Let's settle this once and for all, Subaru or Shinji?

>>145964088
Atleast shinji is in a good series

Subaru is a cringy annoying turd

You mean Shinji or Shinji rip off? I'll stick with the original, thank you.

I relate to NGE Shinji a lot, but Rebuild Shinji is just whiny

I like Subaru but I can't relate to him very well

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>>145964088
>comparing Eva to some flavor-of-the-month shit

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>>145964088
>even having to ask

>>145964088
Subaru a cringe.

>>145964088
Subaru get's a whole lot better though. He becomes a war hero, he becomes an excellent strategist, he gets royal knight tier swordsmanship, he gets Archbishop Authorities (sloth and greed) but he uses weakened versions of them (if he wants to power them up he needs to give up something precious), he gets a personal army, he fights off genocide machines (archbishops), he drank Ekidna's bodyfluids and his word is trusted and taken at face value

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>>145964088
>shinji
>subaru
You're kidding right? best boy every time

Shinji was infuriating and make Subaru look based in comparison.

>>145966684
>All the rhetoric about how this show is deconstructing the isekai genre and how great of a character Subaru is because he is a weak unlikable faggot
>He becomes a gary stu that everyone loves like every other isekai protagonist
That's not better.

>>145964181
t. Tumblrina

Both shows and MCs are awful, but at least NGE has good action scenes

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>>145964181
>>145965903
>>145966038
>>145966061
>>145966088

Remove your nostalgia goggles faggots. If Re:Zero aired in the 90's you would probably suck it's dick like how you sucked NGE's dick.

>>145964088
what's the difference?

>>145968487
Nah, I'd have dropped it when it became obvious it was using hamfisted torture porn in lieu of meaningful character development. This show won't be talked about a year from now.

>>145968602
Like how NGE uses hamfisted judeocatholic imagery in lieu of meaningful character development?

>>145968818
No it didn't, stop trying to be clever by changing out words in an argument. Evangelion never had three straight episodes of cross explosions and nothing else.

>>145964088
both are massive faggots desu senpai

>>145968487
>Implying that people only like NGE cuz it's '90s
Are you for real?

>>145968818
>even implying NGE lacks character development

Who the fuck do you think you are? Get the hell off my board.

>>145968818
No, the hamfisted judeochristian imagery is pure windowdressing and has nothing to do with the character development that actually takes place.

Explain to me how 26 minutes of throwing yet another tantrum and having his doormat waifubait deredere cardboard sidekick take it all is character development? Go ahead and compare that shit to Eva, it just makes me feel more convinced people wanking off over ReeReeZero haven't watched much anime to have any sort of basis for comparison.

>>145968818
You might actually be autistic. That's the only conclusion I can come to that explains your inability to recognize a well-developed character.

For what, pathological whiner?

>>145964088
I dont get it, are these two related somehow?

>>145969216
Nigga I hate Zero more than NGE, but they're both shit
>>145969194
>>145969452
Asuka is about it in terms of development. Shinji is one of the most garbage protagonists I've ever seen, his dad is "muh wife", and Rei is cardboard soul machine

>>145968487
yeah because eva airing in the 90s is totally what made it good

>>145969530
They are both the main characters in the citizen kanes of anime.

>>145969530
They're both faggots

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>>145967011
MY DUDE

>>145969216
That part of the rant was mostly about changing his views on how he saw himself, dropping his self hate to actually improve instead of only working on what other people thought of him.

>>145969530
wish fulfillment not going as expected

>>145969551
>asuka
>development

>>145969802
Thats...a pretty weak connection. There are all sorts of anime you could throw under that label.

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>>145969551
What makes Shinji garbage? Rei's definitely has development, she went from Gendo's bitch to giving Shinji the keys to humanities future.
>>145969803
Asuka was a hotshot pilot who slowly had her reason for living taken away from her until she learned to work with others. Just because you want to fuck a different girl more doesn't make a character shit.

>>145969802
Yeah, I know exactly what they were attempting with him getting over some issues we were never shown up until that point by throwing yet another tantrum and having a one-dimensional character just take it on the chin. It wasn't what I'd call character development, it's what I'd call giving the low hanging fruit that they went for as their audience enough room to handwave the sloppy transition into the plot moving forward.

>>145969931
>until she learned to work with others
This is the part I'm not getting; she never changed, did she? Did I miss it?

