/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

Who is the asshole that took so long to make a new thread?

>>54905404
I don't usually make them, but no one else was, so...

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>>54903064

True. Gangrel and Nosferatu might flourish there too. Vamps interested in luxury and influence in the mortal world would have a bad time.

I Imagine the vampiric population of the eastern bloc as overwhelmingly Anarchs or Autarkis. They probably celebrate the flight of the established order so that they can start building new forms of vampire society Not burdened by the old traditions or the Sabbath vs. Cam war.

In reality though its mostly small Anarchs fiefdoms (a few that actually have a relativly free structure) with little wealth that constantly have to lay low to not get raped by the intelligence agencies (the eastern ones actually have an idea about vamps and keep the Eastern governments clean while actually aiding vamps in the west to further their corrupting influence).

Once the eastern bloc collapses Cam and Sabbath both begin a savage race to occupy territories. Most Anarchs switch sides or become marginalized. Only a few areas remain in Anarch control.

>>54905404
I saw a thread earlier, but it had a bugged picture in the catalog and lead to a 404.

>>54905573
Probably a duplicate.

>>54905352
I had a GM Angel in a Promethean game. Was fun times, and like most angels it won in the end since it had a specific task it needed to accomplish. But the PC had sabotaged that plan enough that the near victory meant the world wasnt overwhelmed by the terrible monstrosity the Angel was trying to make.

>>54905573
Yeah that was me, i tried to create the thread, but it was bugging out for some reason.

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>>54906038
What a fucking failure

On the subject of the Buddhist Get member last thread...what's the most unconventional character you've come up with for your games?

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>>54906387
My favorite antagonist was from a masquerade game I played years ago. He was once a relatively unknown but super skilled martial artist whose only goal in life was to be the best and to fight strong opponents. Unfortunately one night he unwittedly challenged a vampire to a fight and despite being way more skilled soundly got his ass handed to him and was left for dead. A young vampire who happened to watch and who had greatly admired the martial artist in life asked his maker to embrace the martial artist. At first the martial artist was overjoyed at his unlife and greater power until he realized that he could never get stronger and that there would always be others stronger than him due to him only being 12 gen. Suffice to say he learned about diablerie and you can probably guess what began to happen next. He was pretty much pic related vampire mode

>>54905352
Is anyone willing to post a copy of the Changeling 2e beta rules so I can shitpost about them?

hello everybody, sorry for botter all of you but i am a poorfag and i need V20 Dark Ages Companion and i can't buy it. so, if anny of you can borrow a pdf copy i will really happy

>>54905352
I'm currently planning on dropping Quashmal on my D:tD party. There's a particularly nasty Angel in their city that can hack apart and modify other spirits too that they're gonna have to deal with.
Is a Strix / Lune malgath reinforced with Infrastructure bit too much to hit them with?

>>54906725
What Clan was he?

>>54906851
>tfw you try posting on little sleep and end up missing words and typing like a retard

>>54906939
Brujah also one of the players was once his human student who he turned after he was diagnosed with cancer. Suffice to say the player had to struggle with whether he should join his master as a cannibal

>>54906846
Check the pastebin

Reposting this question:

V:tM (classic WoD) related.

15th Gen Inceptor Discipline: Rather than conventional Fortitude, the Inceptor creates a Discipline that upgrades 1 dot of Stamina dice per level of said discipline. Rather than simply soaking lethal and bashing, the flesh itself gains the ability to soak aggravated damage.

"Fortitude has a maximum and it's the discipline that manages aggravated damage" I hear you say. Well, true, but other disciplines affect it too. Serpentis has an ability that allows you to transform, turning soak difficulties to a flat 5. Visceratka has an ability that raises your soak by +1 against agg/lethal, +2 bashing, halves all fire damage, at the cost of -2 touch/tactile based Perception dice on rolls. And Protean 6 lets you assume a marble form that halves damage after soak. So Fortitude doesn't have a monopoly on soaking supernatural damage by a long shot. There are other roads than raising mastery of Fortitude to doing it.

So this proposed ability only makes the mortal body more durable, allowing a second means by which one can develop to mitigate magical damage that isn't Fortitude. Given Inceptor disciplines cost 15(1), 24(2), 36(3), 48(4), 60(5) to attain, and all it'd do is upgrade existing Stamina levels, I figure that's balanced.

Passive would be ideal, but obviously that might be too convenient and imbalanced. Medium hard mode would be making the cainite spend blood (2 points, for thin bloods) to activate all known levels. Hard mode would be forcing them to spend blood per individual level. Extreme mode would be limiting this ability to a few turns or a single turn.

Thoughts?

>>54907216
>https://pastebin.com/7HiVphFm
anon, you are my nigga, i never used a pasterbin before you. God Bless you, now my playes can play a more expanded vampire dark ages world v20 thanks to you

Is Reap the Whirlwind for Requiem 2e a good book to introduce new players without overwhelming them?

So I left about two or three months ago because all the power wank stuff was legitimately turning me off from the game as a whole, are we past that or should I still stay gone for a while?

>>54906778
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/676949-collected-second-edition-open-development-blogs
All of hill's publicly released work on Changeling 2e is linked in this post, older versions are in the spoiler box.

>>54908151

It's a consistent part of the threads now, but at the moment things aren't power level walking and GenCon this week will probably give us new content.

So the Changeling 2e material is actually leagues better than the trash fire i was expecting
Might even buy the book

>>54909129
The material linked >>54908177
Will not be present in the book. Its been Heavily rewritten by Rose Bailey (for the worse in my opinion, mechanics she is in charge of directing just have a way of sucking huge dicks.)

>>54909431

Are you sure they aren't talking about the new preview blog stuff?

>>54909431
Wasn't Rose in charge of VtR 2e? It's mostly good for me.

>>54909482
Her later work on supplements has been far less good than the core. Thousand Years of Night for example was pretty much a disaster that didn't do anything to actually address elder level play. The stat blocks were all garbage, the powers listed weren't well tested or functional, and then it completely leaves out key things like the fact that high Blood Potency characters can't feed on humans any more.

>>54909617
I agree that the supplements have been pretty meh, but the worst is that we still don't have officially published bloodlines! Gah!

>>54909431
Could you throw me a link to the new stuff that doesn't ask for my credit card?

>>54909482
>>54909617
Rose? I thought his name was Charles?

>>54910052
I thought it was Russ.

>>54910052
Save it for when atamajakki shows up.

>>54910041
>Changeling 2e preview links

>Links to all of Hill's preview content
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/676949-collected-second-edition-open-development-blogs
>Links to all of Rose's preview content
http://theonyxpath.com/storytelling-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/merits-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/contracts-of-steed-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/tumbledown-market-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/the-true-fae-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/a-walk-in-the-hedge-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/the-autumn-court-changeling-the-lost/
http://theonyxpath.com/goblin-contracts-changeling-the-lost/

If you are getting prompted for a credit card you might be doing something horribly, horribly wrong, Changeling 2e isn't out yet.

>>54910183
Thanks m8. I found a compiled preview on Scribd that looks like this stuff, but that could just be me being a 'tard.

>>54910052

Nah, it's Rose.

>>54910350
Since when he had some kind of sex change? For what purpose?

>>54910705
>Being surprised the type that OPP hires would cut his dick off.

>>54910753
Does anyone have any after pics?

Wow, you guys lied to me about Shadow Names in 2e. They're still pretty important, at least in the fluff.

