/5eg/ - Fifth Edition General

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>no question edition

Party has a barbarian, cleric, rogue and warlock. Should I go paladin or bard? I'd really like either, just having a hard time deciding.

>>53773468
Flip a coin, see whether or not you end up disappointed.

My vote is for Paladin.

>>53773462
Ive got one: Has a character of yours worshiped or served an evil deity without being evil themselves?

>>53773462
Warlocks?

>>53773498
Someone tell me what spells are best for a Fiendlock spamming Hex as well.

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>>53773462
OP question is: are you making homebrew stuff? If yes, post!

>>53773468
With that setup I'd go bard over paladin. Go control heavy and your melee friends will love you.

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So I want to do some online games but all of my relatives are visiting for the next couple months.

I'm talking about 5 extra people in the house. It'll be insane.

Should I give up until they all bugger off? I'm not seeing any alternatives.

>>53773523
eldritch blast

>>53773523
>warlock
>spamming spells

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>>53773462
Has your character ever befriended any strange creatures in their travels? If so, what was their interaction with them like?

I'm making a Wizard. Should I specialize in Evoking, or Divining? Divining is great because of the rolls you can save up and use on people, but Evoking lets you drop fireballs without nuking your teammates.

>>53773533
What the fuck do your relatives do that they can take two months off to visit? Why are you allowing them to stay at your place if it's going to cause you anguish?

>>53773549
>What is EB

>>53773489
My first warlock served the Queen of Air and Darkness and originally thought she was a good fey.

>>53773498
>>53773523
Warlocks aren't that bad. Some options are subpar but you do it for roleplay reasons to begin with. Just tell your DM to give you a Ring of Spell Storing and a Rod of the Pact Keeper (reflavored as your weapon of choice if you don't like holding a "rod" like myself).

>>53773574
Are you planning to do a lot of blasting? Honestly the choice quite simply comes down to that.

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I really like the conquest paladin now.

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>>53773575
They're my younger brothers visiting for summer vacation, plus my mom, coming from out of state with my grandma.

I already plan on DMing a campaign with my brothers but I want to do my own private games online as well.

I can't figure out a way that voice chat will work. I don't want to be That Guy who has some random teens screaming in the background whenever he unmutes.

>>53773549
In my last campaign, nearly every encounter I casted Hex. It has a horrendously long concentration-based duration, jumps to the next target automatically, makes your illusons and party grapplebeast stick more often, and makes your EBs do a heck of a lot more damage as every hit gets the boost.

>>53773533
Join text only games. You get people who can't play with voice for some reason but still really, really want to play or people who just can't be assed to put any amount of commitment or effort into a game, including so much as talking. It's a wild ride

>>53773596
I have had the subject on my mind because I want to play a tempest cleric, but the FR gods for that domain are all evil. Luckily it's pretty easy to justify a nonevil cleric of Umberlee, since it's specified that sailors pay her tribute so she won't fuck up their shit out at sea for shits and giggles. I'm thinking he will have survived a shipwreck and woken up with his clericy powers, and be convinced she spared him for some higher purpose (which may turn out to be helping her fuck with people on land too).

>>53773605
Well we're starting at 1st level, so I'm planning on abusing Sleep as much as possible between now and level 3, but after that I'm not sure if I'm creative enough to be a tactics wizard. So some blasting at least, but if I can, I'd prefer non damage spells.

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I wanna make an alcoholic character, but I can't decide on a class. I have a background, she's gonna be a Mercenary Veteran and she blames herself for leading her mercenary group into an ambushing and getting everyone else besides herself and one other member killed. The other member ended up disabled and killed himself.

I'm thinking Way of the Drunken Master Monk, but then the background doesn't fit much and I kind of want her to be an alcoholic because of what happened. I've played a Sorcerer and a Mystic so far so I wanna try something new. I also considered some form of rogue, or maybe a Shadow Monk? I kind of want to try multiclassing too. Also having trouble choosing race, but I think Variant Human is basically the best / easiest choice.

Anyone happen to have the r-n-w character sheets?

>>53773694
Battle Master fighter would be a simple choice for a mercenary veteran former leader.

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>>53773558
We met a skeleton once that was actually quite helpful. He had been impaled by multiple spears and arrows and was stuck in the wall. The skeleton was quite friendly to the team and told us to take a healing potion in his satchel.

He asked us to retrieve a trinket that he dropped further ahead when he died, and said to give it to his son who was also one of the main NPCs who started the questline.

When we got the trinket we ran back to find the skeleton and tell him.

He was gone. The spears were still there and a satchel was on the ground.

There was never a skeleton to begin with.

>>53773769
Yeah, but are fighters fun to play as? It really seems like a somewhat boring, generic class.

>>53773694
I played an alchoholic rogue/fighter archer with the same sort of backstory. The alchoholism didn't matter much, in combat, but it was something to play off in RP.

Final build was Thief Rogue 5/Fighter 1/Diviner Wizard 2 when the game ended, and I took the Lucky feat. Was a lot of fun.

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>>53773640
That's precisely why I don't want to join a text-only game.

>>53773783
Whether you have fun with the game or not will always have more to do with your group than with any build choices, unless your character is completely gimped, which fighters aren't. And Battle Master is the tattered remnants of the attempt to make fighter stop being generic during the playtest, until it was cannibalized by 3.5 people who were peeved by fighters doing stuff other than hitting things

>>53773783
every martial has that problem

maybe valor bard would work?

>>53773694
Playing a character with a similar backstory right now. She's a bear totem barbarian with tavern brawler. She uses a brewers kit to make alcohol and carries it on her back in a keg while it ferments.

>>53773814
I've been in a few text only games. They're slow, but can be fun if you get a decent group.

>>53773832
And to add, the only really "generic" fighter is champion, since adding Champion and Battle Master was kind of the compromise reached to appease both sides of that argument

>>53773783
Battle Master is definitely less boring than Champion, at least if you can get interested in stuff like knocking guys over or making them piss themselves or countering their missed attacks. Their progression isn't the most thrilling thing, still, because your choice of maneuvers stays the same so you're probably taking the best maneuvers right away and then slowly collecting the worse ones as you level.

I like rolling d8s for some reason, so I enjoy it well enough.

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>>53773863
Where would you recommend I find a good group?

I'll give it a try.

Anyone play an Artificer? What do you guys think of it?

>>53773527
is that a barbarian archetype or a wizard archatype, im confused.

>>53773832
You're right. I'm hoping me really trying with this roleplay will get everyone else into. Lots of newer people so they're hesitant to roleplay.
>>53773838
A bard does sound like a good choice actually. I'll look into it, but I kind of want to avoid spell casting stuff because I've only been casters so far.
>>53773841
I was working on a Monk earlier to see what it'd look like if I chose that. They had a Brewer's Kit and I was thinking of ways I could incorporate it if I did use that character. That sounds really cool. I'd love to be able to make beer for my party and see if I can maybe convince them to play along with the drinking roleplay. I'm somewhat tempted to buy some cheapish beer to hand out while we play too, nothing strong but just to get everyone in the mindset.

>>53773937
Barbarian

>>53773937
>when your Barbarian Rage is active
I think Barbarian

Are familiars worth it?

>>53773960
>>53773957
Clarification apreciated
>>53773965
only if you're a person who wants to give themselves advantage on every attack action but even then im not sure they're worth it.

>>53773887
As >>53773640, I search for text-only games on roll20 using the advanced search options, then pray the group isn't shitty. I mean, I had a group which had every single anime shit red flag imaginable coming in, yet I'm still with them after a couple months, and then I joined something which sounded great from the campaign blurb and it's possibly the worst game I have ever been on (mostly because the DM tries too hard to be Matt Mercer with a group that's half composed of clueless newbies, but that's besides the point).

>>53773965
They can be if you use them right. Especially if you have a Pact of the Chain familiar from Warlock. If you're creative enough, you can come up with some cool shit. Even if you aren't creative, you can still have them scout shit. No one will be too suspicious of a bird or some other little creature. It's even better with Pact of the Chain because they can turn invisible.

>>53773965
They're a nice bonus. That's about it.

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>>53773985
>>53773863
Thanks Anons, I appreciate the advice.

Hopefully I don't get a crappy group.

As a wizard, do I need to have a ritual spell in my spellbook in order to cast it? Or can I cast it even without having it in my spellbook? I'm thinking of taking Detect Magic, but I'm not sure it'd be useful enough to warrant a slot that could be Grease or Sleep instead.

http://www.medievalchronicles.com/medieval-clothing/medieval-shoes/

Fascinating. Do you think dwarven shoes would be any different?

