Do you believe in God? why or why not

>>733670764
yes. i've seriously seen some shit. That's enough for me

>>733671025
what have you seen?
which god(s)?

>>733670764

i dont. no evidence for it. provide evidence, i will change my mind.

No, because no good reason to.

>>733670764
No, I don't. I can't believe in such a thing. I don't mind if you believe in a god, just don't force to believe. But I'm fine with terrorist attacks in first world countries.

No.
There is absolutely no evidence for a god of any kind.

All of the purposed gods in history are painfully human in their actions and mistakes. All holy texts are filled with immoral commands and contradictions.

The creation of a god or gods is so observable and understandable throughout history as well.

>>733671053
seen some serious paranormal stuff I wasn't even looking for. Like full on ghosts and shit. fuck it i'll green text

i place my faith in mankind, im apathetic to the theology

>>733671314
Even if you started believing in ghosts, why would that make you believe in a god?

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>>733671314

>>733671390
I wouldn't bet on that horse. I don't believe in god, but mankind is worse than any imaginary deity.

>>733670764
I do. Simply because I believe everything is far too complicated to have been made randomly.
I believe in a god that created and watches. Not one who meddles in the affairs of individual lives.

>>733671306
>are filled with immoral commands
morality is relative

>>733671081
>>733671306
>>733671292
>>733671153
how do you think life began?
what happened before the big bang in your opinion?

>>733671390
>i place my faith in mankind

Good luck with that.

>>733671390
Apathy towards religion is a mistake. You should dislike the violent, sexist, homophobic, and irrational views that it creates in people.

Religion is poisonous.

>>733671314
>>733671423

>be me
>be atheist
>be 2005
>go to Blue Ghost tunnel
>don't believe in ghosts
>search tunnel with friend who does
>he says spirits are everywhere
>see nothing
>thisisgay.jpg
>begin leaving
>three girls in front of us doing same thing.
>girls screams
>look over see 10 foot tall totally black shadow looking at all 5 of us
>ohshit.jpg
>remeber that fucking thing from then on

I know what i saw that 4 other people saw too. tried to deny it but can't. if I saw a malicious spirit, i see little reason to deny a god

>>733671553
>how do you think life began?
Dunno. It seems likely that it was basically a chemical reaction.
>What happened before the big bang in your opinion?
I don't even know if that question makes sense.

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>>733670764

>>733671690
No friend
People like you are the mistake

>>733671705
>if I saw a malicious spirit, i see little reason to deny a god
Setting aside the problems with your story, this is dumb. That's like believing in the loch ness monster if bigfoot were discovered.

>>733671553
>what happened before the big

The big bang is the expansion of spacetime. "Before the big bang" isn't a sensible concept.

>>733671553
>what happened before the big bang in your opinion?

i dont know. even physicists dont know. so, thats my final answer.

>>733671553
>what happened before the big bang in your opinion?
Morgan Freeman farted.

>>733670764

I don't know one way or another if there is a creator or not, nor do I know the neature of that creator. Is it a super dimensional scientist experimenting? It is a being who truly loves us? Who knows, and quite frankly, it doesn't matter.

What does matter is that organized religion is a poison that has infected humanity. The gods of human-created religion are petty gods who deserve no worship. And those who would allow the immoral, disgusting religions of the world to continue are complicit, and need to be eradicated just as much as the ideas they infect upon others.

God is unknowable. Religion is degenerate.

>>733671799
I know what i saw, the logic seems to connect with probability. You'll obviously disagree. I've seen less evidence for a Jewish conspiracy millions believe in.

>>733671917
>You'll obviously disagree
Obviously, because it doesn't. How are you getting from spirits to god(s)?

>>733671917
even if what you saw was some sort of spooky spirit... what does that have to do with God?

>>733672117
>>733672128
the existence of spirituality

>>733671706
>>733671832
im not asking what you know. what do you believe. can be stupid or not.

>>733671553
Morality is relative to an extent. There is no culture in the world that thinks murder, rape, or theft is moral. UNLESS it is commanded by a god or done in a god's name.

The whole "morality is relative" bullshit is a cowardly cop out.

How life began is call abiogenesis. Science is still figuring that out. Modern science, real science, hasn't been around very long.

