/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>52221634
Bogpill?

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>>52221659
>Technocrats bow to Bogdanoffs
>In contact with True Fae
>Possess Malfean>like abilities
>Control Council of Nine with an iron but fair fist
>Own constructs & chantries globally
>Direct descendants of the ancient Verbena blood line
>Will bankroll the first cities in the Horizon despite the Avatar Storm (Bogdangrad will be be the first city)
>Own 99% of DNA editing research facilities within the Technocracy
>First Paradox>Free designer babies will in all likelihood be Bogdanoff babies
>both brothers said to have 215+ IQ, such intelligence on Earth has only existed deep in Tibetan monasteries & Autocthonia
>Ancient Indian scriptures tell of two angels who will descend upon Earth and will bring an era of enlightenment and unprecedented technological progress with them
>They own Nanobot R&D labs around the world
>You likely have Bogdabots inside you right now
>The Bogdanoffs are in regular communication with the Archangels Michael and Gabriel, forwarding the word of God to the Celestial Chorus. Who do you think set up the meeting between the chair of Prime & the Templar high command (First meeting between the two organisations in over 1000 years) and arranged the Chorister's leader’s first trip to Antarctica in history literally a few days later to the Bogdanoff bunker in Wilkes land?
>They learned fluent Enochian in under a week
>The Syndicate entrusts their tass reserves with the twins. There’s no gold in Ft. Knox, only Ft. Bogdanoff
>The twins are about 7 decades old, from the space>time reference point of the base human currently accepted by our society
>Have achieved Sphere mastery and are the only known practitioners of Sphere level 11, AKA the BogSpheres.
>In reality, they are timeless Archmages existing in all points of time and space from the big bang to the end of the universe. We don’t know their ultimate plans yet. We hope they’re benevolent beings.

>>52221742
So....... Bogdanoff supremacy?

>>52221789
Bogdanoff Supremacy. You might ask yourself... "Are we living on borrowed time?"

We always were, friend. We always were. The revelation of the BogSpheres is proof of that.

>>52221116
>>52221198
>>52221129
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gET11yaesmM

>>52221957
God does nothing about the Unnamed because God is the kind of father who loves his child despite being a mass murderer. He might even be proud of him.
>Rip the universe to shreds
>That's my boy

>>52222495
Unless God is an Archmage.

In which case

>Like father like son

>>52222536
>You know what they say dear, archmages will be archmages
>When I was his age I was destroying 5 universes every week and no one complained

Furries: the yiffening (werewolf apocalypse) question.
We're all rank one, have had some pack issues and my character thinks the pack alpha is useless. He doesn't want to lead but someone needs to and he doesn't trust any of the others to question the alpha. The alpha also happens to have lost the wolf at the last session and there was 2 weeks of downtime. How do I go about taking alpha? If he doesn't have the wolf back can I just assume the alpha position on the grounds that he isn't fit to lead? If I challenge him he will pick anything but combat and beat me.

>>52222495
>>52222536

Or God was just curious to see what would happen and let things roll on anyway.

I mean, does he ever interfere in things directly? Other than Hunters getting Imbued, I suppose.

Quick question- given that diablerie isn't accepted in the Camarilla, is there any reason NOT to start with as high a generation as backgrounds will allow, 8th? It seems you're really crippling your potential otherwise.

>>52223463
You'd get ate by a Cammie expecting to get away with it, it's a more valuable resource than you'd be equipped to defend against a 12th generation ancilla. And then an elder would blackmail him with it. They aren't morally opposed, they're pearl-clutching.

>>52223663
Requiemfag here. How does this stuff work? When you are say 12th gen and you eat 9th gen do you become 9th gen or just jump one point lower? And what is power difference beetween say 8th gen and 12th gen?

>>52223701
RAW is the diablerist jumps one point down, then there's just as much text encouraging ST fiat about jumping multiple steps if the gap between him and victim is more dramatic.

Could you give me any ideas for a one night game with a group of different supernaturals? My group is having an old member back today and I'd like to do something epic and special

>>52223463

No there isnt. Is the godstat of the game.

>>52222612

Make the master of challenge of your sept or sept alpha, if there isnt a master of challenge, to set a fair challenge between you guys.

This is not a automatic win though, loosing the wolf is a major drawback but it doesnt automatically make the alpha useless.

>>52224066
alien invasion, UFO parks itself over a city and occult empowered aliens begin wreaking havoc. Are your PC's bad enough dudes to save the city? why are they here? etc and soforth...

>>52224633
are they actually aliens? can the normies see them and the ship? if they're not, then what are they?

What the fuck is Bogdanoff?

>>52222495
More like Unnamed = oWoD Antichrist

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>>52224066
The weird science asshole splats teamed up and kidnapped them to experiment with sewing their different asses and mouths together.

>>52224688
Aliens is usually just the scientific term for spirits/umbrood.

If you're Awakened, you encounter spirits in the Umbra, but if you're Enlightened, you encounter aliens in deep space.

>>52221742
>Masquerade Violation

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>>52224964
yes, and?

Feedback requested on character for a new Horror:

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/793173-the-horror-show?p=1063730#post1063730

>>52225903
*character sheet

To answer the other Anon about the Nephandi, I love them because they're pure nihilistic evil. You can't negotiate or threaten them, or they're letting you do it to manipulate you better. Because theses assholes are intelligent (which is usually rare among nihilistic villains), and they know how to best play their cards.

I also quite love their core concept, the fact a human can Awaken his Soul to the realisation that his will can reshape the universe but there's no great Answer. He's still a sack of rotting flesh stranded on a rock in an uncaring universe, and whatever he does is insignificant. And so he descents, and seeks to bring his realisation to the masses.

It sure is quite edgy, but I think it's the fact that they're in MtAs, a game where you have so much power that you'll least expect a villain like this that makes me love them. And the fact that players almost too often underestimate them.

>>52226456
Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the Scelesti in Awakening like that as well?

Vampires: Observe, but do not engage. Threat level minimal.

Let's not mince words here: It's pretty damn obvious that vampires exist. Every city on the planet is choked with bloodsuckers, and most aren't as subtle as they think they are. In the largest cities, they've reproduced and spread indiscriminately Andrew Eldritch clones and Lestat wanna-be's are as common as black T-shirts and bad fashion sense. No matter how many witnesses the "Kindred" intimidate, coerce or manipulate into silence, tracking the vampires in a city with high technology is child's play. Video surveillance - heat signatures = presence of vampires. You do the math.

Despite the ease in tracking them, the Technocracy has grossly underestimated the role of vampires in the real world. Technocrats do not consider most of these "blood cults" to be threats. More importantly, they have no reason to know about millennia-old Ancient Ones waiting to emerge. Not like the Book of Nod is not available in paperback form. On the other hand, Watchers have seen evidence of the Camarilla in action. Vampires usually police their own kind, and sects that don't believe in the Masquerade are set upon by their brethren. Thus, the Technocracy can afford to regard vampires with ridicule. If the techies knew the truth, they'd mobilize their troops a bit quicker....

The only thing the Technocracy really requires concerning these creatures of the night is information. Just as any good police department wants to be informed of the largest gangs in town, the Union surveys and monitors local blood cults. Lacking the firepower to take them all down, the Technocrats merely watch and wait.

The Union attitude toward vampires may change, though, with the recent awakening of a beast of incredible power in the badlands of India. The Technocracy was forced to apply "Operation Ragnarok," the approval of any level of resource allocation and losses, in order to stem the advance of a single vampire!

>>52226516
I love how the Technocrat books are written as if from the perspective of a beleaguered, tired of your shit bureaucrat who's still ultimately an idealist at heart.

>>52226484
I think, but I've yet to read MtAw, I couldn't stand the font/layout of 1e.
I've still bought a PoD after discussions with DaveB about Hellblazer more than a year ago gave me enough trust in his work, but I've got too much books on my plate. It's one of the next I read, though.

Hey, what was the name of that Pacifist Blog thing. My friend is morbidly curious and I can't remember it for the life of me.

