Male friends, jealousy and shit

I think it's whoreish but whatever do what you want.

>>18329669
How is it whoreish?

>>18329675

it's not whoreish, that guy is just your average insecure r9k dweller

>>18329684
I mean, my boyfriend seems to think that I'm a whore as well, so I'd like to hear the reasoning.

>>18329666

>hang out with them one-on-one
If you put it this way, it implies you plan to be alone with your "male friend". Most guys would say no to this. He might trust you but he doesn't trust your friend. However, if the situation just happens that you and another guy are left in the room after a long group meeting, it's different.

>ask me to not be friendly towards males (I obviously cut contact the second they become flirty in the slightest).
I don't know about this, but I doubt this is what he said, this is only what you thought he wants.

>ask me to not go out with my friends to bars, even if I do it rarely, or when he acts like he expects me to ask for permission

Once again, "he acts like", this is what you perceived from him. The poor guy probably just wants to be included in your night out. Or to be considered. Is there any reason that you are in a couple, but you go to a pickup scene without your bf?
I don't know any guys that would be ok with shit like this.

>because I feel like he'd actually snoop
look who's not so trusting now
Oh it's only important for him to trust you, I see.

Your first relationship probably ended because he is tired of you and your male friends but doesn't say it out loud. He probably gradually pulled away to not get hurt or be branded as "jealous". Some guys are like this.

Honestly you sound like a lot of unnecessary drama. I am training to be a mathematician, I prefer to use my energy for my work, If I were him I would leave. Most guys who work in science would make the same choice, for the same reason. Live simple life, simple relationship, complex thoughts are for mathematics. I think Grothendieck said this.

>>18329696
your bf is also an average insecure r9k dweller
In fact any guys who think having close male friends is whoreish, regardless of success and status with women, is r9k.

r9k is an ideology.

>>18329706
OK man

>>18329700
>He might trust you but he doesn't trust your friend.
Does he think my friend, who I've known for 20 years and is married, will rape me? It seems a bit exaggerate.

>I don't know about this, but I doubt this is what he said, this is only what you thought he wants.
Here's an example from earlier today:
"I'm going to hang out with XY, later [my lab partner, we have to review the project for next week]. I'll have a coffee with him and then come over, okay?"
"Do you have to? Can't you talk to him about that at school?"

Sometimes I enjoy going out with my friends alone, or spend some time alone with my best friend, or just hang out with my friends from high school. And sometimes we hang out at a bar. That's it.
I don't want him to come along every time I go out. I do enjoy being with him, but enjoy spending time with my friends alone as well.

>look who's not so trusting now
I admit I don't trust him with this, but the fact that he WANTS to know the pin to my phone and wants to know my password makes me feel like he wants to get inside my phone.

My first relationship ended because my ex boyfriend died. He had female friends as well, lived with 2 girls, travelled for 3 months alone with two female friends and it never bothered me in the slightest.

I don't make drama, I am very down to earth and relaxed. I never argue with him and try to be understanding of his point of view, but it seems a bit unhealthy.
I have male friends because I was a tom boy as a kid and my interests are male dominated. I don't seek male friends, it just happens. Most of my close friends are girls, anyway.

>>18329666
>My first relationship was extremely trusting and we both were very non-jealous people. We were very in love and trusted each other completely, I never doubted his faithfulness.

then why did you break up?

>>18329747
He died in a car crash.

>>18329706
You're a fucking retard. Evaluate your thrice more times before coming here with useless shit. You're as bad as anyone claiming ''/pol/'' or ''reddit'' at every little thing.
>>18329666
At the ''spent the night with them'' i could already feel the jealousy, and i don't even know you. What makes you think it's ok to spend the night with other dudes when you have a boyfriend? Actually, doing this much stuff with other males IS something a boyfriend would be concerned with.

Think about it. If you've missed this much on the situation, i doubt you'd be as understanding as you claim you are, but think about if the roles were reversed. If he was spending time with other girls, alone, spending the night at their house and all. Even if this doesn't bother you, a girl spending the night at other dudes house alone, or doing so much activities alone with them IS something to be suspicious of.

I have no idea how come you haven't understood that. I don't want to attack you for no reason, but really, it baffles me.

>>18329754
ouch.

I'm very trusting of my wife but doubt either of us would be comfortable spending the night with a straight "friend" or spending half the night out on the town boozing but otherwise we both have friends but we also know each others friends. In fact some of my wifes male friends are closer to me now and we socialize.

Your new guy is never gonna understand, ever.

>>18329666
I can understand both of your views. As a guy who's been cheated on 5 times I know the feeling. He's scared and isn't really ready to put his faith in anyone yet. He has yet to recover and until then all you can do is be patient reassure him that you love him and are faithful to him.

He shouldn't be controlling you but he has the expected mindset desu. He's practically waiting for you to show signs of cheating. Don't be insulted its second nature to him. You just need to reinforce that you won't cheat.

>spending nights alone with the other sex

Big red flag. I'm surprised he's put up with you this long. That just screams high risk.

>>18329754
As I said, I can understand why he doesn't want me to spend the night over, or why he doesn't want me to travel alone with them. I already accepted to not do that without further questioning.
I honestly wouldn't mind if he was spending the night with other girls, especially if they were long term friends. I would mind physical contact (cuddles, sleeping close to each other and such things) but spending the night at their house wouldn't really bother me.

The rest, tho, is excessively jealous in my own perception.

I don't understand why hanging out with guys is something to be so suspicious of.
I had my first female friend when I started high school, before that I literally hanged out just with guys and didn't talk to girl.
The two guys I'm close with were my best friends in elementary school, and we still are very good friends. One of them lives in another town so when I visited him I used to sleep over at his place.

>>18329754
>You're a fucking retard
that is an obvious false flag, retard.

>>18329773
I have never done it since we started dating because I asked him if it made him uncomfortable and he said yes. I used to do it in the past, but since it bothers him I have no issues with avoiding it.
I don't see how he is "putting up with me" in any way.

>>18329666
i mean, i wouldn't say what you want to do is neccesarilly wrong, but its reasonable for him to be worried.
It's your life, you should be able to do what you want to do, whenever you want to do it. Just dont expect him to stick around when you're doing these things, i know i wouldn't.

>>18329765
>"friend"
This triggered me insanely. They truly are my friends, probably two of the best friends I've ever had.

>spending half the night out on the town boozing
I don't get drunk ever. I have two beers top.

I don't even mind bringing him along if it's not a girls night or I'm hanging out with my friends from high school (we're super autistic and just inside jokes, so he'd probably not get what we're talking about 3/4 of the time). My male friends like him a lot and I often bring him along.

>>18329666
Have you ever hooked up with those long time friends?

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>>18329696
>Dating someone who doesn't respect you

Are you a sandnigger?

>>18329775
it's suspicious because guys are just as untrustworthy as girls, he knows that even if its hidden in the deepest corner of that dudes mind, he thinks there's a chance he fucks you.
And i think we've all been in a situation we told ourselves would never happen and it ended up happening anyway.

>>18329772
I can fully understand why he's not ready to put faith in me, I don't feel insulted.
I'm just trying to determine how much I should compromise, and how much he needs to get over his shit.

>>18329793
I am willing to compromise, I care about this relationship and about him.
I just don't think that his "requests" are healthy.

>>18329814
>I just don't think that his "requests" are healthy.
Have you told him everything you said in this thread to strangers on the internet?

>>18329814

>>18329806

>>18329814
well if you really cut out the sleeping over and spending time with them alone like you said, id probably not be bothered with the rest of it, i mean what's wrong with going out with friends if its not just one guy. does he have friends of his own to go out with? maybe hes insecure because he doesn't get out as much as you.
But i dont know all the conversations you've had together or the little things about the compromise, so i couldnt tell you whos in the wrong.

>>18329814
The whole going to make friends house thing and sleeping over yeah no. That's not gonna fly but you already acknowledged as such. However you have the right to male friends and just hanging out isn't enough to qualify his paranoid behavior.

>>18329806
No, never. Grew up literally like siblings, the thought of being physically intimate with them makes me gag.
One of them is married (and I was his best man) and the other is engaged.

>>18329821
I mentioned that I don't think he's acting reasonably, but he said it's normal for a guy to be like that.
I don't have much comparison because my only other relationship was very different and I can't really talk about this with my friends.

>>18329827
Do you and you friends act flirty? I think he is jealous of your intimacy with those guy friends

>>18329827
well i mean, every guy gets jealous sometimes, if this was like 1 or 2 small outbursts i wouldn't hold it against him.
But if it's consistent then you need to talk it out with him

>>18329825
I didn't stop hanging out with them one on one and I don't want to. I stopped the sleeping over and travelling together.

He does have friends and probably goes out more than me.

>>18329826
Thank you.

>>18329829
>Do you and you friends act flirty?
I don't honestly think so. We joke around and banter, drink beer, watch sports on tv and sometimes play videogames.
We're not affectionate in the slightest and the only time they complimented me was to tell me "I actually looked like a girl when I put effort into it" at my friend's wedding.

We go hiking and camping, kayaking (but my boyfriend likes it too so he comes along)... we sometimes go sailing? But that's really it.

>>18329830
Oh I'm not mad at him, I understand why he's jealous/untrusting.
I'm just trying to understand where's a healthy common ground.

He has small outbursts a couple of times a week since probably 8 months ago. We've been dating for 10 months.
Nothing extreme, but enough to make me a bit uncomfortable.

