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One in Four Anime Studios Reportedly Losing Money

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http://www.crunchyroll.com/anime-news/2017/05/19-1/one-in-four-anime-studios-reportedly-losing-money

Interesting Article
>>
>crunchyroll
>>
CRASH WHEN
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>>157412166
Shirobako was a shitty show.
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>>157412285
After olympics
>>
>studios are broke pls buy a Crunchyroll™ Premium™ Account™ and support the industry
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>75% of Anime is Shit
>25% of anime studios lose money
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>>157412166
Reminder that no hollywood movie has made profit ever.
>>
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Non Crunchyroll link:
http://www.otakuusamagazine.com/LatestNews/News1/One-in-Four-Anime-Studios-in-the-Red-Says-Report-8977.aspx
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>>157412384
wut
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>g-guys but the industry is f-fine!
That one graph fags ????
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Wouldn't be surprised if we had a crash eventually
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>>157412285

Never. Industry as a whole improves over 10% every year.

Maybe those studios should just stop making shit LN adaptations.
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damn i guess I'll need 2 crunchyroll subs then
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>>157412384

Hollywood movie needs to make over 2.5 times it's production budget to start making money.
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>>157412621
LN adaptions are pretty safe for the studio since most of it is paid for by the company who distributes said-LN. Original productions are a killer since most of those tank hard.
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>>157412621
Revenue != profit
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>>157412621
Horseshit. Nobody would make an anime like Girlish Number if that was the case.
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>>157412166
Good. That's what they get for losing all orginality and trying too hard to pander.
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>>157412700

Are you stupid? Anime is super cheap to produce. Anime industry makes 20b $ a year. Hollywood makes 40b $ a year.

Now compare the cost of making Hollywood movies to the cost of making anime and guess which industry makes a better profit.
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That's a lot less than expected, honestly.
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>>157412726

You know the best money makers in recent years were yuri pandering like Love Live and fujo pandering like Yaoi on Ice right?
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>>157412769
>Anime industry makes 20b $ a year
Please give animators some of that money

They're people too you know
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>>157412166
Of course they are. Because they are stupid. There is a limited number of people who buy anime related stuff. That number is not very flexible. Putting out 30 shows per season is retarded because it's obvious not all of them will sell.
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>>157412712

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2016-09-29/report-anime-industry-up-12-percent-in-2015/.107055
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>>157412834
Key animators get paid about the same as a salaryman in their age group
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>>157412845
>30 shows per season

You mean 50.
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>>157412834
They should form a union or something. Rural people voted Trump into office, what are animators doing?
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They should make animes of American classics like Seinfeld if they want to make money.
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>>157412893
>animator's unionize
>half of all anime now drawn in corea
>the other half's CGI
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>>157412893
>what are animators doing?
Starving?
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>>157412931
Aren't most anime already drawn in SK?
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One in four is better than I would have expected.
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>>157412769
According to the charts being posted the revenue is going up and the production companies or w/e are making more profits, while the animation companies aren't.
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>>157412166
Doesnt this happen in all the branchs of business? Why is it surprising that may be companies in the anime industry that are losing money?

I mean, not all business can be successful, that would be an utopy.
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>>157412959
Nah, the key animation is still done in Japan, only the inbetweening is outsourced to korean sweatshops
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>>157412285
When China crashes. So never outside of World War III or another debt collapse.
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Maybe those stupid gooks should finally start to pander to us if they want money
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Is this the work of Daiz?
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>>157412384>
>157412482
That is because their accountants make the Mafia look like honest people.
>>
Well /a/? Which studios do you think are losing money?

Can't believe nobody has asked this yet.
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>>157413034
this. if you watch egoraptor's interview with trigger, they even said despite the west liking their show and donating all that money to the kickstarter they still don't give a shit about the west and make what they think japs will like.
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>>157412726
Nah, all studios that pander to the male and female otakus are the ones surviving.
Only stupid studios that make westernshit garbage like Gangsta are the ones going down.
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>A-anon my company isn't doing well, can you lend me some money... for some services?
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>>157413063
Gonzo
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>>157413068
>they still don't give a shit about the west and make what they think japs will like.
But again and again, it's been shown that elevens have the worst taste in anime!
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>>157413034
>implying the west buys anime
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>>157412893
Their only bargaining chip is "at least we aren't Korean, Chinese, or Indonesian."
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Reports say it's Actas
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>>157413103
You'd think they'd run dry sooner or later.
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>>157413124
That's implying they have worse working ethics which is highly retarded.
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Maybe we'll stop getting as many tv shows
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>>157412166
It's sad that my first thought was "that's it?"
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>>157413103
Again?

Haven't they declared bankruptcy like 3 times already?
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>>157413010
No, they lost money because you retards keep pirating your animu even when you can watch it in a legal way.
Please subscribe to Crunchyroll to save the Anime industry.
Don't forget to tell all your families and friends to subscribe too.
More Crunchyroll's subscriptions = more chances of saving the Anime industry.
So, please please please subscribe!
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>>157413034
Many studios have tried over the decades.
All of them failed.
Based on the decades of cheap change they get for licensing in the west, I doubt any of the established studios will try again.
They rather focus on emerging Asian markets.
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>>157413063
DP? Though DIU was fairly successful
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>>157413188
>Haven't they declared bankruptcy like 3 times already?
I think so.
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>>157412946
Some of them should get into politics and promise to make anime great again.
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>yfw Netflix, Funi, and Disney start outright buying anime studios after 2020
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>>157413103
Why won't Gonzo just fucking die already?
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>>157412769
>Anime industry makes 20b $ a year.

Where are you getting these numbers?
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>>157413260
Disney doesn't seem to care about 2d animation anymore. Unless it's cheap TV shit.
Netflix probably will, though.
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>>157413260
This is all but inevitable.
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>>157413068
>>157413088
There has got to be some way to tap in to the monsterous potential revenue market of gaijin anime fans, and I can't believe somebody hasn't figured out how to really monetize it yet.

It seems even Hollywood sees this and that's why they keep trying to make live action movies from anime and manga scripts, even though most attempts have failed so far.
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>>157413260
If Trump follow through with launching capital controls, they will have a hard time of doing so.
If he is lying about that, then they may able to buy lots of share in Kadokawa, which are the major holding company of the Japanese entertainment.
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>>157413260
You should be more fearful of Amazon.
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>>157413273
>implying Gonzo dies when it's killed
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>>157412166
Do studios still rely on DVD sales? And when they sell 20000 it is an accomplishment?
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>>157413369
They are taping gaijin anime fans market.
In Asia using streaming services.
Since China, Taiwan and South Korea hold similar cultural values as Japan do, their entertainment need very little localization except for dubbing to be popular.
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>>157412166
>"journalism"
>grammar mistake in first sentence
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>>157413519
edit:
>TWO grammar mistakes in first sentence.
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>>157413260
It's inevitable. The world order loves corrupting and ruining mediums and turning them into propaganda golems.
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>>157413340
>Disney doesn't seem to care about 2d animation anymore.
It really makes me sad. They've got so much capital to work with. Probably the strongest marketing and distribution platform in entertainment media, as deep pockets as any production company ever, and an army of talented animators and artists. Even if they just set aside a little bit of that for 2D projects, and not just for the occasional animated short, that could still be enough to put out some really good stuff.
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>>157413323

See: >>157412857
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>>157412384
You don't make movies to made a profit.
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>>157413485
Yeah, but thats chump change compared to figuring out how to tap in to the US and European weeaboo market.

I think Japan's idiotic narcissism is gonna cause them to lose out on the opportunity to western corporations.
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>>157412166
I think the only way to fix this is that studio should increase the vested interest on particular projects to generate more potential profit.

However ROI could taken years and other production committee member may financial strong arm the studios away from this tactic to maintain control & status quo.

Since the chance of financial failure is quite high and most studios especially the new ones can't afford to risk the gamble.

This is also exacerbate with the current structure of the freelance animator market. Where by talent will follow the larger talent per say or work where they want. While other individuals burn out or stuck in limbo due to industry load increase, production cycle downtime, money and training.

So with talent in flux everywhere, majority of studios can't afford to make new successful IPs to strengthen themselves in the industry while providing decent wages.
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>>157413732
The European market is doomed. Muslims will soon turn it into a caliphate and impose Sharia law, making anime illegal.
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>>157413655

Then why? Seriously curious
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>>157413769
/pol/, pls
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>>157413651
As far as I can tell, the big reason that they don't 2d anymore is so that they can rapidly remake their movies and tweak things.
There's the stories of Pixar remaking Toy Story from scratch three times, and recently Disney redoing Frozen like a month out from its opening.
Once you have the 3d models, it's much easier to do things with them than it is to have to draw actually draw it out.
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>>157413651
The US market actually has a severe lack in manpower for competent 2D animators currently. Most of the good ones are old enough now to the point where they're mostly retired and don't do much work themselves, and the young blood are all flash-trained with little to no training or experience in professional-level 2D animation.