It is a strange argument by the religious to accuse nonbelievers of claiming to have all the answers.
We don't know what happened before the Big Bang or exactly how the first life formed on Earth.

But we do know that there is no type of God. Or at least that there is no evidence of a god and therefore no reason to believe in one.

>>733671690
>grouping all religion under Christianity

>>733672176
Okay. We're right back to loch ness monster and bigfoot. The existence of one bizarre thing doesn't mean that other bizarre things exist.

>>733672176
right, but that doesn't prove anything about the existence of God. That's like seeing a werewolf and saying you have no reason to doubt the existence of Hogwarts.

>>733672210
I believe that life likely started from a series of chemical reactions.
I don't believe that there was a "before" the Big Bang.

>>733671775
and why is that?

It is not the nonbelievers who are bombing concerts. We are not mutilating genitals. We are not depriving people of their rights because of ancient text that contradict themselves. We are not holding back science an societies.
I could go on and on.

>>733672325
>>733672399

Aside from the fact i disagree with you, i'm sensing some real samefag. God and the spirirt world are related.

>>733672582
Can't prove it, but not samefag.

Bigfoot and loch ness monster are both related to cryptozoology.

>>733672210
>what do you believe.

I dont "believe" things. I KNOW things to different degrees of certainty.

I know shit about what happened before the big bang. and so do you.

>>733672582
not samefaging, im >>733672399
>>733672399
>>733672582
it's more that spirituality isn't exclusively part of concept of God. Yes they're related. But it's like how werewolves aren't exclusively part of the Harry Potter series. Their existance wouldn't prove anything about Harry Potter, just that this thing that went into Harry Potter exists. To Prove the existence of Harry Potter, one would require proof of wizardry, Hogwarts etc. Not just an aspect of it that appears in many other things predating the Harry Potter books.

>>733672322
No. I was referring to the Abrahamic religions. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam. That's more than half of the world buddy boy.

And the Hindus beliefs are just as worthless. They are not as bad morally, but still useless in advancing humanity.

Religion is poison.

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>>733672582
>>733672723
Actually, wait, I can prove it.

>>733670764
No. Short answer is I don't believe in magic, but I can elaborate if you want.

>>733672249
>There is no culture in the world that thinks murder, rape, or theft is moral
yeah there are...
>How life began is call abiogenesis
yes thats the term translates to "creating life from non life". There's no evidence for how it happened. 2 major hypothesis but thats about it.
>It is a strange argument by the religious to accuse nonbelievers of claiming to have all the answers.
no one is. im asking what you believe happened.

youre right that theres no concrete evidence for a god/God, but that doesn't mean theres no reason to no believe in one. Belief/faith is personal choice and is based off experiences individuals have. Many people feel there must be something bigger out there to control the laws of universe. Others believe the universe is just a loop.

you basically showed me you dont have opinions and just like to hop the bandwagen with what the meta atheists believe.

>>733672723
not the same thing as God and the spirit world, which are connected, not the same real of science. I explained my position, I don;t need you to believe me.

>>733672811
you shot yourself when you brought up harry potter.

>>733670764
I do, seen some /x/ shit to know
In that note I don't worship God, he's a war god and no fucking thanks

No. Not necessary or likely. No reason to believe.

>>733672914
>not the same thing as God and the spirit world, which are connected
How so? Why can spirits not exist without God existing?
>I explained my position
You've said what it is, not really how you got to it.
>I don;t need you to believe me.
You're free to stop replying at any time.

>>733672914
I was trying to use a simple example, because you're obviously too retarded to understand that seeing a spooky spirit in a cave doesn't equal proof of God.

>>733673045
Then why are you still answering?

>>733673072
try acting like an adult and you'll be treated like one

>>733672840
>Religion is poison.
Hitler wanted to abolish religion. Same with stalin.
>b-but most wars are because of religion
were they? or was religion used an excuse for a corrupt politcal agenda?

most religions, especially the abrahamic ones, gave uncivilized groups of people the foundations of modern morality.
if there is no higher power id argue to progression of mankind is useless. It is better to live as jefferson said, as farmers, where we all own our own land, make our own food etc and not owe anyone anything.

