HEMA General - Historical European Martial Arts

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>>3061164
DON'T FORGET TO STRETCH!

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Anime Isreal

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>>3061240
ohbaby.jpeg

Painted masks can be okay.

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>>3061425
Is pic related /hema/ approved? (like anyone cares)

>>3061500
I think the skull one is borderline okay. A bit edgy but it's not a straight up refrence to anything and is actually decently done.

A good thumbrule could be that if it follows heraldric rules, it's probably good. All the fine helmets on the picture are based on flags or crests. A skull is basicly a heraldic figure so it's a bit so so.

Is there actually some guy with a dolan duck mask somewhere in the world?

>>3061531
>Is there actually some guy with a dolan duck mask somewhere in the world?
I don't think so, you can never be sure though.

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>>3061164
In response to >>3058928 comment
>Look at any photo of GHFS fencers and then look at any photo of the Australian HEMA clubs with their tabbards and meme masks. Which one do you think gives HEMA an air of legitimacy?

Look, m8, we're trying but when even your well regarded instructors have a higher incidence of being on the spectrum it's inevitable stuff like that happens.

Slowly it's changing, but a lot of the Old Guard are furiously clinging to what shreds of relevancy they still have.

Throw in the fact that the SCA in Australia is basically dead in the water and has nowhere to go; you have a recipe for
>"B-but muh cut-and-thrust garb worked in SCA. Why do I need a jacket that has the same rating?"
>"Muh heavy armour works for longsword..."
>"Fuck you all, cunts. I'm starting my vaginally viking themed group that uses kendo techniques and German LARP rules... But Gothic poleyns are okay..."

Thankfully I'm working with a local award winning fashion designer (how I got them on side I have no clue) and we're going to fix that. Keep your eyes peeled Australianons.

>t. Silver is still better than Lictenshitter.

How are the continents ranked regarding HEMA-proficiency?
Europe > North America > Australia > Asia > South America > Antarctica > Africa
Does that look about right?

>>3061500
absolutely right

>>3061680
South africa has a club, if i remember correctly. So Antarctica yet again takes the role of the tailgate

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>>3061531
>Is there actually some guy with a dolan duck mask somewhere in the world?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNdh8KRD2Os

>>3061724
>Antarctica yet again takes the role of the tailgate
IT HURTS

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>>3061500
>that mispainted Union Jack
REEEEEEEEE why is it so hard to look up the flag and get the diagonals right?!?

But besides that bit of autism, yes. That's bang on.

>>3061680
I don't think so. I've seen a Mexibro who was great at German longsword, better than any Ausfag I've seen. I think South America should be above Australia tb h.

>>3062533
I don't think you know how statistics works

>>3062533
>>3061680
Eastern Europe > Northern Europe > Southern Europe > Central Europe > Western Europe > Murica > Asia > South America > South Africa > Antarctica >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Australia.

>>3062647
>Western Europe >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Murica
>ftfy

>>3062893
Are you butthurt my western European mate?

>>3062903
What is western Europe and what is central Europe and what is eastern Europe?

>>3062989
Western Europe is much closer skill wise to NA than what this anon thinks.

>>3063029
What is western Europe? Like Germany alone has enough clubs to be its own league. Frenchies have some top notch stuff to.

>>3063082
Germany could be central europe though

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Since when are Shielhaus okay in Fiore?

>>3062533
Mexico is NA

>>3063842
where do you see a Schielhau exactly?

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What are some /hemag/-approved vidya, series and movies?

(Other than The Duelist and Rob Roy since pretty much everyone knows these.)

>>3063870
Book, I'd say "The Red Knight".

>>3063870
Alatriste is well made.

>>3063842
u wat m8?

>>3063842
Not all descending short edge cuts are schielhaus.

>>3062647
>Eastern Europe on top
How could you POSSIBLY defend this? When was the last time a Polebro won a major tournament or handled any weapon but a longsword well?

In the meantime, every time someone posts David Pascal ITT, multiple HEMAutists start considering sex changes just so they could try and get him to fuck them (no luck though bros, I doubt he has to settle for trannies).

>>3063870
>The Duellists and Rob Roy
Start looking for the other movies Hobbs did the fight choreography for; he's the man behind both of those. The Musketeers movies he worked on are probably the most obvious/important.

A lot of HEMA guys also seem to like Master and Commander and A Field in England, but those don't have much in the way of accurate swordfighting that I can remember.

>>3064706
You forget Russia comrade

>>3061500
Who gives a shit. If it isn't your helmet, and it isn't outright racist or insulting why should you care how someone paints their mask?

>>3064706
>David Pascal
Didn't know who he was, had to Google him.
If his aim is to be unknown to the larger community he's doing a good job.

>>3064706
While the polish are pretty slavic, I wouldn't call them Eastern Europe when we have countries like Russia and Ukraine. The biggest advantage of these countries that for some reason they never grew a rift between the different sword-sports. One day they all might spar with feders, the other they suit up and take a couple rounds of bohurts, then bench 3pl8 and deadlift 5pl8 the next day and then they run off to a larp for the weekend. All while being +100kg with <10% bodyfat and working in the military and being drunk all the time.

>>3065669
kek, based slavs!

>>3065527
Smallsword isn't exactly massively popular.
I do wish he'd be better known because he actually makes what is probably the most frequently mocked sword-type (unless you count spadroons) in HEMA look absolutely badass.

Just in case everyone here wants to ruin their trousers again:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44JxhHTgBvE

By the way, has anyone else seen this lecture?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pW4WwN_bM0
I'd say a lot of what he's talking about is a bit autistic ON DA STREETS shit, but in a sense he is kinda right. I suppose everyone should be figuring it out for themselves how much they want to do HEMA as a sport vs as a martial art in the sense of actual historical combat to the death.
The ideas regarding rulesets and the apparent resiliency of the human body were interesting, as is the concept of taking the omnipresence of daggers into account.

>>3063842
There's a theory, according to it the "volta di spada" is a hint about basic binding&winding. If this theory is correct, then shielhau-like moves are ok.

>>3065688
Damn. He made that first fencer look like an absolute clod.

Smallsword is fun, the issue is you sort of have to stop before it becomes too foil like.

Angelo, imo, is the cutoff for this. Lincour and Labbat, Hope and MacBane, that one German dude who's manual is actually really good? Those are the best.

On the lecture; HEMA as self defence I think boils down to the dagger parts and that's it. Even that is debatable given most people don't "icepick" grip 30cm spikes anymore.

That being said, should one find oneself with a chairleg or decent tree branch, it might be feasible.

>>3065962
He didn't argue about HEMA in the context of modern practical self-defence, as it's 99% unsuitable.

What he argued is, is that if we want to truly recreate the martial arts from back then, we need to look at the more complete package than what most people do now, hence looking at it from an ONDA (cobblestone) STREES perspective.

