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Fake TCG General #9
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You are currently reading a thread in /vp/ - Pokemon

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Previous Thread: >>24951280

At the moment, we are testing our first cube using LackeyCCG. Join in on the fun!
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/145755856/pokemon/updatelist.txt (paste into Lackey)

Welcome to the /vp/ fake TCG set general. we are creating a fake TCG set featuring real Pokemon (no meme cards) in the spirit of the actual game. Anyone's welcome to join!

>Can I contribute?
Absolutely. Although the Pokemon are mostly decided, we're still looking for Trainer and Special Energy card designs. Either make a mockup (Resources section -> Card creating sites), or just post the card's text. We also want artists and testers on LackeyCCG.

>What should I know before contributing?
This set is meant to be a stand-alone series, not to interact with any existing metagame. The general power scale is similar to base set/Neo (read the Tip and tricks section). Our main goal is that every Pokemon, including evolving basics, serve a purpose. For example, even Pokemon like Caterpie should have an effect like searching for more Caterpie or drawing a card, rather than simply "C - Tackle 10".

>Are these cards final?
No. We are currently testing cards to determine which cards will make the cut. Some cards will be modified for balance reasons, while others will likely need to be omitted completely. Once the cards are finalized, they will be remade using a unified template and given proper artwork (all artwork on mock-ups in this thread are assumed to be placeholders unless otherwise specified). Effect wording will also be cleaned up for the final draft.

>Pastebin with useful links:

>Tips and tricks:

>Imgur for recent threads:
So any specific times to be on Lackey this week?
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Probably the evening EST. I'm not sure what everyone's schedule looks like though.

Also, prototype new Baby Pokemon (except Togepi). The concept is that Baby Pokemon can be used as anti-evolution tools to give to their evolved forms. The reason why I exclude Togepi is because it's essentially a normal basic Pokemon in every way.
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Redone Ralts.
Think more carefully about the abilities. Wigglytuff sure as hell doesn't need a 20 damage reduction.
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Wigglytuff is a tough case because it benefits massively from either damage (50 -> 70, 50 -> 70, 80 -> 100) or from damage reduction.

New Kirlia attempt. It turns Kirlia 1's Spin Blast into an Ability (to switch into your Gardevoir/Gallade) and keeps Kirlia 2's attack at 3 damage counters.
Don't the Hotmons and the like technically not evolve from them? Their card effects should say "Search your deck for a Jigglypuff/Sudowoodo/Hitmon in its name and put it on this card".
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This was an oversight. I'll fix that in addition to any suggestions for Igglybuff's ability.

New Eevee. It takes the better Eevee's attack and introduces an ability that helps search out whatever energy you need for a specific evolution. (It also happens to benefit Smeargle and Ho-oh decks.)
So where's the MSE Template guy? ETA on completion?
We're at the point where you need to start suggesting buffs for underpowered cards as well as nerfs for overpowered ones. Start with Grudge Chandelure.

All three of these abilities are too rewarding for too little effort.

That's nice but most decks that run Eevee don't run different-typed Eeveelutions.

Would it be better if they were all 10 damage?

Also, adding the ability to Eevee at least gives some support to people who want to build an Eeveelution or Ho-oh deck. Most of the Eeveelutions have niche utility uses so the deck could function as a toolbox with Eevee at its core.
>That's nice but most decks that run Eevee don't run different-typed Eeveelutions.
It is even useful if you have only two or three cards of one specific energy.
Nice idea,

but all three abilities are too strong. Fair Fight is not even fair.

Lullaby is ok, but Pout and Training Punch are too strong.
Waiting on Lackeyanon to update before the next testing period.
Another guy said if we should nerf the damage to 10 on those Abilities, though I'm not sure it would fix the mons.

As for Training Punch, it should do 10 with its usual effect, maybe have Pout discard a random card from your opponent's hand.

It'd be better than having them as minature Compact Storage Keys.
We have other stuff to test pre-patch. I haven't seen anyone make a deck around a member of the Regi trio.

Grudge Chandelure's attack and ability don't mesh with each other or the previous stages. Grudge rewards you for spamming and stacking lots of Energy and the Retreat block rewards you for forcing in something that can't attack you back.

I prefer something like Grandmaster Tyrogue where you have to fulfill a specific condition for a large bonus. Just attacking shouldn't be it.

Scamper Tyrogue's condition is "2 Energy on a Pokemon with 30 HP".
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Pretty good. I'm in the process of syncing 0.41 right now. The template is not complete, but it's getting much closer. Ver 0.5 will complete Regular Pokemon cards making it so that you can start recreating cards that are going to make it into the set so they all have the same style.
The next release will see Pokemon with Abilities complete. Unless the next release is 0.50.
>Change Tyrogue to 10 damage + Resistance ignore
>Change Igglybuff to status immunity or something
>Change Bonsly to "draw a card whenever this Pokemon attacks"
does literally every card you guys are making have an ability ffs
I just remembered that there were a few "create a fake card" threads on the TCGO forums a while back.
If I can dig them up I'll post a link and we can see if any of the trainer cards would be a good idea.
Most of those don't normally. He just added one when he updated them for some reason.
The baby abilities are probably best reclassified to something else, since they work when the Pokemon isn't actually in play.