>>53773432
that's a badass looking druid

>setting with guns
>they're mostly on par with bows but have Reload #
>want a gun
>have to be the tank but don't want to be a shitty Dex martial with a rapier
>Loading is gone from crossbows
>DM said bows and crossbows can use Strength instead of Dexterity
what do

>>53774094
Dwarves wear steel-toed boots with leather soles thick enough to make caltrops sweat.

>>53773939
I made the character before the drunken master UA was released, if it was out at the time I'd probably be playing that instead. Talk to your DM because everyone rules crafting differently. The beer idea sounds fun, but most of the people I play with don't drink unfortunately.


>>53774089
It has to be in your spell book but it doesn't need to be prepared.

>>53774121
>setting with guns
leave immediately

>>53773965
Expanding on familiars
If i manage to reverse pickpocket my spider familiar onto somebody do i need to roll to hit with a touch spell like shocking grasp?

>>53774144
I'm not really worried about 1d8 martial weapon rifles that only get two shots before needing a reload and has a shorter range than a longbow.

>>53774152
You would still have to roll, but I think advantage would be reasonable because the spider is unseen.

So land druids. Do people never talk about them because they suck, or is it just that moon druids are so much better (which they are)?

>>53774185
No one talks about druids because both archetypes are equally mediocre.

I'm thinking about giving a ranger PC this ability as an alternative to treasure. What do you think?

>You can cast Find Familiar as a ritual, but it only summons a fiendish owl. You can use the owl's senses as a bonus action rather than as an action.
>The owl can cast Hex without using a spell slot or components. It must take a short rest before it can do so again. You can trigger the bonus damage of the owl's Hex.
>If the owl eats a portion of a creature within 1 minute of you killing it, the owl tells you one secret the creature knew using the creature's voice.

The owl will have an off-coloration, occasionally turn its head over 360 degrees, occasionally make the sound of other much larger animals, and looking through its eyes will sometimes make flames appear that aren't really there.

>>53773965
In most cases you would be casting find familiar as a ritual spell, so yes. The usefulness of Chainlock varies depending on GM and type of campaign

Quickly! Post your top
>Tank
>Martial DPS
>Ranged DPS
>Control Caster
>Support Caster

>Your last role

>>53769672
>does away with the stupid initiative system with something much more sensible

I'm genuinely intrigued. Would be deeply pleased if someone would be so kind as to give a summary of how it works?

Anyone know of a decent resource for pithy bard quotes? Fables, parables, songs, poems? I'd like to get a few in me that aren't the super famous ones that will cause people to roll their eyes at me.

>>53774236

>DPS
>In a turn-based game

>>53773558
My character is friends with an elf.

>>53774226
nice idea but keep in mind that owls naturally have the fly-by ability of not triggering oppurtunity attacks so they could fly 15ft down, use the help action and fly 15ft back up away from combat. This is infinite help actions with no drawback. Nice hex idea thpugh

>>53774236
Tank: Battlemaster Fighter
Melee DPS: Battlemaster Fighter
Ranged DPS: Battlemaster Fighter
Control: Transmutation Wizard
Support: Life Cleric

Last role: Sun Soul Monk

>>53774280
I thought of that part about the help action. He's a ranger and could use the utility IMO.

>>53774260
DPS x 6 = 1turn

>>53773626
Go to a basement or a library or a park or some shit.

>>53774260
>Who has the fastest turns AND the most damage
desu not a hard concept

>>53774291
*60 = DPT

>>53774236
>Tank
Paladin
>Martial
Paladin
>Ranged
I don't understand the question
>Control
Paladin
>Support
Paladin

>Your last role
You play classes not roles, but fey bladelock.

>>53774291
>>53774315
>>53774307

It's not hard to tell what he means but it's still a dumb way to word it.

>>53774315
>>53774291
I think you mean that [damage per 1second] x [6seconds] = [1turn] = [6seconds of game-time]

>>53774260
>not allowing a player as many actions as he can physically execute within a 6 second timer
I bet you just let your players roll for diplomacy as well.

>>53774353
oh shit, is a turn 6 seconds long?

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>>53774266
>Being friends with elves lul

>>53774368
in dnd its usually been 1turn = 6seconds of world-time. This means 1 minute is 10turns. and 1 1hr = 600turns

>>53774384
We cut off his ears and glued a beard on him. And by "being friends" I mean "he has Stockholm syndrome"

>>53774257

The poems of John Keats are always good. Take "Endymion" for instance, which talks about Cynthia/Selene the moon goddess. You can transcribe its words to talk about Selune.

https://www.poetryfoundation.org/poems-and-poets/poems/detail/44469

Another example, "La Belle Dame Sans Merci" is a great tragedy about a knight who falls in love with a faerie. This wonderful human being made it into a song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BuNEV3OUjhI

>>53774421
you should scavenge a belt of dwarven kind for him so that he is forced to grow a beard.

I got some homebrewing for a 5e campaign I need to do, and I was hoping this thread would be the right place to ask...

In my setting, elves are basically the inventors & masters of necromancy. Would anons recommend homebrewing a new elf subrace, or just use & reskin the Mul Daya from Planeshift: Zendikar?

Said setting also has elf-orc hybrids as a viable race (long story). Now, there were actually stats for these in 3.0; the Tel-Amhothlans of Kingdoms of Kalamar.

These were basically half-orcs with +2 Dex instead of +2 Str and a few other minor tweaks.

Now, what stat modifiers would you consider best for a 5e version? +2 Dex/+1 Str? The other way around? Or +1s for Str/Dex/Int?

>>53774236
>Tank
Eldritch Knight with Shield, Heavy Armor, and goodies

>Martial DPS
Berserker Barbarian

>Ranged DPS
Sharpshooter Fighter (+Sharpshooter Feat)

>Control Caster
Diviner Wizard

>Support Caster
Bard (Valor or Lore)

>Last Role
Rogue

>>53774391
I thought 1 round was 6 seconds

>>53774450
don't take my advice to heart but consider +1dex/str/cha

>>53774486
turn and round are interchangeable.

>>53774303
Florida doesn't have basements.

Library = people I don't know, usually bums leeching off the free AC and water fountains. What kind of autist goes to the library to roleplay for a dnd campaign anyway?

I'd rather not get mugged in my local park because I decided to bring my laptop out there. I don't even think they have wifi, and if they did it certainly isn't good enough to stream voice and video.

>>53774462
>Berserker Barbarian
People can say what they want... but when it comes up Frenzy is just amazing at killing the BBEG.

>>53774524
No they're fucking not retard. Each round is 6 seconds and each character has 1 turn in the round.

That's why Rogues can Sneak Attack on opportunity attacks, because it's the same round but a different turn then the one they Sneak Attacked on.

>>53774438
Thanks. The session is tomorrow, so I'm hoping I can get a couple in my brain to reference.

>>53774492
Hmm... that just might work. There's not really a lot to work on for the original because... well, see for yourself what it looked like:

https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Tel-Amhothlan

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Does anyone know any good twitch channel for dnd streams?

Trying to find a /comfy/ series of videos to nestle down and watch.

Where do I find the 5E version of sunless citadel?

Also, is there a more expansive list of monster traits out there than in the DMG?

>>53774565
It's in Tales from the Yawning Portal.

>>53774541
Oh, you're in Florida. Then let me give you some specific places.

-Inside a Croc's stomach
-Disneyworld (The jungle one, no one goes there)
-Rent out a cheap swamp house for DnD
-Wait until they leave for one of the parks and do it then

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>>53774602
>Inside a Croc's stomach
We've mostly got gators, friend. Know the difference. It could save your life some day.

>>53774562
>Sun Vulcan
Sadly, I can't help you with your streams- But I can commemorate you on your good taste.

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>>53773558
My druid picked up a mycanoid named Stool during the OotA campaign.
It allowed the party to communicate telepathically through rapport spores, so it was more than worth to keep around.
It basically looked like a loaf of sourdough bread with stubby little legs and would chill in my druid's herb sack.
My druid went a little crazy because that's what the Underdark do and became super protective of Stool and kept it safe through the entire campaign.
It got to the point where during the final battle against demon queen Lolth, the Talon of Lolth, and the Voice of Lolth he used one of his 4 turns of time stop to take off the herb sack and place it somewhere safe.

>>53774562
Fuck you you get podcasts.

Glass Cannon Podcast is good, it's Pathfinder but it's fine.
The Adventure Zone is fun for comedy but not rules.
The Indoorsman is a good 5e, rules following podcast.
The Film Reroll is GURPS but they try and recreate movie plots in GURPS, usually failing.
Bards and Nobles may be good, I haven't tried yet.
Welcome to the Magic Tavern. It's not DnD, but it is fantasy, so you may like it.
We're Alive. It isn't fantasy, but it is a story, so you may like it.
Last Podcast on the Left. It isn't DnD or Fantasy, but it's almost a story.
The History of Rome. It's history, which is almost DnD.

