fucking magical girls

I am willing to entertain the idea that Kill la Kill is a magical girl anime. More magical girl than Utena.

The nice thing about Madoka is that it takes the typical magical girl stuff and gives them dark implications. Most other dark magical girl anime only are dark themselves, they don't make other magical girl anime dark too.

to be honest I don't know a lot about magical girl so I may be one of those people you are talking about.

>It's amazing how series like Yuki Yuna and Symphogear are aimed towards young girls, our cartoons should do that too.

Literally no one thinks this.

Fuck off with this meta garbage. Who cares what idiots think?

>>142638756
Why did you bump this shitty thread dude?

>>142637298
>How can they say they love something when they don't even bother to read up on the history behind it
You sound like a very fun fellow.

>Utena is all about being a strong woman and smashing the patriarchy
>I don't really like any mecha shows except for Code Geass and Eva, but those aren't REALLY mecha shows, they're about the characters
>I love retro anime, Outlaw Star, Patlabor, Ranma, I've seen it all
>Anime has always been moeshit dude, check out these screenshots from a 80's children's show

etc
Western anime fanbase is filled with retards from top to bottom, you just need to learn to ignore it

>>142638756
Kill la Kill is not a magical girl anime.

My only regret is that when the creators said this, it wasn't recorded so I can't cite it on Wikipedia and edit the page so it doesn't say it is.

>>142639680
"moeshit" is a meaningless shitposting term so I don't know what you mean by that even ironically, but moe has existed in anime since forever. CGDCT not so much.

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>>142637298
>Magical girl series are feminist!
It really depends on what you consider feminist. Sally is pretty tradition breaking if you ask me.

It doesn't help that a lot of the good stuff isn't translated. Currently, I'm working trough the toei majokko series, and while I can understand Japanese well enough to enjoy it, it's not enough to translate it.

I also have this hunch that at least the most popular ones like Megu and Sally are going to be picked by a company now that there is some interest in streaming old stuff.

Also, best girl.

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>This archetype is currently being called "Homu-clone" despite already being saturated to the point of parody by 2001

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>>142637298
YEAH! I like magical girls too!

>>142641003
The creators don't get to decide what genre it is. We have to determine its genre based on what the anime actually is.

I am not saying Kill la Kill is a magical girl anime, but it has some characteristics that makes it worth considering, if nothing else, to come up with a good definition for the genre.

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>>142641730

>>142641530
>>142641730
>Character is named Mami
>Is a slut
A tradition kept in the genre ever since the days of Sally.

>>142637298
Damn you're getting awful upset about a bunch of opinions few, if any people actually have.

This thread is shit but I'd just like to put out there that I'm watching Heartcatch and Tsubomi is really cute.

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>>142641784

>>142641203

That was the point, people draw false parallels between incidental moe spawning from children's shows like Minky Momo or side characters in old scifi, and things deliberately manufactured to appeal to otaku fetishization of cute with no scope beyond that (cgdct)

>>142641003
>My only regret is that when the creators said this, it wasn't recorded
So how do you know they said it?

>>142641578
I don't know if I agree. This isn't even within the scope of "death of the author."

If they make a show based on the tropes of magical girls, it's probably a magical girl show.

If they make a show based on tokusatsu, which they did, it's probably not a magical girl show.

>>142642045
I was there.

>>142641003
Genre isn't black and white but it's obviously got similarities, not something to huff and puff over.

>>142642161
Or maybe your just retarded?

>>142642161
Of course, and I realize this line of logic is basically inherently flawed, but it seems like the only basis that it's a "magical girl" show is from people who have no idea what they're talking about, like western reviews.

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>>142641840
Oh yeah, Cutie Honey and Megu-chan's fan service are merely "incidental", sure.

The problem with cgdct is that it's boring if compared to classic shows. With no plot beyond the girls chilling.

Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne was pretty dark.
Sailor Moon manga was pretty dark
Wedding Peach sometimes too

I would say Nanoha was more revolutionary than Madoka

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>>142637298

>>Magical girl series are feminist!
They literally are.

>>142642288
In how they actually affected the industry, I'd agree.

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Which magical princess gets your holy up?

>>142638815
I definitely think that we should show Symphogear to young girls world wide.

>>142642223
That's probably fair, but it begs the question as to why you even give a shit about western anime criticism in the first place?

>>142642244
There are lots of great cute girls shows, don't be a weenie.

>>142642469
I don't, it's seeing it on Wikipedia using that logic (the sources for its genre being western reviews) that's annoying.

Witches are the best magical girls

>>142642244

Incidental might have not been the right word, but that's the point I made, that it's just a certain kind of fanservice with all other elements stripped out.

Plus (the original) Cutie Honey is shounen anyway, or at least some kind of cobbled together mix of demographics, not really in the same vein as the majokka stuff.

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>>142642379

>>142641429
what archetype?

>>142643138
Purple haired lesbian.

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>>142642288
Megu-Chan had like, 7 of its episodes banned in the European adaptation because they were too dark.

Sally also had a sudden burst of sad stories between episode 80 and 89 (Probably because that is when the cancellation of the series was confirmed so they didn't have to worry anymore) with two stories involving death and one "magic can't heal" that is the harshest them all (despite the fact it also features Sally at her most badass mood)

Anyway, Madoka's thing was always execution, furthermore, it was fully dedicated to delivering a sad experience. The thing is, Urobuchi wasn't familiar enough with what is a magical girl (he literally never watched any before meguka) so he couldn't possibly do the "deconstruction" that some people say Madokers did.

>>142641840
Thing is this 'deliberate manufacture' of moe you speak of can be said about old anime sci-fi characters as well. A lot of people argue this, but CGDCT like Bakuon and mountain lolis isn't a byproduct of anything but the mangaka/author's interest in something and them being otaku themselves. In this case bikes/futa or mountain climbing while also liking cute girls. Then you have GA and it's art. Obviously there's shit like Sketchbook which treads more to SoL and less on the otaku hobbyist side but saying it's manufactured is incorrect.

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It's really bizarre that Go Nagai did Tickle of all things, I would never have realized it by myself.

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>>142637298

>>142639111
I'm not sure if that makes someone a hipster, a snob, or both.

Either way, it's obnoxious.

