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Gary Stus

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Thread replies: 58
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What exactly is a 'Gary Stu' ?
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>>120768992
pic related
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>>120768992
Google has that answer.
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INFIDEL DIE
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>>120768992
quoting wiki

>"Mary Sue" today has changed from its original meaning and now carries a generalized, although not universal, connotation of wish-fulfillment and is commonly associated with self-insertion. True self-insertion is a literal and generally undisguised representation of the author; most characters described as "Mary Sues" are not, though they are often called "proxies"[6] for the author. The negative connotation comes from this "wish-fulfillment" implication: the "Mary Sue" is judged as a poorly developed character, too perfect and lacking in realism to be interesting

of course the gary stu is the male version of this. think Wesley Crusher or Onii-sama
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>>120769506
That definition applies to most anime protagonists, unsurprisingly
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>>120769636
>That definition applies to most anime protagonists, unsurprisingly
pretty much.

which is why the ragefests about is he or isn't he a gary stu is so funny around here. most anime leads are gary stus due to the japanese habit of making the MCs a flawless blank wall for self insertion.

By doing so all that's left is a character too dull to be interesting, loved by everyone, and able to solve everyone's issues as if by magic. obviously the more dull betamax mcs aren't gary stus... and well written alpha dogs aren't necessarily gary stus either. but a huge swath of anime leads are gary stus in some way or another, with Onii-sama standing near the top of the heap.
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Gary Stu and Mary Sue generally have a negative connotations since it is a lazy written character because they are typically have no flaws. Is it possible to have a well written one that is the main character? I could understand having one as comic relief as sort of a comparison thing, but could you create a character that is either a Gary Stu/Mary Sue but at the same time be considered interesting.
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>>120771050
You have no idea what Mary Sue means.
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>>120769636
>>120770724
The "too perfect" part is debatable. While there are certainly characters like that, I think most anime protagonists aren't too perfect or flawless at all precisely because if they were they wouldn't be very relatable.
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>>120770724
>most anime leads
You mean, harem leads.

Rule of thumb for being a classic stu,
If a melee soldier is able to cast and nullify magic like a wizard class of his level, and also being intelligent like a scholar his age who didn't attend BMT, all without sacrificing any of his resources (eg: time, health, money, and no emotional flaws),
That soldier is a stu (see also, shoujo manga princes).
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>>120771050
Batman
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>>120771478
>Rule of thumb for being a classic stu,
f the world does not revolve around the character in question, that character is not a Stu. The character needs to be the main character not just for the audience, but for people in-universe as well.
When side characters' primary defining features are their relationships to the MC, then that's a good sign that he's a Stu.
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>>120771050
also, this fucker
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Is Griffith a Gary Stu?
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>>120769506

A gary stu is the negative version of a wish fulfillment character, the guy you dislike instead of saying "shit yeah, that guy is awesome".

Gene Starwind is a wish fulfillment character, but he isn't a gary stu.
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>>120772077
Wrong.
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the biggest problem is so many people seem to expand the meaning of gary/mary sue. You could be a super special snowflake, without being a sue of any kind. The main characteristic is being perfect, and being important to everyone in story, aswell as being important to the people outside the story. The character is almost never wrong, and even when they are it's half assed. Example, Levi beats on Eren pretty hard to the point of ridiculousness, he gets called out on it, but it gets hit by the "heh, did what I had to." with no repercussions.

Bigger example, batman is more of a sue, than Ichigo.
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>>120772095
>fights pirates with a magic gun
>gets a gynoid waifu with a brown catgirl and a japanese assassin lusting after him
>has a special ship no one else in the universe has that's basically the best ship out there (it is at the very least the fastest)
>not a wish fulfillment character

He has a lot of qualities that in the hands of a less talented writer would easily make him a Gary Stu. But he isn't because they remembered to give him a good personality and more importantly, flaws
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If you're going to make a character that's a Sue/Stu, at least make him a showoff so we know it's all in good fun.

Like Zubat
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>>120772227
You applied the "wrong" to the only part of your post that was right.
Good job.
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>>120768992
A character the universe bends over backwards to make look cool
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>>120772269
It's fun once in a while to have a character who's just blatantly better than everyone else at everything, even the most obscure shit like lethal plate thrower.
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>>120768992
I'd say the general traits of a Mary Sue/Gary Stu are being OP to the point where it makes everyone else look incompetent and/or useless, having the entire universe revolve around them even if it doesn't really make any sense for it to and to a degree where it's just absurd, having no real flaws that actually impact them or the story in a negative way, having either no personality whatsoever or a personality entirely based on angst so they can look deeper and more interesting than they really are, solving most/every problem they face with no apparent effort thus killing any tension the audience might feel along with their interest and incentive to keep watching/reading, generally being a super special snowflake who knows more than everyone else or is better at something than everyone else ever or has some incredibly special ability or item of some sort (usually of the variety that makes them more OP), having every character of the opposite sex fall madly and inexplicably in love with them basically at first sight, and of course, being so attractive that everyone can't stop mentioning it (though that last one tends to be more common in self-insert fanfics than actually published work). Of course there can be different combinations of these traits and I'm sure I left some out, but those tend to be the biggest problems that I see.
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If Jesus Yamato and Onii-sama fought with their hands, without magic or mecha, who would win?
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>>120772926
If you had actually watched their shows, you'd know.
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>>120773010
I did, although I didn't see Destiny yet.

