Explain to me how that's not the case.

>>715356571
That's a nice stock picture of a woman.
Only Americans use gallons stupid. This is clearly fake, not that you care.

>>715356216
“I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.”


― Winston S. Churchill

>>715356216
> giving the money you earn back to the government

stay cucked

>>715357339
That's not an actual argument.
Iceland is preety welthy and taxes are preety high there.

>>715356216
Same thing applies for everything different from capitalism

This is capitalism:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JIuGuZzTxA

>>715357339
This is the political equivalent of a food analogy.

>>715357585
Reminds me of the Video "Bizarre Opening Ceremony For Gotthard Base Tunnel"

>>715357585
They make shiny things. K.
Tell me when it's gonna feed the homeless.

>>715357586
Explain how

>>715357524
>He fell for the scandinavian meme

Stay poor, socialistfag

>>715357757
Who gives a fuck about the homeless

>>715357850
> Scandinavia is socialist
topkek

>>715357757

Why doesnt the homeless feed themselfs

>>715357134
thats a danish actress who played a teacher on a show

>>715358082
because they are
homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless = no house = no job = no cash = homeless

>>715358066
I wasn't saying that, you stupid fuck.

>>715357134
Is that your gotcha? That the person who converted danish kroner to dollars converted the liter price to gallon price?
Very convincing mate

>>715358244
Then they're fucking useless and need to be put to work in camps

>>715358244
and thats life get over it

>>715358282
What exactly are you saying then?

>>715358244

Why did they put themselfs in that position

No Im not trolling. People make their own beds. Most homeless are there because of bad choices.

>>715358332
May i ask if you are jewish?

>>715358244
I'm homeless. I make money by contracting neighborhoods of people to take their trash to the curb on trash day. 1 dollar each week. With that I've afforded this neeto phone, a gym membership for showers, and Im applying to various fast food places. Niggas gotta stop making excuses

>>715358425
This. I have no sympathy for people in 2016 with every opportunity they choose to squander

>>715358495
Per house per week I mean. They leave the cash in their doors

>>715358425
No Family, Social Phobia, Mental Problems, Drugs, Sick of this cruel capitalist world, Lost the will to live but too scared to an hero
etc...

>>715356216
>nastiest of men
Alongside literally everyone else.

>nastiest of motives
Self interest? Really? You'd rather build a system around relying on some other motivation?

>Somehow
You literally democratically elect people into financial power with your wallet based on what they provide you.

Pick a cause, if enough people care about it, it becomes profitable for someone to pander to that cause & donate to it in exchange for the good marketing it provides them.

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>>715356216

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>>715356216
because every other system has worked so much better

If you squander all your opportunities to get ahead in life that's your fault. But you commie cucks would rather rely on the government for help.

>>715358597

Literally all of those examples doesnt matter or is your own fault, except for maybe mental problems, which is a minority.

Again, same question, why did these people chose to leave family/start doing drugs/drop out of school/not show up to work and get fired.

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>>715356216
>>715354626
>>715354626
>>715354626
>>715354626

>>715358667
First off, he didn't say that. Second, that mother fucker couldn't brush his own hair and got lost on the way to the university he studied at every day. Outside of theoretical physics he's a literal retard. Why do people keep appealing to his intellectual authority (which is a logical fallacy in itself) for anything that isn't about physics!

>>715358942
>he didnt say it
>but even if he did, its stupid
>but even if it wasnt, we dont have to listen to him

this is what you sound like

anyone would think ur mad bro

>>715359039
I never said that what's written is stupid. All I said were facts, true or falsifiable. Come at me bro

>>715358597
Basically me
>>715358850
Everyone has had different experiences in life. I've have a horrible upbringing in a horrible environment. I cant even imagine some of the shit that some people have been through. We are all human though. Try to be more understanding and compationate than judgmental and self centered.
Some richy bitch boys just won't ever get it though and blind their entire life. Its sad really...

>>715356216
Keynes was a jerk and every country that atempted to folow his lead ended up in heavy debt, bankrupt. His statement is bullshit because "capitalism" is just a word for FREEDOM. People are free to work and to buy whatever they want. So in the end every one is responsible for what is doing with the money, if you like apples buy apples, if you want trap porn go for it. And this is what makes capitalism better. Each buck you spend you are voting to elect the winner of free market.

>>715359331
>Doesn't realize dems are the rich boys
>has never experienced working class culture

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“So you think that money is the root of all evil?” said Francisco d’Anconia. “Have you ever asked what is the root of money? Money is a tool of exchange, which can’t exist unless there are goods produced and men able to produce them. Money is the material shape of the principle that men who wish to deal with one another must deal by trade and give value for value. Money is not the tool of the moochers, who claim your product by tears, or of the looters, who take it from you by force. Money is made possible only by the men who produce. Is this what you consider evil?
“When you accept money in payment for your effort, you do so only on the conviction that you will exchange it for the product of the effort of others. It is not the moochers or the looters who give value to money. Not an ocean of tears not all the guns in the world can transform those pieces of paper in your wallet into the bread you will need to survive tomorrow. Those pieces of paper, which should have been gold, are a token of honor–your claim upon the energy of the men who produce. Your wallet is your statement of hope that somewhere in the world around you there are men who will not default on that moral principle which is the root of money, Is this what you consider evil?

>>715359717
I work hard faggot. For myself.

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“Have you ever looked for the root of production? Take a look at an electric generator and dare tell yourself that it was created by the muscular effort of unthinking brutes. Try to grow a seed of wheat without the knowledge left to you by men who had to discover it for the first time. Try to obtain your food by means of nothing but physical motions–and you’ll learn that man’s mind is the root of all the goods produced and of all the wealth that has ever existed on earth.
“But you say that money is made by the strong at the expense of the weak? What strength do you mean? It is not the strength of guns or muscles. Wealth is the product of man’s capacity to think. Then is money made by the man who invents a motor at the expense of those who did not invent it? Is money made by the intelligent at the expense of the fools? By the able at the expense of the incompetent? By the ambitious at the expense of the lazy? Money is made–before it can be looted or mooched–made by the effort of every honest man, each to the extent of his ability. An honest man is one who knows that he can’t consume more than he has produced.’