>>145964088
One goes through character development while the other remains an omega piece of shit until literally the last episode or two.

You tell me.

>>145969986
I never finished the anime, but in the manga she genuinely changed to be a better person alongside Shinji.

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>>145969986
She thought her Eva was just a tool in the beginning and calls it a doll. She tries to exert full control over the machine unlike Shinji, who relies too much on the Eva going Berserk at times, and this causes her Eva to stop working with her. She only gets back in action because she has an epiphany that sometimes she needs others help, even if that person is your dead mom inside of a biological superweapon.

>>145964088
>Subaru or Shinji

Guts

>>145967390
>most mcs in the isekai are just gary stu at the start
>it takes 3 arcs for this MC to become somewhat of a gary stu

What is character development.

>>145969884
They're both from shows which attempt to deconstruct tropes especially the psychology of it's protagonist.

Hachiman and Satou comparisons are brought up as well but the real difference would be they're both asked to play hero when they are far from having what it takes and after failures and running away slowly try to earn the title.

>>145964088
I really liked how Subaru was called out for faking insanity. While Shinji was never really called out on it, when he likely was doing just the same.

Why are we comparing a timeless classic with a flavor of the month show?

>>145969972
We were shown it, it was just very hard to notice but knowing how people like spoonfeeding, going through that whole episode was explaining. It was always subtle. Whenever there is an insult said in this series, you should have noticed that insults are an indication to hypocrisy. Remember if you decide to look further into the series.
>>145968602
> Torture porn
My ass. Subaru is suffering mostly from his own bullshit that he caused or let happen. If I wanted more torture porn, I would have gone for Elfen Lied, Blood C, Another or some other pointless deaths that had no meaning to them.
>>145969032
Re:Zero never had a mc turn into a literal faggot or make him into a female counterpart in a spinoff.
>>145968487
You're an idiot.
>>145969194
Why the fuck are people going for this bait thread? Idiots. All of you.
>>145969216
The tantrums are coming from his own desire to be recognized and have self-worth that led him to make those bad mistakes he made. That was his own self-loathing and realization from Rem to meet expectations and become a better person. Also, to fucking reply to this thread is fucking idiotic as well as bothering to give a shit and thinking that they are being serious.
>>145964088
You are stupid. The only comparison and contrast to be made is Subaru wanting to be somebody and Shinji that had to end up being somebody.
>>145966038
It's been past flavor of the month already. It's gone full hell with falseflagging, waifu wars, false crap made up by an attention whore among the info we very little have.
>>145967390
> Subaru
> Gary stu
Are you a fucking idiot? The only gary-stu in the story is Reinhardt. He can only be a hero.
>>145966684
I don't give a shit about accomplishments or shit getting done, I want to see Subaru doing what he can with his life he was given. Any more to call it that comes off as worse.

>>145970644
Because it's still airing. I give it 3-6 months after it ends before we never hear about it again.

>>145970644
>>145970705
Why the fuck are you guys taking the damn bait? Is it that hard to ignore? Wait, why the fuck am I in this thread? Why do I have to explain crap to you people that keep getting triggered by it? Fuck this, I'm out.

>>145964088
I probably prefer Subaru.
While Shinji is relatable, his behavior was just plain annoying to watch. At some point you have to bend the reality of how someone might behave for the sake of the plot actually moving forward. Not everyone can remain practically unchanged through the entire show.
Plus Subaru seems like more of a cultural satire, that is now moving towards becoming a real human bean. While Shinji just maintained his frail self for the most part. Remaining what many would call a big fucking pussy.

>>145964088
>lets compare two completely different character that are both in a tragedy setting just because im OP and i suck a truck-load of dicks!

>>145969972
Subaru is character that revolves around people's views to feel self-worth. He masks most of his crap going about the day when he was paying attention while retracing steps, and was revealed to be worried all that time when masking his real emotions before death and broke down his facade by how people really saw him in the mansion arc. He is character that lacks focus and preparation to die when he starts realizing his own position in the matter that it has been increasingly hopeless and caused mainly by him which prevented him from killing himself (that was being unprepared, he was also unprepared in episode 7 until he felt like he mattered by the end, but this recent arc was him realizing he doesn't matter) and wanting to keep seeking people out to acknowledge his pitiful existance (check episode 14 and 15). In truth, Subaru is only a character that wants self-worth and gains it from others, but that desire leads to being egotistical, selfish and essentially self-centered until he realized by episode 18 that he does not matter nor does anyone expect anything from him. That is what he thought until Rem had her view and expectations for him that he will strive to succeed. That's all there is to it. No portrayal of NEET or some other crap (Subaru is not a NEET , anyways, he's just a truant). That's it.
>>145973067
This thread was about to die, why did you have to bump it?

