4 Month old Puppy

Does he have any earlier training? If not, treat him like a two month old. You have to be real adamant about being consistent with training a border collie too because they can turn psycho otherwise. Give him a job, they're an incredibly smart breed just need to direct the energy into stuff. Start teaching him simple tricks so he learns to be obedient and willing and eager to please you

>>2464433
No training, no.
He was just left to be himself with his parents and other dogs from the breeder since the siblings were sold a month ago or so.
I've read a lot about BC and I'm planning on training him a lot and taking him for hourly walks before and after work everyday. Thanks.

>>2464442

I forgot the exercise time to age conversion for puppies. I think it's 5 minutes for every month (so 4 month old = 20 minute walks). Hopefully someonr else can confirm, but Don't over exercise your dogger.

>>2464461
By 4 month border collie is going to have plenty of energy for any reasonable length walk. It's also not a huge breed where you have to watch out for bone problems when walking them young.

>>2464461
>>2464468
Thanks for the warning. I'm planning on taking him to the vet as soon as he arrives for a general checkup and to ask them all sorts of things. I'll make sure to add that one to the list.

>>2464468
This is true but keep in mind that dogs will build strength + stamina and become accustomed to certain amounts of exercise. If you start walking your puppy for 90 minutes a day he will come to expect and require that amount of exercise all the time. Tbh I'd start with the 5 minute walk rule plus training and games at home, and then increase if necessary until you find the sweet spot where your dog isn't destroying your house or being annoying

>>2464431
>I'm planning on chew and potty training him right away, obviously. But most of the things I've read are for 2 month old puppies or so.

>chew training

I've never heard of this. just yell "NO", take the item away, replace with an item they're allowed to chew on, then fawn over them when they chew the allowed item. there's not much to it.

also, 4 month old puppies really need to be socialized. collies aren't known for being unfriendly, but they're definitely more standoffish than, say, a golden retriever, and they can get nippy and snappy. besides potty training and regular manners, work a lot on socialization.

>>2464626
>keep in mind that dogs will build strength + stamina and become accustomed to certain amounts of exercise. If you start walking your puppy for 90 minutes a day he will come to expect and require that amount of exercise all the time

also don't listen to this momscience idiot

>>2464649
The exercise part is true. With border collies, you definitely get what you work towards.

If you go in thinking they are super dogs that need enormous amounts of exercise a day, that's what you will end up with.
They were bred to literally have stamina to work all day long. You aren't gonna tire them out physically for long.

They -need- the same amount of exercise as any other fit breed. They aren't magic. They -do- need proper mental stimulation but they also may need to be taught how to remain calm/normal when there is nothing happening.

I used to volunteer for a BC rescue, and a number of our surrenders were from well meaning owners that simply couldn't handle the monsters they've unknowingly created. Instead of working on teaching calm and off switches, they just kept ramping up the activities.

"Oh, we take spot on two hour runs every morning, daycare, fetch in the evening and take him to agility on weekends, but he's still tearing around like mad and chewing up everything when we're gone/barking/reactive/etc.!"

OP, I urge you not to listen to ANY advice on this board (including mine!) without confirming from a more reputable source: actual BC handlers, those that trial, BC rescue groups, or BC specific forums (Facebook groups don't count!)

>>2464431
The only things that come to mind are puppies that age can hold their bladder much better so potty training is a lot easier (younger puppies will have accidents unless you take them out every 2 hours or so, day and night)

And also 16 weeks is the cutoff point for good socialisation. Not that a dog can't be socialised past that age, but they'll struggle to learn social cues from other dogs after that point. Which can cause issues once the puppy hits sexual maturity.

Though assuming the puppy has been around other dogs and strangers in the past few weeks, it'll be fine. Problems really only occur in dogs that were taken from their parents young and never interacted with other dogs at a young age.

>>2464736
I literally own a border collie. All dogs have a limit where they are comfortable. Collies just have a higher one than most and need a higher rate of mental stimulation.

Can you train a dog to endure two hours of vigorous exercise? Sure. But they won't magically want it just because they can do it. Those dogs you described at the rescue probably were bored out of their minds because their families thought "tire them out" meant only physical exercise.

>>2464904
I've literally owned 3, currently have two (one is an Aussie/BC mix though) and have fostered dozens. I doubt that makes me any more credible on the internet.

YES, Border collies will indeed want/require whatever exercise they are used to having. Of course not literally every dog is the same, but IME, this breed is prone to a more obsessive personality, and that includes becoming problematic when you throw endless physical activity at them and nothing else. Their comfortable limit can be a whole day. Suggesting that moderate exercise is idiot momscience simply isn't true. I would even say it's good advice. It is important to mention as I have on the previous post that they do need accompanying mental activities.

And yes, some of those rescues were "bored" but some also had regular "jobs" (agility, flyball, etc) and were still little hellions. Moderation is key, be it with physical or mental activity. An important thing I've learned is to never really trust a border collie to know it's own limit!

