Why do Americans act like their weapons give them freedom?

>>729229937
Well it's pretty simple...

Americans used weapons to gain their freedom.

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Shut the fuck up nerd.

>>729230036
Currently the only logical response, but still doesn't answer the current situation.
>>729230084
>>729230183
Dumbfuck c+p replies

Because goverment cant just decide and start some ethnic clensing of political opponents without fear of armed resistance. Thats what happened at the start of every communist dictatorship in the rest of the world. Europe should get armed too. Fucking invading sand niggers.

>>729230183
>>729230362
i just made that 5 minutes ago fuck face

reverse google images it

Because it keeps the government from having a monopoly on violence.

>>729230362
Because after Americans used their weapons to gain their freedom, they felt the need to protect the right to bear arms via the constitution in case the government became tyrannical again.

>>729229937
wow. history dunce.

>>729229937
because of the freedom to have weapons

>>729230858

> My .22 will stop a tank

I mean, I do get the logic behind the second amendment but in this day and age it just doesn't apply

>>729229937
Cause they once did... and they still think that they can, i mean it would never work these days but they hold onto the mentality

>>729231072
It also applies in the sense of self protection. In other words the belief that each individual is responsible for his or her own safety. Of course there are police, but that means relying on the government to protect you and essentially leaves you defenseless until the government arrives to save you. After the whole Great Britain thing, Americans became a little wary of relying on the government for anything really.

>>729231072
Because niggers, spics, white trash, etc.
Its also because im forced to go through somewhat shit neighborhoods at time.

>>729229937
Weapons don't give freedom, weapons are a side effect of having freedom.

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>>729231072
Au contraire, mon frere. With the militarization of local police forces, the need for citizens to keep arms is as high as fuck. I'm Canadian and wish I had the same arming opportunities as my American neighbours.

>>729229937
murica = christian nation
Christ sais do not kill
Muricunts kill, even abroad

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>>729230183

>>729231252
Having an armed citizenry is a last defense against both a tyrranical government and foreign Invaders. Why do you think Japan scrapped early plans to invade California? Why do you think Switzerland has been left alone during both World Wars. Partly due to the nearly every citizen in each respective country had access to multiple firearms and knew how to use them.

>>729231072
>tanks are magical creatures that simply do the bidding of the government
>the chairs inside are just for show

The tanks are driven by Men, Men who aren't very likely to fire on their own citizens. The logic stands.
It's not JUST about the ability to fight a tyranical government. What about independent militias that may pop up? to possibility of religious extremism on american soil? What about riots?
What if the power goes out for a week and all the nignogs go chimp?

There's plenty of reasons, good reasons. Because you live in a fantasy world where everyone is nice and nothing bad happens, doesn't mean everyone else is blind.
I'm Canadian, own 5 guns. Canada has more guns per person than america, but we get no flack about it for some reason. All I know is, if the shit hits the fan, I can protect myself and my family, if you can't say the same, then you are a naive infant.

>>729231385
>>729231420

Yep, but that's backpedalling on the whole "PREVENT THE TYRANNICAL GUMMN'T" argument

As for "personal protection" needing guns to protect yourself from guns is silly

> Hurr if we get rid of guns only criminals will have guns

Many, many countries have proven this to be false, if you actually have decent customs at the airlines and proper gun control laws it's hard as fuck for criminals to get guns, yes, some do but on the grand scale instead of every single criminal having a gun only a select few do so it becomes overall safer, even though there will be the odd tragedy where a criminal kills someone with a gun and some butthurt NRA guy will yell "WELL ONLY IF HE HAD A GUN" and acting emotionally and irrationally instead of looking at the whole picture.

>>729231540

You missed the point entirely, so I assume you're actually American, Canadians get a decent education.

>>729231072
Yes a .22 will stop a tank. If you shoot the driver before he gets in, if you shoot the fuel handler, or the cook that makes his food, or the water purification tech. In asymmetric warfare you play to your own strengths. You don't go head to head with a larger more powerful adversary. Those that can't do that either die or become prisoners. Since you can't think outside the box you probably wouldn't be very useful.

>>729231072
because the middle east needs such good gear to beat the americans.

a guerrilla war is won by strength of will, not strength of men

>>729231540
I';m canadian, have 5 guns.
Take the 8 hr course, get your PAL, then go buy a gun.
It's pretty fucking easy.

>>729231782
> hard as fuck for criminals to get guns
M8, the US is pretty expansive, so we can travel for our shit and not pass "customs". Plus guns can be made in home shops. Not really that hard.

>>729231801
i see someone understands logistics. tank on its own is in short time just heavy piece of trash

>>729231771

> Men who aren't very likely to fire on their own citizens. The logic stands.

No it doesn't lol, you just defeated you're own point

> Need weapons to stop a tyrannical government
> Soldiers won't fire on citizens

So why do you need to defend yourself again? If the tyrannical government can't get it's soldiers to act against citizens you defeated your own argument hahahahahahahahahahahaha

> Because you live in a fantasy world where everyone is nice and nothing bad happens

Actually I live in a country with gun control where none of your fantasy world situations happen. I know you want to be Rambo but when the power goes out and the chimps come knocking you're probably gonna be the one who pisses his pants and cries.

But more to the point, like I said, I live in a country with some of the strictest gun control laws and none of your shit happens, it's not a fantasy world where nothing bad happens, it's what most 1st world countries behave like

> All I know is, if the shit hits the fan, I can protect myself and my family, if you can't say the same, then you are a naive infant.

> IF YOU AREN'T EXACTLY LIKE ME YOU'RE AN INFANT

Alright kid

I'm 52 years old, I've never been in a situation where I had to defend myself with a firearm despite living in one of the highest crime areas in my country and not just me, nobody I've ever met has.

My country has about 3 firearm related *incidents* a year, not even deaths, just incidents where a firearm gets waved around. Gun control works if done properly.

>>729229937
They don't. nice loaded question. americans think their freedom gives them the right to own guns

4/10 only because im bored as shit

>>729231782
>you made a good point that defeats me
>wait go back to the point I though I made good
>see me smrt

You're a dummy. A naive little kid relying on people who don;t know or care about you to protect you, while you wander around delusional, convinced the world is baby proofed for you.
When a 300 lb nigger breaks into your house with a baseball bat, you get to watch him rape your wife then bash her head in.
Me? I put a 12 gauge round in his chest.
Have fun being useless.

>>729232138
What country do you live in?

>>729231801

Since you can't think logically you wouldn't be much more useful other than cannon fodder.

You're outgunned, out trained and out resourced and on the enemies home soil. You wannabe Rambo's could never stop a tyrannical takeover, at best you could delay it a few weeks

> Muh- muh gorilla warfare

It won't last, you will lose. These are facts.

>>729229937
they don't GIVE us freedom ... but they help KEEP our freedom

Everyone argues about drones and large scale weapons.. that the military has much more advanced weaponry than the average citizen. And they are right. However in a civil war they aren't going to drop nukes, they aren't going to use the more advanced weapons because they live here too.

>>729231662
I mean Japan scrapped the plan cause the US still had a Working Strong Pacifc Fleet
Switzerland yes does have a Citizen Milita Program but that is its Army compared to the US who have an Standing Army also Switzerland basicly a mountian with nothing important there (No point dying taking something useless) and a Neutrality Policy

>>729232294
The British said the same thing about American militias...
Americans said the same thing about Vietnamese farmers...

>>729230417
the government has tanks, planes and bulletproof armour, but your pistol is gonna stop that?

>>729232198

> >you made a good point that defeats me

You are literally dreaming

>>729231782
Congratulations on literally contradicting yourself and still not having it be the dumbest thing you said.

>>729232138
Gun control doesn't work when your southern border is thousands of miles and is already a hot bed of smuggling and cartel activity. Banning guns would just open up is massive market for black market gun deals from Mexico just like it did with banning drugs and we see how well that I had turned out. You have to look at countries on a Case by case basis.

