/a/ debates that will never end

>>158326340
Pretty sure Edward Elric can kick Edward Elric's ass. How's this even up for debate?

>>158326340
I like 2003's character designs better. Better colors, Brotherhood feels like it copied the manga's designs.

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>>158326366
You clever fuck.

Some things were done better in 2003 and vice-versa. Brotherhood just has the better story. And no, rape does not make a story more mature, regardless of how deep it was.

2003 was better until the story diverges from manga.

>>158326456
How is this a debate? Kazuma is more likable than Subaru.

>>158328225
This. I thought /a/ mostly agreed?

>>158328225
2003 is better BECAUSE it diverges from the manga, manga/brotherhood just becomes another O MY POWERLEVELS generic shonen past that point, while 2003 has kept better tone, pacing, and introduced very intriguing concepts. Basically, if you're in it for the action, stick with Brotherhood, if you want a better story, go with 2003.

>>158328330
>manga/brotherhood just becomes another O MY POWERLEVELS generic shonen past that point
Christ man, you've gotta be more subtle than that.

>>158328264

shaka>everyone else

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>>158328330

>>158327963
>brotherhood fells like it copied the manga's designs
How the fuck is this a bad thing? Are you retarded?

I like Brotherhood a little more than 2003 but I also watched Brotherhood first.

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>watched 2003 first
>liked brotherhood much better

>>158327963
>copied the manga's designs
is this not LITERALLY what it's supposed to do?

>>158328479
That's a bad thing because it didn't work well in animated format.

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>>158328763

>>158328843
That particular case didn't translate well to anime.

>>158328920
I disagree

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1999 vs 2011

Brotherhood wins.
End of discussion.

>>158329534
Anyone who thinks 1999 is better is in some serious denial. It's the case with everything where /a/ just goes against what's most popular.

>>158326340
Homura did or did not do something that was in fact wrong.

>>158326340
TTGL ending

>>158326456
This one is a tie. They're both Down syndrome fuckbois from shitty series.

>>158328287
becuase kazuma is a typical bland selfinsert character

>>158326366
>Ed being able to beat Ed
>not shit opinions

>>158327963
I like Arakawa's designs, so I liked that.

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>>158326340
Which was worse?

>>158326340
2003 is a better seinen

Brotherhood is a better shonen

Neither of them were particularly bad.

>>158326340
Best girl is Riza

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>>158330650
Shamballa only had Nazi Hughes and Gypsy Girl.

Milos had Batman and Lina Inverse.

Shamballa was worse.

>>158330553
So is subaru

>>158330650
I haven't seen the second movie, but the first movie was one of the better anime-based movies out there.

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>>158330838
>Milos had Batman and Lina Inverse.
nigga you what

>>158326340
This isn't an /a/ debate. It's Gaiafags/Narutards holding the wrong opinion while /a/nons explain why they're wrong.

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>instead of posting more examples of shitty debates, people are arguing about 2003 vs brotherhood, again
Kill yourselves. Twice if possible.

One Piece being good or bad

Older Gainax vs. Later Gainax

Moe/cute girls doing cute things vs. Shounen/manime

Dragonball Super manga vs. Dragonball Super Anime

weather Caska enjoyed it or not

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>>158330874
Edward and Alphonse stumble into a crossover fanfic where the Batfamily teams up with Lina Inverse to free Palestine.

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Shichika > Shirou Emiya
Fuck off Fate fags

>>158330961
>DBS manga vs DBS anime
Super vs GT is more accurate

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>>158330838
>>158330988
you must think I'm stupid or something

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>>158327963
>Brotherhood feels like it copied the manga's designs.
No it doesn't. It looks like it took the worst aspects of Arakawa's artstyle, the blobbish faces, the thin hair, the wide mouths, and exaggerated them even more. 2003 took the same designs and gave them a more structured look to make them more appropriate for television. Arakawa's designs never looked as bad as brotherhood's, and her designs were also much better suited for print than they were for animation.

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>>158331079
i agree, but Shirou is still one of my favorite characters ever. only right under Shichika.

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>>158331109
I tell you what is basically the truth.

>>158331090
/a/ mostly agrees that Super is much better than GT, while the manga vs anime debates are much more volatile.

>>158331297
Ichigo is less of a retard and he is not annoying, only narutofags can't see this

>>158331090
Ehh, nah, GT is overall still seen as the worse of the two, as much as Pacos try to meme it otherwise. It's actually kinda funny, they get extremely desperate at times, like when one guy tried to use the cardgame to prove GT characters were stronger, only for another anon to use the very same cardgame to show otherwise.