>>3065992
I should add that he didn't of course argue everyone should train in that way, he argued more that studying HEMA like that has academic merit and could yield interesting results.

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>>3065962
>On the lecture; HEMA as self defence I think boils down to the dagger parts and that's it. Even that is debatable given most people don't "icepick" grip 30cm spikes anymore.
Abrazzare, Kampfringen, Dagger work. Thats a whole lot of self defense. Funny enough, you find for many throws, locks, strikes, kicks and whatever a direct Japanese counterpart. You also have Hugo W. and his noble art of drunken brawling.
There are several problems however, there are very few people that really train this on a high level, and then theres this "too deadly for you" thing which makes training hard and competitive testing impossible.

>>3065176
>Russia
>Europe

>>3068610
The party with "people" in it is in Europe

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Since we've been talking about ONDASTREES related shit, I was wondering about thrust-related wounds.

Namely, whenever I read things about early-to-high medieval swords (basically everything up to type XIV), the literature will usually say how they're clearly dedicated cutters and whatnot.
Something tells me this is fundamentally false. Sure, a somewhat wide or even spatulate tip is not ideal for half-swording and poking between rings. But for thrusting against an unarmored opponent? Probably the results would be incredibly nasty.

In fact, I'm increasingly convinced that wide tips were in a sense intended for thrusting. Quite plainly, it's still pretty easy to poke through clothes and flesh with a sufficiently rigid sword, and a wide blade will deliver a far more ghastly wound than a more rapieresque tip. It seems that back in the day there were people who were skeptical towards slim thrusting swords. The wounds they created, while oftentimes eventually lethal, usually failed to stop an attacker if the thrust didn't hit just in the right place.

In other words, the old /k/ meme of STOPPAN POWA goes back a long way.

>>3072055
>not even page 10
reported

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>>3070642
Well then we get in to the old argument of cut-versus-thrust.

IMO a thrust on average leads to more mortal wounds but doesn't necessarily kill outright (unless it's in the brain or heart).

A cut tends to, on average, be more debilitating in an immediate sense but can be less mortal (cuts to arms, fat belly etc.). HOWEVER a solid blow to the head will kill just about anyone outright.

What's funny is, at least in English sources, the constant talk about how you should attack whichever part of your opponent is closer regardless of whether it kills straight away or not.
THAT IS NOT TO SAY that you attack with tippy-tappy crap, rather ever blow or thrust should have the potential to kill outright but if the opponent presents say their right hand forward, then attack that and end the fight without a murder charge.

Small town club instructor here.
I want to personally train sidesword in my class's free time. After I get a good set of skills going for it, I plan on demoing a class. I got the Longsword class off the ground and now to expand our numbers, I want to make a second weapon available.

I figured that there is plenty of sidesword material to research from. The accompanying off hand items are plentiful. And for empty off hand work, our class starts with Fiore. So there are always grabs and wrestling to do.

I figure the Sidesword can stand as a generic one-hand weapon for people to start with. For those interested in later periods, they can do their own research. For those who want medieval snb can do Lignitzer and I.33. Or buy an arming sword trainer and simply come to a sidesword class anyhow.
Those who want Rapier can be well served by learning the Sidesword, then the accompanying off-hands. Rapier people can likely do their own research.

Basically I want to attract more people to the class and don't want to research seventy different fucking systems. And I feel like having a generalist one hand sword to start and let people do their own shit would be advantageous.

Anyhow, I have Giganti and Marozzo to start with. Should I give Illka Hartikaenen my shillbux for his online school? Is there a good book to buy that will digest Sidesword for me?

>>3073592
>Anyhow, I have Giganti and Marozzo to start with.
I'd add that for sidesword alone, dall'Agocchie is pretty great, easy to read, specific drills are presented in the original text, he starts with single sword contrary to Marozzo, he is a later author bu still very close to the Dardi tradition, more 50/50 cut and thrust than before or after, good explanation of key concepts especially the various tempi of attack, he has the famous "learn fencing in one month course" as a sidesword primer. Plus it's a dialogue, so easy to read.

>>3073928
I shall definitely add dall'Agocchie then! Thank you for telling me about that. Which is the best English translation to work with?

Oh baby, my Regenyei feder should arrive this week, can't wait to try it (and compare it to my Berbekucz feder)

>>3074002
I wouldn't know, the only one I've used was the Jherek Zwanger one, foundable on the net as a pdf, I have only read this one and another which was in french...
It still is pretty good for what I could say.

Also Reinier van Noort made a "cheat sheet" that is a summary of everything about the single sword in dall'agocchie, quicker to work with but not a substitute to the whole text obviously.

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What's your opinion on modern materials in armored combat (aluminium, titanium)? Is it cheating or do you think that as the types of steel used aren't historical either (stainless steel, steels with cobalt, etc.) makes it okay? How about in training/competitive settings respectively?

Pic related is a titanium cuirass that I saw on my fb feed and it makes me frustrated yet aroused at the same time.

>>3074036
I will find both of them. Thank you for the help. A cheat sheet will be useful. Because when you read too much of a source at once, you forget things. So having stuff other people have interpreted helps you store that while you learn.
It's the reason why Fiore wrote in the first place.

"Well did he say that without books no one will ever be a good master nor student in this art. And I, Fiore, confirm it: this art is so long that there is no man in the world with such a great memory that he can hold in mind, without books, even a fourth part of this art. And I grant that not knowing more than the fourth part of this art, I would not be a master."

>>3074050
>titanium cuirass
wtf, I want that!

>>3074036
Oh. Zherek Zwanger's own hosting was pulled. And the only reference I get is a Zweeky Forum link. Which strangely appears to be an image board culture that has taken up shop in a traditional forum.
Odd.
Anyhow, I can't find the English translation. If you have the ability to upload it, I'd really appreciate it.

>>3074072
>>3074051
Here you go, hopefully it'll work, I'm a noob at this:
https://www.fichier-pdf.fr/2017/08/28/1572-dall-agocchie-eng/1572-dall-agocchie-eng.pdf

and here's supposedly RvN cheat sheet:
http://www.bruchius.com/docs/Agocchie%20Single%20Sword%20Cheat%20Sheet%20by%20RvN.zip

>>3074115
Thank you for the help. I will be starting on the reading and the cheat sheet as soon as possible, and I'm hoping to come out of this by teaching the first sidesword class in the area.
You have been a big help, anon.

>>3074135
You're most welcome fellow anon, glad to be of help.
As an addendum, here's a nice and recent vid with the interpretation of the long paired drill (at the end of the 22r folio) of dall'agocchie by Ilkka Hartikainen and Zoe Chandler, with some other stuff as well. Starts around the first minute.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPsi0T3Hn6U

>>3074146
That's also going to be useful. Thanks again!

