/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

We are never going to see the Mage FAQ, and even hoping for the promised cut antagonist material and Legacy updates is a fool's errand.

I just hope Signs of Sorcery is released before the end of 2018.

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/mage-the-awakening/1094513-news-on-the-faq/page5

File: 575584a70253574be8a461271f1179b1.jpg (61KB, 650x366px) Image search: [Google]

61KB, 650x366px

>>53466211
It's one dev who could possibly work on it, he's got to make a living, under contract he can't accept payment from anyone other than Onyx to work on Mage stuff, it's unlikely they'd start a kickstarter for it, he's apparently had a lot of stuff to deal with in the last year, and he's also the main dev on another gameline that's still in development.

What's more, a bunch of the entitled shitheads from the Onyx Path forums start bitching about the company's policies such that it further discourages DaveB to spend his already precious free time on an unpaid project.

I'm just happy that the last Monday Meeting notes mentioned that he's getting caught back up on Mage, and that things are looking up for him.

Be well, my lord Exarch.

>>53466414

The fact that the FAQ isn't paid work makes me OK that there isn't one at the moment (I've never felt like I needed one, to be honest) but pretty miffed that Onyx Path apparently doesn't consider something like an FAQ to be worthy of paid work. Something like that should be paid work, full stop.

>>53466414
Also I do wish he could post at least the Sisterhood of the Blessed writeup which he did for his game.

I'd honestly just like another point of reference for developing my own Legacies.

The creation rules work nicely, and I can kinda see how they did it in the example Attainments, but I'd like another example (perhaps with some atypical Attainments) so I can have another example from the devs who wrote the system.

Also because the update I did is mostly garbage and the Mages are almost always better just casting the spell versions of the Attainments.

>>53466462
Thing is, even if you consider yes, the FAQ should be paid work.
It's not in Onyx Path's interest to put out that stuff (paying money for something they'll likely not make a single buck off of) when there's other paying projects they can get their devs to do.

Personally I really just appreciate the work DaveB puts in on the forums occasionally helping answer questions.

Also let's not rehash that discussion here please.

>>53466171
>How often do you improvise as a ST?

All the time. It's like the first rule of GM'ing your PCs will do the weirdest shit. Hell the players in my current game decided the best way to change the resonance in the bad part of town was to summon Batman from the Temenos to terrorize criminals.

>>53466475
Isn't that by design? If you want power and utility cast a spell. If you want something that just works use an attainment.

>>53466591
I love Temenos summonings.

That being said, when trying to destabilise an authoritarian Scelestus's "perfect Abyssal society" I did take a few Wisdom hits when I summoned a small horde of about 20 Rank 5 Goetia of various aspects of antiauthoritariasm, antiestablishmentism, contrarianism, and my personal favorite, teenage rebellion.

>>53466621
IMO, If you aren't risking wisdom occasionally you're really not playing mage correctly.

>>53466509

It doesn't matter if Onyx Path can make a buck off it or not, if you're doing developer things, you should be paid something for doing them.

I get the reality of the situation, it is what it is, but damn.

>Make a Werewolf character
>He is a shadow lord
>Call him Konrad Curze, also because the ST is a WHfag like me
>He is Romanian
>Time to play
>They ask my Werewolf name
>Oh shit, I forgot about it
>Spend literally 2 seconds to think of a name
>Think of my language corrispective of "Heart of Darkness" for some reason
>I Finish the campain
>A few minutes ago I decide to google the name out, because I always felt it was telling me something but I couldn't remember what
>I find the book of the same name, the translation was even the same
>See the author's name
>Joseph CONRAD
>I almost fall from my chair
>HOLY FUCKING SHIT

>>53466700

We have a house rule that you have to fuck up truly spectacularly to lose the last dot

>>53466462
Didn't he already answer shit in the FAQ thread?

>>53467040
Just trawled through his posts in that thread, and the only questions he answered were fairly simple rules questions. And very few of them, for that matter.

>>53467038

Also experimenting with tracking wisdom and integrity seperately

>>53467038
I also like to use a more 'granular?' approach to wisdom loss. So hijacking somebody's body or mind with Life 2 or Mind 2 would be Hubris at wisdom 7 but it wouldn't necessarily be so at wisdom 4 unless you're doing something utterly egregious.

>>53467154
For just mages or all supernatural splats? Seems like everybody would be a quivering wreck after a couple sessions.

>>53467038
Given that that's what causes your soul to almost irreversibly crack and start leaking magic everywhere, an action that can really only happen caused by something on the level of eating someone's fucking soul without Wisdom-protection...

That's not unwise.

>>53467230

Basically "Don't kill dont steal dont do crack" are tracked by integrity rather than wisdom. you can lose all your integrity and still have high wisdom. Of course, you're a "serene bastard" type character like that.

Or we may just say fuck integrity and make wisdom the sole stat only covering magic shit.

>>53467205
1E mechnaics worked better for it. now it's just like general groupings

Do the concepts of Awakening and Ascension exist within the astral realms?

>>53466898

Kek

Unrelated, someone in the last thread suggested that Vamps should be more powerful than Mages. My retort is that Vamps are so powerful that Mages all disappear from paradox before a Vamp chronicle even starts.

>>53467428
There are certainly realms relating to Ascension and Awakening (the concepts held by mankind) in the Temenos, and there are probably kernels of Supernal truth you can find in both of them amonst all of the crap about people floating up into the heavens and people falling to their knees, their eyes glowing with magical juju.

However none of them will be objectively true, and each will merely contain the single communally held thought of mankind.

>>53466509
DaveB is too pure for this world.

>>53466171
>How often do you improvise as a ST?
Right now. One of my PC's wants to hire a hit man to take care of a problem character in the local neighborhood. He has all the right connections and allies and resources, he should totally be able to do it. Just don't really know how to handle something like that.

>>53467502
Indeed, which is how he managed to Ascend, and join himself to the Iron Seal of Prime.

>>53466591

Seconding this, absolutely. Improvisation is the first, second, and third skill to improve as an ST. Planning shit out is good, but being ready to change it is super-necessary. Players will rarely, if ever, take the path you planned.

>>53467618
Especially if you're playing Mage...
Though that require creative players.
And I've had a few who couldn't cast their way out of a wet paper bag.

>>53466711
Who cares if its unpaid or not. Throwing your toys out the pram and threatening not to release the faq because people ask about it on a forum is immature.

Even had it been paid, it probably still wouldnt have been released by now anyways cos "problems" so meh

>>53467675

I cast a fireball.

"How?"

Well, I have Forces 3.

"Yeah, you can manipulate forces. How do you make a fireball?"

I... I make fire. And then I throw it.

"How do you make fire?"

I... I make the particles move really fast in the air?

"How do you do that?"

I... look, man, can't I just cast fireball? What's your problem?

>>53467729
fuck ascension, fuck paradigms.

>>53467729
Get yourself Forces 4 as fast as possible, then abuse the fuck out of Transform Energy.

It can turn a lake into an exploding icecube.

>>53467483

Vamps should be nowhere near as powerful as a mage but as he posted here >>53466623
It would be cool if they could steal some powers through diablire & power them by feeding on more Mages, or drain a Changling & gain access to their Contracts or other Glamour powers. It make for a far more interesting crossover potential than anything in Beast. A vampire would still have to find a way to kill said Mage or Changling which is no easy feat. & it would not be permanent

>>53467763
Why, you just ask what he's making it out of? Ex nihilo casting requires prime 2 or matter 2 to make it out of the air.

>>53467729

I run a ton shit of ascension i have never run into this. Paradigm is more the player defining the hammer with which he will hit everything as it were nails.

>So i got fire magic as my paradigm.
>Ok, but the guy is bleeding, how will you help him.
>with fire.
>.....can you expand on that?
>I will cauterize his wounds.
>....oh, ok sure.

or
>So you see your enemy and...
>FIREBALL!
>So now you see this technocracy agent.
>FIREBALL!
>So now, this HIT MARK appears and its made of primium, so he got counterspeling so....
>FIREBALL, to the building over it, so chunks will fall and crush him.

>>53467402
Interesting. My PCs are surprisingly straight edge.

>>53466562

Aren't alternate methods of safely relinquishing spell control coming w/ signs of sorcery? If it ever comes out.

>>53468003
This. I've never had issues with Paradigm either, it's just a little RP flavor for your magic.

File: 1491009541674.png (135KB, 640x1456px) Image search: [Google]

135KB, 640x1456px

>>53468202
Yes. Including a large section on Mage Sight to make it clearer how exactly it works.

For example, peripheral Mage Sight is triggered by photographs of a supernatural event, and can tell you what specifically is being affected by the phenomenon.

So you can imagine that at any gathering of Mages, there are probably going to be ground-rules on whether people are allowed to use Magic, and for what purposes.

Because peripheral is your first warning sign of something going wrong, and having that triggered first by someone casting a spell to get rid of their bad breath, followed by everyone else activing Active Mage Sight to see if they're in danger or under attack, will likely drive everyone mad.