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Would pic related work?

>>52226979
The Plain

>>52227209

It can, I know I have the basic framework for it that I helped develop and play test a bit years ago, but that one got nowhere near done.

I wonder where my design notes went off to.

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How would you build pic related in the CoD? I think he could be a Horror of mid Potency, but also Integrity to represent his human mindset. He'd also have a Merit that lets him Risk Willpower, earn Practical Experiences and use the Code, effectively making him a honorary Hunter. His Right Hand Of Doom is a Relic that can summon a Rank 6+ Abyssal or something like that. But what Compact or Conspiracy would he join?

>>52227433
>But what Compact or Conspiracy would he join?
The Lucifuge are probably literally the only hunter group that wouldn't kill or dissect him for being a god damn monster. Hes too inhuman to fit with any of them.

>>52227334
Do you have a PDF or book for it?
Finding it isn't exactly easy.

>>52227505
I dunno, the BPRD sounds more like Task Force VALKYRIE to me. And Hellboy is only inhuman in appearance. He thinks and feels just like you and me. But giving him Integrity might not be suitable, as that trait represents both mental stability and the soul's health. I am not sure if Hellboy has a human soul, or a soul at all.

>>52227571
Given that the BRPD is staffed with monsters its own Tier 3 organization might work best if you want to use the rest of the Hellboy shit. But pretty much every hunter group lacks a lot of nuance and is driven to kill or other wise abuse and hunt monsters, and hellboy, no matter whats in his head, is very clearly a monster.

>>52227549
I don't have it on me i'm afraid. It might be somewhere in the pastebin. The book is called hurt locker.

>>52227571
Half human. Through a witch. But his soul's still good enough that England recognizes him as Arthur's heir and lilies grow where his blood spills.

>>52226979
>>52227334
>>52227917

Hurt Locker

Enjoy!

https://www.sendspace.com/file/zpv5xl

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>>52223701
>>52223876
This is true BUUUUUT they also introduced expanded rules in the V20 black hand supplement.

>>52224087
The Sabbat leadership keeps the fuckery down to a dull roar. If they want to go string up grandma from the local skyscrapers, give them a visit from the local templar and their flunkies. Beat one of them to the edge of torpor and then top him off with blood from their favorite ghoul. Remember, Sabbat are only allowed to destroy one another after Monomacy or a court judgement and those aren't always granted.

http://cautionarycolours.tumblr.com/post/158514839726/unsurpassedtravesty-prokopetz-pursuant-to-a

Kindred can hear your dick whistle

>>52229273
Glorious!

>>52229273
How awkward

For humans and vampires both, especially if the latter can "get it up"

why cant't vampires be mages? I want an abomination mage

>>52230752
Because God hates vampires.

>>52230766
Why did god create vampires then?

>>52230774
A prank to make Caine suffer gone too far

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>>52230752

>>52230800
Caine doesn't deserve this

>>52230834
Not everyone deserves God's gift of Magedom.

>>52230857
Caine doesn't need magedom though

>>52230800
>A prank to make Caine suffer
God literally blessed him, there are no downsides to Cain's "curse"

>>52230878
>>52230909
If a mage's Ascension is indeed reuniting with God as speculated, then God's curse could be interpreted Caine and his descendants never being allowed to join with God.

would a [formerly] jewish werewolf [based on Larry David / Jerry Seinfeld] work better as a Strider or a Glass Walker?

>>52231014
Black Spiral Dancer

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>>52231069

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>>52231089
You know they'd be Wyrm aligned pack. Search your heart, you know it to be true.

>>52231014
White Howler

>>52231140
Too much self important hubris to be BSD.

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>>52231174
silver fangs?

>>52230752
They technically can actually. Look up liches. I think black hand talks about them.

>>52231270
False.

The lich "royal sorcerers" of the east aren't actually Kindred. They are mages who have frozen their progress and achieved a state of immortality.

>>52221489

Archmages are, quite evidently, on par with God if you take into account 9-10 dot Spheres.
Perhaps, as others have already mentioned, God is merely an ascended mage, or the sum total of the Avatar collective, ready to receive new ascendants. Individual mages being individual shards of God.

One has to wonder if the "God" that cursed Caine was in fact the supreme extradimensional consciousness that the Chorus speaks of.
According to Werewolf, Jehovah is but a grand and powerful Celestine whom was responsible for Vampirism.

The cosmologies conflict, but Ascension seems to have the best frame for it, with Apocalypse as a close second. They both go out of their way to try and clarify a few things, while Masquerade tends to ignore it all.
Of course this ironically angers fans of Vampire.

>>52231627
>while Masquerade tends to ignore it all.
>Of course this ironically angers fans of Vampire.
I hate cross-overs so I like this

How would you try to shatter the Masquerade in a hunter campaign? Anybody have experiences of partially or completely destroying the Masquerade

I was thinking about releasing a Werewolf or a frenzied Vamp in a OJ Simpson tier trial that is being broadcasted to the world.

>>52231627
Oracles/Archmages, Exemplars/Archscientists, and Aswadim are all basically different names for the same thing, right?

>>52231627
>crossover cosmology
You went full retard.

>>52231673
You don't, because it's easy to explain away.

Vampire? PCP fanatic unleashed by terrorists.
Werewolf- WHEW BOY I hope you enjoy Lunacy! Everyone watching is going to go legit insane for a bit- mass death ensues, people freak out, but not, because nobody remembers, about the werewolf.

Also this is the BEST way to get horribly murdered by all the folks who like the masquerade- read; every supernatural. Have you ever seen a mage, a vampire coterie, and a werewolf pack argue over who gets to murder a guy? You will soon.

>>52231673
if you want to break the masquerade it's better to set up a vampire, that and you run the risk of turning the werewolf into captain america during the end of marvel's civil war even if they do get off, or making them out to be The Hulk at any time ever [a berserker that proves more dangerous to the people trying to hurt the Average Joe than the actual Average Joe provided you don't make them hulk out]

>>52231746
> because nobody remembers, about the werewolf.

Wait even through digital media people are affected by that?

>>52231746
>You just went full retard

You're the bigger downy here if you can't acknowledge something so blatant.

>>52231746
>>Werewolf- WHEW BOY I hope you enjoy Lunacy! Everyone watching is going to go legit insane for a bit- mass death ensues, people freak out, but not, because nobody remembers, about the werewolf.

>when you realize that'll cause so many people to dramatically fail their lunacy rolls and become wolfblooded
>enough that many MANY more werewolves will be created because of it

wait, why havent the forsaken taken the route of creating a viral video to make more werewolves? it would be like that shitty two part of doctor who ep where he killed the Silence

>>52231717
Arch-scientist always sounds so silly. You'd think that the Technocracy would have a better name for their most powerful Enlightened, kind of like how they call "vulgar magic" Inspired Science (thought they do refer to it as vulgar science too).

What would be a better, more Technocratic sounding term for a Scientist who gets archsphere levels?

Also, to answer your question, Exemplar is a level of Archmastery and Oracles are individuals who willfully stop their ascension to guide others.

Leads me to another question now that I think about it: Could an Archmarauder exist? Now there's a scary thought.

>>52231717
More or less, with a few differences.

Exemplars are evolved Archmages, essentially becoming the so in-tune with their craft that they become the very embodiments of their chosen Spheres.
Oracles are the enlightened ones, Archmages that found the keys to ascension but turned back in order to guide the rest to their ultimate goals.
The final variant are those that form themselves into Celestines, which is the spirit rank Gaia and the Triat hold, and possibly even God if Apocalypse is to be believed.

The Aswadim are the Archmages and Oracles of the Nephandi.

>>52231673
It could be on every screen in the world and still become a promotional stunt for a years-long film project that didn't exist yesterday, now cancelled and its marketers sacrificed for the legal trouble they caused.

>>52231881
>Could an Archmarauder exist?

One already does. She is the Medea of Greek myth, so completely insane that Paradox doesn't even touch her.