>>729232400

> and on the enemies home soil

Missed that part I guess

>>729232406
The government also needs to collect taxes from it's citizens in order to keep those tanks, planes, drones, etc running efficiently.

>>729232400
This. Still pissed we weren't able to beat those slant eyed Charlies.

weapons don't GIVE freedom, they ARE freedom

>>729232198

> A naive little kid relying on people who don;t know or care about you to protect you, while you wander around delusional, convinced the world is baby proofed for you.
> When a 300 lb nigger breaks into your house with a baseball bat, you get to watch him rape your wife then bash her head in.
> Me? I put a 12 gauge round in his chest.
> Have fun being useless.

You're a delusional wannabe alpha who dreams about being a superhero working your 9-5 in some shitty office, and guzzling down your anti-depressant pills and viagra so you can get it up for your dumpy wife and compensating for your lack of masculinity by purchasing guns and joking with the other rednecks at the range about shooting niggers.

$500 you'll never be in a situation in your entire life where you needed a firearm.

>>729232342
You know little about European geography. If Germany could have feasibly taken Switzerland in WW1, they would have. Would have opened an entire new front into France that they weren't prepared for.

>>729232422

When did I contradict myself?

> Oh wait I didn't

>>729232465

>implying every American is knowledgable of the diverse environments found throughout the United States and military strategies that equate to each

The same logic still applies. Trying to police the entire US with military force is impossible logistically. Not to mention going to war on it's own citizens would cease most funding into the military industrial complex. At that point, it's just a waiting game.

>>729232662
>literally betting on nothing going wrong
what a dumbass
I mean I wish I could live in a magical all-white world where I didn't need a weapon
but I definitely don't now

>>729232441

Drug use is actually down, the only drug use that has risen is weed because most of the country barely considers that illegal anymore.

Of course countries are judged on a case by case basis, I'm not advocating gun outlawing, I'm advocating stricter gun control

I mean, for fucks sake, you live in a country where you can walk into a gun show and legally purchase as much firearms as you want without having to provide any I.D or valid permits. That's simply not a clever system, not matter how much founding father dick you suck and how much you dream of being some alpha who shoots a home invader

>>729232662
Well, you need a firearm to hunt...

>>729232662
Anti depressants? Check. Viagra? Not yet. Having to defend myself in a life or death situation? Probably not. I own 3 guns and I can tell you if a nig nog broke into my house in the middle of the night I wouldn't have the wherewithal to get and load my guns. I'd most likely throw an empty beer bottle at them as that would be the closest thing to a weapon I could grab. Maybe a fleshlight also.. depends

>>729232666
.... What that Switzerland is the most defenseable place in europe due to it positioning on the Alps?
and Yeah France wouldn't expect that, but the amount of time Germany would have spent doing so would have given France plenty of time to set up defenses the exact reason Germany didnt invade

>>729232838

> Betting on nothing going wrong to the point you need a firearm

FTFY

I've been in hairy situations, but I've never needed a firearm and in fact and grateful I can live in a country without that fear.

I've been in plenty of bar/street fights and I am forever grateful that I can confidently go into these fights knowing the people I'm fighting will never draw a firearm on me. Situations that can easily (And unnecessarily) escalate to fatal have ended in a few bloody noses and sore hands.

But believe you me, if I was ever unfortunate enough to spend time in America I would never talk back to anyone on the streets or at a bar, I would be the most passive person you ever meet because I know you rednecks are probably all packing, it's just unbelievable to me when you yanks say gun control doesn't work and you need guns because otherwise only criminals will have them when every day I live in a country that's very existence proves you wrong

>>729232294
History doesn't agree with you. If there was a tyrannical government and armed resistance. There would also be factions of the standing military that would fight for the people. Educated and trained side by side with the tyranny. Look at the number of confederate generals that were educated at west point in the civil war. What the people would be would be an armed insurgency. Their job to disrupt operations. Make the cost of military operations higher than not. Delaying a takeover is a very big deal even a few weeks, because in that few weeks a lot can happen. Military aid from other countries, establishment of a rebel army and air force. When there is a coup sometimes the govt wins sometimes it loses its nowhere near as cut and dried as you are trying to make it sound.

>>729233159
What country are you from??

>>729232889
You can hunt legally in australia with a firearm, and in many other countries..you know what tells them apart, we don't give stupid ass city civilians guns because that's america's thing

>>729232868
Most sellers at gun shows are FFL holders, meaning they have to perform a background check to sell. On top of that, a 1997 study by the NIJ found that less than 2% of gun crime was committed using firearms obtained in a gun show or flea market. Meanwhile up to 80% of gun crimes were committed using illegally obtained firearms. Learn about what you're talking about before spewing shit.

>>729229937
The US were founded by actual smart people. Based on what they've learned from Europe they knew that the only way they could ensure their freedom FROM AN OPPRESSING GOVERNMENT (monarchy, dictatorship...) was to ensure that the people (we the people...) could defend themselves through civil militia.

Fast forward in 2017 where all is left in the US are brainwashed fat thrash bleeding until their last breath to make rich fuckers richer, their shrinking brain is not able to remember this instead of the last Miley "song".

Now it's just "Muh gun gives meh freedom against communist and muzlim" while they are enslaved by capitalists and corporations.

>>729233159
I live in NY and I agree with you. I liked that if I got into a bar fight I don't have to worry about someone pulling out a gun. It is comforting to know if I got drunk and started some shit I most likely wouldn't get shot.

>>729233231
Well there you go, you owe me $500.

>>729229937
Don't worry about it, pussy fart

>>729233253
>civil
civil nigger riots you mean

>>729232947
That's the point I'm making bud... Germany couldn't have feasibly taken Switzerland because literally every adult male was issued a firearm by the state.

>>729233159
Kek. You are literally advocating for gun control so you can assault people without fear of getting shot. Learn to develop an argument "twat".

>>729233491
Shut the fuck up. Everyone does stupid shit particularly when they are young. I've started fights.. wouldn't do it now.. but I certainly shouldn't have been shot to death for it.

>>729233159

>i would be the most passive person you ever meet

cuck detected

>>729233159
>But believe you me...
Everything after this point shows that you don't know very much of what you're talking about. I'm not saying that to insult you, but the fact that you think everyone here is waving a gun around willy nilly just shows that you shouldn't have any input because you don't know what it's actually like here.

>>729233159
You just proved us right. Because we are armed we are safer from people like you. Because we are armed you will go about your business and not start trouble. Win for us.

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>>729229937
Because they do.

>>729233159
must be nice to live in a fictional euro country without crime or government overreaching its duties or risk of war on your own soil where your personal experiences represent the needs of all others and you can beat up whoever you want because you're bigger than them and there's noting they can do about

>>729233347
Good goy, keep voting for our puppets and don't read books

>>729233596
If you start a fight and make someone fear for their life, you can legally be shot in most states in America. Here's an idea. Don't get in drunken bar fights to put yourself in a situation where you can shot. If someone is that stupid they deserve what they get honestly.

>>729233724
america fuck yeah

>>729233351
Yeah, but thats a diffrent to the US situation
The Swiss Millita are fully trained and armed by the Goverment
The US is just some random people with guns with limited training
Im a Brit so the hole owning a Gun for self defense is alien to me, we have them for hunting but thats Bolt Actions and Shotguns we'd never think about using them agaisnt our goverment if shit went south, we'd have to hope the Army would step in and fix it

>>729233707
No faggot. Try manning up and fighting. Beating someone's ass puts them in check quick. No need to be a pussy and shoot

>>729233821
This guy definitely starts shit

>>729233795
You're right. Because I'm sure you've never done anything questionable. And if you did you should be killed. Grow up

>>729233821

you sound like a complete faggot that acts like a total asshole at bars to prove your "masculinity"

>>729233596
not sure if irish or huge drunk douchebag
>inb4 what's the difference

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>>729232868
Interesting because I just read somewhere that LSD use is up recently. We gonna have a second summer of love, baby.