>>54910789
Dude who cares about fluff. In crunch they are useless

>>54910799
In crunch you are useless.

>>54910765
Nigga why the fuck would you want to see that?

>>54910799
Well if you aren't playing an orphaned murder hobo, it would relate to spell sympathy. Using your shadow name preventing people from casting on your family and coworkers and such.

>>54910915
If I wanted to explore family ties I'd go live in the read world, not play a game. I generally kill mine off because I just don't care at all about that type of boring relationship drama.

>>54910949
So yeah. Orphan murder hobo. So of course a whole mechanic about splitting your identity between mundane life and mage life would be 'useless' to you.

>>54910949
Shadow Names can also be used as a yantra, or give you access to unique yantras, iirc.

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>>54910915
>>54911000
People play with family and friends in Mage? For what purpose? All that useless garbage will get in the way of fighting evil, exploring and pursuing mysteries

>>54911000
I like the bits about maintaining a shell of mortal identity, but anything more than pretending to be human as a mage just seems silly given the disconnect between mage and mortals. Idk if go murder hobo, but just like in real life, an offer of huge amounts of power or money would easily make my past meaningless compared to that. The magic of the world is just far more interesting than any drab mundanity you can enslave.

>>54911022
And it should make you harder to manipulate through time right? Since at many points, you are effectively a different person as far as sympathy is concerned.

>>54911084
The Shadow Name merit does two things, one being far more useful than the other.

It grants a +X Yantra, where X is equal to the dots you've invested in it, so long as your spell fits in with the concept your Shadow Name describes. So a "Seraph" is going to be great at blasting people with fire, but less good at winding back time.

The other one, is that is separates your mystic and normal selves.
Such that when someone tries to use one of the two to affect the other with temporal or spatial sympathy, the Withstand is increased by the dots.
It also penalises mundane rolls to identify you as the same person as your mystical self. Kinda like Superman's Clark Kent identity.

Do you guys do tons of wits + composure checks even for little things like going to bed or hearing a strange sound?

>>54911231
No, just when it's important.
If people immediately get squirrelly I then push them into feeling guilty about their metagaming.

>>54911252
Oh interesting. My ST does it constantly even for talking with friends and stuff. It gets kind of irritating.

What makes mages so strong in crossovers?

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>>54911339
Mages can do anything and bend reality like it's a cheap dry cleaners hanger

>>54911339
Mage powers are more flexible, more potent, can be sustained for longer can be combined/chained for greater effect, at default don't require a "resources" for use, many are plain and simple hard counters to most opponents (such as focing them to commit suicide with Mind 2 or trapping them in a bubble of looped space with Space 3).

It also doesn't hurt that Mages can 'dispel' other supernatural's powers, using an appropriate Arcanum. A Mage with Fate 3 can cancel any changeling Contract, and can start modifying or destroying their pledges.

>>54911339
The extreme lack of priority placed on crossover balance.

>>54911485
I think you mean complete.
The reason the splats are cross-compatible is so that you can have NPCs from other splats interact with the players.

Not so you can have a Monster Mash.

>>54911485
Is this a bad thing?

No. No it is not.

>>54911498
And that is a mistake since there is nothing wrong with a monster mash but because OPP is so inept vampires which should have been the king of the monsters gets shit on by fucking Changelings let alone a boneeyard geist that can singlehandily rid a city of vampires by itself

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>>54911450
Makes me wonder if such resources could be tapping into something personal.

>>54911550
Vampires in WoD have never been kings of anything. The closest to kings being the extremely low generation methusalahs and antediluvian that were more plot devices than characters.

Changelings in classic WoD sucked. nWoD Changelings are great.

Old Mummies were OP kill machines and were pretty great. New Mummies are superheroes and that's okay.

Werewolves are werewolves, and were always designed to have great big Henshin Daimajin battles with Cthonic monsters. Vampires included.

Prometheans are probably the only force capable of bonking mages on the head and making it hurt.

>>54910799
Buy the fucking merit, get gid yantra. Stfu

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So how would you stat Rick Sanchez in Genius the transgression?

>>54912215
Not interested in fanfiction games, sorry.

In what way the Euthanatos concept of Moksha different from Akashic's Samadhi? IIRC both are "free from the Great Wheel"

>>54912215
>using fansplats instead of just making him an etherite
Why even bother

>>54911550
You just want vampires to be the 'kings' because you're a fucking fat goth chick obsessed with anne rice and twilight.

I found you out

>>54912215
>staining Genius with rick and morty
yuck

>>54905352
Got a Demon the Descent game, looking for players:

>>54903552

>>54912215
I will not deign to descend to that level just because someone was butt hurt that they couldn't make an etherite in awakening.

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>>54912403
>Staining Rick and Morty with Genius.

RPG.net is that way.

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Genius even as a fansplat is better and more playable than half of the CofD lines. And only hipster and contraians shit talk Rick and Morty

>>54912479
>Genius even as a fansplat is better and more playable than half of the CofD lines
No it isn't. See? I can say things without backing them up either. However, it's not a CofD game, so I don't really see how it's relevant here.

>>54912504
It's better than promethean, mummy, beast, and geist. You are free to disagree of course. Also this isn't just a CofD general either

>>54912544
>Also this isn't just a CofD general either
Of course. It's a WoD game then?

Will Deviant be good? Or will its thematic overlap with Beast prove too heavy a burden?

>>54912563
What thematic overlap with Beast? If anything it has a thematic overlap with Changeling. Brutally twisted by your captors, you escape, they hunt you down as you try to cope with your new existence.

>>54912575
Whats the point of escaping something when you are less powerful than a fucking vampire and cant do much about it?

>>54912575
Except that Deviant is explicitly about getting revenge on your tormentors as well. Changeling is 'a bad thing happened, and now you pick up the pieces'. Deviant and Beast both center more around revenge and retaliation than they do about recovery.

>>54912602
While Beast is riddled with revenge fantasies in its story pieces, they aren't actually a theme it has. it has more in common with Vampire and Werewolf. Satiating your Hunger, which can be a literal hunger or something you're compelled to do so that you don't lose yourself to your Horror, is more what it focuses on than any kind of revenge or retaliation. The goal of a Beast isn't to get back at anyone. Even that "Beasts teach lessons" shit was totally inconsistent and more often than not just ignored.

>>54912600
You can be less powerful or more powerful. The thing is unlike vampire your enemies scale with you

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Feedback requested on this character sheet for the Slender Man.

https://pastebin.com/tMwkuTtG

>>54911550
Why should vampire be king of all splats, according to you? I'm curious, really.

>>54912429
I take it that your a reddit and memey fan?

I still stand by that Celerity can one shot Mages. Not all of them have Forces.

>>54912768
No, we hate Genius here too.

>>54912215
Really high Mental stats, good Social stats, average Physical stats. Inspiration 6+, really low Obligation. A good spread of Axioms, with his main ones being Katastrofi, Automata and Skafoi. Morty is his Beholden.

>>54912785
>Moving really fast to slap a mage as hard as a toddler.

>>54912785
5/7 bait.

would bait again.

>>54912873
The truth hurts, doesn't it? Poor magefag. Get speed blitzed.

>>54912805
I think you should switch his social and physical around other than that I agree

>>54912802
Why? And without using memes or buzzwords

>>54912914
>without using memes or buzzwords
that would be impossible

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>>54912734
Because Vampires have almost always been the king of monsters in fiction due to the closeness with the devil

>>54912914
Because it is a fansplat that attempted to cover ground that didn't need covered, using an angle that didn't to exist.