I say 'flash-trained' because I'm making the distinction here between 2D flash animation (the garbage effused by every current western 'animation studio') and non-flash 2D animation. Flash is bad but cheap, which is why it took over animation in the west, where the target audience is children.
>>
To those that think the western market has value, maybe you could give some insight into why?
Other than viewership numbers it's well known that the west doesn't have much of a culture of paying premium for stuff they want to own.
Streaming gives little money back unless you basically lock the market into using your service by either providing a better service than pirates or better quality. In the case of netflix and other streaming services it's easy to see why they started making money with that, but anime, manga, VNs and the like are very easy to obtain and consume. No service right now is better or easier than just straight up pirating anime.
Also, anime has always been a mostly long term revenue business model or promotional one. I.e. anime breaks even in a year, then makes money by the second or third year, even more, or it doesn't but it sells toys or the merch it's supposed to promote.
Such a model makes no sense in the west unless people start, en masse, buying BD seasons which cost between 100-500 bucks, in the west you see 50 buck seasons that come in DVD or a single BD, obviously shows what people are willing to pay over here.
Also, unless the same producers make sure that anime airing in the west is also supported by the same merch that japan has, then in the end no one is buying the merch it's supposedly promoting. What I mean is, if they make an anime promoting a LN, but the LN is not in english, what's the point? sell anime? of course not. And if it's a plamo commercial, or they intend to sell stationery, or goods in general, then that shit has to also be available, otherwise the anime alone can't carry that franchise by itself in sales in the west.
The west will always be an afterthought until the west starts dropping serious money into it, or the japs fully sell the whole package over here.
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>>157413654
>According to the report, the total market value of the anime industry in 2015 was 1.83 trillion yen (about US$18.1 billion)
>market value

Having a market value of $20 billion does not mean they make $20 billion a year.
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>>157413821
German here , its now against the law to watch anime in public because of sharia
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>>157413972
/thread
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>>157413948
>Flash is bad but cheap, which is why it took over animation in the west, where the target audience is children.
Flash took over because of Newgrounds.
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>>157412166
Just pay the animators less, use more CGI, and reuse footage.

That ought to cut costs down.
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>>157413384
True, even Hulu is probably more appropriate than Funimation, though I'm sure there'll have to be a way that they manage to survive if anime starts getting consolidated by media corporations
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>>157414090
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>>157413972
It feels more like there is a way to make money, they just haven`t figured it out yet. Just like the internet in general.
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>>157414109
Oh that reminds me.

Use more panning still shots with speed lines instead of actual animation.
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>>157414156
Oh, the Tezuka style again.
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>>157413732
The formula is honestly simple as fuck, and Hollywood is eventually gonna figure it out if Japan doesn't.

The problem with all these live action anime movies is that they're fucking live action. People like anime primarily because of the visuals, not the stories.

Just make anime with incredibly great production values and stories that are digestible to westerns, find a way to market it, and you'd probably make bank.
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>>157412166
Not our fault Japan is horrible at playing/understanding the market. They are too afraid to station in the US and instead rely heavily on third parties like CR which minimizes the profit, also they do not understand the most $ you should be spending is on advertizement.
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>>157412166

They have been churning out shitty 12 episode long adaptations for LN for years now. It's no surprised less and less people care. Not to mention streaming has become far more popular nowadays.
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>>157414313
It's pointless because westereners aren't used to paying $300-800 per series
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>>157412166
surprised it's not 90 percent

since that's how shit anime is
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>>157414348
You do realize that single-cour LN adaptations are far more profitable than doing an entirely original show, right?
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>>157413972
>the west doesn't have much of a culture of paying premium for stuff they want to own.
Appleshits and comics poke holes in this. People are paying $3-10 for a 20-50 page book with glossy paper stuffed with ads. Marvel/DC cannot get people to buy pulp paper anthologies like in Japan. People just don't want to buy it.
>but anime, manga, VNs and the like are very easy to obtain and consume
Only if you don't spend time on an internet forum. I'm constantly surprised that things like Netflix don't do a better job diffusing their anime to other parts of their recomendations. Like, there's just one ANIME tab, instead of also splitting things up into appropriate genres. Like, why not put action anime in with the action movies/tv series?
But people are definitely NOT buying physical things right now.

I think the issue is that Japan isn't marketing anime right to the West, so the West has no interest in consuming it. At least, to normal people.
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>>157413769
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kt7PChIvzac
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>>157414362
Wouldn`t it be much less if they did less shows per year and tried to reach a bigger audience instead of only niche?
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>>157413068
I'll break it down for you.
A japanese company reaches the western market in two ways.
A. expanding into the west and going through the government red-tape to establish their company, supply/distribution and everything there legally. This is expensive and a huge financial risk. Only big, wealthy and successful companies can afford to take this risk, and only when they have a product they feel reasonably certain will be in high demand, so there's some certainty their risk will be offset. Anime will never do this.

B. Sell licenses to distribute your product (essentially limited, contract-based partial ownership) to a western company that already has all this. In this case, the product has to be appealing enough that a western company will want to pay you for it. Most of the money from this method is earned by the actual selling of the license, a one-time, payout. Royalties are trivial.

The problem is that, while the niche western market that consumes anime is big enough relative to the japanese market to be valuable to the japanese, it's not big enough to be valuable to western distributors, so the demand among western companies to acquire anime licenses is virtually nonexistent.

This leaves the anime industry with no feasible way to profit off its western fanbase. The best way you can circumvent this, as a consumer, is to import blurays and other appealing merchandise related to franchises you enjoy. Working through the existing western licensing companies (eg. CR) by paying their subscriptions ensures almost no revenue will be kicked back to the industry itself, and perpetuates the present abusive system where licenses are devalued and redistributors coast on narrow profit margins while the industry gets almost nothing.
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>>157414388

I'm not saying they should do original shows. I'm saying they should go back to making a couple of 22-26 episode adaptations with some shorter ones in between. I see a lot of studios taking risks by constantly moving from LN to LN. I know that they don't really have much of a choice as to what they adapt or how long the cours are. I just think the industry as a whole has gone from adapting series to making really long commercials.
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>>157414470
Perhaps, the entire anime business model is broken as fuck, it's just that murricans are used to paying $20-50 dollar per series and aren't gonna embrace the hardcore otaku model any time soon
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>>157414362
Was there a reason behind such ridiculously high prices?
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>>157414362
That's the point of making stories that are digestible to westerns. Japanese animation + western story-writing would appeal to normies and children.
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>>157412384
Is the opposite actually, the Jews have developed shady techniques to maximize profit out of each movie which ends up in movies that are reported as "unprofitable" being actually very profitable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_accounting

https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/09/how-hollywood-accounting-can-make-a-450-million-movie-unprofitable/245134/
>>
Why so many doujins of Ema but not Aoi?
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>>157414546
Because dumbass Otakus are willing to spend that much.

Same reason basketball brand shoes like Jordans are outrageously expensive.
>>
>>157414540
Murricans need to understand that otaku pay that much for the posters and other goods that come with the discs, not the disc themselves.
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>>157414546
It's a vicious circle, they have to jack up the BD prices because they sell relatively few and they don't sell because non-hardcore otaku aren't willing to spend those ridiculous amount of money.

>>157414575
Even if they pander to normalfags and casuals it won't make any difference until Japan changes their retarded "put all the money upfront and hope to make it back with BD sales alone" mentality
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>>157414476
>subscriptions ensures almost no revenue will be kicked back to the industry itself, and perpetuates the present abusive system where licenses are devalued and redistributors coast on narrow profit margins while the industry gets almost nothing.
pretty much this


>>157414588
hmmm interesting
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>>157412166
I don't have the frame of reference to understand if this is actually that bad.
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>>157414771
It's not.
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>>157412285
Hopefully soon, VNs are superior in every way
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>>157414476
Isn`t the supply/distribution problem completely different since the internet?
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>>157412384
Source?
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>>157414423
Except comics are not successful any more. Marvel is begging people to read their comics. Individual issues used to move 100s of thousands, and now they're happy if they break 30k.
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>>157414688
>Even if they pander to normalfags and casuals it won't make any difference until Japan changes their retarded "put all the money upfront and hope to make it back with BD sales alone" mentality

That's why I said the west will probably figure out how to do it first because their business model isn't retarded.