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“To trade by means of money is the code of the men of good will. Money rests on the axiom that every man is the owner of his mind and his effort. Money allows no power to prescribe the value of your effort except the voluntary choice of the man who is willing to trade you his effort in return. Money permits you to obtain for your goods and your labor that which they are worth to the men who buy them, but no more. Money permits no deals except those to mutual benefit by the unforced judgment of the traders. Money demands of you the recognition that men must work for their own benefit, not for their own injury, for their gain, not their loss–the recognition that they are not beasts of burden, born to carry the weight of your misery–that you must offer them values, not wounds–that the common bond among men is not the exchange of suffering, but the exchange of goods. Money demands that you sell, not your weakness to men’s stupidity, but your talent to their reason; it demands that you buy, not the shoddiest they offer, but the best that your money can find. And when men live by trade–with reason, not force, as their final arbiter–it is the best product that wins, the best performance, the man of best judgment and highest ability–and the degree of a man’s productiveness is the degree of his reward. This is the code of existence whose tool and symbol is money. Is this what you consider evil?
“But money is only a tool. It will take you wherever you wish, but it will not replace you as the driver. It will give you the means for the satisfaction of your desires, but it will not provide you with desires. Money is the scourge of the men who attempt to reverse the law of causality–the men who seek to replace the mind by seizing the products of the mind.

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“Money will not purchase happiness for the man who has no concept of what he wants: money will not give him a code of values, if he’s evaded the knowledge of what to value, and it will not provide him with a purpose, if he’s evaded the choice of what to seek. Money will not buy intelligence for the fool, or admiration for the coward, or respect for the incompetent. The man who attempts to purchase the brains of his superiors to serve him, with his money replacing his judgment, ends up by becoming the victim of his inferiors. The men of intelligence desert him, but the cheats and the frauds come flocking to him, drawn by a law which he has not discovered: that no man may be smaller than his money. Is this the reason why you call it evil?
“Only the man who does not need it, is fit to inherit wealth–the man who would make his own fortune no matter where he started. If an heir is equal to his money, it serves him; if not, it destroys him. But you look on and you cry that money corrupted him. Did it? Or did he corrupt his money? Do not envy a worthless heir; his wealth is not yours and you would have done no better with it. Do not think that it should have been distributed among you; loading the world with fifty parasites instead of one, would not bring back the dead virtue which was the fortune. Money is a living power that dies without its root. Money will not serve the mind that cannot match it. Is this the reason why you call it evil?

>>715358667
A fucking jew talking about another jew's work. Fuck.

>>715359570
Capitalism is not synonymous with freedom.
Freedom is synonymous with liberty, liberation, release, deliverance, delivery.
You have fooled yourself sir.

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“Money is your means of survival. The verdict you pronounce upon the source of your livelihood is the verdict you pronounce upon your life. If the source is corrupt, you have damned your own existence. Did you get your money by fraud? By pandering to men’s vices or men’s stupidity? By catering to fools, in the hope of getting more than your ability deserves? By lowering your standards? By doing work you despise for purchasers you scorn? If so, then your money will not give you a moment’s or a penny’s worth of joy. Then all the things you buy will become, not a tribute to you, but a reproach; not an achievement, but a reminder of shame. Then you’ll scream that money is evil. Evil, because it would not pinch-hit for your self-respect? Evil, because it would not let you enjoy your depravity? Is this the root of your hatred of money?
“Money will always remain an effect and refuse to replace you as the cause. Money is the product of virtue, but it will not give you virtue and it will not redeem your vices. Money will not give you the unearned, neither in matter nor in spirit. Is this the root of your hatred of money?
“Or did you say it’s the love of money that’s the root of all evil? To love a thing is to know and love its nature. To love money is to know and love the fact that money is the creation of the best power within you, and your passkey to trade your effort for the effort of the best among men. It’s the person who would sell his soul for a nickel, who is loudest in proclaiming his hatred of money–and he has good reason to hate it. The lovers of money are willing to work for it. They know they are able to deserve it.

>>715356216
muh invisible hand will fix it

>>715356216
kid you're just a lazy douche bag.

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“Let me give you a tip on a clue to men’s characters: the man who damns money has obtained it dishonorably; the man who respects it has earned it.
“Run for your life from any man who tells you that money is evil. That sentence is the leper’s bell of an approaching looter. So long as men live together on earth and need means to deal with one another–their only substitute, if they abandon money, is the muzzle of a gun.
“But money demands of you the highest virtues, if you wish to make it or to keep it. Men who have no courage, pride or self-esteem, men who have no moral sense of their right to their money and are not willing to defend it as they defend their life, men who apologize for being rich–will not remain rich for long. They are the natural bait for the swarms of looters that stay under rocks for centuries, but come crawling out at the first smell of a man who begs to be forgiven for the guilt of owning wealth. They will hasten to relieve him of the guilt–and of his life, as he deserves.
“Then you will see the rise of the men of the double standard–the men who live by force, yet count on those who live by trade to create the value of their looted money–the men who are the hitchhikers of virtue. In a moral society, these are the criminals, and the statutes are written to protect you against them. But when a society establishes criminals-by-right and looters-by-law–men who use force to seize the wealth of disarmed victims–then money becomes its creators’ avenger. Such looters believe it safe to rob defenseless men, once they’ve passed a law to disarm them. But their loot becomes the magnet for other looters, who get it from them as they got it. Then the race goes, not to the ablest at production, but to those most ruthless at brutality. When force is the standard, the murderer wins over the pickpocket. And then that society vanishes, in a spread of ruins and slaughter.

