>>876168 >management has been exposed as pretty incompetent How so? Because just like most airlines, they continued to fly through open airspace? There were other airliners that flew the exact same flight path just a few minutes before and after; they just happened to be the one that the retarded Russian military picked to shoot at because "hurr durr we owns the skies DO NOT FLY IN OUR AIR".
As for MH370, it looks like the actions of one deranged suicidal pilot. It happens. Egypt Air lost one ten or fifteen years ago to the same thing.
I flew with them a number of times a few years ago. They have this really annoying and frantic violin music they play during final approach. I suppose they figure it calms the passengers down, but frankly it does the total opposite. Plus the roughest landing I've ever had was with them, arriving at night in a rainstorm into Sabah. The pilot basically slammed the plane down onto the runway.
>>876311 Who cares? We're talking about how the fucking Russians armed a bunch of drunken savages, supplied heavy weapons and military specialists to run them, and shot down a passenger airliner full of innocents.
>>876323 Who cares? We're talking about how the fucking Americans armed a bunch of drunken savages, supplied heavy weapons and military specialists to run them, and destroyed houses and buildings full of innocents.
Admit it, you're only so heated right now because it's Russia. Get your head out of your fucking ass.
Any Canadafags here from Newfoundland? Is it worth visiting? I'm kind of an outdoors guy and I like to drink so it seems right up my alley. I'm thinking of going somewhere in Atlantic Canada in August for a week or two, so if Newfoundland isn't worth it I was thinking of Nova Scotia as a second.
>>876294 >No it was not. The airspace was cleared by more than one committee I think. The only area that was off limits to commercial airlines was Crimea. LOL. The FAA had all US airlines avoiding it since Apr 23rd, just so you know. I don't care about your European committees official press releases worded after the fact, it was common sense, and all pilots worth their salt were already avoiding it. Yea, maybe air turkey or malaysia didn't get the memo because these are airlines to be avoided, k?. If anything is should go to show you that you live in danger if you fly shit airlines. Other planes had been shot down over 4 days. That is major news to a pilot.
My dad runs an airline. Anything management learns about anything is passed down the ranks to pilots, they are debriefed all the time, always been that way, back pre-internet. Pilots also read forums, the news, etc. They're not just airline employees, they are captains and have to make safety #1. They can refuse to fly for being tired, spotting some issue, having a bathroom backed up, any shit they want. Quality airlines do all kinds of security alerts between themselves that you don't see in the media. BA had some internal terror threat a couple of weeks ago, called all the crews home, with 12hr deadline. I'm sure none of you noticed.
I'm sorry you don't understand that the Ukraine contains Crimea. And, it was OVER crimea that the missile was fired.
>>876325 I'm well aware of the Iran Air shootdown, having lost family onboard it.
The U.S.'s actions were nothing like Russia's. Russia is far more culpable. The captain of the Vincennes fucked up royally. The Russian troops running the missile battery fucked up royally. The Vincennes was legally allowed to be where it was, however. The Russian troops are invading a sovereign country under the pretense of being a home-grown insurgency, which is of course a complete fraud.
>>876422 MA announced that they will allow anyone who wants to cancel their flights to do so without penalty until Thursday. You can get a full refund.
Personally, if I go anywhere, I'll probably check with them to see if I can take one of their flights. I feel a lot of sympathy for them right now. They had good service the one time I flew with them -- from where I was to KL to Schiphol, and the reverse route on the way back, the same route as MH17 and I think it was even the same flight number. I enjoyed the stopovers each way in KL.
>>876407 Russia's actions? Invading a sovereign country? I see you have swallowed up that American propaganda. At this point we are basically a gang of bullies surrounding Russia, repeatedly kicking him in the balls and getting outraged when he acts upset. Quickly, how dare he complain or attempt to defend himself! Kick him some more!
>>876374 >>US Airlines >Gee, really? 0 reason behind that. others didn't need to as multiple organizations reviewed and marked them safe. Of course there was reason to avoid that airspace. To argue otherwise is kind of stupid of you.
>>876374 >>Crimea is in Ukraine >No it isn't, and E. Ukraine is not Crimea. Now you're just stupid, or pedantic. Crimea is within independent Ukraine.
>>876405 >>Except there were no other planes. >Yes there were. I smell a Russian-troll-army shitposter. How much is Putin paying you, comrade? There were no US planes over any part of Ukraine, that's for damn sure. And, there were other planes flying this route, and other airlines who were not. In the days preceding this, 3 other planes had been shot down. It should have been clear that no matter the intended target, it would be stupid to fly over a war zone, especially one where at least one of the sides is dealing with homegrown/unsophisticated/untrained personnel, because there's no air traffic control watching, communication among agencies or any fighter jets or anyone else listening to the identifying radio beacons. This would be clear to a government like say, Israel, just who would be flying over them, and when. But rebels on the ground? Nah.
And, before anyone thinks this was unprecedented, your memory is slim. SCUDs were an absolute terror to planes not even a decade ago during several civil wars in the Middle East (Kuwait, Yemen, etc) and into neighboring countries from Iraq, Syria and Jordan aimed at Saudi Arabian and Israeli planes.
