Want to Settle Down, But Without Marriage or Kids

>>18275646
Well, yes - me. I'd be totally fine with it.
I am sure I never want to get married. I don't know if I want kids or not, but mostly no.

>>18275646

To be totally clear: if no-fault divorce did not exist, or if alimony did not exist, and could be guaranteed not to exist in the future, I would be fine with getting married. If we could define our own contract (don't start on prenups; they get thrown out all the time), that would also work. But that doesn't seem to be the case in western countries anymore.

Additional context: I tend to go mostly for women in other high-end professional fields. I work in tech. I tend to earn significantly more though, and will likely continue to do so. Some of my friends have already been through messy expensive divorces and I absolutely refuse to put myself through that.

>>18275655
Interesting. Do you think the rumors about "biological clocks" ticking are true, though? (Curious - are you my age or older?) It seems like many people, particularly people of the female persuasion, tend to believe they don't want kids but then change their mind later. Maybe I should try to find some sociology papers about this and see what the statistics look like.

>>18275668
I am 24.
The rumours probably are true, a lot of women feel the need to have kids when their 30 approach which is why I said my idea on kids isn't set on stone.

On marriage, tho, I'm totally sure. I don't want to get married.

>>18275681
I see, that makes sense -- what is your reasoning, if you don't mind me asking? Trying to better understand.

In the meantime, I found some papers; maybe you might find them interesting--

http://www.jstor.org/stable/2137548?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

http://www.ghcisocialscience.com/uploads/1/3/5/9/13590293/child_free_by_choic.pdf

http://www.popline.org/node/421610

http://www.jstor.org/stable/582108?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

http://www.popline.org/node/493745

http://search.proquest.com/openview/db9080dd2b68a0f69fcd8fa09ec37df0/1?pq-origsite=gscholar&cbl=2042245

http://www.jstor.org/stable/352151?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/19485565.1971.9987930?journalCode=hsbi19

http://search.proquest.com/openview/234181bb4a351a927f3b378db6d44ac7/1?pq-origsite=gscholar&cbl=41824

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/journal-of-biosocial-science/article/talking-about-children-an-examination-of-accounts-about-reproduction-and-family-life/45670B2121435E34C42380BFA68CF60B

>I do not want to marry because the laws are hugely slanted against high-earning men
I don't know where you live, but in many countries, the same relationship property laws apply once you've been together a certain amount of time, so this is a terrible reason to not want to marry.

>>18275700
>what is your reasoning, if you don't mind me asking?
I simply never saw the point.

I don't like the idea of signing a contract about my relationship. I dislike the idea of being public about things like love and commitment, which are very private and deeply felt things for me.
It feels really unnecessary, and I detest weddings.

I would if it was something that my SO cared about a lot, but luckily men care less about marriage in my experience.

>>18275700

Some other articles more focused on marriage -

https://dspace.library.colostate.edu/bitstream/handle/10217/67896/Park_colostate_0053N_11226.pdf?sequence=1

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7932294

http://esource.dbs.ie/bitstream/handle/10788/2300/poster_goslin_o_2014.pdf?sequence=2
(seems that females are indeed more likely to drive marriage goals, at least in this sample)

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2FBF00292534?LI=true

http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0044118X08318116
(desire to marry seems to be correlated with desire to do other risky things as well)

http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1177/0192513X06297272
(older people less likely to marry, reasons include "personal resources, children, experience of divorce, or religiosity")

>>18275707
Not true in the U.S. There is no 'palimony' here. If there were, I would likely insist on being with someone who kept her own place as well-- but thankfully we have not yet reached that level of insanity yet.

>>18275734

And then also found these ones, aiming to tease out some of the underlying causes for these trends--

https://pastebin.com/P5kwVEsD

spam filter is getting annoying; even pastebin throught this was spam

>>18275723

>I don't like the idea of signing a contract about my relationship. I dislike the idea of being public about things like love and commitment, which are very private and deeply felt things for me.
It feels really unnecessary, and I detest weddings.

me too actually. I tend to dislike 'rites of passage'. maybe due to independent tendencies in general.

>>18275700
>>18275734
>>18275751
Why are you posting these articles? No one cares. It's beginning to sound like you're getting super defensive when no one's even arguing against you.

>>18275751
Hoping this one gets past the filter--

http://www.pewsocialtrends.org/2014/09/24/record-share-of-americans-have-never-married/

http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/barbara-hollingsworth/bachelor-nation-70-men-aged-20-34-are-not-married
(note the emphasis on male 'failure' and alleged immorality-- nevermind that I have barely been involved in 'hookup culture'; it isn't as fulfilling as a proper relationship)

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/08/world/asia/08iht-letter08.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0
(Chinese attempts to fix the property issue, but with its own problems)

>>18275767
Huh? No I'm not. Just looking for more data and trends. I'm about to go to bed anyway though. If it isn't interesting to people, I'm sure the thread will die soon enough.

>>18275759
I'm not even particularly independent, I usually get very interdependent relationships with my SO.
But on the other hand it feels very impersonal and meaningless, like it is simply a relationship upgrade. I don't like that kind of shit.

>>18275767
Not that poster, but I found if it strange that you said "the rumours are probably true" without a few studies to back it up. After all, they are rumours- not proven fact or fiction. I can't point you to my arguments (no time atm) but I do know that recent research has concluded that it may be a myth.

>>18275646
Could you clarify what "settle down" means to you? Define the living situation, financial obligations, and sexual commitment for both parties. What do you want/need, and what you have to offer, in the relationship?

For example, I would imagine it will be difficult to find a high-end professional female willing to contribute financially to a household without equity. This means either you provide expenses for the home where you both live, or you live separately. I'm assuming you want to avoid the financial support issue, this means living separately which undermines the foundation of being in a relationship.

Essentially, if you think about it, what you really want is a dog and a hooker with her tubes tied.