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“Do you wish to know whether that day is coming? Watch money. Money is the barometer of a society’s virtue. When you see that trading is done, not by consent, but by compulsion–when you see that in order to produce, you need to obtain permission from men who produce nothing–when you see that money is flowing to those who deal, not in goods, but in favors–when you see that men get richer by graft and by pull than by work, and your laws don’t protect you against them, but protect them against you–when you see corruption being rewarded and honesty becoming a self-sacrifice–you may know that your society is doomed. Money is so noble a medium that is does not compete with guns and it does not make terms with brutality. It will not permit a country to survive as half-property, half-loot.
“Whenever destroyers appear among men, they start by destroying money, for money is men’s protection and the base of a moral existence. Destroyers seize gold and leave to its owners a counterfeit pile of paper. This kills all objective standards and delivers men into the arbitrary power of an arbitrary setter of values. Gold was an objective value, an equivalent of wealth produced. Paper is a mortgage on wealth that does not exist, backed by a gun aimed at those who are expected to produce it. Paper is a check drawn by legal looters upon an account which is not theirs: upon the virtue of the victims. Watch for the day when it bounces, marked, ‘Account overdrawn.’

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“When you have made evil the means of survival, do not expect men to remain good. Do not expect them to stay moral and lose their lives for the purpose of becoming the fodder of the immoral. Do not expect them to produce, when production is punished and looting rewarded. Do not ask, ‘Who is destroying the world? You are.
“You stand in the midst of the greatest achievements of the greatest productive civilization and you wonder why it’s crumbling around you, while you’re damning its life-blood–money. You look upon money as the savages did before you, and you wonder why the jungle is creeping back to the edge of your cities. Throughout men’s history, money was always seized by looters of one brand or another, whose names changed, but whose method remained the same: to seize wealth by force and to keep the producers bound, demeaned, defamed, deprived of honor. That phrase about the evil of money, which you mouth with such righteous recklessness, comes from a time when wealth was produced by the labor of slaves–slaves who repeated the motions once discovered by somebody’s mind and left unimproved for centuries. So long as production was ruled by force, and wealth was obtained by conquest, there was little to conquer, Yet through all the centuries of stagnation and starvation, men exalted the looters, as aristocrats of the sword, as aristocrats of birth, as aristocrats of the bureau, and despised the producers, as slaves, as traders, as shopkeepers–as industrialists.

>>715358384
it doesnt have to be

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“To the glory of mankind, there was, for the first and only time in history, a country of money–and I have no higher, more reverent tribute to pay to America, for this means: a country of reason, justice, freedom, production, achievement. For the first time, man’s mind and money were set free, and there were no fortunes-by-conquest, but only fortunes-by-work, and instead of swordsmen and slaves, there appeared the real maker of wealth, the greatest worker, the highest type of human being–the self-made man–the American industrialist.
“If you ask me to name the proudest distinction of Americans, I would choose–because it contains all the others–the fact that they were the people who created the phrase ‘to make money.’ No other language or nation had ever used these words before; men had always thought of wealth as a static quantity–to be seized, begged, inherited, shared, looted or obtained as a favor. Americans were the first to understand that wealth has to be created. The words ‘to make money’ hold the essence of human morality.
“Yet these were the words for which Americans were denounced by the rotted cultures of the looters’ continents. Now the looters’ credo has brought you to regard your proudest achievements as a hallmark of shame, your prosperity as guilt, your greatest men, the industrialists, as blackguards, and your magnificent factories as the product and property of muscular labor, the labor of whip-driven slaves, like the pyramids of Egypt. The rotter who simpers that he sees no difference between the power of the dollar and the power of the whip, ought to learn the difference on his own hide– as, I think, he will.
“Until and unless you discover that money is the root of all good, you ask for your own destruction. When money ceases to be the tool by which men deal with one another, then men become the tools of men. Blood, whips and guns–or dollars. Take your choice–there is no other–and your time is running out.

capitalism has enabled more people in less time TO WORK AGREE TO SELL THEIR LABOR for the agreed price,thus enriching both parties,improving their material condition than anywhere on the planet,truth or a lie?

>>715356216

Everybody knows this, but nothing can be changed.

Communism.

A form of govenment made by poor people to make everyone poor. because the poor know best how to handle money.

>>715358384
"get over it" isn't an argument.
If I stole your car, would telling you to get over it make it okay?

>>715358495
>no pic
>didn't happen

>>715360482
That sentence is so fucking broken I don't want to pass judgement.

>>715356216
It's really simple. For a company to be profitable they have to provide something of value to someone else.

The most successful companies deliver the best products at the lowest costs. This competition for profit improves manufacturing efficiency, and therefore prosperity for all.

>>715359039
You sound like a colossal fucking dunce

>>715357513
Earning is a spook.

>>715358332
And who's going to fund the camps, genius?

>>715358425
People aren't 100% rational and omniscient. People who make bad choices don't do so because they're like "wew lad I wanna ruin my life lol". They make bad choices because there either ARE no good choices, or they lack the knowledge to make the right choices.

>>715359331

it's the runaway ego

>>715361225
The united states payed millions to study if prayer is effective over long distances. I think we'll figure it out

>>715358756
>But you commie cucks would rather rely on the government for help.
Why should I even consent to a government's existence if I can't rely on it for help when I need it the most?

>>715358850
"No family" can mean your family dies or divorce, not that you run off and abandon them. And if your family has no/insufficient income, you may have to make a choice between work or school. Staying in school will make it possible for you to get a better job later on, but it's all for nothing if you starve to death before you graduate.

>>715359570
Most capitalism in practice these days incorporates some Keynesian principles. And capitalism is "freedom" the same way feudalism is "freedom" - only difference is that the power you inherit is based on your family's wealth, rather than their titles of nobility.

>>715360603
Communism isn't a form of government, it's a philosophy that calls for a stateless society. In practice, all attempts at Communism have turned into states where a small ruling elite enriches themselves at the expense of everyone else.

>>715359856

and then those men come and take it from you via civil asset forfeiture laws. they see the pot of gold in your bank account and go "hurr durr drugs" and then confiscate it from you without due process.

shut up and sit down

>>715361050
>and therefore prosperity for all
You were making some sense until there.

>>715361225
You do not hold people accountable for their actions. Simply needing something is enough of a reason for you to see they should get something. You cannot force the strong to work for the incentives of the weak. The phrase "for the greater good" is euphemism for suicide. You will never have wealth because you lack what it takes to earn wealth. You will not be carried by the strong.