>>142637298
You're just experiencing what mecha fans have experienced since Evangelion, and again during Gurren Lagann.

>>142643755
If someone called thought western movies started at Clint Eastwood it's only natural someone would call them out.

Why the fuck shouldn't people do the same to anime genres?

>>142643814
Fortunately it doesn't make Eva, Gurren Lagann, or Cutie Honey bad.

>>142643934
Nobody was implying that

>>142643864
I'd agree if you're making anime or trying to provide profound cultural or analytical commentary on the subject, but this isn't an all-or-nothing thing. I'm not sure it's fair to expect everyone who consumes anime to be well-versed in the entire history of whatever sub-type they're watching.

Plus, the best commentary on that kind of thing should be able to provide "Ohhh" moments to casual viewers, rather than just calling them out for being uneducated plebes. In fact, as someone who might know a thing or two about it, one could argue that it's your responsibility to do so, preferably without being a condescending shit about it.

>>142644058
Trust me, there are people who do.

>>142644143
People who judge something based on who like it and what they say rather than the thing itself are just stupid though.

>>142644192
Yes.

>>142638815
ANN just did, saying that stuff like YuYuYu and Madoka sells because it empowers girls

>>142644218
>all that Akihabara marketing for meguca
>the otaku staff - Urobuchi, Ume etc.
>the VN and other multimedia releases for YuYuYu and the seinen demographic manga
Retarded delusion.

>>142644304
>all markets are the same
>the western market doesn't matter
Retarded delusion.

>>142644476
Yes, it doesn't.

>>142644476
>western market
It's irrelevant and minuscule and therefore not the reason it sells at all. I never stated it was the only market.

Saying KLK isn't A magical girl show is like saying EVA isn't a super robot show because it doesn't have any robots. You're not technically wrong, but you're pretty full of it.

>>142644611
Whaaat? I don't follow.

Eva is a mecha show because it has mecha.

KLK is not a magical girl show because it does not have magical girls.

>>142644611
Reasons why KLK is a magical girl show, go

>>142644611
I'd say Eva is more real than super

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>>142639111
>>142643755

Look, when you hear someone start talking about the history of magical girl anime and it's themes and shit, why the fuck would you not expect them to know what they're talking about? Doing shit like saying 'I'm making something based off of the magical girl genre because it's so progressive about sexuality and aimed towards little girls!' and they list two fucking series that are Meguca because muh darkness that was never done before, Sailor Moon because muh childhood, and two yuri fanservice shits for old men because that's what they really want.

Fuckers acting like Madoka invented evil mascots and fighting, like Sailor Moon was the first magical girl anime ever, and everything is about muh lewd + muh plot twists.

>>142644611
Basically people like this anon right here.

>>142644476
The only time the west mattered for Magical girls was when bewitched became popular.

Speaking of the west, Star is kinda fun

>>142644861
I know people that would have a heart attack if they found out that magical girl anime was built off of Bewitched.

>>142642091
Didn't Sailor Moon combine magical girl and tokusatsu? Isn't the reason why people are confused, and equate tokusatsu tropes with magical girl tropes, because the only older magical girl anime they've seen (heard of) is Sailor Moon?

>>142637298
Kill la Kill is just trigger version of Project A-ko

>>142644974
Sailor Moon combined magical girls with sentai, is my understanding.

>>142643755
>>142639111
>dumbfucks try to argue

>>142644974
But what makes Sailor Moon a magical girl show and not toku? The majority of magical girl shows after Sailor Moon are far more toku than anything, does that make them not magical girls? I think that's silly.

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Symphogear was the Card Captor Sakura of the Nanoha genre.

>>142645194
>Tokusatsu (特撮) is a Japanese term that applies to any live-action film or television drama that features considerable use of special effects

>>142645194
That doesn't make it not a magical girl show, and it doesn't make other shows that share those trappings either magical girl shows or not either.

>>142645226
Madoka was the Ren & Stimpy of the magic girl genre.

>>142645226
This is what I'm talking about. There is no magic in Symphogear, there is only machines. Functionally they act like magic, but they're not. So then you have Nanoha where they call it magic, but it's the same as Symphogear, they're just high tech gizmos. In Madoka, they outright just say "well to lower life forms like you, super science just looks like magic, so we call it magic." Are any of these shows magical girl shows? They're so far removed from your Fancy Lala and your Creamy Mami, they're just schoolgirls with super powered alter-egos fighting space crime.

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>>142644611
That's like saying Dragon Ball or Fate/Whateverthefuck a magical boy genre. Just because the MC happens to be female who transforms doesn't mean she's immediately in a magical girls show.

>>142645732
This is kind of like people who say EVA isn't mecha because they're based on biological forms; it doesn't matter.

>>142645068
It borrows, and the whole "pretty soldier" idea feels distinctly like sentai (much more than toku in general), so the influence is undeniable. I think as time went on, fighting mahou shoujo shows gradually drew more and more from it, particularly whenever they were trying to appeal to more boys, who grew up on it.

A more shameless and direct (early) combination would be something like Yes! Precure 5, which doesn't really seem to have boys in mind but definitely plays out the "sentai with magical girls" idea. Not too surprising, since it's Toei too.

>>142645194
>>142645282
The last magical girl anime I can remember that didn't involve sentai fighting was Kamichu.

I feel like the genre basically became Sailor Moon ripoffs.

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Sailor Moon is the second greatest anime of all time.

>>142645194
>But what makes Sailor Moon a magical girl show and not toku?
The fact that its not live action done with practical special effects.

The "magical girl is toku" link is mostly due to the fact that magical girl shows are similar to toku show when it comes to the general outline of a typical show from either of the two, the main difference is the medium(Live action and anime) and the audience they are targetting.
Toku tend to be catered to little boys(At least in the past), and were about being heroes and whatnot, fighting off monsters of the week, maybe some friendship and romance along the way.
Magical girl shows aim for the little girls, and were about being heroes and whatnot, fighting off monster of the week, and maybe some friendship and romance along the way.

See the pattern yet?

But nowadays, the two have changed or widened their target audience, there are housewives watching toku for the cute guys(Kamen Rider, for instance), there are guys watching magical girl anime for the cute girls(Or alternatively, the battles).

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>>142645732
Fuck you, Hibiki is a miracle of the universe so great that she can only be explained as magic.