>>158331397
Naruto is a pretty shit character, but Ichigo is a fucking non-character

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>>158330650
I never watched Milos, but in defense of Shamballa Arakawa and the scriptwriter worked together on the first draft and ended up writing enough content to fill and entire single cour anime. It suffered massive cuts, but the first draft was probably amazing. I still like the whole "gypsies in nazi germany" angle. You never see anyone acknowledging them.

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>>158331231
Oh, and how can I forget, the Batfam brought Bane along too.

>>158331426
the problem is that Pacos are a large part of the fanbase

>>158331397
Naruto at least establishes a personality.

Ichigo literally acts in convenience for whatever the situation calls for it. There's nothing separating him from the average person.

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>>158328439

>>158331536
that's kinda the point, he was a normal teenager who could only see dead people and it was annoying for him, and his personality changed a lot of times in the manga, from punk to emo to a mix of both, Naruto stayed a retard till the end

>>158331536
>theres nothing seperating him from the average person
i mean dont get me wrong im 100 percent for characters with bombastic wacky personalities, but i dont think there is anything necessarily wrong with a character having a real mundane and grounded personality as long as they do something with it, which bleach sort of did for a bit but kubo gave up in the last arc.

>>158326340
2003 had much more mature themes and well developed cast. The Hugh scenes in 2003 were GOAT.

Brotherhood was just a battle shounen desu

>>158331474
>>158330650
I loved conqueror of shamballa because of the setting, atmosphere, animation, and unique plot. But maybe that's just nostalgia talking, I need to rewatch it, but I'll probably end up liking it again

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Yes, it was.

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>>158330650
am I the only one who fucking loved Shamballa?
>Punished Mustang
>Ed stuck in Germany while Al goes around trying to bring his brother back
>That Winry and Ed reuniting scene where she was carrying his arms and legs the entire time

Milos was shit tohugh, practically a Naruto movie

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>>158331745
I never said he had to act like a hyperactive and irritating kid like Naruto, im just implying that a memorable non-norm personality is what establishes a shonen character.

The character Ichigo was ripped off from establishes Ichigo's traits much better than Ichigo.

>>158330654
What the fuck do words even mean anymore? They're both shounen, you nigger, they're the same series.

>>158328330
Except brotherhood has a way better story that's large scale too. Large scale as in there's a lot of fucking shit.

>>158328225
I can not understand why people think a fucking Resident Evil movie tier plotline is superior.

>>158332334
>It has a way better story
Just because they flush out the world a bit more by showing other countries doesn't mean it is a better story.

Digital vs Traditional
Was Rebuild 3.0 a good movie?
Flat vs Big

>>158332437
Maybe not for you but for me it is. 2003 seemed like it was gonna go somewhere but the only things it did better were drama, pacing, some characters, and the homunculus.

>>158332447
>was rebuild 3.0 a good movie
it's nearly unanimous that 3.0 sucks ass, what are you talking about?

>>158331474
>and ended up writing enough content to fill and entire single cour anime.

that would have been nice

>>158332215
2003 was written in more of a seinen-like format. It actually took moments that needed to be serious seriously. Brotherhood's serious moments are usually and immediately replaced with a comedic cutaway. There's nothing with either scene direction, it's all in preference.

2003's movie is considered the true ending, which ends with Ed and Al rejecting the goals of a modern person of creating a family, but instead staying in the new world where they could discover something no one else from their world could possibly dream. It's a bold move to create this alternate ending, but it literally solidifies what this series is all about, 2 guys taking a big risk to learn all they can.

Why people say it's written in a seinen-like format because seinen it takes the reader out of their comfort zone and has them think why 'x moment' didn't go the standard route.

>>158330650
>The End of 2003 FMA
vs
>shitty one-off movie that ties nothing together and exists solely to add some edge to the Brotherhood side of things
Even as a Brotherhoodfag I still can't argue for that piece of shit

Say what you will about MUH NAZIS but Shamballa at least served a purpose

>>158332568
shonen and seinen are just demographics, Shin chan is a seinen, that doesn't mean it's more mature than FMA, it just means its targeted to adults

>>158332568
>Why [I] say it's written in a seinen-like format because seinen it takes the reader out of their comfort zone and has them think why 'x moment' didn't go the standard route.
You need to realize seinen is just a demographic and that most moeshit is seinen and most trashy edgelord garbage is shonen

>>158332495
Because other countries weren't necessary for the 03 plotline. They're only needed in brotherhood as the origin bases for the Shin Characters and to help support the idea that Amestria was a human transmutation circle and "the wronged country" while shin was were Hoeinhiem went when he parted ways.