>>145973140
i like to live on the edge

Subaru. Shinji is a fucking son of a bitch.

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>>145970684
>justifying this show

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shinji as a character is just a bitch

So is subaru to an extent, but at least he has some balls to nut up and continue on

Why aren't mods deleting these IRC shitposting threads?

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>>145973725

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>>145970684

>>145964088
Subaru at his worst wasn't half as bad as Shinji at his best. That and it helps Re:Zero isn't pseudo-intellectual trash where I have to waste 15 minutes looking at an autistic faggot do fucking nothing.

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>>145975121
What are you trying to say? Seriously, this is a Chinese cartoon board and here you are, posting American comics.

>>145964088
Subaru isn't that great.

Shinji is fucking terrible.

>>145964088
Subaru is too much of a Marry Sue in my opinion. I get that he is basically immortal, but still.

At least Shinji had some realism and relatability to him.

>>145968487
How many masturbation scenes does Re:Zero have? How many references to the Bible? How many naked 14 year old?

Checkmate zerofag

>>145968487
Eva is Childhood's End + Brakhage + Kubrick + Ideon + Devilman + Mitsuo Iso + Yoh Yoshinari + Anno's depression, conveyed in visual stream of consciousness form to give a love letter to cinema, a criticism of escapism and the beginning of the superflat movement.

Re:Zero is nothing.

>>145976397
> Mary Sue
Subaru has no abilities whatsoever. He is not perfect nor is he idealistic. What you think of immortality or return by death being his power or ability is undoubtedly a mistaken notion by many people. So far, he never succeeded on his own. He never won. Ever.
>>145976636
"I think praying for a wish is an act of pride. Praying should be for receiving atonement."

>>145964088
Subaru, I hated NGE

>>145976397
>Subaru
>Mary Sue

Even Shinji is more of a mary sue than him, Anon.

>>145968487
Kill yourself

>>145976636
How many references to Greek mythology? How many celestial bodies does NGE have? How many sins does NGE convey as a true embodiment that is literal?
Checkmate.

I hate Mitsubishi.
But I fucking hate Shinji more even if his show is miles better.

>>145964088
Fuck you and this shitty ass thread, and fuck all the re:zero shitposters.

Never compare NGE to fucking Re:Zero. That is literally an insult to anime.

>>145964088
Who is shinji ?

>>145975238
>Re:Zero isn't pseudo-intellectual trash
wew lad

>>145964088
>timeless classic or forgettable garbage
Gee

>>145977127
>>145977185
I'm surprised you are merely insulting your own intelligence at this point. Seriously, this is hook-line-and-sinker considering you decided to come to this thread and become triggered.

>>145977127

But NGE wasn't good.

>>145977466
Nice meme.

>>145977486

It really isn't. If you had an ounce of objectivity you could see it.

>>145977182
Did you know that Acedia is actually Sloth in Latin? Or the fact that Betelgeuse means the 'hands of Orion' in Arabic? Or the great beasts are based off the Cetus, Lepus and Hydra?

Shinji is a whiny faggot, but Subaru is a stupid self-centered retard.
I'll keep a thousand Shinjis over one Subaru

>>145977717
But Shinji is a whiny faggot because he's so self-centered.

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>>145969530

The anime industry and fans have been desperate for another NGE to come along for a while now. It can't really be stated enough how massive an impact NGE had on things and it's influence still runs deep but this also means there are plenty of people that are tired of it and want something new that changes the medium and is the new thing to compare everything to.

Every few years now you get a show that gets massively hyped up and eventually the NGE comparisons start to come. It happened with Madoka and now it's happening with re:zero. Notice though that its 5 years after Madoka came out and nobody really gives a shit about it, or talks about it and it has affected and influenced absolutely nothing.