>>53774562
Critical role is pretty good if you can stomach the redhead and some rules being fudged.

>>53774622
>It could save your life some day.
>Gator: Will kill you
>Croc: Will kill you

seems like knowing which is which is not terribly important.

>>53774541

If you live in the Central Florida area, Coliseum of Comics or Gods & Monsters

>>53774622
They're both large reptiles that have been around for a hundred million of years and will seriously fuck you up.

>>53774421
The proper dwarven way my friend

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>>53774665
I've watched a couple sessions from critical role. It's okay. There's just so many people that I barely feel like I get to know the characters themselves. It's missing something. Good for a couple laughs, but eh.

The main one I've watched in full so far has been The Provokers campaign (they're continuing with campaign #2 that's still ongoing). I feel like the DM went easy on the group a couple times but overall I enjoyed the roleplay immensely. Those guys got into it.

>>53774659
Nothing wrong with podcasts. I watch those all the time.

I'll check out the Indoorsman, Glass Cannon, and the Adventure Zone, in that order. Thanks, Anon.

>>53774634
Skeletons are always patrician taste, friend.

Monster Hunter or Samurai Fighter? They both seem like fun. The only spell-less class I've played before was a Berserker Barb.

>>53774236
What's the difference between control and support?

>>53774775
control = debuff and manipulation
support = buff and healing

When a Warlock reaches 5th level, gaining his third Invocation, can he also use the "replace one Invocation whenever I gain a Warlock level" feature to now take an Invocation that requires 5th level?

>>53774764
monster hunter is a better battlemaster. samurai is basically a fighter/barbarian multiclass. they're pretty good as far as non-casters go

>>53774812
yes

>>53774820
Alright, thanks.

Secondly, does a Longsword work with the Hexblade?

>>53774846
Yes.
>>53774820
But like, in terms of RP or just fun? Not necessarily what's "stronger".

>>53774236
>Tank
Druid
>Martial DPS
Sorcerer
>Ranged DPS
Warlock
>Control Caster
Monk
>Support Caster
Paladin

Starting as a Level 5 Hexblade Warlock tomorrow. DM is going with the 500GP + 1 uncommon item.

Any key items I should snag?

>>53774971
>500 gp

FightGyver it.

10 Ball Bearing Bags: 10 gp
2 10 ft chains: 10 gp
Crowbar: 2 gp
2 Grappling Hooks: 4 gp
Healer's Kit: 5 gp
Tymora Holy Symbol: 5 gp
10 Manacles: 20 gp
10 oil flasks: 1 gp
100 pitons: 5 gp
50 ft rope: 1 gp
50 bars of soap: 1 gp
10 Empty Vials: 10 gp
10 Steel Mirrors: 50 gp
Iron Pot: 2 gp
Cooking Utensils: 1 gp
50 Bread loafs: 1 gp
10 Cheese Wheels: 1 gp
Meat: 10 gp
50 pounds of salt: 1 gp
10 barrels: 20 gp
100 chalk pieces: 1 gp
5 Waterskins: 1 gp
1 lb Cinnamon: 2 gp
Hammer: 1 gp
Portable Ram: 4 gp
10 Telescoping ladders: 1 sp
5 block and tackles: 5 gp
100 candles: 1 gp
Bullseye Lantern: 10 gp
1 ink bottle: 10 gp
Fishing Tackle: 1 gp
4 2-person Tents: 8 gp
8 bedrolls: 8 gp
10 whetstones: 1 sp
Total: 212.2 gp

>>53774543
ahhhhhhhhhhh, yeah I was a bit confused about the whole turn/round thing after I wrote my post and read it a few times.
Round = 6seconds.
Each creature has 1 turn in a round.

r8 my concept:

Human
Noble
LE
Warlock
Archfey
Chain
Sprite

Aristocrat makes a deal with some fairy lord in exchange for the power to bend the minds of others at court to his will. However, after seeing how he uses his newfound abilities, the Archfey decides to take a little corrective action and assigns an annoying little sprite to teach him to be good. Shenanigams and, eventually, touching moments ensue. Endgame with the sprite is for her to end up kind of like a daughter and dear friend to the warlock. In the meantime, she's actually pretty useful, with her ability to discern the emotions of those whose machinations run counter to the warlock's interests at court.

>>53775059
Let's play spot the weaboo.

does any spell you're concentrating on stop working once you enter a rage?

>>53775104
yes

>>53775073
what's weeb about it?

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genuine question why are there still liches when casters can do this?

>>53775166
prob the daughteru meme

>>53775214
If any GM actually allows this they deserve everything they get.

any interesting mechanical combinations with the barbarian or revised ranger aside from bard?

>>53775237
But it's 17th/18th level. Endgame shit. Who cares when they're practically max level, you know? By that point you're supposed to be strong as fuck. Besides, Lichdom still has advantages.

>Phylacteries are hard to get to compared to just finding out what materials were used to create a demiplane
>Liches come back within a week while it could take this shit 120 days before returning, and BBEGs can do a lot of shit in 4 months
>If you already allow Wish it's not like this is much of a stretch anyways, Wish is reality-destroying

>>53775214
Liches are desperate attempts when time is starting to run short. They aren't actually at the levels for the crazier reality bending.

>>53775214
because when you're a lich, no one bothers you with their problems.

>>53775311
>Lichdom still has advantages
Your dick rot off and you can't feel emotions

Yeah

Advantages

For you that's from r9k maybe

>>53775447
the kind of people who go for lichdom, are not the same people who get laid.

>>53775237
>>53775311
I was mostly talking about fluffwise. aren't Liches just a desperate grab at immortality when this is a more socially acceptable way to do it? like forget the demiplane a lich can do that with a Phylactery anyway. forget Wish too isn't Clone like equal to lichdom without the downsides

>>53773527
is this balanced 5eg? I really want to play an angry screaming spellcaster and need to know how plausible it is to present this to my DM.

>>53775504
Well Lichdom usually is fluffed as also giving a buff of magical power, too.

>>53775504
>I was mostly talking about fluffwise. aren't Liches just a desperate grab at immortality when this is a more socially acceptable way to do it?
while it is more socially acceptable, lichdom is more attainable than reaching the skill you need to cast wish. Most casters will never reach the level of power necessary to be a lich let alone the power necessary to cast wish.

Lichdom is a shortcut to power and, as usually the case, has...drawbacks.

Avoiding the whole "roll for stats is retarded" talk, what's your favorite method to roll?

>>53775618
point buy is my favorite way to roll.

>>53775504
Usually lichdom isn't just about immortality but some sort of power boost. Not to mention someone insane enough to be a lich probably would find Clone lacking due to the 120 day incubation time and the need to actually go where the clone is to re-cast it every time you die

I would personally rule that clone can't circumvent old age, too. An 8th level necromancy spell shouldn't both run circles around the weaknesses of True Resurrection, a 9th level necromancy spell, and also be almost 9 times cheaper

>>53775618
let it be known point buy is gay, but it has its merits. My usual way to roll is 4d6d1, then to play risk it with the DM. He offers you to switch out a stat of yours for one he rolled but you dont know what he rolled until after you agree.

My FAVORITE way to roll though, is 3d6 straight down the line.

>>53775618
anything other than 3d6 or 4d6 drop the lowest is just people trying to avoid the whole point of rolling for stats

>>53775523
Stop trying to autistically shoe horn spells into barbarian and just play any of the actual spellcasting classes while being angry.

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My character doesn't see in the dark, but the rest of my party can. My DM is the "fuck with the party" type so unless I specifically tell him I wanna light my torch, I don't. This causes me to somehow get lost in the same hallway twice. There a Wright would always catch me and let me go after a lie. I don;t even roll for persuasion or anything.

What's the coolest arcane focus for a Dragon Sorcerer?

>>53775618
roll for stats is retarded

>>53775563
I thought the lich requirements were to be around that level anyway? even if the rules don't work out like that I see it as a good enough reason "why did Jon become a lich?"
"well he was getting up there and he wasn't the best wizard soo ya know"

>>53775735
a dragon dildo

>>53775735
Dragon dildo Using your grandpapa dragon's dick as a model

Real quick, cause I'm lazy and don't want to look up the rules: Our party just found a powerful wizard's spellbook. Can they cast spells from it, copy from it, and if so, do they need to be a specific class?

>>53775768
no they can't cast from it. a wizard's spellbook is in his own personal notation. they can copy from it using the rules in the PHB. they have to have levels in wizard to read the book (or at least understand it and be able to cast spells from it)

>>53775768
Wizards can copy from it freely but it costs money because they need fancy inks. Tomelocks can copy any of the spells as long as it has the ritual tag, and they also need the fancy inks. Then they can cast the spells as rituals as long as they have their Book of Shadows lying by

>>53775768
> cast spell from it
No. Only a Wizard can do that and only from their own spellbook

> Copy from it
Yes, but only if you have class feature or ability that specifically let you do it. Otherwise, you can't decipher the spell book.