>>52231878
Because having a ton of werewolves that are utterly untaught and no grounding in forsaken culture is a recipe for disaster. They'd get eaten up for cause havoc rather than being useful.

I still better some Ironmaster shitter will try it though.

>>52231881
>What would be a better, more Technocratic sounding term for a Scientist who gets archsphere levels?

Probably something boring and understated, like Distinguished Doctor of Enlightened Sciences, or just postdoc for short.

What if a dickhead archmage were to introduce the werewolf gene in all normal humans resulting in everyone being Kinfolk? Do werewolves just chimp out even harder for no goddamn reason? Does consensus change in any meaningful way in lets say 50 years when werewolves and gifts become common knowledge?

>>52232252
Everything he does is effectively erased immediately as if it had never happened- he gets a slapping from other Archmages, nobody else noticed anything happened.

That's how archmages work buddy. Accomplishing nothing- with great power.

>>52232252
I would asume the Traditions would flip their shit because potential new Awakenings might be stopped by everyone being fluffles instead.

And the Technocratic Union would go full Imperium of Man with "Operation Purity" where they try and save the world from horrific universal mutation through introducing Enlightened Retrovials into the water supply to try and "fix" everyone's genetic code.

So what if it's got a 2% death rate? That's better than a 100% mutant rate.

>>52232339
>Technocracy will prevent furworld
They really are the heroes of WoD

>>52231627
>Ascension seems to have the best frame for it, with Apocalypse as a close second

I would argue the other way around.

In WoD cosmology, mages all operate around the basic concept of a sympathetic reality that can be manipulated to conform to individual will. This implies that their perception of reality in and of itself is at some level ersatz delusion.

Werewolves however conceive reality in terms of animism, and as such are capable of actually perceiving ding an sich.

As much as I think it's dumb, philosophically speaking WtA cosmology holds the most weight.

>>52232317
This is oWoD we're talking about here.

Ascension Archmages don't give a fuck compared to the ones from Awakening. The Pax Arcanum doesn't exist in the oWoD.

>>52232367

I completely disagree. WtA is far more limited in its world view than Ascension.

>>52232367
>This implies that their perception of reality in and of itself is at some level ersatz delusion.
That's not how it works. Everyone is right and everyone is wrong. No one is delusional, other than the Marauders. The Union isn't more right than the Traditions, it's just their Paradigm lies in the vast majority of things.

>>52232393
Agreed. Ascension goes further than any other line.

>>52232370
Just because Ascension doesn't have the Pax Arcanum doesn't mean you won't get your shit pushed in by other Archmages for turning the world into a furry's wet dream.

>>52232441
>headcanon

Gee, then why do all those evil mustache twirling Archmages run around then?

Stop trying to apply things that don't exist. You can if you wan to, but it's not a thing in Ascension.

>>52232480
Because despite being evil mustache twilers, they haven't done dick to motivate others to fuck them up?

At least, before you actually start playing the game, which is where that kind of stuff should be considered?

>>52232441
Other archmages could intervene, but it's not a global rule like Awakening.

There's far more leeway in Ascension to break reality without consequence.

>>52232513
>Because despite being evil mustache twilers, they haven't done dick to motivate others to fuck them up?

*cough* *cough* Voormas *cough*

>>52232480
If there are archmages capable of rewriting reality running around, and they're NOT bound by the Pax...

Why does the world function as if they don't exist? Why AREN'T they making changes? Why is it that these allpowerful, unstoppable-save-each-other beings have little to no impact at all?

It's because they're shitty fluff, that's why.

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A cute Thyrsus appears

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>>52232661
Leave ruining the game to me

>>52232657
>Pax
Doesn't exist in Ascension

>no impact at all
Because Archmages don't really care about Earth when they can rule their own damn planets in the Umbra

>shitty fluff, that's why
Sums up the whole of oWoD pretty well.

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>>52232393
>>52232427
That's what I'm saying though.

Conceptual interpretation gives you more freedom to manipulate *understanding*, but in WtA concepts are extant "physical" entities that can be interacted with.

Sure mages have phenomenal cosmic power or what have you, but this is built on the ideation of what are apparently manifest beings that exist in metaphysical space.

>>52232768

I fail to see how any of that gives WtA the edge in cosmological understanding. It's just not a good argument to make, Anon.

Agree to disagree. Or you could just get angry that someone doesn't align with your viewpoints.

>>52232714

Pax doesn't exist in the sense of being a "set of solid codified rules", more of an "unspoken agreement"

>>52232819

Kinda. Not really. Archmages don't bother with eachother until something really bad happens.

In Awakening, even minor things will trigger an SJW Archmaster.

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>>52232688

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QT Moros?

>>52232768
Fuck off werefag. Your splat has no relevance.

>>52217906
The world is sick. In Central America, an earthquake kills 10,000. Over the Atlantic Ocean, severe ball lightning destroys an airliner's instruments. A hundred and eighty people die, freezing, in the arctic waters. A new strain of drug-resistant bacteria spreads through a school cafeteria. The parents and teachers recover. The children don't.

Random disasters? Unforeseeable accidents? Life is not what it seems. There are no accidents. A common thread runs through all these incidents and more besides. The thread is Paradox, and it claims lives.

The Awakened have the power to change the world, but they don't always have the wisdom to change it for the better. Reality has its own inertia, the masses have their own imperatives, and even plants and animals have their own, small say on the direction of the Consensus. Cause and effect are difficult to discern, and a change that seems benign can have unintended consequences. When Awakened magic comes into conflict with the unwritten rules of the world, Paradox is the inevitable result.

The Technocracy exists to insure that Paradox does not destroy the world. They are humanity's first, last, and only line of defense against those that would destroy the foundations of civilization to serve their own selfish purposes. There are monsters in the shadows, some of whom are pleasing to behold.

The Technocracy puts them down, like the rabid dogs they are.

Unlike the Traditions, the Technocracy is very strict about who it allows to join. Only the most ideologically committed scientists, politicians, and soldiers are allowed into the Union's inner circle. Those of lesser conviction, especially those among the Awakened who refuse to abandon the trappings of mysticism, may work alongside the Union as "assets" or among its lowest ranks as "associates," but they are never fully trusted.

In theory, the Technocracy functions like a finely tuned, well-oiled machine.

>>52232942
Each Convention has its role spelled out in the Union's charter and every Enlightened operative has an official rank and title, with duties and privileges defined by her Convention's managing committee. On paper, the elegant interplay of authority, organization, and oversight produces a sublime model of efficiency and accountability.

In practice, things are not so smooth. Though it's leagues ahead, organizationally speaking, of its mystic rivals, the Technocracy is nowhere near as perfect as its architects predicted. Personal ambition, inter-convention rivalry, chronic shortages of Enlightened personnel, and plain old human nature contrive to make the Union's internal politics much more fractious and dynamic than outsiders imagine.

Each Technocratic Convention has its own organizational mandate, but the actual day to day affairs of the Conventions are controlled by the managing committees. In order to secure greater prestige for their Convention (and a correspondingly large portion of the Union's overall budget), these committees will poach the other Conventions' projects and personnel, in an effort to prove the superiority of their organization's approach.

Officially, this is viewed as healthy and friendly competition that strengthens the Union as a whole, and for a large part it is, but to some among the Technocracy, this inter-Conventional rivalry is deadly serious, and anything but friendly. Technocratic policy forbids the lethal duels prevalent among the Traditions, but Enlightened Operatives who have made the wrong sort of enemies have a habit of receiving assignments of the most dangerous sort.

The Technocracy is strongest in densely populated, industrialized areas and those places devoted to science and learning. Their operatives have connections in universities and corporations. They derive their income from stocks, patents, and government grants.

They can be found in militaries, police forces, and walking the halls of power.

What would drive an archmage to try and ascend in M:taw instead of chilling on earth for a couple decades (Or more since immortality is well within the reach of imperial magic) advancing all their arcana to absurd levels and then retreating into their own personal garden of eden for the rest of time?