>>733672914
FFS you should read the Harry Potter analogy

How do you know the spirit you saw wasn't proof of a completely different religion? Shit son!

>>733673161
>Then why are you still answering?
Because I'm trying to get you to think about this. There's a large gap in what you've said so far.

>have experience
>convinced by experience that spirits exist
>???
>God exists

>>733673161
Try learning to reason like an adult, then maybe people won't have to waste their time breaking down simple logic for you. I bothered to try and explain something you obviously don't understand, and you won't bother trying because you don't like Harry Potter?

You deserve to be this stupid.

>>733670764
>tfw youll never marry a muslim girl who saved herself for you, cooks meals for you when you come home from work, and listens to your every wish

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Hitler didn't want the end of religion....every soldiers belt buckle had 'god with us' on it...

>>733673693
Muslim girls are forbidden to marry non-Muslims, such a shame.

>>733673221
>Hitler wanted to abolish religion.
No. The Nazis had all sorts of religious beliefs.
>Same with stalin.
No, just replaced with the religion of the state.

>>733670764
I do not think there are any gods.

Reasoning for how and why religion came about makes plenty of sense without the need for divine creator(s)

God and religion is humanity's excuse for fearing death. It only exists to offer comfort to people who are scared of what happens after death. Furthermore, it has been exploited by the wealthy for centuries to oppress people.

The closest thing to "god" I believe in is that we have a creator, who is some alien that is running our entire universe as a computer program.

I used to know a kid who had leukemia. Survived it and ended up scoring perfect SATs and getting into medical school early. His family wasn't that wealthy, middle class i think. I remember asking him how he was able to keep going and be so brilliant. He just told me he always had faith in God(allah since he was muslim) and His plan.
sounded like BS, but sometimes i wonder if i practiced a religion like islam or something for a month what results should i expect if it is a true religion?
Im assuming if nothing happens religion is a hoax

>>733674585
Ever heard of the placebo effect?

>>733671799
Not really

The lochness monster and bigfoot dont share a mythology where as spirits and god generally do

>>733674871
>generally
Not always, not necessarily, and the gods vary.

>>733670764
No, there's no reason to.
Science gives me all the answers I need in life, I don't need any spiritual crap.
I'm open to change my mind with real evidence, but if god is the one from the scriptures I would simply reject it. That one is an egocentric, sadistic attention whore.

>>733670764
Yes because I've seen way to much storybook shit happen for there not to be (specifically in sports). Also it's logical, minus well behave like there is one, worst case you were a good person in life. Best case you're in heaven. Otherwise best case is you were shitty and not saved anyway, worst case is oops doesn't cut it when God ask why you were a dick

>>733674871
Well they generally do in factitious fairy tales. Realistically speaking there is no evidence that suggest if one exists the other must.

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>>733676232
>worst case you were a good person in life

>>733676232
sports??

Implying a believer is automatically good and all the atheists are evil pieces of shit.

I don't even know if I believe in God or not, im too stupid to even figure myself out, I see why I have no friends.

Nothing has made me inclined to believe a 'god' exists. Any religious text turns out to be dogma and have no evidence, it all rely's on blind faith. As far as your personal experience that's anecdotal and as far as you are aware this divine experience could very well be a mental breakdown. Someone who is religious or a believer will look every bit of fruitless, empty excuse why to believe in god. As a skeptic I'm open to only debate what the evidence point's to.

>>733670764
I do not believe in God, why?
Dude, do you even brain?

>>733674585
I knew a kid who had leukemia. We went to a Christian school, and he, his parents, and all his friends had faith in God and his plan. He died at 7.

>sometimes i wonder if i practiced a religion like islam or something for a month what results should i expect if it is a true religion?

You can't expect anything. It doesn't matter how devout or faithful you are, how often you pray or go to church, or how little or how much you sin. If good things happen to you, you're supposed to give thanks. If bad things happen to you despite all your prayers and hard work, you're supposed to accept it as part of some vast unknowable plan. For every kid that survives a horrible disease or accident and thanks God for it, there's at least one (but more likely hundreds more) who were just as faithful, but died anyway.

That may sound edgy or cynical, but that's the truth. If you don't believe me, read up on the story of Job. Job was a completely upright and pious dude, who had complete faith in God, and God ruined his life and killed his entire family to win a bet with Satan.