>>18329724
math anon here, sorry to hear about your ex and sorry for making that terrible assumption. I just thought it was very likely.

>"I'm going to hang out with XY, later [my lab partner, we have to review the project for next week]. I'll have a coffee with him and then come over, okay?"
>"Do you have to? Can't you talk to him about that at school?"

And you have a problem with what he said? he questions the necessity of having the drink with your male friend to the review of your project. That is not an unreasonable question. Especially for a guy who got cheated on. I have never been cheated on, but if I see my current gf sitting alone with another guy, having a drink, talking, laughing, I would have questions for her. And vice versa.
I am 26 and my gf is 18, I am trying to be open minded about a lot of things, and I am like most people I know (academics who favor principled/ traditional/classical approach). I don't know if younger people have a more natural affinity and forwardness when it comes to male female friendship thing. Perhaps I will show my gf this thread.

>>18329826
>qualify his paranoid behavior
but he isn't really paranoid, at least from what OP's direct quote from him, not her version of his action.

>>18329841
well even if you're understanding its not healthy to have outbursts like that every week, a relationship is supposed to be happy together, so something going to have to give eventually because you're going to get tired of it, and you should.
As for the first guy you replied to, you have to see it from his perspective, you could say you're going anywhere and then head to their house and fuck. His ex probably said she would never cheat and was just going to hang out too. but you probably know all this. I dont think theres a way to fix it, unless he just gives up complete trust again, and that's hard.

>>18329854
>>18329841
also i would be careful, people who are this concerned about cheating are often cheaters themselves, either projecting or assuming you're thinking and doing the same things they are.
not to put thoughts into your head, just a warning

>>18329782
Pretending to be a retard is still retarded. Those people should get a range ban. You'd see such an incredible raise in usefulness of the posts and decline in users, it'd be amazing.
>>18329775
>>18329805
Just read this;>>18329809


It's stronger in some guys. They don't see boundaries. They may feign so well you'd never know. But we men all know it. We can't expect someone to have morals nowadays. It's hardwired for us to feel jealous, not even more so because of nowadays society. Even more regarding people we don't know.

Listen, a lot of people are telling you regarding your actions and you just don't seem to understand. If you really don't, you won't. But accept that they make sense, even if you don't understand them. You're not a dude, and you're definitively aren't aware of your surroundings as it seems. Either leave the guy and look for someone more ok with your lifestyle, or change for good. He's in the right here. No self-respecting man would put up with your stuff silent. Before you or someone else come with ''JUST DON'T BE JEALOUS WTF INSECURE MUCH?''

It's how some of us think. I can't say ''all of us'' since some are okay with little boundaries or none at all, but that doesn't seem to be the case of your dude. I've dated girls like you, been both in the place of the friend of the girlfriend and the boyfriend with the girlfriend that has a lot of males friends. Been there, done that. It's tiring as fuck, cut it out. You expect him to trust predators that claim themselves to not be interested in prey.

>>18329846
No worries, you couldn't know.

>And you have a problem with what he said?
Well, yes. We have to talk to review the project. Study rooms and libraries don't usually allow people to talk. We'd have to whisper for 2 hours, or stand in the hallway.

I am closer to your age than your girlfriend's age, but really to me it is normal and natural to be around males since most of my interests and my field of study are male dominated.
I tend to prefer having female friends because I have to be less guarded, but I tend to develop friendships with males too because I literally hang around them 80% of my time.

>>18329854
>>18329858

We are generally happy together, his outbursts are very small and never escalate into fights... mostly because I'm very patient.
If I wanted to cheat I wouldn't tell him "I'm going to be at Z café with XY from 1 PM to 4 PM.". Wouldn't be a wise plan.

>people who are this concerned about cheating are often cheaters themselves
This thing really bugs me too. I am not jealous because I am faithful and I always assume my partner is as well unless they give me a reason to.

>>18329867
Additional little note on that last bit if he's been cheated on he almost surely won't cheat on you. If he has a moral center he just got kicked in the ego hard and shouldn't feel okay doing it back.

>>18329864
I don't understand the reasoning of >>18329809 .
Even if they wanted to fuck me, and that's really not the case, I don't want to fuck them. You either think they are going to rape me (which is frankly a bit excessive), or you don't think that I'd resist their advances.
So you're either paranoid or not trusting.

My boyfriend knows my friends. He knows we've been friends for literally most of my life, and he knows how much of a brotherly affection they have for me.

I won't stop being friends with two people who literally kept me from killing myself because my boyfriend wants to.
I am a better person than that.

Also - most of my friends aren't guys. I have two close male friends, but most of my friends are girls. I do hang around guys because of my uni and because of my hobbies, but in general I tend to avoid getting close to them because it could be mistaken as flirty.

>>18329874
not so sure about that bud, gf cheated on me and i had never even thought of cheating before that.
Got so angry i went right into another relationship and cheated on her the first week.
Not saying op's man is like that, but i definetly wouldn't count it out.

>>18329883
Well vengeance cheating isn't unheard of. I don't blame you. But seeing as his current gf OP is not the one who cheated she should be fine.

>>18329881
Well so break up and find someone who is worth more than your two male friends, or just start dating them

>>18329666
You're wasting your time. You will always have this nagging feeling in the back of your head that you don't fully trust him. Save your and his time, and end it soon.

>>18329881
Só you value your friends more than your bf.

Why would he be jealous

>>18329899
They're both very taken, and I wouldn't date them even if they were single.

And it's not about "worth". I don't think my boyfriend is worth less than my friends.
I think that his insecurities and issues are not my fault and I shouldn't lose something that really makes me happy because he got cheated by his ex.

>>18329905
I just don't really feel like he trusts me.

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>>18329666
>Is my reasoning wrong? Would you mind if your girlfriend acted like I do?

Your reasoning is not wrong and neither is his.

Let me give you some advice, or at least my philosophy. Invite your boyfriend every time you meet one of these male friends, and furthermore make sure he can attend. If I was your boyfriend and you said 'oh i'm meeting Chad for lunch' followed by 'you can come if you want' but you know fine well I was working that overtime that was x3 pay that I'm not turning down... and then it turns out Chad is only here for one day/few hours so you have to go. That is how you get yourself dumped (in my books at least) without so much as an explanation, and the reason you don't get an explanation is because I wouldn't give you the opportunity to spout your shit because I've heard it all before from another set of lips and you're clearly too naive to have a real relationship or just think I'm a total fool.

I went on to write about how I met one of my girlfriends male friends, currently going through his mod stage trilby and everything minus the scoot and he finished his pint in ten minutes and fucked off... But you can't really write it without sounding like a smug I told you so arsehole. But it's true, i was pretty smug because he clearly wanted to fuck her and she was still in denial about it. If he's her friend you'll know, maybe he did ask her out years ago and it never happened... that's fine, maybe they've slept together... not only will he stay and genuinely take an interest in you because who knows... you could be in the picture for 5-10 years. He might take an interesting what you do and you might make a friend or at least he might have a skill you need sometime or require your professional services.

But um... yeah when you're 24 you've pretty got no reason to be playing the naive little butterfly. Can't blame you for trying it though, no doubt your ex isn't acting the same way he used to (if he's got a head on his shoulders).

>I think that his insecurities and issues are not my fault and I shouldn't lose something that really makes me happy because he got cheated by his ex.

I bet your mother lives in a retirement home

>>18329908
No. It is just a selfish request.
I can accomodate his needs and try to compromise to some extent, but I'm not going to be unhappy and lose two people I truly love just because he feels insecure.
It's not that I value them more than him, but what's the purpose of dating someone that makes you unhappy?

>>18329916
My mom is not even 50.

Have you ever cheated OP? Honest

>>18329925
>>18329925
Date someone who doesn't give you the slightest bit of trouble. Like an inanimate object or a carpet yes man

>>18329925
>whats the purpose of dating someone who makes you unhappy
think you just figured it out op. whether you're right or wrong doesn't matter. go your own direction.

>>18329913
Do I need surveillance when I interact with males? Do you think it is a healthy mindset in any relationship ever?

>>18329927
Nope, never.
I never had casual sex, never even kissed someone I didn't date.

>>18329929
I don't mind putting up with a bit of trouble, but "give up on these two people you've known for 20 years because my ex used to suck cocks at clubs" is a bit excessive.

>>18329930
He doesn't make me unhappy. It's just annoying to have these little jealously outbursts every so often.

>>18329864
>Those people should get a range ban.
Well, you'd probably get banned too.
>You'd see such an incredible raise in usefulness of the posts and decline in users, it'd be amazing
Indeed.
Those short posts are way more useful than wall of text rants at exposing the bias in adv and helped OP to not consider any post with r9k as an argument in it worthy of consideration.

>>18329749
So your dead bf was perfect in every way? No one else will ever live up to the level of perfection you have created in your mind.

>>18329749
the car is your male friends?

>>18329960
Of course not.
He was way too blunt and often said things that hurt me (like calling me fat when I gained 8 lbs and reached the terrible weight of 130). He enjoyed making other people cringe or give them second hand embarrassment. His sense of humour was often inappropriate. You had to tell him things, otherwise he wouldn't notice it. He got distracted super easy. He fucking had a mullet when we started dating... god.

>>18329964
Kek. No.
It was a fucking toyota.

I read a lot of posts on /adv/ every day and the core of 90% of people's relationship problems is that they're more interested in what they want and how they feel than their partner. This is a childish and selfish approach to relationships as true love is self-sacrificing and puts others needs before your own.

