Find a flaw.

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>>140797563
Found a flaw.

>>140797563
madoka threads

Rebellion

>>140797665
>>140797934
>>140797956
Stop.

>>140797563
Urobochi

>>140797563
Most of the spinoffs are steaming garbage.

I think the only decent one is TDS.

>>140797934

>>140797563
Lack of characterisation for pretty much everyone who's not Sayaka.
I felt worse for Imperer than pretty much everyone from this show, except for Sayaka.

Cringeworthy artstyle for the mood it's trying to convey.

There, i said it

Needed to be longer for more characterization.

>>140798095
I disagree, part of what makes Madoka good is quick pacing. Every episode matters, there's no filler, and something memorable happens to move the story along week by week. They pretty much trimmed all the fat because the recap movies that tried to take off a little more were worse for it.

it introduces the characters, esetablishes their personalities immediately, then puts hem through challenges and you see other facets of them, and then they conclude. Mostly by dying. Don't need to meander.

>>140798191
Nah, part of what makes Madoka bad is the rushed pacing.

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>2ch Madoka general threads went to "nostalgic anime heisei board" today
>the last one's numbering was #4854

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>>140797563
>Puella Magi

>>140797563
SHAFT

>>140797563
Too much melodrama and exposition.

>>140798191
>it introduces the characters, esetablishes their personalities immediately, then puts hem through challenges and you see other facets of them, and then they conclude. Mostly by dying. Don't need to meander.

I'm never really sure what people mean by characterization because the series does exactly this. The story is about the cruel destiny of meguca and Homura trying to save Madoka from it and that is the story that is presented throughout the narrative.

>>140798598
>and Homura trying to save Madoka from it
No.
Rebellion is not canon.

>>140797563
how bad it is

>>140797563
>Madoka is good
When will this meme die?

>>140798191
It does get right to the point, but I feel like it would have been beneficial to have more time to get connected to the characters. Mami's death, for example, would have been more shocking if her character was explored more. Sayaka's descent would have hurt more if we were closer to her character. Even some SoL or lighthearted magical girl episodes would have been good for the suffering to stand out more.

MC

>>140798080
this to be honest

I think Kyouko's storyline with Sayaka needed more focus. It felt too rushed with how it happened.

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>>140797563
None of them except for best girl want the D

>>140797563
Mami dying is forced drama because she just stands there for no fucking reason for several seconds so the cake monster has time to eat her which makes no sense given how competent she's been shown to otherwise be

Everything with sakuya in the second half is forced drama because the witches have no real reason to give a shit if they're tehcnically walking corpses. They wouldn't have even noticed unless KB told them so how exactly can't they live relatively normal lives? All KB did was inform them of their one weak point.

The entire premise in general is forced drama because it doesn't take traditional magical girl story beats and shows how fucked up they'd be in real life (like say, princess tutu) but instead just goes "hey what if magical girls were actually this really fucked up thing lol wouldn't that be crazy?" and leaves it at that

The episode that focused on homura was really compelling but in general the show was just trying to hard to wow people with shock value and melodrama because woah cute little girls never have bad things happen to them in anime

>>140798857
I don't see suffering as the point. The show wasn't just meant to shock or induce mood whiplash. Mami's death would've been more shocking if it was graphic and they smeared blood and gore all over the place like the (much worse imo) manga adaptation, but instead it's done in a discretion shot. The suffering doesn't come from a concentrated effort on the part of the people making the show, it came from the people watching it who were invested.

We don't really need to know any more about Sayaka or Mami. Everything they do is meaningful in the story, you know their motivations and you get a sense with what they're dealing with internally. Slice of life episodes wouldn't tell you any more. Sunny Day Life didn't reveal any great character insights or anything. What's there is more then enough to cement them as real characters to people.

>>140799324
>What's there is more then enough to cement them as real characters to people.
What's there is barebones as shit. They aren't real characters.

>>140798857
The character was explored plenty. You just didn't pay attention or think about it enough.

>>140798857
>Even some SoL or lighthearted magical girl episodes would have been good for the suffering to stand out more.

Why? That would be stupid because it ignores the reality of being a magical girl in the context of the story. Urobuchi even joked about this saying it wouldn't make any sense for Mami to die and them go have a hit springs episode even if he thought it would have been hilarious.

>>140799628
Some people just desperately want the show to be Yuuki Yuuna. Which is fucking stupid because Yuuki Yuuna exists, so just go watch that.

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>>140799033
>Forced drama

>>140799324
It does it's job, but it just isn't as impacting as it could have been. The show overall would have been more memorable. Something small like having the characters react to different situations can go a long way. It makes the characters feel more human instead of just one-off tropes.

>>140799324
Wow, this is the first time I've seen someone on /a/ who actually understands Madoka's narrative and characters.

>>140797563
shaft

>>140799766
Madoka is the epitome of forced drama.

>>140799852
We are few and far between.
We mostly don't argue about this because retards can't understand it.

>>140799922
Only to stupid people.

>>140799928
What's not to understand?

It's a dark, edgy twist on the magical girl formula, it's not like the show tries to be abstract or anything.

>>140799324
>I don't see suffering as the point.

Suffering is a very key point. It's just not suffering for sufferings sake.

>>140799994
>He doesn't like what I like
>He must be stupid
Amazing argument.

>>140800042
>it's not like the show tries to be abstract or anything
Thats exactly the problem.
Most people do think there is deeper meaning to everything in Madoka.