NGE's success and influence is as much about it's own quality but also being in the right place at the right time. The show and its success is the very specific result of lots of different economic and social things happening in 90's Japan and these conditions don't really exist anymore. There's also the fact that just in terms of production value and animation NGE is a landmark in TV anime and while Madoka and re:zero don't look bad they don't come anywhere close to how visually striking and impressive NGE was when it first aired.

There's other aspects at work of course but this is getting too long anyway

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>>145964088
Someone should make pic related with OP's picture

>>145977922
Was the original facebook post being ironic?

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>>145977922
Feel free to bait your fellow anons with this.

>>145977922
You are essentially idiotic by standards alone. The only compare and contrast to be made is Subaru wanting to be somebody while Shinji had to end up being somebody.
>>145977884
I barely give a fuck about masterpieces or whatever time which anime came at the right time or started an era. To be honest, I hate history as it just keeps repeating itself and no one ever really learns from anything. I'd rather judge a work that is right there and judge it if it were good or not. I am not part of any era whatsoever. If the quality is good, then it is good. Saying anymore is just overthinking. Saying timeless classic or original, I give absolutely no fucks for. If something is good, then it is good. If I like it, I like it. Over-praising is something I don't like.

>>145978077
Stop your bullshit. I can barely give a fuck about shitposting or new people but if you keep comparing, you are baiting under the pretense to insult both works at this point. I am starting to hate both of the fanbases at this point. No matter how many people try to compare each other, both sides and it's people act no better. Keep doing it, you are making everyone look bad.

>>145966038
Re:0 is basically the Eva of our generation

>>145977922
At least Kirito didnt get blacked and cucked

>>145978249
Idiot. Don't call it EVA or anything like that. Comparisons and analogies mean absolutely nothing. They are their own works and treat it like that.

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>>145977884
>Notice though that its 5 years after Madoka came out and nobody really gives a shit about it, or talks about it and it has affected and influenced absolutely nothing.
It's not nice to lie, Anon-kun.

>>145978412
>lie
>Madoka threads are nothing but shipping shit

>>145969578
the faggot means something like it was made in the 90s meaning no catgirl boys, no furry shit and other crap we came up with later on

>>145964088
Shinji at least has Alpha 3 and the last five minutes of 2.2 going for him.

>>145978665
If you think Madoka didn't impact the anime industry and make waves across Japan, you're retarded.

>>145979509
Flamed the hell out with Rebellion though.

>>145977884
>Every few years now you get a show that gets massively hyped up

I literally never heard about re:zero before it aired. Hell I thought the show was gonna be a harem since it was an LN adaptation.

Subaru's a retarded faggot, but I really liked it when we got to see him unleash his autism at the castle and the argument with emilia. He got to express himself in a way that shinji didn't.

>>145979509

It was big and successful but what has it really impacted? What did it change or inspire? All it ended up being was a very successful and very good show that everyone promptly forgot about after it was done. But while it was airing there were fans and figures within the anime industry who were hoping out loud for it to be the new Eva. That didn't happen though.

>>145979561

I mean it gets massively hyped up while airing, not beforehand.

>>145979826
How do you even make a new Eva in this day and age? In my eyes, a new Eva would have to deconstruct something big and fundamentally change the direction the anime industry is headed in.

So maybe if an anime were to kill all of the LN adaptions, haremshit, and monster girls shit?

NGEfags getting murdered ITT

>>145980081
>So maybe if an anime were to kill all of the LN adaptions, haremshit, and monster girls shit?
What if GATE wasn't shit?

>>145980081
>So maybe if an anime were to kill all of the LN adaptions, haremshit, and monster girls shit?

I wonder why you did not list moeshit

>>145979509
Yeah, it make a yurishit impact that's for sure. Yurishit is not as common before Madoka.

>>145975764
Fuck Shitji and Shitbaru

Betelgeuse is where it's at.

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>>145980298
>Fuck Shitji and Shitbaru
The pinnacle of wit and wordplay right here, folks.

>>145980081

Well exactly. Everyone wants a new NGE, but lots don't really understand what that involves or realise that trying to make that is probably going to end in a failure. Anno and Gainax didn't set out to completely change the anime industry although he was aware he was doing something very different.

I'd argue that it's not just about deconstructing something though. I mean look at Madoka and re:zero, they did/do that but they aren't going to lead to anything really changing. At most re:zero might kill off isekai or lead to a lot more grimdark isekaishit. But that's about it.