>>53468294
I'm also very excited about the merits which modify Mage Sight to tell you the "Arcanum" of what triggers your periphery, and which lets you determinine similarities between phenomena viewed in Active Mage Sight.

Such as permitting you to see a Vampire's Dominate effect, and realising it for what it is, having previously seen a Mage's Psychic Domination.

>>53468294
dont quite get how a photo triggers MS but whatever..

>>53468318
Eh, representation of a thing carries its symbology, and Mages are all about reading and detecting symbology, or whatever. Basically, it's a neat tidbit. Because you can't see it in Active Mage sight, so all you know is somethign weeeeeeird happened then, and that'll drive you mad and send you off to hunt whatever it was down.

So a Mage who sees a Photo of a Sin-Eater, and who has Death 2, will detect the presence of the Geist within the Sin-Eater through his Periphery. And if he has the merit which permits you to know information about the nature of things in your periphery, he'll also be able to tell that that was triggered by a "Death" supernatural effect.

>>53468377
PMS is triggered by the active use of a supernatural effect, how is that coming from a photo of said effect?

Sounds retarded. Just give out photos of supernal effects to every sleeper, or print them in a magazine for lols then, constant pinging PMS??? aids!

>>53468421
Photograph of an active use?
You've also got to remember that Death, Mind and Spirit 2 grant you the ability to detect the presence of Ghosts, Goetia and Spirits in your periphery.

Also while it's not yet been stated, not all things in your periphery and active as as obvious or strong as each other. A mere photo of a very weak Ghost isn't going to do more than slightly tickle your brain, though a few thousand of them pasted all over a room could be a bit stronger.

And almost nothing compares to the "sound" of an Awakening, an Imperial Practice cast by one of the Watchtowers themselves.


Also sure, yes. That could be a simple plot-hook. Who's posting all these picture of Ghosts. Why?
Are they Awakened? Do they know what they're doing? Is it some human under some influence?
Does the God-Machine somehow need 100,000 pictures of Ghosts spread across the city to summon a powerful Ghost-enslaving Angel?

>>53468294
You'd think w/ how bloody useful the sight is gizmos and gadgets that expand what arcana a mage could interpret with the sight would be worth their weight in gold.

>>53468491

Ok. This HAS to be Dave.

>>53468507
Which is why you can get an Imbued item containing Shared Sight for 1 merit dot, or even better, borrow one from your Order with even the most casual membership.

You can even keep it, at Status 3.

>>53468316
So how does active/focused mage sight work with other splat powers?

Say you got a mage chilling in a bar having a beer when something pings his PMS. Some lady at the end of the bar is doing something magical (e.g. the dominate discipline).

Assuming he has the merit he'd know it's related to the death and mind arcana. Otherwise he'd only know the woman is doing something supernatural and would have to flip channels on his sight hoping he has the right arcana.

Say he does have the correct arcana. Active sight wouldn't tell him anything useful if this is the first time seeing a phenomena other than the lady is doing something to the frat boy chatting her up.

So if he focuses his sight and does some Scrutiny/Revelation would he now understand approximately what the Dominate discipling is and how it works?

>>53468202
>If it ever comes out.
keep on whining

>>53468857
PMS tells him she's doing something, and who she's doing it to.

He probably activates both Ruling Arcana in active Mage Sight (or all 3 if he gets a third from his Legacy), to see what all of the fuss is about.

He sees the dominate under under one of his Arcana (probably Mind or Death) and he sees some representation about what's happening. Probably some mystic link between her and the person she's influencing, meaning he can immediately read it as a Mind power, given it fits under Mind.

However he can't tell if it's telepathy, mind-reading, domination, or whathaveyou without the merit, so he he pulls out Focused Mage Sight and stares at her like a total creeper. Scrutiny tears away all of the Opacity, and then when he performs Revelation he discovers she's using some kind of mystical undead blood power to hypnotically dominate the mind of the other person.

>>53468857
>would he now understand approximately what the Dominate discipling is and how it works?

Under Deep information, there is.

How the Arcanum used relates to the Mystery — for example,
using Death Sight to scrutinize a vampire’s ghoul will
reveal Deep Information relating to the undead blood in
the subject’s system, and any powers the ghoul has gained
from it. Using Fate Sight to assess a changeling’s powers
will reveal that they are formed by mystical bargains

>>53468917
no Pms tells him something happened. It doesnt reveal who did it or who it was done too.

He then has to active Active mage sight and see if he can see it via whatever arcana lens he is viewing it through, if he is using death/mind (?) he then can see the dominate.

he can then use focused mage sight to tell its a mental dominate effect, what the person has been commanded to do, blah blah blah.

>>53468991
From the Signs of Sorcery document linked with the "I can see for miles and miles" Open Dev blog post

"Peripheral Sight does not give the mage insight into the nature of the phenomenon, but the location of the effect is apparent: if a vampire activates one of her Disciplines, for example, any mage watching would know that there was something supernatural about her. If the source of the effect is invisible (such as a ghost in Twilight), the mage knows where it originates from even if she cannot see the ghost. A mage can even see the presence of a Mystery in a photograph or a video, or through a scrying window or reconstruction of the past via Postcognition or the like."

>>53469022
quoting something that will never appear, good job.

>>53469022
>Nor does Peripheral Mage Sight give any >clues
>as to what just happened — only that magic >is
>afoot

Actual book in print

>>53469065
I'm happy to interpret that in light of the blog post as reading more talking to the qualities and innate nature of the phenomenon, rather than its geographic location.

>>53468917
>>53468928

The sight seems to be the strongest aspect of the mage template. Knowledge is power and all that.

>>53469143
It's the cornerstone of the entire gameline.

>>53469022
I don't see anything here implying the target of the discipline could be known.

>>53469158
I want to run a game but I'm kind of intimidated by the scope of the system. I've been running a mortals game for my friends to teach myself the core system.

I may take the plunge when Signs comes out.


I love the mage shit posts. It's actually kind of educational

>>53469227
>when signs comes out.

2034 m8

>>53469143
>The sight seems to be the strongest aspect of the mage template. Knowledge is power and all that

Don't forget that mages cannot turn off PMS.

Whether they like it or not, they know about EVERY little active supernatural event in their vicinity. Within the CofD, particularly any decent sized city or active area, the pinging would be incessant. There's a reason why mages are usually ornery and paranoid. Other splats should be thankful that mages are usually more curious than violently aggressive.

Also, if a wizard is staring at you, run away as fast as you can.

>>53468294
>riggered first by someone casting a spell to get rid of their bad breath

Halitosis serves the Lie.

One does not see the Truth of reality and command it with a whim, and then forget his Tic-Tacs at the Consilium meeting with at least some repercussions.

>>53469492
Signs of Sorcery also talks about the limitations of PMS. Unless the phenomenon is happening within your normal sensory range of perception, it has to be an extremely potent event to trigger.

Such as an Awakening, the summoning of a Supernal being, or the Manifestation of a high Rank ephemeral entity.

However Mages are still going to be massive busybodies, so use your powers in public at your own peril. If there's anything worse than fucking with the Masquerade (or whatever it's called now), it's an EXTREMELY interested Moros getting all up in your undead guts.

>>53469517
>Unless the phenomenon is happening within your normal sensory range of perception, it has to be an extremely potent event to trigger.

ANY active supernatural phenomena, event or power in a mages sensory range will trigger his PMS. Bigger event will trigger a bigger "ping."

>>53469492
Don't mages attract oddities/mysteries related to their paths as they grow in Gnosis? (So a Moros would be like a lightning rod for ghosts, a Thyrsus for spirits and cryptids, etc.)

>>53469531
That's... What I said.

>>53469544
That's a potential aspect of your Long-Term nimbus.
However you could just as easily as a Moros find yourself accumulating meaningless transitory wealth, or have people fawn over your hot body or have people frequently physically confront you as a Thyrsus.

>>53469544

Your long-term nimbus will have narrative effects on those around you. Your Wisdom and level of sympathetic connection will determine who will be affected.

At 6+ Gnosis, the effects of your long-term nimbus start to have more impactful results.

For instance, an Obrimos' home might tend to be very hot or cold, or you cell phone reception might range from nonexistent to receiving signals from across the globe. At Gnosis 6+, if the mage stubs his toe in the shower, it may trigger a minor earthquake or tornado in his neighborhood.

>>53467763
>>53467810
>>53468003
>>53468279
Paradigm just means don't be lazy, fluff your shit. In my game for instance, the Hermetic player can only scry things with a reflective surface or by drawing a circle somewhere. He's used everything from the rearview mirror of another player's truck, to a puddle in an alleyway for this purpose.

Another player uses powers based on Shinto and Buddhism. She meditates and carries around ofuda.

Another player uses powers based on Aztec mythology. He does Jojo poses.

>>53469791
Its usually "ST may I" bullshit. You get a fucking shit ST and your boned right from the start.

