Break Up Imminent / Help me decide

>>18631601

Yeah, time to break up. Even if there was nothing romantic/sexual going on between them (though, there sorta is, they're going on goddamn dates), her disregard for your concern on the matter is not okay. A good relationship is ultimately a partnership in which the terms must be something you both agree to. Since she's completely ignoring your side of things, it indicates a lack of respect for you and for your relationship. That will fuck your relationship up in the long run, even if this situation gets resolved.

>>18631601
Sounds like she's doesn't respect you in the relationship, get your heart out of this op

>>18631615
>>18631616
Sadly, this is what I am afraid is the right choice. I know her well enough to think she doesn't realize how stupid her behavior is, but I have pointed it out in length, trying to make her see.

The sad thing is that she probably feels like she's in the right to do whatever she wants as she isn't doing anything intimate with him and her boyfriend "forbidding" her to go somewhere with a friend is controlling and oppressive. I feel like I am not being controlling, and generally I try to not intervene with her activities with male friends. This is different, considering he has explicitely stated his interest and she has been at least secretive if not directly dishonest about their relationship to me (in particular him telling her he is in love with her).

For reference, and that's the saddest part: She's 22, I'm 27, he's fucking 35 or something. From what I know I could kill him in a heartbeat, I am better looking and in better shape, but she doesn't care much about appearances. It might just be his status and maturity in terms of how he lives compared to me, although he isn't particularly wealthy.

I really love her... it hurts so much...

>>18631601
Cuck

>>18631638
In a sense, yes. I'm not submitting to it though, I am taking the right steps considering I feel like she's crossing boundaries now. So in the end, no.

>>18631644
you're doing everything right so far man. sorry to hear you're hurting. does she know you're considering ending the relationship over this? or does she just know you're not happy with the behavior she's engaged in?

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>>18631644
She'll cry and you'll take her back as the cuck you are. We both know it.

>>18631654
I think she "knows", considering I told her how much I disagree with her behavior. I don't think she realizes, I am actually about to do it, except for maybe after my last text. But then again – as pointed out before – she thinks herself in the right for doing things with another person and me in the wrong for trying to forbid her from doing things she enjoys (from her point of view).

An issue I am having is that I can't and won't force her to not do it, as in "forbid" her. But I really feel like there's a boundary there and she has chosen to ignore it, simply because her momentary enjoyment (however naive and innocent that may be) is more important than how I feel about it. From her point of view she probably thinks she is still keeping some sort of integrity towards me and our relationship, but I feel differently.

>>18631637
Don't blame the guy, he isn't invested and made a commitment to you, she did.

>>18631662
I'm not going to try and defend my manliness and non-cuck-status before you, my anonymous friend. I don't have to prove anything to anyone, I'm just here for advice.

I'm aware of the fact that she is going to cry her eyes out if I break up with her, but she has the sense of pride to not do it in front of me, if I do it as a result of behavior she thinks alright.

I'm aware of how her crying makes me hurt and want to protect her, but I'll try and not let that stop me from doing the right thing to preserve my sense of self and my self-respect.

>>18631601
Break up , she's a cheating shit.
She thinks that all guys must run around her..

But if she has some love and want for love( not sex ) Leave her , let her be with that piece of shit cuz it's her who wants to be with him.
And when she gets dumped,
What do you know , she will call you BUT it's your decision to take in her again or not ... cuz it might happen again

>>18631601
I remember last year leaving my girlfriend who sexually assualted me and cheated on me. It was hard to break up dispite how awfully she treated me but I did it and I eventually I felt happy again

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>>18631677
I'm with you, I just don't think you're gonna go through with it. All of it. The following months and everything.

>>18631672
I'm not blaming him, although he's actively pursuing someone he knows is in a relationship. But then again not everyone adheres to the same morals that I do.