Like, are you a brilliant mind that can make whatever you imagine real no matter how crazy? Play Mage.

Do you want a game about super science gone wrong and the consequences on the world? Play Promethean.

Genius was just a bad concept, before you even get to the rules.

At least Leviathan was an okay concept.

>>54913113
At least Leviathan is useful for ERP.

So, whats the trinity/scion news over from gencon?

>>54913110
Vampires have existed around the world in various forms, Anon. They're not exclusively related to the Devil. Nor are they his most devout followers. Humans are.

which game would you recommend to someone who's never played WoD? are they all basically grimdark urban superheroes?

>>54913113
What if i wanted to play as mad scientist, but i don't like mage?

>>54913110
>Vampires have almost always been the king of monsters in fiction
Evidently false.

>>54913172
>Nor are they his most devout followers. Humans are.
Humans are, more often than not, the biggest monsters in fiction, period. How far will one go for power?

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>>54913225
>>54913246
>double posting

>>54913211
Start blue book mortals, then depending on what they want veer into hunter or one of the splats. If they want a splat just give em like....one paragraph descriptions of each and see what catches their eyes

>>54913258
Nah, I forgot to mention the other guy.

>>54911224
So basically it's a merit that lets you play a silver age superhero. That's pretty amazing.

>>54913246
>Humans are, more often than not, the biggest monsters in fiction, period. How far will one go for power?

And that's why mages are the most monstrous pc's in the CofD.

>>54913113
Not everybody likes shitty mage. Maybe someone wants to play as Dexter or Mandark or heaven forbid Jimmy Neutron or Rick Sanchez. So no Genius is not a bad concept.

>>54913228
Play a mortal or hunter?

Find a different system?

Don't play crappy fangames?

But I mean, if you can find someone running a genius game and join them, more power to you. Can't hate on someone for doing what they enjoy I guess.

Just keep it out of this thread, it ain't wod.

>>54913350
>>54913228

The new Alchemist antagonists from Promethean 2e also make good mad scientists,

>>54913350
>Just keep it out of this thread, it ain't wod.
It uses the NWoD system and it takes place in the greater WoD.

>>54913411
Yeah, but they forgot to actually give them full rules. They like, started writing rules for them... then forgot to finish the job.

They could have been better, to put it simple.

>>54913435
>it takes place in the greater wod
It does not, because it isn't an official game. The creator implies that it can be played in the same setting, but it does not take place in that setting.

>>54913459
I say it does faggot. What are you gonna do about it?

>>54912785
How would they one shot a Mage through reflexive Mage Armor? Celerity doesn't boost damage or interrupt reflexive actions.

>>54913485
Tell you Genius sucks, and you're lame for playing it?

>>54913513
The horror!

>>54913511
Depends which mage armor I guess. Some are less useful than others.

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>>54905352
So what's your guy's opinion on what we've seen from the alpha of Vampire 5th?

As someone who's played every edition of Vampire since release in the 90s, I'm optimistic with what I've seen. The few bits of system I've seen seem fine enough and it's not like White Wolf games are known for their system anyway. The main draw for this line is the world and background and it seems like they're going in an interesting direction. That's probably my main gripe with the Onyx Path stuff - in an age of inclusion and political correctness all their White Wolf books are really fucking bland when many past releases with White Wolf itself contained some offensive material here and there but was a really evocative read nonetheless.

>>54913485
Nice to see that this is what a fansplat advocate looks like.

>>54913557
>it seems like they're going in an interesting direction
How? I only have a barely more than passing familiarity with Vampire, but the things I've heard don't sound promising at all.

Have we even linked the Deviant pitch post in here?

http://theonyxpath.com/deviant-deviant-the-renegades/

>>54913649

Deviant sounds good, but the whole "abducted, changed, soul damaged, escape, get hunted, etc." schtick a helluva lot like changeling, just with a little less PTSD, and a lot more revenge fantasy.

There's still certainly a lot of creative space within those themes, but Dave will really need to work hard to carve a unique niche for Deviant.

How fast is Celerity/Acceleration anyway? Will it enable you to dodge bullets if you see the gun pointed at you?

>>54913569
That doesn't seem any worst than the average woof or vamp fan

>>54913805
Celerity gives bonus defense that applies to ranged attacks, so yes. Dunno about acceleration.

>>54913805
>Will it enable you to dodge bullets if you see the gun pointed at you?

Yes, although Celerity only allows a Defense against firearms equal to dots in Celerity, while Acceleration allows a mage's full Defense.

>>54913805
In WoD rank 5 celerity allowed you to run 300 ft per second

>>54913339
There was the game that was and will be again. That game was called Ascension and it let you do all of these things.

>>54913837
In old? I remember it only went up to 80mph. That's a lot faster.

>>54913833
Nobody said anything or asked anything about fucking mage, so why did you feel the need to bring it up? Oh I know because you are a fucking mage supremacist who just had to gloat about how superior mages are. Fucking asshole

>>54913877
Mage mage mage MAAAAAAAAGE

>>54913877
>Nobody said anything or asked anything about fucking mage
>How fast is Celerity/Acceleration anyway?
>Acceleration
Am I replying to bait?

>>54913856
You mean the game where paradox was so broken it was literally antifun and sucked any enjoyment that could be had from the game not to mention the focus on magic instead of supersciene? I'll pass thank you very much

>>54913877
Dude, I despise mages too, but the guy literally asked for Celerity and Acceleration.

You're making mageposters look better.

>>54913837
>In WoD rank 5 celerity allowed you to run 300 ft per second

Source?

>>54913877

The Anon asked whether Celerity (Requiem) or Acceleration (*Mage*) allows a pc to dodge bullets. >>54913805

So, yes the Anon did inquire about Mage.

Thus, I commented that both abilities allow it, but one is better than the other.

In the future, I suggest you try reading first, with less knee-jerk anti-mage, troll-like animus.

>>54913911
>>54913915
My bad I didn't read carefully enough I thought he meant how fast did celerity accelerate. I still fucking hate mage fans though smug bastards

Does someone have the Pdf of "How do you do that?" for M20?
Please I'm not able to find it anywhere.

lol

WoD vampires can run faster than Twilight vampires

Mages can outrun both

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>>54913941
>hate mage fans though smug bastards

>>54913938
Here's the basic run-down on Movement:
Walking = 7 yards / turn.
Jogging = (12 + Dexterity) in yards/turn
Running = [20 + (3 x Dexterity)] in yards/turn.
Characters may move half their maximum running speed and still attack or perform another action in a turn. If attempting to act at the same time as moving, each yard moved costs 1 die from the dice pool.
If Injured, Halve maximum running speed.
If Wounded, you may only move OR attack in a turn. Doing both reduces dice pools (-1 die per yard moved).
If Mauled, movement is reduced to hobbling around (3 yards/turn)
If Crippled, you can only crawl about (1 yard/turn)
If Incapacitated you can't move at all.
Now Celerity is an interesting situation. Naturally, you can use Celerity for Extra Actions and thus gain additional movement actions each turn. Just multiply your final movement rating by 1+(the number of Celerity actions devoted to movement). For example, if you have 3 Dex, 3 Celerity and use all of your 4 actions for the turn running your ass off at full tilt, you would move at: {[20 + (3 x 3)] x 4} Yards per turn.

That comes out to 29 x 4 = 116 yards per turn. Basically you're running over the length of a football field in 3 seconds.