>>53469912
Well thats not how its supposed to work and that's stupid. Its supposed to just mean "Be thematic" so not everyone with Mind 3 plays exactly the same.

File: It has begun.png (224KB, 880x354px) Image search: [Google]

224KB, 880x354px

It has begun

>>53469912
if you have a shit st you should probably just leave the group anyway

>>53469912
You get a fucking shit ST and your boned right from the start.

Isnt that true for all games ever?

>>53471060
why would i ever play ascension??

>>53471142
Why would you ever reply that to my post?

>>53467490
has mage supremacy a concept within the Temenos?

Milwaukee storyteller from a couple of threads here

Campaign said there was 10 on 10 combat between two milwaukee anarch gangs (blood brothers + the union) and even though i simplified it to 1 on 1 combat with every "wound" killing an combattant its jsut AWFUL

I really really dislike the combat and i dont think my players enjoyed the combat scenes either

How do i deal with this?

Just skip the combat in the "by night" book?

Paraphrase combat scenes or shorten them (like i did before)

Any advice?

>>53471865
Also why the FUCK are the values of the weapons not in the V20 corebook im so triggered

Are there any official rules in V20/D20 for getting free physical merits with Vicissitude? Player is asking and I'm not sure if I should still make them cost XP or not

>>53469656
>>53469573
>>53469544

Important aspect: Having a Shadow Name makes it so that the Nimbus leak targets your mystical life, rather than your mortal one.

File: Bandora FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIRE.gif (639KB, 480x360px) Image search: [Google]

639KB, 480x360px

>>53471045
... Pentex controls kermit? NOOOOOOOOO!

>>53471879
What do you mean by 'values'? Like, the damage ratings? >>53472090

>>53472090
No, Vicissitude does what it says on the page. If it doesn't say 'gives Physical Merits' then it doesn't give Physical Merits.

>>53472452
damage ratings + how much ammo it holds + weapon range

>>53472489
Those are in the book bro look harder.

>>53472504
>>53472489
And by look harder I mean it's on page 281, sorry for being rude

>>53472514
>>53472504
Thanks man

I was used to having a list at the end of the book from cthulhu so thats why i looked there

Reposting this from the old thread

So in V20 if I'm playing a Tremere that's managed to learn Visisitude, could I use the Blood Penny ritual on a bunch of those flat glass marble things you find in craft stores, hide them in my body to draw out later when I cast the ritual that condenses my blood to artifically increase my generation? Could i wear sub-dermal armor like a steel plate on the breast bone & kevlar/stab-proof material. What other bullshit could I pull off? In the idea of making myself a unholy terror/super prepped blood god.

File: VtM 1e 6.png (2MB, 1277x1652px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1277x1652px

Don't suppose anyone here would know what kind of sunglasses these are? I'm talking about some specific brand which resembles them the most, to be clear.

>>53472090
>>53472457
I'd let people use Vicissitude as an excuse for how they got some supernatural merits or something but they'd still have to pay the XP cost.

>>53474207
Matrix Top Heavy Sunglasses are a close match in style.

File: 3zdxdm38j.jpg (209KB, 723x1000px) Image search: [Google]

209KB, 723x1000px

>>53474360

Bit too rectangular, IMO. These seem to be more oblong in shape.

>>53474207
>>53474434
helena a shit

toreador a gay

>>53474434
The thing I was looking at from the first picture was the wide frame especially above the nose. The second picture is an entirely different design of sunglasses. Regardless, I doubt there's a brand that is 100% a match, I wouildn't think Bradstreet referenced real fashion for his pictures.

>>53474528

Might as well ask the man himself then.

>>53474434
>>53474207
Pretty sure those're supposed to be Ray-Bans my dude

>>53474192
why i hate masq players

>>53474192
You can do anything if your storyteller allows it

>>53471865
Dark Ages 20th companion has rules for simplified combat.

>>53475086
Other than the 'hardened' rule for the simplified combat, I like it. But unless you're dishing out HUGE amounts of damage, you're going to be nickel-and-diming a guy to death with 1 or 2 damage a pop.

So how about those changelings, huh guys?

>>53475485
random abuse victims, or poofy sad bastards scared of winter...

>>53475485
Interesting enough, but really weak in 1e.

>>53475713
Weak as shit but capable of rolling like 20+ dice for actions with some of the better, albeit boring, dice puff powers. All the cool powers don't give dice buffs and end up being less effective because of it. Then top it off with peak bad editing and you've got CtL 1e. I still love the game for some reason though.

If a 2e requiem vampire wanted to use a devotion or other power with a higher vitae activation cost than their blood potency allows them to spend in a single turn, which of the following is right?

1. They can't use it, as they can't pay the vitae cost.
2. They can use it, but the vitae must be paid over multiple turns.
3. They can use it, the vitae spending limit only applies to things with scaling costs.

>>53475897
2

>>53475485
One of my favorite splats, fluffwise. A bit underpowered though. Although that's part of the theme.

>>53475485
Not to fond of it myself - the fact that every character is essentially an abuse victim I feel really limits you. At least the other splats offers more variety in the kind of character you can bring to the table before you get into powers.

>>53475086
Could you give me a short summary?

I dont have the rules on hand rn

Ok so I have an idea for a Hunter Compact/Banisher Cult called "AntiMa". It should be clear what I want them to be a send-up of, but let's just say the phrase "Mage Privilege" is a part of their vocabulary. Any ideas on how I should flesh out this Idea?

>>53476022

I've always encouraged alternate readings. There's a Storytime on the changeling forum of OPP (Malibu Dream House) where two of the characters had mostly "positive" durances and I'm working on Soldier character who's durance was basically "The Last Starfighter" meets "Platoon." Plenty Traumatic, but not because of his keeper.

>>53476049
I'm at work but I'll get to it. Basically, you use pool to calculate damage values and subtract a soak value with exceptions made for armor.

>>53476130
Thats basically v20 combat rules

Idk maybe i'll just raise damage numbers so its over faster

>>53476123
Maybe add a few other Supernatural splats who were oppressed by Mages? Like a Vampire who got turned into a lawnchair or a woof who's pack got killed by a Mage's Spirits.

>>53476022
>abuse victim
Some times you were just a slave! Or you were a warrior general constantly in battle. You aren't always a rape victim, but you didn't exactly have a good time having your soul ripped out and your body deformed.

So how does oWoD changelings compare to nWoD changelings? Both lorewise and "in action"

What the hell would this guy be in the WoD/CoD?

http://www.scp-wiki.net/drclef-member-page
http://www.scp-wiki.net/clef101

>>53476692
I'd say he's a Mage-hating Hunter who got hit by some sort of long lasting, paradox tainted spell.

>>53476241

Vampires are self obsessed enough, but Woofs aren't given to whining.

Perhaps a Changeling who is "Triggered" because Mages remind them of the keepers - but the truth is they've never even met a Mage (besides the Banishers pulling the strings.)

Many of them are psychics, thaumaturges, or other sleepwalkers lucky enough to get the runner-up prize in the superpower lottery

A promethean tried to join them once but she was run off and accused of being one of THEM.

The people behind this are "Pathological" Banishers - the "Awakened wrong" kind.

"Ideological" Banishers find them horribly incoherent and incapable of understanding the concept of a "Fellow Traveler" - If you're not an "Ally," you're the problem.

>>53476123
In-universe, the concept is completely nonsensical, so the only reason to use it is for cheap laughs; in that case, I doubt you actually need anyone's advice.

>>53475602
>>53476022

Is this abuse meme something related only to nWoD changelling? A friend of mine wants me to get into Changelling (oWoD) and she never mentioned anything remotely related to this shit.

>>53476797
I figured he's some kind of epic Hunter as well. But he could also be a Stigmatic (his Stigmata is his head being replaced with weird things in pics and video) who happens to be really freaking good at hunting Mages/Witches, so the Global Occult Coalition (or whatever Conspiracy replaces it in H:tV) augmented him with a bunch of Supernatural Merits and Endowments. He could be a borderline Loyalist Deviant.

Tell me the way a True Fae might fuck with a Mage without killing him (on purpose)

Do any books describe locations in the Abyss other than that one clock tower of those left-handed clock Mages?

>>53477043
In nWoD you get kidnapped, raped in the ass for like 200 years, then twisted and mutated and released back into the world.

>>53476152
Yeah, but you only take one roll and then calculate based upon known values. I'll get them up to you when I can but I'm at work right now.

Also, check previous threads. Someone posted them within the last two weeks.

>>53477043
OwoD changeling is merely about child prostitute satyrs.

>>53477114
Offer him secrets about the Hedge that will make him powerful but gloss over the danger that it poses to his Awakened soul.

>>53476939
>Perhaps a Changeling who is "Triggered" because Mages remind them of the keepers - but the truth is they've never even met a Mage (besides the Banishers pulling the strings.)

You don't need to make it a Banisher plot. Low Wisdom Acanthus Mages are prone to behaving like the Gentry: maybe the Changeling had a bad run in with one?

