Why does /a/ hate wish fulfillment stories?

MT's prose was fucking shit

Because as we grow into more cynical adults we realize our wishes as such will never be fulfilled, so the schadenfreude from seeing others suffer and experience pain and despair in more realistic settings is the fulfillment of our adult experience.

Or something.

>>149258079
Because they don't fulfill my wish. I just want an anime about a boy who is turned into a girl and seduced by an alpha lesbian who makes him choose to stay a girl and become her wife.

>>149258119
>>149258155
So it's just another case of not being pandered. Business as usual I guess.

>>149258239
Oh, I enjoy wish fulfillment, I was just trying to give you an answer.

Really, I enjoy anything with excessive cute, tits, or action.

Because the wish fulfillment tends to shoot whatever themes the show was going for in the foot. Clannad is about as good an example as there is, where Nagisa's death makes Tomoya grow as a person and culminates in some extremely powerful moments with Ushio and Tomoya's father. And then yay magic time reset and magic mystery disease is cured. It shits over everything it just tried to make you feel in the name of having a happy ending.

Wish fulfillment is fine if the MC puts in the work to make use of it, if they're constantly handed everything on a platter and after that no real problems occur and they never develop anything other than the plot like Re:monster then it's shit.

Shieldbro could have been great but the villains were a little to mustache twirling, spearbro was wasted potential and Noafumi was an angsty shit who only trusted slaves because the author had no idea how to handle believable character motivations.

>>149258452
oh you mean literally the TV series of Re:zero

>>149258079
It's not an /a/ thing, and they suck because they're vapid and shallow. Something that doesn't challenge the viewer/reader/player in some way isn't worth their time, and I say that under the belief that depth comes from what a person gets out of something instead of inherent qualities. In this case, what they get out of wish-fulfillment is (false?) comfort derived from living vicariously through fictional characters, which certainly isn't a good thing.

>>149258105
Who cares, it's still a decent story, and has the best world building of all the popular Isekai stories.

>>149258535
>after writing this post anon goes to watch the newest moeblob haremshit anime

>>149258726
Sounds like that post made you salty.

>>149258535
>Living vicariously through fictional characters which isn't certainly a good thing
marche.jpg

i wish i had that "It's not healthy!" pic

>>149258079
Because they're based on shit Nip tastes.

>>149258761
The only thing I'm salty about is you not sharing a bed with me.

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>>149258836
I have the other one but it won't let me post because it "contains an embedded file".

It was a simpler time back then.

>>149258079
Because they usually have shit writing.

>>149258535
>I say that under the belief that depth comes from what a person gets out of something instead of inherent qualities
>what a person gets out of it
How do you know what people other than you get out of things and who are you to deem whatever it is they're feeling 'not right'?

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>>149258836
>tripfag can't into google images
Step up, senpai.

>>149259007
open it in paint, make a new file and paste it there? Thanks for the pic though, ill save it regardless

>>149259049
Hm, i guess it happened since im using another search engine instead of google. Thanks btw anon

>>149258079
Because it makes me feel like shit so I need to ruin the fun of everyone who likes it by shitposting in the threads and calling everyone who likes it to have shit taste in an effort to make me feel better.

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>>149259068
Even though that other guy Googled it already here you go

>>149258079
I don't. I've been reading Isekai WNs like a faggot.

>>149260797
Faggot. Get some taste already.

>>149258079
Because the older you get. the better you understand that there are no more second chances left for a happy life so fulfillment stories only rub salt into the wound

>>149258079
Because most of /a/ are already at borderline wizard levels with no wishes fulfilled.

Some angst is understandable.

>>149258535
Doesn't you have some dreams and hopes to destroyed, Marche?

>>149261098
>Don't you have some hopes and dreams to destroy, Marche?
You're welcome, ESL.

>>149258079
Because they never turn real

My problem with recent trends in "wish fulfillment," in Japanese fiction, especially the isekai genre, is that its built on many negative elements and emotions. It seems these days the bulk of these stories focus on vicarious revenge fantasies inflicted upon innocents, sexual gratification via objectification, and the glorification of amorality and ruthlessness as cardinal virtues because they allow you to seize the first two things. They're dark stories consumed by an increasingly dark audience.

Maybe you can argue that anime wish fulfillment was always those things under the surface, but at least there was that surface, that attempt to couch what was happening in positive messages and morals and character traits. Now they don't bother, and that's troubling.

>>149258079
>/a/ hates wish fulfillment stories

Anon...

>>149262400
But they do. Every isekai shit gets shit on and gets called as a shitty wish fulfillment, otaku pandering, waifubait garbage all the time.

>>149258079
I like wish fulfillment stories that depicts MY wishes being fulfilled.

>>149261029
I lived a hard live, anon. I just wanna have fun with fun things and listen to some dadrock. Damn hipsters just don't understand.

>>149262521
What is your wish, anon?

>>149262139
>especially the isekai genre, is that its built on many negative elements and emotions.

SAO and Jew Horizon is quite positive, anon. Stop being an edgey faggot. Also read World Teacher.

>>149262139
Wut, which CGDCT have you been watching

>>149262566
I wish for Donald Trump to make anime real.

>>149262598
What kind of real are we talking about here?

For me, it's because they always use the same damn Dragon Quest-inspired fantasy setting.

Would it kill them to at least try and add some originality to their fantasies?

>>149262623
Protip :Madoka was a wish fulfillment anime.

>>149262605
Waifus and magic.

>>149262623
>add some originality to their fantasies?

Konosuba was a decontruction of the Isekai genre. It's deep like Madoka.

>>149262578

>SAO
>Positive

AHHHHH HAHAHAHA!

Ah, you funny mang.

>>149262639

You know when people say "wish fulfillment," they don't mean, like, the literal fulfilling of literal wishes, right?

>>149262700
I though they do?

>>149262720

Well, I mean, the wishes of the AUDIENCE, sure. But not the wishes of the characters.

>>149262672
>deconstruction
No,its just another self insertion faggotry that is aware its a self insertion faggotry

>>149258079
We don't. /a/ is a semi hive mind.

