserve to be hated?
- Adam Smiss

Love leads to Capitalism

>>1105561
>not getting the joke
>implying you can just point at random things and say they were because of capitalism
Earthquakes? Capitalism.
Ebola? Capitalism.
World hunger? Capitalism.
Chinese nationalism? Capitalism.
Unemployment? Capitalism.
Homelessness? Capitalism.

>>1105593
Telephones? Capitalism
Electricity? Capitalism
Cars? Capitalism
Personal computers? Capitalism
Etc

>>1105524
>it's always le everyone's fault
>It's da west capitalists, it's da richfags, it's da JOOOSSS

This kind of mentality is EXACTLY why these places are absolutely fucked despite having enough natural resources to sustain their entire country without issue and then some.

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>>1105623
Space travel? Socialism.
Modern medical practices? Socialism.
Holidays? Socialism.
The personal automobile? Socialism.
Running water and utilities for everyone? Socialism.
The middle class? Socialism.

We can do this all day.

>>1104993
>Ended child labor

I never understood this. Are you guys under the impression that before the industrial revelation kids got to run around having fun? Before that age 92% - 98% of the population were farmers. Kids who could walk were probably expected to work sunrise to sunset just like the adults. How are the conditions in a factory during the 1800s any worse than backbreaking farm work?

It wasn't capitalism that made the world great. Most countries around the world aren't market economies. What made the world a better place was science. Most of the innovation behind science was ignored by capitalism. But of course the retarded economic theologians want to say it was them when in reality they are teh reason why two world wars were fought. Also capitalism is dead. China made sure of that. They have pseudo-capitalism and they're raping the market.

>>1105623
>telephones
>electriciy
>cars
>personal computers
socialist tried to give you all of those things for free.
And don't say 'capitalists did it better' because I counted three linux fags on this board and I bet you had an erection for Nikola Tesla once in your profit-driven life

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>>1105083
>the gooberment did it because...... agencies

we will crash again and again when banks are allowed to gamble with other peoples money and hand out fraud loans

fraud loans as in when several financial institutions were discovered (never tried of course) to hand out mortgages and loans that they knew could not be paid of and then bet on their failure(have you seen the commercials for rocket mortgage?)
>>1105629
he's being historically correct the c.i.a tanked several countries' economies through high interest loans; if I remember right both peru and nigeria are examples of this.


itt: people defending criminals who screwed them

>>1105083
"Everything is always government's fault" squealed the party of personal responsibility.

>>1105645
I dont think you understand what socialism is. Socialism isnt just "anything the governent does." Even capitalist countries need laws and public programs. This is not socialism

>>1106503
If I can attribute random things to capitalism, why can't I also attribute them to socialism? After all, socialism ended WWII.

>>1105548
>tfw love capitalism
>tfw no gf
bring on communism, comrades. i need gf

>>1105684
>What made the world a better place was science. Most of the innovation behind science was ignored by capitalism. But of course the retarded economic theologians want to say it was them when in reality they are teh reason why two world wars were fought. Also capitalism is dead. China made sure of that. They have pseudo-capitalism and they're raping the market.
This

>>1105664

> Family oriented farm labor
Son, pick some vegetables for a few hours then have lunch, then afterwards put some shoes on the horses. That's it for the day. Take breaks as you need them.

> factory
show up at 6am. You'll leave when I say so. No breaks.

You really don't think there was a difference?

>>1105074
Beautiful. It amazes me to see people thinking a moment before posting.

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>>1105538
>Be Moody's
>Recommend subprime CDOs at an AAA+ rating, what could go wrong?
>Everything goes wrong
>US does some deficit spending to stop the hemorrhaging
>Lower US's bond rating to AA+ for their careless decisions
>Problem?

>>1104741
Imperialism made America great, not capitalism.

>>1106626
Imperialism is what brought all these people out of poverty. Science is what made sure we don't return to poverty. Capitalism is a dead ideology like Communism. Authoritarian government run by engineers and scientists will be the next evolution for humanity. This is how most Asian economies are with the exception of the Southeast nation like Nam, and the Philippines

>>1106629
"brave new world" go to sleep.