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>>142645741
Speaking of magical boys, wasn't Toei supposed to be doing some sort of OVA or promo video about this?

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>>142646152
2hu version of symphogears need not apply.

>>142646058
Doesn't Pleiades count?

>>142646261
Yes it does.

>>142637298
>Kill la Kill
>Ryuko is a girl
>transforms with a transformation sequence in a superpowered suit
So, why is she not a magical girl?

>>142646261
Pleiades was really odd
>Outright says it's all science from the start
>Follows classical magical girl stuff closer than a lot of recent witch girl series

>>142646363
Because girls that transform aren't inherently magical girls.

>>142646058
We just had Jewelpet: Magical Change.

>>142642288
I wouldn't call Nanoha revolutionary when it was pretty similar to Akihabara Dennou-gumi.

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Does LilPri count? I remember that TMS was supposed to do a 3rd (2nd was a all CG show from Studio 4C) series for Fox staring Zooey Deschanel in the English version (along side Tress MacNeille, Tara Strong and Cree Summer) but they canceled it (most likely due to TMS' cost).

>>142646363
Aliens and machinery are not magic, no matter how magical they may appear.

>>142646556
Fuck off, Famicom.

Fuck, does Cocotama count? The only real difference between it and, say, something like Pastel Yumi is that the girls need to tell their cute mascot friends to use their magic instead of using the magic directly itself.

>>142646698
I was not the one who brought that news years ago, that was TMSGuy (HamSandMan77 over at TV Tropes).

Just answer me "Does LilPri count?"

>>142646757
No as the main human character lack magic skills.

And the gods won't end up like Kratos.

>>142646577
Then are Symphogear not magical girls?

>>142646757
>does Cocotama count?
Of course not, Kokoro isn't the one using the magic, she's just doing contracts with magical gods while those gods are the ones doing the magic.

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>>142646073

>>142646082

>nowadays

That's been going on since the 80s at the very least.

There is basically a Super Robot / Real Robot kind of divide in magical girl shows, and that is the seinen (Symphogear, Madoka, Nanoha) and shoujo (Pretear, Shugo Chara, Doremi), which are very different in terms of everything except some shared imagery.

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>>142646913
And if one of them falls out of line, he has to kill them.

>>142646073
This.

>>142646073
The manga was better.

>>142647047
Not this shit again

>>142646552
I so need to look that up then.

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>>142646556
Absolutely. Magical Idol Singers have been a part of the magical girl genre since Creamy Mami

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That cancer episode.

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>>142647256
It was pretty fun, and then it becomes deep, but it's still fun.

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Hitler loves magical girl shows.

>>142644611
Eva isn't super robot in the slightest.

>>142647387
Thank you.

>>142641794
>he doesnt know creamy mami

>>142648175
>He thinks I wasn't including her

Is Saikano a magical girl show?
Or would it be if Chise were the main character?

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>>142648377
To be a magical girl show you need to have 3 things

1. Magical transformations
2. Girls
3. High amounts of rape

>>142637298
Is Milky Holmes is mahou shojou?

>>142637298
How was Madoka not the first Magical Girl Anime to explore "such" dark themes?

>>142648664
Yes. It's actually a remake of Azukin ChaCha.

>>142639680
>Mecha shows are only mecha shows if it's not about the characters

Who the fuck thinks like that? Apart from people who never watched a single mecha show, of course.

>>142648767
Because other shows did before it.

>>142642132
You're like that one faggot I saw back when I was trolling the official Sonic forums, who told us that he didn't need to provide proof since "I AM a source!"

>>142648888
Okay. If that was the case I would have already edited the page.

Imaishi's next show is going to be mecha, by the way.

>>142643631
Creamy Mami?

>>142648864
Which one?

>>142648545
I'm not too sure about #3 there

>>142649062
Pretear is about the evil main bad girl breaking another girl down until she summons an evil life sucking tree. Her boyfriend gets murdered by it.

Kamikaze Kaitou Jeanne is about Satan continually destroying a girl's life to bring her to despair. Her cute pet/partner is a fallen angel and she finds out too late she's been working for Satan the entire time and the boy she's been fighting against is the hero. The hero still outright murders someone because he has something they need.

Sailor Moon has death galore.

>>142649062
What is doremi.

>>142649628
Don't forget how the evil main girl of Pretear was also like the main girl, except she couldn't save anyone and all her friends died.

>>142648545
Cardcaptor Sakura has no real magical transformations

>>142649676
Not what you think it is. Doremi has no dark elements whatsoever.

>>142639680
>it's not moe if it's a kids' show

>>142649062
>In one episode of the original 1969 series, Akko-chan attempting to be sympathetic to a deaf-mute kid, Akko-chan wishes to be a deaf-mute version of herself. In a really scary turn of events, after merrily prancing around in her deafened state, Akko-chan finds herself stuck with deaf-muteness: since the Literal Genie quality of the mirror kicked in, she loses her ability to enunciate words, and despite her heartwrenching attempts, the mirror refuses to acknowledge her repeated (and silent) pleas. She was ultimately changed back, but only because the magic mirror was revealed to believe Akko-chan's desire for deafness shallow and impulsive, and wanted to show her how serious a handicap it is.

Gotta love the sixties. Majokko Meg-chan also had dark shit happening. Mamono Hunter Yohko was entirely dark shit, although it wasn't aimed towards girls. For some more recognizable shit,

>Princess Tutu is Princess Tutu.
>Kaitou Jeanne had the mascot actually be the bad guy.
>Card Captor Sakura has wonderful things like failure meaning the erasure of love.
>Sailor Moon is literally Warhammer 40k half the time.

>>142649897
The witch trials, the cancer episode, the racism/white guilt episode the divorce that killed childhood.

I love the Doremi is dark meme. Actually Smile precure has way more sadness in it though.

>>142649628
Even Mermaid Melody has dark undertones in it.

>>142650023
>Actually Smile precure has way more sadness in it though.
Only one episode.

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>>142638756
>they don't make other magical girl anime dark too.

works of fiction are separate and while they may make homages and references to previous works they don't retroactively have bearing on the universes of said works

Mink Momo has Momo get run over in the last episode.

>>142649961
>Sailor Moon is literally Warhammer 40k half the time.
Explain this one.