>>53477043
>A friend of mine wants me to get into Changelling (oWoD) and she never mentioned anything remotely related to this shit.

oWoD Changelings are a bunch of otherkin attention seeking faggots.

nWoD Changelings are those who escaped after being kidnapped and tortured by eldritch abominations.

>>53476692
Probably a Mage in both. Technocrat in oWoD and a Banisher working with one of the Hunter Conspiracies in nWoD. Guy's a Reality Bender which is pretty Mage-y in concept. Although I second >>53477081 with the Endowments

>>53477264
Thanks!

File: DAV20 Companion Combat.pdf (4MB, 1x1px) Image search: [Google]

4MB, 1x1px

>>53476049
Here's a print PDF of it. Basically it's...
* Roll attack and dodge. Subtract dodge from success.
* If 1 success, hit. Any successes are added as extra damage. Damage is not rolled, but is flat damage: a 4L weapon with 2 successes is 6 damage.
* Subtract the Hardened rating (a natural damage reduction, calculated based on Stamina and some stuff)
* Then subtract armor.
* Damage is reduced to a minimum 1.

That's more or less it. Reduced to two rolls, more or less.

>>53477622
The big thing about him in the lore is that he could be a lot of things, including a regular but veteran Hunter who is shrouded in myth. It's entirely possible that he really did use some neurochemical and special effects to simulate a Mage attack.

And if he was a Banisher, he'd know that his simulated attack would not be remebered due to Quiescence. Unless those muffins and coffee are all somehow Imbued with that Prime spell that makes you a Sleepwalker. Or only Sleepwalkers can attend the seminar.

>>53477568

No I mean the only mages he's ever actually met are the banishers who "lead" AntiMa.

He's heard stories from fellow changelings comparing mages to the gentry, but has no real-world experience.

It's not entirely unfair for Changelings to consider Mages bad news, though.

So i've been reading the Silver Ladder Splatbook, and I can't help but be reminded of the Technocracy when I look at their philosophy. It's not the same, of course, but I'm noticing some overlap in terms of how the two groups think. "Humanity should be empowered and not have to kneel before monsters or nature" and all that.

I know mages are powerful, but are they legitimately feared by the other splats?

Do the others even know of one another?

>>53478034

Depends on the splat and their experiences

>>53478034
It varies from book to book, but I think the current consensus is that some Mages know a great deal about the other splats, and the other splats don't know that much about Mages other than the fact that they exist, are very powerful, and should be avoided. From what I can tell, Mages don't really give a shit about the other splats and everyone is inclined to keep it that way.

>>53478034
The various 1e Mage stereotypes seems to suggest yes.

Ventrue argue highly against using the Disciplines against them
Changelings deem it unwise to even get to know them
Demons compare Mages to a suicidal Fort Knox invasion.

of course stereotypes are just that.
Stereotypes.

>>53478259

Actually, a Demon actually has just as much to offer a Mage as Vice Versa, and they are similar in terms of power..

File: Stereotypes.png (383KB, 697x319px) Image search: [Google]

383KB, 697x319px

>>53478343
I don't disagree.

I'm just typing out what was written in the core-book.

>>53478034

Depends largely on your personal WoD.

I usually say that Mages are so rare other Splats don't see them much. The Werewolves in the Sept of the Green might know of the crazy Verbena lady sharing Central Park, but other than one utterly failed raid on her sanctum they've given her a massive berth.

Think like 1/750k people awaken as a Mage. They often have Sorcerers drawn to them, however, and those linear magicians often gain inspiration from true magick. In NYC you only have like ~10-20 mages, half of which will be $yndicate Technocrats safeguarding NYSE and the local corps.

File: Hunter Stereotypes.jpg (181KB, 500x1143px) Image search: [Google]

181KB, 500x1143px

>>53478473

Stereotypes are always fun

What could Santa Claus be in the WoD/CoD? In the latter, I think he could be an epic Changeling who has moved on from whatever trauma he has suffered long ago and now uses his vast powers and resources to help others dealwith their hardships. As for his stats, I was thinking about something like this:

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/349384-think-of-fictional-characters-and-say-what-they-would-be-in-cofd?p=787167#post787167

>>53478669
A Beast that has a Hunger for Punishment and is horribly bad at it

>>53468003

You say you've never run into it but your guy's paradigm is 'Fire Magic'?

Sounds like you don't know the rules if so, because that's a spell and not a paradigm.

Paradigm is like, 'I have a fire gun I made' or 'I do firebending martial arts just like Avatar'.

Even a Hermetic's magic is probably staff-channeled or via weird words, not just 'I move my hands' like it's Elder Scrolls.

>>53478669

Santa Claus is an urban legend just like Bloody Mary or the Jersey Devil. One of the 'Minor Splats' like Shapechangers or Immortals.

>>53478712
>not just 'I move my hands' like it's Elder Scrolls

There's arguably hand gestures.

File: Dark Census.jpg (115KB, 821x378px) Image search: [Google]

115KB, 821x378px

>>53478529

There's somewhere between 2-10 thousand mages in the world in the OWoD. NWoD gives us this census.

Out of that number, I presume the majority to be mortals who've had supernatural experiences or minor templates.

Of the 500 or so who in the given example who have a major template, I presume half to be Vampires.

>>53478712

He was more of an Hermetic house flambeu, so he would mostly say a words in Enochian and do firebased magic.

A light spell made of fire bugs, fireball, heat his fingers to cauterize wounds and the like.

Point was i never run into player struggling to fit an effect with their paradigm be that on the DM side or Player side. Either the effect was possible in that particular time/form under the paradigm or not.

>>53478712
>not just 'I move my hands' like it's Elder Scrolls.

Actually move your hands like elders scrolls is perfectly valid.

OOC: Rules wise he is just moving his hand to make the mudras to cast magic.

While IC: He the symbols he make with his hands evoke different kinds of spells.

>>53478768

I think even 250 vamps is a little high for New Orleans. 250 is like NYC's five boroughs. I go with 1/50k for Vampires, and then 5x that or more for ghoul population. That gives 6k in the USA.

That's a personal belief though, not a splat number.

File: mage fags.png (291KB, 585x307px) Image search: [Google]

291KB, 585x307px

mage fags will defend this

>>53478698
What does he do when it's not Christmas, then? Does he simply let his Horror (which I assume is the Krampus) starve until it goes on a rampage?

>>53478727
Could be. What sort of Minor Splat though?

File: lancer.png (392KB, 600x527px) Image search: [Google]

392KB, 600x527px

>>53478952
Magefags defending M20?

Oh the hilarity

>>53478736
>>53478803

While I agree hand gestures are certainly possible as a foci, they seem more like something a higher-Arete mage would be able to do rather than a rookie with 2-3 Arete. I consider 'discarding foci' to be ditching the 'bullshit' that comes with being a wizard.

An Etherite can just move some greebles to change an effect rather than a rebuild, while an Akashic might just do some punches to shoot fire rather than an elaborate Kata.

Thus Arete is a big gauge of how easy magic is for you in a roleplaying environment same as it is in the crunch.

>>53478776

Fair enough. I think the limitations of paradigm are really what keep Mages from being the 'hypersplat' that rekts all others, but that's all based on the type of ST you are and type of game you run. Anything's valid.

>>53478976
as someone who has never played mage, and knows nothing of the fluff.

What makes it good?

>>53478952
>certain people
>we like to portrait normal people as abormal retards!
>surely this is going to convince them to adopt our entire worldview!

>>53478999
>While I agree hand gestures are certainly possible as a foci, they seem more like something a higher-Arete mage would be able to do rather than a rookie with 2-3 Arete. I consider 'discarding foci' to be ditching the 'bullshit' that comes with being a wizard.

Hand gestures are hand gestures. Discarding Foci is willing magic on its own, no limbs required. It just happens.

File: Sidious.jpg (156KB, 847x1200px) Image search: [Google]

156KB, 847x1200px

>>53479010

THE POWAH

>>53478952

OMage is great in spite of Brucato, not because of him.

NMage, however, would collapse if it were given to someone like him.

>>53479072
whos him

File: Phil Brucato.jpg (11KB, 200x200px) Image search: [Google]

11KB, 200x200px

>>53479082
>whos him

>>53479095
>Phil Brucato
wikipedia doesnt tell me anything about him
is he a sjw cockmongler or whats up

>>53479132
He loves food

>>53479141
That doesnt tell me a lot about a person

>>53479010
>as someone who has never played mage, and knows nothing of the fluff.
>What makes it good?

What make M20 good? It has rules for martial arts and.....passable art.....that about it.

What makes Ascension good? Its a game about playing any kind of practitioner you can think off. You can run from a gritty Constantine-knock off to Spelljammer vs Space marines.

The rules are so modular that you can make lots of different feelings with it and is WW first "Toolkit" game and they never quite replicate.