If you love someone, you're not going to inspire negative emotions and insecurity in them by doing things that go against their value system (like drinking and hanging out alone with opposite sex friends). If their values are too different from your own that you're not willing to budge then it may be more loving to break up rather than expecting them to bend to your lifestyle and put up with it.

>I think that his insecurities and issues are not my fault and I shouldn't lose something that really makes me happy because he got cheated by his ex

This attitude to me is a redflag for your relationship. You obviously have different values and however unreasonable you think your boyfriend's jealousy is, it's how he feels and it leaves you with a few options. Acquiesce to his requests and stop spending so much time with male friends and most likely resent him, or talk/shame him into being okay with it and he stews with resentment privately until you inevitably break up.

>>18329666
My gf was the same.
I'm really close to my exes like, and she would always complain when I hung out with them or other female friends.

What I did was I told her I would cheat on her as a punishment every time she started to act jealous.she kept doing it though, so I broke up with her.

Way I see it, it's not my damn problem and if you don't like it then go back to your damn loneliness

>>18329997
He is literally insecure. It's not about his "value system", it's not about what he believes is right or wrong. He is just insecure and doesn't trust me even if I have never done anything to deserve such a treatment.
If he cared about me, he wouldn't expect me to be unhappy and give up on two friendships that mean a lot to me.

>>18330017
I wouldn't hang out with exes or with people I ever was intimate with.
And I wouldn't cheat/threaten to cheat on him.

>>18330019
Whatever you say. It's obvious you're just here for strangers to validate your choices rather than any receive any real advice or engage in any real self-reflection. I reiterate that if you're unwilling to budge on this the most loving thing you can do for your boyfriend is go your separate ways.

>>18330019
>if he really cared he would do [thing]
Oh god....
I suppose you don't care about him, then, since you won't do [opposite thing]???

>>18330028
Why not?

>>18330034
I do care about him, but not enough to willingly myself unhappy to calm his psychosis.

>>18330031
What's the advice I received, honestly? "Stop interacting with guys because they're going to rape you"?
I am probably going to break up if it becomes more disturbing.

>>18330036
Because I think it's crossing a boundary.
I don't hang out with people who ever showed sexual interest in me, especially if I am in a relationship. People who fucked me clearly would be sexually interested in me.
I think it is inappropriate.

Threatening to cheat or cheating is just childish, I'd rather just break up.

>>18330043
>What's the advice I received, honestly? "Stop interacting with guys because they're going to rape you"?
You received a ton of advice including "Invite your boyfriend to your hangouts", "Break up with him", "Stop hanging out with men" all of which you've ignored or brushed aside in favor of throwing your boyfriend under the bus and suggesting he's broken in some way for even having a stance on it. You're obviously looking for validation (and maybe even attention) and are as transparent as transparent can be.

>>18329666
>>>18330034
>I do care about him, but not enough to willingly myself unhappy to calm his psychosis.
>
>>>18330031
>What's the advice I received, honestly? "Stop interacting with guys because they're going to rape you"?

Kindly fuck off, you received several thoughtfull answer giving you a number of options and points of view, nobody said anything about rape.
Seriously, stop being an asshole

>>18330048
So your arbitrary limit is ok, but his is not?

>>18330050
> you've ignored or brushed aside in favor of throwing your boyfriend under the bus and suggesting he's broken in some way for even having a stance on it. You're obviously looking for validation (and maybe even attention) and are as transparent as transparent can be.

She didn't start it off like that, but now it's definitely the case.

>>18329666
>sleep at male friend's house
>go drinking with male friends
>go to trips with male friends
>always around male friends
>"do you really have to sleep at his house"

WTF????? INSECURE MUCH????

>>18329666
This is why I'm scared of women.

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Okay yeah I was commenting earlier on being understanding but OP you crossed into thot territory in this. Fuck off.

>>18329980
So what are some of your imperfections, since you are so keen on pointing out the defects of others?

>>18329706
I have never met a girl who was "one of the guys" and not a slut or at least a massive attention whore.

>>18330050
>"Invite your boyfriend to your hangouts"
I do. I invite him to hang out with me and my friends every time it is appropriate. I hang out alone with guys only if we have to talk about something private or if it is for school.
Other than that, he's not invited when I go out with just girls (and he complains because he thinks I'm going to cheat) or if I am hanging out with my friends from high school (happened 3 times)

>"Break up with him"
Because of ONE disagreement?

>"Stop hanging out with men"
Unreasonable.

I am a bit pissed off because I feel like most guys in this thread don't believe that I can even interact with a guy without sex being involved. So, yeah, sorry for the tone.

>>18330055
When someone says that "they trust their girlfriend, but don't trust the guys" they're kinda implying that the guy friends are going to rape their girlfriend.

I am a bit pissed off, so yeah sorry for the tone again.

>>18330058
Yes, I set the boundaries in my own friendships. I don't understand what's your point.

>>18330073
I never slept over at a guy's house since we met, or travelled with a guy since we met.
I rarely go out drinking, and if I do it is with girls or he is invited to come along. Sometimes I have a beer with one of my male friends, but it happened maybe 3 times (my ex's birthday, his death anniversary, and when his dad died).

>>18330086
Same. But you know what's worse? Dating one
>he's just my friend, friends do bodyshots off each other !!

I almost belive they belive that the guys are not interested in her.

>>18330090
Now you are just backtracking

>>18330090
>I do. I invite him to hang out with me and my friends every time it is appropriate. I hang out alone with guys only if we have to talk about something private or if it is for school.
>Other than that, he's not invited when I go out with just girls (and he complains because he thinks I'm going to cheat) or if I am hanging out with my friends from high school (happened 3 times)
You hang out alone with your guy friends from high school and to have private discussions. Red flag.

>Because of ONE disagreement?
No, because you have different values and they're irreconcilable without someone having to bury their feelings and deal with resentment.

>Unreasonable.
It's not unreasonable. You're just immature and don't understand human psychology.

>>18330090
What the fuck do you want us to tell you, then? That your bf is a beta /r9k/ Loser and should know his place ??

Did you ever stop to think that his ex told him the same thing you do?

>>18330105
This. Think about what you're saying and doing and look at it through his eyes.

>I feel uncomfortable letting him have my passwords or touch my phone because I feel like he'd actually snoop.

Meaning = "I'm afraid he would find an actual flirty text to my "guy friend" and accuse me of flirting"
Why were you fine with your other boyfriend snooping and not this one? Seems you have something to hide from the start.

>>18330085
I can get pretty insensitive when I am annoyed (and I think it showed). I am very bad at expressing my feelings and bottle everything up. I am extremely introverted and fairly arrogant. I am a worrier, a bit of a control freak and a clean freak. I am pretty shy at the beginning.
Probably a ton other things.

>>18330099
Yes, but I'm genuinely sorry. I get pretty bitchy and defensive when I am frustrated.

>>18330101
My friends from high school are a group of 5 girls and 4 guys. We have a ton of inside jokes and it's unpleasant for everyone to be around us, which is why we don't invite other people along when we hang out.
And, yes, I hang out alone with one of my friends to have private discussions because I don't feel comfortable talking about my dead ex boyfriend with my boyfriend present.

>different values
Being insecure is not a value.
He has a few female friends as well (even if not as close as mine), and he goes out alone with his friends to drink all the time.
If he had such "values" he shouldn't interact with females ever, or go out to drink without me ever.

>>18330105
>Did you ever stop to think that his ex told him the same thing you do?
Yes, and I understand why he feels jealous. But I feel like he's being very unfair and selfish.

>>18330116
>Why were you fine with your other boyfriend snooping and not this one?
My ex didn't snoop. He had all my passwords but he never logged in in my facebook/gmail, or checked my phone.
I don't have anything to hide, but I think that snooping is a pretty shitty behaviour and I don't feel comfortable with someone breaking my privacy because they don't trust me.

I don't flirt with anyone, I rarely ever text with guys... or text at all.

>>18330078
>>18330073
Moral of the story: never consider a long term relationship with "complicated" women who have many close male friends. These girls are good for flings, practice for real relationships. A simple way to break up that they will be ok with, is just to tell them "it's not you, it's my insecurity, I can't deal with you being close to other guys, byebye :(( "

>>18329666
>unhealthy

What's unhealthy is you having so many guy friends and sleeping over and hanging around them. Something either is and feels exclusive, or it doesn't. I was essentially forced into the same situation you had with your ex, and by the time I developed trust for her, she ended up dumping me anyway, know why? Because she had access to too many guys friends and messaging buddies 24/7. Abundance degrades endurance, and in your times of need the shoulder to cry on will be some "guy friend" more than likely.

You don't realize what you're doing can hurt someone. And because someone was trusting of you, doesn't mean you can measure up against how careless he may have been.

Things work when people are together. That simple.

>>18330128
He really wants to trust you, I guarantee.
You'll just have to be patient. Have you ever tried to nurse a wounded animal back to health? It's exactly like that.

>>18330128
>>>18330116 (You)
>I don't have anything to hide, but I think that snooping is a pretty shitty behaviour and I don't feel comfortable with someone breaking my privacy because they don't trust me.

I get that you are entitled to your privacy. However, when you enter into a relationship with someone who has been cheated on you should be prepared for this behavior. If you really care about him, you'll suck up your privacy pride bullshit and take his concerns seriously. Right now, YOU are the selfish one.

>>18330146
Yeah that's true.

The only difference between the relationship she has with her friends and the one she has with her boyfriend is she has sex with the later.