>>54913915
>He hasn't read any of the Convention Books or the Sons of Ether book.

>>54913982
Three-hundred feet PER second is 450mph ~

To dodge the *average* bullet at gunpoint one would need to move -at least- 1,700mph.

>>54913963
>"How do you do that?" for M20

https://www.sendspace.com/file/rdhm81

Sadly, "How do you Do That" really doesn't explain how you do much of anything, and worse, they rules are often inconsistent or don't make any sense.

The best answer for "How do you do something in M20" will always be "Play Revised"

>>54914013
>dodge the *average* bullet at gunpoint one would need to move -at least- 1,700mph.

That's to "science-y"

Celerity and Acceleration are based on *magic*.

>>54914013
You obviously just have to move faster than the person can pull the trigger

>>54914030
I would think Celerity and Acceleration move faster in bursts, which is why they can dodge bullets at gunpoint.

At a running pace, still incredibly fast.

>>54914013
It's only celerity 3 dumbass read the post

>>54914014
The main reason I wanted to have it is to actually have some examples and make the system less vague by giving some examples, but if you say that I guess I'll go screw myself.

Thank you very much for the link by the way, I'll still take a look to it.

>>54914013
People in WoD can dodge bullets even without Celerity by using Dex+Athletics/Dodge usually, but they don't move that fast, how is that even possible?!

>>54914096

Read HDYDT and judge for yourself.

However, be prepared for items like needing Mind to cast a "pyrokinetic" fireball because, uhh...

>>54914013
To dodge a bullet already in flight and bound to hit you, yes, you would need to move that fast. But these powers also let you go first, and then, because you're moving so fast, you get bonuses to Defense against firearms. Because you're harder to hit. Ergo, you're dodging bullets. Tired of these autismo arguments. Time Mage Armor also gives you a Defense bonus against firearms, turning you into Neo from the Matrix.

>>54914108
>>54914119
See >>54914053

I'm convinced Celerity and Acceleration move faster in short bursts, rather than in the long run.
I'm only using science for the purposes of observation.

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>>54913211
From an oWoD perspective?

Masquerade? Well, you can run it like that, but the "Vampions" style of play tends to be the equivalent of your awkward Junior High years: every one had it but no one wants to cop to it. Vampire is a mafia game in undead drag because being a vampire essentially makes you part of a criminal conspiracy by default. Additionally, no matter how much of a good person that you try to be, you're still a blood drinking parasite that dies in the sunlight.

Apocalypse? Military action game in drag. You are soldiers fighting a war against the minions of the bastard gay buttsex baby of tzeentch and Nurgle. The capacity for heroism exists but so does the capacity for Vietnam War tier fuckery and the politics are every bit as vicious if a bit more rednecky.

Ascension? Happy medium between the previous two. It's an espionage game about people with high ideals and the power to change the world at personal cost. So if you want to run a game of warring occult conspiracies with a shao Lin monk Kung Fu-ing the fuck out of the men in black while his Witch buddy zaps a fucking Black helicopter and it all somehow makes sense in context? That's probably the best way to run that style of game.

>>54914119
Time armor can't dodge an explosion or oxygen deprivation

>>54913211
>wod
>superheroes
this meme needs to die

>>54914175
>explosion
Forces.
>oxygen deprivation
Matter/Death.

Although I don't see how these things are relevant. We were talking about bullets.

>>54911224
Slightly wrong, it makes your base sympathy equal to the points you spent on it. It doesnt add your dots in Shadow Name to a withstand.

>>54914148
in oWoD you run better than Usain Bolt on the long run at even Level 1, my ST had it on me because I used Celerity 1 to run away from a guard and it looked like my legs were blurry because they were moving THAT fast and it was a Masquerade Violation, so no, I don't think they are merely bursts.

>>54914262
That's... not the same.

I'm also not stating they just 'stop' after a while
I'm saying they are faster at the start of its usage.

>>54914248
Nope, read the section on Withstand again.
Multiple applicable Withstands stack.
However every one that follows after that just adds +1, rather than it's full rating.

"If a spell has multiple Withstand ratings (for example, a Withstood spell cast with the Sympathetic Range Attainment) it uses the highest rating, +1 for every additional rating."

So I was myself a little wrong.
Good thing I went back and checked.
Because goddamn you can stack that Withstand offensively high otherwise.

>>54914328
Multiple ones stack but only the highest counts then you add +1 for each other. So its either your base sympathetic level or your shadow name level +1. Thats not adding shadow name to the sympathy link.

Shadow name replaces your base sympathy level or adds +1.

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>>54914326

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>>54914202

>>54914148
Mechanically you can use Acceleration/Celerity to act before somebody fires at you and just move of line of sight if its possible with your move range.

Somebody tries to shoot you, you activate celerity, see them aim at you and NOPE your around the corner. Nyer nyer, dont need to dodge that fucking bullet now.

>>54913915
Paradox varies wildly depending upon edition. 2nd was the happy medium, Revised made it painful and M20 nerfed it back all to hell.

2/10 attempt at memeing for imaginary 4chinz points, though.

>>54914365
Which is what I just said. Just then.
In that post you're replying to.
Which is ALSO not what you first said.

>>54914465
So i missed out the +1, dont expect me to hold you hand every time you get rules wrong. At least it made you go back and recheck it

Are any of you anon's at gencon? Sounds like a new v5 playtest is floating around, if your there you should steal it and put it on the internet so we can shit on it.

>>54914465
>>54914505
>Magefags when no other splat to bully decides to bully themselves
Facisnating

>>54913136
A-anyone?

>>54914863
no

I'm gonna be playing Demon for the first time real soon. Anyone have any recomendations for which Embeds and Exploits are the best/most useful?

So why was father wolf a wolf and not something far stronger and badass like a lion/tiger or even a fucking Trex or some shit?

>>54915097
Merciless gunman and knockout punch and display of power

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Feedback requested on this new Horror I made.

BAPHOMETALOS

Virtue: Awesome
Vice: Brutal
Aspirations: Rock The Fuck Out, Face Greater And Greater Challenges, Inspire People To Be Badass

Mental Attributes: Intelligence 4, Wits 8, Resolve 10
Physical Attributes: Strength 9, Dexterity 7, Stamina 9
Social Attributes: Presence 10, Manipulation 4, Composure 6

Skills: Academics 2, Crafts 1, Investigation 2, Medicine 1, Occult 3, Athletics 4, Brawl 3, Drive (Motorcycle) 3, Weaponry (Battle Axe) 4, Empathy 2, Expression (Heavy Metal, Inspiring) 8, Intimidation (Larger Than Life) 6, Persuasion 2, Socialize (Parties) 5, Streetwise 2, Subterfuge 3

Merits: Area Of Expertise 1 (Heavy Metal), Interdisciplinary Specialty 1 (Heavy Metal), Professional Training 5 (Heavy Metal God: Expression, Socialize, Intimidation), Contacts (Celebrities, Fans), Fame 2, Inspiring 3, Iron Will 2, Resources 4, Striking Looks 2 (Blacker Than The Blackest Black), Table Turner 1

Willpower: 26
Defense: 11
Initiative: 13
Speed: 30
Health: 20 (Size 11)
Potency: 10

Weapons/Attacks

Blast (Electric Guitar) [+0L to +5L, Maximum 100 Yards, Presence + Expression + Heavy Metal, 20 Dice]
Flaming Battle Axe [+4L, Melee, 14 Dice]
Psychokinesis [+5L, 13 Dice]

Ban: Can only use Blast with Electric Guitar

Ban: Must answer any challenges to his badassery

Ban: Must help for one scene whoever defeats him in a musical duel

Bane: Being laughed off the stage

Dread Powers: Elusive, Fire Elemental, Hideous Strength, Immortal, Influence (Badassery 1), Madness And Terror, Numen (Aggressive Meme, Blast [Electric Guitar], Hallucination [Special Effects], Rapture), Psychic Talent x 1 (Psychokinesis 5, Advanced 3, Epic 2 [Fire]), Regenerate 1, Unbreakable, Price Of Power x 4

>>54915134
We Brutal Legend now?