Even the setting in is microescale like the rules are up in the air letting you run mostly whatever you want. Its incredible flavorful because it makes the player having to give magic a style of some sorts or at least a theme to it.

Its downside is that is extremely taxing on the DM, and if you are looking for a "read-and-play" this game is not that.

>>53479166
Father's thrusting cock

>>53478952

>this is somehow a problem
>even if it is a problem, it's somehow a fatal flaw that needs immediate addressing

What's wrong with you people?

Running CofD for the first time. What is the best way to.
1. Keep suspense
2. Give just enough clues
3. Dealing with Mary Sue's
4. Not be that GM

>>53479082
>whos him

He is the kind of person that those labels of "This is just a game not real life" were made for. He is the current developer of the M20 and decided that he didnt want to make Nephandi playable not because of thematic conflicts but because he fears people would became real life dark wizards.

He is unprofessional to the point he cut important material in the game just to write sections on how we should only buy food from organic or small businesses.

He is the Rob Liefeld to mage´s deadpool. Anything good that came from Ascension is was made by more intelligent mature people grabbing his concept and expand them or just by accident.

>>53479132
Brucato's kinda just... he's not a crazy SJW or anarchist. He's just... out there. Like, his writing style is awful, and he's new agey enough that he believes that 'playing as bad people will give you bad energy and make you evil in real life'. It's part of what's written in the Nephandi portion of the M20 book IIRC. Also, he's not terribly good of a writer, and has a tendency to drone and self-aggrandize (like putting the sidebar about eating local food, eating a haunch of venison for immersion, but not putting in some actual, necessary rules for M20). Plus he's pretentious enough to have changed his fucking name to Satyros. Legally.

>>53479132
>is he a sjw cockmongler
To put it mildly.
>>53479072
>NMage, however, would collapse if it were given to someone like him.
Fortunately, we have the great Komodo Exarch as the developer.

>>53479205
I dont think its a fatal flaw but it doesn't add anything to the game or to the fluff

I don't play mage - i play vampire and cthulhu - and my perception of gender is up to me as a player or as a gm

And why is it a paragraph and not 2 lines of - we believe the traditional construct of gender doesn't belong in this setting

If you think about it its really only there to encourage the 0.1% to do whatever they want - which isnt something they need to be told and wasting printing space for everybody else

File: Back2Tumblr.png (308KB, 546x700px) Image search: [Google]

308KB, 546x700px

>>53479205
Hello newfriend.
Now get out.

>>53479209
>Running CofD for the first time. What is the best way to.

>2. Give just enough clues
Always give a characters a path to follow, not completely dead end no matter how much they fail the roll. If they fail the roll just give them a longer path to the solution.

>3. Dealing with Mary Sue's
What your definition of mary Sue for CoFD?

>4. Not be that GM
Understand that noone cares about YOUR plot as much as their own characters plots.

>>53479323
i think the last part is an important thing to realize for every dm

if the characters want to experience virtual romance instead of pursuing a murder case just let them - as long as everybody is invested and having fun its fine imo

>>53479323
Mary Sue as in nothing will likely phase them, and they don't really embrace flaws in their characters.

>>53479300
Yeah, I agree, it's sorta unnecessary. But I just ignore it. It's the same as their penchant for using "she" as the neutral pronoun, but updated cause no one thinks that's controversial anymore. Definitely is taking up space, though.

>>53479320
kek dude

>>53479421
That is not a mary sue in any sense of the word, that is a poor player.

>>53479300
>If you think about it its really only there to encourage the 0.1% to do whatever they want - which isnt something they need to be told and wasting printing space for everybody else
Amazingly enough, anon, people DO need to be told this, because there are more than a few players that will tell you that you are playing pretend wrong because the rules don't allow it.
What you think is obvious often isn't to the rest of the world; that's basically the mantra of this board, with it's gross lack of self awareness.

>>53479421
>Mary Sue as in nothing will likely phase them, and they don't really embrace flaws in their characters.

Thats not exactly a Mary Sue. But going by that kind of player there is little you can do to deal with that kind of player IC. Either kick them out of the table or if that not an option give them as little spotlight as possible and only in combat.

If you gotta deal with that concept IC and there is no way around it make the environment react to his flaws. Is he a loner super bad-ass gunman/samurai who only lives to combat? Well the socially people (even supernatural society) will treat him as weirdo.

If he just speak 2 words and mostly threatens people then, said people will overreact to him and overcompensate by closing door on him, avoid him or just get bigger/more muscle to counter him in case things turn violent.

mages are the biggest mary sues

>>53479504
Come on dont pretend transgenders dont exist in Vampire with crossdressing Tzimisceres, etc.
>>53479439
I mean i also ignore it but in the town i live - marburg - theres a lot of that stuff everywhere and it only serves a very small number of people and takes up a LOT of space

Theres lgbt posters everywhere and its really triggering after living here for 3 years

How the fuck can the Garou actually try to get Impergium going again in the modern day and age? Putting aside the other factions at play in oWoD, wouldn't contemporary humans pretty much annihilate them in a direct confrontation?

>>53479737

Eh, what does it matter? I'd rather have posters of nice, peaceful, and generally positive stuff than have nothing.

And, i mean, while it may seem like the fight is over from where you and I are sitting, it's clearly not. Noch keine Homo-Ehe, Brudi, vergisst du?

>>53479272
Well im glad i dont have to read the mage books then
>Plus he's pretentious enough to have changed his fucking name to Satyros. Legally.

Legally? If so the guy is mental

>>53479791

Garou talking bringing the Impergium back again is like muricans talking about making america great again.

>>53479811
Mir doch egal ob es hier in Deutschland keine Homo-ehe gibt, die können doch nach Holland gehen wenn das wichtig ist

Und ganz ehrlich die Steuererleichterung ist auch nicht die Welt

Mich betrifft es nicht also interessiere ich mich wenig dafür und es stört mich wenn menschen ihren Kampf jeden Tag vom Weg von meinem Zimmer zur Uni austragen, das ist einfach assoziales Verhalten

>>53479737
I don't, but how many people you see play them?
Using the lore as an example of pcs is incongruous; how often do you play a gender that is not your own?
How many times has it been accepted at a irl table without people talking shit? I've been gaming for almost 15 years, and I've never seen it be accepted out of hand, for myself or others unless it's a woman playing a male pc.

>>53479939
i've played a woman a couple of weeks ago with my group and i got a bit of shit

after that i played a bitchboy who only does stuff with magicks and connections

I got a bit of shit for both but after roleplaying well and having fun with the group it was fine

Yea i think its an issue but letting players play what they want without giving them shit isnt something that should be in the rules imo

Its like "hey guys dont spill your beer on other people and dont be a sperg"

its kinda self explanatory idk

>>53479939
>>53479993
besides my players dont read the rules anways unless theres a quick play version ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>53479815
Honestly, I don't think there's MUCH that's an improvement over Revised, in all honesty. It's also preachy on the 'alternate gender pronoun' thing, and for some reason Brucato likes writing incest into his fiction (vis a vis 'father's thrusting cock' coming up during an otherwise, seemingly positive, post-coital bit of fiction).

>>53480099
Dude imagine if people actually cared about pen and paper rpgs so people proofread them

If anything but D&D got analized and the results got public im sure there'd be an uproar for half a minute

>>53479993
>its kinda self explanatory
It's not, man, it's really not.
People in rpgs are fucking quick to tell you how you are doing it wrong, and people make more gaffes that you would think are common sense then what is in practice.
I remember people flipping out when the new D&D edition dropped and tranny elves was the new meme.

>>53480171
You've definitely dealt with different people than me then

>>53479289
>NMage
>Fortunately, we have the great Komodo Exarch as the developer.

Meh. I, too, used to worship at the Church of Dave when it comes to Mage, but no more.

I still believe Dave is one of the best CofD writers, both fluff and mechanics, and there's no doubt he truly loves Mage, but I'm becoming less and less impressed with him as a developer. Dave has fallen into the trap of over-promising and under-delivering. He promised that he would release antagonist material cut from the new core, Legacy updates, and the badly needed FAQ. It appears that none of these will soon see publication. I appreciate these items are unpaid work (although he certainly deserves to be compensate), but if he doesn't intend to release them in the near future, he should simply say so as to mitigate expectations.

Similarly, Signs of Sorcery, a paid supplement, has been in "development" forever, also with no end in sight. Tome of the Pentacle hasn't even begun writing, and we don't even know the name of the third supplemen.

RichT has indicated that Dave has been going through some personal issues as of late. That is unfortunate. However, Dave should have at least mentioned something earlier and/or someone else should develop Mage to keep the line moving.

Guys, I'm unsure if the following character would have Wits 6, or Wits 5 + special Merits for Crafting Plans.

He is a veteran Hunter who has survived decades of fights against extremely dangerous and cunning enemies, including Awakened who had prep time. He has convinced many people he has epic powers and legendary origins, but only has a few Endowments. He also has Status 4 in his Conspiracy, which is especially secretive and complex.