>>149258079
Because if you don't like the character, the SI unironically becomes an unbearable Mary Sue.

>>149262783
>SI
What did you mean by this?

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>>149262744
>No,its just another self insertion faggotry that is aware its a self insertion faggotry
>INCEPTION
We must go deeper. Blown

>>149262807
Self-Insert? What about that do you not get?

>>149263870
Why shorten it? Self insert doesn't seem like a long word.

I don't mind when they are actually well written. If the MC and the main girls have really great chemistry and the plot is interesting then I don't see why not.
The only problem is that the majority of wish-fulfillment is written by bottom of the barrel writers trying to make a quick buck.

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>>149258079
Too much at the same time flooded the industry.

And each new one is more and more simple than the previous ones. Have you read Re:Monster? "Dear diary: Today I got "blood suck" "cast dark fire" "energy drain" and "infinite mana"

Wish fulfillment is perfectly fine but like any other kind of story it needs to take its time to build itself and like any other kind of story too much at the same time cause saturation and hate.

Wish fulfillment is way too transparent and makes me cringe at the authors attempts to fool me into his fantasy, I'm sitting here like "try harder".

>>149263897
Because we can? I mean, SI has been used by other anons before in other threads. Isekai and self-inserts are discussed a lot on /a/, so having to type that frequently used word repeatedly gets incredibly tiring. I mean, this isn't even a new thing here. Why are you even surprised at this?

>>149258079
Too safe and predictable to cause any real drama or tension. That was never their aim either, but since SAO got popular you have people looking to the genre for things it was never meant to provide.

>>149266399
Because it feels weird and this is the first time I've seen it's usage I guess.

Pretty sure MT's rapid translations were due to its popularity on /a/, not to mention the constant chain threads it had for like an entire year. What makes you think every individual on the board is against such stories?

I rather read time-travel loop stories than isekai shit.

>>149267671
MT's rapid translations were because Google Translate works fast.

>>149258155
Alice Tale is for you

>>149267671
I don't know how anyone could stand MT's translation and editing. I could barely force my way through, it's so fucking ridiculous shit.

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>>149262639

>>149258079
Is Mushoku Tensei a wish fulfillment story, though ? It starts as one but my impression was that it actually turns out into something interesting once the MC starts growing into an adult (probably somewhere around the time he meets Paul in Millis).

>>149258498
I don't get why people here like the Shield Hero that much. As far as that MC archetype goes, Legendary Moonlight Sculptor is a much better read (but it's gookshit, not nipshit).

what the fuck is even the definition of a "wish fulfillment" story in the first place

seems like one of these popular /a/ buzzwords that are vague enough to describe anything that isn't a sociological study of the lifestyle of middle aged virgin anime nerds

>>149258079
I hate them because they usually involve bland and uninteresting characters.

I am a character liking guy. I will watch anything if it has well written characters.

>>149258079
>Why does /a/ hate wish fulfillment stories?
Because everyday I wake up, is a day my wish isn't fulfilled

I hate Wish Fulfillment because they don't fulfill my wishes

Which mostly involve the MC leading a horde of barbarians to sack fantasy rome or dealing with fantasy politics as nobility.

>>149270310
Rome is overrated.

>>149258079
For the same reason /tg/ almost always hate DMPC and magical realm. The author self-insert and don't create story or world, he just masturbate.

>>149262438
I mean those are just facts. Doesn't mean you can't enjoy them. Sometimes you just have to acknowledge that you consume shitty media without trying to justify how the shitty media is actually good.

>>149270409
Yeah,I prefer China or India desu senpai

>>149258498
>>149269620
>Noafumi was an angsty shit who only trusted slaves because the author had no idea how to handle believable character motivations.

Considering otherwise he'd be a naive goody two-shoes MC who doesn't know any better. Speardude's re-do shows what Naofumi would have been if he didn't snap.

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>>149262578
>World Teacher
I'm sorry anon. That story goes to shit once the elf shows back up and joins the harem. Here's a spoiler for you.
Every single arc involves romance in some way, but since the author doesn't want Sirius to have anymore girls, the girls fall for someone else, like Reus. Even if Sirius is the one that did most of the work, the author handwaves it away saying that Sirius is too perfect so the girls don't fall for him. Every single arc is like this. Basically drop the story shortly after the elf reappears in 50 chapters and never look back.

>>149258079
Because I'm too intelligent for them now.

>>149258079
I love wish fulfillement isekai, even if I understand they're not actually very good most of the time. But I still hate mushoku tensei.[

Because the main character is absolutely disgusting.
Like, most MCs in isekai are reborn otaku self-insert, and I'm okay with that but there's a fucking limit.
He started the novel saying "I won't be like my previous life" but his personality didn't change at all.

I can't self-insert with such a shit protagonist.

>>149273167
You musn't have read very far. All the crap lolicon shit mostly get thrown in the wind and the MC changes a lot.

>>149260984
>Get some taste already.
Why? So I can enjoy less things?

>>149273225
I read up to the point where he meets his father again after the big "teleport incident".

>>149262139
>They're dark stories consumed by an increasingly dark audience.

there's plenty of wish fullfillement slice-of-life stuff.
Like danmachi, death march (which despite the name has got to be the most positive isekai ever, the main character never kills anyone despite the stereotypical cheat-like powers), or only sense online

>>149262623
>Dragon Quest-inspired fantasy
try some xianxia
it has about the same quality as the average web novel but at least the setting is ancient kung-fu mythological stuff instead of demon lord vs heroes stuff.

>>149270310
>Which mostly involve the MC leading a horde of barbarians to sack fantasy rome or dealing with fantasy politics as nobility.

I feel you.
I want a fantasy novel/manga/anime about a young conqueror like Alexander the great. It can even be a isekai harem or whatever, just give me some empire building stuff, that's my wish-fulfillment

>>149273304
That's more or less the period where he starts growing up a lot, going from "I'm in a new world and I can have fun without too much consequences" to "I actually have responsibilities to think about".
That's also the point where the world-building and the over-arching story really kicks in (considering his meeting with Orsted happens shortly after).
Without spoiling too much, he ends up shaping into a pretty straightedge family man.