>>3074050
The first thing I care of is safety, the second one is weapons and armors must be as close as the original in shape, weight and other physical propertis. If you can get so with different materials, well, that's great.
If the physical properties are altered, than it's a flaw or a cheat, depending on how it behaves.
HEMA is not reenactment, weapons and, in case, armors have to be historical but safe in the use, authentic construction is not required.

>>3074217
So then you're not against the Angus Trim or Albion method of construction with modern tools and modern alloys.
I can see why you think this way. And I agree. Our primary concern should be safety. There is a time and place for accurately created kit. Reenactors are best suited for that kind of thing, and many reenactors supplement their fighting knowledge with HEMA.

For us in HEMA, we're interested in the techniques. The martial arts. We wear safety equipment, but it is not meant to portray armor. If we could, for example, use thinner gauges of metal to make ourselves safer in gear that can portray unarmored combat, we would likely do it.
This is why we embrace new plastics and non-newtonian materials to create better gear that can be lighter, quicker, and safer, than historic stuff.
That's why we use fencing masks. We just need to up concussion protection. And possibly lining a fencing mask with something to stop the brain rattling may be the way to go. Or starting from a helmet and working with a steel mesh to prevent penetration. There are many ways HEMA can go for protective gear.

>>3074243
I'm not saying we should wear armors instead of modern jackets and masks.
Armors are for harnischfechten, which btw is a niche in a niche sport. In this case, armor physical properties are relevant, just as weapons properties are.
Blossfechten is ok the way is going. Safety gear doesn't and shouldn't be like a historical armor in any way. The less it hinders the better it is.

Well finished my beginner's longsword course today. Now a proper member of the club!
After the flourish exam and stuff it was basically our first proper sparring session. Even got to face the instructor, lost both times but got a hit or two on him. Could really sense the experience when fighting him. Glad I did this though, definitely going to stay at it.

>>3065527
Do any of you know what is his formal fights record or have any videos of him fight in tournies?

Also, are there any smallsword manuals that show 'flashier' techniques? Like the stuff he does in the video, but not nessecarily. Any flashy techs will do.

>>3076423
>being this tournamentfaggy
Tournaments are antithetical to proper martial practice, not proof of skill. How American can you get?

HEMA Ratings was a mistake, no joke.

>>3077003
>Tournaments are antithetical to proper martial practice, not proof of skill

With a proper ruleset, tournaments can be great. A lot of clubs are using shitty kendo-based point and judging systems, but the club in Phoenix hosted a tournament that I think produced very realistic fighting. It was $100 to enter, you get one life, no time limit, and the prize was a new longsword. So you had fighters who entered the fight with something to lose, and therefore fenced in a way that was pretty close to how a real duel may have looked.

Of course, that ruleset wouldn't work for every situation, but you can have rulesets that work in favor of realism. A really good rule is to have after-blows negate whatever point would be scored. There's a little bit of bullshit to deal with, but the end result is more meisterhau being thrown, and more winding to control the blade.

>>3077003
I mostly agree.

Tournaments are great and useful and I go to as many as I can, but hema ratings and fight records are such obvious bullshit, I don't know why anyone cares about them.

I feel especially bad for all the new guys coming up now who are going to their first tournaments and getting their results recorded forever. If you look at the guys at the top of the rankings now, all of them have been doing hema for a while, and all of them attended plenty of tournaments and sucked before beginning to get good, long before rankings were a thing.

>>3076423
>formal fights record
Jesus Christ, guy.

>>3076423
Almost all french treatises before the 1750's have the pass underneath were you go almost to ground (in La Touche in particular), a good deal of them up to Angelo have the thrust in the back (your back) too for instance.
You should point specific techniques in the video, but early french smallsword of the 17th c. could be quite flashy.

Is Singmud Ringecks Knightly Art of the Longsword worth it?

From some people I hear it's essential, and from others I hear it's very outdated and nearly a complete waste of time

>>3080226
Sigmund*

>>3077403
>I don't know why anyone cares about them.
Marketing.

>>3079795
Early French is pretty fun. As is Italian smallsword. I love how, no matter how early you go, they all complain about the foil not being realistic.

>>3080492
Can you tell me more about italian smallsword?

>>3080226
Ringeck is good for starters in the German school.
>outdated
like sword fighting in the 21st century kind of outdated?

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>ywn wrestling half-naked shredded men with your longsword
IT HURTS

>>3081181
*wrestle
fuck I'm retarded

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you guys disgust me, post more bucklers!

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>>3082367

>>3080629
Outdated interpretations.

>>3080504
>Can you tell me more about italian smallsword?
The TL;DR is there are two distinct "types".
Heavy: Used basically like a short rapier. Surprisingly high use of single-tempo actions.
Light: Used like a typical foil but with only regular Italian guards (Prima, Seconda, Terza, Quarte).

Depending on school it also changed how you gripped it, from one finger in the ring (like rapier), to two, or even a more "Spanish" style where the ricasso is gripped between the index and middle finger.

Anyone here going to swordsquatch next month?

>>3083553
Cool, thank you

>>3083266
Yeah well, thats not exactly a source but an interpretation problem for whatever book you had in mind then.

>>3085956
Not him but that's clearly WHY he asked about "Sigmund Ringeck's Knightly Art of the Longsword" specifically, ya mongoloid.

>>3085967
He asked about Ringeck, not about Lindholm&Svard.
Ringeck is legit, check the Austrians for interpretations, they did a lot of work on that source.

>>3086005
>He asked about Ringeck, not about Lindholm&Svard.
No, he literally didn't. Look, faggot:
>>3080226
>Is Singmud Ringecks Knightly Art of the Longsword worth it?

I like Ringeck's treatise too, but nobody's arguing that, you're just an idiot.

>mongoloid
>faggot
>idiot
take a guess why I don't take you serious...

>>3086092
Wait aren't you that epic Thibault rapier failure guy from lately? Like lots of swearing and zero clues.

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>>3063870
kingdom come: deliverance is a game that is literally based on the holy roman empire and incorporates HEMA elements into the combat.

>>3061240
Dig the take on 6th ward

>>3086127
wdytwa?.flv

>>3086139
>HEMA elements
Like swinging at a guy's head even though he's got a helmet on? Also, his wrist is fucked up. It shouldn't be bent that far, even for neben.

>>3087951
>Also, his wrist is fucked up. It shouldn't be bent that far, even for neben.
If you're not dislocating your wrist to pull of sweet moves then you need to reconsider your life senpai

>>3087951
>Didn't even notice he's cutting with the wrong foot forward
Noob detected

>>3088539
>>3088580
The wrist guy is clearly doing some advance level shit.
The wrong foot and aiming at helmet guy is clearly a novice about to get wrecked

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>watching a dank meme compilation on YouTube like some normie
>one of the clips is Matt Easton wearing a sallet and beating himself with a rolling pin

Guys, is Matt Easton dank?