Capitalism did make America great... but with protectionism.

protectionism -> (develop economy) -> free market

This is why when America tries to force up third world countries to open their markets, it's actually NOT benefiting those countries. You know how the Asian Tigers were able to do so well? They spent decades building up a protected economy before accepting free market principles.

This is also why China is going to continue to absolutely dominate. They're growing massively under state capitalism. Just imagine what it will be like when they become a developed economy.

>>1106667
this is so clear.
where are you from m8?
I'm sick of these free trade agreements and people celebrating it while deep inside we are just being cucked.

>>1106667
>They spent decades building up a protected economy before accepting free market principles.

Wrong.

>This is also why China is going to continue to absolutely dominate.

China's economy is fucked and everyone with money there is desperately buying asset wealth in real estate across the globe. Their corrupt system is falling down around them.

>>1106515
You can do whatever you want. Fact of the matter is, JP Morgan brought electricity to the everyman to turn a profit. Ford did the same with the "car for every American". You have these things only because someone saw opportunity to profit to bring them to you.

And the space shuttle is built by hundreds of private contractors, paid by the government.
>paid

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If you dont know the story behind this picture, you can no longer post ITT

>>1105108
> steel
supported by slave labor

> electricity
Are you smoking some dank weed or something? Electricity is extremely regulated it is anything but capitalism, the time it was deregulated in California you had orchestrated blackouts in the state in order to jack the price of electricity.

> gasoline, the car
which wouldn't have a market if it weren't for socialism because you know... roads

>the personal computer
guess who subsidized the r&d for miniaturization of transistors, microchips and microprocessors. god damn it was the state.

thats what you call socialized democracy

>>1106723
You act like any form of government spending is socialism. It's not.

See: >>1106720

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>>1106720
>hurr let me compare the Soviet Union in their equivalent to our great depression to a time when when we were in an economic boom
Spotted the retard that doesn't know history. At least they didn't have a large percentage of their population fucking living in dirt and tents, hopelessly begging for food.

>>1105001
> Do you think people just stayed where they were born for ages

Africa
Asia
Europe

>>1106736
>Safeway disappears during economic downturns
>grocery stores magically appear in countries without free markets

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>>1106751
>bleep bloop
>economic depression does not compute in Randroid brain

>>1106759
The entire existence of the Soviet Union was an economic downturn, much worse than our one depression that lasted 10 years in our 250 year history.

What you don't understand about that picture is that Yeltsin actually thought the grocery store had been staged for his visit, since he had never seen any such easy access to food in his entire life in a socialist country.

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>>1106765
>hurr durr let me just ignore almost all of the Soviet Union's history except for this one little bit that I happen to like
Just stop. History isn't something that you can just rewrite to your will. During the entire cold war everyone in the US was afraid that Soviet technology and quality of life was far and away superior to our own. It was only during their final years of economic depression that views like yours began to spread. Of course you're too young to remember that.

>>1106727
> hurr durr let me censor them will teach them about capitalism

Things don't exist in a vacuum and markets aren't always the answer to everything because there are people who are unable or unwilling to contribute to the economy those who don't have the education, the health, the ability, the money, There are always people who need help one way or another.

That is why electricity is heavily regulated and it can never be a free market economy because that would mean prices would become extremely affordable and that is why electricity market is regulated in every country on earth.

Agriculture in the USA specially is far from capitalism as it could get, all risk has been subsidized by the government with crop insurance, flood insurance, subsidies and more subsidies, food stamps are not a form of welfare to the poor, they are corporate welfare to farmers and the food industry because they buy crops from the farmers, us aid is a form of corporate welfare for the farmers and food industry also because they buy up crops from these farmers. Yet these farmers are the autistic cucks who stand up and say we are independent we want less guberment.

>>1106778
Are you seriously arguing for big government cronyism that brought us giants like Monsanto and drove the small farmer out of business? Wew lad I thought I'd heard it all from you Berniecucks

>>1106775
>Soviet quality of life was superior to the U.S. during the cold war
Well, now I have heard it all.

>>1106783
IDK but workers on the west had good living conditions because their countries implanted policies to compete with the Soviet union.