No wonder the poor guys is insecure

>>18330162
You don't understand. It is better to PREVENT than LAMENT. Old saying, very useful. Peace of mind has value and so does self respect. I "turn them down" doesn't suffice for everyone. For every story I hear on /adv/ about girl gets drunk, guy friend made an advance, "I was weak" yadda yadda.

>>18330174
What does this have to do with my post faggot

>>18330146
>so many guy friends
I have two close friends that I sometimes hang out alone with.
I have a bunch of casual male friends that I never see one on one, and some school mates that I never hang out with unless it is necessary for school shit.

>sleeping over
I slept next to them while we were travelling, when I was visiting one of my friends in another town, and after my ex boyfriend died (I lived at my guy friend's place for 3 months because I was a bit sad). I never done it since I got together with my boyfriend.

>I was essentially forced into the same situation you had with your ex,
I never forced anyone to do anything.

>and messaging buddies 24/7.
I rarely text at all, and basically never text with guys unless we need to arrange hanging out.
I fucking detest texting and actually resent my female friends because they text me a lot.

>>18330158
That's actually a good point.
Would it be awful if I let him check into my phone while I'm with him?
I don't want him to read certain conversations with my female friends (talking about private things about their relationships). While I don't really have secrets with him, I wouldn't like him to know about their issues. Is it unfair?


>>18330162
Beside daily contact, emotional intimacy, physical intimacy, mutual devotion, exclusiveness and love yeah, absolutely the same.

>>18330187
>ex bf died

It would have helped a lot if you mentioned that earlier. Would have prevented a lot of debate..

>>18330184
I thought you were being sarcastic.

>>18330193
Mentioned it here:
>>18329724
>My first relationship ended because my ex boyfriend died.

Don't really enjoy bringing up the whole "my ex boyfriend was pretty cool but a toyota broke his neck" story. Still feeling pretty shitty about it.

>>18330187

>Beside daily contact, emotional intimacy, physical intimacy, mutual devotion, exclusiveness and love yeah, absolutely the same.

Besides physical intimacy, you have all of that with your friends.

And you lived together for three months? ?????

This just make your bf insecurities more justified

How blind can you be? Do you think that your friendship with those guys is normal/average? Because it's not, it's REALLY unusual

>>18330196
Shows how odd their relationship is. Fucking love quadrangle

>>>18330158 (You)
>I don't want him to read certain conversations with my female friends (talking about private things about their relationships)

That's understandable. When he looks at messages though you need to tell him this. Make it clear it's more of a girl talk thing and not something for him to worry about. Otherwise, I would say all messages from guys are fair game.

>>18330200
I understand your situation. But it's still beside the point I'm trying to make. It is sad to lose someone.

But internalize what I'm saying to you.
It is better to prevent, than lament. If you prevent potential flirting, prevent feeling from developing, you can focus 100% of yourself on your bf. And he doesn't have to live with the thought of "just who is gonna hit on her next?"

I trusted my ex to hang out with her close guy friends. One of em splits with his gf, all of a sudden my ex became his main target. I told her I didn't want her talking to him. Did she listen? No. Testing my patience, deteriorating my peace of mind. She stopped for a while, but before I knew it, back at it again. Granted, we were both young, she was younger. I look back at all this shit like whatever today. But problems don't have to arise if you don't create them.

>>18330205
I don't have any of that with any of my friends.
I don't talk to my friends daily. I don't share my feelings with my friends routinely as I do with my boyfriend. I do not go out of my way to make them happy as I do with my boyfriend. I'm definitely not exclusive. And I don't feel romantically for them.

>And you lived together for three months?
Yeah, after my boyfriend died I stayed over at my friend's place. He was already living with his wife (who was his girlfriend back then).
I wouldn't eat, I had night terrors, they let me stay over to take care of me because I wasn't able to live alone.

>Do you think that your friendship with those guys is normal/average?
No, of course not, but that's what I have.
I have been friends with them for 20 years. We grew up together, like siblings, and did everything together since we were kids.

>>18330187
>I lived at my guy friend's place for 3 months because I was a bit sad

Your bf doesn't know your male friends, while your male friends and you have a long history, with a lot of untold stories. That is a central issue. Girls who have close male friends means complication.

> I never done it since I got together with my boyfriend
Of course you didn't, otherwise why would he still be with you.

>>18330217
He'll shoot himself out of boredom, but okay.

My conversations with guys are basically:
>Pub, 9 PM?
>Ok

>Wanna come over to see champions league?
>Ok, bringing pizza

>*meme*
>Kek

But if it helps him feeling better about it, sure.

I just don't want him to read about my friend's sexual life because that'd be really not nice.

>>18330226
>Your bf doesn't know your male friends, while your male friends and you have a long history, with a lot of untold stories. That is a central issue. Girls who have close male friends means complication

Yes, that isn't OP's fault, it isn't her bf's fault for getting cheated on. Some people just aren't meant to be together long term.

>>18330225

>I don't have any of that with any of my friends.

Well excuse me, but a lifetime friend who talked you trough the death of your bf and suicidal/depressive toughts while you lived together fits all of that.

How. Blind.can.you.be

Read your posts and you will see it:
>>18330225

>>18330232

>I just don't want him to read about my friend's sexual life because that'd be really not nice.

Oh my, are you serious?

>Nothing much just talking about sex

>>18330232
Yeah, why is he so insecure? You are just sexting your male friends!

>>18330232
>I just don't want him to read about my friend's sexual life

This is bait thread.

Everyone Evacuates Immediately.

>>18330247
Female friends. I don't want him to know that my friend Tracy got pregnant, that my friend Jenna loves anal or shit like that.
I don't talk sex with guys.

>>18330242
We are sometimes emotionally close but we don't spend our time sharing feelings and being nice to each other.
Of course they have helped me get over my ex boyfriend's death, but it was years ago and we rarely if ever talk about anything emotional anymore.
They're friends. I have more emotional intimacy with my female friends.

>>18330251
>>18330250
FUCKING WOMEN.

>I don't want him to read certain conversations with my female friends (talking about private things about their relationships).
Here. Fuck. Follow the fucking post chain.

>>18330254
How blind can you be?

>>18330254
OP you've gone from saying that these two are your most valuable closest people for 20 years to saying they're just friends that you don't have much emotional intimacy with. Which is it?

>>18330256
Dem /r9k/ rite????

>>18330264
Fucking this, she keeps backtracking whenever she reveals that they are way more intimate than normal.

I have a girlfriend that would constantly want to hang out with her guy friends that would hit her up because they obviously wanted to bang. I never let her chill with any of them one on one and always go to the meeting. Once they see me they change their tune instantly. Anyway my girl stopped doing that because she realized those guys did not want to be her friends and ultimately wanted to get in her pants.
Your situation seems different OP. As a guy i would not approve of my gf chilling with guys one on one, going traveling with them and would really freak if she ever slept over a guys house ( i would break it off instantly). However it seems like you know these guys for a while and not only that you seem like a honest person (if you truly did not lie in this thread). It all comes down to how muc hyou care about your bfs feelings because i assure you this will never stop and sacrifices must be made if you want to keep that relationship.

>>18330220
I understand what you mean, but it's not my case.
I've been friends with these guys for 20 years. They never once flirted with me or acted inappropriate. They treat me like a sister, they always had.
I have no intention on giving up on them. There has never been flirting, we have never had romantic feelings, I don't see why I should not be friends with someone because they have a dick.

>>18330264
I mean... Both?
It's fucking weird for me to even bring it up that I have emotions, and they sperg a lot when I talk of anything feelings. Even when my boyfriend just died, we literally sat around and joked about it because we're all too autistic to talk about emotions.

With my boyfriend I'm definitely more comfortable, and talk about feelings easily.

>>18330264
That's ridiculous. You haven't caught OP in a lie, relationships ebb and flow. They aren't the same all the time. Sometimes you have to lean on them more times than others.

To OP: I personally don't think this guy is down with your relationship style. He sounds insecure, and that's fine, but you're asking advice from predominantly insecure early-20 somethings here. They spend more time thinking about having relationships than actually having them. I'd just have a talk with your man, and lay out everything you've said here: you're uncomfortable with the amount of control he needs over you to be happy, and some things just aren't his business. Things that are told to you in confidence aren't his business just cuz he's dating you. If he can't deal with that, then you need to leave. Too many people use being cheated on as an excuse to be shitty and controlling in their subsequent relationships, and there's no reason you should have to put up with that. Healthy relationships are built on trust, and he doesn't give you any. Is that something you really want to continue putting up with? Can you really see yourself 10 years from now wanting to go out with your girlfriends, and having him breathing down your neck about cheating on him? Having to look at your phone every time it buzzes?

>>18330272
We are friends.
If one of your friends lost their SO or their dad it is normal to support them and listen to them. Normally, we don't fucking have heart-felt talk about emotions, relationships and where out life is going. We don't share our inner monologue. We joke around, talk about football, books, space shit, politics and plans to go sailing/hiking.

>>18329666
This sort of behavior doesn't get better over time.

I don't think his behavior is healthy but even if it was, if your boundaries aren't compatible then it is totally fine to declare it a deal-breaker.

If you are both willing to compromise then it can work okay but it doesn't sound as if he's willing to find any fault in his position.

If I were you, I'd cut my losses before it gets worse and more painful for the both of you.

>>18330282

kek everytime you describe your friendship with these guys it gets even weirder.
Anyway, imo it's not even that he thinks you will cheat or whatever it's that (at times at least) he feels that he's not the most important male in your life. Try to explain to him in detail everything you said here especially the non intimacy part.