2003 gave you enough the the alchemical world needed for its story.

>Like it was going somewhere
What does this mean, where did brotherhood go that made it so great? From my perspective it all spiraled into an outrageous plan by an unreleatable, unsympathetic inhuman ball of gas.

The homonculi had no proper link to the characters and were part of a weird literal "discard my sin" concept that really didn't add much at all.

It was all one big stupid cluster fuck where as 03 kept this nice idea of having this unstable and risky plan unfold by someone hoenhiem abandoned. It has this nice thing going with the idea of sin, Brotherhood doesn't.

>>158332703
You mean Xing? Who ever translated it as Shin?

>>158328676
Same

I could appreciate what 2k3 was trying to do, but it just didn't strike a chord with me.

Brotherhood just felt more satisfying to see how it ended for everyone.

>>158332748
Huh, you're right. I don't know why I remember it as Shin.

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2003 Sloth
>Plans were going great, just need to kill the Elric brothers
>Suddenly dumb fake son appears and fuses with you, making your body immobile
>Plans are ruined and it's partially your fault it fucked up so badly
>Only reaction, "Eh, whatever."

Brotherhod Sloth
>HERPA DERP IM LAZY AND TIRED

How can Brotherhoodfags defend this writing?

>>158332920

>2003 Sloth
>An actual fucking consequence of the protagonists' mistake
>Human Transmutation retains it's meaning as being taboo
>It's their fucking mother

>BrotherhoodSsloth
>I'm so tired and lazy
>But also the fastest
>My entire fight will be the 100th repetition of Armstrong's muscle Joke but with the addition of Sig Kurtis while Izumi and Olivier meme about who's stronger

>>158332920
>>158333107
What purpose did 03 Sloth serve besides shock value? She did nothing else the whole time. At least Brotherhood Sloth had a clear purpose like all the homunculus were meant to have.

>>158333211
>What purpose did she have
As the series goes on you start to learn the horrific origins of the homonculi as they're connected to various characters in the series.

Then you're finally met with what was to be expected, that the false Trisha Elric that had been made at the beginning of the series had been recruited by Dante.

Otherwise she was the second best infiltration homoculi next to Envy and someone to keep Wrath on a leash. The purpose of all Homonculi in 03 was that they were the results of human transmutation that were purposely sought out and recruited by Dante due to their powers

Brotherhood sloth was just the designated circle builder and storage unit for Dwarf's "sloth" which again, doesn't matter nor make any sense because no matter how you slice it, an inhuman black blob with divine knowledge of the universe would never suffer "sloth"

>>158328330
This.

>>158331351
GT >>>>>> Super

>>158331149
Anon, I think you might have a serious fetish for swords

>>158331351
It isn't, they don't. Super is a mess. If you actually like either show you've got serious problems. As Super has gone on GT is honestly looking better and better.

>>158332920
Wasnt that Lust?

>>158333662
No, Lust was the same in both versions. She was introduced all the way back in Lior.

>>158333662
Unlike Brotherhood, Lust lived long enough to have character development.

>>158332568
>2003 was written in more of a seinen-like format

Bull fucking shit.

2003 was a shameless attempt to go for the Naruto audience. I hate the 2003 anime and it's pretty much the reason Hideaki Anno hates anime. It's copy paste shit that tries to superficially replicate marketable aspects of other series without the "gravitas". 2003 goes for the Naruto drama and does it in a so over the top manner that it fails miserably becoming a joke in the way(human-dog chimera).

Fullmetal alchemist is supposed to be a cynical take on a war torn world. It has a more contemporary real world tone.

>>158333985
(cont)

I mean, I can respect Naruto for being a coming of age story for most the characters. And it's set in a more dark ages/barbaric world. FMA was never that, it was meant to give its take on alternate history contemporary war crimes, to give a sterilized perspective without the psychological baiting.

>>158334052
>>158333985
>Naruto
>Naruto
>Naruto Audience

Your criticism is trash.

>>158334125
>Your criticism is trash.

Nope. My criticism is very apt because:

>FMA is all about an alternate universe take on post -contemporary- war era. It's about war crimes, it's a criticism to a over militarization and personal struggle in such a world.
>Naruto is a coming of age story in a very primordial world, were the forces on nature that shaped the world are still at large.

