how selfish is suicide?

Only once you've lost everything you're free to do anything. Just depends on how you define everything

>>17736079

Hypothetically, your family could be abusive assholes, and you have no choice but to take yourself out...

But probably not. Do you have a terminal painful illness? Go for it.

Do you want to be happy again? Suicide just means you die. You don't get happy again. I wouldn't suggest it if that's the case.

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If you have a loving family, yes. I've never been suicidal but imagining the pain my mother and father would feel if I died scares me more than dying.

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okay so it probably is pretty bad. how do you stop feeling like you want to die? that there's no hope and you're fucked in life. struggling daily just to earn the right to keep struggling

>>17736091
I have loving family members. They're probably the only thing that keeps me dying. Even then it is hard

>>17736079

it's selfish, but everything we do in life is in a way selfish, becuase we do it for our own self-satisfaction.

>>17736079
You'll be dead, you'll never feel the repercussions of your actions. So in a way, you'll never know you've made a dick move.

>>17736119

The desire to avoid guilt is a shitty motivation. You should do some thinking before you begin to resent good people for being good.

>>17736079
if youre depressed theyre the selfish ones for not caring.

The issue starts at believing that you are a slave to your body and mind. You are free.

>>17736149
they care. i have good parents.

but there's nothing they can do to help. especially now that i'm older.

>>17736159

Doesn't their giving a shit help?

If they didn't give a shit, I don't think that would help, and in fact, would be a negative thing, yes?

You sound stupid. Rethink your life. Wouldn't it be hopeful if you were wrong about some shit and life was better than you thought?

>>17736168
how do i rethink my life? i mean i can compare myself to people that have lost limbs or are starving in war-torn countries and it's like yeah maybe things aren't so bad? but then if i were in either of those situations i'd probably be doing all i could to end my life.

depression isn't much fun.

>>17736159
if they care then you should be able to tell them how you feel and they should at least comfort you.

>>17736208
i don't really want to bother them with this stuff, and they can't help anyway. it's the sort of thing you have to face alone.

my mom would suffocate me with comfort and add to my guilt. my dad wouldn't know what to say and recognize that he can't help. and then do nothing while feeling badly

>>17736184

>>>17736168
Read this again. Anon is showing you how to rethink perspective.
It's cold logic - if your parents did not care, they would not be helping, even being a source of negativity.
Since your parents do care, that helps.

You rethink your life by thinking about it. Obviously things could be worse, but things could also be better.

What makes your life so bad? I'm willing to bet if you list your troubles people will offer either coping methods or outright solutions.

>>17736218

Let them decide that shit, not you. You are not all knowing.

>>17736222
well okay.

life has been a struggle for a while. i work really hard for shit pay and it's getting so hard to wake up and get to work on time. and i'm in college to try to get a decent paying job eventually but that's several years off still, and i'm almost 30 as it is. my 20s were wasted on drugs and depression. and i've felt ugly and stuff since high school. i've never had a boyfriend and guys are constantly hitting on my friend when we go out together. kinda jealous of her. a lot.

i don't think i want to continue school. it tires me out with work and everything. my home is a mess because i can't manage my time and have to prioritize work and school. there's no time to rest but sometimes i do anyway. get really depressed and watch netflix or just sit quietly for hours. then deadlines have passed and i feel like a bad person. nothing seems to get better. i fall to pieces and have to rebuild just to get back to basic struggling. it sucks being poor and alone. nothing in life is truly enjoyable. it's all just work with the reward of more work. i'm so tired.

>>17736254

Ok anon, despite evidence that you have been fucked up for years and the fact that this means chances of being to help you help yourself are slim, I will give it a shot.

Most people want the instant solution - which is bullshit.

Your problem is you do not have your shit in order, specifically your time management is hot garbage.

You even said "I can't manage my time," right?

Stop writing "To-Do" lists, if you do that. They will never be complete.

Instead, take 10 minutes to write "Accomplished Lists" every day, and keep them. This will remind you of the shit you got done. Little "achievements" train your brain - this is how video games work, casinos work, little bonuses in the workplace work, gold stars in kindergarten, etc.

The other thing you need to do is just make small changes to your life, but KEEP DOING THEM.

If you clean up, for five minutes, every day, it will make a difference. Day one - not noticable, sure.

