/aq/ - Aquarium General - Shrimp Edition

I'm thinking of breeding and selling sulawesi cardinal shrimp. My water is extremely hard AND I live in a desert area so it's hot here most of the year without needing a heater

Good idea? Would I make any profit? Worth it?

>>2383526

Enjoy your algae

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>>2383530
Cardinals are rad yo.
imo I think the red lines would garner more profit simply because they're cooler.

>>2383524
How many shrimp per gallon is ideal?
Also can one mix cherry shrimp and red and black crystal shrimp?

>>2383533
I WILL!

>>2383544
Shrimps have almost zero bioload, 5-8 per gallon for a start is good enough. Your population will breed and multiply like crazy anyways.

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>>2383552
One thing that always interests me: why do shrimp have such a massively lower bioload than fish? I could put 8 shrimp in a gallon but a single tetra of the same size as a big shrimp would die.

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Who's got some tips to grow hairgrass faster and thicker?
tank has C02 added, fertilizer, high light regularly trimmed... but it still seems patchy

How'd you all get started on your tanks? I've got a 10 gallon aquarium left over from a lizard of mine who passed this year, and I'd like to keep some fish in an apartment I'm about to move into.

>>2383560
Google "fishless tank cycling", there's better info available than what I can give you.

You'll have to invest in an ammonia, nitrite and nitrate test kit. It's a long process, expect it to take a month or more.

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Why don't you like my snels, /aq/?

I wish I could afford/have room to keep larger spiny eels healthy and happy. Like tire tracks and the ones from tanganyika. I had a peacock eel years ago, he was great.

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Dumping pictures of bettas I'd like to have.

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>>2383571
I like them, don't listen to the haters.

>>2383574
I wish I could afford enough room to keep any eel healthy. I'm obsessed with eels, loaches and all other long fish but I can only afford a 5gal shrimp setup.

>tfw friend had a tire track eel and it committed sudoku

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>>2383581

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>>2383585

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>>2383586
Literally any fish with blue and yellow coloring is great. This koi pattern is also amazing.

Wonder if I can get some at next year's Interzoo.

>>2383584

Yeah that's how I lost my peacock as well. Had a family 29g when I was in HS. I still have the tank but we got rid of everything else.

What are good invert tankmates for a Betta?

Jeremy was hanging out with 4 Amano shrimp (and had been peacefully for quite some time) but last week went beserk and ate them all in an afternoon. I don't really fancy putting more shrimp in there -though the shrimp have been breeding and I've seen some tiny teeny tiny juveniles pop out of the gravel numerous times.

>>2383593
mystery snails

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R8 my new betta

>>2383609
Very neat, take good care of him anon.

>>2383554
Because their "moving parts" are a lot smaller. Look at a fish, most of that is muscle. Shrimp only have a bunch of tiny clusters of muscle at their "knees", antennae joints and the joints of their pleopods.

In other words, shrimp are very weak.

>>2383524
Thanks for making it shrimp edition for me senpai

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>bought some fire red cherry shrimp online yesterday (Wednesday)
>Tells me till after I bought em that they only ship mon-Tuesday only

I JUST WANT TO START UP MY NEW FIRE RED CHERRY SHRIMP BUSINESS
(Also don't buy from l.r bretz aquatics. I bought some from him and I got some pretty shit fire reds they all look transparent in perfect quality water)

>>2383581
Halfmoons are beautiful. they're like the pugs of bettas, though.

>>2383641
Brett here. I never send transparent fire reds. Send me a message I may have had a mix up and sent bloody maries

>>2383641
Today is Wednesday. Who'd you buy from?

>>2383619
Huh, explains why fish win whenever they fight shrimp.

Isn't their tail muscular though? That's the part we eat when we cook them up after all.

>>2383543
Are these shrimps freshwater or marine?

>>2383726
CHICKEN STRIIIIIIIPS!

They're fresh water though.

>>2383646
> they're like the pugs of Betta's
How so?

Currently acclimating Tiger Barbs in my 37 gallon and a Convict (only fish in the tank) in my 20 gallon. Fun day so far.

>>2383735
Because pugs have breathing problems. Bettas with big flowing fins get tired more quickly.

>>2383737
Ah, makes sense.

>>2383609
8/10, would keep,
How is his tank looking?

>>2383747
>>2383747
It's barren currently. He has a nice jar though ^_^

Aquarium shrimp must taste pretty shitty, am I wrong ?

Hey everyone, this is my first time posting, so I'll do what I can to keep to the guidelines.

Basically, about a month ago, I went from a 35L (9.25 US Gallon) to a 60L (60 US Gallon) tank.

I was quite reserved with buying fish because the tank was rather small and I was afraid of overcrowding.

Now the tank is bigger, it looks rather empty.
Would you mind giving me some recommendations for more community fish?

Here are the details of what I have right now:

> 60L Tank 2ft x 1ft x 1ft
> Temperature kept at constant 24/25 Celsius (75F)
>Water quality good

Stock:
>4x Ghost Shrimp
>5x Tiger Barbs
>2x Albino Barbs
>3x Cardinal Tetra
>4x Neon Tetra
>3x Corydoras
>4x Bloodfin Tetra
>1x Bristlenose Pleco (About 12cm, came with new tank)

Any recommendations are certainly welcome.

Thanks in advance!

>>2383765
Correction, about 15 Gallons

>>2383765
Pretty overstocked as is

>>2383771
Most of these fish are less than 2cm, so theres surely room for a couple more

>>2383665
It is, but they very rarely use those muscles. Look at which muscles your shrimp uses to move and eat. Those are 99% of its energy consumption. They have a negligible brain and only really use their muscular tail when they're escaping a predator, which is rarely in an aquarium.

>>2383774
That anon is giving you his opinion based on fully grown stock. Cardinal tetras for instance get up to 3.5 cm. Tiger barbs up to 7.5 cm.

Go for more plants and shrimp.

>>2383778
I see what you mean. I should have added that the tetra are all at least 5 months old, and the barbs are 3 months. Do they have much growing left to do?

>>2383782
Yes

>>2383765
You'll want at least eight of each type of tetra.

>>2383794
Fuck it throw in some common plecos add some oscars and 5 pacu

>>2383805
Tetras get stressed if they don't have friends to shoal with.

I drives me nuts when shipping isnt done right away

>Order Kuhli's on Saturday
>they dont get shipped until Tuesday

I mean they're arriving today but the waiting still pisses me off.

Sort of related. I ordered a bunch of Dwarf Sag last friday that STILL hasnt shipped. Was just going to ask for a refund but got an email from paypal this morning saying 'check' cleared. I didnt even know I sent a check, I thought the dude was paid already. How do you send money right away when someone gives you their email?

>>2383651
Fuck off Brett I ain't buying shit from you again

>>2383653
The shrimp farm this time I'm in texas central time so that explains the time difference

>>2383858
You will order from me again. Just take my word on it.

>>2383858
Why wouldn't you message him though? Could possibly get new shrimp.

>>2383810
>>2383794
Sort of.

As mentioned in a previous incarnation of this thread, schooling/shoaling behavior in an aquarium environment tends to disappear when there is no predator or other sources of stress. I'm sure a lot of people here have noticed their tetras not schooling after a while.

Many, possibly most, shoaling fish are not species specific. They tend to group up by size/shape, so it is very likely that a neon tetra will school with a cardinal tetra, especially since this particular anon's fish are all not fully grown. This is why something like a flame tetra will school with a neon tetra and an ember tetra, etc.

So in many cases, four neons plus three cardinals can make a successful shoal of seven.

>>2383858
>shrimp farm

Enjoy your low grade Sakura fire reds.

>>2383919
Because it's been a long time since I've ordered them and even then they want a picture with bag sealed when it arrives so that's out. I was new to fish keeping so I thought those pale looking one would get their color soon

>>2383923
I hope your joking where else could I have bought them

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>>2383598
Mystery snails? As in Apple snails?
Don't they breed like crazy? I've heard Bettas aren't so good with em

>pic
Jeremy the murder fish

>>2384066
Who for some reason has uploaded the wrong way up.

>>2384068
>and here we can see anons dead fish

Naw but in all seriousness, that's an awesome looking betta.

Anyone get a rush whenever you buy a anything for your tanks?