>>149273505
Xianxia is even more formulaic than isekai/RPG stuff.

>>149258079
It just needs to learn how not to take itself too seriously.

AKA don't do it like SAO.

>>149273688
>That's more or less the period where he starts growing up a lot
I guess I might give it a try again.

>Xianxia is even more formulaic than isekai/RPG stuff.
the point was that it at least had a different setting.
From what I read so far, xianxia has pretty much the same structure as isekai (OP MC with cheat ability who forms a harem) stuff, but with fake kung-fu instead of video game stuff. Of course, it's not quality material but neither are most wn/ln.

It's simple really, in wish fulfillment stories there is no conflict or catharsis for the characters to struggle through.. All good stories have characters go through some sort of struggle to get through be it a moe slice of life show or a dark fantasy action series. When a character does not have a conflict it's boring and that's where the problem of wish fulfillment comes in all the struggles the MC goes through are insignificant, easily solved or the pay off is way too large for what they accomplished. Giving everything to a character on a silver platter is just poor writing.

>>149258105
While no masterpiece I actually thought it was pretty good. Well at least compared to like 90% of the copy/pasted shit you see on narou and in battle harems.

Its especially hard to pull of child reincarnation and very rare to see it tell the story of the MCs whole life in detail. Just look how bad most of them are.
Either they end up as a kid forever or pull similar BS where the story just doesn't progress beyond a certain point or its just plain underwhelming.

I know people shit on it non-stop, but towards the end of the story I ended up actually rooting for the MC even if a little.
It was sad when he died and the narration went on to explain his deeds and accomplishments to the world, which I definitely didn't think I'd do at the start of the story, since he was a literal manchild.

Btw did anyone read the new spinoff series? It kinda seems like a setup for the sequel. Decided to stop and wait at chapter 4 since the author is updating daily.

>>149262139
>It seems these days the bulk of these stories focus on vicarious revenge fantasies inflicted upon innocents, sexual gratification via objectification, and the glorification of amorality and ruthlessness as cardinal virtues because they allow you to seize the first two things.

You clearly suck dick at finding the ones that aren't like this then. Practically 90% of the Otome isekai genre has none of these things, and that's just one fucking sub genre of which you can find thousands of series.

Why can't you people just accept that you're about as bad as finding the shit you want to read as Google does finding sauce?

Speaking of child reincarnations and xianxia, I remember reading one where the protagonist thought it was a good thing he was paraplegic in his first life, because being a baby incapable of even sitting up for some time would have driven a normal person insane.

>>149274696
Overall MT is pretty good, have a balanced amount of SoL and action, also i like that all the character have importance in the story and Rudy isn't a Gary Stu and don't start making thing of this world like a genius
About the Spoiler No, i was waiting the translation of jobless, but maybe i can do a briefly summary of jobless and the new spin-off
Also in the next LN The archer girl of LN7 appear again

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Holy shit the double release for Sevens

>Lianne is still butthurt from being kicked out of her kingdom
>Lyle had an alpha as fuck ancestor
>said ancestor soloed agrissa with one body strengthening skill and fucking won
>agrissa the bitch was pretty much an final boss with the ability to create her skills aka slutty reinhardt with a boner to destroy nations
>mfw novem from alpha Lyle's time was a reverse trap
>pic related got cucked so hard that she reincarnated to present time with lyle
>after agrissa got killed suddenly BETRAYAL from the ancestor of the royal family
>Basil is still best boy
The harem grows this time instead of 1 woman cucking her she gets 11
>technically alpha lyle should have became king after killing slut reinhardt
>lyle has the right of becoming the emperor
>this character has a strong claim to the empire of bahnseim

Shit is getting mad in these two chapters

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>>149258079

Because they're generally written so terribly that it's painful to watch. That and I'm generally pretty self-aware, so it watching them feels somewhat insulting. What's worse is that they always take themselves seriously.

>>149273634
Try Vanadis

>>149270113

This. I don't ask for much. Just interesting characters is all it takes to please me these days.

>>149277236
>Vanadis
I remember that one. Last I read the translations were up to the stupidamensia arc.

That part was so boring. Hopefully it gets better later

>>149258079
Can't self insert
MC is too good so /a/ gets jealous

>>149276379
Who's this cutie? MC's childhood friend?

>>149258079
I don't hate wish fulfilment story, but 99% of them are shit.
- either the mc is overpowered, and there is no challenge.
- or the mc have an harem, but they have no character development, or poorly done.

The beginning of MT is pure wish-fulfillment, but it lays the base of the universe.
Then the adventure into the unknown, and the foundation of the plot.
A boring school arc.
DAT fucking turning point 4.

I started to read a lot of isekai, but only worth reading are :
- Mushoku Tensei
- Risou no imo
- Overlord

I read a new Webnovel recently. MC got reincarnated and by three weeks old was already moving around because they 'exercised' their body. Yeah I know, impossible if you know the slightest thing about babies. Anyway, MC got found after having climbed to the floor and sitting up.

Normally things at this point would go the "Oh, our baby is a genius route!'. Instead MC got sent away as a demon child. I was amused. Can't remember the name since I read it a few weeks back and stopped there.

I just can't agree with idiot MCs that throw away a chance at a possibly new peaceful life just because they're impatient.

>>149258079
I hate wish fulfillment but I hate Rudeus even more. Fuck Rudeus for making me drop what could have been a somewhat enjoyable series had it not been for him.

>>149280469
Do you get a sasugasm everytime ainz pulls off a bluff

>>149258079
>nobody is going to finish the redundancy stories

>>149280649
>catch 3 week old baby walking around
Shit, I'd burn the thin and throw salt on the ashes just to be safe.

>>149262683
Its pretty light compared to most Isekai.

Its still evil incarnate and why self-indulgence is looked down upon.

>>149280018
Ex fiancee/ crazy intergenerational stalker.