>>3061164
hema is the only sport i ever see were a women is one of the best athletes in men and women divisions, that`s really interesting i don`t think any other sport have something like that

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>>3088751
Yes

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>>3087951
Helmets can be broken

>>3089565
>a women is one of the best athletes in men and women divisions
What in the name of Christ are you talking about? Women get rekt in HEMA.

>>3089726
I don't think we have actual evidence that such a thing was possible.
It's the medieval equivalent of a dude flying across a room after getting shot in a movie

>>3089860
Women doing well in mixed tournament settings is far from unheard of, Kristine Konsmo for example.

It seems to me that as long as it's not Longsword (or stuff like Ringen), women can compete on almost equal ground.

>>3089993
Isn't Konsmo pretty much like the only example of that though?
And she was doing ballet previously, it's almost cheating.

>>3090004
She's also ridiculously tall, not sure if that's really beneficial though.
My personal assumption is that with sufficient skill, your physical characteristics become a bit less relevant, depending on the specific weapon set of course.

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>>3089976
So it must have been the most popular meme in the middle ages

>>3088580
Pretty sure there is a ACL faggot hiding in this thread and showing his ignorance every now and then. Either that or some rassling guy got identity issues.

>>3090004
>Isn't Konsmo pretty much like the only example of that though?
Konsmo is a fine example of what happens when you are the only one who seriously trained S&B enters a competition of buffalos. You win by technique.

>>3090095
>Konsmo is a fine example of what happens when you are the only one who seriously trained S&B enters a competition of buffalos. You win by technique.
She has come further than this single moment though, she's probably even better at s&b and is apparently very good at r&d too. We'll have to see how far she gets with longsword...
But then she is somehow an "anomaly" seeing how she is more or less the only woman who is fencing at the highest level in mixed categories, and more or less the only one famous for it (or I don't know enough about the tournament scene which is very likely).

>>3090095
>Pretty sure there is a ACL faggot hiding in this thread
A few months ago there was someone claiming to be a ACL/HMB/BOTN guy able to discuss in the HEMA general without getting spotted.
Maybe other anons remember it too.

>>3089993
>far from unheard of, Kristine Konsmo for example
She's the ONLY woman who even gets close, she works her ass off, and she still can't beat the fat nerds who dominate longsword competitions. If there were four guys in the HEMA tournament scene who could walk up a set of stairs without getting winded, she'd never reach semifinals -- and she still usually doesn't.

>>3090184
>2/10 bait
>(You)

>>3089565
>hema is the only sport i ever see were a women is one of the best athletes in men and women divisions, that`s really interesting i don`t think any other sport have something like that
It won't last though sadly.
If both sexes were to progress (skill strength) at the same rate, ultimately the male division beats the female. Hence female divisions (if they were the same we wouldn't need them).
So ladies, get in to HEMA now while there is still a chance.

>>3090184
i thought about this a lot, a huge portion of hema champions are really overweight, they don`t look really athletic

>>3089860
>>3090004

kristine konsmo boyfriend is one of the best hema champions in the worl and he can`t beat her in rapier tournaments, he just can`t

>>3090687
>a huge portion of hema champions are really overweight
Who?
Neither of Axel Pettersson, Ties Kool, Martin Fabian, Anton Kohutovič or Arto Fama is overweight.
They may not look like pro athletes, but they look very athletic.
Are you talking about the US?

>>3089993
>It seems to me that as long as it's not Longsword (or stuff like Ringen), women can compete on almost equal ground.
Are you the ACL/HMB/BOTN guy the other anons are talking about? Or did you start HEMA last week? Longsword is much easier for women to deal with and do well in than almost any other weapon, because it requires less arm strength. Rapier is the hardest.

>>3090746
>Longsword is much easier for women to deal with and do well in than almost any other weapon, because it requires less arm strength.
wrong and wrong, you never see women fencing longsword competitive on mens level, thy physical demands in longsword are way higher than in any other weapon.

>Rapier is the hardest.
oh, you are "that" Brit.

>>3090700
Neither are the Poles nor the Ruskies. You likely are answering a troll post.

>>3088580
We don't know whether the guy cutting took a step or the guy in neben closed distance stupidly. If the latter, then a stationary cut with no step might be appropriate.

>>3061500
>modern french flag is okay
>chinese one isn't
but why?

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>>3092112
This isn't swords

>>3091263
Are you for real or just shitposting? There's a pretty solid consensus that rapier places higher physical demands on the fencer (arm muscles in particular) than longsword. Rapiers weigh as much as or more than longswords and you have to hold them extended with one hand the whole time, no Vom Tag shit.

>>3092491
Please, long sword is full contact, rapier isn't. Take a look at the longsword champs, they out muscle by far your average rapier champ. Even saber is harder than rapier. in fact, pretty much anything but smallsword is more physical than rapier.

>>3092035
I should've cut it out, tbqh I didn't see it because I was so focused on the other masks

>>3090746
>>3090161
Bohurt-fag here. No, even we know which fucking foot to step in with and know that longswords are the female-friendliest weapons. We might suffer from constant concussions but even we are not that stupid.

>>3092491
There's a difference between being easy to get into and being able to excel at it.
Sure, longsword is easier on the muscles, but there could be other aspects. Men unquestionably dominate women in longsword, while other weapons such as rapier and sword and buckler seem to allow some women to compete with men pretty decently.
It might just be down to a lack of truly good rapierists and stuff, but currently that's the situation.

>>3093793
>Sure, longsword is easier on the muscles,
Who the fuck even claims such shit? I mean besides Rapier-Bong? Longsword is physically most demanding and the one weapon where it is hardest to bridge the "physical gap" with technique.

>>3094167
Easier on the muscles TO GET INTO. Sword and buckler and rapier are both more strenuous for a beginner.

>>3094211
>Easier on the muscles TO GET INTO. Sword and buckler and rapier are both more strenuous for a beginner.
>Longsword is much easier for women to deal with and do well in than almost any other weapon, because it requires less arm strength.

You know it doesn't get any smarter just because you suddenly change goal posts.
Rapier is not especially hard physically, even tough you get sore shoulders the first couple times. And swinging a 1.5kg longsword is physically more demanding than the other disciplines.

>>3094229
>Forgets that one uses two arms while the other uses one while holding something close to the same weight

Long sword is far less tiring you retard

>>3094259
>t. Rapierfag
You are like the only one claiming that ever.

What do I have to do to get faster at swinging my saber? I feel like I'm so damn slow, especially after feinting it takes me forever to get to the actual hit

>>3094167
No way long sword is by far the least demanding on the body.

It's held with both hands and close to the body. Forget swords any weight is handled easier in the manner rather than at arms reach.

That's he beauty of longsword. In my opinion it embraces body mechanics better than any weapon I can keep fighting after physical exhaustion just by 'cheating' with my hips and legs. Not so with a rapier etc.

>>3094229
>>3094279
How much rapier have you done? Or saber?