>>140800077
>forced drama because I don't like it
Amazing argument.

>>140799852
>>140799928
Jesus.

>>140800042
Reminder that there are people who spend days analyzing and writing about non-existent messages within the series.

>>140797934
THIS

now watch the tripfags crawl out of the woodwork any moment now

>>140800077
>Woosh
I never said that but you're free to delude yourself into believing that. Only a moron would consider the drama forced. You don't have to like the show, but saying it's forced is a hilarious misunderstanding of what happened and only demonstrates a lack of attention.

>>140800152
Jesus wasn't alive when the show aired.

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Beach OVA when?

>>140800042
>What's not to understand?
>It's a dark, edgy twist on the magical girl formula
The irony.

>>140800225
Actually. Jesus never existed.

>>140800112
>Most people do think there is deeper meaning to everything in Madoka.
Well if there is, then I didn't notice it.

There was never a moment in Madoka where I went "Whoa, wonder what the hell that's supposed to mean".

>>140800280
Actually it's been proven that he did. What isn't proven is whether he really was a deity.

>>140800309
>Actually it's been proven that he did.
[Citation needed]
I'm sure its just bullshit.

>>140799628
>Urobuchi even joked about this saying it wouldn't make any sense for Mami to die and them go have a hit springs episode even if he thought it would have been hilarious.
If he simply did that, he would be a terrible writer. A good writer would find good context to have an onsen episode, like the hair cutting scene in FMP.

>>140799033
It's like you never watched the show

Mami died because she was drunk from happiness.
An episode ago or something she said to be always careful against witches. She didn't there.
Her freedom from loneliness made her excited and careless.
That should be fucking obvious.

The others don't make a lick of a sense at all.
"How can't they live normal lives?"
If you didn't damn notice, even if you don't do anything your Soul Gem will continue to darken due to it needin to keep your body intact to your soul.
You even see Kyouko preserving Sayaka's body this way for christ's sake.

How is third paragraph forced drama? It's forced drama because that's the premise is that? huh?
Do you know what forced means?
Also, Princess Tutu is almost nothing like Madoka. If you say it is, then I highly doubt you've watched Tutu.
The only thing it has in common is despair and magical girl. Literally that.

>>140800283
>For me, I had to sit down for 3 hours and write a 3500 word essay to make sense of everything, so I'd argue that warrants considering Rebellion to be "hard to follow."
>-anon on /meduka/

I think there are some cool allusions to other works and the symbolism chosen is pretty consistent and deliberate, but it's not necessary to understand the story.

>>140800331
Jesus, just fucking google it.

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>>140800429
Yeah. And I'm finding you are talking bullshit.

>>140800383

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The only flaw is that this didn't happen.

>>140800461
>reddit
Opinin discarded.

Literally just Kamen Rider Ryuki.

>>140800546
Gee, I wonder why? It's not because each of those characters is 100% dedicated to someone else during the entirety of the show is it?

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>>140797563
Ripoff

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>>140800461
>My Little Redditor Can't Possibly Be This Autistic!

>>140800669
>Ripoff
clearly has never watched Ryuki and just blindly shitposting

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>>140800659
No, they're into each other. You just didn't get it.

>>140800461
What's so fucking awful is that the material book states the creative intentions of the film:

-Gen was told to create a continuation, not an epilogue aka Madoka takes Homura to heaven
-Both and Gen and Shinbo wanted to save Madoka from her fate
-Shinbo told him to put them in opposition to each other
-Gen went the duality route
-Gen says he may have overdid it on the ending, but it isn't meant to be a bad end

>>140800174
Not him, but I thought the drama was really stupid. Mostly because the entire setting made me think it only exists to bully the magical girls without any chance of hope or being able to do something about it.

If you become a magical girl you're fucked and if you don't you'll likely get fucked because your friends or maybe even you yourself will get killed by witches.
Walpurgisnacht was for some reason impossible for Homura to kill by herself just so that she can suffer more.

In addition the rules for which wish you can make were so incredibly vague that you never knew if the girls were just being stupid with their wishes or if it was because a more powerful/useful wish wouldn't have been possible.

>>140797563

it's a scrapped VN script and basically everything else

>>140801070
>Death is part of the deal. -Tomoe Mami

At no point is it presented as anything more than a bum deal.

>>140801070
You are free to believe that.

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What are they thinking?

>>140801134
But even if you don't take part in the deal you're likely gonna get fucked in some way, like the green haired girl that wanted to kill herself with a bunch of other people.

If she had killed herself, she would've obviously been screwed, but Madoka and Sayaka get screwed as well because they could've prevented it. It doesn't matter if you make the deal or not, you'll get screwed.

>>140801239
>why are our backs bent in such a weird way

>>140800546
>>140800830
Sayaka is shit
SHIT
SHITTTTTTT

>>140801363
I don't understand this complaint. You're mad that a bystander would have died in a world that isn't significantly more cruel than ours when everything is said and done.

>>140801070
Because that's how Kyubey made it so?
If you were a farmer, would you leave a chance for your livestock to run away freely?
Even the anime makes this analogy.
goddamnit anon get good

Walpurgidnact was unbeatable by one MG because she is an amalgamation of possibly hundreds of witches.

>>140801621
I always thought that Walpurgisnacht was Homura's witch coming back from the future, given all the clock motifs in her design.

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>>140801438
>Sayaka is the shit
ftfy

>>140801806
That doesn't make sense since she appears even before Homura became a Magical Girl.
Plus, watch Rebellion.