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>>142650306
The entire time they were fighting Chaos in different forms. Chaos the entity/force. It's behind all of the enemies that Sailor Moon has ever faced.

http://sailormoon.wikia.com/wiki/Chaos

>>142649984
Doremi have realistic episodes, not dark. It shows hurtful things that happen irl but at the end of the day everything ends right, except for Non-chan.

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Wow. I hadn't expected my venting thread to get so many posts.

Thank you.

>>142650854
Doremi seems more touching to me than emotional or dark. Almost like they included those moments even though it was about difficult feelings but not just because it was, the way you might if you really wanted to fish for an emotional reaction out of your viewers.

>>142650854

Reality is dark. It's a necessary part of appreciating things and happiness.

The buzzword you're looking for is edgy, which is reserved for garbage like Madoka.

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>>142637298
Well OP, you're right that there's a generation of anime watchers that have both misappropriated magical girl anime to political ends and also don't have a grasp of magical girl anime outside of mold breaker series like Madoka and Utena or best sellers like Sailor Moon and Sakura

But at the same time most magical girl anime are a fucking slog to get through and it's not that different than a generation of fat greasy otaku who beat it to precure. I can't really blame people for not bothering to watch real magical girl anime made for young girls. Of course I do but even I can only get through so much in a day. I mean, /a/ makes fun at people for eating shit with overly long shonen series, but then calls people out for not eating shit with shoujo series? Makes no sense.

You see this shit? I can't fap to this

>>142652307
You were supposed to fap with Vanila.

>Makes no sense.
It makes sense when you realize /a/ is really full of little girls.

>>142652307
Not all magical girl series are episodic, anon. Shit like Creamy Mami can easily be marathoned.

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>>142652307
Not everything is good.

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>>142652307
>Can't fap to a show literally about semen demons seducing men

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>>142652376
>You were supposed to fap with Vanila.

>>142652044
>Reality is dark
No, it's not, reality could be optimistic or pessimistic, it just need the ackwnoledge issues that anyone could have.

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>>142652376
>You were supposed to fap with Vanila.

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>>142641730
70s were really interesting times

>>142652682
That's also a pretty good Vanila.

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>>142652307
We're all young girls here. That's why it should make you angry that a bunch of smelly old men are consuming offbrand ass/tit shot yuri-bait trash while claiming that they love magical girl anime when they really just like to fap to underage lesbians. They name two popular ones that they maybe kind of remember from their childhood, and the rest is Madoka and post Madoka.

They're like fujoshits but worse, because at least fujoshits admit that the series they cream over aren't for them.

As for why I'm so butthurt, I got suckered into playing a game of Magical Burst with someone who told me that Cutie Honey was the first magical girl anime. And then I read the alpha for Magical Burst v5 and it was full tumblr. Kill me now.

>>142653120
Hold on, there's nothing wrong with lesbians.

>>142649062
>>142649062
Even Sailor Moon was pretty dark time to time

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>>142637298
>Cutie Honey is the first magical girl series.

Not conventionally, no. But it was the first to carry certain tropes that would later become magical girl staples like instant "magical" transformations, ally of justice, super-powers, ect.

Cutie honey is closer to a solo heroine sentai than anything else and sentai didn't officially make it into the magical girl genre until Sailor Moon.

Early magical girl shit is pretty boring and uneventful.

>>142653120
And the worst part is how fujoshits at least buy their shit, while a ton of yuribait shows don't sell at all.

>>142653187
Sailor Moon had to reset time twice, because everyone kept dying. The ending was them dying.

>>142653290
>Not conventionally, no. But it was the first to carry certain tropes that would later become magical girl staples like instant "magical" transformations, ally of justice, super-powers, ect.

It was not. Transforming and magical powers, and even helping people, were in the genre before Cutie Honey happened.

>>142653293
Technically Madoka is only a poor mans Sailor Moon

>>142653369
It really is, and 99% of people act like I have no fucking clue what I'm talking about when I say that Madoka didn't do anything new.

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>>142653293
She didn't reset time, she literally brought them back to life which was her advanced ability that she could do at will as long as she had access to their Sailor Crystal.

End of Sailor Moon was everyone getting absorbed into the universe's primordial soup.

>>142653369
>>142653420

I've seen Sailor Moon in the 90's and Madoka as soon as it came out, and I have to tell you: You're both full of shit, bratty little know-it-alls who know nothing about Magical Girls as a genre. Maybe one day you will start admitting that you don't know a flying fuck, and start to learn about the various sub-genres.

>>142637298
> Symphogear aimed to young girls

sure, totally not a series to sell Cd to Otaku. Not that I complain. NANA WILLS IT

>>142653489
The first season of the anime reset time. The manga is bad and not worth discussing.

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>>142653361
How about giving some fucking examples to show you point rather than just telling me I'm wrong? Transforming into a "hero" that fights evil was certainly a Cutie Honey thing.

>>142653549
>anime
>canon

Come on the anime as far as cohesive universe building was shit. Its autistic to try and hold it to any logic other than fun. You don't have to like the manga but it fit together through all the arcs.

Even so anime Sailor Moon did not reset time, she just revived everything to how it was before. A semantic point but it is different.

>>142653667
It wasn't Sailor Moon either, it was the silver crystal.
It also erased everyone's memories of all the Sailor Moon-related shit, which was painfully illogical and got awkwardly undone two episodes later anyway

>>142653667
The manga didn't fit shit together. Especially in the beginning where Takeuchi couldn't even decide what powers Usagi had, or basically fucking anything. (No, the anime wasn't any better at that - I just didn't care.)

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>>142653558
How about you reading comprehension my post. Also, Ribbon no Kishi was a prototype example of the magical girl genre when it was starting out in the 60s. The main character fought evil often and had an angel as a sidekick.

>>142652396
Oh I've been looking for a good series to marathon lately, I think I'll try this then. I've been watching Heartcatch but it's tough to watch a lot in a row.

>>142654045
Creamy Mami is genuinely the best magical girl series I've ever seen and a must-see classic.

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>>142649392
Whaaaaaat?

>>142637298
Does anybody remember in which magical girl series, where the girls try to become queens of the magic realm, were they born from witch eggs?