>>729233821
I don't have to do anything, because you are going to keep your mouth shut. An armed society is a polite society.

>>729230858
lmao nigga like your ar is gonna stop a drone strike or an actual m-16 held by a guy with a bulletproof vest this is the dumbest reasoning anyone could possibly have

If you think youre going to man a militia and stop the even govment from taking your guns you obviously havent seen their k/d in afghanistan and those kiddos have real guns and rpgs

>>729234100
let me know when they have home-invading drones and bulletproof masks

>>729233972
>>729234012
Same logic is applied the other way. If someone starts a fight with me and I attempt to defend myself and DONT have a gun, assuming he doesn't either the worst I'll get is beat up. If he does have a gun I'll be shot. But you're right. Everyone who owns a gun legally are law abiding citizens and would never do anything like that...

>>729229937
Because they do. Meanwhile in Brussels unelected bureaucats are deciding how many Muslim Dicks your children can take.

>>729234176
Only if you let me know when I become the government bb

I like The Senate memes but I am not the senate.

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>>729234100
You're totally right. The American military is going to use million dollar drone strikes to take out individual people! Because real life is exactly like Call of Duty!

>being this dumb

I bet france wished they had some good ol Americans when those AK47 welding neanderthals rolled up.

Don't be jelly of my gat OP.

>>729234224
or stabbed
or beat to death

I blame their shit tier education systems combined with the NRA fear mongering

>>729234224
>implying you have to actually fight.

damn nigga. are you really that easy to manipulate? for claiming you live in such a "safe country" you sure do bring up a lot of violent crime in trying to prove your points.

lets face it everyone is jealous of murica with its independence, freedumbs and guns.

unless you are getting dragged off of planes and treat like a piece of shit.

everyday murica contradicts itself and becomes more of a laughing stock to everyone

>>729234100
Drone strikes are for targeted attacks. They are not magic. If I am not a known or targeted individual. I don't need to worry about drones. Secondly. You have no concept of a military operation if you are talking matching man for man. You should read some more.

>>729234341
And? So the only recourse is for me to carry a weapon at all times incase the other guy does as well so we can get into a shootout like the Wild West. Good logic you have there

>>729234474
Lol at this pus

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Because they do

>>729234421
No country is safe, that's the point
Rape, burglary, threats to you, to your family, they exist everywhere
Euros try to ignore it like children and pretend everything is fine

>>729234421
Who said I live in a safe country. Also if there was no violence it's kind of makes this whole argument moot. No need to have a gun for self defense.

>>729234474
>his every argument goes back to defending his imaginary "right to get into as many fights as he wants with no consequences"
what a yakuza nigger

>>729230417
Lol moron. They close wal mart and where will your dumb ass get food? They shut down water and electricity how long can you eat and drink bullets? Their armored vehicles can withstand IED blasts, tanks can level an entire suburb with 0 danger to its crew. Good luck

>>729234474
or you know, you could not be a total asshole and you wont get into bar fights.

>>729234474
Ok people don't seem to be able to comprehend this. Outside of the ghettos where drugs and gangs reign. There's not a lot of violence in the USA. In places where people can carry legally there is even less. It's not the wild west at all. People don't want to get shot and they don't want to get in a gunfight. So armed people mind there own business, and they don't fuck with each other.

>>729234540
Maybe because there's something called police, and the police here aren't exactly the half trained, shoot fist ask questions later, mongoloids you have on the US

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You fags cant even imagine how great it feels to be american.

>>729231782
Is assuming its hard to make a gun or buy one illegally... are you fucking stupid?

>>729234675
No armoured vehicle is immune to IEDs. If the first one you dentonate is not effective, just make a bigger IED

>>729234778
>average response time is 10 minutes
>oh well I guess my wife won't mind a LITTLE rape, we aren't savages after all

>>729234675
how about you eat a bullet
APVs and tanks can't do shit to control people, only kill them, and you can't rule over people you can't control

>>729234692
Unless someone else is an asshole and starts one with me. I better go get my gun! It's funny to me though. All these gun toteing clowns are in the Midwest or down south. Going on YouTube talking about home protection when the nearest neighbor is a cornfield away. Lol. Enjoy working at Walmart and fantasizing about people actually giving a fuck enough about your state to try to invade it.

>>729234814
Cool avoid the strongest point I made, they don't need guns to kill you. Cut off power, water, food and you die in 30 days. Nobody can refute my point

>>729234864
kek you dont have a wife you burger eating, gun loving faggit

>>729234920
weird, it usually takes two people to fight.
i guess you can't walk away huh?

jesus christ you're a fucking retard.

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>>729230183
>>729231651

>>729234907

>Can only kill, not control

>"Hey, do this or we'll kill you"
>"Ok"

How is that not control you retard

I don't even have a horse in this race, literally scrolling past this thread and was stunned by the stupidity of your post.

>>729234970
wow great argument eurotrash

>>729234907
Cool you ignored my main point too.

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fucken shitheel europoors

>>729235048
>>729235019
>government will always win, better not bother fighting

>>729234996
Why carry a gun then? Any issues you run into you can walk away from.

>>729229937
Whole reason why. Americans have guns to make sure we keep our government in check. Are government was designed to make sure that if they do something the american people dont like. we can stand up for it. If they were to take our guns or poeples guns, how can we tell them no.

>>729235035
plz dont shoot im unarmed

oh shit you're not the police are you!!!

>>729232406
That sort of resistance worked pretty well against US forces and Russian forces in Afghanistan. It's not that hard to find plenty of examples.

Don't think in terms of symmetrical warfare. Think in terms of guerilla warfare. Just be annoying enough that the oppressor decides that they have better things to do and leave / give up.

Also, for an army fighting its own people, large portions of the army may choose to not fight, or even join the rebels, because they might agree, and because the rebels are their neighbors and fellow countrymen.

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>>729230417
You are fucking delusional. Your kids get taken away by crazy kangaroo courts, you still have instutional slavery, and your government locks you guys up at an unimaginable rate.

You or no other fucking muh freedom fag is going to do anything except shoot up a school or murder a close associate like your wife.

>>729234675
>A tank or drone control run a police state
You think its just going to be a pitched battle against the government or something?
You gonna say
>hurr hurr the nazis have King Tigers, Stukas and battleships! What are french and polish resistance gonna do with SMGs and dynamite?

>>729234962
Power is not nessicary for survival and unless you live in a desert living off the land is not out of the question. The government doesnt have a switch they can flip to make food and water dissapear overnight

>>729235111
So that if someone is threatening you or some else's life, you can defend yourself?
Are bar fights all you understand you fucking chav?

>>729231662
Japanese didn't have the man power or logistics. All high ranking nazis in military and gov were hiding their assets in Switzerland you stupid fucking muh freedom faggot. Your government is out of fucking control go take up arms already or give them up.

>>729235111
you tell me, you're the one that's apparently getting into bar fights every other night.

i've been going to bars for over 40 years and have never witnessed a bar fight. i guess you must live in some uncivilized country where tards have to pound each other for some sort of entertainment.

>>729235163
That's the idea behind the 3 percenters. Out of 330 million, 3 percent is like a 10 million man army. If they have weapons that's a pretty hard fucking fight for our military no matter what. Literally 1 percent of the population would be twice the numbers of our entire military combined.

Ironically, the Americans that think "muh gun = muh freedumb!" are the ones most likely to install and support a true totalitarian police state.

They already have...

>>729234704
Also, due to the banning of leaded gasoline, violent crime rates in cities have dropped, and are now comparable to violent crime rates in rural areas.

>>729234962
You get your food, power and water from the Goverment? Also you can Obtain Food and Water without goverment assistance and you dont need Electricity to live... unless youre a robot

>>729229937
Because they give americans a chance to defend themselves, even against their on government if it comes to that, you wouldn't get far in a rebellion going against the armed forces of the military unless the people were armed aswell. I see it as a fail safe, sure it has its problems and should be regulated more strictly so every psycho over 18 can't buy an uzi to shoot up his school but there are few other countries that could actually stand up against their goverment if they wanted to.