>>18330136
This. "we're not meant to be" is good, too. Clearly there is a huge incompatibility here. Most guy who has a job where he has to spend a lot of time thinking would prefer simple girls, the amount of time spent discussing, explaining, arguing and making up over this whole "how close is too close male friends" thing is just not worth it.

OP's complex type is more suitable for guys with a lot of free time, 9-to-5 jobs and the likes. Or maybe artists, bohemians, revolutionists, NEETs, etc.

>>18330303
We are pretty weird. I mean, we became friends when we were 5 because literally no one else would talk to us and we were complete spergs. It improved with time, but we still have a pretty weird dynamic.
They never treated me like a girl. I honestly think they didn't fully realise I was a girl till I grew tits when I was 12.
I had some other male friends when I was younger, but the dynamic was completely different and they were more like beta orbiters. They aren't like that.

I will try to get my boyfriend to hang out with them more. I really do care about him.

>>18330322
Literally never had an argument about it.
His (small) jealousy outbursts either get ignored or I reply to his pissy texts with "If you have an issue or are uncomfortable with something, tell me about it. Otherwise, text me when you calmed down".

>>18330300
I can tell he's uncomfortable when I am alone with another guy (whether it is one of my best friends or a school mate) or he knows I'm going out with girls and we're going to drink. He's jealous and I can tell he is, but he's not abusive or awful about it.
But, you know - he gets pissy if I tell him I can't hang out with him because I'm going out with my best friend (girl) for drinks, he texts me to ask what I am doing every 20-30 minutes when I'm alone with my female friends, he gets uncomfortable when I tell him that I am spending time alone with a school mate or I am going to pick up my friend to hang out (even if he's invited and he'll come over too).

>>18330293
He's really exceptional. I am fine with dealing with a little bit of shit to be with him, because he's a really great guy otherwise. But I feel like his behaviour is mostly undeserved.
I try to be understanding because while my experience in relationship was amazing this far he had a bunch of shitty women. I don't want him to cross my boundaries tho, or control me.

Thanks for your post, by the way.

>>18329666
I can't really know if his behavior is abusive. There is not enough information and it's filtered through your perception. I can tell you this. You need to let go of your adult male friends. Maybe it's because our generation just doesn't want to grow up but it's selfish to want a family and still want to hang out with friends like you're in high school. The fact that your ex was ok with it probably indicates he was never really committed to the relationship. Sooner or later he would have moved on. Men are possessive. They protect what is theirs. If their not protecting you they don't really care about you. Have you ever seen happily married people. They don't have close friends of the opposite sex. You focus on your partner and any children you may have and any extended families. Women who have close male friends are not marriage material. Your ex knew it. Your current boyfriend knows it. As for your friend being married, that just shows he doesn't respect his own wife. He probably carries a torch for you and hopes to one day sleep with you. Make a move on him and see how fast he leaves his wife. You'll probably just ignore all this advice. You're probably just looking for validation on your opinion. If a man cares enough about you to want to build a life with you he wants you to let go on your old life and build a new one with him. You obviously can't cut out your family, but friends must go to make room a partner and children.

>>18330337
If you spent no time addressing the issue it won't go away and 4chan certainly won't solve your problem.

If you spend an "enough amount of time" to address this issue by talking about it, arguing about it (you will argue in a prolonged conversation, trust me), then making up,etc. Especially since the topic is something as ill-defined, subjective, sensitive and uncertain as your childhood male friends who have strong bond with you, the energy it will suck out of both of you is gonna be ridiculous. This is the hassle that I said most men with a "thinking job" would want to avoid when they pick a girl. They want a simple girl, a traditional relationship.
You don't want to have to make an important investment decision for your company while analyzing the stock market and is only 75% sure that your gf isn't fucking the friend she's hanging out with. I know from your perspective it is 100%, but it would be very unreasonable to want him to reach this 100% in his belief, because you and him have different histories, hence different prior belief. Google Bayesian inference, hopefully it will convince you of this fact. Of course if your current bf has a lot of free time with a light mind, get him to talk about this, in details. BUT, if he has to worry about bigger issues important to many people, not just his own personal relationship, it isn't worth dragging him through all this.

>>18330423
I don't think his behaviour is abusive.

The rest of your post is just cringey. Really. I don't even feel like responding because it is terrible.

>>18330447
Enjoy your divorces.

>>18330438
I tried to talk to him about it but he dismisses it. I don't want to pressure him and nag him to talk about it, since it has never been a major issue that caused us big trouble.
I am just sorry that it makes him feel uncomfortable and I can tell it is.
Actually both of the guys I dated had thinking jobs (ex just graduated in math and was working as a data analyst, current is doing a PhD in theoretical physics) and they both liked me because I was into their interests, so the whole bullshit about them wanting a simple girl makes me laugh a bit.

>>18330451
Thanks, I'll enjoy my alimony greatly.

>>18330455
Well, they fell for you because you are attractive, but I'm sorry to say this, my point is that you are bad for them. It is true that in the end, "simple girl" is just a preference, "pretty girl" probably beats "simple girl" in most cases for young guys.

PhD student is definitely not a job, and not yet "a thinking job". So I would say try to make it work with him. Is that what you want to hear? Honestly I would take your current bf's side because I'm also in academia and I like physics, but I didn't get cheated on so I'm not really sure how much this relationship is affecting his research. I feel bad for him and wish him the best.

>>18329666
tits or gtfo, Satan

OP, I just read this whole thread, and besides Autismo Pegasus or whatever his trip is, there hasn't been a lot of good advice.

What I can say from all of this is that it's shitty for your boyfriend to act this way. Clearly you are trying to keep an open line of communication with him, and while you don't want to share your phone with him, those reasons are valid - as then he gets to see the secrets of others that aren't his business.

But there have been some good points in that I don't necessarily think you can get him to "stop" the way he's acting, and that this may be a compatibility issue. He's always going to hold onto this deep insecurity, and it will probably get worse later in life. It's time for a mature sit-down to discuss why you're not budging here. See, odds are, these friends of 20 years are still going to be there for you in the future, but this guy will eventually be just a footnote in your life, unless you're really thinking marriage is possible.

This is a really bad board to ask for advice on, because it's full of a bunch of insecure kids. Purely by being female they're going to side against you, and blame /pol/ and /r9k/ spillover thoughts like degeneracy and all women being whores and shit.

People do indeed need to make compromises in relationships, but unlike the poster above me said, it does not mean letting your past go and throwing away everything that formed you.

>>18330478
ok beside some generic name calling and lament for the state of adv, which is typical when the overwhelming opinion isn't to your liking
>unlike the poster above me said
which poster are you talking about?

>>18329666

>This is a really bad board to ask for advice on, because it's full of a bunch of insecure kids. Purely by being female they're going to side against you, and blame /pol/ and /r9k/ spillover thoughts like degeneracy and all women being whores and shit.

Oh fuck off, your has been given throughout the thread and this whole paragraph is just a really poor strawman

OP YOU ARE 100% IN THE RIGHT.

RELATIONSHIPS ARE BUILT ON TRUST.

IF YOU BREAK UP WITH THIS GUY AND YOU HAVE ALIENATED ALL OF YOUR FRIENDS FOR THIS MAN THAT WILL BE ON YOU. BUT WHAT'S ON HIM IS THE FACT THAT HE WON'T LET YOU FORM CONNECTIONS AND BONDS WITH 50% OF THE HUMAN RACE. THE FIRST SIGN OF SOMEONE WHO IS IS GOING TO TRY TO CONTROL YOUR ENTIRE LIFE SOMEWHERE DOWN THE LINE IS "CUTTING PEOPLE OFF" FROM THEIR FRIEND GROUP. THIS IS A MAJOR MAJOR RED FLAG.

HE'S LIKE ALL R9K SHITPOSTERS: CONVINCED THEY'RE "NICE GUYS" WHEN IN REALITY THEY'RE ACTUALLY AWFUL PEOPLE WHO HAVE CONTROL ISSUES, PLAYING A SCRIPT IN THEIR MIND OF HOW THINGS "SHOULD GO" AND WILL SNAP AS SOON AS THINGS DEVIATE.

YOU'RE MIGHT GET HIT. HE'S GOING TO EMOTIONALLY ABUSE YOU. HE MIGHT HAVE TRUST ISSUES FROM HIS PREVIOUS RELATIONSHIP, BUT YOU'RE NOT HER. HE'S COMPARING YOU TO HER. THAT'S NOT FAIR TO YOU. HIS HANGUPS ARE HIS HANGUPS AND YOU CAN RESPECT THEM BUT YOU NEED TO RESPECT YOURSELF, YOUR FRIENDS, AND YOUR RELATIONSHIPS.

IF HE REALLY WANTED THIS RELATIONSHIP TO WORK HE NEEDS TO BE VULNERABLE. THAT'S HOW HUMAN INTERACTION WORKS. IT SOUNDS LIKE HE IS NOT READY TO BE IN A RELATIONSHIP AND NEEDS THERAPY.

>>18329666
Males will always try to hit on females, no matter if you say they are only friends.
He has trust issues, because of been cheated on.
You have a behavior that sets the perfect moments for your friends to hit on you, they will do, we are men, that's what we do, your friends are not his friends, and even if he is friend of your male friends, there is chance it happen.
Maybe you will not cheat on him, but hanging with a good male friend can set doubts in your current relationship.
I don't think you are being whorish, but certainly stupidly naive.