>>149281336
the two untranslated redundancy don't have much important scenes
A briefly summary for you
>The God Residing in the Holy Land of Sword
>Chapter 20: Sword God: Jino Britts
-A biographic chapter of Jino, that tell how he was raised in swordland, how Eris changed Jino and Nina life, how Nina ask him marriage and how he train and defeat the previous sword god.
-Chapter 21: In the Meantime
Rudy, Orsted, Alek III and Eris visit Swordland, because they want that Jino joins to Orsted, he refuses, but he promises neutrality, Also there a mock battle between Jino vs Eris and Jino vs Alek, but Eris and Alek loses, Rudy refuse to fight because he suck in close combat
-Chapter 22: Nina Farion
There is a talk between Eris and Nina that tells how the marriage changed their life
>Nanahoshi Gourmet
-These chapters are about Nanahoshi awakening in some months, how Rudy prepare to her food and ask to her advice for some familiar troubles (Like how Lucy start a relationship with Clive)
Maybe this weeks i can make a briefly summary of Jobless and that new spin-off.

>>149281854
What about the /ss/ chapter?

>>149258079

Because usually they eschew actual effort in improving the work for the cheap, but highly effective thrill of shoehorning the reader into the plot.

Wish fulfillment isn't necessarily bad for a story, but it is often used in lieu of effective writing, good characterization or a decent plot. Many of us have gotten to the point where "Look! it could be you!" is met with "There's no reason in the entirety of this work that I would want to be him."

>>149258079
Because /a/ aren't average Japanese high schoolers.

>>149281658
Well yeah, I was just happy that for once the obvious freaky as hell occurrence wasn't waved away with a "Genius!" reaction. I think the MC is just pathetic for throwing away a happy family life just because they were impatient with being a baby. They didn't even give it a chance. They started trying to move around on day 1.

>>149275035

some people just are not really that invested on such things, but that doesn´t keep them from sharing their opinion about them.

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Why are most fantasies based off Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest, and insert JRPG rather than classic fantasy or DnD?

>>149282441
One of the few redeeming features of Goblin Slayer and Overlord is that they're based on D&D rather than DQ

>>149281887
In baka you can find Aisha /ss/ SS full translated with the translation of some LN extra chapter

>>149282558
yay

>>149258079
Similar themes, poor writing...

Rudeus is a horrible character and I hate his guts.

>>149282510
Goblin Slayer the character is DQ guy in the original ASCII WN though.

>>149258105
I cannot agree more.

>>149274696
The prose is still shit, even if it is better than 90% of the stuff that comes out of anuses.

Now, I'm not annavid LN reader - but I am an avid novel reader. And the only thing I admit ss consolation is that, if MT's prose isn't very subpar compared to LNs in general (which I do not know if it is or not), then the problem is that LN prose is fucking shit, which would have as conclusion that LN audience is at fault, and not because they've shit taste, but because they haven't been gifted with an education that showed them the joy of fucking good prose.

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>>149283119
>Rudeus is a horrible character and I hate his guts.
My brother.

>>149283119
>Rudeus
Thats the name of the mc right? If so i agree.

>>149283422
>good prose
Overrated. Go back to /lit/

>>149258105
Well duh, it's a japanese LN, what did you expect. Read something originally written in English (or other white language) if you want decent prose, like Hero's War or Mother of Learning.

>>149283529
I've never seen good prode overrated anywhere, you know. Just bad prose being appropiately rated as a disgraceful, but good prose rated as ecstasic? Nope.

>>149270027
it's a /v/ buzzword
most modern day "/a/ buzzwords" come from and are spewed by /v/ crossboarders
you're literally posting in a /v/ thread right now and you don't realize it

>b-but muh containment threads
Haven't we already taken that line far enough to see that it simply doesn't work? Do your fucking jobs mods.

>>149258105
If you can't read Japanese fluently then this comment if fucking stupid.

I found the prose in the Japanese version to be pretty par.

>>149283689
It's the kind of story yourepeteadly try to imagine being the protagonist in when you're trying to fall asleep in your bed.

>>149258079
Quick, someone post that spiel about how evil POSTMODERNIST college profs and philosophers reprogrammed us all to hate heroes we can look up to and aspire to be and like edgy antiheroes we can look in the eye or down at because good and evil are archaic concepts in today's world or some shit like that.

Something like that seriously came up in an antihero thread recently starting off with a pic of Subaru. Meh, I'm bored of Shaft vs. Kyoani; I wanna see more Subaru vs. Kirito.

>>149283714
>the japanese prose is pretty par

In what context? Par around LNs, or par around a reasonable (aka nowhere near Weebspeare) quality of japanese prose?

>>149283857
Of course ignoring the fact that Sheakespeare wrote theater and not prose; you know what I mean.

Genuinely curious.

>>149283612
prose only needs to be at the mimimum of competence needed. Anything beyond is pointless as it doesnt add to the story.

>>149283838
I'd love to discuss character vs character scenarios but that would probably become powerlevel threads after some point

>>149282375
>I don't know shit about x
>but let me tell you my opinion on it
People need to stop doing that.

>>149284196
Of course it doesn't add to the story -it adds to the novel.

That's like saying that the wheels don't add to the engine. They still add to the car, and are needed for the engine to be fully enjoyed.

>>149264389
You don't need good writing to entertain people, good writing is a luxury, not a requirement..

>>149284775
Not to entartain unentertained people, but you need good writing to entertained the already entertained further.

>>149277165
You're not self-aware enough if you still get bothered by things.

>>149284838
You really don't care about those special snowflakes.

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>>149269056
>Our protagonist was slowly becoming a college drop out. He then started getting into online games and decided this time he wanted to play as a female. He created the cutest possible girl he could. And was sent to another world…as that girl. Yuri harem.

why have I never heard about this before

>>149284711
>That's like saying that the wheels don't add to the engine. They still add to the car, and are needed for the engine to be fully enjoyed.

Following that analogy, you don't need super awesome wheels to have a good car. You just need some basic wheels.

You need prose, but you don't need good prose. As long as its readable, it's fine.

>>149258079
It's too fake and obvious. I need at least some characters and events to be greater than the MC, to not revolve around him, and to not suck his dick.