Also, they're actually finally putting forth effort in trying to tap in to the western weeb market while Japan continually ignores the opportunity.
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>>157412166
So 3 in 4 are still making money. Not that bad desu
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>>157412166
>believing the jews
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>>157414546
Prices inflated quickly during the golden age of VHS because demand was insanely high. Basically, distributing VHS means ordering a set number to be produced as a one-time rollout. Those are then shipped to all participating stores, who each ordered a set number based on how much they think they will sell of it. From placing the order to produce a batch of VHS to them actually arriving in the stores to sell can be a lengthy process, which means it's largely predictive. You anticipate how much you will sell, and if you guess too low, you keep your fans waiting for quite some time before you can restock, leading to fan auctions and resellers boosting the price way up in the interim.

This lead to a very price-inflated business model. Physical copies are essentially a collector's item rather than simply a use-value commodity. When DVD's and BDs replaced VHS, price increased further because these have lower profit-margins than VHS. Broadcast-recording tools becoming commercially available (eg. PVR) means that owning a physical release has almost no intrinsic value outside of being a collectible, which pushes it even further towards the niche collectible business model with increasingly extravagant add-ons and extras. The need to increase the profit margin per sale obviously elevates as sales decline from the lack of use-value.

The result is 70k yen collector's edition box sets and all that other silly crap.
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>>157414313
I wouldn't be surprised if they start retooling romance anime/manga or something. They'd be incredibly cheap, and easy to adapt, I think.
But yeah, Hollywood just needs to find the right team, and they'll crack the code. Likely doing the exact opposite of whatever executive tries to do throw his dick around.
>>
>>157415137
So basically a Deadpool situation.
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>one in four
Do you even realize how small of an amount this is and it's completely normal? In any economic society some companies will make money and some will lose money.
Nothing is happening in the industry, it's the same as usual. Were you really surprised that one in four lose money?
>>
Just consider how many series there are in one season, and how few you watch. Not sure how it relates to the Japanese but it's probably somewhat similar there too. There's a lot of the anime equivalent for shovelware.
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>>157415273
Those Crunchyroll subscriptions won't sell themselves, goy.
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>>157415273
>implying anyone on /a/ knows jack shit about economics
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>>157415341
What the fuck are you even talking about?
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>>157415351
see
>>157412352
>>
>>157415137
The current hollywood business model is basically 'take a hunch of semi-competent randos for cheap, spend a tonne of money on a big name to attach for PR purposes then just scrape together a movie in editing from all the random shit'
There's no unified vision, no organization, no planning, no coordination, no leadership, nothing resembling creative control. It's a melting pot overseen by a disinterested committee uninvolved with film-making. They don't care about making 'good' movies or even decent ones. What they care about is just having something to put onscreen so they can attach a marketing campaign to it. It's all marketing, from top to bottom. It's an ad machine that has a proven-effective formula for getting people to spend money on movies, regardless of quality.

Anime and manga make mediocre subject matter simply because they're not marketable IPs to a mainstream western audience. If hollywood actually has to stop and worry about making a good film to get people to pay money on it, they'll say "fuck that" and make another Marvel universe spinoff instead. The only reason GitS exists is because hollywood recognizes the chinese are a profitable market and worth pandering to, something that was stumbled upon with the accidental success of Pacific Rim in china. Cracking the chinese market is the newest business meme in multimedia production, but all that will come about from it is more shitty IPs getting terrible adaptations that rely entirely on carefully targeted marketing strategies to sell a bad product to a mainstream audience.
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>>157415371
Who are you even quoting? I get that you're shitposting but I don't get it. You want me to think that CR premium would save the 1 out of 4 studios that's not making money?
>>
>average wages for an in-between animator come out to about 60,000yen ($540) a month. Animator Tetsuya Akutsu revealed he had once spent five hours on a frame for which he was paid 200yen (under $2).
>pay slave-tier salaries
>still lose money

How fucking incompetent are these people?
>>
>>157414897
That's more of a symptom of the comics being awful than them being too expensive. I've spent plenty of time looking at Comichron numbers, and it's just because Marvel has been retarded for the last few years. DC is doing well enough at the moment.
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Stop making trash yet expensive anime like re:FateClone and 5cm/sClone and learn to make anime that pleases japanese men. Or keep making that trash and crash, I really don't care.
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>>157415453
Alot of competition, it's amazing that 3/4 make good money. The 1/4 that's losing money are probably newer studios or just studios with bad management.
>>
>>157412659
Wait wut
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>>157415502
>one in four
>crash
>fate spinoffs didn't make money
The fuck kind of retard are you?
>>
>>157414345
It's not that they're too afraid, it's that they just don't care about what happens outside their part of the world.

Japanese people are insanely narcissistic and it's why they completely squandered their peak of global media influence in the 90s to the sad state it is today. They were the king of marketing video games and children shows 2 decades ago, but never attempted to monopolize their advantage and let the west creep in to their huge lead in millennial entertainment.
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>>157413770
Art, fame, shit like that.>>157413770
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>>157415432
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>>157415564
See: >>157414476
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>>157415603
>it was a joke dude sarcasm
>>
>>157415555
>25% in the red because shit doesn't sell
>animators don't get paid shit
>production keeps increasing
>no crash

>fate clone a.k.a. reeee:creators = fate spinoff
Nigger I don't even know what to say, buy a fucking mirror and go see a doctor I guess?
>>
>>157414848
Anime and Mango is still largely a physical media in Japan. Lots of DVDs and Blu Rays. It's a very materal hobbie there.
>>
75% of anime studios not losing money...
>>
>>157415670
>3/4 studios make money
>they are losing money
Do you honestly think 4/4 could make money?Are you actually retarded? And why do you think they have to make money on your moral terms?
>>
>>157415677
Then that is part of the problem.
>>
>>157415743
Dude, just stop. Holy shit.
>>
>>157415777
There is no problem.
>>
>>157412166
>linking to jewyroll
get the fuck out
>>
>>157413384
God I love this planet, desiding which company to be fearful of for fear of the things you enjoy getting assraped.
>>
>>157415670
25% on the red literally means that 75% is doing fine, goy.
>>
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>>157412166
In the short run or in the long run?
>>
>>157415833
Don't worry he thinks that 100% of companies in a market can all make money. He's a legit retard.
>>
>>157415833
It literally means that 75% is either making even or making some profit, learn to interpret the shit you read.
>>
This is a reminder that Munto is the only anime KyoAni lost money on in 14 years.
>>
>>157415857
How many companies are at a loss in a more competivtve field like Hollywood or LA movie making?
>>
>>157414423
Comics don't really sell anymore. That said, at least comics have the advantage of being from the west, so the culture and the reach of those products is simply bigger, unlike manga with terrible licenses, almost no reach or market penetration, zero publicity, etc. Comics do still have an advantage there, but like said before, they don't really sell anyway, Marvel/DC live now from licensing the names to other shit.
>Only if you don't spend time on an internet forum
I don't get what you mean. Anime, manga, and the likes are very easy to consume online, pirated, thanks to the system we have to pirate it, that's what's meant with obtain and consume. Illegal streaming sites, illegal online readers, are super easy to use, easier than netflix like you said. Due to this, even dedicated weeb platforms like crunchyroll have zero advantage over pirating. There's no practical argument favoring using a paid service instead of pirating, simple as that.
Also, like you mentioned, anime is seen as a whole genre/package. That's also a cultural problem, because how can you tell the west that it's ok to see anime the same way they do their regular tv? It's a niche hobby in the west, which personally I'm ok with otherwise it would end up being just western cartoons or western tv by the end of it and that defeats the purpose.
But yeah, people just don't buy merch in the west. Cartoon merch is seen as a kids thing, and live tv like breaking bad and got also sells zero merch other than the DVD/BD boxes but their revenue comes simply from airing on tv or subscription models like hbo/netflix.

In the end my point is not to make an argument that the west has potential to be a market, I think it doesn't have to, or needs to be one, the monetary return isn't worth it. Growing the market is not always healthy, especially when you need to create one artificially.
>>
>>157415900
Nichijou flopped.
>>
>>157415833
Also 1/4 companies says nothing for market share.
If sunrise was losing money, you might have cause for concern, but those 25% of companies likely constitute the bottom of the barrel in-between outsourcing studios who share among them less than 1% of the market's net worth.

In reality, most of that value is concentrated into a few big companies, and 25% of startups failing means that roughly 75% of startups are succeeding, which reflects healthy industry growth.