>>18330505
>EXTREME NUCLEAR SOLUTION ADVICE: NOW IN ALL CAPS!!!!!

>>18330468
Oh of course they liked me because I am pretty, but really the fact that we share interests and get along intellectually was a great motivator in both relationships.
I don't understand why you keep insisting I am complicated, I really am a pretty decent partner and rarely cause any drama.
I had one argument with my ex is 6 years, and never had a serious argument with this one. Go out of my way to make my boyfriend happy, really love the shit out of him, try to please him in every way.
I am not okay with giving up on people I love and who I am for a boyfriend, but I don't think that it makes me complicated.
Anyway, cheers.

>>18330473
No tits, but they are big enough to make up for my male friends :^)

>>18330478
I could be fine with sharing my phone with him as long as I'm sitting around and I see he's not looking into my female friends chats because that'd be unfair towards them.
I'm sure my friends of 20 years will still be my friends 20 years from now. My best friend and them are not going to go away.
I really hope things with this guy work in the long run, beside this insecurity he's a really fun guy to be around and he's very loving and kind. I understand why he feels jealous, I just want him to be happy and see that he has nothing to fear.

>>18330510
Really, they are just friends. We've been friends for 20 years and they never hit on me or flirted with me.
We grew up together. They treat me like they treat their sisters... actually they're nicer to their sisters.

I generally avoid any close friendship with male because I know guys will be guys at some point and be inappropriate, so any other friendship with guys is pretty superficial, but with them it is not the case.
We spent so much time together and they never flirted with me or hit on me, neither when we all were single, or I was single, or they were single.

>>18330491

I was talking about >>18330423.

>>18330496
We're obviously going to disagree but most of the "advice" she's gotten hasn't been constructive, it's been "your poor poor boyfriend, you need to let go of these evil other men and commit yourself fully to him." It's a common recurring theme on this board - a bunch of people who haven't ever been in successful relationships, the ones who are in "successful" relationships clinging desperately to the first person who gave them the time of day, or people who are with absolute doormats that are giving out advice.

There's not a lot of normal people here giving out reasonable and measured advice that actually weighs out the problem.

>>18330512
The problem with sitting and watching him is that he's going to want to dive straight into your closest female friend's conversation with you so he can find whatever equivalent of "omg Chad was so hot at the club last night" he's looking for. Anyone who snoops is just looking to prove themselves right and will twist any fucking words they read to fit their narrative. I know because I've been there on both ends and have matured out of it.

>>18330556
I am not willing to show him my conversations with females. That's really never going to happen because those conversation are personal and I'd feel like I'm deceiving my friends.
I am fine with him reading chats with guys, if that's what he wants (mostly because really it's just setting up plans, a group chat with my two male friends where we talk shit or talking about school stuff).
I don't know if it'd help, now that you point this out:
>Anyone who snoops is just looking to prove themselves right and will twist any fucking words they read to fit their narrative.
I've never snooped and honestly couldn't care less about it.

>>18330569

Yeah, I think you're well within your right to not show him your phone, but I think if you let him in and only let him see select conversations, he's going to convince himself that the ones he didn't see had the information he's looking for.

Snoopers are looking to start a fight - and who knows with someone like this whether or not he's going to see something ELSE that makes him mad.

My mom does this to my dad, for example - she has all of the access to his accounts. She obsessively reads all of his messages. Everything to her is some kind of code word, or if it's an email address she hasn't seen before, it can't be a coworker or old buddy from college, it HAS to be a woman.

But outside of the cheating framework, she'll look at his text messages to me and then be mad at ME for something. Like the other day I went out and bought a TV and wanted his help mounting it. My mom flipped her shit on ME because she thinks redoing my cabinets is a higher priority and I just wasted a bunch of money.

So good on you for looking out for other people's privacy.

>>18330505
I have no problem with female friends. why can women stay friends with their own gender?

>>18330613

Because normal, rational people have friends across sexes and aren't desperate to fuck anyone that gives them a cursory glance. Stop looking at everyone as a potential mate and maybe look for the right person and you'll realize people can be friends.

I can go have sex with multiple women which means I don't fall in love with every girl that I talk to.

>>18330584
He never explicitly asked to go through my phone, but he wanted to get my facebook and gmail passwords after he knew that my best friend (female) has them and if my phone gets a text while I'm driving he'll be like "You got a text from XY [married male friend] in your chat with XY and VW. Do you want me to read it? What's your pin?".

That sounds really obsessive. God.
Is your TV cool, at least?

>>18330631

The TV is pretty cool. I needed a new one.

Good luck with the rest of the thread and your boyfriend - it's not impossible for people to change, but I only changed my ways after a relationship ended because of them.

>>18329666
>sleeping over at (straight opposite sex friends house)

Dropped instantly for me. As a man who has been cheated on before this is a huge red flag and in my opinion men who allow it or women who allow the opposite are (forgive me for using this buzzword) cucked. This is something you need to accept from men. Most men. If you can accept this and feel like it's overly jealous then you should seriously consider playing for the other team. That being said as a man who knows and works with some lesbians they would probably be driven to murder over the same situation.

Hanging out occasionally is fine
Drinking socially in a group with male and female friends without your SO is fine.
But drinking with Only opposite sex friends or spending the night at opposite sex friends homes is a massive red flag. Might as well be a flashing neon sign repeating DANGER. Now is it fair? No. Would you ever cheat? Probably not. But you need to understand how you view things isn't how he views things. Sit down and talk with your partner. Explain your thoughts calmly and ask he do the same. Don't get offended and if you get angry just breathe and think for a moment before you reply.

Jealousy stems from broken and abused hearts. He has clearly suffered in the past from being to permissive and is terrified you'll hurt him the same way. But once again. Spending the night at an opposite sex friends house alone is not a jealous thing to be upset about. It's a smart thing to be upset about. It's like a bright colorful frog in the rainforest. Shit is bad stay away.

>>18330019
Wow someone's defensive as fuck. It's all his fault he's insecure? Where have I heard that before?

I'm going to generalize so apologies to femanons of good standing on this board but ere'ago.

Why is it everytime a man has a serious issue with something his partner does it's because a he is insecure? Is it a catch all female only Excalibur you feel you can pull out Everytime you want to do what you want to do and damn the torpedos? It is, that's exactly what it is. It's a shame tactic against him and a tool of building self worth for you. Oh he is so insecure because he doesn't like me doing X and as a strong independent woman I'll do X anyway because I'm not insecure I'm great and understanding and neutral. I hear this shit from women every single day about their SO at my job. It's literally not a fucking argument. It's a buzzword for women to throw around its an exercise in female only feel good self masturbatory impowerment.

He isn't insecure and you're not a fucking angel. If you cared about him truly did. You'd be having this conversation with him not seeking validation and echo chamber back patting on /adv/. Honestly your values and his values are so far apart the best thing he can do is most likely break up with you. Same for you. You go find someone who is ok with you doing what you want to do and deciding anyone who disagrees is clearly wrong because of (insert mental or emotional fault here) and he can find someone who accepts is value system.

>>18330651
I don't sleep over at my male friend's house anymore because he's not okay with it.
I think it is reasonable to not want me to, and I never questioned it. I asked him if he was fine with it at the beginning and as soon as he told me "no", I never brought it up again.

I sometimes go out for a beer with my closest male friends (either both of them or the married one alone) but it's very rare because we usually bring other friends and SOs. We hang out alone if we want to mourn over my ex boyfriend, but rarely.
I never get drunk in general.

>>18330674
He is insecure. He is convinced I'll cheat on him without a fucking reason, since I have never cheated before and never wanted to cheat on him.
If he thought that males and females couldn't have a friendly relationship without sex being involved he wouldn't hang out with female colleagues, wouldn't have female friends, wouldn't be friendly with women, wouldn't hang out alone with his friends, wouldn't drink without me.
This are not his "values", he's just upset because his ex was a whore.

He doesn't want to have this conversation with me. He avoids it. I tried to, more than once, but I don't want to nag him since he clearly doesn't want to discuss about it.

>>18330674

Let me preface by saying, I'm a guy.

How is wanting to dig through your partner's phone and not allow them around members of the opposite sex anything BUT insecurity? Like, it's pretty much the definition, that he thinks that any guy being around her is going to be better than him and steal her away. It's insecurity.

That's not to say that women don't play the insecurity card about stupid shit (like holding a purse or wearing a certain color or something), but this is a pretty clear cut case of jealousy and insecurity stemming from him getting cheated on.

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>>18329666
calm down satan (just teasing you about your trips)

You need to look at things from his point of view. Would you like it if your boyfriend hung out with a female "friend" one-on-one? Would you like it if your boyfriend went with other females to bars?

I am going to tell you something. It is a matter of respect. If you were dating me I would make sure there wasn't even the appearance of impropriety. That means I would not be texting females other than you (exception of course mom, sister, aunt, etc).

I would not be in any situation where one might think something untoward was going to happen or had happened.

Do not listen to those white knights telling you he is unreasonable and such. Nobody would date those cucks because they are wimpy and thirsty.

So do what you want but realize this. If you want to lose your current boyfriend keep doing what you are doing. He will assume you are not serious and find someone who will treat him as he should be.

That also goes for him. If he were to spend time doing anything that would make me nervous or wonder what is going on I would bring that to his attention and warn him. If that continues I would leave.

So show some respect for him and yourself. Or continue doing what you are doing and you will find yourself once again looking for a boyfriend.