>>53775735
Also, what's the coolest for Warlocks?

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>>53775833
>requiring Warlocks to have a spell focus

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This is how I Curse of Strahd
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGPgRHqUJwQ

>>53775833
To go along with the precious answer. A dildo based on your patron's penis.

How would you like to see the twilight druid changed?

>>53775860
>Baba Yaga's penis
Oh well...

>>53775912
add "when you Druid spell" on harvest scythe.

>>53775648
>would personally rule that clone can't circumvent old age, too. An 8th level necromancy spell shouldn't both run circles around the weaknesses of True Resurrection, a 9th level necromancy spell, and also be almost 9 times cheaper

nah true Res is still better 200 years and no need for a body. the demiplane shit you can just say your soul can traverse the planes only go to death. as for the clone GM can just have BBEG mooks smash them with out the players knowledge and you get a cool ultimatum moment where he offers the PC's a chance to live if they leave him be or risk the certain death he now knows they're so afraid of. moment for some superman under a red son heroics and you get to watch the murderhobo coward out for the first time since early levels

>>53775447
If you're not a virgin you can't be a wizard.

>>53775857
It really is retarded.

I think I made a mistake boys
Decided to DM for a group because I've wanted to play for a while, so we decided to sit down and go through character creation
This is the party they made
>A transexual dragonborn rogue who is somehow Rastafarian and sole objective is to sexually dominate men that are stronger than it
>A Tiefling rogue who asked me how to make the "edgiest" character possible, is somehow a revnant and claims to be immortal
>A samurai who has the same clique of avenging his dead master but claims hes the one who killed him so I have no fucking idea
>A Luchadour who is somehow the son of the samurai as well as his gay lover
I wish I was making this up
I should just get out while I still can

>DM puts game on hiatus because of life stress
>Says he will probably get back to it when he feels like it'll be fun again
>One of the players in the group picks up the slack.
>Bored to tears in their campaign
>But I don't want to quit because if the group falls apart, the original campaign might not come back.

What do I do?

What classes would you say are the ultimate forward heavies, in that all of their best perks are focused in the first, say, five levels of play?

>>53776311
How is it boring?

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Well we had a tpk. I've always played casters so I want to do something more front line. If I wanted to be a memer and use a barbarogue to shove people for days, what's the better class to start with?

>>53776327
Barbarian gets pretty much everything they need by 5, Battlemaster is really good low level but imo falls off once other Fighters get abilities that matter and Moon Druid is the single strongest class at levels 2-3ish.

>>53776344
He stole a lot of story beats from the first DM's campaign, for one. I don't blame him, he's a first time DM and both had worlds based heavily on the same source material, but it's still underwhelming the second time.

Additionally, the DM allowed my character to complete the entire reason she was adventuring in the second session, without giving enough of a reason to continue adventuring. Might see if I can swap my character away for something else now?

Oh, and the DM fucked up and narrated out something my character was doing in the middle of a very important character development moment, which pissed me off to hell. He apologized and felt terrible, but it's still disappointing I had that opportunity taken away. I shouldn't have just rolled with it how I did, but it caught me off guard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1P_BlUY2eF4
This is how I warlock with an entertainer background

>>53776287
Don't believe you.

>>53776287
have wackey adventures were increasingly hard boss fights occur every 4 sessions. Make them amazing boss fights aswell because its really important that they're entertained with the tpk. Then start a new campaign and say its a more serious one with more serious characters.
>>53776347
Stone sorcerer - 4, Ranger - 2
ultimate hit-n-run but can also end up with the highest hp and AC, can reduce allies damage intake and use reaction absorb elements for more tank.

>>53776507
I wish i was lying man
I really wish I was
it's a group of first timers and to be honest we're all fucking idiots and degenerates so this is what happens

>>53776561
don't worry, i played with a person who named their character "big dick daddy withe candy cane nut sack". i feel you pain

>>53776561
I'll give you a tip, don't play with degenerate furries or weeaboos

>>53776595
>>53776561
I've got "The Shadow" who came with dandwiki race and class without asking the DM.

We all agreed we'll wait until his autism really impacts the game before kicking him. Benefit of the doubt and stuff.

is there anything i need to know for playing a wizard starting at lvl 10 ( half our previous characters died) when the only other full caster i've played before is a druid? wizard type is lore wizard

>>53776668
>lore wizard
isn't that the hilariously overpowered one from UA?

>>53776668
force int save fireballs and dex save hold person/monster

>>53773468
Play an AT with expertise in Arcana

>>53776668
Don't take Hold Person on a Lore Wizard, other then that it's not too bad. I mean it needs significant revision before it's used but just don't be a dick and try to break your Lore Wizard powers because you can easy.

Other then that, same as every Wizard. Control spells are 10x better then damage, take a handful of damage nukes but you don't need to worry about damage type and try to focus on supporting the team.

yes it is the unearthed arcana one

and thats what i was thinking, although later on what i thought was really broken would be using power word stun with dex save on the save they have to make.

>>53776693
>Needs significant revision
And by significant revision you mean making it into Sorcerer Revised.

>>53774658
Any tips for running OotA? Yours sounded fun.

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>>53776714
It's called Wizards of the Coast for a reason, anon. :^)

>>53776706
Hold spells... are much worse. If you can get one to go off on STR or DEX then it's 1 minute of advantage, them doing nothing and every hit's a crit. Basically it's save or die at level 3.

>>53776714
Sorcerer should get either a revision, a bunch of power bloated meta magic or power bloated subclasses. From what I've seen of WotC they don't want to admit they fucked up more then one PHB class. So I have a feeling Sorcerer's "Revision" will be more powerful subclasses like Shadow Sorcerer making print.

Wizards could do with a class that gets some worse metamagic effect, but not just plain better ones.

>>53776424
Well damn, that sounds slightly unsalvageable.

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Just gonna post this again because I want to get shit on, and it's on the sorc topic. I came up with most of this before I saw lore master, they stole my ideas.

More Metamagic inc.

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>>53776784

>>53776758
It's a massive bother where there's really no right choice.

My character in the other campaign had a much more open goal. I guess this is just a lesson learned not to have a clearly defined goal or the DM will fuck it up.

>>53776784
I was kidding about the stealing my ideas part, also the level 18 stuff seems kind of weak on paper, but haven't tested it yet.

I'm playtesting now actually, it's been fine so far, waiting for some casters to show up.

>>53773527
This seems pretty overpowered.

Am I right in making my Warlock a cowardly little shit who isn't good at making his own choices? Someone who will always follow his Patron even when it goes against his personal beliefs because he believes he owes them a debt of life?

Staff of Defense seems rather OP for such an early level item.

>>53776877
Nah you're supposed to want to take all of your patron's power at some point.

>>53776906
Magic items are all OP.

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Storm vs Draconic Sorcerer?

Is storm worth it when playing with PHB+1 and no access to EE spells?

>>53776906
I agree, I feel like sticking it towards the end of LMoP would've been a better choice.

We had the PAM Eldritch Knight end up with it... It's not fun watching him walk around in 18 from Plate, +2 from his shield, +1 from defence and +1 from that while being able to spam Shield spell.

>>53776921
What if I do plan to kill him eventually but only to free my people from his tyranny and don't mind losing my powers?

>>53776921
What if my Patron is the positive energy plane?

to be honest family I'd be fine with there being more "inanimate" patrons as Warlocks are meant to be people shortcutting to power and channeling a plane fits under that to me.

>>53776936

AC stacking was the worst part of 3.5. 5e reconciled me with the system because it has much less opportunities to game the AC if the GM knows what he's doing (at least that's my impression but i've only fairly recently started to read the 5e rules).

There is nothing fun in repeatedly missing in any tactical game and my philosophy is the chance to hit should never go below 20-25%, which is why i learned to hate 3.5

>>53773468
I'd say go paladin and focus on being a tank. Go oath of the crown to help protect your squishies.

>>53776991
Really? High AC? Ntn wizards 1 shotting encounters? Not thousands of damage a turn? Not Save Or Die/Suck spam?

>>53776991
You can always wis or dex save that mothertrucker.

>>53776921
How exactly does this work? Do you simply kill them, or...

>>53776991
>not playing a barbarian and getting +12 to hit at level 6 or so

Honestly if you're a martial you're gonna be good at hitting even high AC and if you're a caster AC doesn't matter much since you're using spells that require saves anyways.