Capitalism doesnt mean the guys at the top care about those at the bottom, it encourages people to add value to society in order to earn their worth. In capitalism, the reason the poor are poor is because they either have no self control to limit their spending or they have nothing of value to contribute to society.

>>715360449
new pasta?

>>715361878
Lol wtf kind of memelord mantra is this?

>>715361738
Improved manufacturing efficiency means more goods produced, more goods produced means cheaper goods (supply/demand).

It's why you can buy a burger at McDonalds for $1.

Not complicated.

>>715361225
What about people who make bad choices because they are easier to make than good choices?

>>715361225
if they lack the knowledge to make the right choices, it might have something to do with a public education.

When schools are in the private sector, you have the best teachers and the best course material, or you lose your students to another school (assuming tuition is the same).

By making schools public, not only do you lose this competition, but there are actually laws stating that if you live in X district, your kids MUST go to Y school, killing any incentive to keep better staff or improve course material. Standardized testing determining funding kills any incentive to improve course material, as you want your course material to match the standardized tests as much as possible.

tl;dr if we didn't needlessly throw education into the private sector, maybe people would have the practical knowledge to not become homeless.

>>715361738
absolute prosperity. not relative prosperity. Capitalism will create a gap between the rich and the poor (those who offer value and those who do not), but regardless of this, the developments of the rich will raise the overall standard of living despite the gap in class.

The ambition to climb to the top stimulates innovation to set yourself above others. If we didnt have this innovation, our general standard of living would be much lower.

see any communist country. Why would you try and make something great if you get nothing out of it?

>>715362111
Most places that have public schools have private schools as well. Meaning that the people who go to public schools are those who wouldn't be going to private schools anyway.

>>715356216
You could have socialism where garbage men and college professors make the same amount of money.

>>715362048
>McDonald's
>the best products

>>715360102
Fuck you come to live in venezuela and you will know that capitalism is freedom and socialism is bullshit.

>>715362088
Why would one choice be "easier" to make than another?

>>715358942
only on 4chan is einstein unironically called a retard

>>715362352
That's not how socialism works.

>>715362383
Venezuela isn't even democratic. By definition, it cannot be socialism, unless government decisions JUST HAPPEN to be identical to what the people want.

>>715361708
this is not a problem with capitalism, this is a problem with civil asset forfeiture laws. How can people honestly say "System A is bad because there exists law B that allows for bad outcome C to happen"

Then you throw out the ONE bad element, in this case, law B. You dont throw out the WHOLE system of A (in this case, capitalism)

seriously fucking retarded cmon

>>715362363
Yeah good job totally missing the point.

Thanks for reminding me I'm talking about economics on fucking /b/.

>>715362384
I could choose to either smoke a joint with a buddy, easy choice, or write a job application, harder choice

>>715362539
The whole system is based around rich people trying their hardest to be even richer while not giving a shit about everyone else. That's now one law, that's the whole system

>>715362623
No, the choice requires equal effort. What you're saying is you're unable to see beyond the short term. Which is an example of mental illness, not "difficult decisions".

>>715361708
Does it pain you that your best argument against this truth is an arbitrary law that has nothing to do with the discussion at hand? That your instinct tells you to derail the central argument and go on a tangent that has nothing to do with what we're talking about? It is the hallmark sign of your weakness. And it is no one' fault but your own.


>>715361948
It's a speech on money from Atlas Shrugged, the most triggering book to commies/liberals known to man.

>>715361998
>thinks it's meme shit

This is why you're incapable.

>>715360676

It wouldn't make it okay, but its obviously the solution. You cant do shit about it but get over it and move on... dumbass.

>>715362111
or maybe the school just panders to their constituent population and teaches the kids creationism and propaganda, and they still make a profit because people are ignorant bums

>>715362350
no, not necessarily. If the public sector for schooling didn't exist, let's say, then there would actually be affordable private schools that there can't be now, because they can't compete with the low low price of free attached to public schools. You would still have the elite private schools of course (we still have Cadillac cars even though there are cheaper options, because some people will always want the best) but there would exist schools with affordable prices, that would have REAL incentive to improve their staff and course material, or else lose students to another school with a similar price, but better teaching methods.

>>715362297
The ambition to climb to the top also encourages backstabbing, exploiting others, exploiting corruption ect.

>>715362754
The choice itself does, the actual consequence of the choice doesn't, which is what matters when it gets down to it. Stoners choose to smoke a joint rather than do something useful because its easier, ie more fun, to smoke a joint. It's not mental illness, but yes, it is a deficiency to see beyond the short term. Stoners see the long term, just in a completely different light to a functioning member of society

>>715359331
regardless of your upbringing, there are many forms of government aid to help get you on your feet. If you are able to utilize these and manage your funds well, you can eventually get yourself on your feet. Sure some people have to work harder than others to get to the same place. But thats no excuse to stop trying.

John Stockton was a tiny white man playing in the NBA for the Utah Jazz. Despite his size, he was one of the top players for the team. He was born disadvantaged in terms of physical stature, but he played better than the others because he didnt give up.

>>715362550
except you missed his point which was that mcdonalds efficiently makes burgers, but those burgers are also horrendously unhealthy and addictive.

>>715362958
I would rather be a stingy crook than a slave with no hope of moving up

>>715362958
> implying communism doesnt generate one of the most corrupt social structures

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Capitalism is bad. There must be a balance between socialism and capitalism to be able to get the fairest system for most workers.

>>715356216
Arguments against capitalism are all arguments against people who want stuff and are willing to work for it. This is literally against human nature - the desire to do and have more. "You're not allowed to have something other people don't." Socialist thinking in a nutshell.

>>715362685
But HOW do they get richer? They have to lower their prices or you go to another store that beats them. They HAVE to hire more people because that's where they get their production that keeps their prices down. They HAVE to make their products well, or make their services worthwhile, or again, you the customer will find a BETTER deal somewhere else.

You are grossly oversimplifying what capitalism is. You are correct in saying that greed is what drives it, but you don't seem to understand that the best way to make money IS to put your customers first. If you don't do this, another company that does, will take all your customers. Businesses don't just magically make money out of nowhere. They have to FIGHT for a market.