I'm not saying that this is a reason not to believe, you're welcome to do so if you want. But it's a fact that prayer and piety are no guarantee of success in your life. Extreme faith in God and his supposed plan may make you more willing or mentally prepared to accept what comes your way, but so does Buddhism and meditation. So make of that what you will.

>>733676530
Nahh, that's fine, actually agnosticism is the most rational position

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No, I don't.

>>733676568
Also if your ideas don't hold up to scrutiny, or your not even willing let them be criticized, it's most likely because they don't hold up and are way to flimsy to be criticized.

>>733676699
>that's fine
Not really. Not knowing what you do and don't believe is pretty bad.

>>733676232
>I've seen way to much storybook shit happen for there not to be (specifically in sports)

I don't think that holds up. Devout people lose at sports all the time. Saying that fortunate events, no matter how amazing or unlikely, is proof of the existence of God ignores the tons of horrible shit that happens at the same time.

>>733676645
Well said anon

>>733676699
Be my new daddy...

>>733676782
I mean you don't have to pick a side, it's something you can't prove or disprove, so why bother?

>>733677128
You either believe something or you don't anon.

>>733676699
athiesm

>>733670764
No simply because i never met the guy. Still find religion fascinating though. Also: to the people who say all atheists are evil, i have questions. If God made us all in his own image and God is morality then wouldnt he design us to be moral whether we believed in him or not? Also are you saying the only reason you dont murder is because God told you not to and not because you simply dont want to harm your fellow human? And if you dont murder simply because he told you not to then youre a mindless savage, but he created you in his own image so wouldnt that mean God is nothing more than a mindless savage as well? Answer these questions in a civilized manner and i'll give you the actual best argument FOR the existence of God.

>>733677273
Retard

>>733670764
No because religion is a fantasy for people whome are scared of death so they need comfort knowing there corpse wont be the only thing left of them.

>>733677373
>the logical absolutes are retarded
A or not A.

>>73367076

Do i believe in which god?
Jahwe? Allah? Wotan? Thor? Zeus?
Be more specific

>>733670764
>believe in
fgt pls

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>>733670764
I'd like to believe. It must be nice to have some feeling of certainty. I just tell people I take the Fox Mulder approach. "I want to believe"

But I don't really know, and most religious events or gatherings make me absurdly uncomfortable.

GF's family does a prayer before every meal or big event, and we all hold hands in a circle and everyone bows their heads except me. I just stand there, holding two other people's hands and feeling fucking nothing but discomfort about the whole experience

>>733677364
>Answer these questions in a civilized manner and i'll give you the actual best argument FOR the existence of God.

I'm an atheist, but I'd like to hear this argument anyway, so I'll try to answer:

>If God made us all in his own image and God is morality then wouldnt he design us to be moral whether we believed in him or not?

If God exists, is as all knowing and powerful as we're supposed to believe He is, and had the life of every human being planned out before He even created the world, then it follows that atheists and otherwise immoral people are the way they are because it's His will.

>Also are you saying the only reason you dont murder is because God told you not to and not because you simply dont want to harm your fellow human?

If I were still a believer, I'd probably try to argue that the inherent sense of right and wrong that we have, regardless of specific instruction from God or Scripture, came from Adam and Eve eating the forbidden fruit. Just as we all supposedly have original sin, we automatically understand that murdering somebody or stealing their shit is wrong on some basic level. That would cover civilizations that aren't Abrahamic figuring out basic morality.

I tell myself I don't but I wish some of the shit they feed us in books or movies was real like reincarnation.

When I overthink about god not being real I get depressed because of the fear of it all being over when we die, the concept of death terrifies me.

>>733677942
>the concept of death terrifies me.

Look at this way: if God and the afterlife don't exist, you have nothing to fear in death because you won't be conscious to experience it.

>>733677942
totally get that anon

the fear of oblivion/non-existence fucking terrifies me.

it's dumb when you think about it. you won't exist, so how can any of it hurt?

but then part of me just can't wrap its head around the concept of not existing. i don't want to cease to exist.