I need to stop. I just need to stop. I just dropped another $50 on plants for my 40g. I already want to go out and drop more already and I don't even need to stock it yet.

>>2384094
I just can't get over how cute he is. I can see why people get so attached to them. He's developed a habit of following me about the room (as much as he can in his tank)

Ya they know where the food comes from.

I have to literally hide from Sin if I want to observe my tank and just watch him be a fish.

Usually I'll get under my blanket and be really quiet.

>>2383735
They're horrendously inbred to get their fins that extremely puffed out, so right off the bat they have horrendous immune systems and usually don't live as long as other bettas. They also can't swim as well as bettas with shorter fins and it pretty severely restricts their motion, and because of that they're prone to start nipping their own fins off if they find out it helps them. Plus, their fin bones (i forget the word for them) can break because of the extra weight on them.

>>2384123
Meant to reply to:


>>2384119

>>2384123
That is very endearing.
>no homo

Jeremy usually if he's doing fish things goes off to the plants somewhere and dozes but if there's a person around he will pop out, examine the person and either go back to sleep or observe whatever human things they're doing.

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I just tested my water, it's VERY hard (unsurprising) and also VERY alkaline (also unsurprising)

Is there any natural way to unfuck my water? I'm using well water from the cave state. If you leave a glass out and let it evaporate, you'll have a white calcium film on the entire thing.

How do I fix this anons? Will this shit ton of calcium kill my bacteria bros and betta friend?

Too many fish, so much shuffling. Got my kuhli's today. They are cute as all shit. They went into my 10 gallon with the betta, ghost shrimp and frog

Frog kept tagging them which looked like more annoyance than anything. Still, moved the betta and frog out of the 10g into a 3.5g in the window

I don't know what to do with the ghost shrimp. I plan on ordering some RCS but I hear Ghosts will murder them so the ghosts will either end up as snacks for the koi or potential snacks for the platies

Pics soon

>>2384151
HOW Alkaline? Like an 8.0 isnt much to worry about. Don't know about the calcium though

there's tons of shit you can buy the get your water to wherever you want it to be. All in all, it isnt really worth the constant conditioning and you should just work with what you have

peat moss, driftwood, catappa leaves will lower pH at least depending on your buffer. There's always RO water as well

>>2384151
What pH and hardness are we talking about here?

>>2384097
I get what your saying I have to stop myself from going to the lfs every chance I get before they think I'm some weirdo. How old are you btw

>>2384165
>>2384162

Using the Tetra test strips, it was probably around 8.0 on the pH, if not even more.

Hardness also pretty much maxed out the test strips at about 300ppm.

>>2384151
Use clay based substrate, peat moss in the filter, plenty of new driftwood that hasn't been boiled of all it's tannin will all lower your PH and hardness, depending on how strong of a buffer there is. Consider using a fish-safe water softener too.

>>2384178
I'm 32. Guys at the local shop know me by name, they teach me a ton, I teach them a thing or two. They also by my excess platy fish whenever my 29g starts to get over populated.

>>2384134
Try playing with him a bit.

I get my face up real close to the glass, skim my fingers along the top of the water, and wash random glass things off to put in the tank.

If you don't move too fast and scare them, they get really interested in almost everything.

>>2384151
Just do what 75% of the Missouri Aquarium Society does and keep Africans.

>>2383559
That light looks a lot dimmer than what I think of as "high light."

>>2384202
>tfw your water is so shitty only Africans are cool with it

>>2384151
You could have some really strong Snails with those calcium levels.

>>2384181
:|

That's pretty rough bro.

If I were looking at having to treat my water a shit ton, I would probably more seriously consider just going balls deep saltwater and having an RO/DI unit.

>>2384216
actually, would introducing snails help soften the water? Or would the effect be negligible? I guess you'd have to be constantly cycling snails and murdering them or something.

>>2384097
I do the same thing.

There's a new kid in my lfs who doesn't know the most basic shit like plant names or fish adult sizes. I felt sorry for him and decided to teach him a bit. He really likes me.

>>2384286
That's good that he likes you. I learned a lot from my co-workers since everyone kind of has their own specialty and it's cool to learn from their experiences. On the flip side my primarily saltwater co-workers learn a lot about freshwater from me.

>>2384151
Nothing wrong with having high ph and hard water. I don't think mine is as drastic as yours, but I live in SoCal and I've kept happy and healthy Honey Gouramis and Kuhli Loaches. The key is choosing hardy tank bred species that's been in the hobby for a while, and generally making sure your water is nice and clean.

How big is your tank? If you want fish that will thrive in liquid alkaline rock, you still have a decent variety of options. Livebearers, flagfish, rainbows, etc

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What do yall think of this? I think it looks kinda neat

>>2384321
If that top part is a basking area for the turtle then that is truly a 10/10 set-up

>>2383748
>jar
Literally why.

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>>2384358
>>2383748

>Checks thread
>Some faggot is spewing lies about my fish for some reason

What

It's not a jar, I used a koi food container as a temporary home before I move him to a 3 gal. and I change water every three days and shit.

Name my fish, /an/. Wanted to name it Jade but I got mocked for naming it like a SU oc.

>>2384369
Name it Jade. Jade's a good name.

>feeding 29g breakfast.
>Everyone is at the top grabbing flakes and pellets.
>Drop in shrimp pellets for the bottom folks.
>Corys pecking and chowing down.
>biggest amano shrimp scampers out from under the drift wood, snags a pellet, scrambling back to the wood.
>Met by every other shrimp, and they begin the rumble for the pellet.

There is no honor among thieves!

>>2384435
Kek

>>2384029
Seriously where do yall recommend to get some quality cherry shrimp I just cancelled the order

>>2384321
Can you imagine trying to clean that thing out or rescape it? Yikes. Looks cool though; I like the idea. I especially like the idea of it being a basking area.

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>>2384369
>WHAT THE FUCK I WOULD NEVER KEEP MY FISH IN A JAR
>3 gal tank

>>2383593
Depends on how big your tank is. It's better just to get another tank if you want different fish.

>>2384185
I will be giving this a try.

I've recently found a load of antique marbles (glass) in a cupboard and (once they're clean) I was thinking of seeing what the fish made of them if I added a handful to their substrate.

I'll be watching the Betta closely as he isn't very sure what to make of colourful things yet.

>>2384515
It's a 6 gallon with Betta, 5 neon tetras, plants and (there were) shrimp.

Been established for about a year odd. 1/3 water change weekly and a good gravel vac. I've been very impressed with the filter system as well.

>>2384369
How long is he going to be in there for? He might not be floating belly up but that doesn't mean he's happy in a barren plastic container.

>>2384528
>6 gallon
>5 neons & a betta
Christ, you're really looking for MORE fish to put in there? You're already awfully overstocked.

>>2384544
Oh, nevermind. Reread your original post and saw you're looking for inverts. You're still overstocked as shit, though.

>>2384529
It's not like he's going to be happy in a three gallon tank either.

>>2384551
Sinbad seemed pretty content in his 2.5, but I was also doing things to stimulate him a couple times a week. Which, honestly, I think would be helpful even if they are in ten gallons. They are such attentive fish, I imagine they would get pretty bored with everything staying the same for too long.

>>2384555
Nd his tank was pretty well planted..

>>2384178
I'm good bros with the owner and the employees at my lfs. Sometimes we go out, get shitfaced at a bar, and talk fish. Gotten some weird looks.

>>2384500
Hahahahahaha I was fucking with you. I don't know shit about them.

>>2384555
I think you anthropomorphize him too much. Give him his territory he likes and he will be happy. They like their own territory and it not change too much.

>>2384723
Oh I'm sure I do, but I was going more off his behavior strictly. Like lethargic vs. attentive. Swimming around and exploring vs. Sitting in one spot and not really responding to outside stimulus.

>>2384066
>mystery snails? as in apple snails?
die you nut, they're completely different as one grows the size of a ping pong ball and the other a tennis ball

>>2384369
Veridian

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I have a 26 Gallon tank established with fuck all in it.
I'm looking for a solitary fish for it that is big enough to be comfortable.
Any suggestions? Local fish shop recommended the following.
Solitary Piranha
Leopard Bushfish
A Discus
Some more, but those ones really stuck out to me.
I am open to suggestions though, as I'm in an area with a few different shops to choose from.