This is a case of a website reporting information in an intentionally misleading manner, in order to suggest something opposite to what is actually true in order to push an agenda. CR wants to advance an argument that the industry is ailing economically because they present themselves as the only viable solution a western fan can contribute towards.
>>
>>157413260
>Disneyshit
No, thanks.

>Funi
I wouldn't mind.

>Netflix
Eeeeeeeeeh?!
>>
>>157414897
And yet DC heroes are getting more human and it is crushing Marvel.
the problems with Marvel Comis are:
Forced diversity
Editor have no job
Writters being too powerful
Writter don't even have enough cultural bagage to write a good story and characters. Everyones is more assholeish than ever. things started going in this direction during Civil War and Dark Reing
Events out of the ass. And most of those events don't make sense for any reader with knowledge of marvel universe. Civil War 2 was made to cash-in of the movie hype. it was atrocious. They ignored that their is a bunch of characters that can see the future outside Ulisses.
characters that are "The Solution button to fix this mess we made in the story" is either dead, outside universe or turned into a watcher (forced to only watch and not interfere).
Characters' personaities are being assassinated. Developments of the characters made in decades are being thrown out the window. people are hating the super heroes they loved.
They keep blaming everyone for their lack of sales. The fans, Straight males, DC, The market; literal use of "the world is wrong not me" logic.
>>
>>157414476
Except there was one massive fucking outlet that they could have bypassed western corporations in foreign marketing. The Internet.

The Internet didn't really get completely big until the turn of the century, and not even existing giant corporations knew how to tame it. Tech Companies like Google, Facebook, Twitter, and Amazon were completely new start-ups. Not extensions of existing corporations.

Japan could have absolutely jumped on that Internet as a means to sell to western audiences directly. Hell, 4chan was just a copy of 2chan, yet 4chan is more popular than ever because it continually evolved and updated its functions while 2chan is a dead piece of shit, and nips mostly use western social media sites now like YouTube and Twitter instead of Nico and 2ch.

Japan fucked their opportunity to market to the west despite experiencing a global popularity peak in their media at the absolute right opportunity to solidify it.
>>
>>157415976
Initially, yes. Long-term, no. Total Vol. 1 sales of Nichijou = 7,020. Clearly profitable in the long term.
>>
>>157412905
As dumb as that sounds that star wars novel is getting a manga and maybe a show so who really know.
>>
>>157416004

>Funi
>I wouldn't mind

>shitty fucking hardsubs with memes
>can't even fucking downscale properly to 720p so 720p releases look like fucking shit

Funi is fucking terrible m8.
>>
>>157416067
super heroescomics are all shit, name one DC or Marvel comic that has good writing.
>>
>>157413260
Kyoani is the Disney of Japan, so they'll get mouse'd.
>>
>>157416067
>Developments of the characters made in decades are being thrown out the window. people are hating the super heroes they loved.
Isn`t DC doing that on the movies? I heard people really dislike the new Superman and Batman.
>>
>>157416273
Nah, the stuff CR got from them looks good, so I guess it's their player that is shit, not their mastering skills.
>>
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>>157416324
>Kyoani is the Disney of Japan
>>
>>157416214
>nips mostly use western social media sites now like YouTube and Twitter instead of Nico and 2ch
Citation needed.
>>
>>157416214
Well, you do know Japan is stuck forever in super old internet right?
They don't know how to use that market because they aren't even up to date with the western standard internet.
I mean, even the west has no idea, we only have very few successes, but the west still has more success right now with the modern internet than japan has had.
Also, even the western successes don't know how to properly capitalize their market. It's not as easy as it sounds.
>>
>>157416356
>their player
Does Horriblesubs directly rip the file from Funi or do they screen capture it? If the former, no, Funi's player is not involved here.
>>
>>157415257
The problem is that Deadpool is only a formula for other Deadpool-like films. Iron-Man was a formula movie.
>>
>>157416390
Heresay from somebody on /jp/, and the board is autistic enough that I trust them about esoteric shit like that.
>>
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>>157415422
I only hope Hollywood abandons manga/anime adaptations completely. They are doing a disservice for everybody: otaku, non-otaku, themselves.
>>
>>157416390
2ch is slow as fuck outside of airing days. Or at least the one thread I'm following is, anyway.
>>
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>>157416575
>using /jp/ as a reliable source
Anon, there is no hope for you.
>>
>>157415966
What I mean is that, my brother who is successful and watches tons of HBO and iTunes and Netflix, would never think to google for nyan.pantsu or kissmanga or whatever. Most normal people aren't going do go that step because they don't know it exists. If it's not on those kind of sites/channels/apps, it might as well not exist to them. It's a distribution problem, mostly. People don't know they want something because they don't know it exists.
>people just don't buy merch in the west
Interestingly, this is apparently the big moneymaker for what's left of the comic book shops. Those funko dolls and t-shirts are so goddamn popular it's stupid. The comics basically cover themselves, but the stores can eat merch sales as almost all profit.
>>
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>>157416214
>Japan is stuck in the mud and refuses to change with the times
Whaaaaat?? No fucking way.
>>
>>157416831
But does your successful brother know of Crunchyroll and Daisuki.net ?
>>
>>157415890
As I said, they are doing fine.
>>
>>157416392
The difference is, people in the west like m00t for example were willing to fascinate themselves and take from Japanese internet culture, while Japan was reclusive to learning from western internet culture.

English is the Lingua Franca, yet there are more English speaking western weebs that try and learn Japanese just to watch anime without subs than there are nips that try to learn English for a far bigger magnitude of uses.
>>
>>157416932
>>157416932
No of course not. If the Nips want to make anime viable to the West, they need to double down on things with large built in normal people communities like Amazon and Netflix. Get it off the niche sites, and into mainstream.
I'm not saying it would be a good thing, but that's what they would need to do.
>>
>>157416390
http://www.alexa.com/topsites/countries/JP
>>
>>157417006
>English is the Lingua Franca, yet there are more English speaking western weebs that try and learn Japanese just to watch anime without subs than there are nips that try to learn English for a far bigger magnitude of uses.
How can you possibly know that?
>>
>>157412621
Since when is Misaki a lawyer?
>>
>>157415535
advertising is never listed in production costs
>>
>>157417023
>I'm not saying it would be a good thing, but that's what they would need to do.
I can't see platform diversification for anime as a good thing either. I think they are trying to do this with Amazon now (noitaminA has exclusive streaming rights partnership with Amazon, for example) - enjoy your double paywall!
>>
>>157414066
>Newgrounds
You mean XiaoXiao
>>
the western world is going to shit thought, just wait 30 or 40 years and it will be all about the middle east, rusia and asia
>>
>>157412166
Maybe this will force some studios to take risks so they don't keep churning out the same shit.
>>
>>157417025
For such a shitty looking site 2ch is very high.
>>
>>157413770
Jews money laundering industry.
>>
>>157412166
>crunchyroll
Kill yourself
>>
>>157415422
>the accidental success of Pacific Rim in china
I still don't understand the Chinese market, frankly. I remember everyone saying that China is always an afterthought because the studios would get such little back from foreign ticket sales.
I guess the mega-hits cross the breakeven now that they make so much.
>>
>>157416346
Not him, but Marvel movies are doing well, DC is being retarded with them. However, we're talking about the comics here. Marvel did such retarded shit as making Captain America a Hydra sleeper agent all along, despite the fact that Hydra is literally nazis and Captain America the character was created specifically as an icon to beat the shit out of nazis. The first appearance of the character had him punching Hitler in the face on the cover. To say that the writer turned his back on the entire comic run is to put it mildly. And he GLOATED about it on Twitter. And this is normal Marvel comic behaviour, these days. They just had to fire another writer for putting in islamist propaganda against an Indonesian secularist.
>>
>>157412288
Fuck you.
>>
>>157412166
Anime and manga will continue to exist even if it boils down to 100 fans because the creators produce it for the love of it.
>>
>>157417372
>because the creators produce it for the love of it.
There are people this dumb on /a/. You can't make this up
>>
>>157417390
>nobody would ever draw comics if there wasn't a chance for profit
>people don't make art for fun
There are people this dumb on /a/. You can't make this up.
>>
>>157417447
Manga will exist because it's cheap as fuck. Anime is not dipshit.
>>
>>157417497
That has nothing to do with your original post you stupid fuck. Organize your thoughts and then come back and talk.
>>
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>>157417497
>>157417528
Get a room already.
>>
>>157417528
>Anime and manga will continue to exist
Reread yours you fucking moron. The idea that the creators of anime produce it for the love of it is hillarious
>>
>>157416346
Movie DC universe is just being ruined by constantly forcing a diferent atmosphere and going too serious or too teenager bait (suicide squad).
>>157416320
fine I'll bite. Xmen God Loves Man Kills. Batman The Killing Joke
>>157416324
that would be Bandai Namco no? Bamco is in
everything
>>
>>157417563
>i got into animation because i wanted a stressful low paying career with long hours and strict deadlines

Said nobody ever.
>>
>>157417054
Simple observations? Using basic deductive reasoning?