>>729235284
It's ok. I know you like all these other gun loving faggots live in trash states that no one gives a fuck about and nothing happens. I wish you cocksuckers would susceed. I'm tired of giving 1.40 and getting back 80 cents to subsidize your worthless states.

>>729235097
Post is about why guns make you feel like you have a bigger dick not fighting governments. Which can be done via $$ but you want to live in a rambo movie, and play war, except you've never fired a weapon or done any kind of warfare training. Outside of call of duty

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fuck everyone

>>729235429

>government uses thermobaric and cluster bombs
>I-I'll shoot my semi auto t-that'll stop them

>>729235470
>acts like a bitch about the state he thinks I live in
>doesn't name his own state
>is a fag

>>729235349
Same person responding.

Unfortunately, most people in groups like that scare the ever-living shit out of me. Too many anarchist nuts, sovereign citizen nuts, states rights nuts, Republican theocratic nuts, etc.

>>729235349
Technology wins wars, not men.

A government that doesnt trust its citicens is a shitty government.
Taking away guns from its citizens is showing that the governmet has reached that point

>>729235481
>he didn't understand my unintelligible post, better make another one but with more baseless assertions

>>729235535

>government uses bombs to destroy infrastructure
>having an extra chromosome

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>>729235535
>semi
nigger please
like i can afford that shit

>>729235638
lol

Oh wait, you're serious? Let me laugh harder.

>>729229937
'Cause it is now impossible to establish dictatorship in a country where literally everyone owns a gun

>>729235572
NY. And I hope you're a eurofag for using the word "chav" otherwise you're even more worthless than I thought. Everyone bitches about "liberal" NY and CA - but if it wasn't for our tax dollars your shit ass state would be fucked.

>>729235499
nice

freedom cuz i can shoot someone then get thrown in a cement cage for 15-30+ depending on my skin color, race, education, $$$$ and dependin on if the jury/judge had a decent day

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>>729235703
The rabbit hole goes ever deeper and wider.

>>729232868
Actually, heroin use is on the rise, ushered in by the overuse of opioids in prescription pain management. It's become so popular the mexican cartels have started growing opium poppies instead of marijuana.

>>729235666

>anti personnel bombs
>having an whole array of extra chromosomes

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>>729235700
try again, pinko jew york boy

>>729235535
i understand were your coming from but millions of people have guns in america if you get even 50 percent of those people angry you could have most politicians killed in a couple of days the entire government would be destroyed and sure you could bomb the people who killed the politicians but the damage would be done

>>729231385
Not really, we have given our government nearly unlimited power over us. Our rights under the constitution are pretty much to pacify our need to feel "free". I'm the end though we are still slaves to Big Government.

>>729235799

>anti personnel bombs
>300m+ Americans

subhuman detected

>>729235535
Never said they'd win against the government, if the government wanted to sure they could bomb, nuke their own people but other countries would intervene, it would fuel the uprising too. Assad did this in Syria when his people rebelled against him, he wouldn't have won that fight without Russia's support making him feel safe from the consequences of his actions, pretty sure he'll be taken out by Murica rather than the EU since they already took action.

>>729235796
LOL The customer is always right!

>>729234675
I see others replied to you already. What do you have in your case? only a knife to slice your own throat. Moron spiting in your own face. You have it worse in any case

>>729231662
If the citizenry had to fight against a tyrannical government or foreign invaders these days they'd have drones, planes, and ships dropping bombs and launching missiles from miles away. Your guns wouldn't do shit to protect your ass from that. And that's to say nothing about chemicals attacks and the reality that a foreign invader would have to use nukes or MOAB's to defeat the US military.

In modern warfare an armed citizenry would be less then useless. The best they could hope for is some insurrection resistance movement after the dust had settled, that ultimately would be little more then a stalling tactic.

The only nations that would actually invade the US are ones that don't really give a shit about the Geneva Convention and they would be gasing and executing citizens in mass to eliminate any resistance. So, again armed citizenry in modern warfare of the scale necessary to defeat the US military would be useless.

>>729235836
Lol. And the best thing of all is a born and raised NY billionaire was able to con all you chumps into thinking he is a champion of the lower middle class. All while sitting in the penthouse of a building he owns in manhattan. You dummies never cease to amaze me.

>>729235838
Bullshit nobody is doing anything now and they won't

>>729235971
That worked out pretty well in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Oh wait...

Again, stop thinking about symmetrical warfare. You're assuming that one side will commit genocide wholesale, and that almost never happens. In a guerilla war, it's surprisingly easy for a pissed-off population to eventually annoy the oppressor enough to make them leave.

>>729235685

MM Syria tends to disagree

>>729233270
>if I got drunk and started some shit I most likely wouldn't get shot

You do realize you are part of the reason people that can, do own guns? Starting fights without fear of negative repercussions is a bad thing. And yes, you do deserve to die if you think that's acceptable behavior in modern society.

>>729235971

totally! cuz the US govt would absolutely destroy its own infrastructure while at the same time collapsing it's own economy deploying billions in missiles, bombs and drones.

the autism is real.

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These 'men' of other realms cant even begin to understand

>>729229937
Would you try to rob a military base? Same concept.
Guns keep America free because of how many there are. A tyrannical government may think twice before trying to attack an armed populace. (Not that it would ever happen)

>>729235838
Even better, then military leadership could seize power and install proper martial law.

Just deal with it, guns are a cultural tradition and a method of defence in places where law enforcement is non existent or inefficient, but assuming that having a rifle and all the ammo in the world is going to protect anyone from a government with 21st century military weapons is just silly.

>>729236117
Syria is different. Assad would have lost, AFAICT, if not for foreign intervention. Even then, even with Russia's help, it's not a clear-cut victory. It's still a complete shit-hole.

>>729235986
It is quite ironic

>>729229937
because they are told they have freedom with them, not realising they will be locked up or killed when they use them.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUdosc33eSE

>>729231782
>Canadians get a decent education

Okay, as a Canadian myself, this? No. It's better than the American system but fuck does it still suck.

>>729235986
Are you so deluded that you believe that's what happened?

>>729236164
Thats cause Western Goverments didnt learn from Libya, Iraq and Afagan

>>729236282
It is really fucking annoying. The founders wrote the second amendment, and had that value, because they feared a tyrannical government, and they especially feared a police state. When the founders complained about "a standing army", most people today don't understand what they're talking about. Our modern police are a standing army in every way that matters, from the founder's perspective. Yet, these conservative assholes are some of the biggest supporters of the police state and the police, and the biggest apologists for police abuse and overreach.

>>729231540
Yeah, go ahead. Pull a gun on a police officer and tell us how it went.

>>729236347
Are you so delusional that you think otherwise? Aren't you southern morons still supposed to hate us "Yankees", but go ahead and put a trust fund baby into office? Lol. Enjoy the antiquated jobs like coal mining he's bringing back. Faggots got hornswaggled.

>>729235888
the situation isn't comparable, they have nowhere near the kind of gun ownership in the general citizenry. those rebels have a lot of push from outside forces. there are a lot of neighboring countries looking for a slice of that country atm. i honestly think the country will end up split in two, russia on the west, and some new usa puppet on in the east

anyhow, i do somewhat agree with your sentiment though, it doesn't need to be enough to win, just to make it not worth it compared to other means of subjugating the populace.
>enter usa media

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>>729232406
>>729235208
>>729234675
>The brits have ships, fancy jackets, and kings authority.
>How can your musket even compete?
>Just pay your taxes, goy.

>>729236050
>That worked out pretty well in Afghanistan and Iraq.
Afghanistan and Iraq are sideshow wars. There is a difference in warfare between a major nation attacking a significantly smaller power that has no allies and two large nations colliding in an era of missiles. In WW2 the US bombed the living shit out of Japan even before dropping atomic bombs. The allies bombed the living shit out of Germany, and Germany bombed the living shit out of UK and Russia. Imagine now that type of warfare with current armaments and a population of gun toting red necks yelling "Murica" at the top of their lungs, then yes they would have the living shit bombed out of them.