It seems like you guys don't discuss cWoD in here. Is it because it's outdated? (Though it had kind of an update) Metaplot issue?

>>54915282
Some old fags stuck in the 90s sometimes come here and reminese but most of us has switched to the far superior mechanically and thematically CofD.

>>54915282
There's discussion about WoD occasionally, and V5 was the prevailing topic for a bit.

>>54915282
Its because its shit.

>>54906387
John Tallee, the con artist/priest.

A minor character. He swore that the Vampire we'd just ashed had been keeping him there as a blood bound slave. Sounded suspiciously well informed, but the vampire in question was an asshole, so we threw him out the door. Needed to try to maintain our humanity anyway. Big mistake. Three sessions later we broke up a vitae theft-and-resale ring. And there's John. He makes a break for it, but a celerity-pire is faster than the goat he was fleeing on. John convinced us to let him go, again - he needed his fix, he said. We didn't believe our Auspexpert when she said he was lying and not an addict at all. Still let him go.

>>54915406

Long story short it's twenty sessions in, the rest of the campaign has been chasing hunter cells and vitae operations. He was sort of a mascot. We'd see him, "Oh, you scamp!" and send him on his way with a bruise or a broken arm. We followed him at times to new vitae operations, since as an 'addict' he was good at tracking them down. Our Auspexpert hated the lot of us and swore up and down it was some sort of trap. But no matter how she stalked, she found nothing. Yes, we'd found MORE of these vitae resale operations, mostly staffed by hollow eyed kids with some weird medical conditions and strange reactions - touching them lead to screams or sometimes singing choir hymns. We were absolutely convinced that we'd uncovered some sort of Tzimisce operation, because we had a pair of thaumaturgically inept Tremere and the 'collectors' for these modern day work houses kept targetting our coterie.

Soon, we found out that John Tallee actually worked for the society of Leopold, was using the money from the resale operations to fund hunter cells and 'retrieval' ops, the kids were all Catholic Church orphans who'd been abused. Oh, and we were all now confirmed priests of the Church and on trial for child molestation - we'd been keeping these kids at creepy fetish houses, and look, here are the records to prove it! It turns out we'd killed the original BBEG in session 5 and the GM just winged it. Our Auspexpert was laughing hysterically as we were all hauled into the sunlight by unknowing mortal authorities while under 'arrest'.

>>54915282
Actually there are plenty of anons (myself included) that discuss in this thread and plays oWoD.
>>54915306
>CofD
>superior
>THEMATICALLY superior
Oh god My sides

>>54915443
>implying it isn't thematically superior
Take off the nostalgia goggles, gramps.

>>54915453
I can just count two games being thematically superior to their oWoD counterparts, Changeling and Demon (in some regard) but saying in a non ironic way that the rest of the games are superior is laugh worthy.

>>54915453
Depends on the game line desu.

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>>54915443
>muh Jewish God is real!
>muh metaplot that stifles creativity
>muh superheroics
>muh metaplot!

>>54913649
>most deviants aren't even as strong as *vampires*

TOP KEK

>>54915490
Forsaken 2e is way better than any version of apocalypse. Same goes for Geist, Mummy and Changeling

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>>54915515

>>54915490
They're all superior, with the conditional exception of Vampire and maybe Hunter. What's laughable is pretending that Ascension and Apocalypse, those absolutely absurd garbage piles, are in any way thematically superior to Awakening and Forsaken.

>>54915532
Is that even possible Jesus. A deviant better not even look at one of the Wise funny

>>54913649
It looks like they're trying to have a hunter sort of game. Seems like it'd be easier just to put out a 'rogue' sourcebook with a guide for building endowments on some sort of point system.

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>>54915548
>LALALA I'M NOT LISTENING

>>54915571
..are.. are you complaining that he thinks your bait is shit?

>>54915548
>Gets BTFO
>I-I'll call bait that will show them!

>>54915585
Not even my "bait", anon.

>>54915443
You want me to tell you how I know that you are 30 something year old who has a special place In his heart for Owod because you used to play it in your edgy youth?

>>54915515
Is this even an argument?
>God being Real
Yeah because any cofd gameline discards god enterely, also every gameline in oWoD thrives without god being actually present
>metaplot that stifles creativity
In which way exactly? If you want to create Your city with Your supernaturals population nobody is going to stop you, also what's is wrong about having actual content to build campains with?
>muh superheroes
I miss the times of bloodlines where even the devs where mockering that kind of faggot that thinks about heroics monsters with the vengeful nosferatu mission being a thing
>>54915534
>Forsaken better than apocalypse
Based on which standards? Are you going to go with the "muh ecoterrorists" argument? Nobody that actually played the game ever says that.
Geist doesn't really have a oWoD counterpart.

>>54915112
Anything else worthwhile?

>>54915621
CofD does a much better job of providing campaign content. Plot hooks, characters, settings, and all without having a bloated metaplot that 99% of players ignore 99% of.

>>54915616
I'm 25 and I started playing oWoD around 3 years ago, since then I also tried many other games, from oWoD to nWoD. Who says that the latter is superior actually thinks that the echo-stereotypes that anons say about oWoD are actually true. Play. The. Fucking. Games.

>>54915651
I have played the games. Might be a bit unfair but oWoD has been soured on me because it attracts a much worse crowd, in my experience.

>>54915621
>>54915651
Apocalypse is also kind of racist as well. Only white people and Native Americans can be guaru which are by and far the best of all the changing breeds and than the Native Americans are blatantly racist stereotypes. This isn't including shit like the always drunk and fighting each other Irish werewolves or the ooga booga African werewolves. Than there is that one tribe comprised entirely of butch lesbians. The game was also horribly imbalanced and werewolves had too easy access to aggravated damage.

>>54915647
>muh metaplot
>players ignore 99% of metaplot
???
I guess that the mtaw horde that is ruining the thread is finally awake (hah) so I guess it's better to leave the thread and wait for then to go back to sleep after they will have ruined the thread once again.

>>54915694
>please don't use echo-stereotypes
>I will now use echo-stereotypes
You had one job

>>54915700
I wasn't the one that said "muh metaplot", moron. I just think CofD is neater and more concise without it.

>>54915700
>muh mage the awakening boogeyman
Good riddens you won't be missed tumblr

Remember. Mage is the strongest gameline there is.

Nothing else matters.

>>54915734
>If he goes against my cancerous circlejerking it's a tumblr
Le tumblr boogeyman

>>54915625
Not played it yet but when i get the chance im going to try abuse Teleportation propulsion with Abruption jets technology (players guide)

basically reflexive teleportation to anywhere in line of sight then abruption jets to anchor you. Teleport straight up and stay there, up to windows and then through them, all sorts of fun shit. Add in Merciless gunman to shoot fuckers and it'll be fun, shame the 1 other dude who plays demon is always playing demon by himself already.