Day 10 - maybe a bit.

Day 30 you have spent two and a half hours cleaning shit up.

Now, maybe things are super fucked up and you need to take 10 minutes every day. You can fucking find 10 minutes. And when you look with pride at the shit you got done, it helps every other aspect of your life.

Just start setting small goals, following up, and recording them. This is how the most successful people get shit done.

The only thing is you have to, well, do it - you can't be lazy one day and put it off for tomorrow. You can't put the list off. You can't say "I'll pick shit up for 20 minutes tomorrow" - you can't "bargain" with yourself.

That's just shitty rationalization.

Maybe tonight some stranger on the internet helped give you a turning point. Maybe not. All I know is that I tried.

And that is no bad thing :)

>>17736254
i know how u feel ive been feeling like why do i have to be forced to work and then die. i recommend that you put an alarm for three hrs ahead of when u want to wake up, get up, then snooze, becausr ur preparing ur body to wake up. for example i need to be awake at 7, so i put an alarm at 5 6 and 7, and keep hitting snooze in between. its not annoying cause its a jingle tone

>>17736254
not all careers are work based if you cant handle it. you can try being a chef or musician for an orchestra. also have you tried lecithin for focusing

>>17736268

This is shit advice, sorry, because it interrupts (and therefore fucks up) your deep sleep cycle.

Still don't believe me? Why not "prepare your body to wake up" every hour of the night?

Try that (or imagine trying that) and see how it works.

Set two alarms, both away from your bed, and get up to turn them off.

Going to sleep at the same time every night (including weekends) and waking up at the same time every morning (including weekends) is probably one of the best things you can do for yourself (the other would be to stop drinking soda).

>>17736079
Here's thing thing: it's very selfish, you'll probably devastate a number of family members, but ultimately, you're not really going to be in a position to care, on account of the whole "being dead" thing.

>>17736090
First post best post. Looking for any other advice is over thinking

>>17736267
right, yeah. doing things is the way to fight depression. sometimes though i don't have the will to fight. that's my problem. or one of them.

>>17736268
i wake up at 4:30am to get to work at 6. not gonna wake myself at 3:30 when i'm already low on sleep every single night. it's hard to fall asleep. usually i'm in bed for hours before i get to sleep, which sucks because there's often not even much time to sleep because i've stayed up late doing homework. probably get 4 hours each not on average, except the random days i don't work.

>>17736273
being a chef or a musician is definitely work lol. i still don't know what kind of work i want to do. my job is pretty okay most of the time because i get to know people and i get to be helpful and stuff. feels nice. but it's running around a lot and they keep us understaffed and are constantly asking us to come in for extra hours. mostly because we're understaffed. recently took a week off just to focus on school and to take a break from the work, and i felt a lot better without the pressure from work. idk.

we gotta work. that's what i've always been taught.

https://youtu.be/MOY-jJeOeBk

Generally I'd argue that people are selfish dicks for thinking that their feelings matter more than those that legitimized the person's suicide in the first place. In fact I'd say it can make them horrible and unempathetic people.

In some cases though I'd say it's the opposite, where someone kills them-self despite their death having serious repercussions for others (ie.they're parents to young children) or if they an hero specifically to hurt others.

>>17736294
Please watch

does anyone else have advice? for how to live and stop wanting to kill myself.

it really sucks being alone all the time. everyone else my age is married with kids, it seems.

>>17736090
/thread

Suicide is the ultimate reclamation of self.

He who has the power to destroy something has absolute control over that thing. Suicide is deciding the world is unacceptable and refusing to let it have its way with you. It is not necessarily selfish; when everything is working against you, is it really so selfish to take back control? When you have no earthly connections left, so what if you do something only for yourself? Who cares what anyone else thinks?

It is also not to be taken lightly. It is as valid a decision as any, but also a decision that can only be made once. You had best make sure it is well and truly the only thing left to consider - that the world is well and truly something you want to give up forever, with no chance to get it back.

If you find that you are worried about the people you are going to leave behind, that is a sign that you have not yet given up on the world.

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I had depression in my late teens / early 20s.