>>18330719

If you're so cucked by your wife/girlfriend/whatever that you can't go out with a female friend one on one then I have news about who the wimpy and thirsty one is, friend.

>>18330719
>Would you like it if your boyfriend hung out with a female "friend" one-on-one? Would you like it if your boyfriend went with other females to bars?
Yes, wouldn't literally give half a shit about it (beside being pissed off because he'd be hypocritical).

>That means I would not be texting females other than you (exception of course mom, sister, aunt, etc).
I don't care if you do. I don't care about who you talk to, as long as you keep things decent.

As long as he's faithful, for all I care he can sleep naked next to a victoria secret model. I trust him.
He's old enough to not ask for permissions to hang out with women or shit like that.

I'd honestly rather be single than giving up on two friends I genuinely care about.

>>18330743
>I'd honestly rather be single
Then dump him.

>>18330754
He didn't ask me to choose. If he did, I'd certainly dump him.

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>>18330762
FUCKING STOP THIS HORSESHIT.

I feel a brotherhood with this man at this point. He's been hurt he's been betrayed and he's scared he'll lose someone he loves and cares for to the next Chad who walks by.

And then there's YOU. Stupid fucking bitch that thinks it's always about her. Sometimes sweetie pie, booboo, IT AIN'T YOUR OWN FUCKING SHOW. ITS A RELATIONSHIP. A GIVE AND TAKE.

You do not listen to this man and refuse to think for a second about how he might see it. And to top it all off you're going on about how you'd rather be single.

THEN BE SINGLE CUNT. With this line of thinking you're gonna be that crazy cat lady.

This man sounds like he cares about you a LOT. If he didn't care he wouldn't get upset. If he didn't care he'd let you fuck every guy in town. But you don't give a fuck because god, he's just so insecure and paranoid that You're going over to a male friends place alone or drinking with a male friend. DO YOU NOT SEE HOW THIS LOOKS???

And before anyone asks no I'm not r9k and yes I'm taken and yes I've been cheated on. 5 times as a matter of fact.

Bitch if I were dating you you'd be on the goddamn curb.

>>18330762
>I want what I want the post

You deserve to be alone with your male friends. If I had a guy like him I'd be ecstatic. He clearly loves you and wants to be around you all the time. You're not worth the effort though, another disgusting "just one of the guys" girls.

>>18330282
Dude, circumstances are no longer the same.

You have a man now, act like it. You don't need all the extra male validation. You can either bring your bf with you every time you go see them, and introduce everybody, or stop pretending like this just doesn't bother your partner. He seems more serious about you than you are about him.

>>18330794
He hasn't been hurt by me. I never cheated on him. I am not responsible for his ex girlfriend's action. I am not accountable for all mistakes ever done by women in history.

I am willing to be understanding, I am willing to compromise. If he wants
I am not willing to not ace a project because I can't hang out with a male lab partner. I am not willing to ask for permission to go out with my girl friends, or check in every 10 minutes while I'm at the bar because he's scared I'm drunk, or have him approve my look before I go out.
I am not willing to give up on two of my closest friends, people who have been by my side through the worst things I've ever experienced, people who have been my best friends for 20 years, because his ex was a whore.
I am not willing to never have a private conversation with my friends again because he needs to snoop inside my phone.

That's not going to happen. I don't cheat on him. I don't want to be treated like a fucking cheater.

>>18330797
I do spend time with him and enjoy being with him. We literally hang out every single day and I go out of my way to make him happy.

>>18330811
You came here looking for advice from. The advice overwhelmingly is that you have issues and are disrespecting your bf. Accept it or fuck off already.

>>18330803
I had a man before and still hanged out with my friends as much as I wanted.
They don't give me validation. They're friends, not beta orbiters.
He can come along most of the time. I want to be alone with my male friends sometimes, but it happened very rarely.

>>18330794

Stop being a fucking pussy. You've been cheated on 5 fucking times? My fucking sides, dude. How much of an absolute loser can you be? And "scared of Chad?" No wonder you can't hold a girl down, you're literally scared that other people are better than you - and instead of improving yourself to be better than them, you want to lock a girl away so she just can't see that there's any better. You're a loser.

>>18330803
Hanging around with friends of the opposite sex isn't for validation. It's about being able to be friends with many kinds of people and experience shit outside of your bubble. She's already said the BF doesn't want to go. She's being open and letting this guy come around and scope out the situation and show she's his girl if need be, but he's too much of a loser to come be a part of it.

>>18330827
>You've been cheated on 5 fucking times? My fucking sides, dude.
that hurts :(

>>18330827
Oh wow 10/10 good job boi. I know I'm shit i don't care. I only care about loyalty. Women can break up with guys that's not the problem. The problem is whoring around behind men's backs. There is no fucking excuse. If you cheat you're a disloyal dog that needs to be shot through the temple. Pure and simple. That's why OP disgusts me.

As for OP herself. If you can't handle what's said then get out. We're telling the truth as we see it And you need to learn that your opinion isn't the be all end all of the relationship. Just break up with him and be done with it or try to understand him more.

>>18330827
And just to note-- loser? Really? Pfft lol okay dude. You sound way more fucking dumb than I am. My girl can do whatever she wants. I'm not like ops guy I don't get paranoid about it. I can just see where he's coming from and loathe the fact she doesn't even try to get his mindset.

>>18330845
>That's why OP disgusts me.
I fucking haven't cheated on him. You're disgusted by something I have never done an never intended to do.

And the way I handle my friendships is my decision. I'm willing to compromise, if it makes my boyfriend uncomfortbale, but compromise is give and forth, not "waaaa don't ever interact with another male unless he has is related to you".

>>18330811
You are NOT compromising you are demanding it be your way or the highway. You may not have hurt him but he's BEEN hurt. Its not up to you how he feels. You can do whatever you want really. But you need to understand why he thinks like this. He'll eventually calm down but it is a slow painful process and he needs support. You're too focused on how unfair it is for you to realize that maybe he's just a wounded man that is trying to avoid making the same mistake twice.

>>18330845

>whoring around men's backs
>getting coffee to discuss a project
>having friends of 20 years you probably met in elementary school

...Fucking logic jump here. OP isn't cheating. OP isn't even out at the club with her girls "just to dance." She already accepted her boyfriend's reasonable request of not sleeping over at any guy's house.

Guys cheat too. Everyone cheats. The trick is finding someone you can trust, not fully believing they'll cheat the second they get away from you and locking them away.

The thing about every topic about men and women being friends on this board that gets me is that people are being HONEST with their partners about where they are, and what they're doing. You know what you do when you're gonna cheat? You fucking lie through your teeth. OP's boyfriend wouldn't have a goddamned clue if she said "oh I'm gonna go get coffee with Kathy" and instead went over to her side piece's house for 30 minutes for a quick fuck.

If you're dating someone stupid enough to get caught by telling you where they're going to be cheating on you, maybe it's your fault for dating someone stupid.

>>18330811
>I don't wanna be treated like a cheater

Then don't give people the impression that you need more male attention than is necessary in a relationship. My ex never cheated on me, she did things that came close to it though, know why? Cuz she had so many male and female friends up in her head. Now I understand you've known these people for 20 years, but your life has to start somewhere sweetheart, and you cant keep clinging to the past if you want it to move forward.

All my friends who have their shit together, not one of them hangs out with me, they have jobs, bills, problems of their own, gf's, kids, etc. If you can still make room for "friends", hey, more power to ya, but it doesn't help the stability of your relationship to make room for other people outside of what you've already established. It shows a disconnect really, like you're tied to the past. Press the reset button already.

Men want a woman who can be there for them and isn't going from house to house, guy to guy. Even if you've known them your whole life. When two people start something serious, the bullshit stops and the real world starts. You're probably in your 20's with this combative state against your partner, needlessly frustrating him. He probably doesn't even give a shit about your friends, he just cares about YOU, as he should! Your friends are an unrequired bonus to him most likely. He wants a life with YOU. Not them.

Yes, he's being a dick by not interracting with them, but he doesn't want to share your presence, your existence with other men. He wants you all to himself, he doesn't wanna share you, or even give himself the illusion that he's sharing you.

Nothing I say will change you, so whatever.

>>18330855

I think she gets his mindset enough. Getting his mindset doesn't mean she has to accept and change based on his mindset. He wants her, plain and simple, to not be around other guys unless supervised, like she's a child with no self-control, too dumb to know better.

I'm glad you let your girl do whatever she wants - I'm only calling the Pepe posting "man with a brotherhood" a loser because he thinks a woman should treat him like he's God's gift to the world when clearly he's gotten cheated on five times already. That's not common, dude. Eventually when shit keeps happening, you need to start questioning what you're doing wrong.

>>18330864
She already did compromise. She changed some of the way she used to act when he asked. That's already a step, to see someone's rational point and make some changes. Compromise doesn't mean fully give into demands, it means you sacrifice a little and they sacrifice a little. Neither side gets their way fully, just enough to coexist.

>He'll eventually calm down

When? When she stops hanging out with other men, like he wants? When he gets his way?

>>18330877
Sounds a bit too "I own you" but you got a point. OP listen. The way you're going about this is immature and selfish. Compromise means you need to give up something once in a while and no sleeping at a guys house doesn't count because hello that's something no healthy couple does.

>>18330877

Not her, but this is bullshit and why marriages fail miserably.