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>>149285122
>And was sent to another world…as that girl. Yuri harem.

finally wish fullfillement pandering garbage that fulfills my wishes and panders to ME

>>149285158
Yeah, but you need not to have bad prose, just loke you need not to have bad wheels.

Or else you also ruin degrade the road for all other cars too.

>>149285204
>>149285122
plot twist

slowly begins to hunger for the cock, looks at a guy and gets wet

>>149285204
Just go to novelupdates and dig around the tags for things to read.

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>>149285122
>>149285204
>why have I never heard about this before
because you gave up on the one genre that could give you what you want

embrace the isekai, there's a few more translated and untranslated stories just like this one, only sense online is close to this but a bit different, there's 2 vampire loli isekais as well

embrace it, and you will be pandered to

>>149285307
There's always something for someone waiting to be found

>>149285373
yes when looking for edge power fantasies I found a lot of stories that start off just like shieldbro but then go COMPLETELY different directions, its fucking great

no matter what you want from an isekai, its out there, just wait for a translator with tastes similar to yours to pick it up.

>>149258079
King of /a/ here, who represents the collective opinion of all people who have ever posted in here.
I don't.

>>149285510
Did you read nidome no yuusha or arifureta? Im waiting for the former to continue but i dropped the latter somewhere after the bunnymen rekt the empire that were opressing the demihumans

>>149285688
>arifureta
I still have that tab open
I didnt drop it after the bunnyman arc, but its def hard to continue

chinese webnovels are better at fulfilling my need for angsty edgy power fantasies

there's one being translated by the jibreel fan wing fetishist can't remember the name but if you want to stay within japanese novels check it out

>>149285774
Ill check that out, thanks.

>>149284930

You're going to have to explain this one to me.

>>149258079
I like Slime and Tsuki ga michibiku a- am i healthy?

>>149281854
Oh thanks, wondered what happened in those. Jino's left barely alluded to in the original series.

>>149282558
>>149281887
Fuck Aisha. Just saying.

>>149283529
Bad writing isn't something one should take pride in.
Reading trash is fine, but thinking for a second it actually measures up to something written with care is imbecile. And minimal effort isn't really a behaviour that should be encouraged.

>>149258079
The isekai genre is crafted from the ground up to be a vehicle facilitating the laziest writing possible.

By using a generic MMO-style fantasy setting with JRPG mechanics common to so much isekai, the writer doesn't have to bother with actual worldbuilding.

Instead of having to theorize and describe how the fantastical elements of the world work they can all be written off with "You played DQ or RO right? Well this just like that".

Skills get stronger via level up, so you don't need to make effort to write the MC actually gradually improving.

You can take more stab wounds to the gut because you have more HP, so you don't need to make effort to describe the effects of stab wound.

Currency also conveniently comes in decimal denominations with easy equivalence to the yen.

"Adventurer guilds" are also a convenient way to justify monster hunting and dungeon diving without ever getting into the real specifics of how a monster hunting and dungeon diving economy would work.

The fantasy setting can also be exploited to make magic convenient device to gloss over all the details of the world the author doesn't want to think. Laundry and hygiene is taken care of with water magic. Injuries and illnesses are taken care of with healing magic. Slavery is taken care of with contract magic. Dungeons and monsters are formed through magic. Adventurer guild membership cards and stats screens are all magic. Ah, magic sure is convenient isn't it?

And let's not forget that the fantasy worlds that our Japanese protagonists are transported to often speak a language nearly identical to modern Tokyo-dialect Japanese or have convenient translation magic to make linguistic issues trivial.

Everything is just convenient. And the main character will often wittily remark as such to show how genre aware he is. "Aah, kono pattern ka?"

Gameifying the world removes a lot of the explanations immersion would otherwise require.

It's a story element crafted to encourage laziness.

>>149286329
>Tsuki ga michibiku
That one is pretty good desu senpai
masochistic spider best girl

>>149286341
>Bad writing
prose and writing are different things. Only people who praise prose are wannabe /lit/fags. Writing matters, prose doesn't.

>>149286341
A least i hope that the author can include some events of that arc, like the chapter1 that implies that the Orsted bracelet, the Orsted godsword, a Shield and perugius ship are 4 of the dragon treasure and appear technique god, also Rudy plan to confess to his wives that he from another world
Summary for the next LN (google translated)
Facing a second wife and daughter, Rudeus is to start a new life. Sylphy and Roxy, two wives has good relationship, Rudeus think the girls both cherish had been happily living. Or go shopping at the three people, learn the magic, and or to attend a wedding of a friend, send a daily realistic is substantial.
Meanwhile, Rudeus it comes to the work along with the wives two people. The it was there was a little girl Sarah was a once bitter parting ways.
"Come together in the work with the ex-girlfriend, Nante"
Happy marriage is, at last whether transformed into a battlefield!? Life again type reincarnation fantasy thirteenth edition kicks off here!
So this vol a least going to have half-original

>>149286420
RPG-like setting is common in isekaishit, but that doesn't mean all isekai has RPG-like setting.
One in the OP is normal fantasy with proper world-building, language issues are also there, though for readers it's still just Japanese. Even though adventurer guilds are there, they aren't referenced much.

The main problem is that the protagonist is a full-blown disgusting NEET. He was bearable in the very beginning when he was striving to do something, but he quickly devolved back. And even though he's a really powerful mage, he's a fucking jobber.

Ending was satisfying though.

>>149286420
First of all, OP isn't specifically talking about isekai, but about wish-fulfillement stuff. Most harem anime are wish-fulfillement, but they're not isekai.

Second of all, there's plenty of isekai that don't use literal levels and hp and shit like that.

>without ever getting into the real specifics of how a monster hunting and dungeon diving economy would work.
Except for all the isekai novels that go out of their way to detail exactly how that sort of shit happens. Tsuki ga michibiku for example, specifically explains why and how the adventurers guild was created.

>And let's not forget that the fantasy worlds that our Japanese protagonists are transported to often speak a language nearly identical to modern Tokyo-dialect Japanese or have convenient translation magic to make linguistic issues trivial.

Just like 90% of sci-fi.