I think one of the core assets to Eva's success and continued relevance is that its characters feel very realistic and the struggles they all face have a lot of real world applicability. Any teenage anime watcher is probably going to identify uncomfortably with Shinji because they're just as shy and awkward as he is, but the show has lots more characters with realistic and believable problems that people can easily relate to. They also don't act like obnoxious anime stereotypes despite being ripped off and copied in every anime under the sun now.

Shinji.

>>145964088
Let's see
>Shinji is set up from the get go to be emotionally fragile and his character development consists of exploring in just how many ways he is messed up
This makes Shinji feel like a real person with issues and not a contrived plot device.
>Toyota is presented as a cheerful, caring person who goes through immense personal hardship to help the people he cares about but then the character that they developed for him is suddenly replaced with an angry jealous sperg for no other reason than to generate pointless character drama
What's worse is that they then discarded that part of him and he went back to being the same guy was before sperging out. They wasted 5 whole episodes on fucking nothing.
Reee Zero is written by a hack.

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Shinji has a prettier girlfriend

Shinji

>>145980977
Subaru was always a bit of a cunt it was just more noticeable under pressure it wasn't sudden you could see him sperging out as soon as he saw Emilia under pressure.

>>145964181
>At least shinji is in a good series
Correction : At least Shinji is in a regular 6/10 overrated series. And that is The same with Re:Zero.

>>145981674
Yeah, everyone discusses a twenty year old anime even though it's 6/10

>>145981747

nostalgia syndrome. There's like a few anime airing in the 90s so oldies remember most of the 90s show and thinks it's good.

Re:Zero is on another level and the best show with all the show that have aired since the 90s.

>all these buttrustled eva fanboys
At least Re:Zero is entertaining. Eva is just irredeemably terrible that's only liked because muh first serious animu.

>>145981863
You honestly think that people on this board were even alive for the original airing?

>>145981896
>all these buttflustered re;zero fanboys
At least Eva is entertaining. Re;zero is just irredeemably terrible that's only liked because muh first serious isekai.

BY SHINJI! Subaru is a faggot car.

>>145978095
Putting a work of fiction in its proper social and historical context has nothing to do with overpraising, anon. It's basic analysis, especially with a series as influential as Eva.

Not that you have any obligation to do so, though.

>>145979561
>Hell I thought the show was gonna be a harem since it was an LN adaptation.

But it is

>>145982063
>Harem
>only other girl is completely irrelevant for months

lol k

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Why does this show is always getting compared to NGE when a show of the same season that treats about psychology with awesome direction like NGE never gets a mere comparison?

>>145982277
Nobody is watching that

>>145982277

GTFO Mobfag. This discussion is only for intellectuals.

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>>145982370
>>145982384

>>145982277
Mob is good, but Re:zero is the best anime since Eva

>>145982625

Eva is shit. Re:Zero is the best anime of all time.

>>145982625
If you're not baiting, have you seen more than 10 anime?

>>145982277
Mob only started taking the psychology aspect seriously in the last two episodes before it was just his feels counter. But I'm an animeonlyfag so I don't know how far they'll take it.

>>145983388
There were some scenes treating Mob's psychology in the early episodes too, like the end of ep2 where Mob asks himself what he really wants to do or when he's exorcising the ghost at the girl's school.

>>145964088
Shinji is realistic.
Subaru is just a convenient device for torture porn.

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>>145964088
Lord Sauron, of course

>>145978077
People like Berserk, nobody unironically likes EVA, let alone Shinji. It's not gonna work.

>>145983515
>Shinji is realistic

Imagine the kind of person that feels he can relate to Shinji. Probably why Japan is having a birthrate problem.

I will take none

>>145964088
Personally, shinji struck a chord with me, and his struggles were applicable to a lot of real world scenarios. Along with the other interesting characters, their interactions were dynamic and evoked a lot of intriguing ideas.

Subaru however, isn't all that interesting to me. His character has the potential to be complex, but because him and every other character rants everything, it's all spelled out to the viewer, and therefore not as interesting.
And he's an obnoxious faggot, so there's that.

>>145983899
> If you were a teenager and had to face terrible enemies to save the world, what would you do?
Shinji runs away. Subaru tries to be the hero. Shinji is a normal kid. Subaru is a device.

>>145964088
I'm tired of this bullshit. Why are people comparing Shinji to Subaru? The two characters have nothing in common. Re:Zero isn't even about social interaction.
When will /a/ stop being retarded?