>>140801458
>You're mad
I actually liked Madoka to some degree because of its atmosphere, music and certain scenes. Plus I'm quite fond of some of its ideas.

What bothers me is the inevitability of everything, especially if you try to have some sort of substance or message.

>>140801621
This only underlines my point. In that case the only option is suffering. It's a made up conflict that exists only to torture the girls.


I know that in the end that inevitability gets crushed, which may work as a counterarguement against what I'm saying, but that's what I adressed when I said that the rules were way too vague.

>>140801937
I've seen Rebellion. But it still makes sense. Her witch has time travel powers, so it goes back before she was even a magical girl to fuck things up. Madoka's decision at the end of the series could easily have changed how Homura's witch manifests.

>>140797665
sayaka a SHIT closely followed by madoka

>>140797563
the entire series was one big flaw

>>140801806
I liked that interpretation -- the extra sense of futility that, the stronger Homura gets, the stronger her nemisis gets would've fitted in well with the series -- but interviews effectively canned it.

>>140802154
There's no way someone on the team wasn't thinking that. The parallels are too obvious.

>>140802000
>the only option is suffering
and that is why Homura wants to prevent Madoka from contracting. That's the point.

Also, how is that even a flaw?
I could say "Aria is made to make all the characters happy" and that's no flaw. That' just describing the setting and premise.

In other words, you're literally just describing the show's setting and premise.

>>140797934
Why didn't the thread stop there?

>>140802000
>What bothers me is the inevitability of everything, especially if you try to have some sort of substance or message.

But being unable to change fate is very Japanese. Even at the end of the series, fate is only slightly altered. And at the end of the day, I just feel like the series will inevitably end with Homura choosing to join Madoka in her fate in order to be with her and spare her eternal loneliness.

>>140802026
Each time Homura time travels it's another dimension, another universe so to speak.
This was practically confirmed at episode 12 when Madoka combined all timelines.
So no, I don't think that's possible.
But it's an alright thought.

And yes, I have watched Madoka too many times.

>>140802389
because it's incomplete
it should be
>current madoka threads

>>140797563
Homura
Rebellion
Homura not dying
Homura not being tortured
Everything Homura

>>140802154
The series canned it. Wally gets stronger because of Madoka, not Homura.

>>140802336
No idea about Aria, so I cannot comment on that.

And as I said before, it'd be okay if the only way to suffer was to foolishly make a contract, but the problem is that you're also going to suffer, specifically because you did not make a contract, like if your friends or relatives get killed by a witch that you could've stopped if you actually made a contract.

>In other words, you're literally just describing the show's setting and premise.
Setting and premise can be flawed themselves.
And that's exactly my point, as I wrote here
>the entire setting made me think it only exists to bully the magical girls without any chance of hope or being able to do something about it.

>>140802575
nani
Walpurgis doesn't get stronger at all.
You're probably thinking of Kriemhild Gretchen.

>>140802630
Wally's power scales whenever Homura goes back in time. Hence why Madoka always dies against Wally, even when she has Homu helping her.

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>>140798857
It actually took the prequel manga for me to really feel something over Mami and Kyoko's story.

The ending hit me hard.

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>>140802622
>setting and premise can be flawed themselves
A premise can't be inherently bad no matter how absurd it is.
Anime thrives on absurd premises.

You're complaining because witches are a problem, now?
Really?
I mean, come on, do I really need to say anything about that?

Again, because that's how Kyubey wants it to be. The girls are her livestock. The food of the universe to keep it from starving.
That is not a flaw. That is just describing Kyubey's plans, and why he's considered to be a damn evil little bitch.

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>>140801873
Bless.

>>140802696
That's wrong.
On the 4th timeline Madoka was able to oneshot Walpurgis but turned into a witch afterwards.

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>>140797563
The fandom consists for 90% of delusional yurifags.

Even worse, the threads are just arguing between main pairings and crack pairings.

>>140802517
u mad Sayashits

laughinghomura.jpg

>>140802959
Except it's not. I'll have to find a link, but they had an exhibit at Madogatari that said time travel scaled both Wally and Madoka up.

>>140802696
I don't remember that at any point in the anime. Madoka getting stronger because each loop she went through added more karma/potential to Madoka, yes. Nothing to do with Walspurgisnacht getting stronger.

>>140803039
Homura wrecked its shit in the last timeline to no avail. Madoka at base strength was able to kill it.

>>140802993
>Implying Homura's love wont be returned

>>140802993
>consists for 90% of

>>140803036
I am waiting for that link.

>>140801873
>team killing Kyoko
>hurting her best friend's feelings
>shunning Homura's help because of her selfish sense of justice

Face it, blue blondie deserved everything she got.

>>140797563
Overrated garbage that has decent art.

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>>140797563
Not enough best girl

>>140803088
Madoka was never able to kill it at base strength. First timeline has Madoka dying with Walpurgis's condition to be unknown, and I highly doubt she beat it.

>>140802993
> the threads are just arguing between main pairings and crack pairings.
To be fair, most of that is all one insane guy.

You learn to filter him out.

>>140803129
I'm certain Madoka will just friendzone her twice as hard.

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>>140803238
*dead girl

The form of the head.

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>>140802824
The Different Story is underrated.

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>>140803194

>>140803167
Admittedly I probably can't find it again. It was back in November by an anon who actually went.

>>140803239
It's implied she beat it at the expense of her life and fits in to her role in the narrative.