>>52232956
Though the Technocracy rarely exercises outright control, the lobbyists and consultants under its employ can exert a tremendous amount of influence.

All for the greater good, of course.

It is not the Technocracy's policy to target unaffiliated mages. The Technocracy targets Paradox and Poisoned Awakenings. This is a distinction that is meaningless to mages who follow a mystic paradigm, but it has proven an effective political tool. The fact that the "scientific" Traditions receive a much lower share of Technocratic attention has not gone unnoticed amongst the Council of Traditions.

When the Technocracy notices a Paradox manifestation, its first goal is to suppress information about the event, its second goal is to protect the masses from the damage dealt by the paradox, and its third goal is to track down and "sterilize" the source of the paradox. Sterilization is exactly as unpleasant as it sounds, but the Union prefers to take Awakened captives alive. Most amongst the Traditions consider that to be a fate worse than death.

But the Technocracy's opposition to the Traditions is not solely, or even primarily, military. A substantial portion of the Technocracy's resources is devoted towards the goal of adapting Enlightened Procedures for use by the general public. In contrast to the boundless wonders called forth by the magic of the Traditions, the Technocracy produces bland, mass-produced effects of limited ambition and negligible paradox.

This willingness to share the fruits of its knowledge with the unawakened has paid great dividends, both politically and mystically. As the masses' quality of life has increased by margins, so has their complacency. In most of the world, the mechanistic, materialist paradigm favored by the Technocracy is accepted without question. As time goes on, the Consensus tightens until one day the threat - and the promise - of magic will be extinguished forever.

At least, it will if the Technocracy has its way.

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>>52232963
Any archmarauder or aswadim level threat.

>When the Reckoning happened, however, it was without any of the Unnamed's doing. Hubris had paved the way for him and it was time to finish the game. His forces claimed Horizon and he used the Nodes of the realm to channel his tainted Resonance into the world, while calling every Awakened to face him at Horizon. As expected, he annihilated most of his challengers and used their souls to power his own spell to force the Avatar Storm through the Gauntlet, killing most of the world Awakened immediately and empowering his most loyal Nephandi. Faced with a small cabal of mages that had managed to recover the Greater Parma Magica (and with the help of Senex, who managed to wound him seriously), the Unnamed was forced to flee - maybe for the first time in his entire existence.

>As the Avatar Storm howled through reality, the Gauntlet fell apart, leaving humanity open and vulnerable. The Unnamed now went on his masterstroke, using the tainted Quintessence harvested from the Storm and Horizon to kill the Alder Bole, the World Tree, banning any Oracles from ever entering the Tellurian. In a last desperate try, the Order of Hermes sought to retake Mus, while the Unnamed and his companions slaughtered the remaining Oracles and Archmages.

>With nearly all (if not indeed all) resistance eliminated, the Unnamed summoned his Masters into the Tellurian, completing the Descent of existence and unleashing unimaginable horrors upon the world. The Unnamed himself took up his throne at the blasted ruins of what was once Mesopotamia to rule the ruin of Creation.

Are archmages quality material?

Well, does the setting in any way suffer or even change from cutting them out wholesale?

No?

Then they definitely aren't good material.

>>52232963
Same reasons you don't get lazy motherfuckers who after they Awaken just use their magical powers to live an easier, boring life.

Because you've still got your Obsessions.

>>52233017

I can only imagine just how easily the Unnamed would spank Caine, lol

God did jack shit to prevent any of that.

>>52232963
There's a good chance that is exactly what a lot of archmages do.

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What kin dof Obsessions would a demure, sweet, cutie Mage have?

>>52233063
Unnamed is the Antichrist. He's on a much worse level then Caine in the whole biblical villain hierarchy.

>>52233017
>Entropy 10

He's practically omnipotent then.

>>52233132
Well, in that one Sphere he would be.

Entropy 9 is complete control over destiny and grants Omniscience of all possibilities.

10 dot Spheres were intentionally never listed, and are more-or-less "do whatever the fuck you want"

>>52233094
Soul-Experiments.

Again seeking a storyteller for masquerade, over roll20 and now with 4 players in need of someone to run. Last time I plan to ask, game is https://app.roll20.net/campaigns/details/2092283/vampire-the-masquerade-the-game-the-movie

>>52233094
Hardcore, orifice ruining, banned by sharia law sex.

>>52221742
>Bogdanoffs

Ok, but seriously. How do we stop them?

>>52232807
Not even mad though. It's just reasoning.
If animism is true and is real, then that comprehension of cosmology is necessarily correct but doesn't exclude the possibility of a sympathetic reality. If reality is only predicated on consensus, then "correctness" has no meaning and thus an animistic universe is impossible.

>>52232883
I'm not even a werefag, I've only ever played Vampire but I've probably read every owod book there is.

Are there Mastigos who turn their Awakening trial at the Scourging Watchtower in a positive experience that gives them a more optimistic outlook in life?

>>52233853
Awakenings are different for everyone.

For a Mastigos, it could be very enlightening of the self. Surpassing your inner demons isn't a negative outlook.

>>52233853
Look, you went through hell in Pandemonium.
But what did that do for you? It scoured away your weaknesses.
Through all of the pain and torment, you found your core.
The indefatigable heart of your being that keeps you going.
You are not ruled by your impulses, you can rule them, bend them to your will.
Or perhaps accept them, acknowledge they are a part of you and rob them of their power.

It IS possible to improve. To change yourself.
You CAN conquer your Demons.
Hope persists.

Demons > Mages

Prove me wrong

>>52234099
Mage just sounds cooler, y'know?

Mmmmmaaaaage. Say it with me. Mmmmmaaaaaage.

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>>52234099

>>52234099
Scientists > Demons > Mages

>>52234136
I'm talking about MtA and DtF

>>52234139
I'm fairly certain that wizards are cooler than scientists.

>>52234158
Wizards can be scientists. Magic is a science is a great many fictional settings, like Dungeons & Dragons.

Or the opposite, where it's not supposed to abide by any law(s), like A Song of Ice and Fire or Conan.

>>52234175
Lovecraftian magic is also rather inexplicable.

>>52234139
RPGs do not lend themselves well to actual science, and everything else might as well be acknolwedged as the magical pseudo-science that it is.

There's nothing in this world I despise more than people who want to play a serious "Hollywood Science" game. Screaming "Science, fuck yeah!" while they fellate themselves over their utterly retarded ideas.

The acknowledgement (even just on a meta level) that you're really just wrapping up Magic in Science's clothing is one of the things I appreciate about the various tech factions in Ascension and all of Genius.

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>>52234175
Science is a Magical paradigm, and the dominant, winning one in WoD. Your cellphone is a magical device for Data/Correspondence. Medical operations are magical life rituals. Guns, ovens, cars, are all based upon Technocratic magic. Union Scientists and Doctors are mages with mage levels. The primary difference between Enlightened Sciences and Awakened Arts is the the TU is structuring reality so that everyone can use magic, repeatability, and removing/minimizing the role of individual spellcaster and instead relying mostly on magic devices (though the high level stuff requires Enlightened Scientist to operate).

>>52234175
Pretty sure your wrong.

>>52234233
Arcanotech makes consistently reproducible sense, it's just that understanding the principles is antithetical to human cognition.

Threat Null archmage. How fucked is existence?

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>>52234368
This fucked.

>>52234368
>archmage
Arch-Scientist.

TU and TN are peculiar about this.

>>52234349
>Pretty sure your wrong
You're*

Also take it up with the various authors. Magic and science are either the same thing or not, depending on the fiction in question. This isn't open for discussion, fiction is fiction.

>>52234364
A form of magic in Lovecraft's work is based around weird science, just look at the witch who hurled herself through dimension while utilizing it. Other forms of sorcery explicitly make no sense.

>>52234405
>weird science
It was based around eldritch math, actually.

Lovecraft intentionally made his magic to be fucked up and impossible to grasp.

>>52234349

In Ascension, magic and science are both the same thing, at its core, consensual reality being what it is.