Take flag boards on 4chan as an example. Japan has a population of 127 million people, yet native fluent English speaking Japanese posters are obscenely rare compared to the vast majority of other countries that don't speak English, and many of those countries are not even close to as developed as Japan.

It's incredibly apparent on /int/, and even other South East Asians countries attest to how narcissistic Japanese people are. They have very little interest of what goes on outside of their hemisphere, and that's also historically been a problem with Southeast Asia.

It's just obvious. It's not a coincidence that they experienced their global media peak a few decades after the US straight up forced them to open up to the west after essentially imperializing then following WW2.
>>
>>157416390
>>157416575
>>157416802
>>157416764
>>157417025
>>157417224
There were 16 threads, 1000 posts, each in less than a day when Nyaa died though on 2channel.
>>
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So which studios are most likely losing money?

Besides Bones I mean
>>
>>157417684
PA Works
>>
>>157417684
Kyoani and Trigger aren't getting their money back.
The ones that make money are DEEN and JC Staff for not putting all their eggs in one basket. Low risk low reward
>>
>>157417653
Have it crossed your mind that perhaps the Japanese don't want to hang around on that shitty board and simply discuss their interest somewhere else? Or maybe they are just more passive and want to learn English to consume content without contributing?
>>
>>157417001
t. never owned a business
>>
>>157417776
Trigger will just do another kickstarter campaign.
>>
>>157417776
Kyoani posts profits every year
>>
>>157417683
Why would 2ch even need nyaa for a reason other than sukebei?
>>
>>157417653
I'm with you anon, I think you are right, but that kind of reasoning it's ok if you live in Greece in the 700 BC
>>
>>157417776
Doesn't KyoAni have some of the lowest production costs in the industry or is that just a meme?
>>
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>>157412357
This really made me think
>>
>>157417865
They always use the least amount of animators per show so probably
>>
>>157417865
Probably true since the do so much of the work in house rather than having to farm parts out to other studios.
>>
>>157417776
Trigger has the same problems Gainax had (surprise), where they've got talented people without the business sense to get through a whole project without production hiccups.
>>
>>157417923
>>157417940
Makes sense, I've heard that simply not being located in the middle of Tokyo saves them a lot of money as well.
>>
>>157417940
Studios farm out their animation to Korea BECAUSE it's cheaper. Doing it in house is expensive
>>
>>157417954
Isn't it Vietnam and China recently?
>>
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>>157417819
This.
https://twitter.com/erkin_kawabata/status/589384655796731904
>Budget for KyoAni shows is nothing special, in fact is below average
Every KyoAni anime but Munto has either essentially equalled (Phantom World came within 100 sales IIRC) or broken the Manabi line, and their budgets are below average because they use small but very talented staffs and don't base out of expensive Tokyo.
>>
>>157417791
Hey, you're the one sperging about 25%.
>>
>>157417787
This is just one of those things that you can't absolutely prove or bring up statistical research for because it's a subject that is hardly purposeful.

You have to connect the dots and make your own assumptions.
>>
>>157417984
>Manabi line
Jesus we're not still using this benchmark are way? It's old and it was bullshit back then.
>>
>>157417954
KyoAni has salaried employees instead of paying by the frame IIRC. They don't have to pay their employees as much as employees working in Tokyo because the cost of living in Kyoto is much lower.
>>
>>157413042
It is
>>
>>157417984
Huh? IBO had so many key animators and still looked below average.
>>
>>157418007
Stop using words that you don't know the meaning of.
>>
>>157418050
A ton of key animators is usually a sign that something went wrong, I've been told.
>>
>>157412288
This. It actaully was.

No one cares about your anime industry. Those little inside jokes may be fun to write about but I yawned out. Having cute girls doesn't fix everything btw.
>>
>>157412821
Love Live's success isn't from yuri pandering, it's from pop music.
>>
>>157418032
>You have to connect the dots and make your own assumptions
Which may be completely off the mark and lead you astray.
>>
>>157418050
Typically having lots of animators on an episode indicates a rushed production as the work has to be split among more animators in order to meet deadlines.
>>
>>157418073
Really? Haikyuu S3 had as many animators as IBO and it looked great.
>>
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>>157417776
>KyoAni has literally never lost any money and made profit every year according to their financial report
>NO GUYS I SWEAR KYOANI IS TOTALLY GOING DOWN BECAUSE THEY NEVER BREAK EVEN
>NO GUYS THEY'RE PUTTING THEIR EGGS IN ONE BASKET EVEN THOUGH THEY PUBLISH LN AND EXPAND
This is you, including capslock. An annoying literal nigger that decides to spam the same shit every fucking thread. Every fucking thread. Are you not tired of this, just go watch anime instead of pulling retarded shit out of your ass on a daily basis.
>>
>>157418143
>KYOANI WILL FAIL, THEY CAN'T KEEP MAKING MOESHIT AND GETTING AWAY WITH IT
>said increasingly nervous /v/ermin for the 17th time this month
>>
>>157418050
You dont plan on having a ton of key animators. You end up with them because you fuck up and run out of time and have to farm parts out all over the place, which leads to varying degrees of quality.
>>
They just need to make good anime like SnK and Berserk. Harems with spineless beta MCs need to be eliminated
>>
REMINDER THAT KYOANUS LITERALLY CAN'T DRAW HANDS
>>
>>157418231
isn't the mc of snk a fucking beta thought ?
>>
>>157418207
I see. So what's the industry standard for the number of key animators studios plan to deploy?
>>
>>157417107
yes it is you fuckwit.
>>
>>157418234
WOW! IT... looks like a hand.
>>
>>157418234
I just held my own hand in front of my face in that pose and it looks pretty much like that. You're an idiot, but you already made that clear by saying kyoanus.
>>
>five hours for 200 Yen

This is worse than slave children in China.
>>
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Why don't other studios just make money like Kyoani?
>>
>>157418343
Kyoani has it's own distinct style which has a devoted fanbase and we can't have 30 studios churning out Kyoani-like content.
>>
>>157418234
>objectively incorrect opinion
>downloaded 720p version of KyoAni's first full 1080p series like an idiot
Color me surprised.
>>
>>157418460
Coalgirls 720p is equivalent to a standard 1080p release.
>>
>>157412834
Maybe have some more major studios outside of Tokyo where it is one of if the most expensive places to live in Japan
>>
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>>157412166
Soon they will realize that anime is just a money laundering scheme.
>>
>>157418420
>and we can't have 30 studios churning out Kyoani-like content.
Sounds like a challenge to me!
>>
>>157418563
Yeah, I don't understand the drive to centralise everything.
>>
>>157413384
>You should be more fearful of Amazon

Why?
>>
>>157418563
>>157418624
>durrr why did all the tech companies go to silicon valley
That's not how it works. It just ends up making more sense to go to where everyone else is
>>
>>157418649
Double paywall.
>>
>>157418101
Don't then, I don't care. You're far better off making premature assumptions about things using incomplete but intuitive knowledge than you are only making assumptions about things with perfect knowledge. There is nothing wrong with being wrong as long as you learn from it.
>>
>>157418624
It's more convenient when everyone's in the same spot.
>>
>>157418651
It makes sense in an industry like technology where you're constantly contracting other companies in the area
>>
>>157418687
KyoAni somehow manages in Kyoto. How much are studios willing to pay for this convenience anyway? Is it really worth it?
>>
>>157418649
They have far more money than any other competition, so they could afford to pay huge amounts for licenses and take losses while building up a monopoly.
>>
>>157418420
>Kyoani has it's own distinct style
drawing sameface across every series isnt exactly distinct
>>
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>>157418788
(You)
>>
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>>157412166
if we're going to give money to the industry, we'll give it directly to the japanese, buying the originals and not the american versions.

fuck off, crunchyfag
>>
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>>157418788
'Style' is more than drawings, anon-chan.
>>
>>157414476
>A. expanding into the west and going through the government red-tape to establish their company...
Consider the following:
Nowadays what we have mostly in anime is your option B: selling licenses. So what about instead of making a full branch of their company in the US, they make a subsidiary (correct me if this is not the right term) or they fund a smaller company that works like Funi or ADV or something like that and sell the licenses to them instead to a total stranger, in that way you have 2 companies both making money for you instead of getting scraps from the licensees.
>b-b-b-b-but one campany cant afford that
then talk to other companies and form a keiretsu like group and fund (maybe with goverment funding) such company.
I dont know, maybe what I just said is a stupid idea, but it seems to me the japanese arent thinking hard enough about this, and relying on the streaming for making money is a losing proposition or not as potentially beneficial to them.
Im amused that other japanese business are heavily diversified (like konami or sony), yet, anime tries to rely on its only product and depending on strangers to "expand"
>>
>>157418732
KyoAni are big enough to be self-sustainable though. They're not the only studio located outside of Tokyo of course, GoHands is in Osaka and PA Works in Toyama but they've also reached a certain level of self-sufficiency. The handful of other non-Tokyo studios are typically branches like Ufotable's Tokushima studio or Liden Films Kyoto.