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>>140797563
This bitch.

This is the first thread in forever that I've yet to see a single tripfag.

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>>140803273
>This projecting

>>140803454
>this delusional

>>140802837
>that's how Kyubey wants it to be
That's just such a lazy excuse though.

This is my last post because I have to leave and I'm basically repeating myself anway.

Especially in a case where you're trying to have a point or have some sort of message, you should always avoid shit like destiny or fate.

>It's like that because that's how it is!

Then what's the point? Better hope destiny isn't out for you or you'll get fucked pretty hard! Madoka, you need so sacrifice yourself and become a magical girl, which means the rest of your life will pretty much be complete shit or else everyone you like will get killed!

Also you need to stop building strawmen. I'm not against witches, magical girls, magical girl pets, abstract backgrounds, etc. Do I need to mention anything else so that you're not gonna jump at the chance to put words in my mouth that I never said?
It's about the rules and how things are handled. What you need to do and what you're able to do. What the setting allows you to do and what it does not.

Of course the things one can enjoy are subjective, but story telling 101 is that the characters of a story need to be able to make things turn out well. This doesn't mean everything has to end well, but at the very least that it can if you make the right choices, which of course most characters won't do, which is why you rarely get a 100% happy ending.

The characters of Madoka are mostly powerless against a bigger force that does nothing but torture them. There is no way out of it and it thrives on their suffering. The setting and its rules exist so that they can suffer.

I may have forgotten some things here and there and knowing you, I'll probably return only to see just another strawman. Anyway, take care.

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>>140803364
Best at pushing the consequence of your own retarded wish to your friend

>>140803418
>jynxing it

>>140802389
Because that has nothing to do with the show.

>>140803320
Very, very much.
>>140803377
If she beat it, it doesn't make sense that she dies. She would've turned into a witch instead.
Homura's dialogue implies that she wasn't able to beat it.
Back in their base form Mami was the strongest Magical Girl.

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>>140803531
In the end she admitted that she had been an idiot! She's imo the best written character after Homura.

>>140803549
You can beat something and die of your injuries too you know.

>>140803549
>If she beat it, it doesn't make sense that she dies. She would've turned into a witch instead.

Like Kyouko in episode 9?

>Homura's dialogue implies that she wasn't able to beat it.

Homura never says that she didn't win.

>>140803526
How is that even an excuse?
The premise is an excuse? That doesn't make sense at all.
You don't know how to criticize.

When did I ever say any of those I claim to strawman?
>but story telling 101 is that the characters of a story need to be able to make things turn out well
LMAO
Then it is clear that you are pulling out of your ass. If anything, you need to know how storytelling works.
Ever heard of a tragedy, good sir?

> but at the very least that it can if you make the right choices
And that's what happened.
Are you debating against yourself, by any chance?

A lot of stories thrive on suffering, that's why they're classified as tragedies.


Also I don't think you don't know ho strawmans work. I could say you're just using Argumentum Ad Nauseam and Non-sequitur but I'm not getting into logical fallacies for something of this caliber.

now gtfo

>>140803526
>
The characters of Madoka are mostly powerless against a bigger force that does nothing but torture them.

Madoka succeeds in altering the fate of magical girls and, for the time being, Homura has managed to altered the eternal fate of Madoka. In the face of overwhelming adversity, they both managed to slightly alter fate.

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>>140802824
All the critique on the series being wrung for cash and they never even animated Different Story.

Life's cruel.

>>140797563
not enough ass

>>140803731
Kyouko shattered her own soul gem.
I doubt Madoka would do that in this scenario.

Homura said she can't beat it if Mami can't. Mami was a far stronger and better Magical Girl than anyone else, she has more potential than Madoka in the first place if not for Homura.
Madoka even says so in episode 10, and Kyubey during the early episodes would even testify to this.

One thing I will never understand is how Kyouko shattering her soul gem lead to such a big explosion.

When Mami breaks Kyouko's soul gem it just breaks and that's it.

>>140797563
ripoff of princess tutu desu

>>140803930
has clearly never watched princess tutu desu

>>140803884
>I doubt Madoka would do that in this scenario.
Madoka would gladly sacrifice herself in anyway. It's the entire conflict at the end of Rebellion.

>>140803526
>Better hope destiny isn't out for you or you'll get fucked pretty hard!
Just like the real world. Have you ever looked around you or are you browsing /a/ 24/7?
>The characters of Madoka are mostly powerless against a bigger force that does nothing but torture them. There is no way out of it and it thrives on their suffering. The setting and its rules exist so that they can suffer.
That's the point. Their world is arbitrary and uncaring, just like ours, but Madoka manages to make a positive influence because she doesn't give up hope. You missed the point, your posts are embarrassingly stupid, and I'm not even the guy you replied to.

>>140803980
She would gladly sacrifice herself but she won't break her Soul Gem for no reason whatsoever.
Kyouko did it because she wanted Sayaka to be not alone.
>>140803919
Because breaking her soul gem alone won't kill Sayaka's witch.

>>140797563
>Madoka Magica
>Puella Magi Madoka Magica
>Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica
I want to pick this up but I've found three different titles related to this. I'm confused. Are they all the same or are the different?

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>If someone tells me that it's wrong to hope, I'll tell them they're wrong every time.

>>140804097
>She would gladly sacrifice herself but she won't break her Soul Gem for no reason whatsoever.

Saving the city. That was her entire reason for fighting.