>Currency also conveniently comes in decimal denominations with easy equivalence to the yen.
just like 90% of regular fantasy, including western fantasy stuff.

The rest of your rant is bitching about gamey isekais. If you don't like gamey isekais read the ones that aren't gamey. Or read xianxua or wuxia chinese stuff.

>>149286829
I liked he was all chill with him dying because he lived his life and his lineage would eventually kill hitogami

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>>149258079

Because badly written wish fulfillment stories often takes all the elements that should go into a good story:

>World building
>Characterization
>Thematic consistency
>Engaging plot
>Style of prose

And just ignores them altogether in favor of rushing to the next cheap "ORE WA TSUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE" payoff moment that lets the MC show off how secretly awesome he is or adds yet another member to his harem.

Instead of constructing a good story that includes such wish fulfillment events, it's a paper thin skeleton of a story that exists solely to have such events clinging to it like parasites.

The standard fantasy isekai setting is especially useful for these types of story because it allows amateur writers to piggyback off well established genre tropes and expectations so as to be able to fast forward through establishing the setting or building a story. Videogamification is another device that can be used to skip past having to think properly about how to write powers and abilities and development of such over time.

The best isekai are the ones that actually create a world of their own.

>>149258543
You have obviously not read twelve kingdoms.

>>149282375
I know, but this board culture has always been one that tells people to fuck off if they don't put minimal effort into it, and given that NU exists it's 10000% easier than Googling/Yandexing/IQDBing/etc typical non pixiv sadpanda sauce. Cropped images are a bajillion times harder whereas with LN genres you literally click a tag and thousands of entries pop up, or filter some tags for the same thing.

It should be reversed at this point given how shit Google is.

>>149286420
Is someone working on an LN or anime about some modern-day Japanese kids transported to, say, England, 1066 AD? Maybe they get caught up in the Battle of Hastings, so you've got a semi-RPG setting there.

No one can understand them, not even the one guy who happens to be good at modern-day English.

They have to actually learn how to use swords, shields, bows, and arrows...and carry them everywhere they go.

Until they at least manage to communicate with the locals via grunts and gestures, they have to hunt for food. Disease is a concern.

And oh yeah, no magic.

How long do you think they'll last?

>>149287018
so far all you have said are things that apply to any badly written story. There's no reason to single out wish fulfillment stories specifically.

I miss Roxy /a/.

I want to obtain her panties and make an altar oo.

>>149286935
>just like 90% of sci-fi

I always thought that in, say, Star Wars they were usually speaking some non-English language and they just used the "Babelfish convention" whereby Julius Caesar and Cleopatra magically sound like upper-class Brits.

>>149287137
>There's no reason to single out wish fulfillment stories
There is, because wish fulfillment stories commit those sins for the specific purpose of getting to the "wish fulfillment" part. They have a special incentive to be lazy with their writing because time spent on writing a compelling description of the battlefield and establishing the stakes is time not spent on writing about how the MC storms into the battlefield on his magic motorbike firing off his revolver railgun and making everyone marvel at how amazing he is.

>>149287245
there are specifically universal translators in most sci-fi

star wars actually doesn't. Which is why c3po and other protocl droids exist, they have a shit ton of languages programmed into them and can serve as interpreters for space travelers.
That said, star wars isn't sci-fi, it is space opera (basically fantasy in space)

Are there any good fantasy LNs that aren't isekai?

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>>149287210

>>149287365
Spice and Wolf?

>>149287363
Space opera isn't space fantasy. But Star Wars happens to be both a space opera and a space fantasy.

>>149287306
Do you complain about slice of life stories not having enough drama and high stakes too?

>>149287418
I was not aware of the distinction, but now that I google it, you're right. My mistake.

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>>149287131
>sheltered kids thrown into an era where hygiene isnt common

You know damn well what would happen

Imagine the food

Also
>communicate via grunts and gestures
My nigga i want this so bad

I cant remember when was the last time /a/ had a "write a story outline to impress /a/" thread was

I miss those creative threads

>>149287431
>but but what about
We weren't discussing slice of life, we were discussing MT style stories, i.e. fantasy action adventure

>>149287131
>>149287473
A manga about a bunch of japanese kids dying of disease, being burned at the stake, or just raped and killed by english peasants doesn't seem like a good read.

That said it could work as a guro doujin

>>149285237
Find us some objective measurement of good prose then that somehow bypasses language/cultural barriers then you little faggot. Until then you prose fags just cite /lit/ memes like a bunch of armchair professors.

The Ravages of Time in native chink language has better prose than possibly 99% of fiction in history, and it's made in the country of bootleg with less than 1% concentration of originality. I don't see any of you niggers championing it or giving it its due praise, oh wait it's chink shit it CAN'T be good even if 80%+ of all chinks and asians and practically all of baidu say so; after all the translations lack good prose. Surely the English language has no faults carrying over prose, it's superior to even the million folded katana called Japanese.

If you think a story can go from great to trash just because of prose then you're already a meme /lit/ fag who has no weight in anything. Literally just someone who cares more about the wrapper than the contents. I bet you can't even explain why Harry Potter is so successful without showing vapid biased hatred and meme greentexting.

You trying to be the Azami of reading or something? You gonna make a Central for "This is good taste in writing" and dominate the world? If that's the case go drown in ketchup.

But chances are you're just trying to act smug to indirectly get people to ask you for your shit taste so you can gloat about your favorite trash, though once that point comes along you'd be too insecure to share for fear of getting called out as a retard, resulting in a downward spiral of derailment and shit flinging.

>>149287545
>wish fulfillement isekai
>fantasy action adventure
Now I see your problem. You got the genre wrong. No wonder your list of complaints made no sense.

>>149287595
A DECONSTRUCTION of isekai?

Seriously, it does show how such a situation might work out in real life. A worst-case scenario, but still a scenario.

>>149287640
meant to reply to

>>149287569

>>149287682
I guess it could work as a one-shot
but it has to have some magic tho (or a time machine or some shit) to explain how the kids got there

>>149287365
There's the girl who ate death, also lvl 999 villager, it has rpg stuff but it aint isekai, weird huh?