>>3094279
>shit, everyone knows I'm a retard!
>better claim they're all the same guy and I'm forty different posters

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What's the equivalent of 'pay to win' in longsword? Training and equipment wise?

>>3097303
Pipe bomb

>>3097317
>Pipe bomb
Pretty sure that's against Longpoint's regulations

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>>3097303
Armor

>>3097329
Are they reallybl going to argue when ypu have a pipe bomb?

>>3097373
Fuck me, I hate phoneposting. *really *you

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>>3097303
A custom sword, with lenght, weight and mass distribution made just to suit you should be easier to wield. So you can train better and fight with less effort.
Always remember that the main point is training. Sword is a tool. A good tool helps you get the job done only if you learn to use it. Even the best tool is unuseful if you don't know how it works.

>>3097361
Left is unquestionably better

>>3097685
the undeniable truth

>>3097361
>no cod pieces
Shitty armour fām

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Fuck the gothic armors, I love the kastebrust!

>>3097303
Being tall with an extra long sword.

I even feel sorry for tall fencers sometimes. People inevitably roll their eyes a bit when the tournament podium is exclusively tall guys sometimes it's robs a little of their glory when they're genuinely skilled.

Guys with an extra 15cm on their swords tho... nah.

>>3097378
>the phone autocorrects to "reallybl" and "ypu"
Wad de fug

>>3097303
I don't like 40in bladed longswords with 13inch hilts, but it's definitely not pay to win. Neither is being tall with a long reach.

The biggest advantage is location. For example, clubs in continental Europe and the east coast of the USA that have high profile competitions. Making a yearly circuit to at least half a dozen competitions is far easier.

Having a club with their own brick and mortar location, that does tons of stuff like test cutting, rossfechten, guest instructors, etc. doesn't hurt either.

>>3098209
Nah not autocorrect, just shit at typing on it. Not used to typing on my new phon so usually make stupid mistakes like that.

>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y237mTaexrs
Since it's been posted on reddit, what do you guys think of Holmgang and their commenting behavior?
They're pretty big assholes judging from their website (and obviously lunatics from their videos)

>>3099104
>they claim they had two fatalities
>they don't thrust
They should start using thrusts and do rapier only.

If they wanted to do shit properly they would wear historical padded armour + leather gloves and not go at it like half naked tards. Also, who cares? Not a single federation would touch them with a ten foot pole anyway.

>>3099104
Agree with most of the comments. Why not use armor? I can appreciate wanting to study how sharps interact with each other but doing so in a t-shirt is pants on head retarded. All I can see is a bunch of tryhards "oh look we hurt each other more than the other nerds that use swords!"

>>3099104
>Using fucking mensur swords to fight
>No discernible style or system
>"WE USE REAL TECHNIQUES NOT FAGGOT BALLET" -actual quote
>"Real technique" means no thrusting apparently
>They legitimately have links to neo-nazi groups and kebab removal units

I don't really give them much though tbqh.
If I wanted to test a "sharp" sword on a person I'd just follow one of the plethora of styles, systems, or traditions that exist. Everything from "Fighting to the Bloom" to ACTUAL epee fighting with florets.

>>3098081
If you're going to pity the tall guys, pity them for seldom having other tall people to fight. We get away with a lot of bullshit that only works against shorter people, and it's hard to break that habit when it works a lot of the time. It's a non-trivial training hurdle; I'm constantly having to ask myself whether I'm doing things properly, or just getting lucky.

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Don't die on me.

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Does anyone know which manuals Matt is referring to here? I can't seem to find anything related to this.

https://youtu.be/tgbx4qXvOYE?t=281

>>3101980
Skip to 4:40...the time skip in the URL doesn't seem to work :/

>>3099104
I really hope one of them dies in a longsword fight on-camera. That would be pretty cool. The first death by longsword blow in nearly 500 years.

>>3102166
Maybe not 500 years. In a town I used to live in some guy was riding his bike early in the morning abd was stabbed 37 times and beheaded with a sword. Now it was most likely a katana but police didn't specify

>>3102429
>stabbed 37 times
I don't understand why so many times. It's not unheard of either
Do you think they get tired after all that stabbing?

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>>3102489
Most of the time they stab in the guts so it takes a while for the person to die, I remember seeing an interview with a maniac a while ago saying that he was surprised by the number of times he had to stab his first victim.

>>3102429
what the fuck

>>3102509
>dat image

Now... that's very informative... how did he figured out all of that?

>>3103960
He didn't, since Fairbairn's timetable is extremely outdated compared to what we know now.

>>3104065
What do we know now? I there a similar infographic with the new numbers?

>>3104093
We know that Fairbairn never really said how he got his numbers. We know that clean cuts heal a lot faster than ragged edge cuts unlike what Fairbairn said.

CONTEMPORARY KNIFE TARGETING by Michael Janich and Christopher Grosz is a good resource if you're willing to cough up the $30 to buy it.

>>3104361
>We know that clean cuts heal a lot faster than ragged edge cuts

I can't believe people still believe the opposite to this.

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My club's been considering getting more bucklers, specifically ones that aren't Cold Steel.
Shields Plus came up in that discussion because they're reasonably priced to the point that importing them sounds like a good idea:

http://www.shieldsplus.co.uk/page3.htm

The grips (leather wrapped metal bar) sound kinda bad though. Has anyone dealt with them? Can you for example specify a custom grip construction without jacking up the price too much?
Perhaps the best solution would be to make them ourselves.

>>3105264
Oh, and weight is also an issue. How heavy are they?
There's a huge problem with reenactment bucklers, namely that they're usually way fucking overbuilt. It's one reason why we're considering these things.

>>3105264
Wait a minute... if you're happy to order from a UK retailer, why not just get proper steel bucklers from The HEMA Shop? https://www.thehemashop.com/bucklers

>>3105535
They're the aforementioned overbuilt sort. They weigh roughly twice as much as a historical one.

>>3105577
How many historical pieces do we actually have? I would think many would have survived.

>>3105842
Would not, rather.

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>>3105842
Bucklers made of organic materials have largely rotted away. Metal bucklers on the other hand survive in fairly decent numbers, some with some pretty zany Talhofferesque shapes.

The most average weight is roughly a kilo for historical examples, give or take a few hundred grams. Reenactment ones can weight two or even three.

This one (iron boss with wood, leather and sinew) weighs nearly 1.4 kilograms, but also has a diameter of 43cm, which for a buckler is rather big, meaning this thing is an outlier in more than one way.

The problem with overweight bucklers isn't necessarily about handling or lack of muscles or so; it's that it eliminates the purpose of a buckler.
A buckler must be convenient to carry around, it's the defining characteristic. The small size and low weight are a consequence of that. If you make a buckler too heavy, or too large, it'll get in the way of whatever activity you're supposed to be doing outside of its use in combat. Whether it's manual labour, marching (presumably with more than just a combat load), or fighting with a primary weapon (say, a two-handed polearm), the ideal buckler's presence would be entirely unfelt.
When that little buckler weighs nearly as much as a bass guitar, it's obviously not doing its job.

