Cool Insects

neat!

>>2100590
o o

___

>>2100597
this is bigger than i thought insects could become in our athmosphere

File: bumble_bee_flower_striped_insect_33847_1920x1080.jpg (495KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

495KB, 1920x1080px

Are bumble bees the cutest insects?

>>2100602
what are those lumps between the antennae?

>>2100636
You mean i million Im sure

>>2100688
Another set of eyes.

>>2100680
I hate it then they wake up too early in the spring, when it's still nothing to eat. ;_;

>>2100586
das photoshop

>tfw you only have two eyes ( ._.)

File: 26087058046_dbbc654b8a_h.jpg (354KB, 1600x1067px) Image search: [Google]

354KB, 1600x1067px

>>2100680
Planthoppers, though.

>>2100711
It's not.

File: 15634197950_3cffaeb721_b.jpg (254KB, 1024x708px) Image search: [Google]

254KB, 1024x708px

>>2100580
best mantis

>>2100776
even the L1 ones are amazing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3SMdj-JYepE

File: trilobite b.jpg (225KB, 960x640px) Image search: [Google]

225KB, 960x640px

I think trilobite beetles are pretty cool looking

>>2100579
What kind of sausage is that?

>>2100691
what is the actual maximum size for insects in our current athmosphere? cat-sized dragonflies dont exist anymore , but what about non-flying stuff?

>>2100680
No jumping spider cutest insect

File: WateryUncomfortableBronco.webm (810KB, 1024x576px) Image search: [Google]

810KB, 1024x576px

>>2101086

>>2101087
>spiders
>insects
fuckyou/10 made me reply

File: lanturn-bug.jpg (440KB, 1152x864px) Image search: [Google]

440KB, 1152x864px

this thread is awesome.

does anyone have any clear diagrams/photos of mantid mouthparts? i'm drawing a mantid themed alien critter but i'm having trouble figuring out what's going on in there and my googlefu is weak.

File: 0411161716.jpg (2MB, 4160x2340px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 4160x2340px

Here's an earwig I caught the other day.
>dem pinchers

File: mantis1.jpg (842KB, 1988x2336px) Image search: [Google]

842KB, 1988x2336px

>>2101109
here's a bunch

>>2100799
A E S T H E T I C

File: 3041777064.gif (3MB, 314x178px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 314x178px

>>2101119
the underside view helps a ton. thanks bud!

File: peruphasma_schultei.jpg (104KB, 640x333px) Image search: [Google]

104KB, 640x333px

Peruphasma schultei only lives in a 5 hectar area in the north of peru.

Due to being bred en masse, it's pretty common in captivity though.

File: 21443655342.png (575KB, 793x475px) Image search: [Google]

575KB, 793x475px

>>2100579
I remember catching these guys as a kid and keeping them in a tank. They were bloodthirsty murder machines.

>>2100579
what the heck does that even grow into? is it shopped?

File: Goliath-Beetles.jpg (295KB, 1024x703px) Image search: [Google]

295KB, 1024x703px

>>2101171
It's a goliath beetle

>>2101168
These creep me out and when they're in swimming pools I can't swim in them

File: nom.jpg (673KB, 2000x1125px) Image search: [Google]

673KB, 2000x1125px

>tfw just got my first giant centipede
>wonder why it kept running around the tank instead of hiding
>throw dubia roach in
>Fucker does a 360 and jumps across half the tank to take down the roach

These things are pretty scary when they're hungry.

>>2101178
centipedes are fucking monsters

>>2101190

>>2098541
>>2098544
>>2098545

>>2101086
I doubt there's a hard limit to how big insects/arthropods can grow

>>2100594
is like a mantis and wasp had a baby. this is neat.

>>2100680
eee! so fuzzy.

File: Triops cancriformis.jpg (94KB, 900x534px) Image search: [Google]

94KB, 900x534px

Triops cancriformis.
it is not an insect

File: wacky_waving_inflatable_arm_flailing_tube_man.gif (573KB, 399x290px) Image search: [Google]

573KB, 399x290px

>>2101093

>>2101086

i doubt they could even move or function of you just massively scaled up their exoskeletons

>>2101436
Gotta keep lookin for that highest branch senpai

>>2100590
Mister Mind

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0I9zZSvg0U

>>2100680
I'd like to have bee hives when I'm older/retired. Bees are so cool.

>>2101684
Nice
Do you know what species this is?

>>2101754
It's a lichen katydid, Markia hystrix

>>2101756
Thanks

>>2100579
That's some mighty good eating there. America is one of the few countries that doesn't have insects as a staple in their diet.

>>2101767
Unless you're from Louisiana.

>>2100776
>>2100580
Orchid mantis' are also cool as fuck

>>2100680
It's a toss up between bumblebees and fluffy moths

>>2101846
Not Hymenopus coronatus, the pictured species is Idolomantis diabolica

>>2101875
>you
>reading comprehension

>>2100579
That would be so good fried up in some stirfry with some grasshoppers and red chilli peppers

>>2101197
well , at some point when the relation of body mass to surface becomes too large , the tracheas wont be able to supply the animal with enough oxygen anymore. thin things like >>2101093 would be fine , but bulkier insects have different limits.

monster insects back then (when dinosaurs were walking around) were able to exist because of the extreme oxygen levels

>>2100711
No it isnt, I've seen them around here.

>>2101988
Is that a cicada species?

>>2101799
Some say crawfish count as insects boy.

>>2100799
mad as fuck

>>2102041

It is possible for insects to be larger with earth's current low oxygen atmosphere, but this makes them slow and lethargic and as a result susceptible to predators.

Insects today are only as large as they can effectively survive at.

>>2101878
right, sorry
I misread that fucking sentence
I am stupid

>>2101178
I've seen people recommend that you keep centipedes in two tanks, a smaller one nested in a bigger one. They're escape artists and they WILL make a break for it once they learn you open the cage to feed them.

>>2100579
am I the only one who thinks this looks delicious

File: 1448959642300.jpg (537KB, 1600x1067px) Image search: [Google]

537KB, 1600x1067px

>>2102243
Git gud. Their behavior is predictable if you're observant. You definitely shouldn't be opening the lid wide if it's not burrowed or hiding and you know that it's a hektik kunt.

Flexible plastic they'll chew out of. They'll probably climb up silicone glass sealant, so glass tanks are a bad idea. They'll squeeze out of plastic shoeboxes and sterilites if they don't have latches. Best enclosures I've used are tall, hard plastic jars and polysterene shoe boxes for high heels with a heavy weight on top.

Also, Scolopendra heros is top pede. They're enjoyable to handle if they're well fed.

>>2100597
Kabutomushi?

>>2102303
WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU WANT TO HANDLE THAT
WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM ANON

>>2102573
no, Megasoma elephas

>>2102624
Kabutomushi

File: 800px-Lasius_niger_y_Cinara_tujafilina_en_Thuja_occidentalis.jpg (105KB, 800x533px) Image search: [Google]

105KB, 800x533px

Some farming ant species gather and store the aphid eggs in their nests over the winter. In the spring, the ants carry the newly hatched aphids back to the plants. Some species of dairying ants (such as the European yellow meadow ant, Lasius flavus)[23] manage large herds of aphids that feed on roots of plants in the ant colony. Queens leaving to start a new colony take an aphid egg to found a new herd of underground aphids in the new colony. These farming ants protect the aphids by fighting off aphid predators

File: 12973245_1017206371661471_5733649577300075533_o.jpg (356KB, 1536x2048px) Image search: [Google]

356KB, 1536x2048px

Can anyone ID this little guy? Found in NJ.

I'm like 75% sure he squeaked. I was walking by my stream and took a step and heard a squeak, thinking I stepped on a frog. I looked down and nothing was there, and I stepped again and heard another squeak. So I got down and found this guy. Forgot to get a picture of the sides, sorry. I think he was spotted.

>>2102895
I'm shit with caterpillars. Nyctemera sp.?

File: 13020336_1017272888321486_1887094662_n.jpg (89KB, 674x899px) Image search: [Google]

89KB, 674x899px

>>2102897
No, I don't think so. Different pattern and hair type.

>>2100579
That's a rhinoceros beetle larvae.
The dark section at the end is full of rotten wood and feces.
They don't taste good because they eat literal shit.
Good grubs are ones that live in trees, they taste much cleaner, sometimes like scrambled eggs

>>2100579
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iVXvAWyNBM

Hear you go!

>>2102895
It's not a caterpillar iirc. They're a kind of foreign worm that swarm trees and build massive web nests while they eat trees dry. I live in NY and we've spent years trying to get rid of the fuckers. They're seriously destructive.

Government ended up putting up purple bait boxes in trees that trap and poison them since they flock to the color for some reason. Haven't seen any since.

>>2102136
yup. never seen one that pretty before

>>2100680
You mean honeybees.

File: Forest-tent-caterpillar-malacosoma-disstria.jpg (728KB, 1576x912px) Image search: [Google]

728KB, 1576x912px

>>2102967
Are you thinking of a forest tent caterpillar? Because I don't think this is that, forest tents have spots on the top of their body and the hair stays at the sides.

>>2103011
Bumblebees are so round and fluffy, though.

>>2102638

Source?

>>2102638
Please post source.

I really want to believe that all you said is true, but ant behaviour has been vastly exaggerated and anthropomorphised before.

>>2103605
>>2103892
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aphid#Symbioses

>>2102629
>>2102573
Spiral staircase

>>2100746
That isn't cute. that's kaiju tier.

File: 36f463c3ee86825963ef59f72b9ada6c.jpg (55KB, 640x960px) Image search: [Google]

55KB, 640x960px

>>2102144
Huh, really. I've always considered them crustaceans. You know, because they are miniature lobsters.

>tfw eating crayfish down in Baton Rouge
I wish I was back there.

>>2104008
Singularity point

File: 0316062037 .jpg (30KB, 456x500px) Image search: [Google]

30KB, 456x500px

I don't know how cool he is, but I sure like my little roach, and I didn't see any other insect thread to gush about him on.

He sure is a plucky, cheerful fellow, Gregor is. In a month, it will be warm enough to release him. I worry he has gotten soft from pampered living. He seems very comfy and cozy in his habitat.

It is a tall, translucent cylinder, with many levels inside made of paperboard and held together with toothpick pillars pushed through about 8 inches high. There are many hidey holes, tunnels made of wide straws zigzaging up and down, and a yarn loop running through.

On top, there is a perforated lid that is the ceiling above a small paper tray with a scotch-tape handle that I can pull out and add fresh food every day. This makes easy cleaning, prevents spoilage and accumulating waste.

To the side is a large vertical straw with entry and exits, that acts as both a stairwell and water main. The top is aligned with a hole where an eyedropper passes through the lid and delivers water straight down to the bottom level. This keeps water from warping the paperboard, allows it to pool a bit on the lowest level and also acts as a source for evaporation and humidity.

My favorite feature, though, is a wee paperboard tent that sits in the middle level. Bent at a shallow 80 degree angle and with wedges cut at either longitudinal end for easy entry and exit, Gregor favors this as his shelter and perch,

And that's what brought me here to share. One of the things he likes to do after meals is to scuttle and bumble his way back down from the "dining" level and back into his shelter and clean himself.

And when he's finished and relaxed, he likes to poke just his head out and watch me with his antennae straight up, looking very much like a dog in his house or a rabbit poking out of his hole.

I've enjoyed doting on him and sharing him as company, as he is so cheerful, and it feels good knowing I can make such a timid creature feel safe and sated...