Capitalism just needs regulations. Its not fucking complicated. Socialism need not apply.

>>715362958
No it doesn't. You're just telling yourself that to justify your completely jaded outlook on the world and your cripplingly apparent lack of willpower to find reason to live.

Capitalist question: What should I get for Christmas?

>>715363274
There's a difference between acknowledging human nature and saying all humans should be permitted to fulfill their desires without restriction. I mean you might as well say laws against rape and theft are "against human nature" because it's human nature to desire material wealth and have sex with people.

>>715363249
Is that the fucking GoCompare man?

>>715362958
You'll never escape corruption. Look at communism. But even if the side effect of corruption is a negative of capitalism, the benefits of an innovative society probably outweighs it.

would you rather live in a prosperous city where you can live comfortably despite knowing some people in some companies are betraying eachother to get higher? or live in a country where people are dying left and right to disease because no one has invented any kinds of vaccinations.

>>715363519
What do you mean?

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>>715363475
I thought communism was deep and unique when I was in 8th grade too.

>>715363450
You should get a life.

>>715363475
There's a difference between fulfilling personal desires and fulfilling monetary desires obviously. No one it talking about the former. Quit derailing the central argument.

>>715363650
1st tier from the bottom, above the word "even".

>>715358495
Definitely not true

>>715356216
Your a faggot

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>>715356216
"It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker that we expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest."
-Adam Smith, 1776.

>>715363785
hahhaha lol. The dude with the mustache?

>>715363450
Go on amazon and type in something you want, chances are it's on sale.

>>715363928
>Go on amazon and type in something you want,
But there's nothing that I want.

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>>715356571
> hard for lover class to get by
> denmark

>>715363450
Donate money to the UN.

>>715363475
Yes except that there is nothing wrong with trying to offer the best products or services at the lowest price other than the fact that you are doing it for personal gain.

Now, as far as socialism and taxes go, why don't you explain why taking more money from me than citizen X to fund a program that directly benefits citizen X but doesn't me, is morally right?

Example A: you have 50,000 dollars but could live off 40,000. I see another person that is in a tough spot that the can't get out of but can get out of it with 10,000. Assuming that this money is cash (since the notion of banks would probably offend you) let's say that I take 10,000 from you by force, and give to this less fortunate man. What makes this any different than theft?

Now, you're probably going to pull the democracy card. So, on to example B, which expands on A.

Let's say again that you have 50,000 that you earned. Citizen X is again in need of 10,000 according to me and the majority of our community. Again, I take it by force, and give 10,000 to citizen X. Is this any more justified than example A? If it is, how so?

>>715356571
This pic is so fake it's unbeliveable. They don't have neo-communism. I really hope you are a troll.

>>715363249
Pretty sweet to be Swedish. Dont have to struggle to live in luxury, and a complete safety net if something goes south.

>>715363748
So I guess now that you're all grown up and enlightened, you think we should abolish all laws and live like animals? Since that's what human nature is - it's being an animal, nothing more and nothing less.

>>715363770
Why is money a "special case"?

>>715364335
fucking sjw cuck amirite?

>>715363249
No, if the economy grows enough, there will be such a demand for labor that workers can afford to quit a company to join another one. Companies would have to fight for their labor, which they currently dont have to, because there arent enough jobs for you to run to. They know they have you fucked, and they're right. What would create more jobs? Less regulations on business so that expanding isn't so goddamn hard and risky. They can save enough capital to expand their company (and therefore the number of jobs) and this goes for their competition too. Funny how capitalism is more toxic the more it is regulated (other than by competition and market demand)

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>>715364335
Bor i Sverige själv också. Allt är gött utom bostadskrisen och muslimerna.

>>715364009
You like bitches, right? Well bitches like swole dudes. You wanna look swole, right? Well buy THIS as motivation to get swole to get bitches!
https://www.amazon.com/Father-Forgive-These-Receive-T-shirt/dp/B00XWSDD10/ref=pd_sim_14_7?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=MGH1DYFDWTS6VB9GX3K1
Merry Christmas bro!

>>715356216
it is the case, however, the motive is capital, its so effective that there are many cases were illegal organizations go straight because its more profitable

>>715356216
The nastiest men with nasty motives will work for themselves, the good men with good motives will work for good reasons, anyone can work for whatever the fuck reason they want and their success will be determined by their own effort and skill. Even the nasty will succeed, but they hold no power other than that you willing give them as customers because they have no authority in regards to law.

- dumbed down for anons...
I like company A, so I buy their stuff
I hate company B, so I don't buy their stuff
The government does not mandate who I buy from
The government does not fuck with the companies to hinder my choices.

>>715364659
Are you a paid shill?

A business owner has to work for the benefit of the consumer because if the product is shit nobody will spend their money on it.

>>715364606
And that's the problem. It creates a monopoly of one big company owning almost everything in that branch of things and if that company falls the entire economy fails and it's the deppression all over again. We can't let companies get way too big because if they fail they bring the economy with them.

>>715364809
>A business owner has to work for the benefit of the consumer because if the product is shit nobody will spend their money on it.
Explain Windows 10, then.

>>715364593
ye nothing hurts quite like mad people on the internet

capitalism is great if you have capital, nobody on 4chan have capital and are therefor idiots for supporting capitalism.

>>715364905
In unregulated capitalism it's impossible to create monopolies because there's too much competition.

>>715356571
Stupid bait is stupid
Btw here in Italy we have more taxes than Denmark and our suicide rates are one of the lowest in europe (even lower than usa).
Suicide is usually connected to daylight and religion/social belief not welfare and taxes.

>>715364720
No that's free market economics. An anarchistic theory that pretends you can have a system where government doesn't regulate circulation of goods I.e. Trade. Capitalism is a system where the government operates in the interests of those with capital. Hence why it has the word capital in it.