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>>149287767
Imma check those novels out, thanks a lot man.

>>149258543
World building lol. What part of it had good world building? It was generic element magic with different tiers of strength.

>>149287595
>isekai guro doujin

How is this not a thing

But really there are so many things that can and will go wrong with sending sheltered kids from the future to the past

Kinda reminds me of that edgy dungeon seeker. In a sense that they get stuck at a crappy village and endure shit but thats still pretty light if you ask me (though they got hax skills)

So is nobody here not gonna stop with just blowing hot gas and make a story /a/ would generally approve then betray when it gets too popular

>>149288129
panel 1
>I was right
panel 2
>no you were wrong
panel 3
>you're right, I was wrong

>>149288165
>>isekai guro doujin
sounds good
I'm tired of the usual elf on orc
how about some jap girls on orc

>>149287640
>OP posts Mushoku Tensei
>topic isn't MT clones

>stories that aren't fantasy action adventure don't need world building, characterization, thematic consistency, engaging plot, or competently written prose

Keep burying that head of yours deeper, apologist.

>>149288272
This is the part where Gisu died. The one where he asks Rudy to knowledge him as a good opponent.

For some reason, I only saved my template and deleted the one with
>at least think of me as a strong enemy
>GG 2 EZ
>*sob* *sob*

>>149286669
>Only people who praise prose are wannabe /lit/fags. Writing matters, prose doesn't.
Form matters, period. Language isn't disposable.

>>149287627
>But chances are you're just trying to act smug to indirectly get people to ask you for your shit taste so you can gloat about your favorite trash, though once that point comes along you'd be too insecure to share for fear of getting called out as a retard, resulting in a downward spiral of derailment and shit flinging.
You're extremely aggressive and arrogant for someone who's trying to pass himself as the voice of the people.

>>149288134
The mc of lvl 999 villager wants to punch god in the face for giving him such weird skills. And the c of death is a story of a cute girl doing death god things

>>149258079
People who claim that /a/ would hate something are in most cases newfags who haven't gotten used to the concept of anonymity yet. For everything that exists you'll find people on /a/ who dislike it. In that regard, /a/ hates everything. And given the fact that people are more eager to speak out about things that bother them rather than things they like or they're quite okay with the people who dislike things are always going to look like a larger group of people than they actually are.

The idea that losers on /a/ who consume the kind of escapist entertainment that anime is would dislike wish-fulfilment stories is ridiculous.

People generally like them. They might have issues with particular ones though for a variety of reason.

>>149288958
I wish someone would actively and frequently push translations for the other 2 novels the author made which is set in the same world

>>149258079
Most of entertainment is wish fulfillment in some form or fashion. If you like anime/manga you probably like wish fulfillment.

If you think you don't, you're probably 14 or an idiot.

>>149289935
Same, would love to see the hero/monster girl novel.

Why didn't Hitogami give Rudy any help to kill Orsted? It was his best chance yet to get rid of him.

>>149258079
Because there's so many of them and they all take themselves so seriously. I don't mind and actually kinda like wish fulfillment isekai stories that don't take themselves seriously, because the premise is stupid to begin with. Konosuba is a recent example of this. Even if they do take themselves seriously, try to do something original with the story. Don't have it be your standard "lol elves n' magic" shit. Re:Zero tried and kinda succeeded with the whole time loop thing. Gate also tried and sort of succeeded with the adult male in the army setup that made it stand out from your standard isekai trash.

>>149258105
What on earth is this guy on about?

Did you read the machine tl'ed english version or something? If not, provide some examples from the narou original since I didn't find it to be anything on the level you're implying.

>>149291706
>tfw shieldbro has no dwarves, elves and other fantasy races
>only furries and shit
It does feel weird though

>>149258543
>best world building
I wouldn't say the best but its up there for me.

I especially like it in the new Laplace spinoff where we get to know how the 6 worlds first came to be(Obviously they get destroyed considering the current timeline), the culture of the dragon world in general and its laws.

Also the fact that they can only give birth once in a thousand years, how they're taught to fly, how bizzar of a place the dragon world really is ('Upside Down' as in there are mountains where the sky should be and there's a sky where the ground would be, most things that can't fly seem to be at a disatvantage in that world)

I'm glad the author still keeps expanding the world. There's also the heaven continent we don't know much about in the current world.

>>149292644
> new Laplace spinoff
I guess I've been out of the loop. Are there any other besides the Redundancy, Joblesse Oblige, and this?

>>149293715
Nothing related to MT as far as I'm aware. Though he did also start writing some silly comedy series.

>>149291480
Because he wanted to kill Rudeus, or both of them if he got lucky.

As far as help is concerned he did give him tips regarding the magic suit or whatever, but thats it, he didn't want to invest much.

If possible he really wanted one of them to die. Didn't matter who really. If Orsted was defeated(Very unlikely and he knew that) then thats it.
On the other hand if Rudi was killed then it would be the same as before. There's no way Orsted would be able to reach him and would keep on suffering for eternity.

>>149296143
Did he ever think about the possibility of Little rudy and Papa Orsted broing it up?

>>149296143
You know, I'm guessing that's the reason Hitogami didn't say a word about Orsted before their first meeting. Sure he couldn't see him but there was no reason not to tell rudeus about it.

>>149296660
Maybe, but probably thought it was very unlikely since Orsted wouldn't be able to trust anyone related to hitogami and Rudeus, being the 'third rate' he is was about to go full rambo on a friggin Dragon God. There's also their first meeting to consider.

To be fair Orsted actually was about kill him if not for his family and the determination he saw to protect them. Well even then he didn't fully trust him untill the end of Asura arc.

>>149296699
More like he was confused from where Rudeus came from and didn't know if they were actually related.

>>149275036
>xianxia
is there any good xianxia? everything seems to be really crappy shounen

>>149258079
Because /a/ is shithole filled with contrarian edgelords.

>>149297102
Don't read much xianxia since I'm not a fan of its tropes. But I hear good things about I Shall Seal the Heavens.

>>149297382
>I Shall Seal the Heavens.
whats so good about it?