But it's true that numbers simply got too high in Pathfinder. On the other hand, in 5e it feels more like proficiency modifiers outweigh attack bonuses at later levels. Once your proficiency bonus is high enough even spellcasters won't miss much more often than fighters at the same level, assuming they're proficient with the weapon.

So I'm playing a Fiendlock who started with 16 DEX and 14 CHA because I'm a Kobold.

Should I consider being a DEX Bladelock? I was originally just going to go Tome and not even bother taking the Ritual Invocation because none of them really appealed to me... but I am tempted to try a Bladelock. I know they're kinda shitty but it seems like it could be fun to self cast Darkness + Devil's Sight and turn into a small fury of Rapier strikes. Plus Fiend seems to have alright abilities for it.

>>53773527
Expeditious Retreat. What caster that can only cast spells in pure rage would be capable of casting a retreat spell? you really need to look at your spell list. It looks like you just tossed a bunch of utility together.

>>53777177
go warlock 5/rogue x. your build should work fine

>when you run a session with no prep and just an idea and it turns out better than you could ever hope and everyone unanimously exclaims "that was amazing."

Feels fucking good man

Can you sneak attack with spell attacks?

>>53777218
storytime?

>>53777205
Actually that's not a bad idea, I'll think about it and then at 3 either decide Tome or Blade. If I end up deciding not wanting to go for a Warlock/Rogue then I'll just live as a pure EBlock with the Tome. Actually I'd probably summon a whip...

Thanks man.

>>53777225
No, Assassins can Assassinate with them though.

>>53777225
no, sneak attack requires you to make a finesse weapon attack. spell attacks are not finesse nor weapon attacks

>GM starts a new campaign a level 11
>Increases point buy let's us start at 16 in 2 stats before ASI and racials. Race to get 18 Dex. ASI to get me to 20 Dex and 18 WIS.
>Multiclassing isnt allowed
>Goes full monk, sounds fun
>People start memeing about stunning monk
>OK
>Get into first fight
>People somehow lose their shit because I am doing d8+5 4 times, and knocking people prone as well on top of it.
Why thd fuck do people think Monks are shit?

>>53777241
>No, Assassins can Assassinate with them though.
Wait, just after posting it occurred to me that an Assassin 3/Warlock X could be fun as fuck.

Getting all crits on EB + Hex attacks would be cool and the skills, cunning action and back up option in melee would be alright.

Might end up doing this.

>>53777234
It's too much to post.
But essentially everyone was just on their A-game tonight.

We're all long time friends but it was all new characters and everyone settled into their roles really well.
I was able to improve a plot and puzzles hard enough to not be solved instantly but quick enough as to not hog too much time.

Every now and then I have a session like this that just reminds me why I love this game so much.

>>53777300
You should teach my DM. Usually he will throw unsolvable puzzles at us which have, literally, taken up 4 hours of game time until we eventually solve it by just sheer luck/process of elimination.

>>53777255
Because a lot of the people here are just theory crafting.
Stunning is still GREAT, especially against bosses. But against regular mooks, it's enough to just fuck em up with a flurry most of the time.
If you've got mobile as well, you can get in, punch people the fuck out, and get away without being touched. It's great fun.
And with a decently high AC, you can even act as a tank if you want by bonus action dodging. It's seriously pretty underrated.

Except way of the four elements. That's pretty garbage.
Open hand monk, and shadow are great. Long death and sun soul are decent.

>>53775523
Play a Wild Magic Sorcerer and RP your Wild Surges as getting so angry you start losing control.

>>53777325
Honestly I think the best way is to drop subtle hints about how to solve things. And IF your players have no idea how to solve something, as a DM you shouldn't really just stick to your guns if it's taking 4 hours. Because if it is, you fucked up somewhere along the way. Be it your description of the puzzle, or in its design.

At that point, you should take whatever the players devise that seems plausible and reward them with a success for being creative.

>>53777255
>>53777326
One thing a lot of people don't realised... is against a lot of creatures GWM/SS is complete fucking overkill that is just making you less likely to hit in exchange for having unnessacarily high damage. PAM and CE are pretty powerful, but that's only because Dual-Wielding's badly balanced and should be doing more damage then others if it chews your bonus action.

Monks are fine in most combats, and really fucking good against a lot of weak creatures or 1-2 really tough ones. They start with alright defences, drop down a bit in the level 3-10 middle area and then become hard as nails monsters. It's a pretty good class and has far more out of combat use then a Fighter any day.

>>53774659
>The History of Rome
We have a man of patrician tastes here. I'd recommend 'Revolutions' podcast made by the same guy, if you are into Age of Enlightenment and 'international politics everywhere' shenanigans

>>53777326
I can never decide between open hand and shadow. I always regret my decision. I want both, but I can't get that.

It sucks man. Feels terrible. But at least it means both specs are just so fucking well made that you REALLY want both of them, so that's good anyway, I suppose.

Which just serves to make elements even more ducked up than it already is. Not only is it competing for worst subclass in the game, it is also outclassed so hard by the other two PHB traditions, that you literally have no reason ever to go for it.

PHB ranger is shit, but at least the class still had unique abilities. It filled a niche.

Elements monk has literally nothing going for it. It is just worse in every single regard, and has no redeeming qualities. The only worthwhile traits are shared by all other monk traditions, and the magic is better replicated by sun soul, or even multiclassing as a fucking druid.

It's pathetic.

>>53777364
>has far more out of combat use then a Fighter any day.
Was gonna add this until I finished reading your post.
Seriously, the monk I DM for makes good use out of his mobility and being able to run up walls like an anime protag.

How's this for a hosuerule optional sorcerer class set-up
>Sorcerers lose metamagic and sorcery points (replace sorcery points with something)
>Sorcerers instead can, at-will when casting a spell, alter the spell. This alteration can be anything logically minor - "This firebolt screeches loudly', 'the firebolt makes a 90 degree turn left after about 100ft' 'this firebolt remains where I've cast it for a minute before launching in the direction of where my target was at the time of casting', 'the firebolt splits up its damage between two adjacent enemies'.
If the spell is of your element, you could likely have a bit more leniency with what's allowed and also you could likely reflavour spells not of your element to your element if it's suitable.

In any case, it feels like it achieves what sorcerer was intended for, doesn't have some complex messy rules behind it and even gives newbie casters a bit of leeway with 'Yeah, you shouldn't be able to do that but imma let you'

The only real problem I'm seeing is it's hopelessly arbitrary and hard to define by rules which means it'd never get in an official rulebook. Also it wouldn't be very powerful unless you're creative, and that's kinda how wizards are, too.

>>53777397
>or even multiclassing as a fucking druid.
Exactly this.
I wanted to be elemental mystic man, and so I just went 1 monk for no armor and a bonus action attack, with the rest going into druid (I don't care about unlimited wildshape when I hardly use it).

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What's with the weird XP growth here?
Something to do with 5 and 10 being milestones/next-tier advancements or something?

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>>53776796
I'd blame that on him being new rather.

>>53777218
>when a player unexpectedly helps with worldbuilding
This is a feel I never thought I'd feel.

>>53777418
>>53777397
Druid/Monk can actually be pretty rad. I played a V.Human PAM Druid 1/Long Death Monk 9 in a one-shot a while ago, was awesome.

Get to key AC, Attack, Damage, Stun Save, Temp HP, at-will Fear ability and spellcasting all off Wisdom. So much fun.

>>53777437
>PAM
>Monk
For what purpose.

>>53777415
You pretty much hit on why it would be bad.
The problem is people need rules if it's what's going to define your class. If a DM was quite lenient and very much in favor of rule-of-cool then it could be great. But as a general replacement for the average group? Absolutely not.

Just look around here for a while and you'll notice incredibly stingy DMs that are practically policing player's at all times to see if they're trying to "pull a fast one" on them. No trust between player and DM. It's sad, but how some groups work.

Also, could just be abused if your DM says yes to something then decides later he doesn't want to let you do that. Would lead to some arguments, surely.

>>53777255
>d8+5 four times
>OH WOW LOOK AT THAT 9.5*4 DAMAGE

I'm sorry anon, but 38 damage is still pathetic, assuming you even hit.

A fighter does at least twice that. At range.

>>53777448
>A fighter does at least twice that. At range
Please enlighten me.

>>53777454
>>53777448
Protip: Sharpshooter assumes you have targets where the damage matters, and makes it significantly more unlikely that you even hit. Remember that in your funny little theorycrafting jerk off.

>>53777445
I feel that once you have a good grip on the system (and players trust the DM) it could work well. At that point you know what would be broken and what isn't, and what is reasonable.

And sure, you might realize that a particular application is powerful, but you just.. Allow it, as long as it's not something that's clearly the only 'right way to use this ability'.