>Started practicing about half a month ago
>Today was my fourth lesson, first time I got to properly spar with someone
>Sparring partner been training for quite some time now
>Got absolutely bullied and trampled; Only managed to land like one strike or so.
>Feel absolutely crushed mentally, I figured I was bad but didn't realize I was THAT terrible


Feelsbadman.jpg

>>3106553
Normally, I might feel a little sorry for you, but you're being so dumb that I can't bring myself to.

>>3106553
review what you did wrong, practice on it, then try again. don't expect to be anything for the first few years, just be open and receptive

>>3105264
What about making your own bucklers?

>>3106638
Any link to some good tutorials?

>>3106553
It's normal, don't give up. Everyone was shitty at some point. I feel like a total hypocrite telling you this because I get constantly crushed after every sparring session that goes wrong, but it is what it is. Don't beat yourself over it, think about it rationally, tape yourself when you fight so you can see better what you did wrong, and don't fear or reject criticism. It's going to get better eventually

>>3105577
>They're the aforementioned overbuilt sort. They weigh roughly twice as much as a historical one.
...Bruh, did you even look? The plain 14ga 9" buckler weighs 900g; if you want a light and not too wide buckler, that's exactly the thing. You can even get this, which comes in under 300g, if you're a real stickler for unobtrusiveness:
https://www.thehemashop.com/small-buckler-stainless-steel

I mean yeah, get a Talhoffer buckler and it'll weigh a lot more, but I *strongly* doubt whether it's ahistorically heavy for one of those.

>>3106553
You're a fag. NOBODY's good after three weeks. You're going to have to work on it for a year minimum before you can expect to hold your own properly in sparring. It ain't fuckin' bicycling, you don't pick it up on the way out of the sporting goods store.

>>3106028
You know Welsh bucklers are fucking huge right?

It seems Britain had a preference for what essentially amounted to a centre gripped shield, but just a little smaller.

>>3108580
>Welsh bucklers are fucking huge
Sauce?

>>3106553
Losing its the best way to learn in any martial skill. Look at how and why you lost, what you need to improve, what you need to learn, and (for the hit you got in) what you did right and should continue to do.

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>>3107086
There are a lot of tutorials online. Basically you have to choose the kind of wood and the thickness, then cut it.
Buy a good shield boss.
Pro tip: cover the wood with linen. Don't use cotton or synthetics. Glue the linen to the wood with vynil glue and it will be fine.
Apply boss and handle with nails and rivets.. Apply rawhide on the edge. Put rawhide in water until it's soft, then put it on the buckler and keep it in place until it's dry again. Then nail it to the buckler.

>>3107422
9" is really on the tiny end. The 15 inchers are all over 2 kilos which is stupid. 14 gauge is just too fat, you can use much thinner metal and it'll still be more than strong enough.

>>3108580
All sources we have are continental though. Huge bucklers undoubtedly would be really fucking effective though, especially those convex ones that seem perfect for trapping enemy weapons.
>>3109858
Museums lol

>>3108271
Barring the use of those funky padded swords, I don't understand why a club would let anyone spar after just 3 weeks.

>>3095422
Thats likely why Pim Terminello or Rainier van North are such huge muscle monsters, because rapier is oh so physically demanding.
Theaverage longsword champion is why heavier and more muscular than rapier champions. Guess why...

>>3096716
Obviously a lot more than you.

>>3095422
>No way long sword is by far the least demanding on the body.
Thats bullshit and you know it. Like for example in longsword women are completely outpowered by the stronger men and need their own division because it is physically so demanding. Your average longsword champ is built like tank.
In Rapier they can easily compete with men because it is way less physical. Also manlets and lanklets usually win here.

>>3110708
No I'm serious and I explained why. Rapiers and Longsword aren't so far apart in length or weight but one is held with two hands close to the body and the other at arms length. The latter is more physically demanding.

Both are popular with women and both have mixed and Men's and Women's tournaments.

>>3109858
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yu9naBPQZjo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ouZcAcLMWI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uaMVpzP2aSU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hcB-ER5C8qA

>>3110854
As an addendum to this post.

What you're arguing is that grappling is more physically demanding than fencing which is true but Longsword doesn't equal Grappling any more than any single handed swords in anything but HEMA reduced to its simplest terms.
Sure the range involved makes it more likely with Longsword but it's still very rare unless both opponents want to grapple or one is completely unmatched to the other. Though suggesting grappling is a bit of staged act in most cases in HEMA is a contention for another time In those conditions a rapierist could grapple just as much.


If any given fencer had to spar nonstop for 30 minutes in an empirical test they'll last far longer with a Longsword. It's less physically demanding to wield and that's all I'm arguing. Cultural practices (deciding whether you can or should grapple or not) in HEMA competition are barely related.

Swiss Beginnerfag here.

On my first ever day of HEMA I got the opportunity to do both Longsword and S&B. My impressions were:
>I'm a wimp and I feel like I could practice with a longsword for hours on end
>holy crap just holding a buckler out for a few dozen seconds is tiring as fuck

Since then, my impression is that Longsword is easy to get in to and to just kinda move around, but how that translates into active sparring, I don't know. (I'll take the opportunity to say I'm not the silly person who started sparring 3 weeks into HEMA)
On the other hand, using a buckler based on my experience and the anecdotes from people in the club is really tiring at the start, and even a seasoned and muscular longsworder will struggle holding the damn things properly for any significant amount of time when they start off.
I've been told that it's all about specific little muscles, and once they're trained a bit you'll be able to cope with the stuff easily (and remain scrawny if you are so)

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>>3111076
>holy crap just holding a buckler out for a few dozen seconds is tiring as fuck
once you get in the right flow of movements it won't be so much tiring

>>3097361
>>3097932

Bitches, please

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>>3112441

>forgot the damn pic

>>3110700
>>3111076
Yeah, good rapierists might not be beefcakes, but they're fucking ripped.

So is there any news on when the first set of Thokk Weaponmaster gloves get to people to review? I want a set pretty bad.

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What do people think of this article?

Medieval Hunting as Training for War
Insights for the Modern Swordsman

http://www.actaperiodicaduellatorum.com/previous-issues-1/2016/12/8/medieval-hunting-as-training-for-war-insights-for-the-modern-swordsman-richard-swinney-apd22014

Basically he argues that hunting is a good form of training overlooked by modern HEMA people. He cites historical texts of hunting being used as training and argues that it's the closest way to practice using sharps against a resisting opponent.

>>3113767
Historical hunting is fun. Any excuse I can justify it great.

>>3113767
The only thing I can think of his many modern people would be squeamish about people killing animals with spears and swords, especially with the stated goal of sharpening their skill with such weapons

>>3112447
I want someone to wear a Greenwich harness and sit on my face
>n-no homo

>>3113767
Go to Spain if you want to learn how to use a lance by herding cattle and hunting boars bro.