>>1106781
Quit vomiting out your bullshit. The reason for that is a phenomenon known as regulatory capture where large businesses become so big and powerful that they then begin to start influencing regulation to their own advantage. Meanwhile people like you are exacerbating the problem with your Citizens United "corporations are people" bullshit.

>>1106783
>waaaa the historical record doesn't agree with my worldview

>>1106788
Please show us all the statistics that say your average Soviet-era Russian citizen led a better life than his American counterpart.
Protip, Ivan: you cant

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>>1106835
Comparable to the US, except for their later economic depression. Not bad considering they originally started out as a third world shithole of farmer peasants who knew nothing in life other than working the ground. Their switch in economic systems improved their lives considerably.

>>1106845
>Russians died 5 years younger than Americans
I don't think you understand what "better" means

>>1106852
Nigga, if you were born in rural Africa and died in a fully industrialized first world country, that would be a fucking miracle. Their net gain in life expectancy far outpaced what the US experienced.

>>1104744
In a perfect world, socialism would work.. But good luck with that.

>>1106857
>Please show us all the statistics that say your average Soviet-era Russian citizen led a better life than his American counterpart.
>Protip, Ivan: you cant

>>1105481
Well, I'm a winner.
I think you know my answer, loser.

Winners are the backbone of this country. Losers are the organs.

>>1106869
Replied to the wrong post. Whatever, the point is moot.

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>>1106863
>moving the goalposts because you've been thoroughly BTFO
Also notice how life expectancy went down sharply under capitalist reforms.

Here's some more pictures for your consideration.

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>>1106863

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>>1106863
.

>>1106877
>>1106879
>>1106884
Those straws are slipping away, Vladimir. Grasp stronger, comrade

>>1106863
Mentally they did, since they knew they would be cared for in the best way possible (even though it was still shitty) from cradle to the grave. Mental health problems were really rare in the USSR, becoming widespread after the collapse. Communism came too soon, we need to go post-scarcity first with fusion power or giant space solar collectors.

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>>1106863
Adjusted for the size of their population, they put out many more scientific and technological advancements than the US.

Hell, in my mechanical engineering coursework, all of my textbooks were filled with references to forumulas and other discoveries from Soviet scientists. They truly led the world in engineering.
>Galerkin's Method
>Chvorinov's rule
There's nothing comparable from western researchers.

>>1106888
Unless you spoke out against the state or expressed free will or religious beliefs. To the gulag!

>>1106892
We arent talking about number of scientists, Ivan.

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>>1106906
>Unless you spoke out against the state or expressed free will or religious beliefs. To the gulag!
Nice selective memory there, faggot.

>We arent talking about number of scientists, Ivan.
No, scientific discoveries. As in the things that make possible your ungrateful modern life possible. Fuck, finite element analysis is used for everything. If Galerkin hadn't thought of it we'd still be using 1950's tier airplanes, cars, and buildings.

>>1106912
10 people held on contempt charges doesnt compare to thousands left in brutal labor camps to die of starvation.

All memeing aside, i know you guys are just being edgy, but you should go meet some real Russians who were around for the Soviet days. I used to work with a crew of ex-Russians who had stories about how awful life was under soviet rule. You basically never had enough and everyone made it by forming black markets where they would trade amongst each other for basic luxuries like razors, alcohol, cigarettes, western shoes, etc. So in the end they created their own form of calitalism to survive the socialism, I suppose. In sure there are stories you can read if you cant meet any real life first hand accounts

>>1106919
Yes the Soviet Union is an extreme case, but my point is that this >>1106720 is a bullshit argument for the reasons that I've described. You can't cherrypick history like that.

>>1106925
It's just a thing that happened. Yeltsin legitimately thought the store had been staged, since he had never seen an American grocery store. Imagine never seeing a grocery store like we are used to. It's parts of our everyday lives like this that we take for granted, while many in this world never get to experience them

>>1104744
socialism can only work globally with heavy automation

>>1106775
>History isn't something that you can just rewrite to your will. During the entire cold war everyone in the US was afraid that Soviet technology and quality of life was far and away superior to our own.