>>2384810
apple snails are a family of snails, of which the mystery snail is a species. If you guys are gonna be pedantic fuckwits, don't use shitty ambiguous common names.

>>2384837
Piranha get bigger than the bushfish and discus like angel fish get taller than the do long. Up to you butt nut.

>>2384810
>go buy mystery snail
>see one size of two ping pong balls
Hmmm

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Found my better phone with better camera.

>>2384555
>>2384551

This. The important thing is that it has more horizontal space to swim on, right?

His new tank comes at the end of the week, but even in the container he's making bubbles already.

>>2384837
Get 4 endler's live bearers. Beed a swarm. Then drop in a Bush Fish and watch the slaughter of a only-in-captivity species.

>>2384871
This tank looks like a hampster cage. It might not look the most aesthetic but seems like the Betta's having fun with it. 8/10 OP

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Is this a good resource? Not that I don't trust you guys, I just like having something in print.

I got it for a dollar at a book thing in a sandwich shop down in SoCal lmao.

How bad would it be to pour small amounts of very pure acid in to my fish tank to cure the PH problem? Only like a couple drops of sulfuric/hydrochloric acid shouldn't hurt anything? No fish would be in the tank at the time, obviously.

>>2384950
I was given the book. It's not a bad resource, but there's quite a bit of missing and out of date stuff. Definitely a great read.

>>2384723
>"animals like to do things"
>You're just needlessly anthropomorphisizing them. Shut the fuck up.
People like this are the reason I think all pets should require licenses to own.

>>2384904
They make bubbles instinctively -- it's just a thing they do. It isn't indicative of whether they're "happy" or thriving to their full potential or not.

>>2384971
>I want to be angry so let me first pretend other people are being unreasonable and confrontational when they are actually just having a normal discussion.
y

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>>2384722
Anon I hope you make it to the peak because I will be the one to bring you down

>>2384944
>It might not look the most aesthetic

I t-think it looks aesthetic T_T

Naw but really, thanks man. I tried hard.

It does need more cleaning than a regular tank, but it's worth it to have it in natural light. Those plants are just taking off.

>>2384971
Sorry anon, but this:
>>2384974

>>2385005
For what it's worth, I think it looks cute, and probably pretty interesting for the betta

>>2385026
Yay!

You hear that, Sinbad? People like your tank!

...

He swims in frantic begging motions for you anon. If only you could feed him and be his friend forever.

>been wanting oto cats for a month now.
>keep waiting until I see algae.
>No algae.
>Plants keep growing
>Algae doesn't grow.
>Finally see algae growing
>Wait a week longer.
>lots of algae growing.
>Go to LFS.
>Fucking OUT of oto cats.
>Ended up going to a petsmart to get them.

I feel fucking dirty.

>>2385037
>your petsmart having oto cats at all
You got a pretty good petsmart.

Mine has a shiiiiit selection, which just got even shittier. They got rid of all the saltwater. It's practically all guppies, goldfish, mollies, pest snails, glofish and dwarf gouramis now (plus the usual low-grade cichlids).

The ancient ass lady running the fish department is pretty bad. Fish there are almost all universally in bad shape. Not surprised the saltwater is gone since if she can't keep fucking mollies healthy, no way she can keep saltwater healthy.

Strangely the Petco not too far away has a really awesome dude in charge of the fish dept. I try to buy from him as much as I can, but unfortunately them being a petco means they don't really have a lot to offer me.

>>2385065
Most of the PetSmarts and Petcos around here pretty much have the same selections, minus the salt water. Salt isn't a big thing in my area. Oto cats are generally at all of them. One Petco around here has some really special stuff. The head Aquarist there orders Discus, Royal Plecos, Moscow Guppies, Bush Fish, Butterfly Fish, Medium/High Grade cherry shrimp. The guy also orders good plant variety, constantly has java moss and dwarf sag, guppy grass.

I spoke to him, he basically told corporate that he could move the higher margin fish, and he does. He's really dedicate to making their fish department compete with the LFS in the area.

>>2385077
>PetSmarts and Petcos around here pretty much have the same selections
Yeah, I've noticed in my area that a lot of the fish stores get their stuff from the same suppliers, on the same days.

Two LFS I frequent just happened to get nerite snails on the exact same day? Yeah, same supplier. Many other examples of certain fish stock too.

Likewise between a few of the petco/petsmarts around here. When one gets new neon tetras, they ALL get new neon tetras that day.

That petco guy seems cool. I'm glad he's being successful. Definitely need more variety in the chain stores.

>>2384974
If you want a fluffy friendly forum where everyone is nice, you're in the wrong place.

>>2384871
Oh fuck off with your vase shit already anon, we've seen it so many times already and you'll never listen to our advice.

>>2385127
Yeah man, tell him! Fuck the vase culture! Keeping the poor betta man down! We gotta raise up and fight for our rights!

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>>2385127
What advice do you have for me anon?

>we've seen it so many times

And you have seen everyone elses tanks so many times as well. Maybe, hear me out here, MAYBE, that's because...it's an aquarium general.

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I'm the anon with the extremely hard water. My tank is pretty barren, and I'd love to add some driftwood, as I think it's aesthetically pleasing, and I've heard it will help with the pH and hardness problems.

Do I leach the tannin out of the wood before I add it to the tank? I don't really feel like making tree tea out of my fish tank. I've seen people encouraging it, but I've also read that the tannin is what allows for the lowering of the pH/hardness

I mean, I'm getting driftwood with or without the pH lowering properties, I just was interested in the dynamics of driftwood, and how to safely introduce it to my tank without making the water discolored.

>>2385132
fuck off vase fag

i want reddit to leave

Functional /aq/ discord link
https://discord.gg/UcVqMrC

Update in next op

>>2385157
Carbon will take out the yellow of the tannins, but I have no idea if doing so will effect the pH

>>2385157
So you can run a bunch of carbon to help clear up the tannin , you can also use stain remover additives.
Honestly, your best option is to buy an already leeched piece of driftwood from either a chain store or LFS. I got one for my 29g for that reason, and put an untreated piece into my betta's tank because I like him having that murky natural look. If you want to leech it out yourself, boil the wood in a large pot every day until it comes out clean, or put it into a bucket with water and soak it for a few months.

tl;dr: Spend money for leeched wood or wait long time to use it as you leech it yourself.

>>2385157
Use carbon on your filter.

It's a right fuck-about otherwise

>>2385307
Personally I think he should leech it out himself. Only reason you should be running carbon is to take out medication. If you run carbon you can't do fertilizer or really any additives because it completely defeats the purpose.

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>>2385254
>You won't listen to our advice anyway
>asks you for advice and gives you a litter hard time because you're being a bitch
>can't handle it
>fuck off!

Aaaalrighty then!

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Guppy colony has begun. 40g Breeder, plants, diy spawning mops until the plants fill in and I spread the moss out.
Starting batch of guppies
>Males: half Black Turqouise, Halfblack Purple Tail, Black Body/Orange tail. Each from different stores.
>4 Turqouise Females, 1 Snake Tail female, 1 orange female.

Two were pregnant when I bought them, so I'm expecting fry soon. within days as the snake-female is already boxing up.

>>2385436
Anti-vaser can't handle the bantz.

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>>2385439
I think he just doesn't like that I try and find solutions to the problem that are out of the norm.

Either that or he's just got a power trip and can't stand when someone won't agree with whatever it is he says.

>>2385437
That's a cool looking tank anon, I bet it's going to be fun.

Guppies can be so pretty, but I tend to wonder how prone they are to inbreeding, seeing as they spawn so much.

>>2385451
I have an arrangement with my LFS that will let me trade in the offspring for store credit or straight up trade fish for fish. Ideally I want to take out the males after 2 or 3 generations and replace them with new blood. It's not hard as long as you stay on top of it with culls and have a back up plan.
My back up plans are the LFS and my 29g tank to house over loads. I also have a coworker who has turtles who said she would take the excess ones for food.

>>2384951
Not sure if troll post, but sulfuric/hydrochloric acid have no place in the aquarium hobby.
Use seachem's neutral regulator (or a host of other products), brings the ph back to 7.2 then in a couple days check it again and adjust using the corresponding pH adjusting additives.