Stop thinking of current small scale warfare because that isn't what would happen with a foreign invader of the US. Yes armed resistance fighters work in sideshows like Afghanistan and Iraq, they worked in the Middle East during WW1, they would not work in a major war on US soil with current technology.

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>>729235470
The reason why the need the money and guns is because of niggers.
>your lefty policies are feeding these niggers.

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>>729231072
>>729232406
>>729234675
>>729235971
Pic related.

>>729236624
Your example is bad.

Actual US military estimates for US casualties for an invasion were extremely high. That didn't even count a possible later guerilla war. The only reason why it was not extremely bloody was because the Emperor told the nation to surrender. Otherwise it would have been an even bigger clusterfuck than Afghanistan and Iraq.

>>729229937

Its not that they give us freedom. its that they are what makes us free.

Sure i can concede that we have a problem with gun violence and i am sure theirs a way to fix it. Most of the united states is to dumb to see it.

>>729236128
No you're right I mean a civil war would never do that. Just ask Syria...Oh wait.

Well never mind just ask the American Civil war, I mean there was never any destruction of infrastructure there, there was never a march to the sea by Sherman....Oh wait.

Well never mind that just look at the Russian Revolution their infrastructure and economy was never touched during that...Oh wait.

If a serious uprising happened by the American people against their government going fully tyrannical then yes, the government would drone strike those who rebelled and guns wouldn't do shit to protect them against that.

>>729236716
Lol. Right. Even with our niggers and Jews we are self sustained. If you clowns went off on your own, wal-mart will be of no assistance. You'd be fucked. And you know it.

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>>729236848
Which state are you even speaking about? california?, you dont even know what is is like to have niggers.

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>>729236745

The problem is niggers. They like to make white gun owners the boogieman when they spout off overall stats, but its literally bullshit.

Next time someone says it, ask them how the racial stats breakdown.

>>729236510
this

>>729229937
Because weapons great the ability to use more violence to defend yourself than mere primate muscle can provide and when others seek to oppress or attack you gives an resort to physival force rather than just accepting oppression, injury or death without a fight.

Fucking retard.

>>729236848
That's ok! them possums and coons 'r good eatin'

>>729236949
Source? What year is that for?

>>729236948
NY. And we know how to segregate. We are more segregated than the south who fought for it. You guys can't do anything right.

>>729236734
Actually you just proved my point. The estimates for US casualties were from fighting the Japanese military not the Japanese citizens. And if the citizens did rise up and use weapons then the US military would have resorted to carpet bombing their cities to subdue them. Which is my argument.

The US already leveled cities with conventional bombs long before any plans for invasion. If an invasion was decided then they would have leveled more. Once it was realized that casualties would be high they just nuked two cities. So guess what? That's my fucking argument. If another major nation did an assessment of the casualties it would take to invade the US they would realize that it was necessary to nuke a few cities (or destroy them just as well with conventional bombs, like MOAB's) to subdue the populace. And armed citizenry wouldn't do shit to protect against that. It wouldn't have mattered how armed the citizens of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were, a nuke to the face ended them.

>>729236780
Not necessarily directed at you, but I'm wondering something. Why is it that whenever muhfreedomguns vs. Tanks and airplanes debate is brought up, people pretend that through the forces of magic, foreign aid doesn't exist.

The US gave advanced arms to the militia in Syria, why the fuck wouldn't Mexico give grenades to the militia in a second American Civil War?

Fictional American Rebel forces may not have a fighter jet, but a comblock version of a stinger can't be much harder to smuggle across the border than 10 kilos of coke.

>>729237150
>And if the citizens did rise up and use weapons then the US military would have resorted to carpet bombing their cities to subdue them. Which is my argument.

No they wouldn't. Especially not today. That's not how that works. When they did that in Vietnam, that was considered war crimes and crimes against humanity by many Americans. There's no chance in hell that an American government would do that against the people wholesale. That my point. You're talking genocide. Very few dictators in shithole countries ever do that, and it's absurd to suggest that potential US dictators would, and it's absurd to suggest that the US military would go along with genocide of the American people.

>>729237024

CDC (adjusted after you take Hispanics out of the "white" category, which the FBI lumped together). Not sure the year.

>>729237200
Vietnam should end any debate about this.

>>729237323
Srsly.

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>>729229937
Well I would feel like a real sad person if I was the 12th victim of some mudslime with a hatchet running around in the street. I'm not sure what Europeans use to defend themselves, but if I saw some refoogie raping a woman I wouldn't just shut my blinds and go back to my baked beans and eggs or whatever the fuck you eat.

>>729236143
But how can all the serial killers exist in US then?
Were unabomber and zodiac inside jobs?

>>729237262
Money and power easily remedies that.

>>729237200
Because foreign aid isn't a given. It would take a major nation or alliance of major nations to actually invade the US. If that happened, it could (and would) be seen as an act of war if Mexico or Canad was involved in giving arms to US freedom fighters. Mexico and Canada are weaker then the US so why would they risk getting fucked up to help. Most likely they would internally be cracking down on such smuggling to protect themselves politically. Sure there might be help still trickling through, but we'd have to know the specifics of how the war started between the US and whoever, as well as who was involved to determine how much or if any aid would be smuggled across the boarders. That's why.

>>729237424
There is a reason niggers aren't serial killers. Serial killers kill because they want to, not because they have to. Which means they are financially stable enough to not have to worry about their next meal, or making a payment. They can devote their free time to hobbies. Like unibombing or serial killing.

>>729237426
Why tolerate , when you can remove?
It's more fun anyways.

>>729233821
>"Muh honor"
Thanks for the laugh.

>>729237426
u wot

>>729233231
I live in a city. And I hunt.

>>729237648
Why did you derail my point to niggers, nigger? Speaking of niggers, what kind of fucking degenerate turbonigger can't do something as basic as getting food by any means?

>>729237672
>"muh guns"
Thanks for being a burger.

>>729232138
>you're
>it's
>lol
>52 years old

19 year old butthurt faggot confirmed

>>729237774
Sorry about that. :(

>>729237250
There's no chance in hell that an American government would do that against the people wholesale.
Work on your reading comprehension.
As I said: "That's my fucking argument. If another major nation did an assessment of the casualties it would take to invade the US they would realize that it was necessary to nuke a few cities (or destroy them just as well with conventional bombs, like MOAB's) to subdue the populace."

When did I say the American government would do it to it's own people? My entire post was about a foreign invasion.

In this instance I'm not referring to the US committing genocide against it's own people. I'm referring to a foreign nation invading the US and running the numbers and realizing that in a major war between two super powers such force would be needed and used. Rules change when you get to wars of that size. When you get major nations warring on small unallied nations you get them 'acting' all proper with rules of war, but once you get to world war level warfare those rules go out the window.

>>729232298
You must have problems understanding the meaning of the word "freedom" then. Weapons could keep you SAFE and not FREE

>>729237868
Doesn't matter. For a sufficiently pissed off populace, either you kill them all, or you will have an effective guerilla war.

This is a failing of many people today. You cannot beat an enemy with military power. You cannot. Military power is just another tool of diplomacy. Every "war" is just a form of diplomacy. Every conflict must be ended by a political settlement. You don't understand this, which means you're a reckless fool who will get the US involved in more pointless wars, in addition to undervaluing individual gun rights.

>>729237868
>Foreign nation invading the US
Couldn't happen. Least currently. Haven't had a foreign invader in hundreds of years.

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As a gun owner, I would be OK if all guns were gone. But a gun ban doesn't make them magically dissappear. I don't have the exact numbers, but say there's 30m guns in the US. Gun ban happens, all but 5m are turned in. Half those are buried / lost in boating accidents. That leaves 2.5m guns on the street.

Ammo can last a long ass time if stored properly. People are still using ammo from the first world War.

