Which sort of feelings do animals have?

>>2296681
Based on personal experience with my own puppy, it goes as follows.
Anger - whenever we try to clip his nails.
Happiness - whenever there's ham around.
Sleepiness - because why not
These 3 basically cycle over and over.

Isn't the general consensus that only dogs and cats have feelings and it's okay to treat the rest however shitty as you please.

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Most if not all the same emotions as humans.

The better question would be: What emotions do animals not have?

>>2297961
>What emotions do animals not have?
Most if not all emotions that humans do have.

nociception

>>2297962

Got an anecdote for us or are you just being contradictory?

>>2297964
emotionfags are the ones who can only use anecdotes as """evidence"""

>>2297976
I'm pretty sure I've seen animals express at the very least happiness and fear.

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>>2297983
my computer expresses those feelings too.

>>2297976
Seeing as your second rebuttal had both an ad hominem and absolute fallacy, I'll assume you're not very smart.

Sadness: While better interpreted as a longing anxiety, pack animals often will display depressive characteristics if separated from familiar kin or environments.

Jealousy: Competing siblings and competitive mates will display active stress characteristics when resource valuable species-mates are being given or are giving attention by/to a competitive member of the same litter/population.

Fear: An essential emotion that complex organisms will always display, the drove to stay alive and avoid danger.

Curiousness: Any study examining the utilization of tools by any number of animals must first accept the curious nature of the animal as reasoning for why they are utilizing the tool in the first place.

Happiness: Any excitatory or pleasing behavior as the result of stimuli, recorded numerous times in numerous species for numerous reasons. An animal that derives enjoyment is happy.

That's 5 emotions. I guarantee you can't name 5 that they dont have.

>>2297987
>muh anthropomorphism
back to plebbit

>>2297987
>I guarantee you can't name 5 that they dont have.
Sadness: requires self-awareness to experience
Jealousy: requires self-awareness to experience
Fear: requires self-awareness to experience
"Curiousness" (wtf? are you fucking retarded?): requires self-awareness to experience
Happiness: requires self-awareness to experience

there, there's 5 emotions animals unequivocally don't have.

>>2297991
isn't it more that that they can't actually know what they feel, but do so in regards to happiness or whatever regardless, just very unconsciously?

>>2297998
yes, but an emotion is a conscious experience.

you can't unconsciously experience things. Or if you do it doesn't matter. Like a terrifying dream you don't remember. If you don't know it happened, it didn't happen.

>>2297961
>What emotions do animals not have?
guilt for once

>>2297991
>requires self-awareness to experience
why?

>>2297991
>animals dont experience fear

u wot m8

>>2298022
>why?
because an emotion is awareness of the condition of the self.

say you're angry and unconscious, are you really angry? If you aren't aware that you're angry then you're not as far as you're concerned.

you have to consciously experience the thing for it to be an emotion. Conversely anything that experiences emotions is consciously aware. Emotion is a type of conscious experience, an awareness of what the self is feeling.

>>2298026
when you have a fight or flight response you feel fear. The fight or flight response is not the same thing as feeling fear, and just because another animal or machine has a fight or flight response doesn't imply it feels fear.

they are two separate things:
1. the response to stimuli
2. the conscious experience of the response.

just because you have both doesn't imply other animals do too. They can easily have just one.

bacteria for example have fight or flight responses. That doesn't imply they feel fear.

>>2298047
>If you aren't aware that you're angry then you're not as far as you're concerned
but people often are not aware that they are angry unless they get called out on it

>>2298064
>but people often are not aware that they are angry
then they aren't angry.

just like hunger. Hunger is an emotion. If you aren't aware that you're hungry, are you hungry? Nope, you're only hungry if you feel hungry.

>>2298067
They are angry, only their own perception is flawed. The one pointing it out might be wrong as well, but it's much less likely as such things can easily be pointed out.
Just because I don't know I'm white doesn't mean I'm not white. Just because I don't know I'm autistic, doesn't mean I'm not.

It's one thing to completely antropomorphize animals, another to acknowledge they have and unconsciously do feel emotions. They are not aware of them, they are much less complex, but they do have them on some level. And we know that only because we are self-aware enough to reflect on this behaviour.

I think you're right, however, in that they can not actually feel these emotions themselves. They do have "happy, unhappy" and whatnot, which is how animals can get depressive. Very different from what we experience, obviously. Much more primitive.

>>2298096
>they have and unconsciously do feel emotions.
you're redefining the term to mean what you want it to is all.

emotions are conscious experiences. If you're not conscious of them they don't exist.

If you don't think your skin is white then in your universe it isn't. Your perceptions are subjective because only you are subject to them.

animals in general aren't subjects, they have no conscious, subjective experiences.

I had a billy goat once.
>horny
>horny
>And piss and cum everywhere horny.

I felt kinda bad after about a month of that shit

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>>2296681
Pretty much all of them, but to differing degrees.

>HUNGERY
>ANGERY
>HAPPERY
>SCAREDERY

>>2296681
whichever ones are beneficial to the species survival.

>>2297367
that's the shitty biased normalfag consensus

>>2297987
>line breaks
>hehehe logical fallacies!!
damn reddit fuck off

>>2296681
I have had several dogs and i can afirm with no doubt.

Fear
Anger
Depression/numbness
Happiness/Excitement

>>2298479
>my anecdotes are objective scientific proof
good thing we've established that

>>2298481
I think you can tell when an animal is mad or scarred and is going to attack you.

Same with tge excitement when they met new people or other animals.

>>2298474

Back to /pol/ would have been the better response (((degenerate))).

I believe animals feel just as much as humans but it's difficult to prove an animals consciousness when nobody understands what consciousness is.

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>>2297987
>Seeing as your second rebuttal had both an ad hominem and absolute fallacy, I'll assume you're not very smart.

I honestly find this sort of discussion to always be extremely flawed, and obviously based on human perception and bias.

Hasn't it already been shown that there are many creatures whose brains use entirely different parts, combinations of parts, or functions to arrive at the same or similar conclusions/reactions as that of a human brain?

Imagine what it would be like if a similarly intelligent alien race were to arrive, yet declared us as incapable of thought and emotion simply because their brains, their way of achieving those functions differ so much from that of a human.

>>2298067
>you're only hungry if you feel hungry
>what is anorexia nervosa

>>2298973
>what is anorexia nervosa
an emotional disorder

>>2298975
It causes you to lose the feeling of hunger even when you're starving, though.

>>2298984
yes, but that doesn't make it any less of a feeling.

there are millions of people that can't feel joy. That doesn't mean joy isn't an emotion, it just means they have an emotional disorder. Just like anorexia, there's an underlying physical problem, but joy and hunger are still feelings whether a person can feel them or not.