>>52234453
>>52234349
So what happens if the Trads actually manage to kill of all the Technocrats and enforce their paradigm?

>>52235045
What Paradigm?
The Traditions are a hopelessly disjunctive alliance formed out of necessity and denial, not of actual agreement or unified belief.

>>52235045
Reality splinters into islands of united belief as the traditions tear down the current consensus and replace it with a multitude of their own, wildly varying ones.

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>>52235045
Best case scenario, the world ends up looking like pic related in the modern age.

Worst case scenario, modern civilization collapses as the economy implodes, medicine does nothing, and anything that runs on electricity stops working. The Trads end up in the role of mage lords ruling over feudal sleeper populations once more, not really out of power hunger (except maybe the Hermetics), but more out of necessity to protect their sleeper wards from dragons and shit.

>>52235217
>>52235228
The single biggest issue I have with the premise that “the Traditions win and so technology stops working” is the Society of Ether. It’s arguable that the Society of Ether is the strongest advocate for science and technology in the World of Darkness, even moreso than the Technocratic Union (for whom technology is merely a means to an end); and to say that technology begins to fail upon a victory by the Traditions is to exclude the Etherites from that victory.

Like the Technocracy, the Virtual Adepts see technology as a means to an end; but it is their chosen means, and destroying technology would exclude them from the victory as well unless some sort of substitute for information technology is found.

So even if you disregard the argument that the other Traditions have no particular hostility toward technology, I don’t buy the notion that a Traditions victory would undermine it.

The worst-case scenario I see for a Traditional “victory” is the division of reality into a large number of mutually incompatible reality zones; but even that runs counter to the Traditions’ professed interest in tolerance for other points of view. In a true Traditions victory, the Reality Zones wouldn’t be incompatible; they’d overlap with each other and eventually blend together into an all-permissive zone. And the single biggest problem they’d face would be the tendency to overwhelm Sleepers with the sheer diversity of options available to them.

The Technocracy did not single-handedly create the modern world, and their annihilation will not mean its collapse. They don't actually care about science except as a tool to make new technology. Control over technology is their real power, not their skill at studying the nature of the universe. A Tradition victory is actually the absolute best case scenario for keeping these mainstays of modern life without radical change.

>>52230983

Except they totally could? Golconda and what not.

>>52235045
Things get better.

The world the Technocracy has crafted for humanity is a nightmare and perversion. Science has brought us world wars, fascism, communism, inequality, and the atomic bomb. The Technocratic paradigm resembles the tools and strong arm tactics used by the wealthy in this world. Their line of protecting Sleepers from gribblies is more or less complete hogwash - each culture's Mage contingent (along with other practitioners) did this just fine. The rise of the Union was more a matching current of the rise of merchantilism during the Renaissance and Enlightenment eras that they took advantage of. They don't care about regular people, just their own power.

Also, from a play perspective, good Technocrats are simply boring - without the Technocracy being inherently monstrous (as much of western civilization is), then it turns really into a police procedural, as opposed to "my god, what have I done? what am I doing?" Can the playstyle support Dr Mengele or Peter Creedy from V for Vendetta as a PC? If not, then it's not in character for the Technocracy.

What the fuck are you talking about?

Under Hermetic rule, the average person didn't survive childhood, were likely to die in child birth, were typically not allowed to leave the land they lived on, and frequently suffered from violence, famine, and plagues. On top of this, you were likely to suffer from all sorts of supernatural threats, like Werewolves killing you because you hunted in their sacred woods to feed your starving children, fucking vampire lords like Dracula treating you like cattle, careless mage lords who'd fireball you just because they didn't like the way that you looked at them, dragons, and tons of other fates worse then death. You were powerless, uneducated, your children would likely have the same prospects as you, and all you could do was huddle at the mercy of your local holy man or mage.

Under Technocratic rule, typically, the average person survives childhood, survive child birth, has significantly more personal and religious liberties than a feudal serf, are educated, have opportunity, experience less violence, have greater quantities of food, and better health care. There's even a good chance you can keep all your teeth!

To look at it another way, the Traditions offer up a glorious paradise for the scarce few with the will to Awaken. The Technocracy offers up the modern world for vast majority who don't have that will and don't want to live like rats rolling around in shit. The Traditions are mostly selfish at heart, while the Technocracy, when living up to its ideals, are mostly selfless. Mages like the SoE (I really hate when people bring these faggots up as a good Science faction to play in lieu of the Union) split from the Technocracy not out of morals, but because they were massively butthurt when the Union wrote the Ether out of the Scientific Consensus.

>>52236513
Meant for >>52236372 >>52235321

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>>52236372
You are entirely retarded.
Please, never share your god-awful opinions ever again.

>>52236372

>Science has brought us inequality

Oh yeah, and people were totally all equal in feudal systems.

Equality is a meme.

>>52237504

Of course it is. There will never be a time when everyone is equal.

Unless everyone is dead. I guess that makes the Unnamed good?

>>52221742
Thanks for the rundown.

>gar-oo
or
>ga-row
?

>>52235045

Things become a new, different kind of bad.

Now instead of one Paradigm run by corrupt morons with delusions of grandeur, you have the inevitable turf wars between nine Paradigms run by corrupt morons with delusions of grandeur.

Don't fall for either the Tradition meme or the Technocracy meme. After all, there will be a Reckoning.

>>52238381
I'd say gar-oo, probably because Garou is pronounced that way in my language (French).

>>52238550
vocaroo that shit

>>52238537

>Implying each tradition hews to a single paradigm beyond a few basic concepts

Even the Order of Hermes has disagreements in it's ranks.

>>52238381
>GAH-roo
for Gauru
>gar-OO
for Garou

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>>52233037

>>52236513
>because they were massively butthurt when the Union wrote the Ether out of the Scientific Consensus.
Why did they do this to SoE?

>>52238381
I would say you pronounce Garou as Gah-ROW. But that's because it's the way we would say in Portuguese.

>>52234128
Okay.
Faaaaaaaaaaaggot
Faggot
Yup, flows pretty smoothly off the tongue

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>>52235321
>the Society of Ether.

Sons of Ether.

FIFY.

Let's not pollute Ascension with Brucatto's M20 megadouche delusions; a paradigm so ridiculous that it even controls your culinary choices.

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>>52241337
>Why did they do this to SoE?

Because the Ether conflicted too much with the Timetable and other scientific branches to be reconciled. Half the sons went on to become VE, and the other half joined the Traditions. And it wasn't just the Ether, that was just the last straw. SoE is about what we'd call quack or outdated sciences in our world. They're the types who make arguments on the superiority of individuals or races based off of skull shape. Culturally too, the SoE are divergent from the rest of the Technocracy. They're focused on the individual, and their world outlook is inherently romantic rather then enlightened. Tellingly, their brand of Awakened Science can only be used by them, and usually not their peers and definitely not the Sleepers. An SoE consensual reality would end up looking like something out of Girl Genius (hate the comic, but best example I can think of).

>>52241354

Literally the least offensive of the renamings. If it was the """mercurial elite""" I'd be with you but to be honest it should have been "Society of Ether" from the start. Broken clock and all that.

>>52241607
>it should have been "Society of Ether" from the start

The blatant Victorian / steampunk-esque sexism of the Sons of Ether were part of their charm and an acknowledgment of their imperfections.

>>52241767

"Society of Ether" is a more Victorian sounding name for an organization. They can still be Victorian to a fault and with all that imples, it's just that the name fits better. "Sons of Ether" isn't bad or anything, but it sounds more like one of the clubs that meet at the local Rotary Club than an alternative science/adventure group.

Brucato shouldn't have decided to change it for the nostalgia focused edition and missed the entire point of a 20th Anniversary Edition, but it would be a fine name change for Mage the Ascension 5e or something.