I was really weighing my options for killing myself. Well, not "killing" myself. That sounds too angsty and harsh. I could never kill someone. I just wanted to back out of life. It was like knowing you have to fight someone who is 100 lbs heavier than you, a foot taller than you, and more experienced in fighting. I couldn't do it. I could never do it. I would lose 10 times out of 10.

I was really into the idea of walking off the top of that big 15+ floor apartment a few blocks away. It would be like walking out of life. Just all "goodbye, folks!" and I hang up my metaphorical hat and quit before I embarrass myself and make everything worse somehow.

But I didn't do it.

Oh, that felt even worse. Too much of a pussy to take an exit the easy way. Like who the fuck was I? Like I'm some special snowflake who is so important to the world that they just couldn't do without me? Like I wouldn't be forgotten by the world in 100 years even if I was alive? I failed at failing, good show. Typical.

But that was depression.

To me, I whole-heartedly believed- no, KNEW that everything really was as bad as I thought. That life was the real hell. I realized people all wore masks, some many more than others, and behind more of those masks than I could imagine lay faces terrifying and unbelievable. That the strong eat the weak, and it will never change.

But it wasn't true. At least, not completely. That's how depression works. It's heavy, it weighs you down. It causes a downward spiral the longer you think about anything. It even extends out, pulling downward at those around you until they get distance. It reminded me of those models of gravitational fields in space. The more that gets pulled down, the heavier the pull, which pulls more down, and so on.

And that's just one stage of it.
But know this: While it is the worst one, it's near the end.

please cont(1/2)...

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>>17736654
cont(2/2)...

Yeah, I figured I'd let it slip. There's an end to depression, and no, it's not death.

Death won't get you free from anything. Death makes you keep it, locks it in.

I realized that I didn't get in the elevator of the apartment, not because I was too scared (quite the contrary at the time), not because of "muh famly so preshus" or "all my friends and alll those friends and oh so many sooo many friends", or any of that other bullshit that everyone tries to feed you when you're depressed.

For me, I knew, that if I ended my life there, that would have been me. That would be the story. Saddy "who?" McSadpants amounted to nothing and lived an unremarkably brief life of not dying until he stopped doing that. Here in this empty room we see everything he made and accomplished: There's kind of a tiny old thing there in the corner but we don't know if it's actually part of this gallery or not. No, spiders made those, those are cobwebs. Well I mean maybe he made some of them, who cares, he was a nobody who both lived and died briefly and unremarkably before he could even see how history played out.

If I was going to go out, if life was going to crush me, I would at least see how it did it. So I could at least think to myself "I knew it", and have that one tiny piece of satisfaction.

cont(shit2/4or2/5sorry)...

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>>17736658
cont(3/4)...

And I admit, I was curious. I was always curious. I Still am. I think that's what's always kept me going. I always wanted to see what happened, out of pure curiosity and analysis. If a train was crashing, it would be the "horrified, but can't look away" thing without the "horrified" part. I would want to see exactly how a train crashes in real-time, even if I'm in danger. If life is just a big trainwreck and I'm thinking of dying, I might was well watch this thing go down and see what happens. Maybe try to enjoy myself and/or do something productive while I watch. It's even easier than walking away from it all, and certainly more exciting. Yeah, everyone onboard the crashing plane is panicking, but is that helping at all? Might as well sit back and enjoy the ride.

But that's pretty much at the end of depression.

Just before the end, and just after the worst parts, there's kind of the nothing part.

It's better than the "everything is the nightmare" and the "I should go" parts, but that's just because it's nothing instead of negative. I don't want to spoil it because you have to ride it out and work through the experience yourself (I am legitimately sorry I can't predict your experiences for you but it is the only way and it's worth it), but basically you don't have any strong feelings toward literally anything. It can be a bit of a slog on its own, but the end is right after that.

I guess I just wanted to tell you that it ends.

cont(3/4)...

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>>17736660
cont(4/4)

There's a way out the other side. Some day you can leave it all behind and start to use life to your advantage. You will find things that make you want to go on. Maybe someday you can even do things that make people happy, to MAKE reasons for others to live, just so that those reasons exist in the world.

You just need to keep at it. Think of depression as a task. It's shitty, no one likes doing it, no one understands the work it involves even if you could explain, and no one will even thank you for it, but just see the job through to the end, and piece by piece, your efforts will start to pay off.