File: 1457759374268.png (1MB, 2048x1152px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 2048x1152px

>>2104299


... Most roaches don't find human encounters so positive, but here is one little roach that gets treated like a little king. In return, I get to see a cheerful creature take pleasure in simply living; investigating a morsel of potato, ambling about some string and mapping his home or relishing donut as he loves to do, or just relaxing and watching the world from comfort and safety.

One of the cutest things he does, and indeed he has personality, is using the sides of his tent to scratch his back, presumably when a wing feels out of place. Sometimes he seems to wag his behind and be doing a little dance which I haven't figured out yet. I figured maybe it has to do with digestion or simply 'frustration' from isolation, and it makes me look forward to his release when he can find friends.

I worry, of course; I know he has many enemies that would make him their meal, where there is no one who will dote on him and he will have to forage a dangerous world on his own.

I know its silly, since he is just a little roach. But he helps me appreciate life. And I like to think that if a humble roach can win the caring of a human, then maybe there are small people out there like me, and something moves the world to bring them peace and contentment too, if only once in a great while. If it can happen for a little roach, maybe it can happen for one of us too, at least once in a while.

Have a good night, /an/, and be blessed.

File: PrayingMantis.webm (3MB, 400x528px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 400x528px

hey! this one has a prize inside!

>>2104027
>I've always considered them crustaceans.
Thats because you're exactly right.

File: 1397187307946.jpg (393KB, 960x720px) Image search: [Google]

393KB, 960x720px

>>2104309

I can't tell if its a member or parasite. I assume the latter.

>>2104318

So there would be an intersection at arthropod, I would guess. Crayfish are pretty neat. I too always saw them as small lobsters.

I think everyone likes crayfish and lobsters. I'm also like the coconut crabs /an/ introduced me too. I bet they all have fascinating physiology.

File: well-done-thumb.jpg (13KB, 293x302px) Image search: [Google]

13KB, 293x302px

>>2104300
You're a really great guy, Roach Guy.

I really really respect that you've taken in what most consider a pest and have treated better than most treat their pets. It's a bit weird, but still really awesome!

File: 1304618805_mantis-vs-mouse-cursor.gif (2MB, 360x239px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 360x239px

>>2104325

Why, thank you. That's very kind, and I appreciate it. It's odd to me too. I just sort of fell into it; it could've been any bug that got stranded inside trying to keep warm. It just happened to be a roach, and he came alone.

I couldn't just toss him out in the cold, and there was no sign of others. I've never hosted a stray bug for so long, but then I never see any in the winter. In spring or summer, I just keep them overnight and let them out the next day. Normally, its a spider or ant, or stray bee.

Aside from the cheer he gives just by being so good natured and lively (without being frenetic), I've learned a lot about them and insects generally, and have been in awe of his mental ability for so small a critter.

At the risk of being repetitive, I would note that I have seen him show preference, make decisions that were entirely personal, exhibit self attention, reflexes and curiosity. All that with so little mental hardware; it amazes me.

On a deeper level, the thing that makes me wonder how we more elaborate animals function mentally, is when I observe that he is completely sated and has no reason to seek or search, nor find shelter and the ambient environment is isotropically comfortable. That is, there is nothing to push or pull him away from rest in his position.

"Eppur si muove". Despite all that, this little creature makes a decision internally to roam to nowhere in particular. That there is a cause for this, I find extraordinarily "living". It puts the "animate" in 'animal'...

File: 1339633925368.gif (2MB, 294x164px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 294x164px

>>2104342

... Because its something we do constantly. We often simply move about for no apparent reason. There's a restlessness in us, both human and roaches. We could call it random, except that it seems universal in so many animals. Something pushes us within to move when there is no reason of need.

And it makes me wonder what that is. Is it a deep, ingrained part of our programming. Is it simply to alleviate something, and if so, what? Do we roam and wander as part of surviving, to update information about the options our environment offers before we actually are pushed to need it? Is that the feeling of boredom, a natural frustration from lack of stimuli, a hunger for discovery and new information, new vistas, the confidence to expect more from what's around us?

I know none of this. But when I see such a primitive animal, completely comfortable, sated and safe, make an internal decision to roam, to see more, to expect curiosity, to gather more immediate information just because it might be there to absorb, it makes me wonder about ourselves.

If a little roach has these qualities, and yet we are rarely aware of doing it ourselves, it says much about what living as a sentient creature is, and how often we are in fact distant from being aware of just how we function as animals ourselves.

Sorry for so much rambling. Im just thinking out loud. Have a fine evening.

File: 1327694893845.gif (2MB, 380x199px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 380x199px

>>2104299
>a shallow 80 degree angle


Hmm. that should've read 170 degree angle. It is almost flat but not quite. I had read that they like close contact on all sides, and made it flatter than the prior one.

But Roach showed that he didn't like it as much and after trying it once or twice, opted for a level with more space.

So I took the hint and gave the tent more height, and he immediately went back to is as his favorite spot.

And he has called it home ever since. All it took was for me to get the message.

>>2104344
That's the deepest post I've seen in awhile.

>>2104321
it is in fact a parasite called a nematomorph/horsehair worm

>>2104194
fuck off pucci

>>2104321
Arthropods are animals with jointed exoskeletons. Mandibuladae includes insects crustaceans millipedes and centipedes. So your roach has more in common with a king crab than with a jumping spider. Just an interesting note

File: tumblr_mhr5wyNb0t1rvr9sko1_500.gif (23KB, 500x375px) Image search: [Google]

23KB, 500x375px

>>2105209


Oh my, I see. Thank you.

File: 6960008-wasp-yellow-insect (1).jpg (212KB, 1680x1050px) Image search: [Google]

212KB, 1680x1050px

>>2104299
Post a pic of the whole setup. It sounds interesting but it's hard to put it all together in my mind.

File: Chez Gregor.png (26KB, 487x851px) Image search: [Google]

26KB, 487x851px

>>2105549

Hello

:3

The only pic I have is old and blurry cuz of my crap cam and it is dark now so it wouldn't come out good. Plus, even the best pic I could take wouldn't show so much in anything but strong back light and detail would still be blurry because the plastic cylinder is more translucent than transparent, so it is just fogged enough to make it hard to see anything.

So I've been wanting to make a diagram of it for a while to share, and this was an opportunity.

I hope this gives you the gist; its actually pretty accurate, the the space between the top level and food tray seems higher than real life.

The straws are cut at slants so they are easier to access and make him feel less trapped, but he still doesnt use them much and prefers just to scale the walls or climb the string.

The string is supposed to run halfway above the paperboard rather than touch it, but it got jostled around when I was fixing his shelter more to his liking. He spends a lot of time there now.

His second favorite perch is beneath the food tray, where he is now.

Otherwise, he rests on the wall when he isnt ambling about. He likes to stroll out of his shelter and wander around, but after meals or during naps, his shelter is his favorite rest area...

File: GermanCockroach2.jpg (123KB, 425x293px) Image search: [Google]

123KB, 425x293px

>>2105666

You can tell when he is napping because his posture becomes flattened with his rear angled down, and his antennae are completely flat and laterally oriented. Then if something startles him, he sits up and does a quick sweep with his antennae.

Lately, he doesn't startle easily and if something does, he quickly ignores it and goes back to sleep or decides to rouse, clean himself and go out for a walk, perhaps to see if theres anything new on the dinner tray.

Oddly, he doesn't spend much time on the lower levels and seems to prefer drinking from drops left on the ceiling after watering.

This may be related to his peculiar habit of leaving his droppings in greater numbers on the bottom when he visits at all. It seems to be a habit, but I didntt think roaches distinguished scat as bothersome.

I do know they leave scat as scent trails, but I cant figure why he would leave a marker to a place he never goes except, ostensibly, to poop.

It may be because the water pools there and he is suspicious of standing water out of some instinct to avoid drowning. He may "assume" (as instinct) that where ever water pools, it can also flood.

That would be my guess, anyways.

>>2102303
Nice

File: german_cockroach_sarah_camp_flickr_CC.jpg (52KB, 1280x854px) Image search: [Google]

52KB, 1280x854px

>>2105667

... For some reason, I feel I should note that Gregor's habitat evolved.

It began with an empty cylinder. After a while, after watching him pace in circles all day which seemed like stress behavior (or at least I empathized it that way) I decided that it wasn't natural.

Further, he was still a juvenile and I expect to release him. So I figured running on a flat surface doesnt do well to build his reflexes and ability to over take obstacles. Even in insects, I imagine exercise builds ability.

Further, it seemed cruel, even for a roach, to have no mental stimulation at all besides making turns in a flat circle all day, doing nothing more than judging up from down. I decided that as part of his physical readiness for the world, he needed to have mental challenges too to navigate and make decisions, perhaps to form intuition about options during navigation dilemmas.

Thus, the first 'jungle gym". He immediately exhibited body language in how he moved and supported himself that would be easier to associate with cheer, or at least confident excitement. He still does it whenever I change habitats.

In the beginning, I made a priority of cleanliness for Roach. It was necessary because food was being given out in sloppy large portions. It had to be big enough for him to detect before it dried to where it was a challenge for his species' frail jaw (German Roach). However this would eventually collide with free water and spoil, polluting his air noticeably. I would have to open his lid just to get fresh air in and in only a day it could smell like a brewery. This is partly why the food tray now sits at the top, far from water and close to ventilation. It also provide easy access and has cut way, way down on spoilage that causes pollution.

Later, it occurred to me that he just napped where ever he passed out, and that too seemed a bit unnatural. So I did a bit of research and construct his shelter, which he took to immediately...

File: cockroach-up-close.jpg (149KB, 2564x1716px) Image search: [Google]

149KB, 2564x1716px

>>2105677

Still, it was uncomfortably close to the water, which is why it is now elevated, which he seems to appreciate, generally avoiding the lower level where the standing water sits, also acting as a humidifier, an environmental factor they prefer.

As the structure evolved, it became clear that there was less need to clean his habitat every day since spoilage was way down, and changing his habitat to clean was a source of stress.

So I got an identical container and duplicated it. Now, instead of having to uppend the poor creatures home every other day, I just mate the opening of of his habitat to its identical homolog, and wait for him to wander and cross into the new clean one, and close the opening behind him, and set it back upright, which happens every two weeks or so.

Its a simple design, and the paper board structures are all based on the same size pattern I can cut quickly while watching a movie, and assemble the toothpick pillars, necessary to keep everything in place and stable. Extra attention and variation is necessary for the lower levels where there is water that can roll about, about 8 drops every other day, because it used to damage the paperboard (from a cracker box) often and begin collapsing the overall structure above it.

He seems generally aversive to entering the wide straws made for milk-shakes; he cant tell what is ahead of him because his antennae are cramped and can't rotate well. In the few times he has tried them, even after slanting the entrance and extis so entry and egress are not so cramped, he still only gets halfway though before deciding he doesn't like where its going and struggles to turn around. He still likes to use the straw exterior as a staircase...

File: 0316062039.jpg (529KB, 1600x1200px) Image search: [Google]

529KB, 1600x1200px

>>2105678

... He seems to regard the string, yarn width, as something of a novelty. He will follow it for a bit but generally prefers the flat sides of the cylinder to climb. The point of adding string was to give him opportunities to learn balance on narrow surfaces, which is why, in design, it isnt meant to touch the paperboard.

Most likely, Sunday I will watch some movie and make the next rendition to give him a new clean habitat in the twin cylinder, a Crystal Lite tea package/bottle, the thing I have always used to detain insect/spider visitors at night when I discover them to put out the next day. I always kept two because sometimes I find a bug and a spider the same night or some other incompatible pair and can't put them together.