>>2385277
Never had carbon remove tannins before.

Use Purigen or Chemi Pure Blue in your canister.
Give it a few days and usually clears it right up.

Will endlers nip betta fins?

>>2385499
Or, alternatively, will a betta try and eat chili rasboras?

Anyone here with kuhlis? What do you feed them? Mine are being picky

>>2385502
Bloodworms. I'll also break up algae wafers and they'll munch on those. Sinking pellet food.

>>2385484
>Not sure if troll post, but sulfuric/hydrochloric acid have no place in the aquarium hobby.
Most acid buffers are dilute hydrochloric acid.

I'm constantly amazed how stupid /aq/ is about water chemistry.

>>2385707
look for a long term solution anon, because it's going to just cause more problems when you do water changes.

Add peat moss to the filter to help lower your ph, just soak it for 2 a few days so it doesn't stain your water. you can also hook up a CO2 system to lower it further and give plants a boost in growth as well. Pair it up with a buffer.

>>2385717
I know all this.

I'm not asking how to lower my pH, I'm mocking the moron that's never heard of acid buffer.

>>2385718
>he mentioned "ph adjusting additive"
>somehow this means he doesn't know what a buffer is.
I think the issue is your reading comprehension.

>>2385722
He doesn't know that acid buffer is just hydrochloric acid.

you can't read.

he's probably in better shape than you.

>>2385501
Depends on the betta. Likely not under non-stressed conditions.
>>2385499
Likely not.

Nothing is certain. Always have an escape/re-home plan.

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It's algea free now

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Does anyone else have ember tetras? They seem so intelligent.

They always react to me at the tank, wanting food. They seem to "play" in the current. And recent behavior I've seen is this: being opportunistic. My betta here will peck at pieces of sunken food (algae wafers, shrimp pellets). The embers follow him around and wait for him to disrupt the food from the gravel, then they dash in and steal bits of it floating off.

It's really amusing to watch, none of my other fish have done this. The embers will start following the betta as soon as he gets near the gravel most of the time.

>>2385725
>>2385722

So uhh, should I dump the acid in the tank or not guys?

>>2385795
hydrochloric is fine as long as it doesn't have any added detergents.

it will kill anything it touches though, so the best plan is to dilute it outside the tank first.

pH doesn't matter unless you're breeding fish though.

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>>2383524
>tfw dwarf shrimp always die in your tank despite it being established for more than a year now.
At least I can keep dwarf crays alive. If only they weren't such a bitch to figure out male/female.

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>>2385757
It's never algae free anon. It's only a matter of time before it comes back.
It's never gone.
never...
Gone....

>>2385795
Use a PH buffer or do a shit load of research into how much pure acid you mix to get your desired results.

Don't listen to angry anon whose too autistic about language to be upset.

>>2385809
>>2385797

I guess I need to figure out the right amount of acid to add, and figure out if the hydrochloric acid with react with the calcium in my water or anything. I wouldn't want it to decompose into chlorine or something.

>>2385816
That's why its recommended to use a buffer from someone like API.

>>2385816
>I wouldn't want it to decompose into chlorine or something.
why?
chlorine is less toxic than hydrochloric acid and it will evaporate out of the water in less than an hour. But first it will oxidize organic pollutants, destroying them.

water is just water, it's not hard to figure out.
as long as there's nothing alive in the tank you're just playing with water.

>>2385818
API acid buffer is just dilute hydrochloric.

the only advantage is they tell you about how much to add, something any reasonable aquarist with an internet connection should be able to figure out....

>>2385821
>Guys, how do I do this thing?
You
>JUST FUCKING GOOGLE IT JESUS CHRIST YOU FUCKING NOOB.
Everyone Else.
>Use a buffer with instructions.

>>2385820
Good point. And if the calcium and the HCl interact, it'll just combine into calcium chloride, which wouldn't me the worst thing in the world, and would probably keep the pH down.

>>2385826
I mean, I kinda liked his instructions even more. Playing with acid is x100 more fun than just using boring was buffers, and he's pretty much telling me that its kosher.

Anons, how long should I wait to expect guppy fry in my breeder?

>>2383727
what's the Latin name of these ones?

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>Every few days I'll drop about 4 sinking kelp pellets into the tank for the shrimp
>Always feed betta on other side while doing this
>Feeding shrimp tonight
>Bettas got a mouthful of worm
>Suddenly whips around
>HE'S ON TO ME
>Try to distract him with the one finger chase around
>He ain't goin for it
>Shoots halfway down tank (I thought bettas weren't strong swimmers?!) and snags a pellet
>Betta now has a fat pellet stuck in his mouth and a bloodworm halfway hanging out
>He's not swallowing, just holding it
>Alright, he's gonna spit it out
>He doesn't spit it out, keeps holding it
>Five minutes go by, he has somehow sucked the bloodworm in while still having the pellet stuck in his mouth
>Try to distract him and get him to drop it
>Nope
>'Let go of the fucking pellet you fatty'
>NOPE
>GOING BALLS DEEP
>'GODDAMNIT SIN, LET GO OF THE FUCKING PELLET YOU FLYING FAT ASS'
>Proceeds to spend another ten minutes slowly working it until he finally gets it in his stomach, where he spends another five minutes just chewing it

Fucking hell, gonna have to net him if he's going to be pulling shit like this.

>>2385983
I just separated all of mine up but it was getting dynamic for awhile in my tanks

>feed betta on one side of the tank while dropping food on the other side for everything else
>loaches slowly searching for food right in their faces
>frog takes half an hour to find anything
>shrimp flip into action immediately
>scour the tank for all pellets
>pick them up and chew while swimming around with them
>betta spots tiny shrimp with huge pellet
>they play keep away with eachother for awhile
>loaches finally locate a stray pellet and take a few bites
>frog spends 5 minutes misfiring at his own pellet, eating more gravel and grass than anything else
>shrimp still fighting betta and eachother over food
>betta gets too close and gets frog punched
>all remaining pellets get knocked into unreachable crannies
>tank is a fucking circus of food searching until I vacuum it out

fucking fish

Where do you guys buy your aquariums? Online or do you go to a Petsmart/Petco?

>>2386010
craigslist. Only petsmart/co when they're having gallon sales

>>2386010
Yard sales are great too anon.

>>2386010
my grocery store randomly had a nice quality rounded corner 5 gal with a basic canister filter for cheap so I copped that

I think it's made by some chinese company that low key makes quality rounded tanks in like 3.5 gal to maybe 10 or 12 gal and barely markets them. can't really find them online but a lot of people have reported finding similar tanks in odd places

my craigslist always has 10-100 gal tanks up for sale. I wouldn't pay more than 50 cents/gallon for someone's old glass but people seem to think their neon glo fish gravel, plastic plants, and algae tablets increase the value

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>>2386063
>people seem to think their neon glo fish gravel, plastic plants, and algae tablets increase the value

Shit cracks me up whenever I see it at flea markets or yard sales.
>10g Glofish kit at yard sale.
>Me:I'll give you 5 bucks for all of it.
>Guy: it costs like 60 at Walmart! I need at least 30.
>Me: I just want the tank and filter honestly, I'd be throwing out those ugly decorations.
>Guy: 25 is the lowest I'll go.
>Me: Eight is the highest I'll go.
>Guy gets visibly upset and tells me to leave.

Why are Otocinclus so fucking delicate? I've gone through 6 of them in two days. If the last ones I'm done with getting any more now. jesus fuck.

>>2386073
They aren't. They come in starved. Otos have a bacteria in there stomach and if it they don't eat for some time it starts dying so then they die. If you don't believe me you can look it up.

>>2385800
I keep cherries and dwarfs together. But my dwarfs won't breed.

Another anon in the last thread mentioned the idea of snails removing calcium from the water for their shells, making the water hardness go down.

Theoretically, how many snails would it take to lower the hardness?

If you had several pond snails or something, and they made 100 babies, and those 100 babies developed and made shells, how much calcium would they pull out of the water in doing so? Do snails even use calcium in the water, or must they get it from food?

>>2386125
Here's a way to make some cash and lower your ph.