But it wasn't at all

It was magnitudes worse and outcome of soviet bullshit is prevalent to these days you fag

T. poor slav

>>1106781
No, he's just pointing out what a hypocrite many "independent" businessmen really all, with a government teat in one side of their mouth and bloviating Randisms from the other.

>>1106987
even if it works in this case, it still makes the world worse

equal distribution of goods, or even favorable distribution of goods to stupid people just breeds more stupid people, which reduces whatever capacity we have to maintain automation, or reduces surplus capital to reinvest.

there is literally, never, ever, a good reason for socialism. we'd be feeding 80 iq african peasants who can't stop killing each other instead of building mars rockets.

there's literally no reason to do this.

>>1106778
>That is why electricity is heavily regulated and it can never be a free market economy because that would mean prices would become extremely affordable and that is why electricity market is regulated in every country on earth.

This isn't true at all, the industry is heavily regulated because of the dangers of having no electricity in certain areas.

Also I don't know what backwards part of the US that you live in but the area I'm located at has different companies that generate, transmit and distribute electricity. It's not a pure free market but not a fully regulated market either.

>>1106723
>Orchestrated black outs
Enron was the only one, have your (you)

>>1106759
funny thing is, seattle still has a huge homeless encampment

>>1107077

underage b&

>>1104997

>me and Jamall

Jamall and I*

>>1106775
>Soviet technology and quality of life was far and away superior to our own

their country was literally so fucking shit that something as basic as a grocery store with actual food in it shocked them all

socialism fucking sucks dick dude why do you think the USSR failed

>>1105083
>heavily regulated period between 40s and turn of the century where no significant financial crisis springs up
>repeal of Glass-Steagall and Interstate Banking
>biggest financial industry meltdown since Great Depression

Yeh, dat damn gubmint and dem agencies, how dare they

>>1106688
>everyone with money there is looking to buy asset wealth real estate around the globe

Any economy with a significantly positive balance of trade will have that feature, dum-dum

E.g.: Mitsubishi buying Rockefeller Center

>>1108103
>here, let me just spout memes instead
I hope you thank a Soviet engineer when you start your car to drive to work tomorrow morning. Without their discoveries that modern car would have been impossible to design and manufacture.

>>1106765
>most backward country in all of Europe and possibly Asia, filled only with podunk peasants and inbred royalty
>becomes world superpower after just a couple decades
>"permanent economic depression"

Just stop, this is embarassing

>>1108115
It's not fucking memes dude. The countries were shit to live in. That's why everybody wanted to leave.

You are a piece of shit commie sympathizer. My grandparents didn't escape Hungary in the 1950s because the soviets were giving away free candy, they left because they fucking ruined every country they took over.

Go ask anybody who actually lived in the USSR, it fucking sucked dick.

>>1108115
>>1108119
>Berniecucks actually think Soviet Russia was a nice place to live

Hahahahaha no wonder Shillary is BTFOing you guys so hard

>>1108120
And are those countries now suddenly gleaming modern utopias under capitalism? No? I didn't think so.

If anything they've declined since their privatization. Your argument is invalid so shut the fuck up.

>>1108126
Those people held referendums and voted for free markets by overwhelming margins because socialism was such shit to the everyday man

>>1108125
>y-you B-Bernie cucks!
>h-ha, I posted it again mom!

>>1108127
And by how much has life improved since then?

>>1108126
>your argument is invalid hurr

Sure they had smart scientists but that doesn't mean it wasn't shit to live in. People were literally running away from East Germany, they ran away from Hungary, they ran away from Cuba, the list goes on.

They ran away because it sucked dick. I don't see anybody running away from the US, they're all trying to get in here..maybe we are doing something right.

Shut up you privileged piece of shit useful idiot. Your opinion is fucking worthless. You never lived under socialism.

>>1108120
Funny, if life in the USSR sucked so much, the Russians must really hate their past

I do wonder why so many of them vote communist though

>>1108135
Whoever does not miss the Soviet Union has no heart. Whoever wants it back has no brain.

- Putin

>>1108133
>no one emigrated from America ever

Look at that, shill trying to argue based on emotions with no facts!