Even when there isn't much debris or detritus, it has to be rendered again due to simple wear and tear from movement and paperboard fatigue. But the parts are all disposable, so its no matter.

I guess that was a lot more than anyone wanted to know, but thats how the design came about.

Have a good evening, /an/ and a thank you to OP and everyone else posting these nice pictures of cool insects. I will try to share some myself.

File: silverfish2a.jpg (80KB, 648x504px) Image search: [Google]

80KB, 648x504px

>>2105686
Silverfish are top tier bros. They can infest my home as much as they want.

They look so damn prehistorical.

File: image.jpg (1MB, 3264x2448px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 3264x2448px

My ghostie molted today.

She used to be the size of a bean. Now, I can see patterns on her butt leaves.

File: jackjumperant.jpg (38KB, 800x534px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 800x534px

>implying I'm not going to consume your soul

File: 20160421_153951.jpg (79KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

79KB, 640x480px

What insect is this?

>>2105719
Amata sp. Are you in Europe? If so it's Amata phegea by the looks of it.

>>2102243

>once they learn

They don't have brains, anon. Everything they do is instinctual.

File: DSCF0723.jpg (4MB, 3648x2736px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 3648x2736px

Here's a couple pics from the 2015 /out/ trip to Dartmoor.

File: DSCF0820.jpg (3MB, 3648x2736px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 3648x2736px

>>2105746

>>2105683

File: 735.jpg (17KB, 213x400px) Image search: [Google]

17KB, 213x400px

>>2105683

>>2105719

No, not Europe. Now that I know the genus, it looks like Amata huebneri up close and clear. Thank you so much, stranger!

>>2105684

I.....I CANNOT EVEN

File: image.jpg (18KB, 277x182px) Image search: [Google]

18KB, 277x182px

Hey guys I'm an insect

File: image.jpg (21KB, 277x182px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 277x182px

Oh wait no I'm not

*Stalks internally*

>>2105885
>>2105887
cringe

File: 1388438485552.jpg (92KB, 800x749px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 800x749px

>>2105885
>>2105887


lel I had some nudibranchs I was going to post too, then I remembered what the thread was.

I wish I had more neat insects to share. Instead, I have neat pictures of common insects.

>>2105679
That was really entertaining to read thanks man and also i feel bonded with your little friend and i hope it won't get crushed under someones feet as soon as you release it.

>>2105916
That thing looks amazing.

File: 1370074682294.jpg (64KB, 620x438px) Image search: [Google]

64KB, 620x438px

>>2105742


Maybe it depends on how you define learning and distinguish it from memory. I dont know how long they remember, but I have definitely seen Roach modify his behavior based on experience or new information.He knows, for example, where to scuttle if me opening his habitat makes too much ruckus.

I think its possible he may know things without knowing that he knows it, unaware of why he follows new patterns adapted to new circumstances.

Humans do this too, especially with regards to food, sex or drugs. They will "find themselves" close to something they want or like without exactly making a conscious decision to locate themselves for that reason. Its a bit like how people will unconsciously start talking about food a lot when they are hungry, or how boys might alter their path to see a girl without being entirely aware of why he has changed course. The action precedes the awareness of why it is taking place. Perhaps it is that way with other animals also, if they are aware of it at all.

Over the last few weeks, I notice that Roach seems to associate me moving his habitat out of the shadows in the evening with food, because that is what I do before I feed him.

So once I sit his habitat down again, he waits for about a minute of peace and then hurries up to the food tray and excitedly snoops around, as if assuming there is something there to be expected.

Not down, not left or right, but decidedly up to the food tray, and consistently. I've read they do have some learning ability; at first I thought I was imagining it and other behaviors that changed over time. Sort of like a lizard, it is erratic and episodic. While there is a consistent pattern over time, it is not without lapses and variation...

File: candy striped leafhopper.jpg (325KB, 1024x683px) Image search: [Google]

325KB, 1024x683px

>>2100680
I love seeing these guys in the summer.

>>2105931
are those some kind of aphids ? if so arent they kinda annoying to have around since they jump on you and make you itchy all the time?

>>2105932
No, these are leafhoppers.

>>2105934
bro i totaly remember those from the camping trip i went to last summer. They were all on me and i was couldn't sleep for a week and it fucked up my camping experience realy bad.Ever since i hate those fuckers and i dont thing i can tolarate anyone feeling close to them fuckers.

File: pandora sphinx moth.jpg (277KB, 1600x1200px) Image search: [Google]

277KB, 1600x1200px

>>2105930

.... For example, he seems to have generally lost his fear of me opening his lid and poking in, but not so much that there aren't still times when he decides its too much fuss to be around. Occasionally he will scurry to shelter, but more often he just retreats an inch and watches me.

Now as to how aware he is of his association or how long he can retain it, I couldn't say.

>>2105929

I think they are pretty neat too. I quite enjoy moths and butterflies. Here is a type I once saw in the country; it was huge.

>>2105927

Thank you, I am glad you found it interesting, I appreciate it. I too worry about his release, or that I've dulled his reflexes through captivity and care. He has had steady food and safety for two months now, and his remaining lifespan is likely not more than 6 months top. I would like to see him know freedom again though; I don't know which is the right or wrong option. But I feel he should have a chance to be free, even with all the bad things that can happen.

My hope is to find a place that is close to human habitation he needs, but not so trafficked that he would get picked off by humans or birds. It will be spring, so presumably I should be able to let him loose around the alleys around the diner district by garbage bins or such, but close to some sort of uninhabited shelter.

He likes to roam a lot, so its difficult. Its not like I can put him near food and shelter and expect him to make a reasonable decision to stay put near necessities. He's going to travel no matter what. Likewise, I dont want to be responsible for spreading a 'pest'.

There is a dumpster near an isolated convenience store I have in mind. It isnt highly trafficked, and Im sure there will be bits of something to eat he can find. Plus, it is urban enough that there aren't many vertebrate predators, but remote enough that he shouldn't immediately encounter human antagonism.

File: 1426199730953.jpg (116KB, 880x587px) Image search: [Google]

116KB, 880x587px

>>2105940

... Most likely, I will assemble a roachy Winnebago for him, a mobile home stocked with some starter food and a safe refuge. I dont want to give him too much food because he has to remember to learn his new location and scout on his own.

He eats very little of course, and they aren't picky. The biggest obstacle I have noticed so far isn't so much the food but that it stays soft enough for him to bite and chew.

>>2104299
>>2104300
I feel like I just read a Sparksnotes version of "The Metamorphosis"

File: 1360040048428.jpg (106KB, 900x600px) Image search: [Google]

106KB, 900x600px

>>2105940

Re-reading, I want to clarify: he would be near the dumpster, not in it, of course.

>>2105931 poster here, I should have read the whole thread because I didn't see >>2105180

Still, very cool little insects. Really beautiful if you notice them, they're so small that it's hard to see them despite their bright colouring.

File: bws.jpg (16KB, 590x350px) Image search: [Google]

16KB, 590x350px

Anyone ever been bit by one of these? I have a premonition I'm going to be bit and I might die. I hate spiders.

File: Cockroach.jpg (406KB, 2240x1200px) Image search: [Google]

406KB, 2240x1200px

>>2105942


lel I wonder about that sometimes too. I sometimes wonder if I am weaving across the line between fun new hobby and love of animals, or hangovers from winter cabin fever and devolving into personalizing the care of an insect to some sort of madness.

I like to think I have a handle on it; he's just fun to dote on for someone who can't have (nor could manage) pets, and stuck in the city.

Full disclosure: About a month ago, I did catch myself quietly singing the theme to an old cartoon "Grape Ape" and replacing the words with Gregor the Roach references. I still do sometimes.

Dont watch this, the tune will be stuck in your head for days.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8G5gSP64D4

>>2105949
its a good thing you are scared of them since they would fucking put you down with one bit. I guess your are fine as long as you are careful

File: jun_24_0043_male_nephila.jpg (86KB, 800x806px) Image search: [Google]

86KB, 800x806px

>>2105949
The lethality of spiders is so absurdly overblown by movies and arachnophobic pussies like >>2105955
.

File: 1369277805800.jpg (237KB, 1024x768px) Image search: [Google]

237KB, 1024x768px

>>2105949

No, but I do contend with Yellow Sac spider sometimes.

I did get bit by some unknown spider once and it was carrying some necrotic bacteria on its fangs. It scarred very badly in a very public way, but I got over it with some antibiotics.

The odds are very slim, so I don't worry about it. I find the scariest looking ones are typically harmless. Yellow Sac spiders are rather dull but have some toxins. Nonetheless, I afford them the same policy of peaceful removal.

>>2105955
You do realise that a black widow bite is less dangerous to a human than an adder bite, do you?

At worst, most people get nausious for an hour or two.

File: 1365555991713.jpg (141KB, 1200x800px) Image search: [Google]

141KB, 1200x800px

>>2105950

Thats pretty neat. I seem to be among the few people here who like wasps and such. I think panic causes a lot of unfortunate outcomes. If I remain calm during a fly-by, I dont get stung. People I see getting stung panic and swat, which scares the wasp.

This doesnt apply to clashes when you enter their home, of course. But in my experience, if you simply remain still and let them conclude you are not a threat, they wander off. I experience the most encounters if I am wearing certain types of cologne in the summer.

>>2105963
Would you mind telling me what kind of cologne and if you have done experiments?

File: Dasymutilla_occidentalis.jpg (53KB, 500x387px) Image search: [Google]

53KB, 500x387px

>>2105963

OK so im all for equal insect rights nut my friend just irks me.
I myself am an avid moth fan and often try to spread the message of moth wear ever i go.
BUT my fucboi friend on the other hand cant stop sucking butterfly dick, that smug asshole.
He cam into my house trying to show me these pics he took on some /out/ trip he went on.
I immediately began to feel queasy as i realized it was nothing but pictures of Danaus plexippus, that fucking normie.
I tried to show him the light, i really did, showing some Actias luna and Acherontia pics but he wouldn't have it.
He started throwing around buzzwords like "hairy worms" and "useless insect" and i lost it and punched him dead in the face.
I fucking hate butterflyfags.

File: wasp.jpg (867KB, 1824x1368px) Image search: [Google]

867KB, 1824x1368px

>>2105966

Im sorry. I have not done formal experiments. A very long time ago, I think it was something called "Samba" when I was younger and wore cologne more often. I dont even know if they still make it. It was a decidedly citrus scent. I used to wear all types, so its hard to be sure it was that one, but thats what I would guess.

More recently (I have to stop here and actually look at the bottle)....here it is: "Acqua di Gio, Giorgio Armani". It's all I use anymore, and not often. It too has a fruity scent (Thank you, I'd forgotten how much I liked it).

Anyhoo, in the summer, I notice when I wear it, bees and yellowjackets take a heightened interest in me if I get out to the country side. From experience, I know what they are interested in, so I just let them buzz for a bit. Naturally they are confused because they can't locate a central source or anything appealing.

To keep them from attempting a landing, I;ve learned the trick isnt to swat and panic them,but to simply annoy them with slow-motion, low arm movements that dont reach towards them or anywhere in particular, slowly, randomly and erratically.

What it does is make them constantly have to re-calculate how to land without colliding with some moving limb and frustrates them until they give up, never being able to find a source for the scent anyways or anything visually interesting.

I also tend to wear a lot of white and beige in the summer; I dont know if that has anything to do with it or not.

>>2105967


Thats pretty cool. I think someone was telling me about those here a few weeks ago. Very attractive.