>Buy 4 mystery snails.
>Fill tank almost to the very top.
>Put 1/2 inch of gravel onto bottom.
>Put hood on.
>Dump a ton of food into the tank.
>Let Mystery Snails breed viciously and drain the water of it's precious calcium.
>Sell snails to LFS for a quarter each.

>>2386081
Otos aren't the only fish like that. Almost all fish come in starved, they get shipped halfway across the planet in little plastic bags, and the only "filter" they get is from the "breathing plastic" in the bag, which makes carbon dioxide exit at a higher rate than oxygen enters.
It's why you should only buy from either a respectable shop, that lets the fish acclimatise before putting them up for sale, or from another enthusiast/breeder.

>>2386007
Fuckin lol

What has domestication done to these poor creatures?

>>2386125
I think you're going to have an easier time just buying a britta filter or buying bottled water anon.

>>2386196
I know, I understand. I was just curious at exactly the amount of calcium the development if snails will leech out of the water.

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I just bought some driftwood for my tank for exactly $5. They told me it was some mahogany. The LFS keeps them in their tanks so they are pre-leeched of all their tannin. I boiled it to kill of any pestilence or snails. That LFS has a massive snail problem.

I noticed it smelled really odd after boiling. The wood kept the heat very well, so all the water wicked away and it was incredibly dry for just being submerged. It smelled like beef jerky, mixed with that creek kinda smell I equate with tadpoles.

Is it normal for wood to have such an odd smell, even post-boiling? Pic related, the driftwood in my tank.

>>2386159
Yes but read the rest of my post.

>>2386205
Yeah. It happens. It's the wet doge smell of wood.

Doubt you'll be able to smell it once it's submerged in your tank though.

>>2386205
Pretty normal. Get it in the tank and you wont smell it. Any plecos you get will be in love with it, and shrimp love them.

>>2386201
Eh, try and test it.They can be like pests and over run a tank though. Would probably want to test it in like a 5 gallon.

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Water change Saturday!

Changed water in 29g, 40g Breeder and 10g. Trimmed wisteria in all tanks and brought them to the breeder to fill in further. Should grow a nice forest in the following weeks.

Best news is that one of my turquoise girls dropped fry right after the water change. I've counted a total of 7 fry so far, and the adults haven't had any real interest in them so far.

Anyone know where you can order some quality cherry shrimp? Every store around me is blown out of them.

>>2385436
Simple way to see this is life expectancy.

I kept tanks as a child because it was a hobby of my mother's. We had a betta live for almost 5 years.

Then I was stupid when I moved out and got me a tiny gallon tank and bowls, periodically. Even with water changes their life span was an average of 1 year.

Switched back to a 10 gallon and my recent betta just passed away 3 months after the 5 yrs mark (got him from a local breeder when he was still a fry)

Anyone keep betta sorority tanks?

>>2386221
I always got good quality from
https://www.theshrimpfarm.com/

They arrived all alive even when my lazy postman didn't knock on my door and instead placed those "sorry we missed you" notes. I only knew she did so because I saw the fat bitch literally running back to her Jeep out my front window. It was a Saturday so I guess she wanted to go home.

Point is post office was closed by that point and then on Sunday, but they were all still alive Monday morning.

>>2383530
Just fyi, cardinal shrimp have a larval stage that's extremely difficult to support.
They're definitely worth having either way, and it's not like it's any extra effort to try breeding them. If you can get a good size colony going they do sell for a pretty good price, so I'd say go for it.

>>2386073
Algae wafers, algae wafer, algae wafers. I have fish-in cycled with Otis. They aren't super hardy, but they certainly aren't delicate. always make sure they are well fed, they won't always necessarily get what they need from what's available in the tank.

>>2386233
*otos

>>2386232
>cardinal shrimp have a larval stage

are we talking amano levels of difficulty? I thought I read they just produced shrimplets.. hm

>>2385718
I'm not surprised most hobbyists these days overthink water chemistry.

>>2385826
>Guys, how do I do this thing?
he literally asked if he can use acid to lower pH in an aquarium.

the answer is yes, that's how all the companies do it. Only problem with diy is you have to figure out how much to add, which means either googling it or adding it very slowly and testing repeatedly.

Most aquarists enjoy diy. /aq/ doesn't, but that's a sign of immaturity in the hobby.

>>2386228
I'd have to have them shipped overnight to save my conscious, and that costs more then the damn shrimp. Looks like I'm probably going to have to bite the bullet to get these damn things.

>>2386242
>if you don't DIY you're immature.
That statement is the sign of immaturity. Not every hobbyist wants to do every step themselves. Of course you would understand that if you didn't have autism.

>>2386243
>and that costs more then the damn shrimp
Buy more shrimp.

>>2386244
>Not every hobbyist wants to do every step themselves.
Are you an aquarium hobbyist if you pay someone to assemble a tank for you, maintain it, and feed it?

are you a hobbyist if all you do is own the thing and look at it?

most people with some time in the hobby realize the more you personally do the more you are engaged in the hobby. In fact if you never do anything you're not part of the hobby at all. Experienced aquarists enjoy the hobby solely for the diy aspect.

Because of this simple inclination you can judge an aquarist's experience level by how much they diy. /aq/ is very immature in that regard.

>>2386243
What >>2386246 said. Shipping live things cost money, but that money is reassurance

As I stated before, my shrimp all lived even after multiple days. This place does pretty well at packaging live specimens. But I do recommend overnight for peace of mind.

>>2386253
I can smell the pretension.

>>2386270
shouldn't bother you as long as you admit to your own lack of experience.

/aq/'s problem is that it's both pretentious and stupid. Presumably that's why you are here though. Everybody else has chased you off.

>>2386253
THIS

Every hobby gets infinitely more interesting the deep you go, and the more layers you peal back.

Take coding/game design for instance. Yes, we could all code on Unity and use some game engine. Or we could make our own shit, learn, make mistakes, and have fun. Or baking. You can buy a fucking break mix and just pop that shit in the oven. Or you can hand knead the dough, make it raise, measure yeast, ect.

If all you're doing is going to the store, buying a pre-assembled kit, and just putting it together without shopping around and learning, that's kinda lame. Sure, I could buy a package, drop some stuff in the tank and that'd be the end of it. But it'd know nothing. I'd have learned nothing, and it would be an unrewarding endeavor.

You can't always play it super fucking safe with everything, having it all prepackaged and shit. Sometimes you have to get your hands dirty, get out of your comfort zone, and learn. Wise else, you're pretty much just some faggot script kiddy.

>>2386253
>Are you an aquarium hobbyist if you pay someone to assemble a tank for you, maintain it, and feed it?
>are you a hobbyist if all you do is own the thing and look at it?
>most people with some time in the hobby realize the more you personally do the more you are engaged in the hobby. In fact if you never do anything you're not part of the hobby at all. Experienced aquarists enjoy the hobby solely for the diy aspect.
>Because of this simple inclination you can judge an aquarist's experience level by how much they diy. /aq/ is very immature in that regard.
Not that dude you are arguing with but he has a point. Your definition is extremely narrow.

Even fucking Joey Mullen, who literally calls himself the King of DIY, who is the most popular aquarist on Youtube, who travels around the world to give talks on DIY, still buys a ton of pre-made shit and actually uses it.

Even his aquarium gallery, that is a fucking house that he designed himself, is still going to be filled with a rack that he is not making himself, NINE 120G tanks he will not be making himself, a custom lighting system that he did not make himself, several filters he did not make himself.
Yet somehow, by your definition, he is immature and not that experienced.

I guess he's a total amateur then. The dude even had the gall to hire contractors to help pour cement!


Or even Cory, who also runs a popular Youtube channel and runs a successful fish store. Look at all his stuff at home (and obviously his home): very, very little of it is DIY.

>>2386246
>>2386266
>>2386243
I didn't mean to be glib about it, but it is the truth. Generally, it is just not financially sound to order small batches. I only order online if I'm buying $50+ worth of fish, if not more.


Which is difficult because that means I'll likely need more than one tank for quarantine.

Also buying a LOT of shrimp at once I think you'll find starting up the colony to be a lot easier.

>>2386275
It's not so much important that he always diy, but that he knows how. He has a deeper understanding of the hobby for having built a tank or two in the past.

that's all. and if someone asks a question about building tanks, who's better qualified to answer, him or someone that has never done it?