>>18631678
Cheating in the sexual sense is highly unlikely, but I agree with the fact that every male is running circles around her. She's quite good-looking and successful.
She repeatedly told me she doesn't want to be in a relationship with the other guy and isn't attracted to him at all sexually. I'm not sure how that'll change if she spends another few months around him while not in a relationship. The problem with your scenario is that she's as stubborn as I am and in her mind I'll be the one to blame if I break up over her doing something absolutely acceptable. At least that's what I'm thinking might happen, considering she wouldn't plan doing something she considers wrong.

>>18631690
If I break up with her, we won't see much of each other. I'll be busy sleeping with other women and she'll be busy working her ass off trying to forget me and fill the emptiness. And spending time with that one friend who made her destroy her relationship... must leave a bitter aftertaste though.

Right now I'm just not sure if I can go through with it and how I will. I really don't like the prospect of having been in the wrong, even if that is just her perspective of things.

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>>18631702
I'm sure that she'll think a lot about you.

>>18631709
I don't, as I said, she'll try and drown her emotion in work and superficial happiness as usual.

>>18631668
i hear ya. explain to her in the simplest most straightforward terms that she is her own person and can do as she pleases but the fact she's in a relationship makes what she's doing an incredibly selfish behavior. she will protest. guaranteed. stay calm, stay steady, and ask her to explain why it's unreasonable to want to be in a relationship with somebody who respects the relationship. what she's doing would be perfectly acceptable if she were single. prioritising another man and relying on deceit to do so is beyond disrespectful to you. pointing that out and expressing your unwillingness to accept the behavior does not make you possessive nor controlling. she is acting as if she's already checked out of the relationship yet expects you to not feel any urge to actually officially check out of the relationship for real. ask her how that is fair. she'll either snap out of it and reevaluate all the nonsense we're taught about hurr durr men are so oppressive to us and she'll gain some self awareness, or she'll get indignant and buttmad and self righteous and then way later on maybe learn her lesson long after she's lost you.

>>18631672
the guy is a vulture. this doesn't excuse her decisions.

>>18631741
I'm actually pretty sure she's going to agree that it's somewhat selfish. Then again she's going to say how wrong it would be to not do something that she feels is absolutely alright in a relationship and that makes her happy simply because I don't want her to. She'll come back to the fact that she is neither able nor willing to make me or the relationship the top priority 24/7 and that that's completely normal and healthy. I'll be unable to answer anything to that except that I feel bad and disrespected due to her behavior and that's about it. We've had variations of this discussion, just not with stakes as high.

>>18631742
Completely agree.

>>18631746
>Then again she's going to say how wrong it would be to not do something that she feels is absolutely alright in a relationship and that makes her happy simply because I don't want her to.
yep. and you're going to let her say it, and then you're going to ask her why she thinks that only one person's happiness needs to matter for a relationship to be considered alright.

>She'll come back to the fact that she is neither able nor willing to make me or the relationship the top priority 24/7 and that that's completely normal and healthy.
if you're single, yes. there's nothing normal and healthy about half-assing a relationship because it gets you what you want without you having to reciprocate and meet their needs in return. that is selfish at best and bordering on psychopathic at worst.

>I'll be unable to answer anything to that except that I feel bad and disrespected due to her behavior and that's about it.
that should be more than enough. both parties have to actually give a fuck for a relationship to be mutually fulfilling. she's not holding up her end of the bargain, insisting that's ok, and expecting you to have no problem with it.

>>18631793
Bottom line will be that she's going to consider herself unable to lead a relationship.

girls can be really dumb about this shit youd be shocked

the thing is, you shouldnt be telling her who to hang out with. im sure he does give her a huge amount of support and friendship, and naturally she wont want to just ditch her best friend because you said to. now you either trust her or you dont, and if you don't it's time to leave. but if you do trust her implicitly, there should be no issue with her being friends with a guy, regardless of whether you think he's into her.

look im very sorry but if she's not cheating on you i dont see what the problem is. this sounds like a lot of your own insecurities surfacing, fear shell leave you, etc. and he probably is super into her, but why would that bother you if you're secure in the relationship? trying to force her to have different friends is just going to make her resent you... basic psychology. either be okay with it or leave, if you try to get her to ditch him your relationship won't survive.