The typical studio would rely on freelancers and other studios for support work like CGI and composite, so being in Tokyo among other studios would help with getting work done. It doesn't help that lots of key animation is done on paper so work needs to be moved around physically hence having staff and studios in one location would help.
>>
>>157418931
>It doesn't help that lots of key animation is done on paper
Still?
>>
>>157418997
Yeah, it's still common though digital animation is slowly picking up. Studios just need to overcome the high setup and training costs, so larger studios so far have been able to transition to digital. OLM have been doing it for Pokemon Sun & Moon for instance, though the show still isn't entirely animated digitally.
>>
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>>157414476
yes and no
if the final product in the west (CR) is a shitty one (aka: streaming at a lower quality, having to pay a subscription but receive less than netflix, bad or americanized translations, DVD missing special content or limited edition items) then, I rather not contribute to the west and see directly what japan has to offer.

plus, why stream when you can "keep" the episode with you ?
>>
>>157418651
It's a safer option, but not always the best one. There are a certain risks and rewards involved, and Japan is absolutely horrible about not taking risks.

I think most people can safely assume Silicon Valley wont be the global leader in Tech development forever, but the question is who will actually replace them? People are not oblivious to trends, and for instance, when Austin, TX started attracting an abnormal amount of start up talent, housing prices in the city skyrocketed to one of the highest in the US.
>>
>>157418931
>PA Works
One of the best non-KyoAni studios. Maybe there's something to this whole not working out of Tokyo thing.
Doga Kobo might be Godly if they moved out of Tokyo.
>>
>>157419413
PA Works seem to be unable to attract and grow talented animators to work for them though. Their shows are pretty mediocre in terms of production values save for a handful.
>>
>>157419495
NagiAsu was fucking beautiful.
>>
>>157418997
Funnily enough, a lot of the outsourced to the Philippines stuff is all digital.
>>
>>157414546
son't no the validity but I have seen some people say that in the 80s-90s studios where basically just making OVAs and selling them to video rental type places like the old blockbuster stores in the US which is why there where quiet expensive. However they failed to realize how dedicated (crazy) otakus where to some series and they weren't expecting them to go out and buy the actual OVAs, and ever since them they basically decided since there is a dedicated group that will buy there anime and such high price, why lower it.
>>
>>157415535
with jews you lose.
>>
>>157419525
That was due to the background art though, not the animation.
>>
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>>157419539
Top kek. Outsource a high tech job to a third world country. Oh Japan.
>>
Japan is kill. They destroyed themselves by exponentially pandering to an audience that is niche but loyal instead of trying to expand their consumer demographic using a lower profit margin but larger long term rewards.

90s anime was consumed by normies in Japan, but they stupidly pigeon-holed themselves in to appealing to a smaller and smaller but more immediately profitable demographic until the entire business model became irreversibly cancerous.

The Anime industry is in a bubble that is on course for explosion.
>>
>>157413770
Bluepilling the masses.
>>
>>157418651
I wasn't implying they move to bum fuck no where just outside of the city limits so it cheaper, and while yes silicon valley is the main place for tech companies, its not the only place to go where as anime studios its basically tokyo or bust.
>>
>>157417827
Most series airs very late.
>>
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>>157419881
Japan will find a way. You're wgetting worked up over nothing.
>>
>>157420127
Shut up Avilio your anime flopped hard
>>
>>157418460
>KyoAni's first full 1080p
I'm pretty sure it was only the OP/ED for that.
>>
>>157420030
Recorders are a standard with a TV these days.
>>
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>>157412166
>studios doing westernpandering shit are going down
So what's the problem again?
>>
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>>157420167
All to prove your point of Japan having shit taste.
>>
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>pander to gaijin
>expand the audience
Don't do this please. Culling the herd will do good.
>>
>>157413063
Madhouse
>>
>>157420401
Why?
>>
>>157420173
Nope. When anibin says "955.5p" for a KyoAni anime, that means it's full 1080p. KyoAni's use of AfterEffects fucks up anibin's lineart measuring thingie. They're working in full 1080p in this behind the scenes screenshot from the Chuu2 BDs.
>>
>>157419881
Question is, when does it happen, who survives the bubble, and how does it change the course of the industry?

Anime is literally geared towards making a profit off of people who don't procreate, are anti-social and single, and also have lots of disposable income to buy overpriced merchandise. That is a retarded long term business plan especially as Japan has finally started to redirect their national trend of young people having less and less kids.
>>
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>>157420173
>>157420440
Also, it's obvious their anime are full 1080p just going by the eye test. I've seen enough anime studio bicubic upscales to know what upscaled anime lineart looks like. This is not upscaled. Look at the eyelash detail. That's full 1080p.
>>
>>157413972
>doesn't have much of a culture of paying premium for stuff they want to own
>Apple watches are a thing
>>
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>mfw Kyoani
>>
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>>157420635
>>
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>anime studios are losing money, stop torrenting anime and start giving us money to save anime studios!
>>
>>157420441
Anime will be targeted at retirees now.
>slice of life/medical insurance drama
>How I Reluctantly Decided To Trade Shares For A Living But Opened The Gates To Another Dimension In The Process??
>more anime around chess, go, karuta, shogi whatdoyouhave
>>
>>157420711
>slice of life/medical insurance drama
I actually kinda like this idea.
>>
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Reminder that Bones is an "in the red studio"
>>
>>157420837
How do you know?
>>
>>157420865
By reading their financial report.
>>
>>157418036
Kyoani really is the exception to most rules but their structure is very unique.
>outside of Tokyo
>salaried animators
>animation school let's them keep it in house
>>
>>157420914
Do post the link.
>>
>>157420431
probably still trying to recover from when Maruyama almost drove the studio to close down before leaving (some speculate Nippon Television pressured him to do so) and founding MAPPA
>>
>>157421007
It was just in another one of these "every small studio is losing money except kyoani" threads a while ago, let me see if I can find it.
>>
>>157414810
Except for the whole animation part.
>>
>>157421092
>Maruyama almost drove the studio to close down before leaving
For what purpose?
>Nippon Television pressured him to do so
This defies all logic.
>>
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It's definitely not KyoAni.

Especially when they finally adapt Keit-ai.
>>
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>>157414810
>VNs are superior in every way
>>
>>157421170
I think he meant 'superior in every way to hentai anime'.
>>
>>157420711
Retirees are a shit demographic though. That's why Fox News is in such turmoil right now and attempting to completely reinvent themselves to appeal to younger viewers. Even omitting the fact that they're on the edge of death and obviously not sustainable, they simply don't spend as much money as people who are 21-54.

The anime industry will either have to quickly change the direction of their revenue model, or experience a total implosion. Why would people have any confidence in investing in an industry that is gonna become continually harder to make a profit in? It's not like studios are rolling in money to begin with.
>>
>>157421155
Because they didn't animate Kon's last project or something.
>>
>>157414810
This is some /pol/ tier shitposting.
>>
>>157421245
How does this connect to closing down Madhouse? Somebody got salty over Kon?
>>
>>157421239
They can sit glued to the screen all their waking hours 7 days a week though.
>>
>anime panders to otaku neets that don't have the money to support the industry
Gee I wonder why.
>>
>>157421155
Basically Maruyama would green light anything he found cool/interesting regardless if it would sell or not and when Nippon Television bought most of Madhouse's stock (think it was around 85-95%) they didn't really agree with Maruyama's approach hence the speculation to whether or not they forced him out, or he left on his own.
>>
>>157418914
Yes, that's Aniplex of America. Despite everyone in the West bitching about their prices they're doing quite well for themselves.
>>
Here's a thought: stop producing garbage.
>>
>>157421007
>>157421112
Looks like I misremembered, they were in the red until very recently.