>>54915774
I didn't mean to say tumblr damn autocorrect. I was calling you a toddler

>>54915625
There is an exploit that allows your gun to fire bullets that deal aggravated damage and also one that allows you to manifest your true form and send it out to do things for you without blowing your cover

>>54915772
Not even making stuff from other media in Dread Powers?

...Like most of the monsters from the second Scooby Doo live action film.
>"We're gonna die!"
>"Think positive."
>"We're gonna die QUICKLY!"

>>54915772
Except they're not. Mage being the "strongest" is a meme. A creation of this place. If you actually take the time to read OPP forums you will notice that mages are a lot weaker than you take them for,.

>>54915848
>read opp forums

Expects us to take him seriously.

>>54915848
Well, that's not true. They are the strongest splat, crunch wise, mostly because of how versatile and powerful their spells can be. Also archmages are scary because there are no archmummies or archvampires.

That being said, those generals assume some silly shit about mages and gives them WAAAAY too much credit as a splat, power level wise.

>>54915848
In case you haven't noticed, Mage is the only splat to have gotten a god tier Template.

No other splat has that. Yes they're flat out the fucking strongest of the bunch.

>>54915848
Please define "Strongest" and "a lot weaker" for us just to be sure we are on the same page..

>>54915867
>That being said, those generals assume some silly shit about mages and gives them WAAAAY too much credit as a splat, power level wise.
Alos there's the fact that any mages who Awaken with 6 dots in all 10 Arcana are probably from a False Awakening (Exarchs: "HAHAHA-Fuck off.") and quite likely to explode

>>54915100
because WereWOLVES.

>>54915912
Well, given what folks around her ascribe to Mages in every hypothetical scenario you'd assume that every Mag ever has every Arcana set to 6 dots.

>>54915924
No, you're just exaggerating a lot, anon. No magefag ever gave their theoretical shits 5+ in every Arcanum.

>>54915924
Because multiple Arcana can solve the same problem. It might appear that every mage has every arcana but what is really going on is explaining that mages with x,y,z or any comination of them can all solve the problem and arnt restricted to "I claw it".

It's not a mages fault all woofs can do is claw things and when that fails, they claw it some more.

>>54915935
The "muh perfectly rounded Mage" is a stupid meme because some retards think that when somebody lists the number of ways a Mage could approach a given scenario, they somehow assume that the poster is speaking of one Mage with all those capabilities.

>>54915905
Archmages are an outlier and shouldn't be accounted for anything. They're not even in the lore unless you use Imperial Mysteries.

>>54915973
Go text search 2e you fucking mongo.

>>54915924
Those are (probably) White Room Scenarios.

White Room is when you ignore outside factors to work out how things would fit together...though this doesn't account for Gameline Bias.

False Awakenings are an actual thing in Mage. they're Mages who Awaken to an unheard of Watchtower, gain Gnosis at an alarming rate...and eventually explode due to their soul being overloaded and rupturing.

Not sure what causes it, could be Abyssal infection or one of the Exarchs using your soul as as a paddleball. Actually, understanding False Awakenings could be quite a good Mystery to look into.

>>54915973
They're not even in the lore unless you use Imperial Mysteries

>who is Merlin
>who is the Corpus Author
>who are the Exarchs

>>54915982
wtf are you talking about?

>>54915984
>>who are the Exarchs
Ten cute girls...and exactly one Trap.

>>54915973
I'm convinced that only retards hate on Mage every time I read a comment like this

>>54915993
The difference between using a Mage in a White Room and a False Awakening, can't you read?

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>>54915996

>>54916011
>false awakening

Wtf is that, read all the books, cant think of them. Please enlighten me.

>>54916022
Exarchs didn't even create the world though. They just fucked it up.

>>54915969
>It's not a mages fault all woofs can do is claw things and when that fails, they claw it some more.

That's entirely unfair. Woofs employ a varied approach to problem solving. Sometime they also bite as well as claw...

>>54916027
You basically pick up an Awakening to a weird watchtower that's probably abyssal and entirely fictional, like "the watchtower of the ever burning jungle". Over about 3 weeks your arcana and gnosis hit the *roof* until you perform an ascension spell. The person given as an example has a spell that involves making a colossal bomb in a local office building piled with ley lines and blows themselves up, augmenting it with a massive working of forces.

>>54916027
Check the Mage version of Night Horrors, pages 128 to 132.

Also, I may have gotten some of the info wrong.

>>54916027
>read all the books
For some reason I don't believe you.

>>54916040
But let's face it now, the only group that can have any fun in combat is Hunters, because they get to be a bit...groovy.

>>54916042
So do these false Awakened become Archmages once they hit this "roof" ?

>>54916071
No, most I can tell they just die...explosively.

What I got from the wiki is that this was curse made by a member of the Silver Ladder and it only affects Sleepers.

Either the Mage was a Seer plant or this only happened because of a massive cockup.

>>54916071
Wasn't mentioned. Starts off at a point of gnosis every week, and a point of arcana every other.. day, I think? Start getting flaws, derangements, etc. Eventually it starts to accelerate and becomes a point a day, I think. And they fixate on a 'ritual' which is just an elaborate method of suicide as well as an infection vector for the next person. Result of some nasty bit of paradox.

>>54912651
That lessons shit got tacked on because people reading the previews complained that they weren't being reassured their villain protagonists would be good guys.

>>54916111
Probably a fuckup made by a hubristic Silver Ladder trying to find a way to induce Awakenings.

>>54916071
No. One must pass the Threshold to become an Archmaster.

>>54916124
Yep, seems about right.
Instead of getting what they planned, they just gave the Ministries of the Seers more ammo.

If I were a Mastigos with a bird for a familiar, could I scry through its eyes and have it act as a kind of drone? If I used Mind, could I still function just fine while perceiving what it does?

Getting ready for an Awakening 2e game. Lot of options.

>>54915984
Technically none of those are archmages senpai. They've ascended which is a whole other can of worms.

Ever think DaveB gets saddened over all this white room talk?

>>54915772
>Mage is the strongest gameline there is.
Yes...
>Nothing else matters.
Why would this be your conclusion?

>>54916177
>failing to understand that they were all archmages at some point

>>54916179
Rumor has it he finds it boring and counterproductive. I don't know why he would be saddened.

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>>54916179
He's said so.

>>54916061
I said read, i didnt say remembered.

>>54916198
>"Mage Supremacy talk bores the tits off me.
>"Mage Supremacy forever!"

HE NEEDS TO MAKE UP HIS MIND

>>54916236
All eternal things become boring. Judging by the timestamps, this one took a month.

>>54916174
>If I were a Mastigos with a bird for a familiar, could I scry through its eyes and have it act as a kind of drone?

Yes, you can swap between yours and your familiar's senses as a reflexive action. You can also cast a spell through your familiar for a piddly +1 reach w/o having to use the sympathetic casting attainment.

>If I used Mind, could I still function just fine while perceiving what it does?

Sure Mind •

>>54916174
You can cast sympathetic spells through a familiar without space for sympathetic reach, yeah.

>>54916258
>>54916259
Neat, thanks.

And while I've got you here, what are the Lower Depths, and why would one be considered Left-Handed for having contact with them? Is it hell, basically?

>>54915979
>B-But nWoD is superior because it doesn't have the same metaplot limitations as oWoD I-I swear
>everyone gets angry if you don't use god templates and assume that exarchs are archmages when their nature was obscure and up to interpretation on purpose.