File: Live nude moths.gif (590KB, 640x400px) Image search: [Google]

590KB, 640x400px

>>2105976

I swear I remember this from somewhere

Finally, a chance to use this gif I made

>>2105981
its from the metal copypasta, the one with nickle and copper i think.

File: Cat_matrix_deja_vu.gif (2MB, 400x162px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 400x162px

>>2105988

Oh. I guess it's over my head then. I'm not familiar with it. Maybe I just imagined it. But then how did I end up making the gif?!?

I really should log off more often, the web is warping my brain.

>>2105957
>The lethality of spiders is so absurdly overblown by movies and arachnophobic pussies

In my opinion there's both an exaggeration and also a downplaying. Like if you google Black Widow deaths, most of the information you'll find is that no one has died from a Black Widow bite in the US in an exceedingly long time

But if you keep searching you'll see that they don't really talk about complications and stuff that might occur. So if you go into shock and die from a widow bite its a 'complication' and they don't attribute death to the spider

Either way black widows are incredibly common as are their bites and even though fatalities are allegedly rare, the bite is almost always described as some of the worst pain imaginable over 2-4 days of suffering

So yeah, why wouldn't you be scared? You'd be stupid not to fear them -- so tiny and fast they are impossible to keep track of and control, nocturnal so you can't usually see them when they are active, etc

Fuck Black Widows.

>>2105959
>At worst, most people get nausious for an hour or two.
This is just as wrong as believing a widow bite is a death sentence. Its much worse than just nausea lol

>>2105958
>Nonetheless, I afford them the same policy of peaceful removal.
And how exactly do you peacefully remove spiders? The fuckers are lightning quick and if they're pissed off they'll bite you before you even know what happens.

The only semi reliable method is a vaccuum cleaner but thats not 'peaceful'

>>2106013
Black widows barely move around and when they do they do it slowly. Not fast animals.

File: 1413936996076.gif (1MB, 231x161px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 231x161px

>>2106016

Well, I dont pursue them, per se. What I find most successful in catching any bug is to coax them into a jar. I remember seeing a Hollywood doc on "Arachnophobia" about how they would get the spiders to perform using tricks like hairdryers. With some species, you can just use vibrations, depending on the circumstances, or your breath. Above all, dont startle them or invade their space until you have your receptacle ready. Or it can be as simple sometimes as simply planting the receptacle over top them.

In capturing most insects, one finds that its not about "catching" them in pursuit, but rather anticipating where they will go and why. They are less likely to be concerned with a jar or cup than the five legged beast sneaking up behind them

Maybe it takes some skill. It is admittedly harder in tight spaces, no doubt, and ceiling spots can be disorienting, since their first reaction to pursuit is typically to drop if they havent invested in a web.

The thing to remember is that they are small, and they dont attack, just respond. They aren't out to get you and you scare the crap out of them. Just because they can look creepy doesn't make them powerful.

Some species you can catch by hand, slower animals dont waste emotion on panic they cant do anything about. But mostly, its just a matter of anticipating where they would go and being ready with a cup or some such and something to quickly cover it with.

Typically, I find the fear people have of being bitten is more excruciating than any chance of actually being bitten. There is rarely a need to come into physical contact with them.

Another age old trick involves non-lethal weapons which I use for tight spots, a plain old spray bottle of cold water. Once they are stunned, all that speed and reflexes go out the window while they are trying to figure out what the heck just happened.

>>2106013
Black widows aren't "active". They sit in a web 24/7 and are functionally harmless.

File: giphy[1].gif (536KB, 500x375px) Image search: [Google]

536KB, 500x375px

>>2100590
>>2100592
>>2100595
>>2101528

>>2106047
So if you had one inside your room by a window it'd never ever leave its web if it wasn't disturbed?

File: Peek-a-Boo-Jumping-Spider-arachnology-31947219-500-432.png (302KB, 500x432px) Image search: [Google]

302KB, 500x432px

>>2106091

Not him, but I would remove anything I know to be venomous.

I have a different issue with spiders.

If I see one by a window, I tend to let it alone because I figure it can eat. If it seems like it set up house somewhere where I know it wont get enough food, I relocate it outdoors.

But a happy comfy spider presents a different issue. Babies.

Baby spiders are cute, but they hatch in such numbers and are so incredibly delicate that there is no way to remove them without killing them. By the time you actually managed to wrangle one without somehow crushing it (really, really delicate- I think three snowflakes would flatten them) fifty others would have gotten into every thing. Thats the problem, They are just babies and have no idea where they are going or why, and they all arrive at the same time.

If you love animals, it makes you feel like a monster trying to compete for living space. But they get in everything. They are too witless to even respond to coaxing. The most you can hope for is forgiveness and a swift end. Only the swift end is guaranteed. Its horrible. Its as bad as fruit flies, but at least with fruit flies you know they had a childhood. Removing baby spiders doesnt even give you that.

File: Golden_stag_beetle.jpg (704KB, 1600x1067px) Image search: [Google]

704KB, 1600x1067px

>>2105679
That's really interesting. Never thought I'd consider a roach as an interesting pet, nor wanting to let it go back into the wild after I observe him. Sounds like you really care about the little guy. I might have to try this sometime. Thanks for the read.

File: GoldInsect.jpg (64KB, 436x300px) Image search: [Google]

64KB, 436x300px

>>2106175

You bet, and I appreciate the kind words. It surprised me too. I learned they do have personalities, and are an evolutionarily precocious critter. They are exceptionally good natured, as timid creatures might be, but he is not mindlessly skittish. He is a German roach; I can't speak to other species.

I think a lot of my empathy for him comes from the fact that he sits by my computer in the evening where I spend most of my time, so I get to see everything he does. By giving him a more stimulating environment, I unintentionally gave him the opportunity to see how he reacts to different things, his choices, preferences, a sort of reasoning to his routines, things I would've never noticed had he been kept in a empty jar because he had nothing to engage with.

He has been cat-napping most of this evening under his food tray. I will have to give him fresh food soon, but I didnt want to disturb him. He has more food than he can eat, so I think his seemingly expectant behavior has more to do with interest in food than an actual hunger, the way a kid might fiddle with something just because it interests him even if he doesn't really want it.

So variety in food is sort of like a scavengers 'television' I guess. Checking for new food may be like 'channel surfing' when he isn't actually hungry.

Often I see him taking nibbles at things so quickly that it couldn't possibly be to fill up, simply to experience what it is. These are things you could only notice, like behavioral language, if you had an opportunity to glance at him often. No one would otherwise find patience to actually watch a roach all day, so this is a fortunate confluence of circumstances.

File: img_24651.jpg (324KB, 1626x817px) Image search: [Google]

324KB, 1626x817px

>>2105697

I too am very fond of them. I kept one for about a week once, but it ended sadly. I don't know what happened exactly; it appeared that he either burrowed into wet tissue and drowned, or perhaps some chemical in the tissue overwhelmed him. I try to be careful about such things. Even plastic can be a problem.

They are indeed an ancient animal. My experience with one indicated that they are rather silly bumbling creatures, no distinct personality and comically slow-witted, and reminded me of a lesser rodent, like a guinea pig, full of emotion but not a lot of sense.

And quite lovable, even if hapless bumblers. To add, his physiology was quite remarkable and alien.

For some reason, they always made me think of the 'sand trout' from the Dune series.

File: Buprestidae-1.jpg (893KB, 1200x872px) Image search: [Google]

893KB, 1200x872px

>>2106232

Hmm, maybe this is a better pic.

File: Secret life of a bug - Water droplets make this inset look twice the size.jpg (213KB, 964x606px) Image search: [Google]

213KB, 964x606px

Well, feeding is done and Roach seems much more chipper and lively, even though he hasn't actually touched his food, he is probably just keeping up with the daily excitement of happenings.

He seems to like any reason to clean his antennae. I learned that the effectiveness of their antennae drops severely with even the slightest bit of dust, thus the constant cleaning. So when he has a reason to clean, it means something new has happened and it seems to boost his "morale" inasmuch as an insect can delight in anything. A bit like a playful dog hopping about with no idea why it is so excited. Its the heartwarming sight of a critter expecting something good, and reacting cheerfully even when they dont technically have the mental hardware to be aware of abstract emotional states.

He seems played out already and appears to be trying harder to stay awake than actually succeeding, back under his dinner tray.

I take this as a sign his habitat needs cleaned, as a piece of pastry was knocked down yesterday and got in the water pool. So it is probably fermenting, meaning his new clean habitat on Sunday is certain. Until then I will simply have to vent his habitat daily to keep fumes from accumulating.

Presently, he has discovered a bit of burger, something new to him. It seems to be a big hit...

>>2106251

Variety is important for critters. As I say here often, if you cant let your pet into the world, bring the world to it. Animals sense the passing of time even if they could never understand it. Change is how we note the passing of time, so no change feels like slow death, boredom, coma. To experience the new is the ultimate change, new frontiers, life.

So if I have an indoor pet, I would bring it something new; a dried leaf, a blossom, something shiny, something aromatic, something noisy. Precious things to a mind that awakens anew every day without knowing a day ever passed. It affirmation that life is continuing. Perhaps thats why we roam, vacation for its own sake, try things we dont expect to like.

We just like evidence of time moving, proof that there was something left to see.

And maybe thats why Roach was acting like a bit of burger was the most fascinating thing he'd ever encountered. Because up until today, I guess it really was.

****

I am adding an insect that was very, very cool to me. He may not look like much, but he was pretty special to me.

I found him a week before a personally devastating time. I think it was a she actually. Anyways, it was sick and on the bathroom floor struggling. I got the sense it came in contact with some sort of poison. Later, I thought maybe it was simply starved.

For a week, it seemed to get worse, as I gave it every sort of remedy I could think of; honey in water, water mixed with two grains of salt for electrolytes and some crushed vitamin.

Finally, as my own situation was reaching its perigee, I thought I would try some clover blossoms, and simply picked some. I became aware of something I have had to relearn for some reason with stray critters, *they have to recognize it as food, no different that putting a sandwich on the floor and seeing trash, not dinner...

File: 0607020254 .jpg (66KB, 553x422px) Image search: [Google]

66KB, 553x422px

>>2106253

... As Bee crawled listlessly over the blossoms, he had to clean his legs. Proteins, that was the missing nutrient. They get protein from cleaning pollen from their legs.

Within a few days, this poor thing that was near death was up walking around again. Soon he was actually achieving some flight in his habitat, and my heart leapt amongst my own troubles. Something good was going to happen in all the misery.

Then one day, right as my own situation imploded, causing me to have to give up my country home and move to the dreaded city, I worked up my confidence and decided it was time; Bee was healthy enough.

I opened the lid and nearly teared up watching this animal, small as it was, soar again towards the sun and disappear.


In the midsts of my own disaster, the recovery of this little animal kept my spirits up. I'll never forget seeing him soar so strong, so fast and high, as if the sun was where he wanted to be.

And I was so filled with gratitude. I had to give up my home in my beloved rural settings with all of nature and so many critters, but I still had a reason to feel good, all because a little bee had more life left to live.


And that was my good bye to the countryside. It showed me that, in more ways than one, life does truly go on, and I am grateful for it.

Sorry for all the prattling. Good night and be blessed, /an/.

>>2106049
what do you mean those are looking hella cute

File: flat_1000x1000_075_f_u1.jpg (190KB, 621x1000px) Image search: [Google]

190KB, 621x1000px

>>2104344
You've convinced me to visit /an/ more often anon. That was really interesting, thank you

File: (Coccinellidae) Lady Bird Beetle in Morning Dew.jpg (638KB, 1909x1185px) Image search: [Google]

638KB, 1909x1185px

>>2106454

I am glad you found it interesting and appreciate the kind words. Have a great weekend!