>>876431 >>>876430 >Oh I'm still going to fly with them. The two crashes had nothing to do with the airline. I just don't like the jokes and comments people are making. >As someone who works for an airline I definitely feel bad for them, especially when I have only heard good things from their customer service and stewards. Oh, I wouldn't say "nothing to do with them." It may be nothing like this ever happens again, high odds that it won't, but the airline is definitely practicing poor judgement within, and with their pilots. Like all state run airlines, probably underpaying and limited personnel.
>>876495 >There were 193 of my countrymen on that plane, and it makes me sick to see the US and the UK abuse this tragic accident for their own political agenda. I'm going to give you a pass for being upset. But, begging Putin to take away weapons from the idiots, and using his influence with them to allow access to the crash scene safely and with cooperation with all investigators is fine. Those are your countrymen on the ground rotting, who need to come home, intact, and with dignity. And, this is absolutely considered a war crime, and in polite circles, the crime didn't just involve your one country. It was an international incident. So, stop your bashing. I personally think all the countries of the world have been restrained and deferring to common decency.
>>877994 >my brother is going to fly to the island of crete in a week from the netherlands. >Are the chances higher than normal of something weird happening midflight? If you mean, are the netherlands targeted and therefore their flagship airline or planes that originate there? I doubt that. But, if you have lax airport security, and in the current political atmosphere between some countries in Europe and other countries around the world? I think odds are probably slightly worse for all air travelers, and therefore, security should be even more perfect. That's my two cents. I, personally, won't be flying over any countries with missiles and pissed off inhabitants for a while. My next trip is to Canada (so, no, I'm not avoiding all air travel). I'll be flying a quality airline to do so, too, because when all other extraneous factors being equal, a good pilot can make the difference in foul weather.
He's flying transavia if you know the company. I don't think he'll get shot down but 3 planes in a week under different circumstances doesn't sound like coincidence to me and i don't like to let things happen out of my control.
There's no real evidence the plane was shot down in Ukraine. Until the investigation concludes, you should assume it crashed. The lost Malaysian flight crashed, as well, and it was the exact same type of plane.
It's a real possibility that glorious American engineering is at play here, so if you take Malaysian Airlines, don't go with a Boeing.
>>878002 Did you mean to reply to someone else? If not, clam down. Everything I said makes logical sense. If you want to know if it's safe to fly, you look to your airline first, and then you look to the quality of the airport security at the local airport. It's a spectrum of risk/chance, not black and white good or bad. Air travel is not inherently safe by definition. There is a human factor. Yours and theirs. You can choose not to fly in weather they deem good enough, too.
>>878003 >but 3 planes in a week under different circumstances doesn't sound like coincidence to me and i don't like to let things happen out of my control. In this case, it's coincidence. It's actually out of your control once you're in your seat. At that point it's in the pilot's hands. There's rational fear, and there's irrational worrying both. Why can you control? Use common sense about who you fly with. This Transavia airline has no planes younger than 15 years. Not a great problem, but you could do better. Their fleet is leased, not owned, which adds another contractor to their maintenance, and their ability to recover easily to mechanical, which could affect your travel plans, or even cause them to use poor judgement. How so? Well, if this airline doesn't have lines of credit for gas and maintenance throughout the region's airports, they may head for home vs handle something afar. I realize people look for bargain airfare in any way possible, but there's your advice. If iceland or italy has another volcano eruption disrupting travel, will you get home first after the smoke clears? Or will you be seriously inconvenienced another week or two?
>>878008 >There's no real evidence the plane was shot down in Ukraine. There is evidence. The only thing that flight recorder is going to indicate is how long the passengers had mental awareness they were falling and dying, ie suffering.
>>878013 Well i don't really care for my brother being inconvenienced. I just want him not to die.
Personally i just don't fly at all. There are too many important factors outside of my knowledge that i can not judge. It may sound paranoid but i call it taking responsibility for myself.
My bro's already booked the flight and he doesn't seem to want to cancel, so i'd need a good reason to convince him. I hoped 3 planes under unfortune circumstances would be enough but he's not buying it.
You have some serious problems. Don't bother your brother with them. Your fear is highly irrational, and unfounded. 3 planes crashing doesn't make a 4th crash more likely. I refer you to my Toyota analogy for that. Your argument of "control of the situation" is plain wrong. Traffic accidents are called accidents for a reason. You don't control that drunken driver that hits you on the street, yet you are not afraid to go outside, are you?
Seriously, leave your brother alone and let him enjoy life while you waste away under your paranoia.
No, I was talking directly to you. You have proven yourself incapable of calculating risks. The risks you are trying to asses are so fucking small and unlikely that's its completely pointless to consider them. It's the equivalent of wearing a hard hat on your desk job... I'm assuming you also buy lottery tickets?
>>878044 But that's considering the average amount of crashes each years. Right now there is something going on and there are 7 airplane crashes/disapearances this year. 3 of which in the past week. That last fact especially tells me something might be going on and there might be more shit to follow.
The odds of not dying in a plane crash are great if you fly in Europe, North America or Australia. It's slightly worse in Asia and Latin America. Africa though is a crapshoot for planes. Still odds there are pretty decent.
I'm really sad that MAS had to have another airline incident in a few months. Their economy class has great service, great food and really friendly people much, much better than the other Western and Asian airliners I've flown.
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