Religion is just a way to control the masses, it gives people a way out from facing the reality of the world. E.G. Your parents get cancer and die. "It's God's will, they're in a better place now" That's bullshit, the only place we go when we die is 6ft under or in a fucking oven etc etc. Science proves that evolution is real and that "God" didn't create life. Religion is literally a tool to help most of humanity cope with the existential crises that is life. Not only is religion and every holy text bullshit but the devout followers of these religions are morons too imo.

>>733670764
No, for the same reason i don't believe in Santa Claus and the Eastern Bunny

Most of us aren't even scared of death. We're scared of not being remembered, of not living our lives to the fullest and of regretting not doing something before we do die.

>>733678019
Is not that, I mean, as humans we are very complex and the idea of the things we learned and connections we made going to the trash can at some not-too-far point just fucking depresses me a lot when I overthink about it. As the other guy said, I want to believe.

>>733677451
From what ive gathered, there may be actually be a heaven and a soul, though theyre not as mystical as we make them out to be. Heaven: After your heart stops, your brain is still active for 30 seconds-3 minutes. During this time, your brain releases the most powerful form of dmt on the planet. This is the stuff that paralyzes you and makes you dream when you sleep though you get nowhere near as much when you sleep compared to whenyou die. This stuff also causes extreme time dilation so theoretically, when you die you spend thousands of years in a peaceful dream world=Heaven. Soul: Energy cannot be destroyed, only displaced. You have energy in you created by atoms and the weak nuclear force that causes you be alive. When you die this energy leaves your body. This energy=soul.

>>733678180
So you don't believe in god because he didn't give you the nintendo 64 u wanted?

>>733678297
>the idea of the things we learned and connections we made going to the trash can at some not-too-far point just fucking depresses me a lot when I overthink about it.

This is going to sound stupid, but you shouldn't waste your time thinking about that or let it depress you since you have no control over it. Just make the best of the time you have.

>>733678453
Different guy, but I got my nintendo. Still don't believe.

no-one fears anything beyond suffering
that is my proof against your almight God
no-one would give a shit unless your God could condemn them to eternal suffering
kys you fear-mongering assholes

>>733678453
i don't believe in them, because there is no reason to.
"Why does the universe exist?" Is the as "Where do all these chocoloate eggs/ present come from?"
And then hearing your 5 your old niece answer with "god, the easter buny/ Santa".

>>733676645
I just thought of something as an addendum to this:

The ultimate proof that prayer and faith don't actually have an effect on your life one way or another is Jesus. The only human being to live his life without sin, and the most faithful believer in God (and how couldn't he be since he was God's living avatar) in God ever to walk the Earth, and what happened to him? He ended up being very slowly tortured to death.

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I look at the preferences from worst to best scenarios

>Religious
Clams a consistent belief usually passed down from an omnipotent being as guidelines to obtain infinite peace/wisdom, yet is constantly edited by the followers for personal gain/satisfaction in the current life. Often will claim the religion is for self-guidance for those who struggle to abide by the "Golden Rule", yet often attributed to violence and crimes forbidden by the same teachings.

>Atheism/Science
Claims to be superior in thoughts and ideas, yet admits belief in originating from nothing or having no ultimate importance or end goal. Creates series of measurements for better understanding the universe, but also admits most are inconsistent . Things that are explainable or consistent through these measurements to some degree are listed as "laws", things that are not are theories.

>Nihilistic
Claims to believe in nothing, but can only do so within the presence of something. Similar to how the idea of anarchy can exist solely because of the current existence of government.

>Agnostic
Open to pretty much everything, but not fully convinced by anything.

>>733676782
>>733677273
>>733677467
The problem is 'A' is too vaguely defined for it to be as black and white as believing or not believing.

I don't believe in religion. I entertain the possibility that some version of 'god' exists, though I highly doubt it would be what most people define as god.

I think being so simple as needing to polarise complicated questions is worse than not knowing what one believes. Not knowing leaves one open to discussion and new ideas. Being already decided means you have an incentive not to take in new ideas that could conflict with your position.

>>733679195
Claims to be superior in thoughts and ideas, yet admits belief in originating from nothing or having no ultimate importance or end goal. Creates series of measurements for better understanding the universe, but also admits most are inconsistent . Things that are explainable or consistent through these measurements to some degree are listed as "laws", things that are not are theories.
bulllshit
>claims to believe in no god
there's your definition of atheism, try refuting it

>>733678807
Amazing analogy!