>>18631662
God fucking damn. The only thing that man has left is to find the guy, shoot him, then head to Mexico.

>>18631637
im glad you can see it from both sides. i didnt realize she kept that from you, that does make it a bit different. though from her perspective- shes just trying to keep you from being upset by not telling you and keep him as her friend because she needs the social support and validation. i totally see where you're coming from now, it's not really acceptable to hang out with someone who you KNOW is in love with you because 1) its cruel to the person, and 2) its cruel to you (op). really unfortunate conundrum.

>>18631822
I'm not sure if you read all my posts. She admitted that he explicitely told her he was in love with her. She also withheld that fact from me during a phase of estrangement that – surprise – came along after she met him a few months ago. She opened up about that fact a few weeks ago and I have been trying to come to terms with the fact that they still see each other this frequently ever since. I'm not saying she can't see him, I am just saying that having a very close and intense relationship with someone who is into her is sabotaging our relationship. If her reaction to that is non-existant, I doubt there's a stance I can take that accepts her behavior and keeps my self-respect intact.

>>18631822
>>18631835
to conclude, since you asked for help deciding, i genuinely think shes a good girl- sometimes we have to tell lies like [keeping that info from you] because she knew how you'd react. it's really not remotely comparable to cheating, and i guarantee she thinks of him as her gay best friend. ending a friendship for a relationship is a horrific feeling, makes you feel alienated and alone, and it makes you feel hurt and angry as well- like 'fuck why can't he just get it'. my ex asked me to stop speaking to a friend of 10 years who i had awkward skype sex with ONCE (like 5 years prior). we never ever did it again because it was fucking weird and yet my bf felt really threatened by that. at the time i was pretty socially isolated, living in a new town and that was my BEST friend who ive known longer than anyone- so i told him not to push me and to deal with his own insecurities instead of foisting his emotions onto me. i was so frustrated, it put me in the worst position. not exactly the same, as this guy isn't in love with me at all and my bf just felt like he was because he liked all my dank facebook memes, but comparable. maybe her having a cucked "gay" best friend is something you can live with, maybe it isnt. but giving an ultimatum will not work.

I guarantee she's either cheating or lining him up to replace you. Also she has no respect for you if she knows this guy is into her and continues to hang out with him alone. My question is, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to leave? The relationship is pretty much over at this point anyways I just want to see how much more of your self-respect you will surrender for this woman.

>>18631855
I really appreciate the time you're putting into this, it's two years of my life (and potentially a lot more) that I'm deciding about here. I know her and myself quite well and I fear that if it's good bye, it will be for good.

Sadly, I agree with the statement that she doesn't mean any harm. That doesn't stop me from being harmed by her actions. She has not cheated, I agree, and she most likely won't. I'm not forbidding her to see him, nor writing with him, I just feel like the constantly high intensity of their relationship coupled with the fact that he is trying to get with her (no matter if he's openly doing so or not, I know how men react around her – hell, here I am sitting obsessing over her instead of going after the girls/women who throw themselves at me because of what I see in her) is not okay. I'm not going to give her an ultimatum. But I don't think I can accept things as they are, including them making plans for a trip for several days together.

I'm at a loss here, really.

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>>18631831
>find the guy, shoot hi-
Pick up that dumbbell.

>>18631866
It's understandable that you think that, I happen do know her and the situation quite a lot more intimate than you do and I can in turn guarantee you she's not cheating in the sense of doing anything physically with him. She might be lining him up subconsciously although I'm borderline on believing her that she's not into him physically since he isn't particularly attractive and quite a bit older than her to the degree that she might perceive a relationship socially unacceptable.