The question that started the discussion was about using acid to lower pH. One answerer had done it the other had not. Which is more likely to be correct?

and more importantly, why the fuck would you think you can answer a question about something you've never done?

What's a good color for aquarium backgrounds? Do you guys use those premade ones printed with leaves and shit, or just go with the blue? I was thinking about using black to mask the large filter and heater in my setup by allowing them to blend into the background? I have natural colored gravel, and I'm planning on using a lot of live plants, so would that help accent them and not drown them out, right?

>>2386275
BTW I should put a disclaimer that although I think your definition is too narrow, I myself am a DIYer. I'm an engineer by education and trade and I build the shit out of shit.

But even then, while I have made several lighting systems (for photography and general lighting), I have still bought some aquarium lights (certain Chinese brands have an insanely good price to PAR ratio that I'm just not going to match buying small quantities of LEDs myself, particularly Green Element).

And sometimes you may just not enjoy certain things. For instance building nice wood stands. A lot of people may just not like the woodwork. It's kind of a pain in the ass and time consuming, and the initial startup is expensive. Concrete blocks is an alternative, but they're kind of shit.

>>2386283
I find simple black or navy poster board (coated, preferably. But not shiny) works the best.

>>2386284
I can also get behind this. That's a much more reasonable position to take. DIY is an important part of the hobby, and doing things yourself really can improve your experience.

But somethings are better left up to those with more skill, such as woodworking or assembling light fixtures. Or as you said, when the cost is cheaper to have someone else do it for you.

>>2385157
Tannins are what are lowering your pH. If you take out the tannins, you're taking out the stuff lowering your pH.

>>2385820
Add it incrementally and test the pH as you do.
Hydrochloric acid "decomposes" into chloride ions, which just bond with other ions in the tank like calcium and magnesium to make salts, which are basically harmless.

Or you could just get livebearers. Or cut your tap with RO water.
Fucking around with pH is a pain in the ass.

>>2385820
Sounds like you're talking about chlorine gas, which is different. If you put table salt in nonchlorinated water, it isn't going to offgas chlorine later.

>>2385840
The full gestation period is 25-30 days, fry are free-swimming several hours later.
And then they're lunch.

>>2386284
yes, different people enjoy different things and it's rare to find an aquarist that's a plumber, electrician, glassworker, carpenter, interior decorator, water treatment operator, fish breeder, microbiologist, & etc.

but experienced aquarists are good at least a couple of those things. If you don't get your hands wet you're not in the hobby.

>>2385983
>>2386007
I kek'd. Thank you very much for these.

It shouldn't be too hard to train a betta to swim into a net for feeding time, right?

>>2386010
If you want new and everything with it the sales PetSmart has on kits are hard to beat (eg. petsmart.com/5250815.html)
If used is okay then classifieds like Craigslist (incredibly hit or miss), aquarium Facebook groups, or in-person aquarium society meetups.
If you want to put something together yourself the $1/gal sales are a good price for the tank, but even with that buying everything separately puts you way over the price of a kit.

>>2386224
My friend used to. It's difficult to balance their personalities so that they actually get along. You have to pretty much constantly monitor them and have a couple backup plans.

>>2386290
>Sounds like you're talking about chlorine gas, which is different.
He asked about chlorine, which HCL mixed with water will produce. It's the precursor to those chlorides you mention.

>If you put table salt in nonchlorinated water, it isn't going to offgas chlorine later.
You've clearly never mixed saltwater for a marine tank.

>>2386238
>are we talking amano levels of difficulty?
Probably similar. There aren't very many testimonials of people trying to breed either one, so it's difficult to really compare them. Iirc all of the Sulawesi shrimp are like that. Something about hard/salty water, it seems.

>>2386242
>Most aquarists enjoy diy. /aq/ doesn't
I don't know if it's that, or it if it's because big corps have basically convinced Americans that "nature is dangerous and you should buy our super safe processed shit because we took out the bad stuff, we promise."

>>2386274
>Or baking. You can buy a fucking break mix and just pop that shit in the oven. Or you can hand knead the dough, make it raise, measure yeast, ect.
Living like this is like a dream of mine in some distant future when I'm not occupied 14 hours a day.

On topic, I guess I agree with what you're saying, but I don't fault people for want to get into a hobby at a low-key level. Everyone has their own pace and if someone just wants to be able to have some nice fish who greet them at feeding time I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

>>2386281
>why the fuck would you think you can answer a question about something you've never done?
>"Because I read about it on the internet :^D"

>>2386291
Exclusionism is pretentious and stunts hobbies.

>>2386283
Dutch and Belgian tanks use black. Japanese style tanks are more likely to use white or a white/blue/orange gradient.
I don't really see blue except in tanks with fake plants and plastic décor.

>>2386294
>It shouldn't be too hard to train a betta to go into a net

Not the first time, no. The problem is convincing them to come in every time after that because he is going to learn that the net traps him and keeps him from the goods.

>>2386313
He should also learn that it mean food time, though, right? Like how dogs hate harnesses until they associate it with walkies.

>>2386306
>or it if it's because big corps have basically convinced Americans that "nature is dangerous and you should buy our super safe processed shit because we took out the bad stuff, we promise."
that certainly gets more aquarists into the hobby, but over time most learn what they're putting in the tank and how their equipment works. At that point I think most go into diy either to save money or just to have the system they want. Especially as they grow into bigger tanks where the equipment is either extremely expensive or just doesn't do a great job.

there's still niches that the industry doesn't serve, and not coincidentally people tend to find their way into those niches in time. Presumably because it DOES set them apart from beginners. Pretentiousness is also a big part of the hobby.

>>2386331
The best aquarists are the ones that don't act pretentious and genuinely want to share the hobby with others. The guy who runs the LFS near me is exactly that. He points you towards the right equipment, hands out to customers print outs to DIY various things, tells people to never throw out their filter media, directs them to Aquarium Co-Op's youtube for lots of tips.

On the otherside of town, we have the guy who runs his shop the exact opposite. He sells people the msot expensive fish he can, he's overpriced. Tells people to buy all the gimmicky shit. If you come in and try to talk shop he talks down to you if you've never had a tank over 100 gal. He tells people who buy plants they HAVE to buy all the additives, even if it's just some wisteria or anachris. He refuses to carry basic fish like Platy or Guppies because they "Attract the kids who are going to just kill them"

Guess who's always packed and guess who complains about not being able to cover his costs?

So, we've all been having an argument over the idea of DIY or not, but my original issue is still something that needs to be answered.

Obviously adding acid to water = lower pH.

But what acid? It seems like acetic acid seems like a solid idea, right? Because acetic acid will decompose into CO2 make carbonic acid, and will generally just drop the pH. Not to mention it's cheap, and readily available.

Do you guys think I can calculate the amount of acetic acid I'd need, or should I just trial and error it?

>>2386321
Food time is anytime you are near the tank.

Naw but in all seriousness, just try it.

>>2386356
Yes, you can use pure hydrochloric acid to lower ph, however you would want to dilute it and test a ton.

You could also make a DIY CO2 system to pump a ton of it into the tank and lower the PH that way, of course it lowers the oxygen content too.

>>2386356
acetic isn't used presumably because it's also food for bacteria in the normal form you can buy- vinegar.

sulphuric is no good because it produces hydrogen sulfide and other deadly nastiness.

nitric has a similar problem in producing oxides of nitrogen which are deadly.

hydrochloric is the best bet for acids you can get hold of. It does produce trace amounts of chlorine but that will disappear quickly on its own and shouldn't be a problem with the tiny amounts you'd be using.

>>2386355
This.

I got a 125 gallon last year, but I still get excited any time I can get people into the hobby the right way, regardless of if it's with a 30 gallon high tech planted tank or a 10 gallon with plastic pirate ships and guppies.

>>2386363
The chlorine might be a problem for bacteria colonies if you're going to be using it in the tank itself, but you just use some extra dechlorinator beforehand to combat that.

What causes the Cl- to turn into Cl2 when you put it in more water?

>>2386363
Aren't I trying to grow bacteria? So woudlnt vinegar be a good idea?

>>2386371
>>2386363
>>2386360

Okay. I read online that it can be used in aquariums.