>>54916296
Exarchs arnt archmages, they are to archmages what archmages are to mages. ie Ascended mages.

Do you even know what the fuck you are talking about?

>>54916296
In 2e, Exarchs may or may not have been Archmages.

In 1e they were quite evidently former Atlantean asshats.

>>54916313
Can you even Read?

>>54916313
He just wants to respark the WoD vs CofD argument because it faded into obscurity just like his gameline.

>>54916275
Varies by gameline. CofDG lore is that each depth is a new universe missing one or more of the Mage Arcana, but there are others outside it that are just fucking weird, like Duat, the Inferno and the Strix homeland. Not everyone contacting them would be left handed. Certain legacies, like the Cnn Anwen (who feed parts of the world to the Depths to make their own little perfect gardens there after bonding their souls to a thaumavoric predator from there) are left handed. Their particular depth seems to be lacking in everything but Mind, for example.

>>54916328
Oh, and here's another bit from one of the WW posters who turn up sometimes from a mage standpoint.

"Technically, they're their own category "beneath" the Fallen multiverse (I really cannot stress
enough how even places like the Underworld and Astral Realms are "The Fallen World").
Different Lower Depths, though, are missing different foundational aspects of reality, and some are
more void-like than others. The deepest, darkest Depths where thin beings that cannot be said to be
alive in any conventional sense swim through the membranes between worlds, are completely
inhospitable to anyone not capable of bringing their own universe with them (so... archmasters).
Nearer Depths, like Inferno or the empty place the most powerful Strix go to when they use their
Shadow Potency 10 power, are survivable for short visits, but mages might find that in a Depth
absolutely lacking a particular Arcanum their Mage Sight and spells of that Arcanum fail; there's
nothing to see and nothing to work with.
"

>>54916275
Also don't forget that a familiar can be a spectacular mana battery for you. A Thyrsus might be better at collecting mana then an Obrimos at a certain point.

If I used the Practice of Entities with a Quintessence corresponding to Arcadia, could my Archmage turn her Chantry into a dreamlike world? One where I can live out any story for my own amusement?

So how is a Lower Depth different than the Abyss? And where do Lower Depths come from if they're not a part of the fallen world?

>>54916423
The Lower Depths are a part of the Fallen World.

>>54916433
That can't be right.

>>54916414
Yeah, probably. I'd assume you could do it with Mind and Dynamics if you already had a chantry to work with.

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>>54916313
>And this... is to go even further beyond!

>>54916433
DaveB popped up and said they aren't. They're 'beneath' it. They take some aspects, sometimes, but only the very nearest ones - they're utterly alien.

>>54916423
The Abyss is part of the "fallen" universe. It surrounds it like a caul, and is sort of like a refracting mirror. Everything that isn't inside the fallen world, and all the myriad possible derivations of those things, live in the abyss.

>>54916414
>>54916440
Wouldn't that be loads overpowered? Become the One Above All from Marvel and never leave your Golden Road ever again.

Also isn't Dynamics not Lasting by default?

So how religious does the Mysterium get? Teetering between them and Free Council.

>>54916470
>Become Stan Lee from Marvel.
FTFY

>>54916456
Still doesn't explain where the Lower Depth realms come from.

>>54916470
You're sitting in a universe that comprises that is your soul and conforms to your desires, one that can be invaded externally. It's just solipsism. You could do it now if you went crazy the right way.
>>54916486
Never had any hints of it, just like nobody knows where the rest of the universes came from.

>>54916476
Depends, do you consider exterminating sleepers more of a calling? or a passion?

>>54916492
I haven't read imperial mysteries but I thought archmages were alreadyt omnipotent within themselves without any archspells?

>>54916470
There's a good chance many if not the majority of archmages do just that.

>>54916519
I doubt it. Some might, but Archmages want those sweet, sweet Mysteries like everyone else. Don't they?

>>54916513
No. They can't even found a chantry without rank 8 (or steal another with rank 7) in an Arcanum. They can be invaded thanks to paradoxical fuckups. Etc.

>>54916513
They're not omnipotent within their own soul but you'd be hard pressed to tell the difference.

>>54916533
Why go looking for Mysteries when you could be an all powerful comic book god?

>>54916470

What you need to do is to become an Archmaster Scelestus with each Arcana at 10 (because ironically they are the only in-game philosophy that enables this goal), get the Quintessence for an imperial ritual for Assumption with each of them, and then declare yourself God.

Just like that.

Good luck not getting dying horribly while you cast it, though.

>>54916545
>Why go looking for Mysteries when you could be a Fed-Ex delivery guy?
Again FTFY.

>>54916535
They're not omnipotent until they turn their Chantry into the perfect virtual reality as people are suggesting.

>>54916549
Yes, but why do through all that effort when you could just make yourself omnipotent within your own Chantry?

Sure, you lose all of it once you leave, but why does it matter? You could make a second last an eternity in there.

Archmagefags are funny

>>54916573
That slow, constant call of the Supernal yelling "come home"? The fact that if you're driven enough to seek the Imperial Mysteries, you're probably not going to get caught up in a lotus eater machine of your own making?

>>54916476
>So how religious does the Mysterium get?

It depends. With any of the Orders, you can maintain low status by just towing the party line and not causing too much trouble.

>>54916179
I assume at least half the magewankers ARE DaveB. It is the best explanation. No one else could care that much that mages always win.

>>54916573
Probably because you are some manner of obsessed with Absolute Truths, and crazy enough to try and write one all over existence.

I am decently positive it would make no sense for someone to try -that- out of hedonism, after all.

Becoming something ineffable and absolute is probably a bit random or void in the enjoyment department.

Also: it would make no sense for you to be able to support something that CANNOT exist in your Chantry.

>>54916549
Isn't that Aldous guy already a multi-Assumption Seeker?

>>54916612
>Also: it would make no sense for you to be able to support something that CANNOT exist in your Chantry.

What do you mean by that?

>>54916608
Stop projecting. So many of these arguments are caused by other splatfags just wanting to get one over on Mages for once.

>What do you mean, Caine can't beat an Archmage?
>What do you mean, I can't just one shot a Mage with Celerity?
>What do you mean, Camelot is canon Mage fluff?
>What do you mean, an Archmage could beat Luna?
>What do you mean, I can't just claw everything to death?
And so on.

>>54916622
..maybe? Not enough information. Transfiguration at best. Special case, since he was apparently able to make his own portal to the supernal to exist there physically.

>>54916368
>Not Dave
kys

>>54916642
Transfiguration is transitory. He can turn anyone he meets into a Mage without them turning into a Banisher. He's apparently above even other Archmages.

This implies he has 10 dots in most, if not all of the Arcana.

>>54916647
He was probably operating on the assumption I don't know who Dave is.

>>54916639
Umm...CODE CUSTARD!

>>54916655
He also doesn't need quintessence, and he can do as much as he wants with transfiguration as he does assumption, it's just not as permanent. We just don't have enough information about Aldous beyond "holy shit this guy is one in a trillion".

WHo is Aldous?

>>54916236
He did make up his mind, Mage Supremacy is the unquestioned design intention of 2e and as such does not need to be discussed

>>54916630
An ineffable transcendent entity is something that, by being beyond understanding and denying the very notion of contradictions, I believe, is foreign to the Supernal in its presumed current state.

As opposed to just an entity that can do anything a "mortal mage" finds conceivable.

Left-Hand path, though from 1e, actually has a nice bit of Scelestus-oriented fluff on the matter.