It would take 2-3 generations for the guns and ammo to dry up. Who is going to protect me and mine in the interim? The Supreme Court has ruled that police have no duty to act.

I'm not willing to jeopardize my life and the lives of those I care about just so someone else can sleep easier.

If someone has a solution that doesn't require magic or belief in a higher power that doesn't exist, I'd love to hear it.

>meanwhile in north korean /b/:
>Why do filthy capitalists act like their tongues give them freedom

>>729238045
No shit. Someone gives you a nuggie long enough you're going to say uncle. To say that couldn't be accomplished with might is foolish and neive.

>>729238063
That's the thing. No one is trying ban guns. Despite what crazy republicans think, Obama wasn't trying to do that either.

>>729232868
I live in Michigan and I have to present my ID every time. They also make sure you have no felonies.

>>729238284
Simply false. Just look at Chicago, or DC, which had a complete handgun ban. Or look at the Democratic bellweather of California, which really looks like it's trying to ban all semiauto guns.

>>729237550
If the US government engaged in open warfare on its citizens, it would be open season for the countries that want to see US supremacy crumble. Everyone from Argentina to Zimbabwe would be chipping in things that go boom. Everyone likes to root for the underdog.

>>729238298
Yeah. That's everywhere. Called a federal background check. However you can avoid that in shit states down south with the gun show loop hole. If you go into a store down south you can't.

>>729238162
Not sure if you're agreeing or disagreeing.

I should admit some fault with what I said: With a sufficient power disparity, depending on the particulars, you can effectively oppress a population. However, many people vastly overestimate how easy it is to maintain a military oppression of a hostile population, as seen in Iraq, Afghanistan, Vietnam, Korea, etc.

>>729238329
"Looks like." Uh huh. Fucking tinfoil hat gun freaks.

>>729235535

It worked for Vietnam stupid.

>>729238329
Were guns banned? No. shit the worst that came out of elementary school children being slaughtered was a 10round cap in a couple of states.

>>729238422
Shall I provide some citations? Their assault weapon bans are trying to ban all semiauto rifles. They are really trying to ban all semiauto rifles with quick-reload magazines. They also have this handgun make and model allowed list. You're not allowed to buy handguns that are not on the list, and they're not adding any new handguns to the list. Old handgun make and models are grandfathered in for a while longer, but new handguns must meet some impossible requirements, and no gun manufacturer is going to do it, which means it's becoming a complete handgun ban too.

>>729238454
Like the above poster, you need to look at the recent california assault weapon bans, and what a "bullet button" is, and the handgun make and model list.

>>729235638
>>729235638
False, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about.

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>>729237765

In what situation would you need anything heavier or faster than pic related for that?

Not the same anon btw.

>>729238422
>>729238454
To continue, the problem is that they're trying to ban just "assault weapons", but in their world, with the recent ban on bullet buttons, in their world, the phrase "assault weapons" covers all conventional semiauto rifles. The problem is that the politicians are liars who know better, and the general population wrongly believes the lie that some semiauto rifles are more dangerous than other semiauto rifles.

>>729238369
https://youtu.be/9VXpIg8HnRY

>>729238540
I'm aware. I live in NY and I'm in the industry. I have a NY legal ar-15. And let me tell you something. Obama was the best thing for the gun industry. Since trump took office every aspect of the business is down 20-30%. The industry is driven by uneducated morons fear.

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>>729238623
you make this so easy

>>729237868
Well the ATF didt pretty good job at burning all those religious freaks in Waco, no fucks were given, surrender or burn.

>>729238454
In Washington DC and in Chicago, yes, all handguns were banned. That was DC vs Heller was about.

Combined with California's ban on all conventional semiauto rifles, and that's a ban on practically all weapons manufactured in the last 50 years.

>>729238688
So, then do you disagree with me? How can you disagree with me? Based on Chicago, DC, and California, it's quite obvious that the Democrats do want to ban all guns - at least all semiauto guns (and revolvers). I'm sure that they'll come for bolt-action rifles after that too, just like England and Australia, which Obama and Hillary and Bernie all complimented on gun control policies.

>>729238732
Why are you leaving out NY? We can't even have the billet button

>>729238045
>Doesn't matter. For a sufficiently pissed off populace, either you kill them all, or you will have an effective guerilla war.
Are you fucking retarded? That is literally my argument. An invading nation would realize that level of destruction necessary to subdue the US population and respond accordingly. It might just take a few bombed out cities, it might require a level of genocide akin to such atrocities as the Indonesian genocide or others. Nations have been conquered in the past and subjugated after mass killings of their people.
>You cannot beat an enemy with military power.
Yes you can. That's literally how most enemies are defeated. You use military power to crush a enemy to the point they are willing to either stop fighting and start talking peace, or crush them to a point were they are willing to submit to your political aims.

> Every conflict must be ended by a political settlement.
Yes, and sometimes you achieve that ending by dropping two atomic bombs on them.

>You don't understand this
Actually, I think you've proven you don't understand it. I suggest you spend some time reading a bit more about military history.

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>>729232138
Why choose cuckoldry, instead of freedoms?
We have 7th largest guns per capita in the world, but only 3 homicides done with firearm per million people per year. And number is that "high" only because our two mass shootings in 21st century, done with stolen guns. In fact, over 90% of those homicides are done with illegal gun anyways.

Guns don't kill people, I do. So what is your pathetic excuse for not having liberty to do what you want, or have decency of letting other people do things that they enjoy?
>Y-you don't need guns!
Just because you might don't need something, is not viable reason for not having option to get it, poorfag.
>Civilized people have police, you savage indian!!
What is the point of relying on police with gun usage at dangerous situations, when those cuckers or what ever pathetic excuse for police you happen to have, don't even have those said guns, but a fucking rape whistle.
>b-b-BUT GUNS ARE SCARY AND MIGHT SCARE OUR LOVELY RAPEFUGEES AWAY!1!
Well, I can't argue with that, you disgusting faggot. I'm fucking ashamed to live right next to europe.

>>729238816
Sorry, didn't know. Just talking what I know about offhand. California IIRC also just got rid of the bullet button exception.

(I'm not a gun owner. Just someone interested in the debate.)

>>729238434
Vietnam had something called China and URSS who were supplying them with SAM missiles, explosives, anti tank weapons, tanks and all sorts of goodies.
When the N. Vietnam army rolled into Saigon, they rolled in soviet made tanks not with bicycles and AK's.

>>729234910
Fuck yeah

>>729238807
No. I don't agree. However I agree with a democrat in office because of people like you. People afraid of evil democrats taking away their guns. After sandy hook my company got a 1.5mil dollar order for 30/40 round mags. Cuse everyone was afraid.

>>729238053
>Couldn't happen. Least currently.
Yes it could especially with how war-happy the US has been. It's not out of the realm of possibility the US will pull some dumb shit and end up in war with China or Russia. Living with you head in the sand and saying "couldn't happen" is about the dumbest thing you can do.

>>729238915
Let's start with the facts. Do you agree that they banned all handguns in DC and Chicago? Do you agree that California, and apparently NY, banned possession of all conventional semiauto rifles by banning rifles with quick reload detachable magazines, and even recently did away with the "bullet button" loophole?

Do you know about the handgun make and model list for California? It bans the sale of all new handgun make and models. Purportedly, they'll put new guns on the list if they satisfy some insane and impossible requirements, but all gun manufacturers have said that they won't even try. How is that not a subversive attempt to ban all handguns?

In California, that together is a practical subversive attempt to ban all guns.

What do you disagree with?

>>729238863
And the ARVN were equipped by who?

>>729238945
Nope. Won't happen. MAD. For us to go to war with Russia or the opposite would assure everyone dead. So we just posture and flex.

>>729239028
In ny they couldn't outright ban ak's and ar's. So they tried to ban the features. No mag over 10 rounds. Any semi auto that can take a mag can't have: forward grip, adjustable butt stock, flash suppressor, mussle break, pistol grip, bayonet lug. So they came out with the "ny legal featureless ar-15". Look it up.