>>52224688
>>52224964

>"Calling the demons would be underestimating them. I don't know what those forces are, but they're not something the un-enlightened should ever have to deal with. Trust me. When we kicked the Nephandi out of orbit in the '40s, we learned a lot about their masters. Call them aliens, Those Beyond, Ka Luon, Umbrood, Zigg'raugglurr, whatever you want. Something is out there. We've seen them. I've seen them. That's why I'm here now. And they're not something the Masses should ever discover - or remember. So we watch them, we study them, and when things start intruding on our Earth we slaughter them. Sooner or later, the Technocracy will take the fight to Those Beyond. We'll see who rules the world then."

>"You've been doing some *serious* drugs." [The Malkavian said]

>>52241996
>You've been doing some *serious* drugs." [The Malkavian said]

> Reality Deviant detected!
> Sterilization squad dispatched... Priority Beta
> Request for Hit Mark authorization... Approved

>>52242176
see
>>52226516

>>52241607
>mercurial elite
I still can't understand and stand it.
I mean, Virtual Adepts is good, and I don't see why 'Mercurial Elite' would be a better name. It's not even "Mercurial Leets" but again, why would a bunch of computer nerds and cypherpunks name themselves after a goddess ? The trappings of mercury ? Fuck you, Crazy Uncle Phil, technomancers are fine and they aren't technoshamans.

>>52244132
m8...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_(mythology)
>patron god of trade, communication, travelers, luck, and trickery
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/mercurial
>having qualities of eloquence, ingenuity, or thievishness attributed to the god Mercury or to the influence of the planet Mercury
>characterized by rapid and unpredictable changeableness of mood

I'm not saying it's a good name, but it isn't as nonsensical as you think it is

>>52244248
I know who's Mercury, thank you, but I don't see a bunch of /g/entoomen choosing a name after an old God. There's some paradox in being all about Data, modern technology and bearing the word of an ancient Greek/Roman God.
I mean, I can see the appeal, the fusion of technology and old mysticism, but to me the Virtual Adepts weren't about that, they were all about the technology and full on cyberspace.

>>52244248
I thought ME kind of worked. They're apart of the traditions but they use plenty of the Techno tools and methodology. Computations and media. They're riding the fence as it were.

Their specialty sphere is Correspondence, so You've got a bit travel and sympathy.

So you can actually play with some of their cross loyalties of mythism and modern science.

>>52244248
>>52244680
For some reason the name 'Mercurial Elite' made me think of the Mercurial factions from Eclipse Phase. I guess it makes sense, what with AGI uplifts and Data-sorcery.

Still kind of a lackluster name though. Virtual Adept has a ring to it, it tells you what they're about. I understand the mythologizing of 'Mercurial Elite,' though. What would be a better name, /tg/?

>>52244791
>Mercurial Adept?

Virtual Elite doesn't work at all. TOO 90s 1337

>>52244791
As a computer guy i'd never want to be part of a group as up their own ass enough as one would have to be to call themselves the Mercurial Elite.
Virtual Adepts sum up not only the core focus and 'feels' computer-y. Mercurial Elite sounds like some up their own ass college group.

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>>52233132
Impotent*

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>>52244990

>>52241343
Just like your boyfriend's load, right down in your tummer

>>52244860
>like some up their own ass college group.

Well, that DOES sum up the attitude of the VA/ME, and probably why it was obviously one of the favorite Traditions of the WW employees in the 1990's.

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>>52238381
Gaar-AWOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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>>52245051

Awakening >>>>> Forsaken > Masquerade >>>>> Changeling

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>>52245173

Hurt Locker mentions "Brutal Sorcery" (p.45) as a Mage fighting style, but I cannot seem to locate it in the Mage 2e corebook?

Is this an errata in Hurt Locker, or am I just missing something in my review of the Mage core?

>>52245191
>Masquerade instead of Requiem

Because everyone knows Requiem is stale ass piss.

>>52245466
You probably have an older version of the pdf, brutal sorcery sadly didn't make the final cut. Maybe we'll see it around the time we see the mage Q&A.

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>>52245277
This is the future of werewolves after mages are done with them

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>>52245828
THIS is the future of mages after werewolves are done with THEM

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Read this on the PP forums

>Mages should never take it for granted that they can take on other supernatural creatures. They are human and, while they can temporarily modify themselves to become superhuman, do not have any innate supernatural capabilities. They are prey, not predators, and should never assume that they are anything but prey when they deal with other supernatural creatures. They should never get into fights with other supernatural creatures without proper preparation, should always avoid unnecessary fights with other supernatural creatures whenever possible, and should never fight fair against other supernatural creatures when they have to fight.

>This is actually what homosexuals believe.

>>52245898
So werewolves learn how to be decent husbandos?

>>52245915
We already went through this. That entire thread was retarded and the idiot had no idea what he was spewing.

>This is actually what homosexuals believe
More like homosexuals laced with Down syndrme

>>52245942
>implying they weren't already

>>52245915
We already had this conversation
>>52198884

>>52245943
Homosexual otherkin with downs

>>52245942
Don't anger the mage waifu, or she will personally cut your knot off with a silver cheese grater.

>>52245915
You realize that the OPP forums love to hate on magefags, right? Even if they're good at not showing it.

The oWoD section is the absolute worst. I have never seen so many veterans that actually don't know what they're talking about.

>>52245563
>Hurt Locker
>You probably have an older version of the pdf

Does anyone have the updated Hurt Locker PDF with any errata?

Thanks.

>>52245955
They have the potential to be top tier but that hasn't been realized
>>52245965
Could probably do much worse

>>52245942
>>52246073

Daeva Vampires would make for superior husbandos, considering just how obsessive they can get.

>>52246097
Nothing dead can make a good husbando

>>52236372
Science brought up toilet paper. Please wipe your ass with a fucking bramble and enjoy the sweet caress of the Traditions on your anus.

>>52246251

I'll stick with the sweet, thick, absorbent, quilted softness brought to us by our friends in the Technocratic Union.

>>52246052
>updated Hurt Locker PDF with any errata

Here you go!

https://www.sendspace.com/file/2i33s8

>>52245915
I feel like some people loath Mage to the extent of deluding themselves thinking that they're not actually the strongest splat there is.

Bias is fucking disgusting.

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Irraka's Thyrsus wife. She is the sweetest girl.

>>52246360
Pity given that she's also a Thyrsus she's a filthy whore and will fuck anyone who gets her wet to fulfil her Oblation.

>>52245915
Mages with low Arete are going to be fodder for the rest, at least in direct confrontation. This isn't really open for debate.

Mages with high Arete, provided they're prepared and abusive of their capabilities, will curbstomp most everything. This too, isn't up for debate.

>>52246335
>Hurt Locker PDF

Thanks!

>>52246437
>Mages with high Arete, provided they're prepared and abusive of their capabilities

There are mages with high Arete who AREN'T prepared and abusive?

Who knew?

>>52246535
Well, it would be a rare thing, that. You don't become a master by being unprepared.

Realistically, surprising a master is nearly impossible with the ludicrous amount of contingencies at their disposal.

>>52246360
>Irraka's
>Thyrsus wife

It's always a shame when mages engage in bestiality, but it's to be expected with Thyrus.

However, no doubt that shaggy werepoodle will be kicked to the curb once she experiences the sweet loving of an Obrimos,

>>52246430
She's a pure loyal wife who is already pregnant. Irrakanis the only man she's ever known

>>52246618
>pregnant by a werewolf!?!?

That mage is a disgrace to her Path, cabal, Order and Consilium.

Another respected Thyrsus needs to quickly terminate that abomination of a fetus (along with the werewolf), and teach the girl about the do's and don'ts about being a superior mage.

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Four demure, and virginal Thyrsus girls waiting for a gentleman to court them.

>>52246251
>implying that's worth the tyranny of the Technocracy

"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

"Sell not virtue to purchase wealth, nor Liberty to purchase power."

>>52246758
>virginal
>Thyrsus
Pick one

>>52246765
The irony of using a quote from Franklin is absurd considering that he was very, very likely a Technocrat and Enlightened Scientist in WoD.

>>52246765

Give me Charmin or Give Me Death!

>>52246765
The only ones who lose liberty are the mages who want to be god kings.