>>140804160
They're the same.
Madoka Magica is shortened.
Mahou Shoujo Madoka Magica is the original jap name and Puella Magi Madoka Magica is the english localized name (I think).

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>>140803919
Something about her overcharging it with magic rather than just shattering it.

>>14080416
Just go with Madoka.

>>140804209
Yes, she wanted to save the city.
Sooooooooo
Why would she break her soul gem for that?
Again, Kyouko killed herself because she didn't want Sayaka to be alone. If you didn't notice, she broke her own Soul Gem at her final attack.

>>140804160
>abbrevation
>localized English
>Hepburn romanization

>>140804263
I guess that makes sense.

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>>140804160
There's the original twelve episode anime, the two movies recapping it, the Different Story prequel manga, and Rebellion Story's the sequel movie to the original series.

The series in general can go by all three of those names though.

>>140804285
Did you not see Kyouko's attack that harnessed the power of her soul gem? Or are you ass mad that Madoka beat Walpurgisnact? I cant tell which. The favt Kyubey and Homura are just hanginh around the battle zone without running fir their lives implies Madoka beat Walpurgisnact.

http://vocaroo.com/i/s1b98yOqA5pA

>>140804403
To be fair, the entire city is destoyed as we see Madoka dying in Homura's arms. It's implied that Madoka can only defeat it but at the cost of her own life, and not even the city could be saved.

>>140804495
>It's implied that Madoka can only defeat it but at the cost of her own life

Yes, that's implied by the story.

and not even the city could be saved

Cities are made of people. Buildings can be rebuilt. Every minute it's alive, people die.

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>>140797563
No yuri

>>140804403
>Did you not see Kyouko's attack that harnessed the power of her soul gem?
Everyone's attack harnesses the power of the soul gem. The reason why Kyouko died is because she took her soul gem at the point of her attack, as a form of suicide, and the fact that if she didn't do it she would turn into a witch.
Madoka doesn't know about MGs turning into witches, for one.
Madoka isn't that strong in base, for two.
And three, Walpurgis disappears after every attack. Else how did you think that Walpurgis became so powerful without being extinguished by MGs yet?
And finally fourth, Mami is stronger than Madoka in base.

No, she didn't kill Walpurgisnacht. It was never seen, therefore it didn't happen.
The burden of proof lies on you.

>>140804222
>>140804286
>>140804387
Even the torrent names for this thing are all over the place. I've only downloaded one batch so far and it seems I was right to be cautious. Thanks.

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>>140804627
Homu feels your pain.

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>>140797563
Best girl died in just three episodes.

>>140804658
>Sun shining through the wreckage
>Homura looming over Madoka's dead body
>Has casual conversation with Kyubey
>Entire focus of wish is to go back in time and save Madoka
>Neither of them bring up Walpurgisnacht
>Entire scene is peaceful
>No sense of urgency

God you're fucking autistic.

>>140804839
but she got best fight scene in the movie

>>140804627
We'e got one more movie.

>>140804387
Spot on, but TDS isn't actually canon to the storyline.

>>140804658
>Walpurgis disappears after every attack. Else how did you think that Walpurgis became so powerful without being extinguished by MGs yet?

Nice head canon.

>>140804850
oh you're very delicious

>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead.
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead.
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead
>doesn't mean Walpurgis is dead.
Walpurgis goes away after every attack. It was even compared to a heavy storm.
get good

>>140804935
It is, it's part of the Drama CDs.

You know nothing about Walpurgis.

>>140805005
But the drama CD's aren't canon either.
Also with that logic, technically only the first part of TDS is canon rather than the whole story since it adapts from Farewell Story.

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>>140804935
There isn't anything really discrediting it as a canon part of a past timeline.

>>140805207
For one, it's nowhere referenced that they shared a past.

>>140805182
The Drama CDs are made by SHAFT, so it's probably canon.
The Drama CDs even explain stuff like Madoka's first wish (saving a cat, hence why in OP she holds a cat)

>>140805280
Kyouko knew who Mami was. It's even the reason why she transferred places.

>>140805182
Drama CDs are made by shaft so they are canon. Just because it isn't written butcher doesn't mean it isn't canon. If shaft makes it, it's canon

>>140805376
*written by butcher

>>140805325
>probably canon.
See, even you can't claim it's canon 'cause you're not sure yourself.
Just because it's official doesn't mean it's canon.
Canon is what's true within the fictional setting.
The first drama CD is slightly referenced in the OP but it's only Amy.
>>140805364
Yeah, magical girls had to have awareness of one another's existence seeing how their system was territorial.

Madoka never loved Homura you faggots. Get over it.

>>140805376
Then I guess Sunny Day Life is canon too!
No, it isn't.

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>>140801806
That was a popular theory back when the show first aired, but it is incorrect
Personally I really liked that theory myself and partly wished it was true.

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>>140804935
Technically no, but TDS is so good I say it's cannon, even if it's not.

>>140805667
It made for an interesting theory.

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>>140805364
Furthermore, when Sayaka says "Mami is dead because of magical girls like you" Kyoko gets a dramatic close up, clearly showing some emotion and pain over the statement. She then proceeds to go all out against Sayaka, where before she was just kind of messing with her.
Granted, this theory is a lit of reading between the lines, but I don't think it's too much of a stretch to interpret it that way.

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>>140805280
Kyoko knew who Mami was. We're just never given much on-screen acknowledgment of how.