>>729238284
>No one is trying ban guns.

You have a point.
California passed a law saying you can own approved handguns, but no new handguns can be added to the approved list unless they are manufactured with a process that doesn't exist yet.

Pelosi actually said she would ban them if she could. But she can't, so I think that means she isn't trying.

Mag changes take less than 2 seconds from an untrained person, but a cap of 10 makes people feel safer, so where's the harm in restricting those.

So yeah, no one is trying to ban guns, just make things harder on people who want to use them for lawful purposes. But that's not a ban.

Less people die of obesity when they have to buy 3 16oz bottles of diet coke instead, instead of one heart stopping 44oz cup of Pepsi.

>>729239071
>For us to go to war with Russia or the opposite would assure everyone dead.
Yes because human beings are always rational and never do anything stupid. I mean humans haven't done anything to destroy the environment and cause irreversible climate damage that will end all life, nope mankind would never do that, is would assure everyone dead.

And humans would never dumb toxic substances into their own water supplies, that would never happen since it would assure everyone dead.

No humans are completely rational and always avoid anything that would hurt themselves and others.

>>729239215
You're right. And honestly.. the m16 was designed to mortally wound people. Better to incapacitate one person and have 2 more out of combat taking that person out of harms way. You shouldn't hunt with an ar. So what's the point other than enjoyment?

>>729233649
Well, you americunts do have a reputation for guns....and being fat, religious and stupid...just sayin'

>>729239389
Yeah we do. What country are you from so I can toss some stereotypes your way?

>>729239511
Im a leaf!

>>729239189
So, you have some bizarre gun that cannot be reloaded? Because rifles with detachable magazines are not legal in California, no matter the capacity of the mag.
https://thegunrange.biz/california-bullet-button-ban-law/

>>729239373
People hunt with AR's all the time. People call it a varmint rifle for a reason.

>>729239651
No I have it featureless. I can put in mags all day long as long as they aren't over 10 rounds

>>729239651
https://www.dark-storm.com/dsi/ds-15/ds-15-moe-rifles/dark-storm-ds-15-moe-featureless-5.56-rifle-black/

OP is captain planet until he realizes the true world of noone gives a fuck about him. And that day he gets raped, nearly killed, or someone close to him gets killed and has to endure what humans are truely capable of, he will not undetstand a police officer is designed to take care of a crime that ALREADY HAPPENED, not to prevent it. Prevention does happen, but rarely. a phone call takrs a long time, including the time it takes to.get to your rescue. Maybe you will umderstand when death is near, believing noone is going to hurt you in your imaginary fuckin world.

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>>729232400
>We can do the same as the Vietnamese, who allready fought 20 years against their colonial oppressor France
>A whole people, that more or less know how to live in the jungle
>Have backing of Russia and China against US invasion

And most importanty, the technology gap between you and the US armed forces is vastly bigger than the one between Vietnamese nationalists and the US forces at the time.

The Pentagon is also a semi socialist (don't get triggered) center of power, that is decades above anything on the civilian market.

>>729239722
>>729239794
Ok. I see. You can avoid this if you avoid all of the "evil features".

However, if you don't see how this shows that the goal of the Democratic party is to ban all semiauto rifles, then there's no reasoning with you. Other policies show the goal is to ban all handguns too.

>>729239066
Lol the ARVN was like the Iraqi Army (before and after Saddam), completely useless and corrupt.

When both combatants have similar weapons the best soldiers win.

>>729239922
samefag here. and also its obvious he doesnt live near a military base.

>>729239922
Grab a bludgeon and beat the dude. Fucking newfag

>>729239373
Varmint hunting is cruel, and prairie dogs are cute. So tat reason is fucked up.
Deer and hogs can be killed with a bolt action, so no need for an AR there.
Competition shooters are such a small segment, so fuck 'em. They can compete with something else.
Cops kill too many people as it is, we don't need weapons of war on our streets.
As Joe Biden says, all you need is a shotgun for home defense.
Defending yourself shouldn't be as easy as it is with an AR, "it's unfair" (quote from stepfather of deceased oklahoma home invader)

To summarize, if you want violent personal enjoyment, whip up a batch without lube, like a civilized person.

>>729239993
They aren't. That's why there are checks and balances you dolt. Just like trump failed with his travel ban twice.

>>729240050
I agree with you fool.

>>729240083
> They aren't.
Yes, they are. Why the hell else do they have the handgun model registry with impossible requirements to add new guns? Why else are they continuing to expand the definition of "assault rifle" to include more and more rifles?

> That's why there are checks and balances you dolt. Just like trump failed with his travel ban twice.
What does this have to do with the goals of the Democratic party? Absolutely nothing as far as I can tell.

>>729233159
>i usually go around committing crime
>cant do that in the usa, i might get shot

Looks like guns save the day. Better than thr police it seems

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>>729232545
>They need my taxes to work

Assuming the very unlikely scenario happens, where a large enough amount of citizens would stop paying taxes to affect them having enough in the budget:
They have their own gasoline and oil reserves and probably food for decades. Not to mention, that the Pentagon is the biggest US institution to change into renewable energy sources.

What do you think they do with the military budget, that is bigger than the next 11 countries combined? lol

>>729239922
You speak as if life is important

>>729240159
Goals and achievements are two separate things. And history has proven that if there is a demand there is a supply. That being said, I think there should be more gun control.

>>729240294
And we were talking about the goals of the Democratic party. You just did a bait and switch.

Of course the Democratic party will find their goal difficult because of recent SCOTUS decisions. However, the goal of most of the party leadership and a substantial portion of their base is to ban all guns.

>>729239993
you can slap any rule or law against weapons down you want. firearms in america is as deep as religion lol. paperwork isnt gonna change that. and i dont even own a gun. i hate guns. but i come to the realization of its presence isnt going to go away just because they ban them. the black market would fuckin sky rocket forcing legal non criminalistic citizens to flock to it. so instead of legal fbi background checked purchases, theyll just buy whatever they want with am even larger selection. shit aint gonna change.

>>729240434
So, are you admitting that the Democratic party leadership wants to ban all guns?

>>729240488
No, It's just a strong opinionated comment to if thay were the case.

>>729240375
I honestly don't believe that is the case. I honestly feel like they are trying to give their constituents what they want - reasonable gun control. Keep in mind politicians want to stay in office. They do so by appeasing their constituents. There is no grand scheme. If democrats decided tomorrow that abortion was terrible.. best believe the democratic politicians would all turn pro life. Plus the industry was so much better when it was driven by fear. :(

>>729240631
Then please explain the DC handgun ban, the Chicago handgun ban, and the California handgun model list which is tantamount to a state-wide handgun ban, and the new California laws that ban most semiauto rifles, and it looks like that noose will continue to close.

So-called "reasonable gun control" is largely a joke. Rifles are no more dangerous than handguns - the stats bear that out. Even for mass shootings, half of all mass shootings happen with handguns only, and also account for half the total death count. Even so-called assault weapons are not statistically more dangerous than handguns. Magazine capacity limits are also a joke.

The only explanation that makes any sense is that the leadership and people who propose these things have no idea what they're talking about, or the more likely proposition is that the gun control lobby is like the anti-abortion lobby - trying to chip away at the right as much as possible with nuisance laws, to go as far as the courts will let them.

i had sex with an antler once. moose logic is proprietary. you give a moose an inch each year, eventually it will be full moose tyrannicle.

>>729240800
yea but anyone in the ages of 10-25 mostly dont understand that. back to the basics of "why do merikanz fight 4 gun rightz duurrrr cuz i didnt fight for mine now im jelly, durrrr"

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>>729240631
The numbers don't lie. Obama and the threat of a Hillary presidency did more for the weapons industry than the NRA ever did. Lawful gun nuts started hoarding ammo causing conspiracy theories, which made for a self fulfilling ammo prophesy. Within the next year fire sale price guns will hit the market, causing an increase in gun crime, which will perpetuate the cycle.