>>715361012
you HAVE NO ARGUMENT JAGO FF YOU FUCKHEAD THEORISTS
WHO NEVER HAD A JOB HAVE RUN THINGS INTO THE GROUND FOR EIGHT GODDAMN YEARS
ASSHOLES GO FUCK PAUL KRUGMAN YOU BOLSHEVIK CUNT,,ever had a real jobbbbbbb??????? A JAY OH BEEEE EVER HAD ONE???
EVER???
eggheads' first and last resort when they have no answer zero
argument,grammar they are idiots you are an idiot
jagoffs
ya lost
capitalism got embraced stalinism tossed off the bridge,,lithuania estonia east germany, bulgaria,latvia,the 100 CCCPs,england said fuck you EU.
trump won
you lost cuck
ya losers
get a job

>>715364920
This is a good point, but isn't a problem of capitalism. This is a problem of microsoft Nothing says you have to buy a computer with windows 10, or upgrade to it.

You could use a Linux/Unix system, or an apple. Explain to me why you don't.

>>715357757
When the decent people with money volunteer and/or donate with the approx 1 million+ non-profit charities (Red Cross, United Way, Churches, etc...), who do it far, far more efficiently than any government program ever has or will.

>>715364905
yeah, why go through the whole hassle of capitalism when you can just have communism and have the government monopolize everything right from the get go.

>>715365323
False, because some products/industries are very good at creating monopolies. If you own all the coal mine in town, no one is going to be able to compete, because they're going to have to import coal from elsewhere, and that incurs transportation costs which prevents you from being able to offer the same low price.

>>715365442
No need to have an autism attack m8.

>>715364920
Regulation prevents companies from competing against monopolies.

>>715365364
I mean they have less suicides than america so the whole shit is just made up

>>715365515
>You could use a Linux/Unix system, or an apple. Explain to me why you don't.
Because a lot of software only works on Windows.

>>715365617
> welcome to lala land we have unicorns and rainbows!

>>715365661
Are you counting things like intellectual property rights as regulation? Because I'm not aware of any law that says only a few companies have permission to make computer operating systems.

>>715361654
>And capitalism is "freedom" the same way feudalism is "freedom" - only difference is that the power you inherit is based on your family's wealth, rather than their titles of nobility.

Actually, capitalism was one of the reason for the fall of feudalism. Smartest of common men invested into factories and banks and become more wealthy then degenerated feudals not knowing a shit about trade or investing. At the end of feudalism these elites were richer and therefore stronger then feudals and literally forced rulers to abolish the serfdom because they wanted free movement of workforce. It wasnt humanity what brought freedom. It was capitalism.

>>715361012
you HAVE NO ARGUMENT JAGO FF YOU FUCKHEAD THEORISTS
WHO NEVER HAD A JOB HAVE RUN THINGS INTO THE GROUND FOR EIGHT GODDAMN YEARS
ASSHOLES GO FUCK PAUL KRUGMAN YOU BOLSHEVIK CUNT,,ever had a real jobbbbbbb??????? A JAY OH BEEEE EVER HAD ONE???
EVER???
eggheads' first and last resort when they have no answer zero
argument,grammar they are idiots you are an idiot
jagoffs
ya lost
capitalism got embraced stalinism tossed off the bridge,,lithuania estonia east germany, bulgaria,latvia,the 100 CCCPs,england said fuck you EU.
trump won
you lost cuck
ya losers
get a job>>715361012
>>715361012
>>715361012

>>715365654
Nobody just happens to own all the coal mine in the world.

>>715357134
http://money.cnn.com/pf/features/lists/global_gasprices/

>>715366048
*in town not in the world. Sorry

>>715356216
And for some reason the lazy and the people who don't want to work won't depend on the government during socialism/communism?

>>715365654
>which prevents you from being able to offer the same low price
Exactly. They only stay a monopoly as long as they offer the lowest price, which is good for the consumer. C'mon man it's like you're arguing for us. What is the advantage of having a monopoly in your eyes? Because clearly, you can't raise your prices. The instant you do, competition will crop up.

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>>715365764
So are you implying that charities don't exist and help fucktons of people already or that people can't be good and have money? If it is the latter then we shouldn't give the poor money because it would make them bad.

Enjoy riding your unicorn.

>>715356216
Because no one in capitalism works for the community. They work for themselves. So the nastiest people will get by if they work hard, and the sweet lazy people won't get a single penny.

I encourage all libertarians in this thread to start reading some Hans Herman Hoppe. You need to realize, in the modern world basic free market principles won't be profitable in the long run. Neoconservatism, neoliberalism, and globalism in general will only lead to more ruin.

As for the commies, I'd unironically recommend for you to start reading Mein Kampf and other fascist/NatSoc literature. You have a lot more in common with us than you realize.

>>715362088
If you rather willingly make a bad but easy choice instead of good but hard, then you fucking deserve being miserable.
I can understand bad choices based on insufficient information, or just bad luck (most choices are about probability of outcome), but not this bullshit.

>>715365725
>Because a lot of software only works on Windows.
This is basically your admission that while windows 10 is shit, it is still the best product out there.

You don't have to make the best product you can to sell it, it only needs to be better than all your competition. May I ask you now, what is stopping Apple or Unix/Linux making their systems compatible with more software?

>>715364606
Sure, ever heard about slavery?
In purest form capitalism endorses slavery.

>>715366271
you say that as if its a bad thing.

Imagine if the entire world was only sweet but lazy people. we would all just starve to death within a week.

>>715366271
The reason why capitalism is viable as an economic model is because social interests and economic interests (for the most part) coincide.

Principles of supply and demand dictate that for every commodity it will be profitable for the company to efficiently allocate output to match society's demand (outside of monopolies).

Only issues are in oligopolies and monopolies. When there is competition the society and market stay healthy.

>>715366233
> rich people donating any significant value in general
> charities not being a industry in itself

>>715365826
I'm not saying that only a few companies are allowed to do that. I'm saying that regulation makes it too difficult to compete against larger companies.

>>715366563
Idiotic statement. Viewing the ideology in a vacuum and ignoring every other factor (humanity, ethics, morals) is just fucking stupid.

Besides, if a company insists on not paying its workers the workers will simply move somewhere else.