>>53480148
The problem with M20 is that Brucato had literally almost NO additional oversight. He's listed as developer and writer of the primary text. I'm also surprised the vocal WoD transgender community hasn't torn him apart for the dog-loving, runaway FTM transgendered character who is awfully written.

>>53480257
That's not Dave specifically, that's just OPP. Wraith20 was supposed to deliver, what, Q3 of 2014?

>>53480306
how many people does this transgender community consist of?

im sure theres not that many wod players in the first place which should make a sub community like that pretty small

>>53480257
Dave is that one guy from every FPS lobby that's trying to play the objective while the rest of his team all try to get sniping montages in the back of the map.
Only so much one guy can do for a gameline.

>>53480333
If you listen to the OPP forums, probably about half? I dunno. I know a whopping two transgender WoD players in real life, and they don't play with us anymore because of other OOC drama not related to their transgenderness.

>>53479791

They can't. The Weaver has already won the Triat war. Werewolf is about the Wyld and Wyrm fighting a losing war while the Weaver just keeps on spinning an unstoppable juggernaut.

The Technocracy, Human Government, and Camarilla's Masquerade are all Weaver-affiliated groups that have a stranglehold on the various splats.

Aside from having the best raw combat ability, being a wolf is literally suffering. Every normal person hates you like the plague, the Spirits are dicks, and Banes/Fomori actively try to corrupt you. Plus all your fellow Fera hate you for killing them all in the Raeg war.

The Impergium is basically a suicide mission to make the Garou great again, that'll end alot like building a wall: overbudget (in blood/corpses) and incomplete (World at war with the Garou).

In any event, a Werewolf attack on man, even if successful, destroys the Consensus and lets the Mages off the leash. Same with losing the Masquerade - a massive consensus breach lets all the Archmages in the Tellurian walk on Earth again and then it's off to the fucking races.

File: TheLostBoys-David.jpg (20KB, 400x300px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 400x300px

Was he a Brujah or a Caitiff?

>>53478669

Because of the running joke about Geist. I just say that Santa is the awakened avatar geist of a krewe and the krewe itself are santa's little helpers.

On the same christmas notion, Krampus I just say is a beast with the hunger for punishment though.

>>53480427
Im under the impression that this whole transgender thing is blown hugely out of proportion

Looking at statistics theres 4% LGBT in cali which is a pretty small percentile

I'm sure theres really nothing to worry or care about given that theres not a lot of people who are affected by LGBT problems

If you look at depressed or mentally ill people that number is higher and they dont get nearly as much attention

>>53480575
Except they're a huge face in our community. I know a significant number (like 10+) people who use RPGs as a form of social therapy. I don't GET what they get out of it. I think a lot of it boils down to 'gamers are already a minority, and an even smaller minority wants to be positively represented'. You should go to the OPP forum and read the thread about 'NuWW's edginess' and see the transgender discussion that happened.

>>53480638
That was depressed/mentally otherwise, not transgendered.

>>53480552
Gangrel

File: Dungeon-Master.jpg (175KB, 970x545px) Image search: [Google]

175KB, 970x545px

>>53478897
>>53478768
>>53478529
Oh are we talking demography? Because I fucking love demography. In my WoD, the numbers are as follows.

Mages: 1 in 250,000 [4 per million], leading to a global population of 30,000, counting those in the Umbra. Division is 77% Traditions and Crafts, 33% Technocrats, meaning just over 20,000 mystick mages worldwide. Population of Horizon is 1200 Mages, further subtracting from that number. Division of power leveis is.

Arete 5-6 [Masters in my game]: Less then 1% of Mages, 97 cosmos-wide across all factions [that are known of]

Arete 3-4 [Adepts in my game]: 64% of Mages

Arete 1-2: [Initiates/Disciples]: 35% of Mages

Sorcerers: Roughly 80,000-90,000 worldwide, don't use Sorcerer rules. Instead they know a list of static effects derived from the Spheres, or a few points in Enhancement. No Sorcerer has equivalent-Arete greater then 3, by that point they basically have to Awaken to get stronger.

Vampires: 1-10,000 across all factions [Camarilla, Sabbat, Kuei-Jin, etc]. Or about 700,000 worldwides.

Werewolves: A few dozen, not using any Werewolf fluff. They act more like Forsaken werewolves, patrolling the Near-Umbra to avoid dangerous spirit manifestations. Nothing against them, I just don't know their lore and their Triad is too powerful for the more toned down power level of my setting [for instance all gods are merely Master-equivalent and Masters of the Art don't even exist]

I have more numbers autism on the off-chance anyone cares.

>>53480575
You get lots of people with special snowflake syndrome who claim to be omnigendered gopherkin or whatever the new identity of the week is to feel unique, and these people are very, very loud in their attention seeking.

>>53480461
>Vampires
>ANY Vampire
>Weaver affiliated
Do you even know the lore?

>>53480638
Im not a forum guy but from a guy who struggled with depression before i think the positive part about RPGs is that its a social game and that you can be someone other than yourself when you play them

I've already undergone like 6 years of therapy when i started playing pen and paper and i wouldn't recommend it to anyone as serious therapy because theres a good chance you wont learn how to act normally when playing rpgs.

You might become happier but thats not the sole reason people go to therapy sessions - they pay for those so they can become a somewhat productive member of society

>>53480767
Vampires ARE canonically aligned to the Weaver. They are beings of static order. They're immortal, highly urban, rarely changing, dead, frozen creatures.

Vampires primary way of "fighting" the Garou is by pushing urban expansion.

They may not be consciously helping it, but for that matter neither if the Technocracy. The point is their interests are closely aligned.

>>53480638
>You should go to the OPP forum and read the thread about 'NuWW's edginess' and see the transgender discussion that happened.

Link?

>>53480790
Vampires are Wyrm creatures, and that's why they are hunted by the Werewolf in the first place, you ignorant.

The fact is that they don't even know what the Wyrm is /at least most of them) so they are just ignorant victims most of the time.

>>53480767
>>53480875

As >>53480790 states the Weaver is Stasis, and Camarilla Vampires personify stasis. Even the Sabbat are working actively in order to prevent an Antediluvian Apocalypse.

While the lore states the Vamps are Wyrm-Tainted I think that's pretty much just wrong in the way they otherwise present the Triat everywhere else.

>>53481084
then werewolves would stop hunting cammy vamps

>>53480845
http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-classic-world-of-darkness/1093829-is-vv-going-to-be-too-edgy

Read at your own peril.

>>53481143
>someone arguing that edgyness is something thats bad in a dark fantasy vampire game
???

>>53481141

Werewolves don't hunt the Camarilla. They hunt Pentex and agents of the Wyrm like Fomori, generally avoiding cities with some exceptions.

>>53481362
If you're a camarilla affilitated Vampire the werewolves will be your enemy and will kill you

dunno what ur on about

Is there a Sorcerer equivalent in CofD/nWoD?

Anything that is close to Mage without being Mage

>>53481421
Second Sight-ers.

I had considered making a Merit which permitted a Sleepwalker to join and learn the first 3 Attainments of a Legacy though.

>>53481421
WoD: Second Sight. Should be in the trove

>>53481200
Welcome to the modern WoD fan. They want WoD, but they want social discourse that fits their own narrow worldview and viewpoints.

>>53481362
Werevolves will KILL every single vampire they will find, with very few exceptions, they don't care or either know about vampire affiliations and factions, you smell like Wyrm, then you are their enemy and you must die.

Also there are plenty of Werewolves agents in the cities, tribes like Glasswalkers and Bonegnawer live there every single day undercover.

>>53481421
You could also use Witchfinders.

>>53481421
There are the Proximi Lineages from Mage.

What do werewolves think of mages? Both old and new

>>53481657
Old Werewolves will see the Technocracy as agents of the Weaver.
The Nephandi as agents of the Wyrm.

I guess that Marauders and Tradition mages will vary.

>>53481570
I mean they can still do that it all depends on the GM

Just as a GM tell your players there will be a Camarilla game and they should maintain their humanity to avoid fenzy cuz high society or whatever the fuck

>>53481657

something to do with knots

>>53481711
Yeah, but people want it in the books. People want to see people like they are. It's why all these transgendered characters cause such an uproar, because it's not <X> enough for some people, too <X> for others.

>>53481657
Dangerous prey, strange allies, & a nucience to their goals

>>53481657
Werewolves see Mages as potentially superior spirit workers.

The Thyrsus make for amazing shamans.
Very valuable to a Pack.

>>53481589
Is there a quick fix for making Witchfinders work with 2nd Ed?

Elemental Mysteries sucks in comparison to kinesis powers

>>53481781
No clue. I don't play using 2e on the rare occasions I get to play.

>>53481740

My understanding is that they hate Mages for being Spirit-Breakers. They twist and control Spirits rather than bargain and supplicate them.

>>53481397
>>53481574

Hating Vampires =/= Hunting Vampires.