If you don't die, shit will be fun to watch.

>>729240800
I beg to differ. Semi automatic rifles are much more efficient to kill many people vs a handgun. However handguns are more dangerous in my opinion. Only because they can be easily hidden. And you're right.. most of them don't know what they are talking about. They aren't gun owners. They haven't shot. They see an ar-15 and an ak-47 in military movies and the ak in war town countries. A mini 14 is no less dangerous then a ar15. But to honestly think there is some sort of "agenda" is foolish. Your boy trump was at the NRA convention last year talking about how there will be no places that ban guns. Oh the irony that he was at a fucking NRA convention speaking in a hall that didn't allow guns inside.

>>729241096
Exactly. It was a good time for the industry. I ordered for my company 15k ar/m16 mags. When trump won I cancelled the order.

>>729241096
>Within the next year fire sale price guns will hit the market, causing an increase in gun crime,

Citations please. That's full of shit.

>>729241127
>I beg to differ. Semi automatic rifles are much more efficient to kill many people vs a handgun.

For civilian contexts, the stats say that you're wrong.

The difference matters in military contexts, when the enemy is shooting back, but for civilian mass shootings contexts, there literally is no difference. When you look at the stats of all mass shootings in the US for the last 30 years, about half used handguns only, and that half also accounted for half of the total death count. You're just wrong. Reality says that you're wrong.

> Your boy trump
I'm a card-carrying radical Marxist, a social democrat. I voted for Bernie in the primary, and Hillary in the general election. I believe that Trump is morally comparable to Hitler, and we should all be very afraid. He's possibly the worst thing to happen to my country in my lifetime of 32 years.

PS: Fuck you.

>>729241253
Ok you're skewing the numbers. Of course the majority of deaths are by handguns. The big massacares that make the news are usually rifles. That's like saying sugar kills more people yearly than guns. And you'd be right. Just like auto crashes and the like. More people have died from smoking cigarettes then people killed on 9-11 by hundreds of thousands. It's not fair to compare.

>>729241444
No. Fucking mass shootings only. Half are handguns. Half of the total deaths are handguns.
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jones-full-data
Here's the data. Go to the third table. Add it up.

Ex: IIRC, Virginia Tech was entirely with handguns, and with 10 round magazines.

>>729241444
By that logic, fuck tightening up security at airports.. more people are killed going to the airport by wrecking.

>>729241253
>Citations please. That's full of shit.
No citation needed, but only slightly full of shit.

More cheap guns = more guns in low income homes. Most robberies occur in low income areas. Most guns used in crime are not bought, but stolen.

I may not have the numbers for things that have not happened yet, but my logic is sound. I just hope I can buy something other than a high point when prices hit rock bottom.

>>729241534
Your logic is not sound, on several levels. Your connections are tenuous at best, and it's probable that it's statistically insignificant. Gun ownership rates is only very loosely correlated with gun crime rates. Other factors are much more important, such as economic, and especially lead poisoning via leaded gasoline.

>>729241505
Fine. Assuming your argument. You do feel it should be as easy to get a handgun as it is a rifle?

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AMERICANS ARE MIND WIPED ANIMALS
THE CULTURE OF VIOLENCE IS MADE IN AMERICA
IT IS NOT BY A CHANCE
IT IS TO KEEP PEOPLE FIGHTING AND KILLING EACHOTHER AND LEVING THEIR OPRESSORS ALONE

>>729241700
Generally, yes. If anything, handguns should be harder to obtain than (semiauto) rifles, because they're easier to conceal, which is why they're used more often.

>>729241769
At least we agree on something.

>>729241824
I am a firm believer about the legal meaning of the second amendment, and I'm a firm supporter of the rule of law, which means the right of weapons ownership shall not be unjustly infringed until and unless the federal constitution is amended.

Having said that, I think that we should also institute certain gun control of a certain kind. In particular, we should license all gun ownership. It's like a license to drive on public roads. Driving on public roads is a constitutionally protected right (Bell v Burson), but it's also a licensed right. I don't see why guns should be any different. Further, I also argue that under the power of the congress to discipline and train the militia, it is legal to require mandatory training, which can bring licensing. This is also well supported historically, such as by the second federal militia act of 1792. People then can opt out of militia training, but then they also lose their gun owner's license.

For my full rant, please see here:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ak6bx8jyDxIlsLuFHHevw-4RQ7R5vJb15RtTNG5d79w/edit

>>729241611
Leaded gasoline hasn't been sold in most parts of the country (us) since the mid '90's. Economic factors are the primary driver of most crime.

Loosely correlated or not, there is still a correlation. I was only being half serious, but the threat is as real as the fact that you are just as likely to be the victim of a home invasion as you are an armed robbery.

Despite things not being likely, it's good to know what is within the realm of possibilitiy.

>>729242177
The difference in gun ownership levels probably causes less than a 5% or 10% difference in gun crime rates. It will probably be lost in the noise. These sorts of laws don't actually do anything significant to crime rates.

I appreciate your recognition that the effect is going to be small.

PS: I'm not a gun owner.

>>729241700
It should be easy to get all of them unless you are a prohibited person.

>>729242002
Driving on public roads is a right given to us by the government.
The right to self defense is given to us by God. The government can not take that away or "license" it.

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>>729242002
>It's like a license to drive on public roads. Driving on public roads is a constitutionally protected right (Bell v Burson)

That's not what the Bell v Burson decision at all stated. Driving is a privilege, not a right. The decision simply stated that the privilege couldn't be revoked without due process.

If you are trolling, well done. I actually had to Google that shit.

>>729242177
PS:
Don't underestimate the amount of remaining lead contamination from leaded gasoline. It's really bad.

>>729242587
Well, I'm an atheist, there is no god, I disagree, and your reasoning is contrary to well established constitutional principles, and arguably contrary to the practices of the founders.

>>729242624
>That's not what the Bell v Burson decision at all stated. Driving is a privilege, not a right. The decision simply stated that the privilege couldn't be revoked without due process.

Which is a distinction without meaning. It cannot be granted arbitrarily, and it cannot be denied arbitrarily. Bell v Burson specifically said:

> Suspension of issued licenses thus involves state action that adjudicates important interests of the licensees. In such cases, the licenses are not to be taken away without that procedural due process required by the Fourteenth Amendment. [...] This is but an application of the general proposition that relevant constitutional restraints limit state power to terminate an entitlement whether the entitlement is denominated a "right" or a "privilege."

>>729242587
Please don't bring God into the debate between natural vs. granted rights, adds more flame into an already fire topic.

>>729242624
How do you think that's trolling? There is no such thing as a government "privilege", in the normal sense of the word. "Privilege" denotes something that can be granted and revoked at the government's arbitrary discretion. That's exactly what SCOTUS said the government shall not due.

Further, that sort of reasoning is servile. The idea that the government may arbitrarily decide that some people may do something, but others may not, is tyrannical. It's entirely inconsistent with a free society.

I fucking hate everyone who says that "driving on the road is a privilege, not a right", because of that incredibly authoritarian and servile attitude that it rests on.

>>729230500
>>729231651
You didn't make shit. You copied someone elses joke and pasted it on a newer image.

>>729242800
Please show me on the Bill of Rights where the mean lady from the Dmv touched you.

The purpose of government is to rule. Period. The particular form of government is up to the people, by vote, or by force. The nature of government is tyranny, at a level deemed acceptable by the people. Don't get pissed at me for stating the obvious.

The free state movement may be morally and ethically in the right, but they're not lawfully right. It is what it is. Anything else is just childish fantasy.

>>729243197
Thankfully, at least for the right to drive on public roads, SCOTUS disagrees with you.

Again, I'm making a nuanced point. I am not saying that the licensing scheme is wrong. The government may require licensing for activities that are particularly dangerous to others. This is also exactly what SCOTUS has said.

However, SCOTUS has also said that these licenses cannot be granted or revoked arbitrarily, and the licensing system must be connected with the public good, and rules that have nothing to do with the public good are unconstitutional.