Kira has Coordinator hax and Tatsuya is a ninja. They seem pretty evenly matched.
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>>120773069
>They seem pretty evenly matched.
No.
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>>120772861

I think this can all work if it's played for comedy.
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>>120773123
Oh, for sure. The problem is that it's usually not.
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>>120773123
Enter, Sakamoto-kun
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>>120773142

True. I mean, Sunred is completely invincible, he shitstomps anything the villains send at him without effort.

But that's not the focus of the story. It's really just a SoL about a sentai hero that's a lazy bum/asshole and his rather friendly villains.
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It is impossible to have a likeable main character without them being considered a Gary Stu or a Mary Sue.

TRUE OR FALSE?
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>>120771604
This is what I came here to say.
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>>120773222

Tatsuhiro Satou.

Or maybe that's simply relatable.
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>>120773222
To be likable, flaws are just as important as strengths. You can't have a strong direction if you're trying to go every way at once.
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is toru (the mc from iris zero) a gary stu?

i feel like his ability to solve shit other people cant is reasonably explained in that being able to see the world without an iris in a completely different way than his peers and the respect/affection his friends have for him seem pretty well earned

or im just a fag
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Apparently it's some kind of festive dish.
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>>120773222
I like Satou from NHK, but Gary Stu is the last thing I'd call him. The man is his own worst enemy
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>>120768992
Hello, brother.
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>>120773959
Why is Eggs so perfect?
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>>120774053
Because the writing is terrible and they don't know how to make him flawed and interesting.
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>>120774201

The dude is literally an asocial, autistic human wreck who is only good for fighting mech battles. How is he not flawed? And he is the most interesting character in the series. By reading this thread, you should realize that gary stu doesn't mean "a character I dont' like".
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>>120774326
How do his flaws negatively impact him in any way?
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>>120774349
He gets shot in the face.
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>>120774349

It has affected his relationship to the other characters from the beginning of the show. Are you completely brain dead?
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>>120774326
I would say anytime he enters combat, he becomes a Gary Stu. Once combat ends, he turns back into an autist.
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>>120774457
That's not what Gary Stu means.
You may call it plot armor.
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>>120772861
This is 100% true for Tatsuya.
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>>120774383
That wasn't because he fucked up, it was because Slaine was throwing a tantrum. Not to mention that turned out to be a net positive for him with his stupid robot eye.

>>120774409
But it really hasn't. No one really treats him like he's weird or anything, other than a few comments from Calm to his sister and Rayet calling him stupid. Inko gets frustrated with him but she always gets over it offscreen. It hasn't caused him any real problems or created any real conflicts at all.
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>>120774486
Once you're sniping robots on Earth from space, it doesn't just qualify as plot armor anymore.
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>>120774591
>That wasn't because he fucked up,
His fuck-up was way earlier when he failed to get Slaine to understand the meaning behind his hesitation and instead got into a shooting with him.
Slaine mistrusted him when he didn't need to.
A true Mary Sue would have recruited him then and there. Instead he got himself knocked out for 19 fucking months, and the princess MIA.

Besides, if he'd been a true, calculating Mary Sue he'd been able to recruit Slaine even after Asseylum was gunned down. Instead he pulled his gun.
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>>120774409
Not him, but do elaborate on the strains of such relationships.
Does it hinder the story or provide inconveniences to Inaho in any way?
Did he learn how to tackle such problems (character development)?
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>>120774618
Yes, armor is the wrong term for offensive skills. I apologize.

Nevertheless, Mary Sue is wronger still.
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>>120774735
You should watch the show.
It's not good, but it'll stop you from asking stupid questions.
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>>120774779
Precisely because I have watched the show, that's why I'm asking you those questions.

Come now, do elaborate.
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>>120774876
First question is answered in >>120774664.
Second question is answered just after the first battle of the second season.

Pay attention?
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>>120774664
I can't even say that was either Inaho or Slaine's fuck-up, to be honest. The entire situation was so contrived and forced I can only blame it on the writers. Neither of them answered each other's perfectly legitimate questions honestly for no real reason other than that the writers wanted them to end up on opposite sides, but couldn't think of an actual legitimate reason for them to end up deciding to be enemies there, so they just wrote WHOOPS MISUNDERSTANDING TIME! And then no one fucking bothered to bring it up afterwards, let alone criticize Inaho's response to Slaine. It was beyond stupid. As for episode 12, while pointing a gun at Slaine was a stupid move, I don't think there's anything Inaho could have done or said to Slaine to change what happened there.
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