>>3114362
That squeamishness is a good reason to do it. To train away weaknesses.
Even if you don't plan to eat your kill you can always donate it to Hunters for the Hungry so you can settle your conscious that's is for a good cause.

>>3110708
>In Rapier they can easily compete with men
>he actually believes this

>>3114803
I think he meant other people would be unhappy with the idea of you stabbing animals to death, especially when you're doing it for no other reason than to get better at stabbing things to death.

>>3116287
This only adds fun to the training

>>3113767
>>3114033
>>3114803
>>3116287
>>3116313

http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/i-drilled-him-outrage-after-hunter-former-ncaa-javelin-athlete-kills-alberta-bear-with-spear-posts-video

Dude dude does something awesome, and bleeding hearts around the world cry about how wrong it is.

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Javelin is love, javelin is life

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10/10 would smash

>>3116476
What a bunch of funless pussies.

I'm glad murrica is fine with historical hunting and even regulate less than modern hunting

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>>3117153
STAY AWAY FROM HER YOU CUnT

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>>3118438
No.

>>3117153
>>3118438
>>3119056
>American """""HEMA""""""

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>numales constantly complaining of Nazis and virtue signaling on HEMA pages

STOP

>>3119162
gib example please, I need a good laugh

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>>3116937

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>>3061500

>>3120237
Cringed

>>3120473
it helps to infuriate the enemy. It's as useful as using a banner saying "I fucked your mom yesterday".

Whatever gives you an edge, it's worth it.

>>3120237
Would this be tournament legal?

>>3120605
Or, you know, you can just practice until you're better than them instead of wearing a silly mask. If it's just for fun, then whatever.


In another topic: Which style/weapon would you say is the flashiest or most impressive in HEMA?

>>3120701
I would say no but I don't make the rules.
I think they should have it that the masks aren't designed/ painted in a way that is distracting. So country flag, or club logo if they aren't using overly saturated colours or overly complex design (a union jack is fine but a union jack on a waiving flag is not) this would mean some club logos may need a simplified version painted on.
A solid color to help distinguish competitors is fine.

But again I'm just a guy who has no say in how any tournament regulates it's rules and competitors

>>3120237
What a dickhead.
>>3120605

>Whatever gives you an edge

You're what's wrong with HEMA. You know what would give you a greater edge? Not being a fat fuck.

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Had my very first ringen class today. Was pretty fun, especially learning the different types of throws. Bit confused on the way some of the arm locks work, but overall I felt I learnt a lot.
Unfortunately I got sick maybe three quarters of the way through. I think it might have been motion sickness, being flipped around may have did it. Any other anons experience this, or am I weird?
Also any general tips for ringen, maybe training or things to try?

>>3120237
Australia ruins HEMA yet again.
Thanks for continually undermining all the hard work we do.

>>3122046
>I think it might have been motion sickness
Not necessarily, I also get that and I made one club mate run vomiting to the toilet.
I think it's the extreme amount of strain on your body, you use pretty much every muscle there is and I guess you normally don't do that

>>3120713
>the flashiest or most impressive in HEMA?
Polish saber looks fancy, sword&buckler can look cool.
I guess staff or halberd is most impressive when there are a lot of wide swings

>>3117153
How's it going, Lee? Didn't know you browsed 4chan.

>>3122046
Unsurprisingly your vestibular system doesn't like when you get thrown around too much.

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Does anyone have any info about when these things are coming along? All that Thokker is talking about right now are his silly little yellow pads.

Also, my big concern with these things is that the whole viscoelastic whateverthefuck stuff won't be adequate protection against getting your hand or finger squeezed up. How does this material react to that sort of compression?

>>3123423
I'm not an engineer or anything but my understanding is that the liquid turns solid when put under sufficient pressure. So whether it's a fast impact or slow compression the end result should be the same once enough force is applied.

What I'm concerned about is the gloves getting punctured and the fluid leaking out

>>3123829
Didn't he say that they would have some kind of puncture resistance? I'm honestly hoping that they'll be good enough for all weapons.

>>3123423
I'm behind the curve. What is this deal with this thing?

>>3124014
Basically they're gloves that rely heavily (but not just) on viscoelastic foam, a material that is fairly soft and flexible but gets solid when it gets hit.

IF they work as claimed (and I'll wait for reviews before I believe any of the hype), then they're supposedly longsword-tournament grade protection with shitloads of mobility

is saber generally 'slow'?

>>3124710
No, unless the fencers are new or just bad.

>>3120713
Side sword and messer can both be pretty showy.

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I really hate to turn this thread into a gear discussion, so I'll make this brief:

Bracers. What's your solution for forearm and wrist guards?

>>3124931
Drink milk and stop being a bitch. Getting hit should hurt so you don't forget to be cautious. So you have some fear of getting hit like you would against a sharp

>>3124065
A see I thought they were filled with a nonnewtonian fluid, that's why I was concerned about leaks. Making it out foam that does the same thing makes a lot more sense, although it's less "futuristic".

>>3124931
The cuff on my sparring gloves is enough for me, there is a small gap between the end of the glove and the start of my elbow protection but it's not enough to worry me.

>>3124990
There's a difference between avoiding pain and avoiding broken bones. Time spent injured is time not spent training. I can still feel plenty of pain through the cuff I mentioned so bracers aren't necessarily for avoiding it.

>>3124931
What >>3125120 said, but also children's shin guards from sports supply stores seem to work well, the ones with the straps, at least.

>>3124990
Cool opinion, bro. I got a hand injury from sparring a few years ago that required expensive surgery and has permanently affected my ability to train, so I value protection on my upper limbs.


>>3125120
If you're referring to the Polish sparring gloves, I'm not satisfied with the "styrogum" material they use. There's too much play in it, and my aforementioned injury occurred while I was wearing those, and I've also had a dislocated finger in those as well. I'm looking for something much more rigid for forearm protection.

>>3125566
>hand injury
Well of course hand protection is incredibly important. Those are small bones which are much easier to brake. The wrist need protection for the same reason.

>>3125836
Right, and even the forearm. Compared to the upper arm (unless you're a very strong man), there is very little tissue protecting the bones and tendons from impact, especially once you go past the cluster of muscles that control the fingers. In fact, last year at some tournament (can't remember which), a guy had his forearm broken from a longsword zornhau, since he was only wearing his gambeson for protection. I can take hits to my unprotected triceps and biceps practically all day, because of the muscle, but one clean hit to the forearm and you're risking a bone chip or fracture.

>>3125493
Yeah that makes sense; a child's leg is the size of a man's arm. I'll check out my local sporting goods store and see if I can find a good fit.

>>3124065
When are they going to be out?