Not only are Vampires VERY good social ninjas while Werewolves are literally outcasts whose rage scares most normal folk, they usually have no reason other than !!Wyrm!! to hunt Vamps, and often threaten their tenets and must range quite far from a Caern to hunt the Vampires in their normal environs.

Yes, a Wolf will kill a Vamp given the chance and without hesitation, but on the list of things to kill the Vamps aren't very high for the Werewolves.

Which splat has the greatest reasons to fear and hate Mage-kind?

>>53481942
mages

>>53480790
The anarchs would like a word with you.

>>53481942

Vampire of course

>>53481942
In general? Hunters.
They can't really take them on, any attempts to do so will likely involve running into Queiscence over and over again, and ultimately even if you take them out the rest of their secret society will likely take vengeance upon your asses.

Of Supernaturals?
Vampires.
The standard Mage partyline for half of the Pentacle (Ladder, Council, Mysterium) is that Vampires are vermin and should ultimately be wiped from the face of the earth for the sake of mankind's burgeoning Awakening. Or at least stopped from reproducing.

>>53477181
>>53477608
Why on earth would you play that?

>>53480257
This!

So after searching forums Dave said this on 26/9/2016

>I'm waiting for the errata'd book to drop. I've >done most of the FAQ already.

So the FAQ has been nearly done for 8 months.....and he is now unlikely to finish it because people asked about it on the onyx forum and he got upset.

Paid or unpaid work, i too have lost some respect for him.

Maybe somebody else *is* shadow developing Signs & Sigils like they did with Changling 2e....

>>53482088
Its actually better than oWoD changling to be fair..

>>53481942
Other Mages, and who says otherwise is just a magecuck trying to start a flamewar like always.

>>53481827
>social ninjas
The only reason why werewolves didn't destroy vampires is because they hide in cities, but an encounter with a werewolf in a city isn't impossible and in that case the vampire is in big trouble.

>hey usually have no reason other than !!Wyrm!! to hunt Vamps
That's more than enought to justify their actions, they don't think too much about it.
Stop forcing your reasoning at once, Werewolves are Vampires natural enemy and they will RARELY spare one for either reason.

A chance for a vampire to survive is either by being of high generation, or attacking a lone werewolf with a group of vampires, but werewolves usually move in packs.

Or trying to escape.

File: Papyrus And Sans.jpg (38KB, 630x630px) Image search: [Google]

38KB, 630x630px

What would pic related be in the CoD? I think would be Sin-Eaters. Sans' Geist would be W.D. Gaster, but I don't know what Papyrus' Geist would be.

Have any Mages ever decided to just found their own city? Seems like it's within their power & would help their cause

>>53482184
oWoD mages created their own planes of existance called Horizon realms.

>>53482182
? Demons, Beasts or Mage creations.

>>53482184
Yes. Powerful mages have created their own planets out in the Deep Umbra.

Archmages can do it on their own.

Tell me about your current games, anons. I need inspiration.

>>53482129
You gotta have a very shit taste if you label being a rape victim as better than anything. I mean you can dislike fairy tales or whatever you don't like about the old one but there's limits.

File: superf.jpg (135KB, 1000x515px) Image search: [Google]

135KB, 1000x515px

>Running a game of Mage [oWoD]
>Have a number of factions for the PCs to join with or fight against in broad metaphysical conflicts as well as more personal ones.
>PCs instead decide that all these philosophical issues are less important then the Sleepers, make their own goals effectively 'Ignore philosophy, protect humans'

I'm not sure what I think of this. All these chances for abuses of power or ideological extremism and their consistent philosophy is shepherding the ordinary, common people.

>>53482305
Dumbass players

Slap them

Regarding vampires and the Weaver, the Book of the Weaver states that vampires tend to have a mixture of Weaver and Wyrm taint, with one or the other being stronger depending on the vampire's proclivities (those with Humanity 7 or higher don't actually show up as Wyrm-tainted, for instance).

Regarding fighting the Weaver... well, the Apocalypse book presents one way to do it, by releasing the Balance Wyrm from its prison by performing a ritual in Malfeas. But that's clearly endgame material. Before that, I think the smartest choice is to try to bolster the wilder aspects of the Wyrm so that they tear into the Weaver's assets, while defending your own territory--for instance, it'd be very useful to damage relations between the Black Spiral Dancers and Pentex, preferably to the point of having them fight each other.

>>53482293
>>53482293
its a fucking meme you nobber, your more likely to have spent 100 years as a fucking lightbulb as you are to ve been getting bummed for them..

I prefer the theme of ive escape hell and dont want to go back (with a "omg somebody else is living my old life") theme than owod's im a fucking faerie, look at me!!!!

>>53482111
If they were, it'd be out by now.
Most recent Monday Meeting Notes mentions that DaveB's moving back to Mage 2e now, after doing a lot of work on Deviant & Co.

>>53482182
>>53482240
That reminds me. Could you do an Undertale-esque story in a CoD Chronicle? Undertale is kinda based on the monsters not being really evil for the most part, but the monsters in CoD are often evil by necessity or opportunity. I'm not sure what the power of Determination would be in CoD either.

>>53482305
>Complains about not having murder hobos with a god complex in the splat that gives characters the most godlike powers

Count your blessings & make enemies that want to kill sleepers. Don't bitch & moan because they decided to be decent people & not be dicks

File: 1450491398278.jpg (79KB, 467x453px) Image search: [Google]

79KB, 467x453px

>tfw you have all these ideas for your next game but no players.

>>53482305

This is a perfectly legitimate way to play the game.

I'd argue that a Technocracy game specifically lends itself to doing this. You're the MIBs out to protect the universe from horrific abominations.

Vampire and Werewolf both have their shares of Superhero-style games and those splats have logistical reasons why it shouldn't work well.

Mage has none of those limitations.

>>53482293
You clearly haven't read CtL; the whole point of the game is trying to move past the abuse you've suffered, in spite of everything that tries to remind you of it and/or pull you back into that abusive place you left

It's very well written.

Liking it more than owod Changeling doesn't mean you label being a rape victim as better than anything, it means you get more enjoyment out of underdog stories about people who are trying to get past hard times than you do out of magical otherkin or w/e oChangeling is actually about

>>53482358
That's like saying you dont want to say "I'm a fucking vampire, look at me!" when either playing requiem or masquerade. Or whatever other splat. It makes no sense to be honest, like it or not changeling is about fae and fairies got nothing to do with how you're describing nWoD changelings.

>>53482411

Write good fanfiction instead.

>>53482305
Isn't the whole point of Mage to help the sleepers to ascend?

>>53482436
>Classical stories about fae
>People get kidnapped and made slaves, pets, and playthings for faeries

>nChangeling
>You get kidnapped and made into a slave, pet, or plaything for a fae, and then escape
>The entire point of the game is how you deal with what you've experienced

>>53482468
addendum, based on a limited understanding
>oChangling
>One of your parents was a faerie! You are too! Go out and have fun!

Awakening > Lost > Requiem >>> Forsaken

>>53482088
I don't know why anyone would want to play oWoD Changeling either.

As for nWoD, the rulebooks make it clear that while you do have PTSD, and your kidnapper may or may not be trying to get you back, you still escaped, and now have a community of other escapees to support you and help get your life back on track. It all has a very nice "friendship in the face of adversity" theme going that I like very much.
Also, Changeling politics is ridiculously fun, as its based on the idea of making such a clusterfuck that the Gentry get confused and leave.

>>53482430
But what does that theme have to do with fae and this general theme?

I know very little about both changellings and I think that was obvious since the first post I made. That's why I ask so much questions.

I find the idea of playing fae in a modern fantasy setting attractive. Just like I find attractive the idea of playing vampires or werewolves or mages in a modern setting. From what you guys tell me nWoD Changelling has nothing to do with that, it's got it's own themes that make no sense or have any relationship with the mythical creature you're playing as. And to be honest I can play the underdog in any splat that isn't mage and in most games, if I want to.

>>53482535
Just play the 20th anniversary Dreaming; it's quite good, from everything I've seen of it, and no one's forcing you to play Lost.

>>53482358
>>53482293

I've played Changling a bit & my character were a country boy who was stolen by Herne on a hunting trip with his dad, & groomed into a horned hound tasked with hunting changlings, who eventually broke free with his pack

& a male model trying to make ends meet who took a job for the Leanansidhe, he ended up being having to support a marble pillar like Roman statue for a few years

You can do Changling without the rape

>>53482456

I don't think so. Mage doesn't have the apocalyptic feel of the other splats ever since Guide to the Technocracy came out.

The Technocrats have a fairly strong but still tenuous grip on consensus, while the other Traditions are trying to break that grip and get rid of paradoxical magic.

The theory holds if you 'win' the fight to change consensus you all ascend and all the sleepers awaken and it's kumbaya but there's nothing in the story stating that that's an actual thing. Some people may have ascended, but what is that?