To Roachguy:
I am an avid moth fan. I rescue caterpillars (they poison those around here) and it is a pleasure to feed them, watching their plump bodies go through the whole process before emerging as graceful, fluffy moths.

I believe raising insects out of love/curiosity is completely different from raising them for, say, research. We notice their behavior in a deeper sense, not exactly anthropomorphizing, yet not analysing either. My brother worked at a lab with roaches all day, and never noticed this sort of behavior you describe.

I remember the day I accidentally touched a moth's cheek with a tiny cotton ball, and it instantly stroked it's cheek, just like a cat. It made me seriously question, how far do they think? I mean.. It didn't get wet or dirty, but the touch bothered the moth. I've seen beetles not minding being covered with mud, but to think that huge moth was bothered by a slight touch makes it undeniable that they have a deeper awareness of their bodies than we'd think.

Anyways, please carry on with your posts, I really enjoy them.

File: makrosemka__prakti4eskoe_rukovodstvo_dlj.jpg (92KB, 1217x800px) Image search: [Google]

92KB, 1217x800px

>>2106889

I can really relate to that cotton ball anecdote, thats exactly what its like watching Roach. You notice things they do that dont have any purpose equally primitive or as simple as the creature doing it. These random individual behaviors obliterate the notion that we are looking at miniature biological robots. The complexity and nuance of these individual preferences, decisions that dont coordinate with a basic need and the way they select things to focus absent any logical cause all speak to some sort of individual personal consciousness.


By consciousness, I dont mean that they have an ego. Put another way, there is more of them in us than there would ever be of us in them. We have a thought and are, at least usually capable of, being aware of having the thought. They simply experience the thought and constantly react.

Whats interesting is that they cannot, by any biological evidence, be aware of the thought, they simply experience it and have no concept of themselves outside of monitoring their physical body.

This interests me especially, because while they cannot be aware of it, we are nonetheless very capable of thinking the same way, going through the day disassociated from our ability to be aware of what we are thinking and simply reacting to whats around us or the emotions and images in our head.

So when I look at Roach making the decision that there is one flake of dust on his antennae too many and its time to clean, I am seeing not only a more primitive version of my own software, but the essentials of survival itself, and it is naked of any ego, just like your moth reacting to sensory information about how contact with his cheek presents him with a decision about his relationship to activity in his external environment, and makes a visceral decision that has no logical premise whatsoever...

.... If you'll pardon me elaborating at length....

File: insect_leaves_colorful_83988_3840x2160.jpg (3MB, 3840x2160px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 3840x2160px

>>2106935

The reason this sort of thing fascinates me, perhaps, is that this primordial cognitive process, the act of living in the thought instead of being aware of it is also the two sides of how human thought is described in Buddhism in its search to better model thinking for happiness and efficacy. It teaches that when we live in the thought, we are experiencing life in the moment, second by second, which can produce the highest state of being alive and give us the most emotional reward, but at the risk of also experiencing the deepest misery.

As humans, by contrast, we can also detach ourselves from our thoughts and observe them and deliberately manipulate them. This gives us relief and the abiility to abstract the future and past, but can just as easily beome a new world to be lost in, in which our emotional highs, and typically more often lows, influence us completely independent of actual life happening. This is why soldiers can laugh and joke with death all around them while a wealthy man on a sunny day by his pool can be deeply morose over something from long ago. That then becomes our living experience instead of the real world, and we have to go back to observing our thoughts to even realize we are in an artificial and potentially self defeating realm of existence. We ocsillate between these constantly, and even worse, 99% of the time dont even realize it. From this, we learn the meaning of 'ignorance is bliss'...

File: Animals___Insects_Insect_on_a_piece_of_041349_.jpg (435KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

435KB, 1920x1080px

>>2106936

... So we have both the gift and burden of ego as part of our thinking. My roach and your moth do not. It is nonetheless fascinating to me that these insects, fully alive in every sense of the word, exhibit such a pure form of one half of this equation; in a sense, naturally wired to fully live in a heightened, biologically compelled state of mental being, something that has to be taught in Buddhist ideology to humans, but only through the path of the ego, which Roach and your moth do not have. Likewise, every treat they get is the best thing ever, while every passing shadow is the worst terror ever, moment by moment.

Meahwhile, we can abstract, self analyze and construct great hopes for days we may never see, and both inspire and demoralize ourselves. But we vascilate, so often without that control we seek, unknowingly either planted blindly in the moment like Roach, or lost in memories and visions while life slips by. So few of us can ever find the balance, and eagerly take any peace or joy we can get no matter how real or artificial it is....

File: beetle-variegated-foliage-insect.jpg (830KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

830KB, 1920x1080px

>>2106937


... I didn't mean to prattle as I do, but thats one of the reasons Roach fascinates me. Its knowing that there is more there than robotic reflexes and neurotransmitting sub-routines. No matter how fleeting from second to second, there is something there to make decisons, have preferences, and willing to submit to or terminate every impulse he feels. And no matter what he does, he is in the moment, as survival insists on. He experiences time, and therefore the experience of going from birth to death in the purest form. He is perfection in mortality, racing side by side with the universe in the most natural way, as a living thing, all his chemistry and energy moving in perfect time with his senses.

And yet despite all that, somewhere in there, is the being making the decisons. Something in there, idealized in Buddhist sutras, is independent of reflexes and reactions, making choices and decisions beyond need and compulsion. It can only be imagined, speculated, theorized. Because the alternative is that it doesn't exist, and if thats the case, the much greater part of ourselves and all we imagine ourselves to be doesn't exist either. And that would be where we find ourselves only to be matter among matter interacting helplessly with yet even more matter, nothing more than the shape of a biological cloud in the winds of the universe....

File: 77647-insects-spiders-wallpaper-1920x1080-insects-spiders.jpg (244KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

244KB, 1920x1080px

>>2106939

... Which is entirely possible. But then you have a paradox: who would be asking the question, and what imaginary jibberish would they possibly interpret as an answer?

Sorry Im rambling. I guess I can see why animals figure so much into Asian mysticism. Theres a lot to see when you look around, and perhaps thats what animates Roach and your moth. We look for the things that perhaps they can't help but see.

Thank you for your very thoughtful input and empathetic grasp of my endearing experience with Gregor the Roach.

Must go, sorry again, and have a great weekend.

>>2106935
>>2106936
>>2106937
>>2106939
>>2106942
Mothguy again.
Thank you so much for taking your time to share your views, I find your writing style very pleasant, and it's content even more so.
A little unrelated, but if you haven't already (judging by your use of words) you should seriously look into publishing academic articles, I'm sure you'd be great at it.

Back to our little friends, I must say, I completely agree on how their sole existence is a challenge to our minds. Their inner workings are but a detail in their whole gamut of "thoughts" and behavior, and that in itself proves there is way more out there than we know or comprehend. Roaches, and moths, have existed since way before mankind, and we're still finding out more and more about their skills and how they view and feel the world. Just like they recently found out roaches have personalities, and moths have complex mechanisms to cope with seeing in the dark (they willingly slow down their brains).

I'm afraid I'm too tired right now to develop our conversation, but I'll thank you again. Please keep posting about whatever, I'll gladly read it.
Have a great night and weekend, too.

>>2102963
>starts eating at the sad lizards eyeball
>While it's still alive.

That was fucking brutal anon. upon close examination nature is far from beautiful, it's more like a metal album exploded into reality.

>>2102303
I'll take 500 orens for this fellow.

are crustaceans insects?

>>2106947
I'm so glad that I share a board with Wener Herzog!

>>2107092
no

>>2105930
very interesting description anon, thanks for the input

>>2107092
no. but they are mandibuladae like insects. they both have mandibles, antennae, and compound eyes as adults. whereas arachnids have chelicerae, simple eyes, and no antennae

>>2106947
I think it's a real stretch to say any invertebrate has a personality in the sense that a human does. Individuals are of course going to have varying behavior patterns across a single species. Things like insects do have the capacity to learn but only in the sense that their autonomous feedback loops are changed as a result of exposure to specific stimuli.

>>2107556
>their autonomous feedback loops are changed as a result of exposure to specific stimuli.
the irony being that your audience here has probably never consciously done a thing contrary to their instinctive first reaction in their lives.

we're not breeding geniuses up in here.

>>2107557
no u

>>2106947

And thank you again for your kind words and interest. Its nice to have people to share the experience with.

>>2107525

You bet!

>>2107556

True, but when we use abstract terms like 'personality' it helps to nail down just what a personality is.

I don't know that I am qualified to give any scientific interpretation of how we would define it, but it would seem to me that maybe we could look at it as being responses that form a pattern, perhaps looked at in binary terms of probability, such as acceptance or rejection to a set of variables, waiting or action, caution or courage etc. Its the only objective way I can think of to define it in any measurable metric.

I mention it because the way you describe the invertebrate absence of personality happens to be the same way I would think of personality. One of the themes I have experienced with Roach is observing his very primitive behavior as a foundation for our own. The simplicity in 'mental' interaction with his environment as a life process is a great part of what fascinates me.

Today I have a bit of a challenge. I am noticing that he roams less after time once his habitat has been replaced with a clean and new duplicate. If the point of roaming is to absorb new information, and that absorption produces my desired effect of keeping his "mind" busy, then I have to come up with a new design. This is a challenge because I already have the best design I could've come up with.

If he is engaging in his default natural behavior less and has less to experience, and as a result has become more lethargic, then I could, right or wrong, interpret this as stress behavior from captivity and wish to ameliorate it.

This means I need to design something with a modified configuration and perhaps increased complexity to inspire him to return to his natural exploratory behavior. If these skills are left unchallenged, I worry that release will be disproportionately stressful and leave him with poor reflexes for survival...

File: 6888658-insect-wallpapers.jpg (3MB, 2560x1920px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 2560x1920px

>>2107844

My thought was to simply add more levels with different patterns for ascension and navigation, more complex geography and different options to make decisions.

I know its only a roach, but then thats sort of the point: there's even less excuse not to try and give him the best when it takes so little. All I have to do is cut different patterns into the paperboard levels, modify the large straws to present more entry/egress options and may add some new angles to the string.

Its sounds more complicated than it will actually be, and I dont mind, since I like to keep my hands busy when I watch movies on Sunday evening anyways.

g2g, have a good day /an/

>>2100680
what's the difference between a bumblebee and a hornet?

>>2108128
Like everything.

>>2108128
What's the difference between a marshmallow and an iron nail?

File: 1368639197051.jpg (726KB, 1200x800px) Image search: [Google]

726KB, 1200x800px

>>2108128

Hello. This was a chance for me to learn also, although I struggle with the terminology.

From what I can tell from wiki, bees are taxonomically descendants of wasps.

"Bees appear in recent classifications to be a specialized lineage of crabronid wasps that switched to the use of pollen and nectar as larval food, rather than insect prey... As bees (not including their wasp ancestors) are still considered a monophyletic group, they are given a grouping between superfamily and family to unify all bees, Anthophila."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apoidea

There is much of that I don't understand. I found it when trying to distinguish the families and orders, and frankly got stuck where they seemed to overlap.

From what I can tell, the wasps/hornets are an older, more primitive design, while bees are somewhat newer in evolutionary adaptation.

I also found this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vespoidea

To me, it seems all bees are related to wasps, but not all wasps are related to bees. Sort of like you may have many uncles, but your uncle may have only one son, is the way I figure it. The bees appear to be a sub-set. I am not certain though.

