I really need some good advice. I need to know if I should get

>>18029099
If a ring is the only thing keeping you together then your marriage will fail anyway. If you seriously think she will leave you just because you don't want to propose to her then the last thing you want to do is propose to her. You can only propose to a woman you not only love like crazy and want to be with no matter what, but one who feels the same about you. If she really loves you, she'll stay with you whether you marry her or not.

>>18029099

Anon said it better than I could >>18029112

Marry because you want, not as an ultimatum.

>>18029099
Do you want children? If yes the marriage is just another step in you becoming real adult.

If no, then you will break up anyway.

If you are scared about finaces in divorce, do prenup and google some divorce stories and research them with your future wife. So both of you know how badly you can end up and possibly prevent it.

And yes human beings are generally scared before making huge steps in their lives. Marriage is one of them.

Why not get married but not legally?

You can have the proposal, rings, wedding, vows, religious element, whatever you want. But you don't have to have the government involvement or piece of paper.

Keep in mind though, in many places you are technically married under the law if you live with you SO for long enough.

If you love her and she's perfect for you and you don't want to lose her, marry her. She obviously loves you. Even if you don't feel like it's a huge thing for you, it's obviously very important to her. The finality of it shouldn't be an issue if you really don't want to lose her. That's the point.

Financial ruin is only on marital assets. Stuff you made while you're married. I mean yeah, if you think you're going to get divorced, don't get married. If you think there's even a chance, then just let her go and find someone who loves her enough to commit to her.

At the end of the day she just wants to feel like you feel the same way about her as she does for you and the fact that you clearly don't is probably wounding her more and more deeply the longer you hesitate. If you're really not going to propose, just break up with her.

People saying "it's just the ring" seem pretty clueless. It isn't about the ring. It's about the symbolism of you saying "yes, I do want to spend the rest of my life with you and no one else."

>>18029196
Yes I do want children. And I like the idea of a pre-nup and researching divorce cases. I hadn't thought of that

>>18029283
Keep in mind a prenup only covers things that existed before the marriage (for example a house you bought in your name). Anything else accrued within the marriage is subject to dispute within a divorce court.

>>18029287
Is that true? Never knew that

>>18029344
Yes. They also can be thrown out if the judge believes the other party didn't fully understand it or signed it under duress.

>>18029270
>probably wounding her more and more deeply the longer you hesitate

She has actually told me this. She says I'm a coward too. I get what you're saying in your post. Maybe this is an issue of me being scared and needing to be a man about things. I've just never done anything like this in my life

>>18029287

If that's true, that's crazy. It seems like you should be able to write provisions in it protecting things within the marriage as well, as long as we both agree

>>18029270
>She obviously loves you.
that's not really obvious from what he's said.

>>18029397
I agree. Marriage as a legal institution is in incredible need of reform. Family courts are corrupt and ineffective. Personally, I think it should just be overhauled and replaced with personalized contracts like what you have said.

I can understand the governmental incentive to promote and reward relationships that create and raise the best next generation for the country, but modern legal marriage is no longer doing that properly. If it can't even fulfill its actual function, get the government out of relationships completely.

where do you live?

>>18029196
>prenup
Not worth SHIT. You can find a million (probably literally) stories of them being tossed out. If you want to protect your assets the only safe route is not getting married in the first place.

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>>18029099
> I will be ruined financially
Take it from someone who has been through divorce court, lost it all, and pays child support monthly. It's all just stuff. It don't mean shit in the end compared to someone who loves you.

Marry her. Take the chance. It's the best 50-50 shot you will ever get.

>>18029099
Why in the world would you consider marrying someone who tries to pressure you?

>>18029431
To be fair, the 50% stat is a myth. It comes about from taking the gross number of divorces and marriages from within the same year. So it's not even the same couples marrying and divorcing, and it doesn't accurately represent the real rate. Even in the 70s and 80s when divorce rates were at their all-time high, it still wasnt at 50%.

When you factor in things like college education, number of previous partners, etc. the divorce rate drops dramatically.

And the divorce rate overall has been declining since the 80s, and is predicted to continue to decline. However, it is also true that the marriage rates have declined, are at their all-time low currently, and are predicted to continue to decline as well.

So overall, we are seeing less people getting married, but of those people who are getting married, less are divorcing than before.

Don't ever get married. It's a trap. You will give her the power to divorce rape you of all your assets and like most other married couples you will be living with a dead bedroom. Married women put on weight, starts nagging alot more, takes husband for granted and doesn't see the need to have sex as much.

>>18029431

I can't tell if this is scarasm

>>18029099

its completely normal, and its not a good idea. you're the only one who DOESNT want this, so why should you do it just to please everyone else.

it may be the breaking point in the relationship... but thats better than extending it in an unhealthy way.

>>18029196

pre nups only protect pre-existing assets. they are meant to protect money and property you have, potential inheritences, family owned assets etc.

a prenup does not protect your future wages. the idea of being married is that everythign you own, you own together. thats what marriage is for. so if you get a divorce she is entitled to half of that, including your future pay, because the law still sees women as being taken care of by the man, you promised her a lifestyle, and you have to give it to her for the rest of her life.

>>18029466

Why would it be sarcasm? It really is all just stuff.

Human beings and animals have a natural tendency towards loss aversion - we're REALLY anxious about losing things that perceive as being "ours".

Ultimately, though, it really is all just stuff. Look at all the lonely ass NEETS that buy shit to fill a void, only to find it a temporary distraction from the crushing loneliness.

Btw, there are a lot of people in this thread who obviously have no understanding whatsoever of what they're talking about. "If she really loved you she would stay with you no matter what!" is a 13-year old's idea of what love is. Marriage and love is supposed to be about helping each other become something greater than what you could've been separately, raising kids, and companionship.

If it were a different situation where his girlfriend didn't want to have sex, all the megavirgins here would be screaming bloody murder about how she's a cunt rather than going "Oh Anon, but if you really loved her then you have to accept that she doesn't want to!" The whole point is that you guys are reaching the point where you want very different things.

You do not want to get married, she does. There is also no such thing as a foolproof, 100% guaranteed way to find the absolute perfect person. When you get married, you're connected to that person for literally DECADES. Think back about how your life and your parents' lives has changed over the course of the past 20 years - probably a fucking lot, right? The same thing is going to happen with anyone that you marry, regardless of who it is. She could be an absolute saint that licks your balls and sucks you dry on command right now, but in 20 years she might have fucking cancer - and it's pretty harsh to expect your dying wife to gargle your dick whenever you want it. Conversely, she could be a fiery, combative executive today but after the 3rd kid she might decide that she wants to hang up the pumps in favor of watching her kids grow up.

>>18029792

At the end of it all, the point is that a marriage ultimately depends on the CHOICES that each person makes and not their innate nature or personality. Sure, what someone is like certainly influences the decisions they make and what they use to inform those decisions but to throw your hands up and say "that's just the way I am and the way things are!" means that you're giving up on the idea that you are a free agent who is in charge of his/her life and responsible for his/her own actions.

The key is to find a partner who can understand this and is also willing to constantly work on themselves, work with you, and work on the relationship to to make the marriage fulfilling.