>>149283566
>Hero's War or Mother of Learning.
my african american friend! another similar good one is two year emperor

>>149297497
I heard it had less of the usual tropes but its xanxia so I'm still hesitating.

>>149286829
>he's a fucking jobber
What does this even mean?

>>149297497
The author is actually competent and have plenty of foreshadowing about future plothooks and revelations. The first ~500 chapters are the best imo, then it somewhat tapers off but still remains worth reading.

>>149287210
I very much liked Roxy, but the author turned her into a slut.

>>149298895
>>149297497
Oh and Meng Hao, the protagonist, actually has a personality which is something completely groundbreaking when it comes to Xianxia.

Is there any LN about isekai military stuff
Much like GATE but without all that gary selfinserty shit?

>>149298876
He loses the majority of one on ones but that is because the only people on his level in terms of raw power are immortals and demi gods.

It's not really his fault though he can't use touki meaning he less defense than the average swordsmen and his fighting armor needs to be summoned.

>>149298996
Rakuin no Monshou
Altina the sword Princess
Youjou Senki

>>149275180
moar info please!

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>>149298996
>Is there any LN about isekai military stuff
Do you mean modern? There's Rune Trooper. People say its kinda like gate but unless you know jap not much has been translated.
I only know of Yojou Senki otherwise

If you mean something like Rakuin No Monshou and Madan there's Shiro no Koukoku Monogatari. The manga adaption is pretty shitty though.

>>149299573
I've never read the LN but shiro no koukoku is pretty mediocre and also very weird in terms of worldbuilding. I do still like the 'middle ages'/'modern' kind of setting.

>>149298996
Muv Luv Alternative

Marginal Operation

>>149299410
>>149286719

>>149297102
Ze Tian Ji(Way of Choices) is great, unless you dislike a slower paced story, and a MC that doesn't go around killing people for disrespecting him.

>>149298996
Gunota is about military. It's funny, the style is quite similar to MT and Konosuba

Most of the xianxia get a badass character that is a complex and 3-dimesional. Their love interest are interesting and isn't a stereotype like japanese heroine. The villains are not one dimensional like japanese ones. For some reason i think the villains are even more complex. Xianxia has good training arc that are not repetitive. They are much better then wuxia which the training arc consist mediation,sword training and internal training.

I rank xianxia>korea ln>Japense webnovel>Japanese Lightnovels>English Webnovels>Wuxia
Xianxia are growing popular worldwide, but i think japan is scared of adapting xianxia novels. They are fearing a chinese novel will become popular in japan. Yeah Romance of the 3 kingdom is popular in japan, but they butcher the fucking adaption and change the genders of some major characters. It's a fucking disgrace that japan only adapt "moe shit". Xianxia should fucking adapted so the japanese can finally open their eyes how much the chinese mc are better then their beta harem mc's. Chinese mc are much more complex then their counterparts. Their romance interest are much more interesting then japanese "Clone stereotype girls". The villains of xianxia actually got a motivation for their evilness. Xianxia are not pretending to be philosophical deep pieces like some of japanese anime(Utena,Eva,Tatami galaxy,Logh..). Those anime are actually deceiving the plebs to be deep and philosophical. They are actually propaganda crap that convince the normal viewers to be good.
Korean manhua/webtoons like TOG,Noblesse,The breaker,Sun ken rock,Household affairs,skill of lure, sweet guy are much better then japanese manga(berserk,fma,holyland,bokurano,hxh etc..)


-Better Mc example: sweet guy

-Villians are extremly developed example:noblesse

-non repetitive training arc that isn't a filler example:noblesse,tog

-Good heroine example:skill of lure

- better art

-Side characters are much more develop then the generic comic relief friend

>>149287365
Sure, you're just terrible at finding material on your own.

>>149299200
>Altina the sword Princess
>1st and 2nd volumes all about sweet massed battles and some light slice of life with the main cast who are all mostly okay even if their personalities are pretty much cardboard cutouts
>3rd volume suddenly about a generic superstrong yet dumb dude saving a crown princess from a coup by the evil militaristic nobles, in a completely different country

fuck this shit, pisses me off how they establish that "army+tactics>individual prowess" in the first two volumes and then have this superstrong dude that can dodge musket bullets

>>149287131
There's already an LN about a reincarnated salaryman who tries to save the world with modern medicine. and fails.

>>149273092
>...the author handwaves it away saying that Sirius is too perfect so the girls don't fall for him. Every single arc is like this. Basically drop the story shortly after the elf reappears in 50 chapters and never look back.

Why , anon? You like harem shit? What a pedestrain.

>>149287365
http://www.novelupdates.com/series/zero-kara-hajimeru-mahou-no-sho/
The translations are just really fucking slow because nanodesu.

If women can have wish fulfillment stories about masculine, brooding, hot, dominant, romantic older alphas falling for plain janes why can't men get stories about cute innocent sweet girls who fall for betas?

>>149306499
Because /a/ is made up of edgy contrarians and people that take this shit far too seriously along with thinking too highly of themselves.

>>149287682
>A DECONSTRUCTION of isekai?
You mean Grimgar?

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>>149305368
>Their love interest are interesting and isn't a stereotype like japanese heroine
Skin like jade, the strongest woman, exceptional background, a toad wishes to take a swan? Like sticking a flower in dog shit.

>The villains are not one dimensional like japanese ones.
You dare lay eyes on my woman? You dare not give me face? You court death. My father won't stand for this. I'm a chosen of the sect.

>Xianxia has good training arc that are not repetitive
PILLS HERE

Spirit Blade Mountain already got an anime by DEEN. It was alright, great tits.

>-Better Mc example: sweet guy
Korean porn. You want a Jap MC that fucks bitches, go read H-manga.

>-Villians are extremly developed example:noblesse
Sup M21, remember when you killed those humans for fun?

>- better art
That one image of that tall guy with the 12 pack.

>-Side characters are much more develop then the generic comic relief friend
Sup Shinwoo, and other irrelevant humans. Maybe he's gotten past being a regular human by now, I haven't kept up.

tl;dr There's variation in every medium, and it would be wrong to generalize and cherrypick.