I wasn't able to discern the fine points, but I think I got the broad strokes.

Apparently the taxonomy was recently changed, making it difficult for a novice to delineate where one group ends and the other begins, since both old and new systems seem to both still be in circulation.

I hope this was helpful or at least points you to the right direction.

>>2108200
my ent prof described it as this: bees are wasps that became dietary specialists. wasps feed their young meat of any kind, and adults will eat meat, fruit, mountain dew, etc. Bees on the other hand only eat pollen/nectar.
>inb4 honey--that's just nectar regurgitated and dehydrated

File: 1362789413011.png (2MB, 1280x960px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1280x960px

>>2108214

Thank you, thats interesting. Not that I am very educated in animals, but I dont recall having heard of meat eaters switching to eating plant matter. I always thought the dietary path went the other direction, having something to do with the increased efficiency in absorbing nutrients.

I wonder how common it is for it to go from meat to plants like that.

>>2108218
one thing to bare in mind is how versatile insects are. because of their numbers and fast reproduction if theres pressure to evolve in a given direction they will manage it. shit they've evolved wings a bunch of separate times...and fleas even evolved to ditch the wings!

that being said the only big carnivore turned herbivore i can think of immediately is the Panda, and they aren't exactly successful

>>2108228

I see, that makes a lot of sense.

I dont know much about pandas though. I figure if something is surviving, it must be doing something right. Maybe human expansion plays a role, I dont know.

I do remember seeing a sad and rather bizarre nature story on PBS recently, where they said there were these tortoises that were severely endangered, and the only ones left were in captivity.

The problem was that they were evolved to only survive in one area that had been completely altered by human development to where they couldn't survive there anymore either.

So it presented the problem that if they were bred back to any numbers in captivity, there would be no where to release them to. I thought that was a pretty messed up situation. Maybe that is the deal with pandas, but like I said, I dont know anything about them.

g2g, take care and thank you.

File: image.jpg (782KB, 3509x2481px) Image search: [Google]

782KB, 3509x2481px

>>2108228
Pandas were fine until recently when most of their endless bamboo forests were developed and farmed over. Their strategy was historically very successful since they had no other resource competition and an essentially infinite supply of food.

>>2108272
not really. wide territory over long periods of time still doesn't compensate for:
1: a digestive sys that can barely glean any nutrition from a plant based diet
2. milk so nutrient poor that twins, normally a boon for a species, must have one infant terminated because two tits can't support two cubs
3. a reproductive process so rigid (only fertile for half their lifespan, and estrus is only 2 fucking days a year!, and an almost unwillingness to made in sub-ideal conditions

they were considered mythical cryptids by most of China from about 100 AD to the 19th century, which means they are marginally more successful than bigfoot

>>2108159
one is soft, the other one is hard

>insects
>cool

File: grasshopper.jpg (208KB, 1024x799px) Image search: [Google]

208KB, 1024x799px

Phew! Gregors new habitat is done, and it was a lot of tedious (but enjoyable) work. Its much like trying to rig a ship in a bottle. He has already picked his shelter, similar to the earlier one but slightly higher. The straw tunnels were reduced by one and altered to allow even easier access so he doesn't feel cramped, the water and food system remained much the same. There is still a string running free laterally and following the sides, but not as prominent, as he rarely uses it.

What is new is that there has two be more than twice the earlier levels. Not counting the water chamber and food tray, I count nine. In the theme of adding complexity to work his navigation skills, half the levels have openings cut into either the center or alternating sides so that it is not simply a stack of flat levels, and each one has different variations that present different options to ascend or descend to the next; center, periphery, left, right etc.

I expect he will take some time to re-map the habitat. It is good to see him roaming again for the sheer desire to explore, having already located water, shelter and food. The roaming had begun to slack off in the old habitat (which was more polluted from bits of food contacting water than I expected)...

File: 7019479-bee-insect.jpg (2MB, 2880x1800px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 2880x1800px

>>2108356

... It is interesting to see that he has settled once again on the level specifically made to be his shelter. The habitat is similar but not at all the same. So it either has some precise features that distinguish it as preferable to the other levels, the paperboard 'tent', or there is some memory. It could be either. Like before, he seems to keep his wandering orbit closest to the food and shelter, the top half, while showing less interest in the lower half, which is essentially a maze to the bottom where water pools, although he isinvestigating it now and explring access options to the water, presumably leaving scent trails/markers as they will.

The goal has been accomplished and he appears stimulated, calm, curious and typically plucky. My little guest has found new geography to explore and the day ends with new experiences for him to absorb in the catalog of his brief and singular residence among the living world in this universe.

A clean home, new vistas, and Gregors dinner this evening was a mashed crumb of beef, some ricotta cheese and several drops of Haagen Daz Vanilla ice cream. I like to think for this little roach, it was a good day among many and apart from others....

File: Insect-wallpapers-2.jpg (463KB, 1920x1200px) Image search: [Google]

463KB, 1920x1200px

>>2108357

... Presently he seems to be engrossed in one of the more luxorious, sensual and deeply attentive baths that I've noticed to seem to be beyond the casual two-minute wash-up and characteristic of increased activity and indulgences. He'll devote much more time to each limb, carefully attending and lingering on every bit of his body and make it a series of relaxed rituals for a half hour.

If he can keep from nodding off, as I notice his antennae slowly drooping flat and laterally in the pauses, and his hindquarters sinking, with the intermittant sitting up as if his little satisfied body is ready for bed, but whatever we would call wee Gregors mind is not. Though my hands bustle about near his habitat reaching for a beverage or this and that, it quite appears he couldn't care less. He is relaxed and noticabley drowsy, perhaps from the activity and warm cream.

A little happy fat sleepy roach, and a good day for us both.

g'nite /an/ & be blessed.

>>2105949
I actually woke up a few months ago with one waddling on my thigh. Evidently the most dangerous thing their bite does is cause difficulty in breathing - assuming you're fairly young and in shape, you should be okay!

>>2108293
>1: a digestive sys that can barely glean any nutrition from a plant based diet

It was still enough for them to live off of, albeit at a slow pace. It was likely harder for panda ancestors to hunt in those areas. They made do with what they had and they had a metric fuckton of it. It makes no sense to attempt to hunt when you've got a limitless food source, even with all the costs that comes with.

>2. milk so nutrient poor that twins, normally a boon for a species, must have one infant terminated because two tits can't support two cubs

Sucks, but it's a K-selection trade-off.

>3. a reproductive process so rigid (only fertile for half their lifespan, and estrus is only 2 fucking days a year!, and an almost unwillingness to made in sub-ideal conditions

Still worked out for them in the past when they had large territories, likely as an incidental way of keeping population density low. How the Chinese are trying to breed them now is pretty forced.

>they were considered mythical cryptids by most of China from about 100 AD to the 19th century, which means they are marginally more successful than bigfoot

They're a specialist, solitary species with a low reproductive rate and large ranges per individual. I'm not saying they were as successful as a rat. They were successful for what they were until habitat degradation happened. Pandas could have gone extinct on their own in several million more years, but it wouldn't have happened at the rate it is now had the bamboo ranges still existed.

File: 1424298813493.png (148KB, 380x349px) Image search: [Google]

148KB, 380x349px

>>2101112
>tfw you go to get the mail one day and the mailbox is full of these fuckers

File: Forficula auricularia.jpg (334KB, 2000x861px) Image search: [Google]

334KB, 2000x861px

>>2108633

They might be scary looking, but they aren't so bad. My only real objection to them is the smell they leave if they cluster

Why is it only the huge centipedes that look really meaty. I've never seen that in other insects.

>>2101521
>threw off all other male beetles on the tree to get the female
>after finishing with her proceeds to throw her off too
kek

File: female thoracica.jpg (91KB, 1239x700px) Image search: [Google]

91KB, 1239x700px

>>2108820
centipedes not being insects might have something to do with it

File: House Centipede.jpg (1MB, 3108x2071px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 3108x2071px

>>2108828

Not him/her, but- They are not insects? I didn't know that. I should revisit and calibrate my understanding of what an insect is. I must be getting them confused with arthropods or something.

I know less about exotic centipedes. All I know is that I like house centipedes. No webs, and they patrol for pests, sort of like having a mouser-cat, but for pests.

Scary when they pop up from a base-board unexpectedly, but a comfort knowing they do no harm and spend all day getting rid of potentially problematic pests

File: Untitled.png (21KB, 225x185px) Image search: [Google]

21KB, 225x185px

>>2108842
insects always have a body with 3 parts: head, thorax, where their 6 legs are, and abdomen

File: opt1291245327d.jpg (124KB, 1024x768px) Image search: [Google]

124KB, 1024x768px

>>2108848

Oh I see, that helps. I remember reading once that silverfish are considered "true insects", and I wondered what they meant; I gathered it had something to do with their very primitive design.

File: Bh_silverfish01.jpg (328KB, 488x800px) Image search: [Google]

328KB, 488x800px

>>2108856

Perhaps I was thinking of 'true bugs' since I got the urge to look it up and cant find anything on 'true insects'

Its more confusing because now I cant remember why I thought silverfish were 'true insects; or if they actually are 'true bugs'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hemiptera

>>2105949
A few years back, I was fishing on a river in missouri and I felt something on my arm and it was a black widow about the size of a small pea. I let it crawl up my arm for a few seconds then just flicked it off. I always thought my reaction was weird because with all other times when I had a completely harmless thing like a moth or some other spider even near me, I got creeped out to the point where I was panicking for a way to kill it or get it away from me.

>>2108901

I think it means that you have good instincts and reflexes when you need them. Sometimes, the involuntary part of the mind has more courage when needed than the intellectual part.

>>2108856
For this, it really depends who you talk to, I learned it as there are 5 classes of arthropods that are closely related to insects but arent true insects because they are wingless. Of these 5 classes they are grouped into the ectognatha, where their mouthparts are inside of their head, then there is the thysanura (silverfish) which are more closely related to true insects because they have 2 points of attachment on each of their mandibles. The last class is the microcoryphia/archaeognatha where their mouthparts have only one point of articulation. Thats how I learned the classification of the hexapods that aren't actually part of the insects.

File: phylliibae.jpg (383KB, 1024x787px) Image search: [Google]

383KB, 1024x787px

Has anyone here owned a Leaf mimic aka Phylliidae, I've been thinking about getting one when I have the space but didn't want to raise it wrong.

File: 20160425_225817.jpg (517KB, 2048x1152px) Image search: [Google]

517KB, 2048x1152px

It's not weird a insect but I figure posting in here is better than making another "wat dis bug lol" thread

I live in southwest Florida.
I've always assumed these were tarantula hawks, but TW's antennae are curled, don't have a third "antenna", and their wings fold completely over each other.

>>2108945
Now that I can actually see one close up, the third antenna is actually their true antennae and what I assumed was the antennae are a pair of legs

File: gypsy-moth.jpg (680KB, 3734x2491px) Image search: [Google]

680KB, 3734x2491px

>>2108942

Wow, those are amazing.

>>2108941

It would take me a long time to knowledgeably remember such details and I appreciate you sharing your knowledge of it. Such things overwhelm me, perhaps because I have great difficulty remembering terms that I can't pronounce.

Its reassuring though, that there are smart people on /an/ who really do understand these things. I could only remember that they are distinguished my their mouth parts, but I doubt I could remember more.

Im just glad there are people who know these things. Truly, the closer you look at these wonderful creatures, there is so much to see and learn, and similar things are revealed to be not so similar.