>>142654105
That's high praise, I'm looking forward to it.

>>142637298

People that got into anime only within the past couple years thanks to crunchy roll have a really fucked up and skewed view of things. Just utterly utterly clueless and it's bleeding into other sites now, even /a/

>>142646211
That blue-eyed boy is very cute.

>>142639680

Spot on

>>142654571
What was his magical girl form again? Ah, I remember, it was Blue Eyes White Dragon

>>142641820

On the contrary I think it's worth while. Anime fanbase needs to own it's shit and get called out for it once in a while

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http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2016-06-07/gdgd-fairies-staff-reveal-maho-shojo-naria-girls-original-anime-for-july/.102932

The genre is saved.

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>>142654755
>gdgd fairies
Mother of god

>>142642288

Honestly the biggest lasting thing to come out of Madoka is people's lingering obsession with Gen Urobuchi, edgy time reset story concepts and Shaft. Never mind Gekidan Inu Curry which contributed a ton to the shows visual style but is hardly ever referenced anywhere or the fact that the shoe noticeably draws a fuck ton of influence from Princess Tutu

>>142637298
>How can they say they love something when they don't even bother to read up on the history behind it
bet you're real fun at parties fampai

get a fucking life, nobody don't have time for that shit

>>142654873
At least you know it'll be super meta, though I'm kinda getting sick of that lately.

>>142646386
>that episode where one of the girls has to fly like an entire month straight through space all alone while a mindless doppelgänger replaces her real self so she can find a piece of a spaceship floating above a dying star

>heterosexual romance

Yeah it was pretty weird.

>>142637298
People are ignorant and have no desire to change. More news at 11.

>>142643202

This. Gen Urobuchis biggest take way from old anime seems to be of all things Zeta Gundam, is in that genre that Western fans claim not to like at all but that their favorite writer is obsessed with and even wrote an essay about. I bet he probably plays Super Robot Wars games when he's in down time like Hikaru Midorikawa

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>>142654949
>though I'm kinda getting sick of that lately
So am I

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>>142654949
I think Maji de Otaku na English! Ribbon-chan had almost the exact same premise.

>>142644740

If it's regularly featured in Super Robot Wars there's a good chance it's a mecha franchise

>>142655055

Being Meta is something that feels exhausting in all anime made in the last couple of years. Nowadays they've taken it one step further (being meta about their meta-ness), but even that gets old really quick. If every show makes fun of tropes you don't have any shows on which your jokes are based on anymore

>>142655083
There's been a few shows that have gone past the tiny bit of navel-gazing and self-awareness that mahou shoujo have taken on to having a full-blown premise that's about taking the piss out of everything about it (or at least being very, very self-aware about everything it does).

In b4 someone calls it a deconstruction, though.

>>142655222
Actual kids shows play these ideas straight, and probably generally will. Take Boku no Hero Academia, for instance, especially hot on the heels of OPM. I think maybe that's why I still like Precure so much, even though it's usually kind of shit.

>>142655011
>that episode where one of the girls has to fly like an entire month
It wasn't nearly that long for the girl due to time dilation.

>>142641578
>The creators don't get to decide what genre it is.

What? GRRM wanted to write a medieval fantasy with Game of Thrones. Sucks to be him then.

>>142646577
>Sailor Moon=Aliens
>Precure=Alternate dimensions but basically aliens and definatley so in Heartcatch but we'll exlude mahou
>Tokyo Mew Mew=genetic science vs aliens
>Madoka=Recruited by Aliens
There are more aliens in the genre than there is magic.

>>142637298
Kill la Kill can pass as a magical girl series.
>Protag tranforms into a costume with bonus fighting capability through transformation sequance
>heavy focus on fashion and clothing
>Power is derived from friendship and positive feelings and relationships
>Fight a vague aliens enetity
Totally passes as a Magical Girl show, if an unconventional one.

>>142645732
Doesn't Creamy Mami get her powers from an alien?

>>142657218
Yeah, but the alien is magic.

>>142657274
But it's still called an alien, even has a spaceship!

The Magical Girl genre runs pretty much on the mushiest soft science you can get but it's still (fictional) science.
Aliens are more prominent in the genre than outright fantasy elements. Even some cute witch/magical girl shows feature them.

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>>142657430
And don't that just throw you for a loop?

>>142656972
When it comes to Kill la Kill being a magical girl anime, I think it could be interesting to look at the mascot animal character.
Because it kinda does have that, in the form of the school uniform. It does, in many ways play the usual role of a mascot character. It is different in that it isn't a cute animal, but it's still interesting I think. It could be interesting to look at what defines an animal like this in terms of Magical Girl.

>>142647426
It was bad, I'll give you that, and completely forgettable as I just had to rewatch it completely. However, the series has worse episodes (see onpu's naisho episode, for example).

>>142657619
>Because it kinda does have that, in the form of the school uniform. It does
I actually forgot to note that.
>Non human character that mentors and assists the protagonists and is or tied to the source of her power
Shows like Shugo Chara had non animals as their mascot companion, I don't see why a sentient clothes item wouldn't pass.

>thread about magical girls
>precure not mentioned in OP
shit thread

If Cutie Honey Flash still is Magical Girl, Kill La Kill sure as hell is. The first show in ages to put a complete new spin on the Genre.

>>142647426
>>142657945
Never fucking mind, I just figured out you were refering to the literal cancer episode, not the one in the filename. I'm stoned and should go to bed.

>>142641003
>Ryokos japanese voice actress was 27 at the time it was made
>Her German voice actress was 47.

Kill me.

>>142658065
I wasn't aware that Precure was made in the 60s.

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Vividred is explicitly Science! (but not quite mecha musume), but even then they had Grandpa turn into a ferret to be the token mascot animal.

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>>142658065
You have already a whole thread for that excuse of magical girls show.

>>142658232
To be fair, in fiction "science" is a shorthand for "magic" more often than not anyway, so unless it's a really hard "hard sci fi" show you can still call it magical girl without putting the "magical" in air quotes.

>>142658242
I like all iterations of magical girl shows, including Precure, but it's by far not my most favorite show of the Genre. Unfortunately it seems like the only show running right now.

How's Nurse Witch Komugi-chan as a Magical Girl show? I mean the new series, not the OVA.