>>140805747
>canon
Another word for official, often used to describe official fiction from fanfiction
>cannon
any piece of artillery that uses gunpowder or other usually explosive-based propellants to launch a projectile.

The more you know.

>>140805376
By this logic, all filler is canon because it's produced by SHAFT. If it isn't referenced as a plot point and it has no ramifications on the long term story, it is not canon.

>>140805857
This has been dubunked every time when brought up.
Kyouko becomes pissed because Sayaka kept getting back up from blows that should've put her out of commission.

>>140798080
I hope this is bait

>>140805948
>>140805990

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>>140805967
Auto correct on my phone changed it... but noted, thanks for that.

>>140805990
No, anon is right. Bringing up Mami pisses her off and Mami states making a wish for someone elses sake ends in tragedy. Rebellion even says it was Mami who invited Kyouko from Kazimino. That said, TDS is still not canon.

>>140804863
I think you mean of all time

>>140804160
Just call it Madomagi like japs do

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>>140805990
Re-watch the fight. When Sayaka says that there is a clear shift in emotion. Again, the theory I presented requires a bit of reading between the lines because Kyoko isn't exactly the type to explain her emotions, but like I said I don't think it's too much of a stretch and could very well have been the writers intent. (Maybe)

Samey soundtrack that tends to blend together. There isn't any one track that stands out. Plus, the first 2 or 3 episodes are really dull.

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>>140806204
Really? I mean, to each his own but I thought the different character themes stood out at the very least.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcgEHrwdSO4

>>140806204
It's called a leitmotif.
Plenty of standout songs anyways, decretum, the insert songs, sis puella magica

Agreed about the first 2 episodes being boring though. I'm glad I went through with it though.

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>>140798095
The true overarcing plot as far as i can tell is focused on the fate of magical girls and their relationship to universal entropy and so on and so forth. The characters themselves are nothing really more than vessels intended to pull us through the chain of events and show us how everything unravels. Thats my take on it anyway.

>>140806204
The OP and ED are some of my favorite anime tracks but the rest isn't very memorable.

>>140798922

this.

I'm pretty upset they went in a romantic direction for Rebellion, I felt like Sayaka and Kyouko connected best on a more familial level. For some reason, I always pictured Kyouko seeing in Sayaka some of her younger sister.

The artstyle, and Kyouko's character in general, are the weakest parts for me. The labryinths, the witches, and the bgs are A+++, but the weak character animation/design outside of the battles really makes it hard to immerse sometimes.

>>140806366
You're nuts, those first two episodes were amazing. Couple of the best witch sequences in the series, and they brought the deluge of speculation.

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>lel those nerds will buy anything if we put their favorite girls picture on it!
I am okay tho

>>140806511
Maybe

I dropped it two times before actually getting into it.

I think that may be my fault though. I first watched it on the premise that it was a cute SoL show about cute moe lolis.

Looking back though, the mall scene was amazing

>>140806408
>I'm pretty upset they went in a romantic direction for Rebellion

KyouSaya is fan pandering to compensate for no MadoHomu at the end of Rebellion.

All the characters feel like they were constructed to fit an existing plot rather than naturally developing the plot on their own.

Homura is a good example of how this plot-based writing is flawed: she has literally no characterization beyond her attachment to Madoka, no backstory, no relatives, no natural friendship with anyone other than with Madoka, no anything.

>inb4 Rebellion
I'm judging the original series on its own.

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I want to stick my dick in crazy.

>>140807557
>she has literally no characterization beyond her attachment to Madoka, no backstory, no relatives, no natural friendship with anyone other than with Madoka, no anything.

Her entire role was mysterious antagonist up until episode 10.

>>140807474
>fan pandering
Because two girls getting close together is considered "pandering"
Great job, neo /a/

There is no yuri or romance at all in Madoka. Homura has an abusive obsession and Madoka doesn't care about her.

>>140807672
Homura always was and is the villain. All the suffering is directly her fault and she enjoys ruining everything to keep Madoka (who hates her) to herself. Doesn't change her character is laughably flat, unrealistically evil and exists solely to torment others.

>>140807785
If only all that development didn't happen off screen. I accept it's a thing. I just see it for what it is.

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Why is my waifu, Miki Sayaka-chan, the most perfect and amazing magical girl in the world?

>>140807557
The only existing backstory for Homura was that she was in a hospital due to heart problems and somewhere in her childhood she played with dolls which the Clara dolls resemble.
>>140807870
>If only all that development didn't happen off screen.
I'll give you that, would've been nice instead of having to interpret it outside the box but the film was Homu-central.

>>140807962
because she is flawed

>>140808036
>The only existing backstory for Homura was that she was in a hospital due to heart problems and somewhere in her childhood she played with dolls which the Clara dolls resemble.
Where the fuck are her parents? Why is she living alone in an apartment, or are her parents just off working all the time so you never see them?

>>140808036
Yeah, Kyouko and Sayaka are living together and Homura is obviously shipping them, so I accept it's there. It just would have been nicer to have some build up, but I guess it's not terribly necessary. They are the beta couple of the series and not the driving force of the plot.

>>140808062
This, makes an actual human character and not some marry sue.

>>140808128
Urobuchi never wrote her parents, so just assume she's an orphan like so many other anime protagonists.

>>140797563
Kamen Rider Ryuki did it better

>>140808272
I'm assuming Homura got the idea of Kyouko's feelings when Kyouko told her to protect the very thing that means the most to you 'till the end.