>>1108139
Yes, and I'm sure you must've carefully dissected exactly what Putin meant by that quote

>>1108131
By a fucking lot. What are you even talking about? You obviously have never spoken to anyone from a country where the socialists were in power. They talk about it like they barely escaped with their lives. This has to be a troll there is no way you think socialism is good. Go talk to people outside your womens studies classes and read something other than Slate for your economic knowledge. Good grief

>>1108140
>facts

The facts are that the USSR was so dogshit it collapsed as did almost every other socialist country, the facts are that quality of life was medieval peasant tier

just look at north korea vs south korea

there's your "facts"

Nobody can be this fucking stupid. Congrats on being a le epic troll.

>>1108144
He's a sad troll.

>>1108145
Ah yes, lovely South Korea, country with the highest suicide rates in the world. Bedrock of nepotism and governmental corruption. American stooge par excellence

Great place

>>1108127
>>1108133
>hurr, it was another shoah
Funny how life expectancy dropped by seven years under capitalism. >>1106877

Fuck, what better of an example do you need? You have the same country with the same people with the same geopolitical favtors, before capitalism and after capitalism. When controlling for all factors other than economic system, the switch to capitalism worsed everyone's standard of living by a large margin. Your family was simply jumping ship because they wanted to go to an already rich country, not because socialist policies were what was hurting them.

>>1108151
Please, he's probably underage. I mean, you have to be to keep believing le ebin evul commy making hell on erf real, now stop demanding a living wage and benefits maymays

>>1108150
>>1108151
>>1108154
>look at me mommy I'm playing devils advocate on the internet

How's highschool lad

>>1108157
Life expectancy dropped by seven years. What is your response?

>>1108151
>>1108154
>Bernie 2016

>>1108157
>I am so thoroughly brainwashed by Western media that I will contradict hard evidence of a quality of life decrease and call them high-schoolers
>t-that will show them!

>>1108159
Life expectancy in Russia is currently 70 and has been in the high 60s for almost a decade. Nice cherry picked chart

>>1108159
>>1108161
The USSR collapsed, North Korea is STILL an oppressive shithole, the socialist countries that are still standing are extremely poor favela shitholes(Venezuela&Cuba), people were literally fleeing Cuba by boat, East Germany by jumping over walls, the supermarkets were so shit that when they came to the US they thought it was fake, they threw political dissidents into gulags, they purged millions, and had to put up walls to keep their own citizens from running out of their shithole of a country.

And the life expectancy in the US is 78, compared to Russia's 70. South Korea's is 81 compared to North Korea's 69.

What is your response?

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>>1108164
Well these are the official numbers you faggot. Not sure what you're complaining about.

>>1108168
My response is that you can't compare across national borders because of genetic and lifestyle differences. You have a clear before and after. Why are you so butthurt that you can't accept that?

>>1108172
>no real argument

I see high school is going well.

Would you like to live in Cuba? If communism is so great why don't you go live there? Buy a plane ticket to Florida, get on a boat and fuck off forever please.

>>1108168
My argument was always comparative numbnuts

Compare Russia circa 1915 to USSR pre-collapse. Literal shithole turned into a superpower

>>1108172
>genetic differences

North and South Koreans are literally from the same gene pool.

>>1108175
Shit, I'd be more than okay with living in Cuba if the Americans lifted the embargo. Decent healthcare, good climate, lots of job opportunities if the band are lifted

Or is the crux of your argument lying in "In Cuba you can't buy the new iPhone, hahaha, suck on that socialists!"

>>1108169
>get BTFO
>post the same chart

>>1108178
Also Cuba has a higher life expectancy than the USA

You know, despite being buttfucked by decades of embargoing

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>>1108178
You don't need to wait for the embargo. Do what michael moore did, please just get on a boat and fuck off forever please.

>>1108175
What the fuck are you even talking about? Can you form a coherent argument? I'm arguing raw numerical demographic data while the best you can muster is
>go back to commie land you big mean red

While I wouldn't advocate for something as extreme as Soviet-style communism, it's completely disingenuous to say that a few strategically placed socialist policies wouldn't be good for our overall economic and societal health.

>>1108181
Do you want me to make up different data then? Like what do you expect?

>>1108184
I've already formed arguments you just keep deflecting them with hand waving.

