Thoughts about Aikido

>>1536986
Its shit. go do some judo or bjj instead

>>1536992
So much this.

>>1536992
>>1537622
At least give some reasons or you are just biased.

>>1536986
Aikido is probably the most passive martial art out there. You will never initiate an attack as an aikido practitioner.
The founder Ueshiba Morihei took mostly counter technics out of a lot of Aiki-jujutsu especially Daitō-Ryū Aiki-Jūjutsu and formed this martial art purely made out of counters.
Since it isn't a "Koryu" the style wasn't used during the meiji era and therefore never prove it's effectiveness during medieval japanese wars.
The moves are from Koryu styles, though.
Usually there is a difference between sports and martial art. There is e.g. sport Judo, full kontakt karate sports and kendo to name some.
The japanese also differientate also between jutsu and do. Jutsu means art and the perfectioning of the martial art takes priority whereas "do" means the way and the the priority is maturing your character through the specific martial art, growing into a better person and being overall more self confidence and having more control over life. The "do"s have a very big spiritual/philosophical aspect to it and mostly involve a strong zen-buddhistic way of thinking.
There is ofc no clear border between Jutsu and do. E.g. you do in judo, ju-jutsu also sports and in lot of a lot of times both help to mature your character and still try to perfect your style.
To sum it up: If you have interest in a purely passiv art, care more about the philosophical/spiritual aspect instead of wanting to kick ass. Go for it.
Since it's a technical art, it will probably take you a decade until you can use those techniques effectively in a street fight in contrast to muay-thai or it's sports derivative like kick boxing where a half year is enough to beat some punks.

>>1536992
the two most overrated martial arts in existence

>>1537994
>The moves are from Koryu styles, though.
Meh, not that much, Daïto-ryu isn't koryu, you may found some traces of Kashima Shinto-ryu, which is the actual koryu Ueshiba was taught, but it really will be only very vague trace as the aiki-ken is far away from anything practical. Some aikido stuff probably look like koryu jujutsu, then again you could say the same from judo. There is a necessary link between koryu and gendaï budo at some point, but it usually is so faint that it doesn't really matter.

>>1538009
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nihon_Kobud%C5%8D_Kyokai

Daitō-Ryū Aiki-Jūjutsu has been officially rated as a Koryu. I can't ofc tell you through personal knowledge if it is one, since I don't do anything near Aikido. But the Nihon Kobudō Kyokai has labeled it as a Koryu (and they are pretty picky) so I assume it is one.

>>1538050
Well then it's a bit of a misnomer. Daïto-ryu is a tradition of the Meiji era, not earlier.
Now... some martial traditions that are post-1868 are indeed counted officially as koryu (why, I don't know, but they most certainly have their reasons). I know some styles of jujutsu, naginatajutsu, and so Daïto-ryu are like that.

I was therefore wrong saying Daïto-ryu isn't koryu, however I will keep believing that it was created by Sokaku Takeda, and therefore it's a Meiji art and not a Feudal era style (and that really was the main point I wanted to make). I typically use "koryu" as anything "pre-1868", it seems it isn't entirely right of me to do so.
All of this says nothing of its efficiency obviously.

Anyway, there is always bullshit about aikido being "the style of the samurai" - not saying that it was implied anywhere here. It's complete crap, aikido is gendaï af, its core is gendaï, the fact that it may have (may) koryu techniques means nothing in that regard, as core concepts is what makes a koryu.

>>1538081
I see.
I don't know why people tend to claim Aikido to be the hand-to-hand combat style of the samurais, too. It was made in the late 1920s.

>>1538050
There are non koryu arts in the kyokai depending on how you define the term. Its actually younger than Judo.

>>1538270
>>1538009
So what is your estimation about the amount of koryu techniques in percentage in aikido?

>>1538288
Well I mean it depends what you mean by "koryu" techniques. Almost everything in judo and bjj is derived from some koryu. The same is true for for daito ryu to some extent. Its been noted that many daito ryu techniques look similar to yoshin ryu, the grandfather of judo.

However daito ryu has a huge variety of kata, far more than most koryu, its believed by some that Takeda just improvised and his students practiced these variations as kata.

Its even been argued that the core of daito ryu is not the techniques but the internal training methods, which are also found in some koryu, its been noted they were very common in edo period jujutsu styles however most of them are dead and alot of that has been lost with only a few arts still practicing them as practical methods

>>1536986
An arguably wonky take on somewhat outdated jujutsu, further filtered through the mystical ramblings of a man who was so taken in by a shinto cult that he went to Mongolia with the intent of establishing a religious state. By this I mean that while there's clear links to old school Jujutsu, Aikido's parent art of Daito Ryu claims to have tradition stretching back to ancient times while everything points to its founder just starting his own school. And that even legitimate old school Jujutsu would potentially cling to things that have been proven to not work in a modern setting, like things that would best be applied against an opponent in armor.

Can some of Aikido's stuff work? Sure. Wristlocks are seeing increased use in BJJ and not that many martial arts bother to learn weapon defense as part of their standard curriculum anymore since the focus is modern competition so that can be nice. But its focus on unrealistic forms of training and heavy talk of vaguely defined spiritual forces and energies means its training can range from being too soft to being complete bullshit. It also doesn't help that Aikidoka in general seem deathly afraid to prove their skills in anything that isn't pre-arranged demos.

>>1538050
>>1538270
>There are non koryu arts in the kyokai depending on how you define the term.
This and the list proposed as some curious miss like Kashima Shin-ryu who is absent of it while definitely being a koryu.
Now it's hard to know why this one is there and that one isn't, still...

It depends of the school, you have to look for a serious one, not for a ki master pussy destructor, this art takes years to understand and use.
You will find people like this >>1536992 saying that is useless because it has no application in ufc, mma... and its true, but the real aikido does not look for it.
Good luck.

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Wow this became an actual informative debate without any WWE shitposting and far less Aikido shaming than I was awaiting. I'm pretty proud of you /asp/.

>>1538409
You should still do Judo and BJJ

>>1538420
I'm not OP. I already do Wadō-ryū Jujutsu Kenpō.
Mind explaning why specifically Judo and BJJ and why not anothe Ju-jutsu than BJJ?

>>1538428
I'm memeing on you. But honestly, use of competition and stricter standards help ensure that you learn things that are mechanically sound and that you learn to apply them under pressure against opponents that aren't only just resisting but actively trying to do the same to you. Which is very important because if you ever have to apply these skills, you will be doing so under pressure and against people trying to harm you in some way.