Weak characters thing can't be helped. It did its best with the condition of
>one cour
>original, no source material before
>has an actual plot to be developed unlike SoL
>6 characters including qb

>>140808347
Fate did it better

>>140808456
My head canon says Homura wants it to happen because it makes Kyouko happy. God knows Sayaka doesn't ship MadoHomu.

>>140797563
Third movie

>>140808272
It makes sense that Rebellion was primarily Homura's perspective, but more Kyoko and Sayaka interaction before the hand-holding would have been nice.

Maybe next installment.

>>140807474
>KyouSaya is fan pandering
It was pushed by the creators with the intention for the viewers to get attached to it.

>>140804473
underrated post

>>140808991
Well it's true.

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I'm holding out for the sequel to have a Clara Doll fight somewhere in there.

>>140808908
It's actually the opposite anon. Fans wanted KyouSaya so bad that the creators threw it in there.

>>140809294
The sequel will be about Madoka (who unconditionally hates Homura deeply) killing Homura so probably. Madoka wants to rid the universe of the mistake that is Homura.

>>140809477
Right, because there certainly is an official source to all this.
Staff long fell in love with the pair in the events of episode 9.

>>140808797
>Maybe next installment.

I honestly doubt significantly more will come from it beyond some more hand holding and an possibly a verbal acknowledgement. It's not a romance anime and they aren't going to waste an emotional confession scene on the beta couple.

>>140809477
If you were here during the original run you'd have found out that the creators were already shipping it before the fans. It doesn't help that episode 9's ending song was of their voice actresses singing some sort of love song. Though I agree that it became very popular and that may have been a reason that they pushed it so much in Rebellion.

>>140809603
Sayaka was straight in the series and her arc ended with her acknowledging that she lost the Kamijou bowl. Don't even try to deny this. Fans shipped KyouSaya way before episode 9.

>>140809644
>Creators

You'd better have a fucking source straight from Urobuchi or Shinbo.

>>140809732
I'm not denying Sayaka's former sexuality.
It's just a stretch to assume KyouSaya was pushed because of fans.

>>140809827
Rebellion had no plot and was made to pander to the fans, then surprise them with a bad end with Homura revealing her true wicked nature.

>>140809890
Ah, now I see who you are. I won't be taking your false flagging serious.

>>140809827
Butcher admits to enjoying doujinshi and browsing Pixiv. Where the hell do you think he got the MamiNagi pairing from?

>>140810054
No, >>140809890 isn't me.

>>140809771
Shinbo is probably the biggest offender. Anyway I was referring to Ume, who is the character designer.

>>140810064
I'll give you MamiNagi but the others were written far before then anime even aired.

>>140810054
It's the sad truth.

>>140809732
It's certainly true that Sayaka was in love with Kyousuke until the very last moment but Kyouko's feelings for Sayaka were always a source of speculation for the possibility of KyouSaya.

>>140810108
Based, Ume

>>140810054
And I believe Kyouko was probably gay for Sayaka. But Sayaka didn't even have a friendship Kyouko. And if you're going to say that she saw that Kyouko just wanted to be with her, it really begs the question as to why Sayaka continues to be on mutually terrible terms with Homura. She even stating that she would not have been interested in helping Madoka save Homura if Kyouko wasn't going to be there.

>>140810314
>Sayaka didn't even have a friendship Kyouko
She and Kyouko were able to become friends in the Madokami timeline which Kyouko mentions after Sayaka's death.
That's the primary timeline where Rebellion took place.

>>140810314
Sayaka wasn't on bad terms with Homura anymore in Rebellion.
She wanted to aid Madoka in re-uniting her and Homura (granted she mainly wanted to see Kyouko again).
Sayaka takes issue in Homura again when Homura re-writes the universe and takes a portan of The Law of Cyles.

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>>140810314
They become friends if they're able to get past their differences. I'm pretty sure there were also several other timelines in which they became friends.

>>140811306
Why are these two so delicious?

>>140811365
They aren't. It's degeneracy. Both like boys.

>>140797563
The whole thing falls apart if you already know the twists.
And all the Shinbo/SHAFT tics, like head-tilts and IKEA architecture.

If it weren't for these threads I wouldn't even have noticed that Kyouko and Mami are paired up

>>140811653
It's a minority that increased after TDS was released.
Here though, it's spammed to rile up users.
Maybe a few actually like the pair and I don't care but to see it brought up constantly is tedious.

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>>140807962
You keep asking everyone. I don't thinkyou know.

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Wow is this thread not complete cancer?
Less circlejerking and no one is biting fuckfaces bait

>>140811854
Wasn't TDS released in the same year that the anime was?

>>140812043
>less circlejerking
>73 unique posters

>>140809771
>If given the chance, Kyouko and Sayaka would have developed their relationship into something beyond friendship
Straight outta Gen's mouth. But the butcher likes to make Sayaka suffer so that probably ain't ever happening.

>>140812055
That was the manga adaption of the anime.
TDS was somewhere in 2013, I believe.

>>140812107
Most of the thread isn't just people circlejerking their waifuwars and they're at least attempting to discuss the show. Doesn't happen often.

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>>140811854
>Minority

Literally every single person here likes Mami x Kyouko.

>>140812180
Come on anon, even I wouldn't fall for that and I ship KyouSaya.

>>140812043
Fuck it, it's decent. Some good discussion going on.
Certainly better than floods of meta.