>>715366664
Yep. Your point being? It's the law of nature, you don't TRY to get by you WONT get by.

>>715357339
Boy, was he wrong. United states taxed itself in to the world's foremost superpower in the 40`s

>>715366676
True true, monopolies and oligarchies are a problem.

>>715366979
>America succeeded due to taxes
>not because of the manufacturing and exporting boom before, during, and after WW2

Is this what commies actually believe?

>>715366048
I'm not talking about the world, I'm saying for example in a country or small town. No one else can realistically compete for that market.

>>715366979
Pretty sure we just blew up the bucket.

>>715362623
If you choose not to contribute to society, why should society contribute to you?

hmm I could go hunt for some food, but it much easier to just lay down and die, so I'll do that instead.

>>715366271
The nasty people can do everything solo. If they want business to grow then they have to 1) be decent to customers to maintain sales, and 2) be decent to employees to maintain a workforce to take care of day-to-day business. Freemarket capitalism means that if an asshole can learn to play nice he'll lose it all since people are free to buy/work elsewhere. If his business is regulated/required by the government the he has no incentive to be nice since his business is no regulated to grow and/or guaranteed not to fail.

Freemarket capitalism means no fucking bailouts. If a business a large as GM or Chrysler could go under then they deserve it for fucking up so bad, and it's likely that out of the failure, other would rise up with new business to fill the void

>>715367000
Definitely. Not only are there huge ethical and moral problems with them, but they're also horribly inefficient in the market. Monopolies often require subsidies to stay afloat.

*Cough* big banks...

>>715367230
*nasty CAN'T do everything solo

>>715367109
the workers had decent lives because of taxes*

>>715365654
show contempt for a simple,gramatically decently constructed,brief answer,mate,,you got a mortar attack,,more people have followed the relatively few rules rules made and signed off on by the people,,and made their lives more comfortable than any other system of government on the planet,

>>715366563
oh boy here we go.

I'm just gonna say: You're wrong. You cannot afford to pay your workers nothing, because your workers will move to another company that will pay them.

Plus, you want to pay your lower and middle class workers so they can buy your product with the money you give them (which is to your advantage). Without giving the lower class money, who will buy your products?

You are just seriously trolling now, I think.

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>>715358667
>>715358942
>>715359220

He did write that, you moron.
>google "Why Socialism? pdf"

>>715366916
>humanity???
really?
something that doesn't fucking exist
The only reason we have laws protecting other people is because we want ourselves protected.
Morals don't exist, especially in higher circles

Pedophilia is common in higher circles. People that are rich have no morals and see their workers as mere numbers

Capitalism will always strive to go back to slavery, apple still produces its products with company's that use child labor just like Samsung and major other company's.

Ethics are for the poor people, the rich wipe their asses with it.

The only reason why we get a decent pay is because the workers in the western countries revolted in the past, they didn't receive the benefits they have today because of ethics, morals and humanity, but trough threatening to murder the rich.

t's all about self preservation, nothing more

>>715367148
I meant in town not the world (that was my bad). Either way if no other company can't provide the same low price and the same quality, how's that a bad thing?

>>715366203
It's not like companies can set any price at will though. The one who owns the mines in town can actually afford to offer a low price without taking a loss, the ones what have to import coal from elsewhere can't do that. So the one in town has no incentive to lower prices below a certain point.

>>715367437
the goal of the corporations is that people should just about able to buy their products so they can have as much of their money as possible at all times. Its a balance that inevitably collapses sometimes

>>715366483
>May I ask you now, what is stopping Apple or Unix/Linux making their systems compatible with more software?
Why don't you answer that? At one point it was possible to run Windows programs on the iPad, but Apple put a stop to that. Why did they do that?

>>715356216
You, the nastiest of men, work because you want money. You only do it because of this egoistic reason. But although you help the society with that because you offer your work to someone who then produces something with your work which other people consume = benefit for the society, read adam smith

>>715367501
Holy shit where do I even begin with this retardation.

So capitalism always wants to go back to slavery. Based on what evidence, exactly? Nazi Germany used Slave labour, Sparta was built in the backs of slaves, and would you not consider the wages of Soviet workers in the 20th century "slavery"? Slavery has always been an efficient way to produce, regardless of ideology.

I'm not even going to address your relativist stupidity on morals, instead I'm going to simply restate what I said before. If the company didn't pay the worker, why would they choose to work there?

>inb4 imperialism or something equally stupid
Like with all the examples I mentioned before, imperialism isn't unique to capitalism.

>>715368020
>If the company didn't pay the worker, why would they choose to work there?

Look at 19th century Britain. Low pay, meant massive workers, no regulations meant firing people on the go. People got payed just enough so that they could eat. While the rich bought the products.


>morals
People don't care for other people.
Don't believe me?
Go fake an injury on the street, not a single person will help you, on the contrary, they will steal from you.

>Based on what evidence, exactly?
Logical taught. Look at Belgium
Wages are getting lowered each year. The government allows it, because otherwise they would leave. The companies wanted the removal of laws that made it hard for people to get fired and laws that said that workers needed to know their working hours a day before hand. Now you can get called any time of the day, work 18 hours while only getting payed for 7.4, and its legal. I know of 3 companies that already do this, and its rising. Why? because there are no jobs, so the companies can do what they want.

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>>715367845
Explain doctors.

>>715359856
Except that most money nowadays is n made that way.

It is produced by fiat, by banks, by trading in bits of paper the that have no relation to real goods, real labour, real resources.

For example, Apple mad expensive more money in 2012 from investment than from sales of goods dislike. They have so much cash that they could le buy the entire entire GDP of then United Kingdom. For three years.

Everything. All the food, all the electricity used the water drunk, the clothes bought the entire houses built the cable tv programs rented, everything

All the work done.

From money made by shuffling paper.

So wealth now makes wealth, with no relationship to work, or any sense of earnings. No one "earns" a million dollars a year. No one works that hard, or has that much much expertise.

Capitalism has become a means of generating fake money, which can bee used to buy a value s stuff.