>>3124910
How do I git gud at saber then?
I feel slow and uncontrolled as fuck, feints are nearly impossible because I'm not able to change directions fast.
Feinting a hit to the left of the face and then turning around to a hit to the right feels like it takes forever ;_;

>>3124931
I wear SPES arm guards but only when I know I'm facing an overzealous retard out to break opponents. I go out of my way to avoid them so I practically never wear them. Which is good because they completely fuck my dexterity up.

>>3124910
>>3127947
Also what can I do to stop those fucking cramps in my hand when swinging the saber more than 10-20 times??

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>>3128413
Get a grip-trainer, and also start doing forearm exercises. Pic related is the best by far.

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>>3128892
>>3128413
These are also fun. By the third set your shit's on fire

>>3128892
>>3129341
How about exercises to get my left arm as strong as my right? I've been doing sabre for about a year now and the difference is pretty stark.

>>3130054
Do the matt Easton sabre waggle on your left hand.

>>3128892
>>3129341
thanks guys!

>>3130074
Not that anon, but what could I do when doing italian saber?
Instead of wrist wiggles elbow wiggles?

>>3130054
Have you tried pinch exercises?

>>3130074
>>3131915
I don't know what either of those is.

>>3132061
The sabre waggle is a holding the sword out in front of you, and while minimizing the movement of the shoulder and elbow, cutting straight down and raising it back up. You do it for several minutes. You can then start doing 1 and 2 cuts instead of straight down once the arm starts to get accustom to it. Then you can start doing all 6 cuts, all from the wrist and minimalism other arm movements.

If you have any questions you can refer to Matt's video on solo drills

>>3132223
This is where double weight wasters come in handy, right? Or just 5 kg dumbbells.

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>Pirata is preparing a learn HEMA with anime girls book
Golden age reached?

>>3133975
absolutely based, time for hema to switch into maximum overdrive

>>3133975
What a time to be alive

>>3133975
>Destreza chart with Meyer plates
tip top kek
Also fuck, I was going to do a HEMA manga.
Has the first two chapters written as well, but no artist :(

What do you think about the red dragon jackets?

>>3134314
What do YOU think about them?

>>3134320
They've been around for some mothns now, but I discovered it just today. Just from the pic, the sparring jacket is a imitation of the usual AP (as other new red dragon items are copies of other SPES stuff).
I don't know how to feel about the "built-n gorget", there's enough room to slide a thrust under it. In his review, Matt Easton recommend to wear a regular gorget under the one of the jacket.
So, the shape is from the AP, it has a weird neck, it has roughly the same price of an AP. Do they have similar hit absorptions? Do they have the same mobility?

Are there any one-handed swords that could go against a Longsword without being in that much of a disadvantage?
If so, which?

>>3134493
In a one-on-one duelling situation a rapier goes well against most weapons because it moves quickly, it has reach, and it's whole purpose is duelling, but ultimately it comes down to the skill of the fencers as to who wins. If you're reallygood with a sabre and they're shit with a longsword your chances look better than the other way around.

>>3134617
Of course, but I meant a situation where both participants are more or less equal in skill and physique.

>>3134627
Rapier has an advantage over longsword, but it's not objectively better. Sword and buckler maybe, too, as you have a second device to occupy the weapon, but at the same time you're giving up a lot of distance to employ it. As for other weapons without companions, if you have the extra reach you probably have the advantage, otherwise you're at the disadvantage.

>>3106553
>bullied

Only part of that post that concerns me. HEMA is the most satisfying martial art for training with beginners. The difference between a trained fencer and a guy off the straight is astronomical compared to other MAs. Don't be worrying about that.

For the record I judge beginners on their attitude and not any hits they land. If you're frustrated in a way that motivates you to train harder you're probably gonna make it.

>>3106553
Where do you train?

Damn, Battuta and Filo aren't as easy and simple as I thought, Barbasetti really is quite interesting!

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>>3134493
I'm putting my vote in for:

B R O A D S W O R D

What is the "best" discipline for a complete newcomer to get started with? I'm going to a different college for my major, and it has a HEMA group listed on its list of clubs. Obviously I'll be restricted by what they teach, but it's a fairly well-funded school and at least six faculty members are registered as being instructors, so a decent array of options should be represented.

>>3137066
I wish the Scotts had written the pre-brittished sword style

https://youtu.be/hmCozSuZTB0

I did my first event/competition this weekend. I've only been doing HEMA for about three months, but have a background in sport fencing. Looking for pointers

pls no bully

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>>3137804
>pre-British'd
In what way?
Are you talking pre-1745? Or just not written by "Lowlanders"?
Or do you mean "Before" they spoke """English"""? Because I assure you, Scot's English and Gaelic are not easy to understand...
Or do you mean as a weapon system? The Scots took to basket hilts incredibly quickly, hell early on they were called Irish Hilts (Irish being, at the time much like Gallowglass, a generic word for Celtic or Scots from Ireland).

>>3138711
I like it, but rapier in general is something I love watching!

>>3137749
Depends on which disciplines are available?
Longsword is normally the most available but has lots of techniques.
I think saber is relatively easy to get into, also sword and buckler (although it may take some time getting used to using both arms potentially independent of each other).
Messer and rapier take longer and are more complex I think.

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>>3134267
I think he is just fucking around with us.

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>>3134493
Montante?

>>3134493
I'm pretty sure rapier is your best bet, fast and relatively long so the longswords reach advantage is nearly irrelevant.
Swords with proper hand protection (saber, sidesword, basket-hilt broadsword) could maybe keep up if you're lucky and get in fast.
A lone arming sword without buckler is completely fucked against longsword.

My class mainly teaches Meyer but I want to learn some older techniques that are one action, not a series of actions like devices. I know that you can use certain moves from devices without doing the entire thing but I was looking for something easier to extract from.

What books would you recommend for this? Is Secrets of German medieval longsword good or are there better books for what I'm looking for?

>>3140295
this will always be great

>>3139249
>wifebeater and puffy pants
Better look than expected.

>>3140414
>wifebeater
?

>>3140741
a white tank top

>>3140817
Thanks, I didn't know
(not a native speaker)

>>3139249
Oh god, those bent elbows are fucking triggering me.

>>3141434
C'mon, grow a thicker skin

>>3139556
Honestly, just go to Wiktenauer and read Ringeck's manuscript. The translation is pretty good and since you already know Meyer, your interpretations will come fairly easy.

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Filler post

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>>3144903
I was looking for my "Fiore Special" pic but I can't seem to find it.

But have this picture of what is most likely an illustration of a student of Meyer using their go to groin based attack

These threads always turn into a shitcrawl once we come close to the bump limit...

NEW THREAD: >>3144946

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>>3144980
This thread isn't dead yet

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>>3145451
>This thread isn't dead yet
but it will soon bee

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just posting cool medieval art to kill this thread

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this

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>>3145505
will

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>>3145507
soon

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>>3145511
be

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>>3145514
OVER

>>3144980
These threads are always slow