>>140812107
That's better than just 4 tripfags. And 73 Isn't that low amount

>>140812293
Last I checked, both MadoHomu and KyouSaya tower over that pair on Pixiv but whatever, your delusions.
MamiNagi may even surpass it in time.

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>>140812293
Well definitely not all since I don't like it.

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>>140812424
>MamiNagi may even surpass it in time.
As it should

>>140812469
Same, I like them as a dual though and the fanon sisterly portrayal is fine.

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>>140812293
I like the familial side of it anyhow.

>>140812499
Pedo.

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>>140812499
cancer

Mami is paired with no one you pedo faggot

>>140812571
>only three years older

No white knighting fag in this thread? That's a first. Though I guess he'll come eventually since he can't fucking resist it like the maggot that he is.

>>140812633
>Mami's face
Downies please go

>>140812611
Legal age for fucking in Japan is 18.

>>140812424
I don't know why people even reply when it's obvious that it's just bait. And we were having such a decent thread too.

>>140812660
What? Isn't it 13?

>>140812726
In rural hick county it's 14 I think, but they can also marry their first cousins.

>>140812726
It is 13, he's making shit up.

>>140812726
>The Japanese Penal Code sets a minimal age of consent of 13.[44] However, the Children Welfare Act chapter 34 forbids any act of "fornication" (淫行) with children (here defined as anyone under 18 years of age)

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>>140812660
I prefer fluff over lewd, so it's fine.

>>140812706
Something that moot said about self-moderation but I tend to mostly ignore and only engage when it's already at it's worst.

Utena did so much of the stuff Madoka did first and better.

>>140812863
Utena was shit.

>>140812775
>with prefectures and districts specifying further details in (largely similar) "obscenity ordinances" (淫行条例) like adding exemptions for sex in the context of a sincere romantic relationship

Also none of it matters if both parties are under 18

>>140812938
Assuming that Mami will be 18 and Nagisa will only be 15 it would become illegal for them to engage in sexual acivities.

>implying they'll live that long

MamiNagi is flaring up and Nagisa only had a whole minute of screentime. Relax and wait till something actually happens.

>>140813123
Who the fuck cares about the law anyaway as long as you're not doing anything that is morally wrong

>>140813170
I don't even see MamiNagi as intended to be romantic. They're just like a mother and a daughter.

>>140797563
It's fans.

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Any flaw is alleviated by this face.

>>140813522
meh

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>>140812293
I don't know if they are that popular. The cannon pairings are probably the most popular, but they are cute, arnt they?

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I'm looking forward to Nagisa hopefully getting an actual personality in the sequel.

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>>140813875
She's cute and she likes cheese, what more do you need?

I feel old. I remember when they delayed the final episodes because of that earthquake. The fanbase is cancer but I enjoyed watching the show with /a/ at the time.

>>140814007
I remember reading about that but I hadn't seen the series yet.

>>140799324
It's not even graphic unless you're five desu

>>140800269
Kyoko has the right idea here.

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>>140814408
>double ice cream
>slightly above doubled breast size

Kyouko truly is amazing.

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>>140813552
ye

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Who's the best looking in a swimsuit?

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>>140814717
Isn't it obvious?

>>140809609
>and they aren't going to waste an emotional confession scene on the beta couple.
For being the beta couple they sure did get a lot of important screentime

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>>140814717
The answer is always Homura.

>>140814823
Madoka and Kyoko doing their own thing while being admired. A day in the life.

>>140814823
That's lingerie actually.

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>>140814894
What happened to Kyokos bottoms?

>>140814717
Mami

>>140814894
Mamis lucky in that pic but I think Sayaka might end up getting jealous

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>>140814823
Wait is it a piercing or belly jewel?

>>140814894
Characters look awful and Kyouko's being poorly portrayed.

The characters are too young and stupid to make a serious drama

>>140815196
Sayaka's soul gem.

>>140815196
That's her soul gem.

>>140815254
So 99% of anime series?

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>>140815100
Mami's breasts are public property, no use getting jealous over them

>>140815254
Why? Homura is like 25 by the way.

>>140815411
Mentally.

>>140815272
>>140815286
Yeah, but I was wondering what form it was taking.

>>140812293
False.

>>140815388
>that cringe
Nobody likes Mami.

>>140815388
Wasn't this official art?

>>140815587
It's from the calendar.
Not like it's rare to see characters posing in swim suits together.

>>140815482
A music note or whatever.

>>140815388
I want to be in Madoka's place.

>>140815587
Yep, Madoka confirmed for having a great ass

>>140815683
Who made the calender?

>>140815587
Yeah but official art =/= canon. It's just there to bait the yurifags.

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>>140797563
The fanbase, especially the ones that feed the trolls.

>>140798029
Homura's Revenge gets better in the second volume.
Tart Magica is surprisingly good.
Suzune Magica is trash but silly trash.
Oriko Magica is fun yurishit.

Kazumi Magica is shit that gets better once it stops trying to pander to lolicons. Fuck, Kazumi Magica actually has motifs and symbolism. For instance, Kazumi's obsession with having meals with people relates to how the wish of the witch she was born from was 'to have one last day to spend with her dead grandmother and cook a meal with her'

But I'll agree that TDS is easily the best of all the manga.

>>140815411
>>140815458
But is she? Does her brain revert back like her body when she loops?

>>140815753
I believe SHAFT did.

>>140815762
So rebellion?

>>140815762
It's canon artwork.

>>140815762
No one wasn't implying yuri.
Neither does that artwork.