>>52246765
Man, it's a good thing that we don't have a police force, tax system, a representative democracy and all other modern benefits of society.
That might actually require us to invest a little of our own personal liberties in something for mutual benefit.

>>52246832
>mages who want to be god kings.

Want to be? Newsflash: Mages are ALREADY god kings!

>>52246858
Spoken like a true statist who cannot live independently.

>>52246858

But we don't have magic crystals?

What good is democracy and other comforts without magic crystals?

>>52246832
To be fair, that's really only the Order of Hermes that wants to replace the Technocracy and go back to the pre-Rennaissance. The Cult of Ecstasy just want to be left alone to do kinky sex magic in the woods, and Verbena just wants to go back to sacrificing and burying infants in fields for good harvests (they were voluntary sacrifices, we swear they consented).

>>52246874
How many of the things you used today did you make from nothing? Let me guess, its not all of them.
People evovle as a social animal, pretending you aren't dependent on things is nice, but then you don't get food or electricity.
And even if you have 'off the grid' abilities to do these things now, you only have that ability because you depended on outside sources to learn how.

>>52246874
>Spoken like a true statist who cannot live independently.

Hey, you're free to live in the woods, but most of the rest of the world either enjoys the benefits of technology and the safety and security of the modern western state, or desperately wants it.

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Will you walk me down the aisle to my strong Rahu groom, Heirarch?

>>52246922
Thinks civilization amd technology cannot exist without a state. Free Market buddy. Well this is WoD afterall a game designed by welfare babies

Can anyone share:

Tales of the Dark Eras
Beast Ready Made Characters
Cursed Necropolis: Rio

Thanks.

>>52246925
That sounds like Provost duty to me.

Thyrsus Nimbus enhances her nubile and virginal characteristics.

>>52246962
One of the blurbs was was that the Technocracy tried anarchism and communes around the world, and it worked too well so they had to crack down on it. Brucatto has always really, really hated the Enlightenment/Age of Reason and what it stands for.

Also, voluntary Verbana human sacrifices.

>>52246962

The free market and scientific development largely thrive because of the existence of the state. Free market capitalism, no less scientific progress, is most certainly not synonymous with anarchism.

>>52247036
>One of the blurbs was was that the Technocracy tried anarchism and communes around the world
Pics, or you're full of shit.

>>52247054
Government regulations and protectionism

Free Market

Choose one

>>52247058
>The Spanish Civil War provides the opportunity to test the Technocracy's idea of using anarchism as a model government. The experiment succeeds beyond anyone's expectations, so much so that the Technocracy fears the breeding of ideas which deviate from the Technocracy's agenda. They declare the idea anathema and allow a fascist regime to take over.

>>52247036
>Brucatto has always really, really hated the Enlightenment/Age of Reason and what it stands for.

Obviously.

It also helps explain why Phil needs a Patreon to help pay his rent.

https://www.patreon.com/philbrucato

>>52247082
Government regulation can co-exist with a free market.
Competition enhancing policies are important.

Making love to my virgin Thyrsus wife on our wedding night, while in Father's Form. She cries and says I'm hurting her. What do I do?

>>52246758
>Virginal
>Meet Virginial
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3Qvb7q9Nm0

>>52247082
>Government regulations and protectionism
>Free Market
>Choose one

Sure, right after you provide a list of the multitudes of capitalist anarchist billionaires.

>>52247121
>virgin Thyrsus
>mage marrying werewolf
>werewolf being straight
???

>>52247121
>She cries and says I'm hurting her. What do I do?

Pray she doesn't form an Imago of you dead or castrated or complains to the local Sentinels about being sexually assaulted by a werewolf.

>>52247143
Because there are no government bailouts, people will be more wary about taking huge risks. Small to medium busnissess should be the norm megacorps sucking government cock and having taxpayers pay for their losses is criminal.

>>52247103
>It also helps explain why Phil needs a Patreon to help pay his rent.

That douche ruined M20.

I'll happily watch him starve.

>>52247220
Beating a dead Horse there

>>52247202
Removing Government regulations opens the way for massive abuses of market power by large corporations, destroying the possibility of competition.

Resulting in ludicrous high barriers to entry for smaller companies and permitting either a monopoly or oligopoly, and the setting of prices above equilibrium level to ensure that companies can reap larger profits from a consumer base who have no alternative to turn to.

>>52247268
Corporations exist usually because of government protectionism.

>>52247247
>Beating a dead Horse there

Beating an obnoxious organic, free-range horse.

FIFY

>>52246603

So how does one surprise a mage then? Other than being another mage, of course.

>>52247186
>complains to the local Sentinels about being sexually assaulted by a werewolf.

That reminded me of the section in The Pack that describes how angering a mage often results in a fate worse than death.

>>52247374
>So how does one surprise a mage then?

You really can never be sure you are surprising a mage given their vast and unpredictable abilities, and even if surprised, are generally more than capable of immediate escape (and later horrible revenge) or easily causing you grievous physical harm or far worse.

Stick with easier targets like vampires and werewolves.

What does it mean to make a Shielding spell against Gravity?

>>52247426
You are now a balloon

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>Even Enlightened Websites know that Entropy is shit

>>52247333
Corporations exist because they're the most efficient methods for achieving the economic allocation of resources.
Their very NATURE supports their own existence, not some shadowy Government conspiracy.
Efficiency breeds competitiveness, which breeds lower prices, which breeds peak societal good.

The only basis for that argument is the existence of the Corporate Veil protecting Directors from personal liability.
However were you to (idiotically) remove that, the economy would fucking COLLAPSE.

Protectionalism as a concept merely seeks to restrict the operation of the market to a specific area, creating walls within which to achieve peak good. So removing the TPP might not increase overall, worldwide good, however it will stop foreign countries with this ludicrously low costs of living and standards from driving down costs of labour and killing jobs and workforces within higher socio-economic countries where Companies simply cannot source work from any more.

They want to hire American/Australian/European workers. But they can't. Because their competitors will hire some $2 Indian guy, and be able to decrease their prices to below their level, taking all of their customers.

>>52247426
>What does it mean to make a Shielding spell against Gravity?

You no longer have to worry about falling off cliffs or ledges.

>>52247478
If they hire the Indian guy that makes them smarter than the competition.

>>52247426
Against Gravity?
Immune to Bashing damage from gravitational sources, and decrease all Lethal damage by spell Potency.

So given normal falling damage is bashing, you'll be fine.
However should you fall on something nasty, like spikes, you'll be in a LOT more pain.
Also if you hit the 30m+ mark, then it caps at 10 Lethal...

So really if it's a short fall, you should mostly be fine with Shielding.
If it's a long fall, be prepared to take (10 - Potency) in Lethal.

>>52247545
>If it's a long fall, be prepared to take (10 - Potency) in Lethal.

Or pay the one Reach and be immune to lethal.

>>52247426
You know how people have that cool lighting effect when jumping off tall objects in deus ex?

>>52247543
Exactly. Competition has little if any room for compassion.
The most economic allocator of resources wins.
Which is why Govt. regulations are used, and why many Govt.'s are worried about increasing trade and use of G&S from foreign countries.

Some family-run companies however, which aren't publically traded WILL engage in less than profit-maximising work. But that's mostly because they operate to benefit their workers and the family most.

Pretty much every bargain-bin service that can be done by following a procedure (call centers being the primary example) is being outsourced to the third world. Because there's no reason to hire in you home country where the wages are higher (unless the entry costs to that foreign market's labour market are too high, which are rarely the case).

>>52247563
Going by the Alchemist's Touch metric, that should be two Reach, but yes.

What's the Technocracy's view on automisation?

>>52247726
Poptarts

>>52247545
Posts like these make me paranoid that DaveB is watching us.

>>52246858
/k/ is now screeching autistically and they have no idea why.

>>52247738

What until you see the advances in Poptart technology the Technocratic Union has planned in just a few years...

>>52247098
...Man, that shit did NOT work well.