Don't really feel it is supported by much else, or 2e, for that matter, but it is honestly one of the most coherent POVs for the setting's workings, and mighty decent inspiration to playing an ideological scelestus ("I want to bring down the Supernal, and I have decently reasonable justificative for it, which nevertheless still implies I am ultimately a crazy extremist"), rather than just an edgelord.

>>54916682
Featured in the supernal tarot book. Old Guardian of the Veil who basically turned himself into God by sticking his dick in Soulstones, but was too shit scared to ascend. Now he sits on a mountain top and ponders temporal ethics.

Thousand years of night was supposed to be the Vampire book about elders right? I don't really play Vampire, what WAS in there?

>>54916423
Lower Depth realms lack qualities that the human realm takes for granted like matter or time. Abyssal realms possess qualities that should not exist like matter that's crystalized time catalyzed through murder-rape

>>54916707
Disappointment.

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>>54916682

>>54916673
He was also written before IM so basically doesnt use any of the rules from them.

If he was rewritten into 2e he would conform to 2e archmaster rules.

tldr, he is no longer canon

>>54916716
But what if Aldous is Caine

>>54916725
Aldous as Caine, The Old Man as Voormas..

>>54916720
No, he IS canon. Aldous is mentioned in Imperial Mysteries twice. He has since then Ascended.

>>54916720
>2e
>canon
Um no sweetie it's White Wolf, not Onyx Path ok?

>>54916707
Nothing of any interest. The people who wrote it didnt even know how to make characters.

>>54916738
>>54916714
Yeah but like, what kinds of mechanics?

>>54916707
A few odd characters. The most interesting part were the devotions. And one literal BP10 Sodomite who travels the world murdering vampires.

>>54916588
>>54916612
So creating a perfected virtual reality is something most Archmages won't do? What if they get invaded INSIDE their Golden Roads?

Would this not be a good way to say "I am supreme within my own domain!"

Look at Kadmon's Chantry, it's a forest. Can't really defend yourself with bark and twigs. Not that much has been shown on his part.

>>54916751
>And one literal BP10 Sodomite who travels the world murdering vampires.
Well he clearly needs to take the stick out of his arse.

>>54916759
..none of your questions really link to previous statements. If they get invaded, they'll have to stomp whatever it is. If they create a perfect virtual reality, it's only perfect for as long as they're there alone. Something stronger can always come along and invade. Kadmon's garden is.. well, his garden. It doesn't restrict what he's able to do.

>>54916759
>thinks you can invade somebodies golden road

Only way somebody else is getting inside is if you let them in. Via a Iris or whatever.

Could an AI go through an Awakening?

>>54916799
No

>>54916799
This is the world of darkness.

So the answer is no, and yes jesus christ it is happening right now how are your players going to deal with it.

>>54916759
No, on my end, I am saying that it is unlikely to be something that an Archmage chasing after absurd concepts like transcendent truth should do.

It bears differentiating there between truths in the sense that supernal symbols are true, and transcendent truths in the sense they are ineffable.

>>54916784
>If they create a perfect virtual reality, it's only perfect for as long as they're there alone
Are you seriously suggesting that an Archmaster couldn`t bring his friends over for Virtual Madness Day? Really? Why would it be exclusive to his mind alone?

If so, why not employ the Arcadian Quintessence as previously suggested?
Turning one's Golden Road into a sliver of living narrative would be a way of being "supreme" within your own confined, I would reckon.

>>54916808
>So the answer is no, and yes jesus christ it is happening right now how are your players going to deal with it.
Well done, I have been completely bamboozled by this sentence.

Where are people getting the "superhero" idea from. Has something changed with CofD, or do they just not understand Gothic horror or even horror in general?

>>54916812
(cont)

After all, that same necessity for seeking what basically amounts to an absurd concept given an absolute scope would be anathema to contenting themselves to a localilized narrative.

>>54916828
Okay mate. You've been given half a dozen reasons why it couldn't be a perfect eternity forever as well as why an Archmaster wouldn't. You're going in circles. If you don't like the answers, okay. Not much else I can give you.

>>54916838
It isn't the biggest stretch.

>Mages are 'humans in a world of monsters'
People often consider them the most human of the creeps, and count them among humans/mortals when talking about big scary stuff encroaching on humanity.
>Mages take on impossible big cosmic threats
While vamps and such cause harm on a street level, Mages are too busy dealing with cosmic horrors. The same way Superman only busies himself with small time problems if he isn't off saving the world from a meteor.
>Mages take on secret identities to protect their loved ones
This one explains itself. Shadow names are just superhero names, with a similar purpose of dividing their mundane life from their 'heroics'.
>Mages are colorful dickheads with no sense of normal life
For all this, Mages seem to always be characterized as understanding the human condition least. Like a rich billionaire in a bat suit pretending to know how to help rid a city of poverty and crime.

>>54916828
Fate 7 Mind 6(7?(maybe Matter as well?)

That's what you need to turn your Chantry into a mutable paradise

>>54916855
I've seen nothing to suggest that. If anything, this is an exercise of Imperial Magic.

On the "perfect eternity forever" deal I don't think the Mind Arcanum would cut it.

Was the original Yen Sid a Mage?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rrm8usaH0sM

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So attacking an Archmage within their road sounds like an easy way to kill them after reading this discussion

Thank you magefags for granting us this benefit

>>54916892
It only needs to be in your mind. Any other paradise is vulnerable to outside interference.

You guys are bordering on Supernal retardation. You want your Archmaster to become a True Fae?

Ok, here.

Cast Dominions *inside* Arcadia. INSIDE. Your Road now has a Wyrd environment. There you go, you're now a not!Gentry. Possibly even better.

How easy was that? Now discuss something other than Mage.

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>>54916874
>Like a rich billionaire in a bat suit pretending to know how to help rid a city of poverty and crime.

>Kill The Batman

>>54916940
Golden Roads are vulnerable, period. Whether or not you turn it into a living paradise or a 60s town based off of your childhood is irrelevant.

Archmages are going to beef up their Chantries in a variety of ways. Whether it be a magical Fort Knox or a virtual reality, it doesn't matter.

>>54916950
>Now discuss something other than Mage.
Like...what's the best dread power for a guy who can turn into Sabbac from Captain Marvel?

>>54916971
>>Kill The Batman
Dude...how far have you actually gotten with that?

>>54916950
You don't need to cast Dominions inside Arcadia. You can turn your current Chantry into your own personal Arcadia using Fate Entities.

Though, you might actually -need- to go into Arcadia to get the relevant Quintessence. Or somewhere similar.

>>54916976
Because anon is too lazy.

Sabbac is just a demon-looking guy with:
Superhuman strength, speed, endurance, durability, flight, fire breath and fire blasts.

He also looks like the devil, and has a pentacle on his chest.

>>54917019
So he's slightly more powerful than Ibac. (seriously, the Ibac form only gets power from three of its patrons...though given Caligula's dubious sanity that's probably a plus.

Good to know.

Why do Archmagefags never agree on anything?

It's like discussing Creative Thaumaturgy at my table but 10x worse.

>>54917044
Because when you let someone do 'anything', stuff starts to break down.

>>54917062
All I'm reading so far is:

>"I want to turn my golden road into wonderland. what do?"

>"can't do"
>"can do"
>"no archmaster would"
>"it's all in your head"
>"stan lee"
>"true fae x archmage"

And I thought the Kinetic Shield argument was bad