>>53777454
CBE+SS, 20 dexterity.
1d6+5+10 damage (18.5) per hit, -5 to hit from sharpshooter but +2 to hit from archery.
Then they have other things such as battlemaster manoeuvres, such as ones that increase their chance of hitting.
They can make this attack four times a turn (extra attack 2 + bonus action).
Then they also have action surge for 3 more attacks if they wish.

>>53777448
This is why homebrewed adventures are always much more fun than out of the box ones, imo.
Of course, you can change them up to do a similar thing, but I just prefer making up my own shit.

Reason being, if I've got a monk in the party. You better believe I'm gonna throw them a bone and let them act out their weeb fantasies. There's gonna be people on high towers for them to run up and punch them out of. There's gonna be archers they can catch arrows from. There's gonna be situations where the party has to be unarmed and a fight breaks out. It's just gonna happen because I like seeing my players happy with their choices.

Meanwhile, if I've got a fighter and he likes to pump out massive damage. I'll give him stuff to kill and be the hero he wants to be.
>wow you did 80 damage in a turn!
>that was just enough to kill him!
it was really 50 damage more than you needed, but DM rolls 20 on deception

>>53777466
If you do more damage than you have targets, then who really cared about how much damage your monk is doing in the first place?

>>53777469
Yeah, and I agree with you there.
It really all comes down to DM and player trust. Rule of cool, rule of fun, whatever you want to call it. I think it could be a great way to play sorcerer if that's the kind of game you're going for. But as a player it just feels safer to have something that's concrete.

How about you give them some concrete options that you can always do, and then open it up to say "and/or additional effects might be allowed based on the DMs discretion" like certain spells have such as Bestow Curse.

I think this would be a fine middle-ground to shoot for and would likely make the option more attractive to someone looking to pick it.

>>53777440
So I could use it with Shillelagh. That means I've got a bonus action attack still but can use it with my Quarterstaff so it's keyed off Wisdom instead of dexterity. Also the reaction attack's not bad.

The whole idea was a Monk that only needed 14 or so Dexterity. I plan to try it again as a Firbolg one day.

>>53777470
This is just a general thing. You should always have dynamic environments with environmental hazards and all that. Monks can benefit a bit from all this, and martials in general. It helps put more focus on tactical combat over just doing damage and standing there.

But I won't let someone pretend that monk is a good damage dealer.

>>53777483
Probably. I did consider 'you can spend sorcery points for alternate effects' but it just gives another way to spend your points when twinned spell is still going to come out on top, really. It's like giving monk cool new things they can do with ki, stunning fist will still likely be an overwhelmingly good option.

>>53777490
First point I absolutely agree with. It was more along the lines of, I'll specifically add favorable environment for the monk to enjoy that other martials would perhaps otherwise ignore.

>But I won't let someone pretend that monk is a good damage dealer.
They're pretty "competitive," whatever that means, early on compared to lots of other classes because they have the extra bonus action attack. Granted you can receive that as well from variant human PAM.

However, monks certainly aren't "underpowered" in my opinion when it comes to dealing damage. They're pretty on par. In my mind they fill a good niche of battlefield control as a martial. They are also pretty versatile. I think I mentioned earlier, you can be a stand-in tank if necessary with the decent AC and dodging, while still being able to attack.

Surely they won't be able to pump out meme-worthy amounts of damage on par with fighters, but they shouldn't. That's really what fighters should be doing. They should be the best at fighting. It's in their name.

>>53777495
You wanted to get rid of sorcery points all-together, yeah?
You can still do that.

But you could make a list of things you already mentioned:
Spells that require attack rolls:
You can split it into two attacks and deal half damage to each target.
You can have it curve around corners.
You can have it make a loud noise.
You can have it be silent.

Things like this. Then add: "You may be able to instead suggest a different effect on the spell if the DM allows"

And give a few options for spells that require saves as well.

Whatever happened to the DMsGuild Trove?

>Astral Plane focused adventure
>Dying isn't lethal
>It's a world of thought, you can have dreamworlds, psychonauts, inception and other bullshit
Why haven't I done this sooner?

>>53775214
>enemies invade your demiplane
>rip

>>53777506

Fighters also end up with better defence due to platemail and crowd control (Via battlemaster) for most of their life.

How do you effectively use illusions in combat when one attack vs it means all enemies will know its an illusion?

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>>53777506
A monk isn't really much better a tank than some others until high levels. You get high AC, empty body and proficiency in all saves. There're some really strong late monk features.
Early game, level 1-3 is barely worth considering for most games. Level 4 is when evern non variant-humans can pick up feats and will likely vastly overtake a monk.

For the meat of most games (not incredibly low level or high level) monk doesn't do great at damage dealing. They're not an absolute failure, but it looks something like this graph if everybody sticks to what works best for damage dealing for their class.

Seriously though,w hat the fuck is up with empty body?
'At level 18, you can become invisible and have resistance to all damage except force damage'
So enemies have disadvantage to hit you, you have advantage to attack and you're essentially a bear barbarian?
I guess casters are getting shit like wish at that point though.

>>53777522
It kinda feels like I could make a really long list of things you can do and that could work.
Also I kinda want the same for monk, but it'd be a case of 'remove stunning fist but give them versatility such as with blinding opponents with the ki'
Weaker effects but a vast variety of effects that could actually be more useful sometimes (Blind a beholder, I guess?)

Sorcerer sounds like it'd be easier to fix in this regard though.

>>53777544
>Fighters also end up with better defence due to platemail
At level 8+ like recomended where most Monks have 17-18 AC. Or lower which gives them better AC for 1 or 2 levels. Yes, their AC is better.

>crowd control (Via battlemaster) for most of their life.
One option, gets a maximum of 6 control options at their max level. Where a Monks Stunning Fist is better then all of them and he can do it 15 times at that point.

>>53777561

>At level 8+ like recomended where most Monks have 17-18 AC. Or lower which gives them better AC for 1 or 2 levels. Yes, their AC is better.

And the moment magic armour gets involved, the monk is kinda shit out of luck. They really should have kept Ki Focus/Cloth armour from 4e for helping with that.

>>53777569
Can't monks get the +2 ac bracer?

>>53777569
Monk is really just there to feed the hungry 'I WANT TO BE AN UNARMOURED GUY' and 'I WANT TO BE AN UNARMED GUY' weeobs.

>>53777576
Yeah and the fighter could have cloak of protection shield+1 plate armour +1 or whatever
Fuck magic items

>>53777561
>At level 8+ like recomended

Not saying you are wrong but where does the book reccomend 8+ for plate armour?

>>53776796
Tell the GM you're not having a bunch of fun. Offer him advice (such as starting over in a new setting to avoid 'samesame' problems.)

>>53777552
>monk without any feats
>fighter and barb with two each

You're right though. Empty body is fucking weird. I never liked it and didn't understand it much flavor wise. I guess you can fluff it as "He's fast! Too fast to see!" But going ghost always seemed odd to me.

>>53777576

Doesn't the bracers replace your AC, not add to it? Or am I thinking of something else?

>>53777600
Why would the monk have feats? They're getting ASIs.
Feats for fighters/barbarians are much more important over ASIs.

>>53777586
>Monk is really just there to feed the hungry 'I WANT TO BE AN UNARMOURED GUY' and 'I WANT TO BE AN UNARMED GUY' weeobs.

Can you really say that when the monk has been about longer than a hell of a lot of classes at this point? I mean, the Warlock is a much newer class than the Monk is.

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>>53777612
Yet monk has almost always been utter shite.
They don't really care about monks.

>>53777600

The fighter can easily afford to get feats because his defence isn't stat dependent and he gets more stat ups.

The monk needs two separate stats for his defence so he's hungry for every single stat up. That and there is very few feats a monk can actually use to improve it.

>>53777620

AD&D and 4e monks were both pretty good.

>>53777586
Monk could technically also have a cloak of protection and the bracers, and the other protection item if you just want to give them ungodly AC.

But magic items are all DM fiat anyway. Who cares.

>>53777569
Except the lowest magic armour is Rare, and I imagine if your DM's throwing a Rare item around for the Fighter then other classes are going to end up with something for them as well.

They can give the Monk a lotta shit. Cloak of Protection, Ring of Protection, Bracers of Defence, Insignia of Claws and etc. If the DM doesn't give Monks magic gear then he's just a dick because most of that's more common then Magic Armour's meant to be.

>>53777588
I remember there was a tweet about offical adventures normally refusing to have easy access to it until 8 for balance reasons, and it's recommended it's the same in most games.

One thing I found searching the DMG is starting adventurers between levels 5-10 don't even have a good chance of being able to afford Plate with their money.

>>53777610
>>53777622
I'm more so making fun of the graph that has them with both feats from level 1. It's skewed in that regard.