Many thanks for filling me in on these details; at least some parts of it will stick, and the next time it comes up, I'll know to look into how their mouth parts distinguish them so I can better understand.

>>2108945

Its pretty neat, whatever it is. Those bold contours and striking shape. I assume thats a proboscis?

Whatever it is,I would hate to be whatever it hunts, as it does appear built for pursuit.

>>2108957
You should see them in flight
while at rest they're a dull rust, but when they're flying their wings turn a brilliant vermilion
likewise their bodies appear black, but when they catch the light they shine a royal blue

File: antlion.jpg (134KB, 600x800px) Image search: [Google]

134KB, 600x800px

>>2108945
>>2108957

from a dorsal view it's very similar to an antlion, but I'm seeing nothing in google images that looks like this under "antlion"

>>2108978
not to mention the mystery bug's abdomen is much too thick

>>2108967
>>2108978

Wow, that does sound amazing. Perhaps if you gave your region, the more informed people here might be better able to determine what it is.

Here are some sites I like to use to pin down insect identities:


http://www.bugguide.net/node/view/15740

http://www.insectidentification.org/

It can take a while to sort it out, but eventually I usually do track down what a bug is. The first one admirably does seem to have even exotic details and species, and that one I recall has never let me down.

>>2108985
I'm in southwest Florida, Sarasota if anyone cares for that depth of specificity

I actually went through all ~300 insects for Florida on insectidentification and it wasn't there, and nothing else I search anywhere seems to yield any results. I wonder if it's a newly invasive species?

I'm gonna go through the first one and see what I can find.

>>2108990

That is possible. Sometimes, there are special variations that have distracting distinctions. Other times, the age of the critter can make it confusing from images.

If you can pin down a group, just ruffling through the image tab can give visual clues.

File: Oleander%20moth%20rez.jpg (42KB, 511x432px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 511x432px

>>2108990
there's a couple moths that look like that.
not sure which one yours is because they're all very similar in appearance.

oleander moths, wasp moths, tiger moth, etc.

File: oleander.jpg (151KB, 640x477px) Image search: [Google]

151KB, 640x477px

>>2108998
>oleander moth
bingo
That makes sense too, because both my house and at work (where I took my photo) have a boatload of oleander growing around.

It might be mimicry so as to appear like a tarantula hawk. It's effective too because I avoided the fuckers like the plague

>>2108578
>They're a specialist, solitary species with a low reproductive rate and large ranges per individual. I'm not saying they were as successful as a rat. They were successful for what they were until habitat degradation happened. Pandas could have gone extinct on their own in several million more years, but it wouldn't have happened at the rate it is now had the bamboo ranges still existed.

i agree with what you're saying, but i think you and i have different views of success. I think human industrialization has been terrible and devastating for a lot of animals, but for them to be so easily outcompeted by agricultural societies of the day...I think that's an unsuccessful critter. It kinda reminds me of those "endangered" plants in california that aren't endangered because of human development but because they only grow where the sun strikes the side of a single hill for exactly 2.3 hours a day or whatever. I'm not saying they don't deserve to live, I'm saying one moderate natural disaster, independent of human intervention, and they are fucked. Pandas are fucked. I think your million year statement is optimistic as hell. I'd have given them 300,000 years tops, assuming optimal conditions.

oh one thing i do disagree with is the k selection trade off. that really implies that the pandas were so successful there wasn't enough bamboo to go around and so the birthrate dropped or led t infanticide. even if these bitches eat tons and tons of bamboo in Pand Paradise those guts aren't gonna extract enough fat for two pandas. and despite that they still can produce two cubs, still put all those resources into two babies, and don't even have the behavior to cannibalize/reclaim those resources like some hawks and rodents do.

totally agree about the chinese breeding programs though.
>LING LING YOU FUCK PING PING NOW!
>nothing happens
>FINE I FUCK PING PING YOU KEK!

>>2108945

Do you suppose you might be able to get a picture with more relief? It is hard in that picture to tell black body from shadow. and appears as a silhouette.

File: 1024px-Oleander_caterpillar.jpg (194KB, 1024x768px) Image search: [Google]

194KB, 1024x768px

>>2109003
what's more, I've just seen what the oleander moth's larvae look like and I can tell you they are all over my house outside. I just called the things tentworms before now.

>>2109006
I wish I could but it's night and that's about the best I could get. I was too afraid to get closer in case it WAS a tarantula hawk.
The good news is, we got a positive ID as an Oleander Moth

>>2109008
I've been stung by a tarantula hawk before, it's really not that bad. Like getting hit with a hammer and stabbed at the same time. It's only agonizing for about 15 minutes, then it fades to a dull ache that lasts a few days.

File: Empyreuma_affinis_Imago.jpg (383KB, 2000x2540px) Image search: [Google]

383KB, 2000x2540px

>>2109003

Im glad you found it. I was having trouble pinning down a body shape, trying to resolve the antlion pic with the broader bodied one it appears you shared. I kept going in circles with various flies, but I did see a lot of interesting bugs.

>>2109008


Cool beans. Lets see if I can find a nice pic.

I searched Oleander Moth. Is this similar? I am happily surprised to see it has such nice color. I mistook it for black.

File: oleander2.jpg (44KB, 560x560px) Image search: [Google]

44KB, 560x560px

>>2109010
Yep, that's it.
Now I can actually enjoy their colors without running away. They really are pretty when they fly.
interestingly enough, I don't think it was my photo that was shitty because this picture of the moth taken in full light is just as dull.

I'll stop posting oleander moths now and start posting pictures of other interesting insects I found in my search

>>2108942

I really want to collect these types of leaf eating bugs.

File: hagmoth.jpg (631KB, 1600x1356px) Image search: [Google]

631KB, 1600x1356px

apparently this is a hag moth larva

>>2109004
>i agree with what you're saying, but i think you and i have different views of success. I think human industrialization has been terrible and devastating for a lot of animals, but for them to be so easily outcompeted by agricultural societies of the day...I think that's an unsuccessful critter.

Right, but that's not a standard we should be going by if we're talking conservation. That standard will destroy all but the greatest of generalists in the long term, and I'm not excited about the prospect of an Earth with rats, cats, dogs, pigeons, raccoons and humans. Might be cool in a Blade Runner sense, but I'd miss the weird esoteric shit. Shit like Poecilotheria species in the Indian jungles, through no fault of their own, go extinct in the wild due to habitat destruction. Pandas may be finicky fuccbois, but they're a good conservation meter and something that I think is worth our time to conserve in the wild if at all possible.

I'm not saying we'll get anywhere though. I genuinely think the only way we'll conserve a fraction of our current biodiversity is through banks of genomic data.

>I'm not saying they don't deserve to live, I'm saying one moderate natural disaster, independent of human intervention, and they are fucked. Pandas are fucked.

Sure, that happens, but any species should have a shot at survival if only for our own long-term sake and interests. Pandas may have had a shot at adapting to their environment left to their own devices. Maybe not. Hard to predict. But the bamboo forests would likely not have receded so quickly in a more stable, naturally warming climate rather than the current shitfest of climate + habitat destruction.

For the environment they evolved in, I think pandas were just fine. The niche was open and something took advantage of it in its limited way. Would've been strange not to.

File: mealybug.jpg (387KB, 1800x1329px) Image search: [Google]

387KB, 1800x1329px

this is a mealybug, a rather harmful agricultural pest...

File: mealybugdestroyer.jpg (238KB, 768x558px) Image search: [Google]

238KB, 768x558px

>>2109029
...and this is the mealybug with its top predator on the left, the aptly (and frankly badass-ly) named and rather more grotesque looking Mealybug Destroyer

it has some pretty neat looking aggressive mimicry

>>2109033
>left
right, right right right
god I had one job

>>2100590
> :o)

>>2109027
>Hard to predict
not really.

statistically on geologic scales you can count on specialists and giants going extinct at least 10 times faster than generalists and smaller animals.

the anon is probably right, though he has no concept of how many millions more years the panda might survive without human interference. He has no concept of the scale of evolution.

File: 77647-insects-spiders-wallpaper-1920x1080-insects-spiders.jpg (1MB, 1733x1598px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1733x1598px

>>2109014

Very nice. It was probably just a spectrum issue. It can make a big difference in iridescent color expression.

>>2109029
>>2109033

Neat! I was watching Roach lazily nap a while ago, having munched on some burger, a picture of peace and safe comfort.

I got to thinking of his release, and imagined how terrifying it would be to be him when a spider snuck up on him, and how sad it would be for the little guy, who is now so used to safety, calm and an easy life. I tried to imagine what it would be like to be him in such a ferocious world of predators, and it was depressing.

I guess I dont understand the natural world so much. The sad irony being that I still eat meat, but always take a moment to remember the animal and the sacrifice, and give thanks to it and the world, even though Im not religious as such.

Even watching him nibble burger, it confuses me, knowing that cow would like to still be alive, and not wanting to see Roach hurt by spiders, birds etc.

I just can't figure why things work the way they do, the predation and sadness it causes.

I remember about five summers ago, I saw seagull fleeing behind me as a hawk attacked it. The hawk would not come near as I was there, and the poor gull was quite injured and shaken. Eventually, I browbeat the hawk into leaving, and in the moment, I felt it was good that the gull was spared.

But later, I felt guilty. The poor gull may never recover from its injuries, and the hawk needed his hard fought meal like anything else. So I learned to not get involved.

Still, its confusing why things are the way they are. I just hope little Roach knows peace until the end. The way most animals go must be so terrifying, and at the very end.

I know he wouldn't experience it the way i would, but its sad all the same.

At least tonight, he has comfort, peace, ample food, safety and shelter. I hope when he has freedom as well, he can keep the rest too.

Sorry for rambling, g'nite /an/

>>2109055
Stop anthropormophising what are essentialy biological roombas. Roches have no capacity for emotion or even thought. When a spider is tearing into one it is't thinking "oh fuck, my greatest fears have been realised, why cruel world". It is thinking "HULL BREACH IN SEGMENTS SIX THROUGH NINE INITIATE ESCAPE PROTOCOL." I roach has never thought "man, that sure does smell tasty, I cant wait to eat sum dat and not have to worry about forraging for awhile." It is thinking "NOURISHMENT CHEMICAL DETECTED AT 30 DEGREES, ADJUST ROAMING PATTERN"

File: 012093812_prevstill.jpg (98KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

98KB, 1920x1080px

>>2109062

Oh I know. But I also think part of being human is feeling empathy for things that cant have the same feelings themselves.

It kind of goes back to what I was saying upthread about the line between consciousness and basic neural impulse for survival. At the risk of solipsism, it is likely that everything I see sad about the end of Roach or even myself is entirely an illusion fabricated by tangled interpretations of my own neural impulses, which was sort of my earlier point: that I am really no different than the insect in neural functions on the score card of survival: I am no better at imagining what the world looks like to him than he would be trying to understand how it looks to me. When you think about the time animals spend sleeping or gazing at nothing and then the amount of thoughts we have that are utterly useless to survival, it would appear to be rather the same thing. Articulating it to a machine by wiggling my fingers over a keyboard doesn't alter nor elevate that point. Its just a fidgeting primate sitting next to a dozing roach.

Im not ashamed of my primate empathy though, even when I know its falsely directed. I like to think its one of the things that keep me human, so that I can experience the world naturally as intended rather than as some other critter, even with all the ridiculous musings and horrible imaginings of what it must be like to be a little helpless bug in such a vicious world.