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>>145964088
>Let's settle this once and for all, Subaru or Shinji?
>Not posting the king

>>145986277
Who

I feel like shinji would have given up after 3 or so deaths and Subaru would not be very good at handling a Eva since he is afraid to die so personally I like the two in my opinion

>>145985811
There is a large age difference and one is technically immortal.

>>145985004
No one was actually right about their criticism for Subaru although Anastasia as close, Priscilla didn't spell anything out while Emilia and Crusch were straight up wrong. Subaru'a arguments are actually correct despite being the one in the wrong which is why he has a hard time getting over himself.

>>145986517
Subaru sees and suffers a lot of shit and keep going as if it was easy. He is a plot convenience. That's the point. Torture porn, the show.

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>>145982370
>>145982384

>>145985932
>When will /a/ stop being retarded?
You're on a board that discusses the worst garbage aired every season like it's the best shit ever. They will never stop being retarded.

>>145987056
/a/ BTFO

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>>145964088
Try making this thread again 20 years from now.

>>145978249
eeehhhh no.

Eva never had a flock of cliche doves fly by in the middle of waiubait's speech on how much she loves the pathetic MC.

>>145978249
Re:0 is the overrated "Monster of the Week Harem" shit with a garbage ending "intelectual" weebs feel good for understending of our generation?

>>145987572
Your post is buzzwordiest post of our generation

>>145987166
>Try making this thread again 2 seasons from now.
ftfy

>>145987264
Instead it had heavy christian symbolism "because it looked cool".

>>145987629
ok

>>145975121
>Comics
Go fuck yourself you fucking faggot >>>/co/mblr

>>145964181
this

>>145987638
And ?

>>145987942
It lacks contextually meaning entirely instead of just being overused like the doves.

Are people actually making this comparison?
That's fucking sad man.

It like comparing Sword Art Online with Lain regarding philosophical themes. Or Hibike Euphorium and Ping Pong when it comes to the actual art (not art design)

>>145989296
Don't argue with children. While quality is not subjective, it also doesn't equal enjoyment. I myself hold NGE in high regards while also enjoying to watch (the good parts of) Re:0.

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>>145964088
What a retarded question.

>>145964088
Subaru is a better character
Shinji is a better fuccboi

>>145982277
One and mob are for patricians with superior taste, so of course no one on /a/ discusses it.

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>>145982384
>intellectuals
>on a anime discussion board

>>145964088
Shinji because he never dies.

Would Shinji and Subaru get along with each other?

>>145991414
Shinji's character is he doesn't get along with anyone, so no.

As characters they're not really analogous to each other the way OP thinks they are. It's not the same journey.

Having said all of that, I actually hate ShinJim, he was literally born into that world and he still had to be a sour puss about it. Basically like Gendo, I feel the little shit should've never been born.

>>145970157
Asuka got fucked up the worst, too. Several times.

At least Subaru can just run away, Shinji can't even do that.

>>145991486

Still, he lived peaceful life before even knowing the existence of the Angels and the reason he was a sour puss was because he was dragged out of his peaceful and was made into piloting a combat unit.

>>145993961
Not actually true, although I don't think Subaru has quite thought out this scenario yet:

>Subaru goes somewhere to live in isolation
>Lives out his days in relative peace
>Dies of old age
>Satella then returns him back from death to the checkpoint she wants him at

Now let's say he just keeps trying to repeat this
>dozens of deaths later
>Witches' scent is so strong, he attracts monsters from hundreds of miles away even in the city
>They wreck the city and kill Subaru
>Now stuck in an infinite timeloop of reviving and getting killed by monsters

>>145964088
>subaru
Toyota is better.

>>145986517
Oh they were right. Crusche never said he was wrong about. But the fact she would gain nothing from it exactly, his behavior making her believe it may be a him believing a lie is a truth, and the fact that he is only doing it for revenge. Based on his behavior and the fact she would gain nothing from it, or the fact that the info is very shady coming from Subaru and him just saying I know is just bad.
Priscilla was right. Subaru was willing to put his pride on the line for revenge to get what he wants. Is that not greed?
Anastasia knew Subaru did not bother being perceptive in the whole situation and was acting childish. He was pretty bad in negotiations since there should be a gain in a agreement.