This is nothing a good system. It means that people who work get little, do those who have a wealth are given disproportionately more

>>715356216
Want me to explain it to you? Simple, govenment dont do shit, and stuff is built by work, thats the truth. Gather the best politicians - i have no idea of what that is supposed to mean to you - in history, none of them have the honor to lick Descartes and Tesla balls; none of them did shit, while geniouses who pursuited their will, did. Thats it, dont work, dont do shit, be a neet, the best spot for you shall be then in misery on your own shit. Shit dont get outta nowhere, government dot create things, it needs to be built, the world have causes, reasons and logic, denying them is denying existence and life

>>715367734
I don't know the answer to this, buddy. Either they find it more important to develop their own apple-flavored versions of microsoft programs and apps, or there is some law preventing from apple too closely mirroring Windows OS architecture in a way that allows compatibility with microsoft programs. The former is a failure on apple's part, and the the latter is a failure in IP/patent law. Note that in either case, it's not capitalism's fault.

>>715369321
explain what?
http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/buitenland/1.2549514

>>715359856
>>715359913
>>715359964
>>715360065
>>715360115
>>715360182
>>715360283
>>715360357
>>715360449
my beautiful/handsome niggas

>>715361896
But the inherited wealthy also have nothing of value for society- how about outlawing inherited wealth.

Make huge death taxes. Let each person prove their value

>>715367624
>It's not like companies can set any price at will though
I mean, yeah, they can. This is what determines your margin. They can't raise their price past what market demand dictates, or nobody will buy their product even if there is no competition, unless their product is seen as a necessity.

Yes I agree that having no incentive to lower them past a certain point is a bad thing for the consumers. But note that he can't hike prices up just because he is the only act in town. Other people that argue against capitalism seem to think monopolies and oligopolies have absolute power to do whatever they want. You seem to be somebody that understands this isn't true, thank god.

Because it's made under the assumption that all business owners are evil, which is an incredibly infantile view of our society.

Wal-Mart is such an evil company, that's why they donate millions of dollars to various charities. Retard.

>>715369022
>Why? because there are no jobs, so the companies can do what they want.

The real question is why are there no jobs? Does Belgium have a free enough market economy that business owners can afford to expand and create new jobs?

>>715356216
This is a fake quote OP

>>715370441

Tax write offs, they literally donate nothing. You can't be that fucking stupid.

>>715370860
Are you implying that I can donate money, and get more back than I put in?

WOW HOW HAVEN'T I HEARD OF THIS BEFORE. TIME TO GET RICH QUICK, THE GOVERNMENT GIVES ME TAX DOLLARS FOR SENDING MONEY TO CHARITIES.

>>715357134
Where did the Murkins originally get their gallons from? That's right, they took the gallon with them when the religious/economic oddballs they quit Great Britain.

>>715370076
inherited wealthy actually can contribute to society and economic growth by investing their wealth in various businesses as capital.

Literally every inherited wealthy person does this if they use a bank (unless it's one that gets bailed out, which again, is no fault of capitalism)

>>715370860
You do not do your taxes, right? Or else you are roayally fucked.

>>715371041

Huh, I guess you are. No idea how any of that shit works, do ya?

>>715371566
Look bro, you're the one claiming that donating tremendous amounts of can somehow turn a profit on their end. Please explain to me how they can turn around 1 billion dollars of charitable donations into a net profit, because if it's anything short of witchcraft, I will be disappointed.

>>715371794

Fine kiddies. Donating certain amounts qualifies you for specific tax breaks, that billion dollars you donate might end up saving you 3. That's the only reason any of them do it.

>>715372126
Do you honestly believe the shit you're saying right now?

Yes donations and charities can get you tax breaks and incentives, but to suggest that you can turn a net profit from donating is a colossally retarded assertion.

>>715372274

I work in accounting. Companies have entire departments dedicated to this very purpose. If I made $20, I'd get taxed $10. If I donate $2, I'd only get taxed $3, saved $5. Call it profit. Is that really so hard to believe?

>>715370540
Sorry for late response.
If you as an employee receive 10€ and hour
Your company needs to pay 30€ an hour
And a whole lot of other retarded taxes that only increased thanks to the refugee crisis.
So socialism is to blame.
But i find all monetary systems flawed by design. Communism is like the only one that can work if a computer is the ruler. But that would create a whole lot of other problems.
Too bad there is no perfect system, as of now capitalism with a hint of socialism is good as long there aren't any fucking parasites

>>715372804
You're going to need to backup those numbers with some actual IRS stats, because I seriously doubt that's how it works.

>>715373021

It's a lot more complicated than that, but I assure you that's the gist of it. It saves them a great deal of money.

>>715372835
do away with the retarded taxes and the system is fixed. Capitalism only failed here because it was over regulated.

>>715373287
you mean overtaxed, best thing the people are about to lose their pension, the government can't pay for it anymore. Water is the more expensive in my country, so is electricity. Yet we pay the most taxes.

We have 6 times as many politicians that each get 100k a year as the usa.
Take a guess where the money is going to

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Cmere negroids
>>715368370

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"the gambling man is rich and the working man"

Money is and resource is finite, not everyone can be rich in a capitalist system only the few can be. That means someone has to be poor and fucked over, those people are the workers.

>>715373567
NONE of these are a problem with capitalism though. it is a problem with the regulations. They are problems with overtaxing, crony capitalism, and corruption.

>>715360449
Sounds like flowery libertarian half-truths to me. Glorifying the gold standard and have little to no regard for those who are disavantaged by culture, creed, or genetics.

There's plenty of truth in there as well, but let not your heart be hardened, pretending it is objective truth throughout.

>>715356216
You don't expect them to work for the benefit of all.
You hope that you get to be one of the nasty men.

>>715356216
Your post is based on a logical fallacy. Good day to you sir.

>>715375425
Libertarians believe in curing social ills, they just disagree that the way to do it is by having a tyrannical government restricting our liberties in order to TRY (keyword because thus far they have failed) to help the poor, ensure justice and liberty for all, etc.

Go read a fucking book you democuck.

>>715375574
tfw you don't have any good points to make so you just flat out call other peoples views wrong