>>142649961
>Akko-chan
I'm intrigued enough to watch this episode.

>>142656972
All of those are hallmarks of other genres as well and not exclusive to the magical girl genre.

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>>142649961
>It's a Chappy discovers what people did to the witches in the past episode

>>142658427
The majority of people didnt like it, but I thought it was a decent little show. Not really something I'd watch unless it was airing. It also has some idol segments that aren't that bad.

>>142649715
Calling out the staff counts

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>>142658372
You should learn Korean. Flowering Heart is adorable.

>>142652307
I never understood why episodic is a problem really. I also think the average /a/ user should try to consume something other than 12 episodes anime.

>>142658691
Yeah but the combination of them and >>142657619 make it as much of a magical girl show as say Princess Tutu or Pleiades.

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>>142658427
I couldn't make it past 4-5 episodes, I found it just too awful.

I watched all of Mahou Shoujo Nante Mou Ii Desukara, though. Not sure that I'm proud of it, or that that makes it a good mahou shoujo, though.

>>142658932

Holy Shit, South Korea has an animation industry producing something other than Ladybug? Since when?

>>142658983
The combination of tropes that aren't necessarily from magical girl shows PLUS a pseudo-mascot make it a magical girl show?

I disagree.

>>142659052
Did they adapt the part where the milton's previous magical girl dies? In the manga it was a "oh shit" moment, that really showed how he cared about the MC. (Kinda like an anti-qb)

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Magical girls you say?

>>142659190
No trope comes or belongs to any genre. But genres are generally built when a few or more specific tropes are used, usually together.

But defining anything as part of a genre is subjective, especially when often something will belong to more then one genre.

>>142658427
It's shit, the original OVA series was a parody of the genre. They fucked it up with the remake, they took seriously everything that was a joke in the OVA.

>>142659449
She-Ra could count as one.

>>142659449
She Ra was the first Magical Girl show I ever watched.

>>142659462
I don't disagree with any of that.

The examples given aren't substantial enough, in my opinion.

>>142659052
not as hard considering it was a 3 mintue show, Komugi was probably better but it was full length so I had trouble getting through all of it too

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>Mahou Roma
>The theme of the story is faustian bargains
>Little cute pet is full of shit and tricks people
>Started out in 2009
>Gets canceled shortly after Madoka's boom
>Author disappears
I bet he was kidnapped by Aniplex, a true shame.

>>142659404
They didn't adapt any shit from the OVA, they made their own thing and slapped Komugi-chan in the title.

>>142659068
Funny you should say that, they actually got a chunk of help from Japan (folks like Ishihira Shinji). I'm not sure, but I think their studio (Iconix) has a top-level connection to Toei, so maybe that shouldn't be surprising.

>>142659404
No, they just played everything for yuks and bullying the whole way through. Kind of like Kumamiko, now that I think about it.

>>142659601
I'm talking about Nante Mou Ii Desukara

>>142642244
>The problem with cgdct is that it's boring if compared to classic shows. With no plot beyond the girls chilling.

That's not really a fair comparison. cgdct shows are supposed to be sitcoms.

>>142659404
Waitwaitwait, I thought this was a funsy little loli show?

>>142659559
Fair enough.

Now that I think of it and relating to >>142659449 I don't count shows that don't have a 'normal' world as a magical girl show.
There's something about the idea that when the character transforms they are entering a different "world" (not in a literal sense) where things can be dealt with through magic/science power, a world different from that of their civilian lives.

Anyone writing their own magical girl series?

>>142659449
But that's a boy.

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>>142642244
>The problem with cgdct is that it's boring if compared to classic shows
Sora no Woto is mostly CGDCT.

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>>142659852

>>142659826
As a matter of fact, well, yes, but I'd rather not go into the details, as it's a niche fetish magical girls series that would disturb /a/, but I've had my fun working on it.

>>142659782
90% of it is, but there is one scene in the manga where Milton is having a nightmare about the past.
I posted the image a couple of times on the airing threads, but right now desu is down.

>>142660047
I think that's a boy too.

>>142654231
Sugar Sugar Rune?

>>142660084
Hmm.
I'm helping a friend write a comic/doujin/point-and-click adventure and decided upon it centering around a magical girl that lives on a island with a orbital elevator in a future that runs on solar power.

The thing is, because of an alien presence on the planet, a lot of people are waking up with strange abilities, and the main characters get their powers from a crystal that they use to transform (but in reality, is a piece of a wishing engine/reality gem used by another alien species to remove the first)

I've been putting a lot of effort into making the writing good, but I'm wondering if I should bother, because like you, it's also got a fetishistic nature (DID), so I'm wondering if anyone will even care. I think the story is decent, but I'm kind of worried that anyone that would be interested would be turned off by that. I guess I could rewrite it later...

Maybe I'm just trying to punch above my paygrade

>>142659826
I'm adding a secret magical girl mode to a WW2 mobile game I'm stuck making. Does that count?

>>142659563
Komugi is terrible because it suffers from severe identity problems. Is it a cheesy send-up to standard mahou shoujo or is it playing it all completely straight? For a show based on Komugi why does it have a really standard shoujo romance (as in feels like it really is aimed at small girls)? Did they really want to make an idol show? Who the hell is the main character supposed to be?

Mou ii was at least consistent with what it was. Even really juvenile stuff like Kuromajo ga Toru is much more palatable because I know what the show is trying to accomplish.

>>142659781
>cgdct shows are supposed to be sitcoms.
That's true and not true. Some shows are really not funny because they aren't really trying to be that other than a few gags. Others aren't funny because the humor is hard to call humorous. You can argue that some are actually sitcoms, but others aren't really even if they have the odd joke. But they're not exactly traditional SoL because the events are still plot contrived and not very true to life.

>>142660912
DID is such an innocuous basic fetish I doubt anyone would be turned off by it. Besides, if it's niche it's niche. A magical girl point and click is already plenty niche so just do whatever else you want because it won't narrow the appeal any.

>>142661199
>>142660912
Dick Inside Dick?

>>142662293
Damsel in Distress

>>142659826
Modding an FPS to make a single player magical girl shooter.

I'm divided between making functional magical girl-appropriate analogues of your usual FPS guns, and the (admittedly tired in 2016) novelty of a cute young girl massacring things with a realistically rendered assault rifle.