2003 FMA tried to take elements from a series like naruto and that's why it fails.

>FMA with original ending
>FMA following the manga ending
>both gets animated

is there even any other anime that pulled this?

>>158334362
>is there even any other anime that pulled this?

Hellsing ?

>>158333985
Wow, that sure was a lot of meaningless bullshit you just let out. The only thing linking 2003 and Naruto is the fact that they both are shounen anime. I suppose they both also have blonde protagonists. If anything brotherhood has much more in common with Naruto from its tone to it's large cast, but still the similarities are limited to shared traits in the battle shounen genre. Brotherhood just fell more in with battle shounen troups, while 2003 broke away from the manga storyline before any big fight scenes happened and the cast ballooned out of porportion.

Naruto is the copycat shounen here. Early plot threads of Naruto were taken almost directly from Hunter X Hunter, which is a manga that already draws pretty clear influences from dragon ball and JoJo. I don't know enough about battle shounen, particularly pre-00s battle shounen, to draw you a perfect pedigree of shounen manga through the ages, but Naruto follows a well-trodden path that goes back decades. FMA is one of the few battle shounen that stands out as being different (no bullshit power-ups, no fated rival character, no long solilques, no powerlevels), and 2003 amplified those differences in the way it diverged from the manga (relatively short, grounded villian, brief, realistic action scenes, focus limited to principle cast only).

Also, I can say with a fairly high degree of confidence that Anno has never commented on FMA or what it says about the state of the anime industry.

>>158331536
>Naruto at least establishes a personality.

Naruto lives in a world akin to that of Luffy. They are more stories of idealized mythical people than anything else.

Ichigo is simply an alpha. "Guy slaps Rukia's ass, Ichigo slaps guy."

>>158334297
Wait, but those things you just said are completely different from each other.

>>158328982
Not OP but I agree that brotherhood looked worst.

>>158330913
This. 2003 had nice things, but Brotherhood is overall superior. Take off your goggles you faggots and give it a rewatch, 2003 is not even that good.

>>158334297
Except 03 has nothing to do with that. 03 chose to focus on the taboo nature of human transmutation as a sort of warning about the inability to accept death.

Brotherhood abandons this element to instead focus on the evil military hierarchy of an omniscient black blob with an over the top grandiose plan.

If anything brotherhood has more in common with Naruto. It loses the initial focus to instead butter up a villain with a convoluted plan and an even more half-assed reason to go through with it ("Muh understanding" being as dumb as "Muh peace through mass illusion").

03 was a bunch of people having a bunch of people going to great lengths to cheat death and unknowingly feeding one of two people who actually did so at a great cost. There is something incredibly human about the scenario of 03 in that regard.

Brotherhood was just one big convoluted plan for a piece of god to become god while his inept former partner is trying to undermine him.

>>158328323
I personally liked the feels bad ending.

Did Brotherhood get its ill-timed humor from the manga or is that shit original?

you took forever to say nothing.

>>158334500
>while 2003 broke away from the manga storyline before any big fight scenes happened

2003 was greedily trying to get the audience that big shounen series of the time had (naruto, One Piece, BLEACH) before the story was meaningfully shaped. Arakawa gave the anime studio a middle finger with the way she progressed the story.

>Naruto is the copycat shounen here.
yeah, naruto like many DragonBall wanna be series started very typically. it shamelessly copied Flame of Ricca and others. It was successful for long enough to become different but that's not our topic. I am not comparing the fucking manga, I am saying that the 2003 FMA was trying to be a naruto type fantasy when the manga was about post war.

>FMA is one of the few battle shounen
our discussion is about 2003 FMA vs FMAB. Hideaki anno hates that the anime industry became a superficial replication marketable aspects of other successful series in order to appeal to the die hard otakus.

>>158332334
Larger scale actually made it worst.

Brotherhood became more generic the more characters they introduced.

The older one's story contained itself and didn't have as big of a "hail mary"

>>158334642
>Except 03 has nothing to do with that.

Yep. I meant the manga. 2003 focused on forced fantasy drama.

The theme of the FMA MANGA IS NOT A COMING OF AGE STORY. It's WAR and MILITARIZATION.

>>158334642
>Brotherhood was just one big convoluted plan for a piece of god

Jesus I can't believe I have to spell this out for you, seriously how old are you ? Father symbolizes military and scientific advancement getting out of hand in a militarized world.