I, too, am curious how much more of my self-respect I am willing to sacrifice for that woman and if I will get out intact. I oftentimes feel like I sold my soul to the devil.

>>18631872
You don't know if she's cheated or not. You don't know what her intentions are for this guy, but you know she's spending a lot of time with him, that they met during a rough time in your relationship and that she's spending time with him despite your reservations about it. It's not just two years that's on the line. Your relationship is already over.

>>18631879
You can't guarantee anything. She's spending time with him alone. He could be pounding her pussy every time they meet up for all you actually know.

>>18631817
then so be it. she's chosen to throw it away not because she was being controlled and oppressed but because she's too selfish to sustain a relationship. if she's so big stronk independent womyn she can acknowledge that and face up to her actions having consequences.
>I really don't like the prospect of having been in the wrong, even if that is just her perspective of things.
^ mission accomplished

>>18631873
Joke's on you, I'm /fit/. Doesn't really matter in this case, we're not in a pissing contest for 16 year olds trying to get with the hot chick in college.

>>18631887
Impressive mental gymnastics, but in the end you're completely right. Thanks, that'll be useful in case that's how the conversation is going to go.

>>18631885
Repeating a point I already responded to doesn't make it more valid.

>>18631880
We could discuss the philosophical boundaries of knowledge, but that's not what I'm here for. I'm confident I know she hasn't cheated on me, that should be good enough for you for the purpose at hand, which is helping me understand the situation and a possible course of action.

The relationship is going to be over when I say it is. I'm strongly considering it. In fact, when I started this thread, I was pretty sure that was my only option.

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>>18631890
You are not bigger than those two, anon. Their presence alone would make you bend. So the joke is still on you.

>>18631897
if i may ask, is my hunch that you're in sweden correct?

>>18631915
I'm definitely not. If that's what you were trying to convey I misunderstood and I don't see the relevance. Moving on.

See >>18631879 and >>18631913

>>18631925
You may ask, you'll even get an answer. You're wrong. European mainland is right, though.

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>>18631930
They actually lost a lot of weight, so you might be bigger.

>>18631872
I went through the same argument with my gf. She had this guy who was in love with her 8 hours away who would always text her. It bothered me and he was a total beta, so I wasnt worried about her cheating, but the fact that she kept in contact with a guy who was constantly talking shit about me bothered the hell out of me. Of course my feelings didn't matter, only hers did, and she couldn't stand the thought of losing a "friend". After two years she finally blocked him, but it was only after he lashed out and called her a stupid whore or something similar. That's what all of our fights were about, her feelings were legitimate and mine were not. I ended up breaking up with her for good after two and a half years and went through counseling afterward. I just got done with my last session this morning, and talking with a professional who helped me understand why I would be attracted to a woman who treats me this way and identify the unhealthy behaviors in my life has been invaluable. I feel a lot better now that I'm free from her grasp, if you leave her it will be tough, but you'll feel a lot better because of it.

>>18631934
I actually might be. Still not relevant, I appreciate the heads-up.

>>18631872
OP, it clearly means more to her to keep seeing him while knowing how uncomfortable you are because you know and she knows how he feels about her. If the relationship and you meant more to her she would see him much less and surely wouldn't be going away together for several days. You won't listen, I can tell by all your responses, but this guy has replaced you as number one in her life. Its a shame you have been permissive of a girl that is dating 2 guys, at some point you needed to walk away.

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>>18631956

>>18631970
I think you may be right. I'll talk to her tomorrow and that will be the end of it.

I'm hurting.

>>18631913
That said your confidence in whether she cheated or not is questionable since you have a vested interest in believing she's being faithful to you. I don't. Whether you break up with this girl or stay with her makes absolutely no difference to me, but from what you posted here it's clear as an outsider that the relationship is a downward slide. She's being dishonest and disrespectful toward you and spending a lot of time alone with another man (whom she met at a rough spot in your relationship). Considering all this, it wouldn't be a far stretch at all to assume she's cheating or at least thinking about it. Your clinical and cool-headed writing style belies your seeming inability to put 2 and 2 together and come to the hard conclusion that I'm sure you know you need to deep down.