Becoming a "we" instead of two separate people that complement each other is unhealthy as fuck and doesn't work. It's not how humans are wired, and life isn't a reset button when you meet. What point in time of dating should be the "reset button" anyways? The moment you agree to be Facebook official? The moment you get engaged? Married? Have kids? It's stupid. The people around you have molded you and supported you and deserve better than to be abandoned because you met someone you can fuck.

>>18330884
Yes. 5 times. I'm no gift to the world I know that I'm a pretty poor human being. But I try at least.

Also every one you replied to was the same guy. Hi. I just want some fucking respect going on here is that too much to ask? OP doesn't respect him enough to understand how it all looks and just thinks of it in an abusive light. I'm not saying he's in the right god no. I'm saying discussion is key. And when she just stone walls and goes nope to every suggestion that rings to us that she might be the one shutting off all avenues of compromise here and not him.

>>18330877
I wanna add though, that you're free to go as you please. But just because something CAN be done, doesn't always mean it SHOULD be done.

Your situation, from my perspective, is easy to empathize with, 20 years, long time. I'd hang out with them and you. But some people just wanna go straight to the point. And frankly, eventually, I'd probably become the very same way.

If we had kids, a life together, bills, chores, problems together, and you cut off just to visit old guy friends, I'd be left feeling pretty cruddy. The older you get, the more problems you wanna avoid.

>>18330864
I am compromising.
I invite him to come over basically every single time I go out unless it'd be awkward to have him here (school stuff, ex's birthday/death anniversary), I am okay with him checking on me a couple of times while I am out with my girlfriends. I already compromised when I agreed to not sleep next to my male friends. I am willing to let him go through my phone, if I supervise him.

And, yeah - I do hope he calms down, and I don't get mad at him or anything for feeling hurt, it is understandable. But being understanding doesn't mean accepting to be unhappy to shelter him.

>>18330895
I never said you had to abandon them. But realistically, a man and a woman leave their home to start a new life, they leave even their parents behind, their MOST loved ones.. behind. To move ahead. To start a life together.

That's not to say you wont see them during the holidays, or that you wont txt or email them, it's to say the beginning of a new start is now.

>>18330055
psychosis literally means illness

If his opinion is unhealthy then obviously she shouldn't be indulging it.

>>18330896

Sorry for being an asshole then. I know this shit can hurt. It's just something I stand pretty toughly by because I've had to end relationships with women that can't get over my two extremely close female friends. Respect really is key, but what I can figure from OP's problem is that there isn't a solution on her boyfriend's end that can appease both sides. Really, he wants one thing... for these guys to disappear entirely. She is rightfully reluctant to do that, because even the best relationships fade, and when she goes back to her friends to try to repair the friendship, they'll remember the time she was willing to cut tail on them for a piece of ass.

I don't see anything here that is making it sound like her boyfriend is just asking to come along every once in a while to make sure these guys are on the level, or asking her maybe just to dial back their frequency some to spend more time with him, both of which I'd support.

>>18330906
Well first I will say that the phone thing is a bit much. Its your private stuff and I would say that shouldn't be allowed.

And second this is exactly it. You need to talk with him. A huge long talk that may very well end with a breakup from either side. Its clear there is a distinct lack of communication on your part and trust on his. This needs to be remedied immediately or you're both single. My advice is to bring up how you feel so uncomfortable by all the stuff he does but at the same time make it clear you want to stay with him. Try to work through his trust issues. But he warned they are likely massive and he's going to get emotional.

Sorry about being rude. Good luck dude.

>>18330908

My friends have always meant more to me than my parents or family ever will. My friends have been there for me, my parents have sabotaged me. I still love them, but if you made me choose between the lives of my best friend and my mom, I'd pick my best friend 100% of the time. I don't have brothers and sisters, and my aunts, uncles, and cousins would readily watch me rot in jail before paying $50 in bail money.

I think adult life is more complex than you're giving it credit for. I left my parents and everything long ago... for myself. Sure, it used to be in the old days that you'd turn 18, leave the home, marry your hometown sweetheart, and start a family where it was just the two of you, but we've moved past that. Men and women pretty much both have to hold jobs these days, they have to establish lives of their own before they find someone else.

I mean, if you don't have friends that you'd sacrifice everything for, I don't know that you've ever truly had friends. It's a drastically different bond than some chick I met at a bookstore and have been dating for a year. Maybe eventually that girl will mean more, but she has to prove that.

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>>18330827

>>18330896
She's probably stonewalling because she feels she's already compromised enough. OP is probs gonna break up with her dude but isn't ready to admit it to herself yet.

>>18330877
My life started 24 years ago, and there are some people who have been part of it for most of my life: my two male friends for 20, my best friend for 12, my other friends for 8 or 9. This is a large part of who I am, a large part of what defines me.

I am not old enough to get married or have kids. Of course my family would come first if we had one, but I wouldn't exclude my friends from my life if I had a kid. My parents never did it.
If he wants a life with me, he should accept that my friends are a part of the deal. I don't care if he doesn't want to interact with them, I care that he doesn't want me to interact with them. He needs to get over it because I'll never be all to himself, I have other things to do and other ambitions other than being his.

>>18330921
That's very reasonable. I agree. And it's cool man I get it.


Holy shit an argument on 4chan ending civilly? Now I know it's the end times.

>>18330920
Or she indulges it, and his opinion isn't so unhealthy. OP presented a distorted version of her bf.
And we are back to this point >>18330050

It is entirely possible to answer OP just by quoting previous posts in this thread. If the goal is to hit 300+ post just do that instead of wasting your time.

Also >>18330762 summarizes the thread, there is really no need to read OP's various accounts of the details of her close friendship with her guys or her version of events, at this point they aren't trustworthy.

>>18330946

Seriously. Together, are we the antichrist?

>>18330935
I understand. But if you put your friends above a partner, it just tells me you're not exactly head over heels about them. And they probably get to feeling that way too.

I've seen homeless couples together, begging for money, food, shelter. That to me is a serious union. I feel if what you want is to preserve a safety net, over a long-term companion, it's really circumstsncial and up to you, but it will always make more sense to me, to start a family, as opposed to assuming I have one in the presence of friends.. people change. I'd prefer to make a concrete decision.

>>18330949
>Also >>18330762 (You) summarizes the thread, there is really no need to read OP's various accounts of the details of her close friendship with her guys or her version of events, at this point they aren't trustworthy.

If a man asks me to choose between being with him and (anything that makes me genuinely happy), I'm going to dump him. Ultimatums are dumb. Not working to find a compromise is dumb. Not caring about your SO's happiness is dumb.
I am willing to work my ass off to make this relationship work, but not betraying myself or those I love. I won't do that ever.

Mind - if my friends, for some reason, asked me to choose between dating my boyfriend and them I'd date my boyfriend because I wouldn't want to be friends with such assholes.

>>18330963

We probably can't ever completely get either side to change their mind on this one. But to me, the choice should be about PREFERRING to spend time with "the one" as opposed to skipping out on your friends because you HAVE to. I have a couple of close friends that are in wonderful relationships where I've become friends with their partner and we all enjoy each others' company. I've also had friends who immediately closed off to be with their girlfriend or boyfriend, and then watched them try to climb back into the group after essentially telling us they couldn't spend time with us. It didn't work out well for that second set of friends. They'd missed out on fun and stories and we all found out we were basically completely different people to this point.

I'm someone who is serious about relationships, but I want someone that is all about fitting our worlds together instead of becoming our own. My last girlfriend tried to pretend she liked going out and having a social life, but it was plain to see that she just wanted someone to cuddle and watch Netflix with into eternity. I couldn't handle it, despite the other great things about it. That wasn't me.

>>18330968
You are totally in the right. And so is your partner for wanting just you, nothing else.

I feel you wanna intigrate him into something he wants no part in, that's all. He doesn't wanna share in your life, he wants to share HIS life with you.

Another thing about us men is that we don't wanna be forced to hang out in places or situations in which we don't feel comfortable by force or by compromise. Some guys just feel "added" like a ledo peace to a picture that existed long before they arrived, and they wanna paint their own picture so to speak, something new and fresh, not be molded into an existing life.

>>18330989
added like a lego piece* rather

>>18330989
And that's fine as well.
I just want to keep this part of my life. With him involved in it or without.
He cannot ask me to belong to him only and forget every other person I've ever cared for and loved. He isn't forced to be part of my life, but he cannot force me out of it.

>>18330989

While I think this is fair to say, this isn't particularly the kind of style I or my guy friends want in their life with a girl. I'm not sure if it's regional, or something to do with what class we consider ourselves, but most guys I know want someone who has their own life and their own thing going on, so we don't have to feel like we're all their life is.

>>18330999
I don't think he'd force you no.. but I don't think you'll be too happy in this combative state of mind either..

>>18331002
this is normal too

>>18330968
And after 200 posts and many wall of texts, did you find that compromise? are they novel or simple and obvious? I wager there is literally nothing changed in your opinion about your bf or your friend before making the OP. You will keep saying the same thing, you will keep doing the same thing.

Sometimes I wonder, are these people making threads because they are bored with life? the OP is two simple yes no questions. One would think all reasonable answers should contain two words replies.

Also >>18330438 is completely right. No guy with an important job is gonna want a gf with many close male friends, they need a traditional family, not one where the wife hangout with her high school guy friends every week. Or they might want flings, but not long term relationship. I don't think I've seen anything like that worked out ever.

So it would make sense to spend this much effort on building simple trust if you're dating guys with 9 to 5 jobs or NEETs

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>>18329666

Classic bait. 190 replies of pure nonsense. 10/10. Congrats, OP. You are victorious.