Nobody knows. Nobody knows how to do it. It's all hubristic mages trying to attain ascension without ending up in quiet, but Mages have lots more free will than a Vamp or Wolf.

>>53482305
Just roll with it. Have some Nephandi cultists threaten a neighborhood. Or some crazy and powerful Marauder whose come to town, and they have to work with the Men In Black to stop him.

I think WtA would be a lot cooler if they had a similar concept to the Masquerade. Delirium just feels like a get out of jail free card.

>>53482401
Alternatively, you could just borrow the themes without using the Underground. The players would be a special Cell of Hunters that are not interested in killing the monsters, but learning about them and helping create a world where they can coexist with humans. Possibly a Network Zero focused Chronicle, with the antagonists being opportunistic monsters who want to take advantage of these well-intentioned Hunters, and more traditional Hunters who do not want an Unveiled Masquerade.

>>53482599
One of the litanies of the Werewolves called "The Veil" is basically Lupines equivalent of Masquerade.

Also, you cannot really count only on Delirium, some people may remember the "incident" and you would face conseguences in the future.

>>53482564
I'm just trying to know more about Lost, which makes little sense to me right now with the info I got from you guys. And your blatant antagonism for the old version and memes bout otherkins don't help me to take you seriously.

I'm of course going to play Dreaming, if I play changelling at all, for the same reason I play only oWoD: I don't know enough to be a storyteller myself and the ones who do in my group dislike the nWoD. But I'll like to know about the nWoD version in a non-memey way and that's why I asked.

>>53482535
In Lost, you play a Changeling, someone who was kidnapped and altered by fae, but is not, themselves, a fae, technically. That said, you do have very fae-like powers; they're all contracts of various sorts, and you use them by invoking them. The general aim of the splat is moving past your trauma, however you want to do that, although it's also perfectly viable to have a game focused on dealing with your trauma.

In Dreaming, you play a Changeling, someone who is descended from a Fae, and at some point in their life became a Fae themselves. Your powers are similarly contract-based, afaik, but the general aim of the splat is more about finding a way into the Dreaming, or something along those lines.

Neither one is better or worse, objectively, than the other, but a lot of people prefer Lost, because Dreaming has heavy Otherkin-y undertones

>>53482649
From what I've been told Dreaming also has a heavy fantasy vs banality theme a la Neverending Story that Lost must lack, as the fairies and therefore fantasy are clearly portrayed as a negative thing.

>>53482630
Sure, but that's like one person in a million. And no one would really believe in a crazy guy talking about werewolves unless they were wyrm agents.

>>53482599

They have 'maintain the veil' or whatever but I agree that Werewolf is the most soulless splat. I think part of it is that they inspire revulsion in most normal willpowered humans so fail to socialize much or be relevant in society.

I think the big thing is that unlike Mage or Vampire their enemy isn't themselves or man, it's a dumb mystical trinity and spirits. There's no Werewolf Sabbat or Government Agency hunting them into the Umbra.

I'd love to see an altsetting for Werewolf where the War of Rage is a new thing, and the shadow war is between the Garou and other Fera amid the glass towers and dark alleys. Or even a Homid-Lupine war.

>>53482742
Just don't pump your Rage up too high if you want to keep chatting with mundanes. Also, there are a lot more Kinfolk than there are Garou, so it's not too hard to maintain a social circle.

Also, there is a werewolf Sabbat: it's called the Black Spiral Dancers. And Pentex and certain Weaver corporations can come close to government agencies.

>>53482742
>There is no Werewolf Sabbat
What about Black Spiral Dancer you idiot?
>No Government Agency hunting them
Pentex has Fomori and Bane spirits all around the globe and their influence extends in both Physical and Spiritual worlds, and it's one of the most powerful firms in the world.

>>53482780
I agree that the Black Spiral Dancers kinda look like the Sabbat, but Pentex is not really the same as the government, inquisition, or the technocracy. They are evil dudes bent on fucking everything because evil, and they hunt werewolves because they fight against evil and not because they are a threat to the consensus.

>>53482775
>>53482780

Not him nor I'm defending what he says 100%, but sabbat are perfectly playable and their motivations understandable. They're edgy, but so are lots of human organizations.

Spiral dancers are just crazy evil nuts who want to cause the apicalypse for some reason.

>>53482775

I just don't feel the Black Spirals (One Garou clan among dozens, corrupted because lolwyrm rather than ideology) or Pentex (A corporation that again seems to be evil because lolwyrm and My$$$) really compare to the Sabbat or Government.

The Sabbat have a very legit ideology and are the other side of the coin: We are Vamp-Kings and must destroy the Antediluvians if we want to stay that way.

The Spirals and Wyrmites in general seem to be possessed by the Wyrm and intent on destroying everything for kicks, like the Nephandi except the Nephs aren't the big bad of a gameline.

>>53478768
If .5% of the population is supernatural, then what percentage if the population knows someone who is supernatural? Is there a mathematical model for this? I'm very curious all of a sudden.

>>53482742
>no Government Agency
There's Project Twilight.

>>53483121

I assume the .5 includes people who know about it.

>>53483121
All human beings in the modern world are within 6 degrees of connection with another. That is, I probably know Person A, who knows Person B, who knows C, who knows D, who knows E, who knows you, Anon.

So you could construct a model for a given percentage of the population using that rule of thumb I believe. Just plug in the percentage supernatural and then plug in the Rule of Six and see what it says.

>>53483121
According to the core book (Chronicles of Darkness), and this has been repeated by the Devs a few times, a massive proportion of the population DOES know on some level that the Supernatural exists.

It's just that the vast majority also wants nothing to do with it, and puts it out of their mind, eventually forgetting everything they saw.
Anyone can take the Occult skill, which grants some actual, genuine information about the Supernatural world.

According to Dave, anyone with a couple of dots in Occult knows of the existence of the Pentacle Mage Orders.

>>53482436

>I'm Mr. Vampire, look at me!

>>53483298
>"Existence is pain to a vampire John Dee. And we will do anything to alleviate that pain."

>>53483298
Fun fact.

Going strictly by the rules for Artifacts, a Meeseeks Box would be a 7-dot merit.
5 dots for Life 5, Mind 5, to create a living, thinking servant.
Then add in Conjunctive Fate's Conditional Duration for another dot so it dies when its purpose is complete, and Time 4's Time in a Bottle for another dot so you can squeeze in another reach.

Which means for a point of Mana and an Instant Action, you can use the Artifact to create a Meeseeks which will persist for up to a year, or until its purpose is complete.

>>53483294
>According to Dave, anyone with a couple of dots in Occult knows of the existence of the Pentacle Mage Orders.


... and will never, ever sleep soundly ever again.

>#bastardmages

>>53483294
And that doesnt' apply to my games, thank god. Mages are fuck awful.

>>53483415
What paradigm is Rick?

>>53483466
Rick would be a Void Engineer.

>>53483466
>>53483477
Rick is more like a Genius from Genius: The Transgression.

>>53483489
Technocrats are essentially the Geniuses of OWoD, anon.

If you're arguing CofD, then sure.

>>53483415

Considering that the Huntsmen from Changeling 2e are basicallly this already, i dont see the need for more.

>>53483555
The Huntsmen (at least as shown in the initial previews) can do a lot more than a Meeseeks. Hopefully they'll have more interesting personalities as well.

>>53483466

Blatantly Etherite. Sons of Ether are the definition of 'Sometimes Science is more art than Science'.

What is the worst thing that ever happened to VTM: the Talma'hera or the Kuei Jin?

>>53483466
Etherite, without a doubt.

He's staunchly anti-authoritarian, doesn't give half a shit about ethics or oversight, or regulation, or working well with others, thinks he can do "science" and create a RNA cocktail that'll fix everyone on earth by mixing together random animal's genetic codes.
Doesn't care about efficiency, or anyone else other than him understanding how stuff works, and has repeatedly stated his hatred of the Government.

He flies into space in a ship made out of garbage in his garage, for goodness sake.

How would one play a demigod in CoD? Would demigods be a Major or Micro Template? I think the Thors would be Major, while the Percy Jacksons are Micro. Setting-wise, they'd be like Pangaeans, but connected to the Astral instead of the Shadow.

>>53484143

>>53484012
Would be too tricky. Gods are too variable and differ in ranks.

This would just make Demi-Gods rather wonky.

>>53484012
That might work for an American Gods style game.
However you've got to deal with the problem of the knowledge that the Astral is just the collective subconscious, and that currently Pepe and Ronald McDonald are more popular and well known than Demeter and Janus.

Hey, trying to find that greentext story about that guy who played Vampires The Masquerade as a wannabe super hero, the red meteor or something weird?

>>53484165
>Ronald McDonald

>Ochemata of The Father

>>53484012
>>53484165
Your best bet, if you wanna keep to the setting, would be someone Claimed by a spirit related to whatever god; eg, Thor would be a Thunder-claimed.

Honestly, though, you're better off just playing Scion, since that's LITERALLY about playing demigods