>>18631976
How the fuck... it's either a huge coincidence or you realized I was the Karlie poster on a different board. If it's the latter, you are a genius.

>>18631982
Your perspective is understandable and actually reasonable. I have reason to believe she hasn't physically cheated, but I agree that her behavior is close to or her equivalent to the common sexual cheating. My writing style aside, I have been quite upset about her relationship with the guy for months and only somewhat settled after we finally had the cards on the table a few weeks ago. I not only see your point, I have been beating myself up over it for months, so it being out of the question for now is just for clarity and to not burden the already complex topic with inert doubts and fears that have more to do with my own psychological issues than anything else.

Is it strange that I feel like you calling my writing clinical and cool-headed is a compliment?

>>18631932
intredasting. leaves me torn between france and denmark then. doesn't matter though. the point regardless is that you deserve better than to be taken for granted and not prioritised by your partner. hope you realise and believe that.

>>18631947
this guy gets it. glad to hear you're doing better now anon

>>18632041
Both wrong again. I'll try.

>>18631980
The time for talking is way past OP. Shamefully, I admit to going through the same shit with two different gf's until I realized they didn't give a shit if I liked it or not they were going to do whatever they wanted whenever they wanted and with whomever they wanted. It was I that didn't have the courage to walk away from a situation that made me very unhappy. In both relationships I discovered they cheated but all the while telling me I was crazy and jealous for no reason.

There is a silver lining however. I'm with someone now that cares enough about me, the relationship and themselves that they introduced me to their friends and we talked and she was adult enough a rational discussion was all it took. Those guys she knew had something for her she withdrew on her own. I did the same. We didn't cut ourselves off but firmed up the boundaries. For example, I told a female friend she cannot call me at 11 pm nor will I continue to spend full evenings and sometimes sleep over. The female friend got angry and I knew then she was not my friend but a girl that wanted a relationship with me. I ended the "friendship". My gf had many guys she casually dated and stayed in contact with and would hang out alone but when she introduce me to them many withdrew and those that continued to pursue her in earnest she stopped any contact. Several of her male friends are closer to me now than to her and we socialize more. Jealously and angst is a thing of the past.

>>18631982
anon, I agree with you that everything OP has disclosed tells me she is cheating with this other guy. There is no other reason for her to totally disregard and disrespect OP and the relationship. She has another man and flat ass doesn't care what OP thinks about it. To her OP is a nuisance and an obstacle to maneuver around. I mean she is going away with the guy for 3 days so they can be together as a couple.

>>18632333
Nice, you're disregarding the fact that our relationship isn't the easiest so she'd be way better off just dumping me if she really felt like I was a nuisance, as you put it. In our setting that makes no sense whatsoever. I appreciate the negativity nonetheless.

>>18632318
So essentially you're saying I should leave unless I somehow manage to turn the current issue in the latter situation. In theory that's what I've been trying over the last few weeks, but I'm not sure if she's willing or able to get there.

You will be a cuck if you let her go on a date with a guy who is in love with her. They will be together for several days, that guy will try everything to get her pussy. Just look at this from the guy's perspective. It does not matter what your girlfriend says, he just needs one opening, one moment of weakness and he gets to fuck her.

Anyway, I assume they already fucked and this date is just another fuck session.

>>18632348
You are a blind man

KEK. LISTEN.

Be an alpha male. Tell your bitch to commit to you 100% and delete this guy from her life, or chuck her shit out on the street and say goodbye.

The more you let her fuck around with another guy, the more you become a pathetic beta cuck with no hope or self-respect.

Wake up. Be the boss.

>>18631601
What is there to decide? You're clearly being fucking cucked.

>>18631662
lol that was a fake story