The USSR collapsed, North Korea is STILL an oppressive shithole, the socialist countries that are still standing are extremely poor favela shitholes(Venezuela&Cuba), people were literally fleeing Cuba by boat, East Germany by jumping over walls, the supermarkets were so shit that when they came to the US they thought it was fake, they threw political dissidents into gulags, they purged millions, and had to put up walls to keep their own citizens from running out of their shithole of a country.

And the life expectancy in the US is 78, compared to Russia's 70. South Korea's is 81 compared to North Korea's 69.

What is your response? Respond to me without deflecting or hand waving, or fuck off.

>>1108184
You literally said Soviet Russia was a nice place to live, so nobody is now going to take anything else you say seriously

>>1108183
Michael Moore still lives in the US, what are you even talking about

>>1108184
This whole thing started pretty civil and moderate, but then the edgy commie hunters had to start making it about the USSR and their Cold War era misconceptions about it

Guess that's what you get with the current state of the educational system

>>1108194
Michael Moore went to Cuba by boat, if you love communism so much go there and never come back.

>>1108177
North Korea is modelled after WWII Japanese fascism, not socialism. Nobody is saying we should be more like them.

My point is that you can't make a perfect comparison between the US and the USSR for life expectancy when looking at capitalism vs socialism because of too many confounding variables.

>>1108195
Nah, I'd rather stay and try to make this country a little bit better by acting as a counterpoint to you edgy cucks

>>1108200
>make this country better
>by implementing policies that failed everywhere they were implemented

>>1108196
This also applies to>>1108192

>>1108201
>everything the USSR did was bad, always

8 or 80, a dichotomous view of the world is a clear indicator of intellectual deficiency

>>1108203
>hand waving
>no rebuttal formed yet

>>1108204
>let's keep trying things that failed literally every time maybe this time it will go better

That's a clear indicator of insanity.

>>1108204
Lol no. Thinking Soviet Russia was a nice place to live is a clear indicator of intellectual deficiency

>>1108206
That was a rebuttal you faggot. You're just too asspained to read it.

>>1108206
>every single policy that made a shitty backwards nation of peasants into a world superpower was wrong

See, I had a slight feeling I was dealing with a retard, but now I'm sure. The aversion to empirical evidence that questioned your narrative was a big red flag

>>1108210
>"""rebuttal"""
>>1108211
You literally believe in your head that Soviet Russia was a nice place to live.

You're a retard tbqh.

>>1108216
Hahaha arguing with these clowns is hilarious. I hope they talk like this in real life so everyone can see how retarded Bernie's supporters are

>>1108216
>still unable to understand my main argument

This whole thing is pointless since I'm obviously dealing with an idiot who buys into outdated narratives with a lot of fluff and little substance, and who clearly has zero idea what nuance is.

This country really is headed down the shitter when the uneducated morons suddenly think they've got a right to speak loudly and authoritatively about anything

>>1108222
>literally believing that Soviet Russia was a nice place to live

point and laugh

>>1108222
>suddenly think they've got a right to speak
The Bill of Rights, another thing you dont get in Soviet Russia

>>1108216
>LALALALALALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU
the post

>You literally believe in your head that Soviet Russia was a nice place to live.
Nigga, let's try this one more time, but after that it's a lost cause. We're talking about the net benefit to society here. Was the USSR completely superior to the US in every way? Absolutely not, but they started as a third world shithole while the US was already in a pretty good position around the time of the Russian revolution. They want from a nation of farmer peasants to the world's first spacefaring civilization in only 40 years. Socialist policies improved the quality of life for the average Russian unimaginably so.

So to say that socialist policies are always bad because muh evil commies is flat-out wrong. They were some of the most effective policies that the world has ever seen in terms of economic development and improving quality of life.

>>1108233
Nope. The average Russian was better off before. Going to space and having a giant military has little to no effect on quality of life.

My grandfather spent half a decade in a gulag for being a Christian and being from the wrong town. Explain how the space program helped his life

>>1108233
And btw, you were arguing socialism's merits vs capitalism and how Russian quality of life was better than U.S. quality of life during the cold war

You literally do believe Soviet Russia was a nice place to live

>>1108248
Well for one life expectancy nearly doubled, so there that. >>1106845

Electricity, utilities, education, and automobiles are nice too.