>>2465019
>Suggesting that moderate exercise is idiot momscience simply isn't true.

no one said moderate exercise is idiot momscience. the idiot momscience part comes in when idiots try to get out giving a dog good exercise by theorizing that "well if I give fluffy an hour, he'll get used to it and then want an hour and a half! then two! then three!" that's plainly not how dogs work.

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>>2465019
Hey I hope you're still here. Do you have a picture of your BC/Aussie mix? I have one too and I wanted to see if they look similar.

>>2465019
>never really trust a border collie to know it's own limit

That's the truth. Mine will lick his asshole until it's raw if I don't stop him. There's nothing wrong with his anus, he just loves to lick it.

Also, after the first time that I took him for a long walk on a hiking trail, he ended up with raw skinned armpits from his harness. He made no indication that he was in pain during or after the walk. I felt so bad.

>>2465069

>well if I give fluffy an hour, he'll get used to it and then want an hour and a half! then two! then three!

Literally no one has said that.

>>2465069
So what should I do? Just stick to a routine and mental stimulation?

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>>2465081
Not that Anon, but here is my Aussie BC mix.

He is almost 16 and is very arthritic. Has his bad and good days, but I know I'll have to make that decision sooner than later.

Best dog I've ever interacted with, period.

>>2465264
He is beautiful. I want to tell him he's a Very Good Boy

>>2465264
Sheepdogs are best dogs.

>>2465151
Yes

>>2464649
Chew training is basically feeding them in chew toys instead of bowls to keep them busy while you're away so they learn to enjoy being alone.

>>2464461
>>>2464442
>I forgot the exercise time to age conversion for puppies. I think it's 5 minutes for every month (so 4 month old = 20 minute walks). Hopefully someonr else can confirm, but Don't over exercise your dogger.
Yup that's correct 5 mins for each month old

>>2465758
So, my 5 year old dog needs to go for a 5 hour walk everyday?

>>2465929
nah it's just a rule of thumb until about a year for large breeds. you want to build a dog's stamina slowly to prevent joint issues from over exercising

>>2466058
I see. Thanks

>>2466065
To clarify, it's only until the growth plates close. This could be a little bit under a year for small dogs, to about 18 months to 2 years for large ones. BCs fall somewhere on the middle, usually being done growing by 18-20 months. The only way to know for sure is to have an X-ray done.

The reason for this is if the ends of the bones (where they grow from) get damaged while they are still growing (which can happen during repetitive/high impact activities like prolonged/"forced" running and excessive jumping), it can affect further growth, either stunting it, leading to abnormal bone growth or contributing to hip/joint problems the dog may have later in life.

Note that this is only forced, high impact stuff, things like leashed runs, repetitive and long sessions of fetch, jumping repeatedly for frisbee, etc.
Self directed stuff, in other words running/playing/whatever on their own accord is generally fine.

So my puppy is finally here. I wanted to tire him out before work but he didn't want to go out. I'm afraid he's scared of the street... So far he's been raised on a farm so he's not used to the city at all. Any tips? I need to take him out because there's not enough room in my apartment to properly tire him out.

>>2467817
How about teaching him to play tug of war or try to teach him some tricks such as sit, roll over, lye down and stay. Mental stimulation is as important as physical stimulation for these dogs and the sooner you get them to grasp the lye down command the better,

>>2467817
I don't think you will ever be able to properly tire a collie out living in a city.
My aunt and uncle had collies living in the Poconos and the dogs used to run off into the woods and come back hours later with a deer leg in their mouth. I've been to Ireland and seen collies chase sheep up a hill a mile away and corral them back to the shepherd

>>2467817
Feed him treats when you are near the street. Treats/eating generally make a dog feel good. If he won't take treats, get fat enough away from the street until he does. Keep working st it, and eventually he'll equate being near the street to feeling good.

Do this for a lot of things, not only fears. It's the best way to get your pup comfortable with stuff.

Watch this:
https://youtu.be/sI13v9JgJu0

It's with aggression, but it works for fear too.

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>>2465264
My Collie/Chow Mutt doggo is 12 and starting to show a lot of getting old signs. That's great that yours has lived a long life.

After only two days, I've decided I'll rehome the pup.
I feel like shit but it's too much responsibility. I'm willing to dedicate my time to it but the problem is that the pup is going to be alone 8 hours a day and I'm afraid that's gonna result in a pretty unstable dog no matter what I do when I'm home. Also the weather has been very shitty lately so can't even practice taking him out... Worst day of my life to be honest.

>>2468309

Poor baby... but at least you made the decision before the puppy got attached. Did you give the puppy back to the breeders though?

>>2469813
Yes, there was another person interested in him and they took him. They have way more space and time.
One day I'll get my dream dog... Or not. I want to raise it properly so if I can never own a BC then I'll never do it.

>>2469910

I think that people shoyld try to take a 1-2 week vacation if they get a young puppy. Longer, preferably, but getting a puppy then running off to work the next day feels HORRIBLE. I adopted a 5 month old and I came to see him during my lunch, but I could tell how lonely he was during those few hours apart. I was able to take 1 month off (all my accumulated vacation time) and we really bonded and I broke some of his bad habits. Being there with them while they get settled in is so important. Hopefully next time you're in a better space and can spend more time.