>>142660084
>would disturb /a/
/a/ would circlejerk over it

big friends like this thread are a minority

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x203ytl_魔法使いサリー-第１話-かわいい魔女がやってきた-1966_tv

>>142662736
Make it a cute realistic assault rifle

>>142662509
>Unending disappointment

>>142663242
Why not the youtube dubbed version? Eitherway, there are a few episodes of Sally translated on Nyaa

Anyway, Mahou no Mambo is such a fun song, too bad it would be impossible to do an /a/ sings for it on Sally's 50th anniversary

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-l-MmQTsEUw

>>142663482
>dubbed
I meant subbed

>>142663482
Why would it be impossible?

>>142641530
>>142641730
>>142641784
>>142641825

This is severely underrated.

>>142644922
Sabrina the Teenage Witch feels way closer to what magical girl shows actually are than Bewitched.

>>142647225
TOKYO
O
K
Y
O

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>>142653120
Magical burst is one of those games that had the potential to be something really cool but Ewen just went full tumblr after his ERP phase and it just made the game shitty.
t. Magical Burst original playtester

>>142650642
That's dumb bullshit from the manga that doesn't even make the series more dark.

The series is legitimately morally ambiguous is ways that honestly surpass the majority of anime though and this deserves to be praised. I can't think of anythign else that goes as far as it does in portraying anti-natalism sympathetically.

If you are who I think you are, how much of the anime have you gone through at this point?

>>142663920
Idk if there are enough anons that care

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>>142637298
>>Cutie Honey is the first magical girl series.
Who says this?

>>142653120
>We're all young girls here
I don't want to be the little girl. I want to fuck the shit out of the little girl.

>>142663242
How is the quality of something that old so good?

>>142637298
Eh, well anime's sort of "in" right now so of course people are going to go "Hey look at me I'm well informed about this piece of culture that is very relevant please talk to me about it so we can socialize."

As for them being feminist, I'd not say the genre is. There's a bit of a gradient to a piece of media's leanings, I mean let's not be so binary about whether or not a show fills certain qualities that make it feminist.

Magical girls shows sort of are feminist in that they provide examples of empowered girls that can influence the world around them, positively, typically, but there's never really situations in these shows that actively challenge the ideas of gender norms. Like you'll never see mannish alice and her girl-pal posse defeat the dick monster only boys were supposed to be able to defeat.

In the end you have shows that yeah, will provide nice role-models for girls, which is a sort of soft feminism, I suppose, but if any shows within the magical girl genre exist that actively strive against the ideas of a woman's role in society, such shows are the exception rather than the norm.

Like, what, are we going to call Pokemon feminist because some of the gym leaders, elite four members and champions are girls?

>>142664721
The kind of fuck that goes on internet scify debate forums.

>>142664549
>Evil universe destroying threat that corrupts everything it touches isn't similar to the thing that does exactly that, with the exact same name.
>Chaos infects the birthplace of souls
>Wins in the future so hard that Sailor Cosmos comes back in time to tell Sailor Moon to nuke said birthplace of souls
>Turns people into horrific monsters and steals the life force/dreams/souls of others.
>Main character's lover and friends, and future daughter, disintegrate in front of her.
>Big bad brings them back to life and forces them to fight her, so she has to kill them in self defense. Also the big bad kisses her lover too.
>Then she kicks him into the birthplace of stars.
>Also their daughter is erased from existence

Yeah Sailor moon wasn't dark at all. Not like Usagi committed suicide in her first life, after everyone and her lover in the Moon Kingdom got fucking wrekt. I have no idea what you are talking about.

>>142665718
>Like, what, are we going to call Pokemon feminist because some of the gym leaders, elite four members and champions are girls?

>women in positions of power and authority
>all law enforcement and healthcare essentially run by women outside of rare, special cases
>girls are afforded equal opportunity to pursue pretty much everything boys are allowed to do

I mean, yeah, it's pretty benignly feminist.

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>>142665758
totally

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>>142665961
not

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>>142666009
dark

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>>142666058

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>>142666215
Fucking fuck you anon. That's some uncalled for shit, my ribs are leaving Earth's gravitational pull. they're moving on their own!

>>142666215
The fuck?

>>142665906
Well, I agree it is, but like you said it's a benign presentation. Every sign that there are people out there in the world that agree that women can do whatever a man can, fulfills the most basic requirements to be feminist, but past that some messages are more strongly written than others.

Pokemon isn't really saturated with those sorts of ideas, I mean gender not mattering in a lot of situations in the game outside breeding, that's something, but it's not a great big deal in terms of feminist leaning, at least as far as I know.

I suppose there are specific elements present in the games besides that though, that you could also bring to light. As for me, I don't really have too much of a horse in this race though, so I'll take a pass.

>>142665758
>>142665961
>>142666009
>>142666058

Things like having a badguy implicitly kill off tons of unnamed people, or named characters who are then resurrected, is done in children's media all the time.

All this stuff is childish melodrama. It's dark, but no more dark than the anime, which is at least as willing to actually kill of sympathetic, properly developed characters for good, and in more dramatically impact ways. I have massive respect for the way the manga makes Usagi suicidal though, and I consider that one of the few genuinely ballsy things it does.

Is Yuki Yuna any good? I've seen it mentioned around here, about how everyone calls it a Madoka ripoff.

>>142668173
I didn't watch all of it but it didn't really seem like a ripoff. Lots of people really like it so you should give it a shot. I thought the magic world parts or whatever had a real nice look to them.

>>142668173
The premise seems like a ripoff but execution was far away from what Madoka did. Even Yuna and Madoka are totally opposite characters.

>>142668173
I don't know. Recently I have been debating over whether recommending it now or saying "wait a year, until we get a new season or a manga"

I thought the show itself was okay, cool build up, eh ending, the thing that boots up the franchise for me is the current LN, since it has a take on mikos and religion that is pretty unique for Magical Girls.

If you are in the mood for some combat mahou shoujo and cute slice of life that takes a bittersweet turn, I'd say go for it.

>>142659826
Ive thought about writing Madoka fanfiction that continues from where Rebellion left off. Does that count?

Is there a chart/list for must watch magical girl anime?