>>1108255
Everyone's life expectancy doubled in the 20th century, moron. It's called modern medicine.

And electricity and personal cars were creations of American capitalism. But you knew that.

>>1108260
Look at the chart, faggot. It Nearly doubled immediately after the revolution.

>And electricity and personal cars were creations of American capitalism. But you knew that.
And none of the peasants had them before then, did they?

>>1108264
And they still didnt after. You really think your average comrade woke up in his 3 bedroom house, kissed his wife and two kids goodbye and drove to work at the office, then stopped by the grocery store to pick up some milk and turnips on the way home. You're delusional

>>1106987
This is the untold argument because the initial point about basic economic principals rejecting socialist concepts in our common era baffles the common socialist.

>>1104747
Nationalism and unity are the more efficient forms of "socialism" created through the people's determination to work and bleed for the greater good of their fellow countrymen... Government created programs to simulate this effect under the guise of "socialism" will never be as effective, instead resulting in a micro form of social devolution.

>>1108276
The data seems to disagree with your propaganda. Keep in mind that you're viewing all this through the bullshit glasses of their arch nemesis. Russia recognized their propaganda bullshit but the US never did.

>>1108260
m8 you better not use cell phones. Is a soviet creation.

>>1106863
It was strong enough to fight and fund a dozen proxy wars, couldn't have been that bad.

>>1108851
No it isn't. Show me the Russian citizen who had a cell phone before Americans did. You big government toolbags act like you would have access to all this technology without free markets

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>>1109764
You'd be surprised how many modern technologies originated in the Soviet Union that corporations over here simply put their grubby little hands on.

>>1109978
>put their grubby little hands on
You mean make them readily available to you and me? Or do you know how to build a cellphone network from scratch? It's telling that a Russian came up with the cellphone, but no Russian citizen ever saw one until Japanese companies brought them to the masses

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>>1110246
Most people in administrative positions had access to them. Keep in mind that it wasn't until the 80's and 90's that regular people in the US could afford mobile phones either, and yet the soviets had access to them in the 50's.

>>1110274
Not even close. There was no cellphone tower network in Russia in the 1950s. Russian civilians did not have access to cellphones in the 1950s. No civilians in any country had cellphones until private companies built massive networks of towers

>>1110274
Btw the first civilian carphone service was carried by Motorola in America in the 40s.

>>1104744
>scandi countries
>Implying their success isn't based off oil wealth
>Implying they're homogenous

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capitalism would never make such a beautiful thing ever. Just because muh programed obsolenscense.

>inb4 free market gave acces to this technology

>>1110349
sweden no oil
denmark negligible oil
norway sea of oil

>>1111469
Denmark is Europes third biggest producer and a net positive country. You're high

>>1104741
>>>/pol/

Fucking /pol/lacks should stay in their shitty containment board ffs

>>1104741
I think I found my new favorite board

>>1104991

> 200 years free labor

Yes America was the first to enslave others.

Dumb fuck.

>>1105538

Bush wanted to make it so minorities could own a home.

> lets get really stupid people to buy homes
> how?
> minorities

>>1110349
They were homogenous when they were good. And only norway has oilbased wealth.

>>1105645

> The middle class? Socialism.

Yes the middle class is complete socialism, just look at The Netherlands. But if you look at the 1950s, that isn't the middle class and is clearly the poor and rich divided.

I mean it's weird that the more social programs rolled out into America, the middle class shrinks. I mean, that's just crazy. Isn't it?

Why work? When I could have 8 babies and smoke crack?

>>1105698

> free

You're correct, no one is paying for that at all. It just comes into thin air with the "atom putter-together/shover-together 3000" that was also made out of thin air. Not sure how, but I'm sure the bible has an answer.

>>1111611
>Clinton
Ftfy

>>1111624

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GkAtUq0OJ68

>>1110274
WE WUZ ALIUM FONE TECHNOLOGY COMRADE

Fuck off. Russians didnt start getting cellphones till very recently. It really doesnt matter what socialist governments create if the people never have access to the technology now, does it?

:^)