>>158334698
>I'm going to give the animation studio a big middle finger
Ah yes, a big "let's go overthrow the military while they throw absurd and retarded things at us somehow isn't more generic shonen.

>>158334805
>IT"S NOT A COMING OF AGE STORY
It's a dealing with mistakes story.

>Father symbolized military and scientific advancement

Father is a cheap Snake in a generic adam and eve story manifesting into your typical "muh plan" shonen villain.

He enters knowing seemingly everything, makes humanity dependent on him and undermines them with false promises all so he can become god. His motives are basic as shit but made worse by the fact that he isn't human. His only relatable issue is being contained in a flask, which he resolves. But oh wait, you mean he now has an existential flask of being limited by his god body and complete control of a nations alchemy? Nevermind the whole "removing sin" thing because well he's more omniscient god particle than human.

He's shit anon, his entire plan was shonenshit. Dante was more realistic, Dante was human and an actual meaningful responsibility of a Hohenhiem that wasn't shaped to be an innocent Eve like in brotherhood. Dante wasn't "le master planner" she was literally winging it by gathering everyone elses futile attempts to cheat death, got lucky enough to even get the king of the nation as a homonculus on her side.

Father was literally just the Umbrella corporation from Resident Evil.

>>158329534
1999 has better animation in some places, but overall the fact that it only makes it up to the end of York New is its biggest flaw. The second biggest is that the director was a huge Leopika shipper and added in a bunch of fluff scenes, while 2011 is completely faithful.

>>158328330
this is the cold hard truth

>>158332568
>2003 was written in more of a seinen-like format. It actually took moments that needed to be serious seriously
>Why people say it's written in a seinen-like format because seinen it takes the reader out of their comfort zone and has them think why 'x moment' didn't go the standard route.
You have no fucking clue what "seinen" is and are just using it as some retarded superior-wapanese substitute for "mature and adult like me." Lurk more, newfag.

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Yeah I don't give a crap about seinen or any of that shit but 03 has a better story overall.

I watched 03 before reading the manga and was severely disappointed the manga wasn't like 03.

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Thought it was a woman for like 8 years t b h

>>158333211
In 03 she is a character in a story.

In brotherhood she is just another shonen archtype.

>>158337589
still hot

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>>158335108
preach it my brothah

>>158331137
Each version just went with it's time.
Neither is actually that close to the print designs.

>>158332447
>Was Rebuild 3.0 a good movie?
There isn't a single good Eva movie, they have all been cashgrabs to pay for Anno's antidepressants

>>158329534
according to Japan, 1999 > 2011

>>158326340
2003 objectively and subjectively has the superior soundtrack.

All in all if you skipped the 2003 version your a pussy

>>158326340
The manga you dunce

>>158331859
No, it wasn't.

>>158326340
2003 Ed is a lot hotter.

>>158328225
I agree, but I don't think the anime-only part of 2003 is bad except for the last arc.

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Shiki can kill servants.

>>158332920
>>158333107
I know you guys just have the hots for an evil milf villain, no need to justify it

But I agree 2003 Sloth is a better chacater than Brotherhood Sloth

>>158330913

I've been on /a/ since Gurren Lagann aired and I definitely prefer 2003 over Brotherhood. Like someone else said, Arakawa's character designs just don't translate very well to animation, they needed tweaking to work and 2003 definitely improved them. It just doesn't count for much if an anime copy pastes the manga and follows it to the letter if the source material is kind of meh to begin with. And don't get me wrong on that, the manga started off great but it quickly devolved into politics and race issues while applying shonen logic to it whereas I think 2003 did a good job of separating the politics from the inherent magic of alchemy.

But lets be real here, no one does shonen politics like Magi.

>>158326340
Brotherhood

>>158329534
2011

>>158332137

Yusuke and Ichigo aren't similar at all though.
Yusuke was a wise cracking delinquent and Ichigo was pretty much just an average Japanese dude who people mistook for a delinquent based entirely on his hair color.
He didn't smoke, skip class or get into fights just for the fuck of it. He also didn't have half the sass that Yusuke did and I think its kind of a stretch to compare them.

And I've also held the opinion that its a stretch to say Bleach is a YYH ripoff since Bleach fucking started. The only thing thats mildly similar between the two is the ghost aspect but there are hundreds of other anime and manga that also deal with ghosts. And trust me, YYH is my all time favorite anime so if there was a series that ripped it off I'd acknowledge it.

>>158326340
Both are masterpieces of anime. :)

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Who was in the wrong?