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>>142668818
I don't know about "must watch" and I'll be honest I know fuck all about the genre, but here's a chart I have saved.

>>142668946
Thank you, I'll check some of these out

>>142668173
Eh, rip-off doesn't seem like a fair label. It does magical girls and suffering, but the conceits in each are very different.

Madoka was largely concerned with a twist on the usual story and counted on you knowing roughly what (fighting) mahou shoujo was about, then twisting around the simplest expectations. The surprise was important, but not essential. I don't think it set out to be an epic tale from the start, nor be anything deeply philosophical. If you just look at the 12 episodes, though, I think it managed to do what it set out to do, catch most of its viewers off-guard and take them on a ride. But it has little to do with little girls' dreams.

Yuuki Yuuna is big on its world-building, and layering stories on top of stories. The anime is okay on its own, but tries to do a lot of storytelling, character building and emotional rollercoastering without really committing to any of them, and seemed unwilling to compromise anywhere for the sake of achieving any of those things, like it wanted to eat its cake and keep it too. The LNs and VNs hint at a much, much bigger world and story they're hoping to tell that may or may not be well thought out. It's perception of "heroism" seems to be the kind you'd see fantasized about in shounen more than regular mahou shoujo, though.

>>142668946
Needs Pleiades

I WANT TO CREAM MAMI!

>>142669650
Get in the line, m8

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>>142669650
With a monkey? Really?

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Everyone forgets about Shamanic Princess when it comes to dark magical girl anime.

Although it's another one of those series where it's certainly debatable if you could call it magical girl or not

>>142668946
>When you've watched all but two things on that chart.

Feels good.

>>142670507
>feels good
What are your favourites, senpai? And which haven't you seen?

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>>142670620
The ones I haven't seen are Minky Momo cause no subs. And Witch Craft Works because I just haven't seen it.

Doesn't that one mech anime with that Maru girl count as Magical Girl since they had those transformation scenes?

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>>142670749
But which one is best Precure?

>>142648817
I assume most people with that opinion think mecha shows are 23 minutes of "buy our toys".

>>142670930
Splash Star.

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This is your magical girl for tonight.

>>142672731
wow this sounds silly as fuck

>>142641003
>>142642132
Can you at least say where it was?
I'm pretty sure most of the Trigger panels at AX and the like have been recorded.

>>142666574
Usagi is underrated as fuck

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Here's a nice magical girl concept.

What would her backstory be?

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>Nobody has subbed Corrector Yui
Yui's socks and bouncing breasts changed my life when I was a kid.

>>142675043
also floofy hair

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>>142675043
>Corrector Yui

Why are there so many sci-fi based 'magical' girl shows that nobody ever talks about?

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>>142675785

A lot of them are just old and finished and most magical girl stories, sci-fi or no, don't have especially complicated stories or settings to talk about

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>Shūmatsu no Izetta or Izetta, Die Letzte Hexe
>Japanese literally translates to Izetta of the End and the German translates to Izetta, The Last Witch
Looks interesting. Original anime too.
Unknown staff tho

>>142677654
Thanks, anon. Looks like it'll at least be interesting to watch. Red-haired chick MCs are always a plus.

>just marathoned Utena
>have to watch kill la kill to cleanse palate and reset expectations

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>>142639680
>Anime has always been moeshit dude, check out these screenshots from a 80's children's show

It's a well-known secret that WMT bred many future lolicon.

>>142644821
>Madoka invented evil mascots

I'm pretty sure it did.

>>142674972
>rollerskating waitress finds dusty old top hat
Those are some weird birds. Are the food enemies?

>>142679225
Nanoha is seriously freaked out that the weasel is a dude. Boys are evil.

>>142668173
I kept waiting for yellow to die but it never happened.

>>142679379
It felt like the pathos in YuYuYu was delegitimized by the resolution. Contrast with the resolution of Madoka; I felt like none of the pathos had been wasted by the time the show wrapped up.

I think the singing imouto was better emotional stress point than blue's amnesia or the special olympics motif they had going on. But none of it mattered. Did blue get her memory back? What of the legions of girls other than Odin who fought the good fight? Were any of them healed by pink teaching the godtree the value of friendship? Unaddressed, unimportant. The lack of context is what makes the comparison to Madoka inept.

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>>142670749
Too much Precure, not enough Wedding Peach

How about this?

19th magical girls fighting the Martians from War of The Worlds.

>>142679241
No I'd say her power is food and her mascots are those tiny griffons.

>>142674972
Good concept, we rarely see magical girls who are above 20 (and still manage to be cute as fuck).

>>142680067
you said it, man

>>142659490
I liked the TV series...

>>142670749
I don't recognize number 6 (next to Princess Tutu) and 8 (in between the Cures)

>>142680067
Hab dich im Traum geseh'n
Es war so wunderschön
In einem weißen Hochzeitskleid

>>142681141
number 8 is Mahou no Stage Fancy Lala

currently working on it, it's pretty fun, and nice opening song.

Number 6 seems to be Shamanic Princess. Never heard about it, but it's written in the picture if you look closely.

>>142681141
I think that the one in between the cures is Mahou no Stage Fancy Lala, but I could be mistaken.

If it's right then fuck me, I must have seen it on italian television something like 16 years ago.

>>142681264
>>142681257
Fuck me I was right, what the hell.

>>142681257
>>142681264
Thanks

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>>142681186
Une brise chaleureuse souffle à travers les branches des arbres... Le printemps est proche... Les nouvelles fleurs commencent à bourgeonner, et on peut y sentir la fraîcheur de l'humidité matinale. Pour avoir été abasourdies par un Démon et nous obliger à nous battre, je ne te pardonnerai pas ! L'Ange de l'Amour, Wedding Peach, est très énervée !

>>142680852
You mean Strike Witches?

>>142677654
終末の can also mean "the final", which is probably what's meant here.

>>142679690
>Did blue get her memory back?
Yes
>What of the legions of girls other than Odin who fought the good fight?
It's literally the content of everything else made in this franchise.
>Were any of them healed by pink teaching the godtree the value of friendship?
Crippling was exclusive to this group of Yuushas, to avoid death. Therefore, as one can guess, other girls simply died.

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>>142677654
>Design by bunbun
>Music featuring monaca
Are they becoming the standard for government sanctioned mahou shoujo?