>>151305096
>>
>>157421417
I see. RIP Madhouse, you were a good studio.
>>
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>>157421468
>Kyoanus only produces garbage
>produces boatloads of money
>>
>>157412166
At what point did anime become a medium for just getting your dick hard?
>>
>>157421468
Not gonna happen until the every studio actually gets financially punished for it. Absolutely no foresight is currently happening in the anime industry, and its astonishing that more and more studios are popping up in an industry that is continually shrinking in revenue source.

It's like the Housing crisis except we can observe it in real time in the context that we know they are digging their own grave.
>>
>>157421520
Madhouse will still survive since Nippon Television has made the studio its subsidiary, but the chance of it pumping out numerous works there aren't expected to make a profit the same way under Maruyama is slim at best.
>>
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>>157421694
The internet ruined me. Even the most purest, non sexual shows get me hard.
>>
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>>157421694
/a/ is the wrong place to fix your dick problems, try /h/ or /e/
>>
>>157421694
I don't know, but I love it.
>>
>>157421827
So they will be making 1 show every 2-3 years?
>>
>>157421427
Protip: doing well right now doesn't mean they are going to do well forever. The anime industry model is so fucked up. People have been saying forever that it's headed in a stupid direction, and it's beginning to show cracks of that.
>>
>>157419918
>>157417240
crossboarder go home
>>
>>157421694
Sometime in the 80s.
>>
>>157420635
Kyoto Animation will live for 1000 years
>>
Mods = Gods
>>
>>157422047
>Flopayashi
>>
>>157421893
It means they'll be called on to shill a shitty LN every 2-3 years.
>>
>>157413260
would be pointless, studios can die at the drop of a hat and the staff will just go and start up a new on, if Disney bought Kyoani for a billion they could use that money to move to a new studio called Anikyo and Disney would be fucked because unlike every other kind of business Anime studios don't really thrive on previous properties some don't even own any, all they make is just borrowed series from somewhere else.
>>
>>157422251
If they bought a studio they would simply make all the valuable talent sign contracts with non-compete clauses
>>
>>157421893
they still make shows, this all happened back in 2011. What it boils down to is
>No more movies like redline that were in production for 10 years
>No more manga adaptations from mangaka like Urasawa and Fukumoto
>More LN adaptations
>>
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>>157422225
>more garbage like Mahouka incoming
/a/ sings a dirge for Madhouse when?
>>
>People surprised that the amount of studios that aren't profitable isn't higher

It's a cash now industry. The fact that any significant percentage of the industry is losing money is terrible. It'd be one thing if they were losing money taking risks, but studios in the anime industry are losing money DESPITE their complete aversion to risk-taking. That spells doom.
>>
Remember when Gonzo wasn't all bad?
>>
>>157422296
impossible, to many animators work half a dozen concurrent jobs at any given time, you coudn't make a contract like that without it being broken immediatly.
>>
>>157422404
Yeah, what happened to them? Gainax had tax evasion shenanigans, but does Gonzo have an excuse?
>>
>>157412166
hopefully they stop releasing much trash and put more effort in only a bunch
>>
>>157420175
Something else that is standard: the internet.
>>
>>157422251
You do know Disney once had a Japanese studio before splitting off to become independent in 2004, right?

Also TMS has been doing Anpanman & Conan for years now and Sazae-San has been running for decades now.
>>
>>157422451
Bad with money, shows didn't sell well, general administrative incompetency.
>>
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>>157422382
What studios besides Kyoani are taking risks?
>>
>>157422524
a good example of why it mostly doesn't work, with the exceptions of companies that get their money from the name of the shows they make instead of what they make then yeah I can understand, Toei does this big time and even though they can't make anime for shit they still make big money, but the studios that function the way are few and they're value is in their copyrights not in their work/animation capabilities.
>>
>>157422547
Yeah, but hasn't enough time passed for them to fix those issues? If you make a bad investment, then you try to cover your loss with a good one?
>>
>>157422578
Shaft started out by taking risks but now it would be risky to be normal so it's hard to say where they stand.
>>
>>157422578
MAPPA
Wit
Toei (believe it or not)
>>
>>157416908
they're changing to much for my comfort desu
>>
>>157422524
Disney, just like most major media corporations are probably banking on an implosion of the anime industry so they can come in and buy it up at a much cheaper price. It's obviously unsustainable. What amount of premature action they're taking before it's collapse is trying to undermine it outright with live action moves using popular anime/manga scripts. If it falls, everyone will scramble to fill the void.
>>
Reading this thread I am glad I stopped watching anime regularly and stick to reading manga. I'd feel pretty bad knowing my hobby is hostage to archaic business practices and stupidity and could come to an end in the first recession we encounter.

But thinking about it more calmly, maybe that's the reason I don't watch it anymore, it's been some time now since there's been anything interesting that didn't come from a manga and I'm just not interested anymore. And, as has been pointed out, that's probably a symptom, where only niche pandering anime survives and originals are just too big of a risk to be made.
>>
>>157412166
Fuck crunchyroll the best way to support the anime is buy the Japanese Blu-ray's or manga.
>>
>>157422894
>subjecting yourself to THAT
It's probably best if you manage to kickstart some company desu. Take a couple of friends, gather some cash, and go to japan to their jobs right.
>>
Good, can't wait until Japan goes fully bankrupt, its demographics collapse

oh wait
>>
>>157422815
>I'd feel pretty bad knowing my hobby is hostage to archaic business practices
And you think Manga is not held to these? Don't be deluded. Get off your high horse, idiot.
>>
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>>157415422
> something that was stumbled upon with the accidental success of Pacific Rim in china
Are you sure about that?
>>
>>157415422
>something that was stumbled upon with the accidental success of Pacific Rim in china.
That's bullshit. Hollywood had been eyeing Chinese markets since years before Pacific Rim premiered.
>>
>>157422171
>4K
Not a flop, but not great, either.
>>
>>157423158
literally chink shit.
>>
>>157423035
>Get off your high horse, idiot.
You shouldn't get triggered this easily, it's hysteria. But, as far as I know, manga business is in much better condition. It's sold in magazines, not in BD 4 chapters every 2 months for hundreds of dollars, and there's lots being published all the time, including new and interesting stuff, which is why I still read it.

Of course there are also problems, but overall it's in much better shape.
>>
>>157412166
Let me guess: cr blames piracy and advertises themselves as the solution
>>
>>157417184
>rusia and asia

>implying that's a good thing
>>
>>157423274
atleast the american scum will finally die.
>>
>>157419143
Did you read the post you're responding to? It says explicitly to avoid places like CR
>>
>>157417684
Sunrise is losing creative influence
>>
>>157412166
>make shitty anime
>wonder why it doesn't sell
>Japan takes forever to release stuff to DVD, even in their own country
>Japan blocking streaming, preventing them from getting dat youtube/stream money
>the only series that make fat stacks are the ones that are easily commercialized (like K-On, Love Live etc that shit had promotions in every store) or kids shows (like Conan, Purikua)
Smart.jpg
>>
>>157413340
>Disney doesn't seem to care about 2d animation anymore. Unless it's cheap TV shit.
And what's seasonal anime if not that?
>>
>>157423441
>Japan blocking streaming
Wrong, there are plenty of streaming services in Japan that show anime. People in the industry acknowledge that BD sales aren't as important as they used to. Streaming, merchandise, and live events are the main revenue streams going forward.
>>
>>157423410
They haven't had creative influence since Bandai bought them

Remember when Bandai cucked Tomino and told him to air episodes of Victory out of order so a gundam would appear in the first episode
>>
>>157423441
>wonder why it doesn't sell
but kaion sells good.
>>
>>157423441
But it's the shittiest animes that sell really well.
>>
>>157413948
God that makes me sad.
>>
>>157423797
Yes and no.
>Bakemonogatari
Good
>Madoka
Good
>love live
Shit
>Yuri on Ice
Shit
>Fate/Zero
Shit
>SnK
Shit
>K-ON
Good
>Haruhi
Good
etc.
>>
>>157424325
>bakemonogatari
>good
>>
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>>157424325
>Fate/Zero and SnK
Maybe you have a shit taste.
>>
>>157424325
>>Bakemonogatari
>Good
Stopped reading right there.
>>
>>157412166
This is another topic, I know, but I am seeing tons of people praising that Chinese cartoon about esport, saying it has Kyoani or Production IG level of animation, or also better. I can understand some Chinese being proud or something, but are they serious? Except for some fighting scenes, the animation is awful, really low budget, and the CGI is horrible. The drawings are often off.
>>
>>157421694
when cuttey honey was made.
>>
>>157417759
Silly on you, PA Works is living well with goverment shill's money
>>
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>>157424473
>liking fateshit
>liking snkshit
>>
>>157418036
Tokyo studios used Vietnam and China slaves for that, nigger
>>
Is it time to sell my anime stocks?
>>
>>157418196
stfu kyofag, you are pathetic
>>
>>157424722
No, sell them during the Olympics when it'll be at it's peak.
>>
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>>157422894
>mfw I bought KnK bluray from Kyoani's shop