People tend to make fun when I say that if I could pick an animal to be, it would be a butterfly. Its a short life, but so wonderful. You come into the world bumbling around humbly and no one notices you. But then one day you feel "the heck with it, Im taking a nap right here"

And then you wake up, and are beautiful & elegant, and spend the rest of a life you cant measure sailing over flowers in the sunlight, lounging on blossoms in a sea of nectar, and bring happiness to everyone who sees you

Its a short, short life. But I bet it'd be so very nice

>>2109040
>He has no concept of the scale of evolution.
i'm 80 million years old! I walked Bob Dylan on stage who the fuck are you?

>>2109089
>I walked Bob Dylan on stage


I did too, last Tuesday!

Or maybe it was it was the Kaiser. Where are my pills. And why does this television have a type-writer?

Answer me, you confounded contraption!

The hell with this. I'm calling the nurse.

File: 0419161739a.jpg (2MB, 4160x2340px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 4160x2340px

>>2108941
All of my ento classes has explained it as protura, diplura, and collembola are hexapods, but not insects. Thysanura and Microcoryphria are considered the most basal of insects.

File: P9240008.jpg (524KB, 1616x1704px) Image search: [Google]

524KB, 1616x1704px

>>2108942
Phasmids in general are pretty easy. Just have a constant supply of their food plants and keep track of humidity and temp.

Their weird body shapes often give them molting troubles though, so I'd suggest getting a bunch of them if you aren't buying adults to be prepared for potential bad molts. Common species are cheap anyway. Once you have adults they multiply like fucking crazy, especially parthenogenetic species.

>>2109335
That's good to hear I live in florida so I'm hoping things won't get too hectic for it, despite almost anything surviving here.

File: 3MpgY1q.jpg (463KB, 2579x1932px) Image search: [Google]

463KB, 2579x1932px

>>2109062

I feel I should add that I don't quite subscribe to the idea that insects are wee robots. It seems that way until you look closer.

Sometimes people wonder if insects feel pain, and the answer is no, not like us. But then thats just it: not like us.

I go by the old saying "(Even) a worm turns." meaning that even the lowest creatures come to a point where they choose for or against something in their path. Lets say Gregor didn't feel pain. Yet, he reacts to things. A moving shadow might send him scurriying (it doesn't, he's eccentricly brave). There is a reflex. But the reflex is aversion. If conditioning changes behavior, then it only has one path, through chemistry. Chemistry is where feeling lives.

Let's look at an example. Lets say little Gregor has been released and is resting under a leaf, and a hungry spider sneaks up on him and attacks. A sad end for Gregor. So what would he do if he cannot feel on some primordial level.

Consider: would he not try to flee? Try to stop the attack? If he weren't so defenseless, wouldn't he try to fight back? Sure he would try to flee. But why?

If Gregor doesn't even have the precursors of emotion, then what would compel him to save himself? If there is no pain, he does not feel the attack. Clearly he has no concept of his own life, that it will ever end, and therefore cannot value it. He doesn't have any abstract intellectual tools for him to associate the attack with any outcome, so why fight back or flee?

File: img_1136.jpg (2MB, 3888x2592px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 3888x2592px

>>2109616

... You could argue that these are all moment by moment reactions, but then reactions to what, if he can't sense an outcome and feels no pain. One thing seems clear: he doesn't like it. If he doesn't like it and has no intellectual capacity to make a judgement based on any reason, then it must be some sort of emotional aversion. Otherwise, why try to stop it? Why avoid the perception of danger at all. If you say something is reflex or instinct, you have to define what that is and how it is divorced from feelings, preferences, likes and dislikes.

Luckily, little Roach doesn't have to worry about that this evening. He is just watching the screen flash about after ricotta for dinner, and there is donut for dessert later. He's been especially chipper lately between lounging lazily and exploring his new habitat. I often figure that when he watches the computer screen in the evening with all the flashing lights, it must be the roachy equivalent to a swanky apartment with a view to downtown Tokyo and all the flashing colorful lights.

I almost got a pic of him the other night doing the 'dog house' thing with his head poking out and his antennae sticking out, but it took me too long to get the camera working.

>>2109617
>If you say something is reflex or instinct, you have to define what that is and how it is divorced from feelings, preferences, likes and dislikes
these things are already rigorously defined in biology, so there's no real need to reinvent the wheel.

emotions aren't magic, they're just self-awareness noticing instinctive reactions.

>>2109620

So then you agree that they exist in insects and they factor in decisions.

I dont see what you are disagreeing with. It is not antrhopormorphizing to notice that emotions, or at least emotional precursors, are both driven by low-level sensory reactions while also being able to change through modification by experience, a primitive learning.

Different experiences among individuals produce unique patterns chemically governed to be retained or dismissed inasmuch as the creature is capable and behaviorally expressed. Personality isn't magic either. It has precursors and levels of complexity proportional to the creatures capacity for it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-belgium-cockroach-personalities-track-idUSKBN0M614H20150310

This notion that they are chemical robots is only valid if you think we are also. Suggesting that there is some supernatural distinction in the biological construction of personality that differs in formula from other animals is just another form of mysticism.

You're not saying that, but you are leaving a lot of room to get there if you think lower creatures function chemically in a way that is absolutely divorced from the same governing physics that guides us. Anthropomorphizing is saying that a roach dreams about donuts and burger, and spends his day wondering whats for lunch. Its not anthropomorphizing to note that he prefers them by observing his behavior and deducing it.

A warning to those who value rational analysis of animal psychodynamics: It is a safe assumption, a fact really, that animals do not think like us because they cannot. And one can elaborate in many ways why that is, what the physical differences are and split hairs on what subjective terms like 'personality' means.

But if you really, really want to see inside the clock, it is a huge mistake to assume we are not governed by the same chemical dynamics...

File: cockroach_t1200.jpg (24KB, 403x403px) Image search: [Google]

24KB, 403x403px

>>2109641

.... Anthropomorphizing is sort of like what I say about the concept of humanity- never, ever forget that both were invented by primates.

>>2109723

I couldn't seem to make the link work, not even by melding it with a fb url

>>2109027
For the successfulness of a species, you have to remember that evolution/natural selection never has an end goal. You can think of it as it doesn't look into the future, species react to the stresses put upon them at each moment.

>>2109641
Emotions exist in insects if you only define emotions as specific concoctions of neurochemicals amd nothing more. I mean yes essentially this is what they are in humans too but we have such an incredibly wider range of thoughts and actions that they can alter. Using the term to describe anything that an invertebrate (I can allow cephalopods maybe) experiences comes with so much rhetorical baggage that it's counterproductive. Inappreciate your interest i roaches and bugers and stuff though just sayin.

>>2109797
also excuse my shitty half asleep phone in bed typing

File: spider.jpg (537KB, 1600x1200px) Image search: [Google]

537KB, 1600x1200px

>>2109797
>>2109800

I see. Thats how I see it. A long time ago, I had to pin down just what 'emotion' meant in humans. I still have to revisit from time to time because I have goals that require better mental coordination on several levels, including emotion. Its forced me to be more objective, looking past just the chemical reactions of science and compelling myself to reveal associations and feedback loops, that is imagery and emotional overlaps that aren't immediately obvious. Oddly, Buddhism has shown to be an effective tool, though I dont consider myself spiritual. Like any spiritual tool, I have to translate the metaphorical to actual objective terms.

I am tired too, so I apologize for babbling. What I mean to say is that I consider my own brain to basically be a chemical soup that needs occasional seasoning.

The Buddhists, from what I can tell, call this self negation. The metaphor I hear is like comparing a mind to a wagon, which is made of parts. So if you take the parts and separate them, where does the wagon go, is the premise. I take it to mean an analogy to the ego.

I am certain ego disappears the further down you go the evolutionary scale, but then another way of looking at 'down' is closer to actual essential survival neural functions

For example, it is my view that what we call intelligence isn't an especially great tool for survival of the individual, but rather a side effect. Comparing other apes to humans, what we notice is that the ego sort of serves as an emotional break. It gives us some advantages, but comes with tons of complication and errors. What we perceive as intelligence is just a great capacity for memory and abstraction. It seems nice, but demands cultural transmission to be of any use in any complex application. By function, thought demands a slowness of action, which humans can afford somewhat if only in our concept of civilization. In actual contests for survival, its still speed & strength that win survival for the individual

File: 1339141905051.jpg (195KB, 1600x1067px) Image search: [Google]

195KB, 1600x1067px

>>2109844

We are also social, which insists on trade of resources. It presumes coordination as well, but of how much use would it be if we couldn't also talk, transmit ideas. That is, our intelligence really only is acknowledged at all because we have the labial ablitly to perform complex vocalizations.

So I guess I leave an open question: if terms like personality and 'emotion' in the complex human sense reside within intelligence from our view, it seems corollary that we are an exceptional minority among the species of animals on the Earth. Nature doesn't seem to normally favor extreme exceptions. There are billions of us no less, yet by the simpler creatures like Roach, we are exceptionally outnumbered. So it seems nature, having its own supreme metric of survival, favors the simple and the proven.

Its hard to be a human and not fall into the idea that we are supreme, even when we know nature- between asteroids, earthquakes and ice ages doesn't give a furry rats butt about our technology. The neurological complexity we have naturally seems great- but to us. And its natural we would see it that way, in the same way a male wildebeast looks at a female and sees utter beauty.

I just mean we should notice the way in which we talk about personality, intelligence and 'true' emotions. We are a tiny minority. The esteem and value we place on our intellect may be completely off the mark vis-a-vis what fate nature has for our species. We werent so physically different tens of thousands of years ago, very recent in geological terms, and not especially bright given our neurophysiology, and still much smarter than the next ape. Nontheless, we were nearly wiped out several times.

File: Ant-Drinking-Water-2048x2048.jpg (275KB, 2048x2048px) Image search: [Google]

275KB, 2048x2048px

>>2109847

So this could all be self delusion. People often say of animals, "they will be here when we are gone." It may be truer than we realize. Even this discussion, where I wiggle fingers over a keyboard thinking I am conveying deep musings through global electronic transmissions, objectively, is really not so different than some sparrow tweeting in the sunlight for no reason other than he wants to, and both of us thinking in the moment that its visceral important expression when we are both just making our own version of noise.

So theres a certain blindness of ego that may be skewing our own perception of ourselves and the relevance of intelligence or shape of 'true' personalities. Personality, in me or Roach, is an effect, not a cause. Its a product of external influences on our chemistry and its capacity for change.

I guess thats why its clear I empathize with Roach, though he cannot empathize with me. I personalize his nature, so defending him has having no personality or emotion, I am in fact defending myself. I'm sure it seems a bit mad, which is sort of my point about intelliigence and all its potential for flaws and idle synaptic farts we consider high cognition.

Sorry for prattling again; this board seems to be my remedy for insomniac ramblings.

Have a great evening, blessed /an/. If it makes you feel any better, I notice even Roach stops watching when I start building these walls of text. It seems even Roach recognizes dullness when it interupts his light show.

>>2109641
>This notion that they are chemical robots is only valid if you think we are also
the conclusion only follows if you subscribe to scientific reductionism and the modern notion that humans aren't unique in kind or extent.

I'm a biologist, not a physicist. We know about emergent properties so while I may agree that reductionism is true in theory I very much doubt we have the knowledge to actually say what's happening in human thought. To call it chemical machinery is perhaps true, but to pretend we understand that machinery or that all other animals share it is naïve.

An airplane may fly, but its parts do not by themselves fly, nor does an airplane that's missing parts fly. Humans are absolutely unique among animals and that's fine. We don't know why yet, and that's also fine.

How does a mantis' mouth parts work with eating, I've watched a few times but don't get how they take apart what they eat. It looks like they shred their food almost.