1ml of vinegar in on gallon = .3 pH change.

My pH is off of the scale 8.3+ and I have hard ass water.

I added 2 and 1/4 tsp. to my tank. Assuming 1 tsp = ~5 ml and I have a 5 gallon tank, I've just shifted the pH by about ~1 pH. Which will put it right where I want it.

There are no fish in the tank, the swing will not effect any living being. I am letting the vinegar run through the tank and become proper dispersed, I'll measure the pH in a couple of hours and relay the info on here.

Wish my tank luck, lads. Thanks so much for the interesting discussion on DIY!

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>>2383571
My croob will arvest snels shell

>>2386371
Different types, presumably.

>>2386377
Good luck. Keep up posted.

speaking of lowering pH, how well do pH buffering substrates work? My own water sits at 7.8 pretty consistently and i'd love to lower it for fairly cheap.

Could I through a 4 pound bag of it over my current substrate in my 40 and see results?or do I need to fill the tank with it?

I was thinking of filling the tank with pool filter sand and topping with Fluval

>>2386379
I got pinched for the very first time by my hermit crab. I've never experienced such bad pain.

>>2386387
I know what you mean. I got pinched by my marmorkrebs last week.

>>2386383
Substrates a good way to go, because it will keep helping after you've done water changes, whereas with buffers and using chemicals you'd have to treat and test everything you added to the tank.
Also it's a gradual change, not an immediate with substrate. It has to seep into the water over time.

>>2386407
>It has to seep into the water over time.

so I could use a small bag and see results eventually then? 40 gallons of water/4 pounds of overpriced substrate?

How hard is it to get a sump and refugium set up? I love the idea of having an extra 40 gallons to dilute waste into, grow java moss in, all that fun stuff.

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It it possible to just have one invertebrate in a saltwater tank? I've never had a saltwater build before, but I really want just a sea urchin or a sea anemone or a sea cucumber or a sea star. Just the one. I think they're really special and cute and beautiful and I don't have the means for a big saltwater tank..
If it's possible, what do they need and how do I set up the tank? All the instructions I read (which are few in existence) assumed you've already had a tank going for a while.

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>>2386426

>>2386434
Okay, it's because there's this store nearby that sells live sea urchins for uni and I love how they move their spikes and I love their tube feet so much I have to save at least one.

>>2386437
nigga I do not care about that. Why did you just post a picture of some girl's uterine castoff?
>chiton

what IS this evil??

>>2386377
>>2386382

Alright, so my pH is now somewhere around 7.3. So my calculations were more or less correct. That is just using test strips, I really should get an electronic meter.

So far, nothing has changed visually. the hardness has gone down and so has the overall alkalinity, and they are all now in safe levels, I believe.

>>2386441
>His ballsack has never became inflamed and detached

>>2386442
how often do you have to do that though?

>>2386441
They're molluscs. The one I posted is a gumboot chiton. They're really big, and if you pet them they feel like wet velvet. I want one of them, too. They're just a big meaty wad of cuteness.

>>2386356
>>2386442

Other things to try besides vinegar... citric or phosphoric acid should be safe, although you could get the phosphate algae with phosphoric depending on how much you added.

I've pitched some citric acid and baking soda in an aquarium to experiment with real iffy CO2 generation and it didn't hurt anything, although it also leaves some sodium in there, which isn't useful. Potassium bicarbonate and citric acid could actually be a useful mix to add for plants, but I'm not sure if anybody has ever experimented with it or not.

>>2386444
Uhh, I guess every water change, I need to add about a quarter of a tsp. So often, but it's not like it's a lot of vinegar.

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>get home from work this morning
>200L is cracked

>>2386472
Let it run for a while, see if there's a smell or anything that occurs.

>>2386484
That's rough anon. is it leaking or is there just a crack right now? Either way, i'd say go get a big 200L tub and drain it and it's inhabitants into that until you can get it replaced.

>>2386490
For sure! I'm monitoring it very closely.

>>2386413
>so I could use a small bag and see results eventually then? 40 gallons of water/4 pounds of overpriced substrate?
Yes, absolutely.

I tested new substrate not too long ago. It will actually happen faster than in tanks since it's a small scale. You will have relatively little water compared to the relatively larger amount of substrate, so I just let it sit overnight.

(The experiment in question was some substrate for pothos. I had some leftover crushed red lava rock from my bonsai and I planned on using a spare shower rack, the suction cup kind you put shampoo bottles in, to hold the substrate + pothos. Strangely my eco-complete lava rock which I use for my main substrate, which is too fine and would fall through the drains of the basket, is totally inert as advertised, however the red lava rock for my bonsai raised my pH noticeably. Definitely something else in there.)

I tried this with both tap water and aquarium water, same results. :\

>>2386484
>>2386491
Just missed a PetSchmo $1/gal sale too. However you said 200L so probably no Petcos around you, and sometimes it's difficult to get them to lower the price on their 55G's anyway.

>>2386531
>PetSchmo

Taylor, is that you?

But really, I wouldn't be all that surprised if she lurked /an/ once in a while.

>>2386535
No unfortunately I am the exact opposite of her (i.e. a dude with a job). Obviously though I'm a fan of hers.

I recently was given a small freshwater crab. He's very small, maybe slightly bigger than a quarter. Anyone have any protips for it? He's in my 10 gallon shrimp tank atm, hasnt attacked any shrimp yet and I dont know if he will. What should I feed him? Looks like he eats by filtering sand through his mouth, will fish flakes that fall to the bottom suffice for him?

>>2386563
>Small freshwater crab

lol, you probably have a fiddler which need brackish water (slightly sea salt) and need time on land to breath.

He isn't going to survive long in your tank.

Take a picture for us so we can identify it.

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>>2386569
That probably explains why he's been chilling on top of the heater for the past few hours. Will that be enough land for him?

I can cover that spot up so he cant escape btw - just removed it to take a quick pic.

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>>2386572
he only really needs enough room to get out and breath but they appreciate more to walk around on

>>2386572
Definitely looks like a fiddler crab.

Honestly, I would take him out and put him in a separate jug container with a big of water and something to climb on until you either re-home him, or can make him a proper set-up, because they are notoriously good escape artists.

I researched them a bit cause I really wanted some, but it was going to be too much of a pain in the ass for me to find the salt where I live and mix it properly and find the right tank and maintain it...

So now I have bettas!

just wondering if anyone else here also eats their fish once they die if appropriate size/fish? can this be bad for me?

>>2386585
Potentially...

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>>2386367
>What causes the Cl- to turn into Cl2 when you put it in more water?
just molecules finding their way to stability when given the chance.

>>2386371
>Aren't I trying to grow bacteria?
the problem is there's more than one type of bacteria in your tank.

yes, vinegar is food for beneficial nitrifying bacteria, but it also feeds a shitload of neutral and harmful bacteria as well.

more importantly, that bloom of bacteria consumes oxygen which fish and inverts need to survive. Bacteria are an important part of bioload. Too many is harmful.

>>2386426
>All the instructions I read (which are few in existence) assumed you've already had a tank going for a while.
This is because inverts are extremely sensitive to ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. They NEED a cycled tank. Most of them also subsist on types of algae and micro-organisms that are only found in established tanks.

So when they say an organism requires an established tank they generally mean it. Almost nothing in the ocean can survive new tank syndrome. Almost everything in the ocean relies on established food webs.

>>2386593
Is there a way to make the tank safe for them without actually having fish? What if you take the water from an old tank and put it in a new, empty tank and put the animal in there?

>>2386607
Also, what about just having a sea anemone? People get them in their tanks completely by accident and have a hard time getting rid of them, so can they really be that difficult?

>>2386607
>Is there a way to make the tank safe for them without actually having fish?
yeah, we buy quality live rock and allow the tank to cycle and age using the dead organisms on the rock as an ammonia source.

you'll find that live rock costs way more than fish though, so this isn't going to save you money or time.
>>2386608
>Also, what about just having a sea anemone?
They're some of the most delicate animals you can get. Expert only in a well-established tank.
>People get them in their tanks completely by accident and have a hard time getting rid of them, so can they really be that difficult?
only aiptasia, and only people with established aquariums.

aiptasia are tiny, and won't survive in a tank with any ammonia or even slightly elevated nitrate. The are a pest in established tanks though. I have one in one of my tanks, but it hasn't spread because my nitrates are relatively high (5-10).