I'm probably the only person making these cards and I have a fetish for abilities. All of those (except Eevee) already have a version with an Ability anyways.

If anyone has any suggestions I'll gladly listen, but I can't do anything until someone speaks up.
Ok, here are the links to a few of the ones I found:

Only a few posts with Pokemon ideas.

Fun thread that became a contest, but fell apart. Mostly Ace specs.

A contest to make the best Suicune EX.

Another contest focusing on a list of EX pokemon.

A contest all about trainer cards. One item and one trainer per person. This is the best one for what we need.
There are a lot more, but here are what I think are some of the best trainer card ideas. Some could use a little balancing, but that won’t be hard.

>Elixir ACE SPEC
>For this turn only, your current active pokemon can attack without having the necessary energy equipped for its attacks. (Cannot be used on Pokemon EX)

>Ninja Edge ACE SPEC
>Attach this to a Pokemon with 90 HP or less. When this Pokemon attacks, you can select one Special Condition. The defending Pokemon now has that Special Condition. When this Pokemon is Knocked Out, your opponent takes an extra Prize Card.

>Memento: Ace Spec: Item
>When you play this card you use the effect of the last supporter played.

>Stadium: Wishing Well
>During their turn, each player may evolve a pokemon with remaining HP of 40 or less from a card from their hand at any time.

>Chargestone Cave Stadium
>Each Active Pokemon (both yours and your opponent's) can't retreat. This card isn't affected by abilities or other trainer cards.

>Mega ring (item/tool/Ace spec)
>If pokemon this card is attach to mega evolve, your turn does not end.
This was before spirit links became a thing.

>Giovanni - Trainer - Supporter
>If your opponents hand size is 6 or more cards you may look at their hand, return any 2 cards you like to his/her deck and your opponent randomly discards one card.
Part 2

>DRAGON SCALE – Trainer Item
>If this card is attached to your Dragon Pokemon, it provides 2 energies of any type, but only 1 energy of any type at same time. You cannot play card named 'Dragon Scale" more than once during your turn. At the end of your turn, discard this card.

>X Accuracy
>your coin flips are heads for the duration of your turn.

>Mega Evolution Stones (Pokemon Tool)
>You can only attach this card to your active pokemon. At the end of your turn, search your deck for a mega evolution card that mega evolve from your active pokemon and put it onto your active pokemon (this counts as mega evolving).

>Red card Pokémon tool
>If the Pokémon this card is attached to is damaged by an attack from your opponent’s active Pokémon, select a Pokémon on his/her bench, that is now your opponent’s active Pokémon. Discard Red Card afterwards. If your opponent’s bench is empty, do nothing.
The creator later admitted that he forgot that there was already a Red Card.

>Ice [from Pokémon rangers shadows of Almia] Supporter
>Show your hand to your opponent and discard all the water energies you have. Shuffle all the water energies on your field and in your discard pile back into your deck. Your turn is now over.

>HMO3: Surf - Trainer- Item (Pokemon Tool)
>The Pokemon this Tool is attached to may use this cards attack as its own.
>Surf [W][C] 60
>Ignore the type of the Pokemon this Tool is attached to. This attack type applies the effect of a [W] Pokemon (You cannot have more than 1 HM03 in play.)
Final ones.

>Xerosic Supporter
>Search your deck for a energy card and attach it to your Pokémon. shuffle your deck afterwards. you cannot attach an energy card from your hand during the turn you play his card.

>Supporter: Mom's delivery
>Search your deck for 2cards and place them on top of your deck in any order

>Spell Tag - Tool
>When the pokemon this tool is attached to attacks, prevent the damage done to your opponents pokemon. Place the same amount of damage counters that would be done as damage from that attack on the defending pokemon.
Elixer can be broken if there's adequate recycling, Memento is just a worse VS Seeker but on an Ace Spec?, having Chargestone Cave ignore Switch trainers/abilities is silly, Dragon Scale and X-Accuracy are broken or can lead to tiptoeing later, and Ice doesn't make sense.
Well let's fix what we can and throw out what we have no use for.

I have no clue how to fix Elixir, and I doubt it can be fixed.

Memento is worded to say the last supporter played for a reason. Keep in mind it is an item card, so that is the effect of 2 supporters in turn. Also it says "the last supporter played", so think carefully about what that could mean.

Chargestone Cave is silly, but in a deck that uses cards that can poison....

Dragon Scale has limits, but it is still broken.
How about:
>Dragon Scale-Tool
>If this card is attached a Dragon Pokemon, it provides 1 energies of any type, but only 1 energy of any type at same time. At the end of your turn, discard this card.