Kyoani will live forever!
>>
>>157412872
But work more demanding hours?
>>
>>157412166
25% honestly isn't bad
>>
>>157424553
Anyone has an opinion about this?
>>
if kyoani did go down i would fly to japan and stab everyone on DEENS production staff to death
>>
>>157424811
>mfw bought it from Amazon

Hopefully will give them the hint to pick better source material to adapt
>>
>>157423621
I thought it was around 80s when Zeta Gundam came out when Bandai bought them out. They were more dead when Bones left Sunrise.
>>
Why did Ema-chan become a symbol of declining anime industry?
>>
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>>157412166
Ema a shit.
Aoi best girl.
>>
>>157425099
Because i will make her a single mom
>>
>>157425099
It's not so bad at all. Actually, the industry overall is doing well, economically
>>
>>157425099
memes
>>
>>157412621
Anime is basically whoring itself out to the superior LN medium. If this stops animu will simply die.
>>
tumblr influx redirecting people to /pol/ when big bad anons call crunchyroll jews.

nuke this board already.
>>
1/4 isn't even a bad ratio.
>>
>>157425766
Indeed
>>
>>157412166
Remember to stop pirating anime!
>>
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>>157421164
>KyoAni and Keit-Ai finds a way together

POTTERY.
>>
>>157421164
Already a thing.

https://www.fictionpress.com/s/3206139/1/Keit-AI-Tomoyuki-x-Seiko-Keit%E6%84%9B-%E5%A5%89%E6%96%87-x-%E8%81%96%E5%AD%90
>>
>>157413972
/thread
>>
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>>157424811
>mfw bought the wrong KnK
>>
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>>157421164
Kumiko Oumae falls in love with Reina Kousaka.

Unable to confess, Kumiko is gifted by a hibike ex machina with the girl's phone number. Never minding the strange area code, she immediately calls her, and is overjoyed to find out that she has a crush on her as well.

But, the next day, when she recounts the previous day's confessions to Reina, she only looks at her with a perplexed expression. After some investigation, she finds out that the girl she called is not the same girl she fell in love with. In fact, she doesn't exist in this universe at all. She is Reina's alternate universe counterpart, who has fallen in love with the MC's own AU self, who too is blissfully unaware of her crush.

Hijinks ensue as the two strike up a deal to give each other their darkest, most private secrets in order to equip the other with the weapons they need to conquer the heart of their other selves. While the two chase their respective loved ones, DRAMA ensues as they begin to fall in love with each other instead and question the NATURE of ADOLESCENCE.
>>
>>157414423
comics aren't selling and I'm not sure what you're trying to say with the second paragraph
>>
>>157412285
I doesn't have to be a crash. A contraction would help a lot.
>>
If anime death means that I will finally leave this place then yes, for the love of god, die anime.
>>
>studios

Most studios don't matter, they are funded and owned by big publishers and networks.
You make and buy your own I.P. and hope you make it big so you can cut your dependency to your slave masters and become a slave master yourself.
Toei, Ghibli, Khana and Kyoani are good example of the most successful studios.
>>
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>>157413034
Why the fuck would you want that? So we can see calls for niggers and spics in anime like what we see in Hollywood? So we can see Western cancer leak into anime?

Every shitty Amerifat in this thread can fuck right off.
>>
>>157412166
THIS IS A TRAVESTY!
Like >>157412357 said, 75% of anime studios should be losing money
>>
>>157425208
Pink Aoi is better.
>>
>>157418094
Thanks for letting us know you don't watch Love Live.
>>
>>157426697
Yeah, "pander" is a very strong word.

I'd conform with an upsurge in more avant-garde media coupled with a profitable, affordable distribution method for them (and us) in the States, so that neither the producers or consumers get fucked in the ass.

Kind of paradoxical at the moment, I'm aware, but someone's gotta find a better solution than what we get now, eventually.
>>
>>157416324
Madhouse is the one Disney contracted for the Stitch anime and all those Marvel shows nobody watched.
They'd likely be moused first.
>>
>>157424657
And the products often end up looking terrible as a result.
>>
>>157422451
They kept making shitty movies about sentient trees and shit.
>>
>>157426344
>implying you won't be stuck here well into the medium's zombie state like /m/ is about their genre
>>
>>157412621

Whether the industry makes more money or not, very VERY little of this money goes to studios or animators that are making the anime in the first place.

When /a/ pirates all this shit they are very much hurting the large pool of animators trying to live in Tokyo doing a job that literally none of us are thanking them for.

Anime may make more money than ever, but very few people are actually making THAT money and literally everyone else gets fucked because of it
>>
>>157420603

That's the most retarded analogy I've ever seen
>>
>>157429579
>when people who are literally incapable of purchasing absurdly priced BDs pirate anime it hurts animators
Literally no.
>>
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GOOD! Now these nips can finally go fuck each other so we can have future robots and bette anime.
>>
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Probably because they flood the market with 2-3 shows a season unlike Kyoani who produce fantastic quality ones every other season and probably make bank.
>>
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>>157412166
>China starts making anime
>Better because China is better
>Japan either suffers or embraces diversity to keep up

Suck it weeb shits. Your suicide inducing, xenophobic, homogenous, and racist country is falling.

Manchildren BTFO
>>
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Pretty sure Gintama had an episode where a kid wanted to work in anime and they convinced him to get a different job by the end.
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>>157412893
>form a union
That's literally what killed hand-drawn animation in America.
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https://www.reddit.com/r/anime/comments/6c5c6t/one_in_four_anime_studios_reportedly_losing_money/

We /reddit/ now?
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>>157412166
Crunchyniggers OUT.
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>>157429579
Animators don't get anything even when you do buy the BDs. Any money from that goes to the production committee. When you buy the BDs it's just showing your interest in the show and hoping that production committee would fund another season of it by hiring the studio again.

Which, may not even happen even if the anime is a big success. The whole production committee system leads no room for the studio to get any profits for it to support their animators even if the show is successful. But, it also prevents the risk of a studio completely collapsing if they end having a show flopped if they are not heavily invested in the show.
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>>157429107
Wait, what?
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>>157423035
It isn't, you're just looking at Weekly Shonen Jump where mangaka have a week to complete a single chapter.

There isn't that kind of money issue outside of WSJ.
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CGI is the future
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>>157429579
>"hey, here's an anime i really like, i'd love to own it for personal use in e.g. bluray format"
>if it's even available it's $200+
>most of the time it simply isn't available because fuck you
you're really making my brain do the thinky thing jig, aren't you?
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>>157417287
It was an afterthought back then. But now, with chink firms actively investing/or outright buying studios, that's not quite the case anymore.

>>157423125
Bayformers was probably the first notable big budget hit.
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>>157417791
t. owns/works in an SME and thinks it's the same for studios that are part of a bigger business
Constant reminder that anime is just part of the business than entails other media and merchandise
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So what's stopping studios from outsourcing all animation work to China now? China was on the learning curve, but now they make their own 'anime'.
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>>157438935
Because it's often not any cheaper but is significantly lower quality and more difficult to manage logistically.

Have you seen those chink "anime"? It's amateur hour at the animation house. I'd hardly trust those folk with inbetweens.
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>>157438962
>Because it's often not any cheaper
Really? That would be hilarious, wages of Chinese animators actually being higher than their Japanese counterparts'.

>Have you seen those chink "anime"? It's amateur hour at the animation house.
Come on, it's not that all anime boasts stellar animation either. Plenty of shows every season are gold mines for QUALITY.
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>>157413769

Muslims love anime since it's not real.
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Last year anime sold more than any previous year. The industry isn't dyimg that's for certain.

Source : http://aja.gr.jp/english/japan-anime-data
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>>157439064
The thing is, if it's just cheap, crappy animation they need, they already have korea and in the case of Toei, pinoys. And the way things are going, the chinks aren't going to happily accept shit pay to do crap work for the japs when they themselves can pay shit wage to the bottom rung chink and get more of the profit for themselves.
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>>157412166
It's only a matter of time until it becomes possible to automatise drawing in-betweens, then all the problems will be solved because nobody needs those cheap animators any more.
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Anime is dead
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