>>53777603
Its just a +2 when not using armor or a shield

>>53777646
They tale the feats as soon as they're ready. That's what the power spike at level 4 is.

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>guy posts about how his monk is pretty fun and not that bad to play
>couple of guys agree
>autists come out in hoards with their graphs and theorycraft to tell them why they're wrong

>>53777640

>One thing I found searching the DMG is starting adventurers between levels 5-10 don't even have a good chance of being able to afford Plate with their money.

Mind you, half the classes barely touch money so getting the fighter plate that way is pretty easy. The warlock/wizard/monk/rogue/ranger don't really have big money investments.

It's a bit like Warcasters in the IKRPG. Fighters/Paladins scale with dosh better than most other classes as once you start throwing about plate levels of money, other classes don't have similarly valuable investments to spend money on.

>>53777586
>Yeah and the fighter could have cloak of protection
You don't give martials cloak of protection what the fuck. Unless you plan on mind controlling them and make them fight the rest of the party.

>>53777658
Lets face it, 5eg is just a battlemaster circlejerk

>>53777657
Oh I see, I misunderstood the chart in that way then.
I stand by the fact that monks are in an okay place.

What they really need is an extra ASI, which would move them from consistently good to great. And would make races outside of variant human and wood elf more attractive options.

>>53777658

Something can be fun and still have problems.

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>>53777658
I'm sorry anon, but I can't allow misinformation to spread, else they might nerf monks.

>>53777676
>>53777679
I'm just laughing because it's like literal clockwork.

>>53777673
Nah, they need to be less ability dependent in a game that for some fucking reason has rolling for stats as the 'standard' option.

>>53777679

I really do miss 4e monks. They were in a great place mechanically and fluff-wise.

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>>53777658
People are having too much fun!

>>53777466
>>53777454
Assuming AC 19 (for fun), a Monk hits half the time.

Effective damage per turn is 19

Fighters (which is very much "best case scenario", nobody does as much damage, but they also sacrifice pretty much all utility for it) does 74 average damage, and assuming optimal conditions (archery style), need a 13 to hit, so 48 damage on average.

However, this assumes several things:
1. That you dedicated everything to do this one thing (20 Dex + archery + CE), where a Monk did nothing aside from being a monk.
2. That the monsters need tot ale that much damage
3. That you dont need something else.

A monk does this damage, and can, for free, remove reactions from any target hit with FOB (up to 2), knock prone with Dex or push away with Strength. If you want to target con instead, you can do that for 1 ki point.

Unless you straight up killed the target with your damage, you will take return damage. A monk can just choose to disable the opponent.

They do 2 radically different things, and the damage from a monk is far from bad considering how hard they fuck things with save-or-suck effects.

Now try comparing with something that isnt a single minded Fighter. They are literally one of the single best classes at doing sustained damage. Nothing outside of UA cheese gets close to that, so in your average party where everybody ISN'T playing a fighter, the monk is doing quite a lot of damage for no effort at all, while also being deceptively tanky.

>>53777662
>wizards don't have big investments
Copying spells costs a lot. Components can cost a lot.

>>53777662
>The warlock/wizard/monk/rogue/ranger don't really have big money investments.

>Warlock
Scribing spells and 99% of Warlocks are douchebags who'll horde money.

>Wizard
Costs 50gp per spell level + matirial components

>Monk
He needs the money for potions and if his DM allows them Magic Items. Apparently his class is shit enough to mean he'll need all the help he can get.

>Rogue
See Warlock

>Ranger
Arrows, spell components and Half-Plate

I agree Fighters get better with more money, which is a balancing factor to the fact their better then other martials. Sure the rest of the party can give all their gold to make him better but at that point they're investor's, not adventurers.

>>53777667
Which I never understood... because Eldritch Knight shits on it once he's level 7+

I have a feeling it has to do with the amount of Roll20 players who never get past 3 in the thread.

>>53777679
>>53777676
Except they're not as bad as you think they are.

>>53777706
>but they also sacrifice pretty much all utility for it)

The fighter didn't really have much utility in the first place.

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What would happen if I as a DM allowed longbows to scale with Strength

>>53777706
Death is the greatest condition, anon.

>>53777711

>See Warlock

I don't think rogues need to scribe spells.

>>53777686
Here's the way I see it. Most classes depend on two scores and constitution. Monk is no different.

Well, the difference is that monks need to max wisdom, dex, and about a 14 con to be "viable" as some put it.
Some say they hate this because they don't get much opportunity to take a feat.
Others say the reason they hate it is because of d8 hit dice.

With an extra ASI (which make thematic sense, imo.) you can take tough if you want more HP, you can diversify yourself and grab a different feat if you like, or you can simply pump your wis/dex higher EARLIER if you like.

For a class built on the premise of perfecting body and mind, it seems they should have ability score improvements at LEAST on par with rogues, if not fighters. But they get more features than fighters, so that's understandable to give fighters for ASI/feat slots.

>>53777722
You would be seeing more SS+GWM meme builds because they can now also hit people from 600ft. away with normal bow damage or run up and super -10 Attack, +20 damage people.

Precision Attack sadly makes that retarded burst viable.

>>53777725
Death is the last emotion.

>>53777712
They're not bad. At stunning and running.

>>53777736
It's more about the fact a solid amount of Rogue's will be someone who cares about money. It's sadly a very, very common trope for them to only be adventuring to get Dragon levels of wealth.

>>53777725
Except for when you're doing so much DPR that the DM just inflates everyone's HP so they last more than few rounds. So you're effectively not contributing anything. Meanwhile a monk can at least disable the opponent.

>>53777743
That's their role though.

>>53777738
With an extra ASI, all you do is speed up the rate of them getting wisdom and dexterity. It doesn't make it any less overwhelmingly good to take dexterity or wisdom over a feat.

>>53777711

>I agree Fighters get better with more money, which is a balancing factor to the fact their better then other martials. Sure the rest of the party can give all their gold to make him better but at that point they're investor's, not adventurers.

It does, however, make balancing a lot harder. As the fighter scales on two different tracks rather than just 'Exp' like most classes.

They really should have given all classes expensive stuff to spend money on so if the fighter gets plate earlier, the monk has ki foci and warlock a fancy implement or such.

>>53777751
How does inflating HP reduce a fighter's ability to do as they do without severely wrecking the rest of the party?

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Post your PCs drawn by you.

Bully others.

>Playing Sorcerer
>New Mystic player's ranting about how my at-will damage is waaaaay too high compared to Sorcerers in /pfg/
>While he literally just wanted to make a character who "Could do everyone's role as good as them"

>>53777751
But then everyone other than the fighter will be blown out of every encounter.
>Oh wow I crit with both my attacks, cool!
Right, now you almost deal as much damage as the fighter's average.

>>53777755
Depends on the game and the player.
Some people would shockingly prefer to play something like a goliath monk or some shit because that's the character they envision in their mind. So yes, pumping dex or wisdom is probably best.

If you prefer to be a wood elf and be a monk perhaps you want some druid-ish magic and take magic initiate for a little bit of utility that way. Or perhaps you want to be a shadow monk and take mage slayer to be even more of a caster disabling fucker.

It simply opens up more options.

>>53777766
Cute.

>>53777752

Well, at 5+. They don't start with stunning strike, it's not like a rogue and sneak attack.

>>53777765
Because you target the fighter who is doing the most damage. Or you simply just leave them as giant HP sponge. It doesn't have to increase the damage it will do to the rest of the party.
>>53777769
>oh surprisingly the monster you targeted doesn't take as much damage to kill, that's weird
Sounds like a dick thing to do right? But not as uncommon as you think.
Fighter will either target the big bad or some smaller underlings (doing a single creature encounter is fucking stupid).
They now overkill underlings or they focus on taking down the big bad.

If they focus the big bad, it will have a ton of HP and they'll just be wailing on it for a few rounds not really doing anything meaningful.
The big bad has now had a few rounds to be big and threatening and perhaps hurt a lot of people. Now's a good time to let the fighter kill it. Or better yet, the bard gets the kill with his dagger.

I'm not saying I do this when I DM. Mostly because my players don't treat it like a theorycraft experiment and MMO. But it's easy as fuck to cheese as a DM if you wanted to.
There's a reason a DM screen exists. It's because DMs lie all the fucking time.

>>53777766
Never been able to draw worth a damn, so I've never tried to draw a character.

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>>53777766

>>53777017

I guess i never got high level enough for these problems to rise up. Also we sucked at optimizing and no one really tried (my monk was the best damage dealer of the team), except for AC because that shit was easy.

>>53777738

Basing the 5e monk on the 3.5 monk really wasn't a great idea imo. It's this chimera of random ideas that doesn't really result in a coherent whole.