X-Accuracy might just be unsalvageable.

Ice is.... Yeah, it needs work, and I'm not sure what part of it should be changed to make it usable.
Here is what the creator said about it:
>At 1st glace, some people will scream that this is too powerful, and others will shake their heads saying that it hurts you too much to justify using. This is a card that should be used as a last resort late in the game and only if you have a deck that is 2 or more types. First, the positive is that you now have reclaimed all of your water energies and they are back in your deck. I shouldn’t need to say how useful this is especially late in the game when you have burned through a good chunk of your energies. Now that alone would be too powerful, so the large negative effect is needed to balance it out. The worst thing is that all the water energies have been removed from your hand and field, so you are going to have to wait until you draw them to place them on your Pokémon again, but it gets worse because you also have to end your turn.
That description for Ice just makes it more confusing. Does he know better non-supporter cards like Energy Retrieval, Super Rod, and Energy Recycler have existed? I really don't get it.
Christ, and I thought we had some awful trainer ideas.
I think the idea is that recovery of all the water energies would be more useful, but the restrictions of the card make it unusable.
I am going to throw it into the unfixable pile.
>"create a fake card"
!= "create a fake SET"

This are standalone cards, we want to create a well-balanced set
>>Elixir ACE SPEC
I have an idea for a lighter alternative to Elixir:

Triple Rainbow Energy
Triple Rainbow Energy provides (C) Energy.
While in play triple Rainbow Energy provides every type of Energy but provides only 3 in any combination at a time.
At the end of your turn, after your attack: If Triple Rainbow Energy is in play, discard it.
If Triple Rainbow Energy is in your Discard Pile, put it into your Lost Zone.
>>X Accuracy
X Accuracy makes moves like >>24987536 doing infinite damage.
Is just a bad version of Energy Search.
Well, there is one thing that you didn't consider.
The text said:
>Search your deck for a energy card and attach it to your Pokémon.
So this can work with more than just basic energies.
Has anyone tried making Trainers that puts the opponent's hands into the discard/discard into deck yet? Or is that frowned upon/illegal.
Pokemon has never been big on hand destruction. It exists, but it's pretty rare because the game just doesn't have ways of defending against it like Yu-gi-oh or Magic so it just ends up frustrating for the person on the receiving end.

I would argue that Yu-Gi-Oh players get fucked over by hand destruction even more just because they don't have Draw 5/6/7 Supporter cards to reset their entire hand. If your hand gets wiped in Yu-Gi-Oh you have a very strong chance of losing.
These fanmade cards are all horribly designed except Red Card. Red Card's only flaw is ignorance.

Bury this and any other ideas like it.
Do. We need these.

If you drop to zero cards in hand in Yugioh, and you don't have game that turn, you're fucking dead.
In Yugioh, pretty much every deck is full of interception methods to stop dangerous cards like hand destruction. In Pokemon, you're completely helpless during your opponent's turn. If they nuke your hand, you have no real way to have prevented it outside of running dedicated Trainer lock.

Not really. Yeah, you're correct that Yugioh has some ways of preventing it (Effect Veiler, Ghost Ogre, Burning Abyss-style floaters, traps if you went first), but if you don't have any of those you're out of luck and basically have to scoop because there's no "draw 1 card and recover your entire hand" like there is in Pokemon. Hand destruction is very strong no matter which game you play, but the difference is where the RNG falls (opening hand in Yugioh vs. what you topdeck in Pokemon).
Regardless, cards that promote taking control out of the players' hands is inherently bad game design. Hand destruction should be costly for the person using it or should require some amount of setup.

Or, better yet, be left out entirely. Pokemon, at its core, has always been very heavily focused on what's happening on the field rather than the players' hands. Choking things before they hit the field is very rarely a major aspect of the game outside of trainer lock.
Yu-gi-oh decks are more consistent by nature, because they're smaller and don't have Energy cards taking up a quarter of the deck. You have a better chance of having a way to stop hand destruction in your opening hand than you do of topdecking a hand refresh card.

Most decks typically don't maindeck 3 Effect Veiler/3 Ghost Ogre/many traps though, especially in this format. The most realistic assumption is that people run 2-3 Veilers or Ghost Ogre and that's a 23-33% probability of opening with one, whereas in our Pokemon meta people run 8 supporters minimum. That's approximately a 13% chance each turn to "draw out" of a discarded hand, and unlike Yugioh your opponent has to win 1 prize at a time, so assuming a constant stream of benched Pokemon you end up with a +50% probability of drawing into a supporter before your opponent can win. On the other hand, if you lose your hand in Yugioh you're going to get 1 or 2TK'd very quickly. I'm not going to deny that it's less likely to draw an out in Pokemon than in Yugioh, but there is less impact in Pokemon.

That being said, I think it would be interesting to explore hand destruction as a deck focus with Chandelure and possibly Slaking.
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