>>733678383
Our consciousness could potentially travel to another dimension when we die.
Though would this afterlife be heaven?
Would god be there?
And would a human's consciousness still be them if removed from human form and sent to completely different form of reality?

>>733679298
>The problem is 'A' is too vaguely defined for it to be as black and white as believing or not believing.
How can you believe something that isn't defined?
>I think being so simple as needing to polarise complicated questions is worse than not knowing what one believes.
You're free to think that. I think not knowing your own mind is one of the worst things you can do.
>Not knowing leaves one open to discussion and new ideas.
No more so that knowing your own mind does.
>Being already decided means you have an incentive not to take in new ideas that could conflict with your position.
You understand that there's a difference between "I don't believe x" and "I believe not x", right?

>>733677913
So yeah so when God sends you to hell its just part of his great plan, your soul purpose was to go to hell. And on the adam eve part, fundamentalists defeat themselves. Them eating the fruit lead to morality being built into us. Also why did God create that tree in the first place, and why was his punishment so harsh if they didnt know any better beforehand? But i digress. Heres my god argument: Atheists reject God and choose science as the answer to to our questions and problems. But, as i see it, science itself may be the best evidence of God's existence. First, let me state what constitutes a god, its three things: Omnipresence, Omniscience, and Omnipotence, these three things constitute God. Well lets think of what science is: Science is everything (Im science, your science, all that exists is science) so science is omnipresent. Science is (as you obviously understand) is trully the answer to everything. Science is knowledge itself so science is omniscient. Finally science is all powerful as it is the establishment of the four great forces (Gravity, strong nuclear, weak nuclear, electromagnetic) that create and destroy everything so science is omnipotent.

Science=Omnipresence+Omniscience+Omnipotence=God

>>733679595
if God was there (in the other dimension) but not here (in this dimension) he wouldn't be God would he? God supposedly has ULTIMATE power over EVERYTHING even other dimensions.

>>733679397
>Atheism/Science

I stated it as such because atheists will often refer to science and vice versa for their reasoning on why a deity may not exist.

Sure an atheist can not believe in both god and modern science and still have valid points, just like how a person can believe in a god and modern science and have valid points.

>>733670764
no, because i am not a child

>>733679595
We'll just have to wait and see.

>>733679732
believe in God all you want but modern science does not support your views

>>733679696
Yes he does, so our rules of the universe do not apply to God. Something we cannot comprehend.
Also, post nudes of Mudslims and Indians.

>>733679732
Science is the whispers of God's knowledge.

>>733670764
nope ... there is no god

>>733679739
So brave. Face of atheism. Someone throw this anon a parade!

>>733679837
>something we cannot comprehend
then what's the fucking point
GOD DOESN'T EXIST, it's something we cannot comprehend
are you convinced?

>>733670764
No. Because the concept of their being a man or spirit that rules a kingdom in the sky is utter lunacy.
Also, logically it makes more sense that when we die, we'll just be dust or worm food. We're born with nothing and we die alone. There is nothing beyond life.

Until I see a ghost, demon, angel, etc. With my own two eyes, I refuse to believe in such nonsense.

>>733679659
Imagine reading a book about a character doing whatever. You can read page by page what he does or skip forwards and backwards, edit, and remove parts. You can know and/or change practically everything about what this character does without them even knowing it's happening, all the while they believe their "path" is by their own will. They can't comprehend anything before "page one" or after "The End" because they can only exist on paper. If they could, they'd be you, the reader and the writer.

>>733679798
I never said that I did. In fact I actually listed very prominent yet accepted holes by followers of both science and religion.
Might as well say "believe in modern science all you want but God does not support your views"

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>>733680130
>holes by followers of science
point them out
there is nothing beyond physical processes
enojoy life while it lasts, it's the only time you get to experience ANYTHING

>>733679830
If the universe is seemingly endless and we're comprised of and within it, it's possible that we at some degree can be endless as well. That's not to say that our complete consciousness, memories, or physical beings will remain intact forever.

>>733680130
Im god argument guy, is this your argument? If so what do you think of mine?