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>>2386608
Here's a shot of my pet aiptasia for reference.

He's about 1/2 inch across and tall. He lives in a snail shell on the sand. I've had him a few months, but even these guys won't survive in an uncycled tank.

>>2386585
depending on cause of death, could be bad for you.

>>2386585
>this guy eats his fish
>this guy has contracted aquaplasmosis from eating his pet catfish
>aquaplasmosis worms compel him to persuade others to eat their dead fish

>>2386636
What if you started the tank with collected ocean water/sand, just pouring it in?

>>2386759
I'm not the Anon you asked. You need the bacteria to build up in the filter. While the water and additional items for the ocean may aid in building this bacteria, it isn't the means to an end. The majority of the bacteria is found in the filter and its media, not the substrate, plants/coral. Etc. Cycle the tank, get it established, and then add in the little sensitive buggers.

>>2386759
It works, in fact it's potentially the best thing to start off with. You'll still need to wait for it to cycle, but it will have lots of good stuff in it for your tank.

>>2386762
*from the ocean.

>>2386588
The picture explains why there would be Cl- in the water. I'm not familiar with a process that would cause Cl- to bond into Cl2.

>>but I'm also not a chemistry major.

How do you guys find decent LFS? I've been looking for months and I can't find shit. I've asked around, i've googled, i've tried yelp and there's fucking nothing. The store I usually go to, which is the absolute best i can find, is run by people who told me I could keep multiple male bettas in a 40g "as long as its planted" and tried to tell me that dwarf puffers needed saltwater.

>>2386882
>I could keep multiple male bettas in a 40g "as long as its planted"
It's possible. People have done it successfully.

It highly depends on how dense the aquarium is planted + the temperament of each betta.

As for the dwarf puffers, many people seem to incorrectly assume they are brackish or maybe they are thinking straight up saltwater (definitely not dwarf) puffers.

Either way, yeah, looks like you got a bum deal, bro.

Try instead looking for local fish groups. I started looking into them and was surprised at how many there were and how active they are. Many "LFS" here don't even have a public store front. Some you can only visit by appointment. Super weird. But they got some rare stuff and obviously they know their shit.

What area do you live in?

>>2386882
at least it's not my LFS
I already had a 10g tank for a betta and they were like oh you can just put it in a bowl they don't need a lid they don't jump out and pointed to some plastic bowls sitting on a bottom shelf

>>2386914
I'm just wondering what kind of filtration, if any, they recommend with a tiny ass bowl.

>>2386857
My understanding is that conversion to Cl2 occurs during oxidation of chloride salts by any of several agents already present in the water or introduced by the HCl reaction, including HCl itself, and the Cl it produces.

Oxidation of mineral salts is a constantly occurring process in the aquarium though. It's just too slow to make any real difference.

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Is it normal for java fern to be sold in pieces?

I bought what looked like a big leafy fern, but when I took it out of its pot, it turned out to be about 4 separate small ferns with one or two leaves each. Should I feel ripped off? I'm going to stick them all over the tank and hope that they colonise it a bit but right now my tank looks very shabby with one leaf here and another leaf there.

>>2386985
yeah it's normal. I also got three smaller plants bundled together when I bought them. They had ~ 5 leaves each tho.

>>2386985
Pretty normal. When I bought my chain swords it was 3 separate plants. If you're buying the topfin java ferns it's a single plant, same for their amazon swords. But a heads up, those are all cultivated above water, so once you plant them, the new growth will look different.

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This is my first planted Aquarium. I decided to make the switch since plastic plants started to bore me. It's a 5 Gallon tank with 1 Dwarf Gourami and 3 Cory cats. Ant tips for a newbie in the planted Aquarium game?

how long does it take for bacteria to die off without oxygen? I'm starting to think there was a blackout last night because my ammonia is spiking like crazy

>>2387188
If you use a HOB filter, as soon as your media dries, your bacteria dies. Try using an additional sponge filter to help mitigate the effect, or throw sponges on your intakes. It makes a world of difference.

Hey /an/, for those who own 10-20 gallons, I was just wondering what plants/animals you have stocked them with.

>>2387271
I've got a planted 10G with a dwarf gourami and some amano shrimp. The gourami's really cool, he really pays attention to what's going on outside the tank.

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guys, I need your help badly.

I woke up today and found my tank was unusually cloudy. Then I see that my neon tetras are nearly dead, struggling for life, hardly moving and gasping for air.

I checked all water paramters and they're fine: 0 ammonia, 0 nitrite, 0 nitrate, 7.6 ph (what it's always been).
What the FUCK happened? Why is the water so cloudy? I did a water change yesterday so I'm wondering if that has something to do with it...

>>2387294
sorry, picture is upside down.

>>2387294
>>2387295

On second thought, a few days ago I removed my carbon filter because some people told me it was useless and to just replace it with physical media. Did I get memed?

>>2386921
>"They don't need one because they can breathe from the air! "

>>2387312
Carbon isn't totally useless, it's just not normally necessary. It seems unlikely that that's what's causing this. Did you use tap water for the water change?

>>2387155
>Ant tips for a newbie in the planted Aquarium game?
Bigger tank. 5 gallons is really small and it's going to be very difficult to keep both stable and clean, especially with something like a dwarf gourami, which can be a bit delicate. 10 gallon tanks are inexpensive (PetSmart and Walmart have basic kits for $30), but ideally you should try and get a 20 gallon so you have enough room for a lot of cories to hang out together and do adorable cory things.

That 5 gallon would be very good for a betta or shrimp.

>>2387271
My 15 gallon has three Fundulopanchax gardneri killifish and 2 pygmy cories (lone survivors and no one stocks them anymore).
When I had a ten gallon before I had celestial pearl danios and sparkling gourami, and I had another one after that with cherry and bee shrimp.

>>2387333
Yeah. I treated it though.

>>2387342
I was thinking there might be something else in the tap water that's changed that you didn't/can't test for, like hardness. (I lost a bunch of fish a while ago because I didn't bother checking the hardness of my college's tap water). Maybe do another water change but with bottled water?

>>2387294
check your heater. It might be cracked and slowly electrocuting your fish in intervals

>>2387188
It takes 30 minutes to an hour without flow for bacteria to die in most filters.

>>2387312
If you leave carbon in for a couple months it becomes covered in nitrifying bacteria and essentially becomes a biofilter. At that point removing it can disrupt the biofilter and cause the tank to go through a soft cycle.

>>2387294
Cloudy water is caused by bacteria in the water column.

these bacteria consume oxygen, effectively suffocating your fish. Do a couple big water changes, find out what's dead in your tank, and consider using a UV sterilizer to prevent bacterial blooms.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/301165445187?_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

I just bought this thing for my new 40 gallon. The LEDs are 3w. Did I do good? Can I grow high light plants now?

>>2387345
That may be it, I dont have any testing supplies for hardness now though. I can try bottled water tomorro

>>2387347

I checked and it seems to be okay. Also, my gourami seems unaffected by whatever happened.

>>2387351

I think this is what's causing it. I found a small dead shrimp inside my filter that's probably been decaying for a while. There was also another 2 dead shrimp I found today but I think they died for the same reason the tetras did because they were alive yesterday.

I did a 25% water change and put the carbon filter back in. Tomorrow I'll do another 25% change and see if this will help. Thanks guys.

>>2387271
I have a 20T with a lone Convict Cichlid.

>>2387188
Generally it's fine until it dries out. The bacteria colonies take a few days to two weeks to actually starve out as long as they're kept wet.

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>>2387312
Lol

>>2387366
Update: All 8 of my neon tetras are dead. :( I'm so sad. Shrimp and gourami seem unfazed.

>>2387421
Sorry to hear that m8. Similar thing happened to me, 4 out of my 5 cherry barbs died because my school's water was ridiculously hard. Luckily my gourami pulled through.

>>2387421
my condolences

>>2387424
>>2387425

Thanks guys... definitely gonna take this as a learning experience and be more vigilant in cleaning up dead shrimp before another bacterial bloom happens again.

>>2387465
Haha

NEW THREAD:

>>2387536
>>2387536
>>2387536