>At 4th level you get slow fall. It's the ability to have a weaker version of feather fall.
>At 7th level you get stillness of mind to allow you to stop two, very specific mind-affecting abilities.
>At 13 level you get the ability to...speak all languages! On a non-charisma class. Without any language-based abilities. When tongues is a 3rd level spell and comprehend languages is 1st level.
>At 15th, you get the ability to not age!

There isn't really any design coherence with the monk other than 'They are vaguely eastern mysticism'. They should have sat down and worked out what combat/non-combat roles they wanted them to fill.

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>RRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE LET ME HAVE MY BIG NUMBERS BUILD
>I AM A FIGHTER AND I MATTER RRRRREEEEEEEEEEEE

>>53777552
>Monks
>just above 30 damage
????
Who the fuck made that, and what level is his math skills? 2. Grade?

Monks have 4 attacks, at level 5. They easily have 20 Dex by then. Damage die is d6. That's (3,5 +5) x 4 = 34.

That table is bullshit.

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>>53777766
>>53777826
Use this

>>53777837

So how do we fix the 5e monk?

>>53777722
Another solution is to make bows have a Strength requirement to be able to use. Maybe crossbows, too, but theirs is lesser. Say, 12 Strength for a Shortbow, 14 for a Longbow; 10 Strength for a Hand Crossbow, 11 for a Light Crossbow, 13 for a Heavy Crossbow.

That or accuracy on bows and crossbows scales with Dexterity but damage scales with Strength, but that's getting too complicated for 5e.

>>53777841
I think he's assuming point buy.
15
+2 optimal race
+2 ASI

>>53777846
my character has 2 paws, 2 claws,
wings and a tail
And would probably get me banned

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>>53777841
>Why does your monk only have 18 dex at level 5?
>Easily have 20 dex by level 5

Rolling for stats fag detected
GTFO

>>53777852
>>53777722
http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Composite_Shortbow

>>53777620

AD&D monk was fucking overpowered because of how weapon masteries worked.

>>53777837
That's because monks get a lot of their specific flavor from their subtype. What unifies monk is vaguely eastern mysticism. Seems like they did a good job.

>>53777852
What about range based on strength and damage/to-hit based on dexterity?
I don't think a weakling should be able to accurately land a shot 500 feet away with a longbow.

>>53777857
Imgur?

>>53777849

I think the core of it is 'You need to sit down and work out what you want the monk to be, then build around that'. The 5e monk is designed in a very top down (We are making a monk! Ok, what sort of things are monkish?) way rather than bottom up (We are making an unarmed class, what things would aid in that?)

A single target damage dealer, an AOE damage dealer, a very survivable defender or a debuffing controller are all things that could be within it's wheelhouse and build a class or subclass around.

>Monk - Unarmed damage dealer
>>Iron Soul Monk - Nasty brawler, counters and survivability.
>>Desert Wind Monk - Elementalist, AOE damage.
>>Shadow Hand Monk - Single target assassin, focus on doing extra damage to isolated guys.
>>Centered Breath Monk - Mysticism, Debuffs and status effects

A lot of the monk stuff like slowfall and tongue of the sun and moon could easily be folded in as flavor things for subclasses, with the main class being 'Beat a guy to death with your fists' and the subclasses being if you are a tavern brawler, a practised martial artist or a pressure point using mystic.

Composite Longbow
1d8+Dex
+Str (1)(2)(3)(4)(5)

Each +Str costs gold or requires special materials to augment.

+1 - 200 Gold for the finer materials needed to craft, but most crafters can make it.

Etc etc for all your arbitrary bow upgrade needs.

>>53777889
Shortbow
>regular range = 5 * str
>extended range = 20 * str

Longbow
>regular range = 10 * str
>extended range = 40 * str

>average str of 10
shortbow becomes (50/200)
longbow becomes (100/400)
I like it. Picked them mostly arbitrarily though

>chad thundercock with 20 str but shit dex steps up to bat
longbow becomes (200/800)
He can potentially hit some faggot from 800 feet away but can't aim for shit.

>>53777923
>>53777937
Why don't we just give Longbow Finesse.

Does the rogue's Reliable Talent only apply to skills and tools?

>>53777722
You should go back to older edition since you obviously love a useless detail design that slow the game down.

or just play Shadowrun

>>53777956

The issue there is that strength is already the better stat in general for combat. It gets you 2 handed weapons (Much, much better damage support) and heavy armour (Less investment for more AC). Letting longbows go Str would give little reason for an archer (The guys who already care the least about moving) to not go heavy on the Str.

>>53777973
I guess so. Maybe I'm just autistic and unable to use a bow without having a +3 to hit and damage.

>>53777722
Then barbarians would become archers.

It basically buffs any strength-based classs such as paladin, some fighters and most barbarians by allowing them an easy ranged attack that isn't penalized much.

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>>53777809
>Because you target the fighter who is doing the most damage
DM metagaming if your enemy isn't aware of the party strengths.
>Or you simply just leave them as giant HP sponge.
Still doesn't address the problem of the monk not being on par with damage in the slightest.
>Sounds like a dick thing to do right? But not as uncommon as you think. Fighter will either target the big bad or some smaller underlings (doing a single creature encounter is fucking stupid). They now overkill underlings or they focus on taking down the big bad.
Are you trying to argue for the monk, or against the fighter? Because currently I don't see the point you're trying to make, specifically with underlings that, unless you're playing with a 4e houserule of minions, means that monks are no better at clearing them out than the fighter.
>If they focus the big bad, it will have a ton of HP...Now's a good time to let the fighter kill it. Or better yet, the bard gets the kill with his dagger.
Why are you DMing D&D exactly? Why not just play a free form if you're going to be abstract with your values?
Adjustments for theatricality are on a case by case basis and not "whenever the fighter is present".
>I'm not saying I do this when I DM.
?
>Mostly because my players don't treat it like a theorycraft experiment and MMO.
Quite literally, 100% by the PHB. If you're so horrified, disallow those feats, or feats in general.
>But it's easy as fuck to cheese as a DM if you wanted to.
No shit.
>There's a reason a DM screen exists. It's because DMs lie all the fucking time.
Still have no idea what you're trying to argue. I'm all for trying to rebalance things as a DM you might find overbearing/undertuned, granting aid in the form of over the table tweaks or goodies, or worst case scenario talking to the problem player about the issues, but what you presented (I just tweak it so 1 player is hitting a wall of my own device) is a blatant favoritism of the worst kind.

>>53775214
Because liches are a defined thing in the games extensive lore and this is le random lulz power gaming dickery no good GM would allow.

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>>53777993
>>53777809
>There are still ShitDMs that need the crutch of lying to their players and beefing monsters up or down arbitrarily
>They don't have somebody with, say, the special ability to determine a creature's HP to the nearest 10.
>They still roll behind screens

Anons! I want to convert the Tel-Amhothlan (a half-elf half-orc) from Kingdoms of Kalamar to 5e. Tell me how overpowered this first draft is!

3.0 stats for comparison: https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Tel-Amhothlan

Tel-Amhothlan
Ability Score Modifiers: +1 Dexterity, +1 Strength
Size: Medium
Speed: 30 feet
Vision: Darkvision 60 feet
Relentless Endurance: When you are reduced to 0 hit points, but not killed outright, you can instead choose to be reduced to 1 hit point instead. After using this trait, you cannot use it again until you complete a long rest.
Fey Ancestry: You have Advantage on saving throws against being Charmed and are Immune to Magical Sleep effects.
Keen Senses: You have Proficiency in the Perception skill.
Muddied Heritage: Tel-Amhothlans are chaotic breed and can favor either orcish or elvish aspects of their lineage. Choose the Orcish Brutality, Elvish Grace or Fae Magic subrace options.

Orcish Brutality:
Ability Score Modifier: +1 Constitution
Savage Attacks: When you score a critical hit with a melee weapon attack, you increase the damage inflicted by +1 dice.

Elvish Grace:
Ability Score Modifier: +1 Dexterity
Fleet-Footed: Your base walking speed increases to 35 feet.
Natural Athlete: You have Proficiency in the Athletics skill.

Fae Magic:
Ability Score Modifier: +1 Charisma
Mystic Talent: You can cast Prestidigitation and one other Wizard cantrip of your choice. Charisma is your casting ability score when casting the cantrips provided by this trait. At the DM's permission, at character creation, you can trade this racial feature for Drow Magic (PHB pg24) or Mul Daya Magic (Plane Shift: Zendikar pg19); this choice cannot be undone later.

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I've been playing a druid for a while it's level seven. We have a five man group but no supports we have two tanks and two damage should I go into control or support? Oh and the DM somehow let me have two druid land circles. Artic and mountain. Found out slow is really fuckin helpful at times