>Want to go see my mother on her deathbed.
>Need transportation from communal transportation pool.
>Concensus needed from other commune members to procure use of a truck that I owned before all property was abolished.
>LOL fuck you.

>>52247756
>Posts like these make me paranoid that DaveB is watching us.

Dave removed the Arcana speed bumps, so Shielding against things like gravity or kinetic energy are totally fair.

>Obrimos Supremacy!

>>52246895

>Order of Hermes that wants to replace the Technocracy and go back to the pre-Rennaissance

House Thig.

The only hardline anti-science group in the council was the Verbena, and they were shit (and probably wyrmbait) anyway.

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>>52247876

>>52247609
Calling BPO call centers bargain bin jobs. Its a thankless jobs and needs a unique skillset and has more nuance than taking calld all day.

>>52247036

At one point I said in an online discussion that Mage the Ascension was at it's heart an Absurdist Game and he got a little bit buttmad about that.

>>52247973
>needs a unique skillset
Then it can't be simply done by "following a procedure".

>>52247545
How van you fall if you are immune to gravity?

>>52248003
Yes most of the time modern call centers dont follow a procedure.

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So can we make a Thyrsus Legacy now about demure Thyrsus maidens taking Uratha as life mates? Must have something to do with Luna right?

>>52248030
Employees being given scripts and punished for not following is extremely typical. The fuck kinda of bizarre call centers have you been around?

>>52248067
We dont follow a script but we do have some flow charts and mandatory reminders but in general we just have to talk to customers like a normal person.

>>52247998
It works if you approach it from the perspective of most of the shit being Trad propaganda. The Trads are hopelessly Romantic and individualistic to a fault.

Besides, the laymen are mostly innocent. The average Trad doesn't want to overthrow the Current Scientific consensus, but just to not be brutally murdered by a HIT Mark. Likewise, the average Technocrat just wants to protect the human race, and doesn't respect it when his lab and all of his mates working on the cure to a paradox microbe afflicting the Masses end up fireballed through their computers.

Is it possible to run a Seers game where you are still helping the Lie but through some alruistic means? Like the Seer in question helps people and communities and is a positive force for mortals in the Fallen world but still somehow reinforces the Lie?

>>52248010
Quite easily.

>>52248090
Well that's why you still have your job then.
Many companies advertise based on the fact that they have call centre operatives with complementary social graces, from your own country.

Product differentiation, and all that.

>>52248227
So how do you fall while being immune to gravity?

>>52248190
>Is it possible to run a Seers game where you are still helping the Lie but through some alruistic means?

No.

The only arguably "good" things done by Seers is that they help keep the Bound imprisoned, and that's only because they are a threat to the Exarch's (and everyone else).

>>52248190
Look, the Exarchs want subjugation and blind obedience.
But that doesn't mean your life necessarily has to be complete shitfest.
You just have to do what you're told, when you're told, and not have any opportunity to Awaken.

However you as a Seer will likely find attempting to maintain your morality in the face of your superior's orders, and the power-hungry nature of your lessers and co-workers increasingly difficult.

You will soon be disillusioned of the altruistic nature of your work, through the world you find yourself in, and if you persist in the face of this you will likely be backstabbed by your fellows and potentially even killed by your superiors because you might later reject orders.

You can enter the Seers believing that what you do is a necessary good for the wellbeing of the world. However few Mages manage to keep that naivete (or their lives) for long in the face of the rampant egotism and domineering nature of their Order.

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>>52248106

The way I see it, the Marauders are the real heroes of the story. When you realize the Ascension War is a battle over semantics, that the Traditions could become the Technocracy with so much ease, and the Nephandi are trying to get you to fall by showing you pic related, you're better off creating your own meaning. Your own reality, one with blackjack and hookers.

>>52248296

While I fully support blackjack and hookers, Marauders hardly offer a much better alternative to the Union, Traditions or Nephandi.

>>52248296
With the Traditions, you'd likely end up with many pocket kingdoms where different laws of reality applied. There'd also be more beasties and lovecraftian abominations from Space/Umbra since consensual reality would be very weak, but at least mages wouldn't have to worry about Paradox.

>>52248261
You can weaken a spell while it's still under your control. If you relinquished a gravity protection spell and walk off a ledge you'll probably be floating in midair until somebody can come grab you.

>>52248313

I didn't say they were better, I said they were the Heroes of the Absurd story of Mage.

>>52248261
Because that requires Patterning to redefine the way in which kinetic energy interacts with your form.
Shielding can instead decide to merely stop it from occasioning harm to you.

A good example is Shielding against Fire/Heat.
Does it prevent thermodynamics? If it did, you'd either freeze to death (if you didn't take any heat in and let heat out), or boil in your own skin (if it didn't let any heat out, regardless of if you let heat in or not).

Instead, what you do is ward yourself against harm. It's not a binary on/off spell. You use your Magic to create a Ward against harm, it brushes up against excessive energies and protects you from harm. With enough power, it can even render you immune to all but the most horrifically eggregious forces.

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I hear Elodoths make good husbands.

>>52248362

Don't get me wrong, I know the Marauders create a lot of Havoc and Mess and death and hate as they drive the world mad, but it's a revolutionary act beyond what the other factions do.

>>52248064
Luna's Wives

>>52248389
>Forces
>kinetic energy, heat, gravity, electricity, etc.
>it can even render you immune to all but the most horrifically eggregious forces

Fuck with Obrimos at your own risk.

>>52248523
Forces 2 can render you immune to all harm occasioned by kinetic energy.

Get fucked wuffles.

>>52248389
Stop hiding behind your anonymity, DaveB.

Does money even matter in a Mage game?

For example a Moros can literally just create currency or if you're worried about hubris you can create nearly any equipment you'd ever want.

Mage society would be post scarcity like the federation in Star Trek. Tass/supernal artifacts would be the closest thing to anything of value.

Anons? Quick, hopefully easy question: I heard somewhere that in one Requiem sourcebook, there's a deformity/mutation/something for Nosferatu who have a head like an animal, like some fucked up vampiric egyptian god. Anyone got a handle on where it is? I skimmed through Beast That Haunts The Blood, but I didn't see it there.

>>52248820
For certain Mages? Money could be a mere trifle. Their powers are sufficient to permit them to get everything they'd need from the mortal world. However even then doing so still has risks relating to attract the attention of other Mages, Sleeper witnesses causing Paradox, Dissonance, and Quiescence harming your Wisdom.
However even then, they have to be creative and put in effort, otherwise their resources will only last so long as their spell does.

On the other had, simple money is quick and easy to spend, doesn't inherently draw supernatural attention to you, and doesn't require you to waste your talents on such a mundane topic.

Mages as a whole may consider Awakened items as the only things of any "real" worth, each of them beyond value in terms of cash. However other Mages might be willing to sell a surplus of Tass they've accumulated for some mundane cash which they're running short of.

Not all Mages are highly proficient, nor do they have the resources, skills, or Magic needed to make large amounts of money without resorting to unWise strategies.


Mage society is far from post-scarcity, that would require them to be able to fabricate lasting matter out of nothing, without significant effort, and while Mages certainly can, with effort and a little magic, create items and harvest materials of significant wealth, it's not quite so easy as pressing a button on a wall and getting a guitar.

>>52248296
There are three primal forces, and each of the factions fall into one of them.

First you have Dynamism, which represents change. It's Triat is the Wyld. The Traditions usually have Dynamic (or Questing) Avatars since they seek change. Marauders are Dynamism taken to an extreme.

Second is Pattern or Stasis, which represents stability and order. The Triat of Patterns is the Weaver, who binds the Wyrm in her web. The Technocracy unsurprisingly embraces this force the most, and their Genius can sometimes outright kill weaker supernatural creatures through their Banality. Science must be replicable and scalable after all. Instead of going Marauder, High Stasis mages are afflicted with Clarity, which turns them and everyone around them into unthinking Drones slaved to a Pattern. Threat Null represents the extremest Pattern faction.

Third is Entropy or Primordial, which represents tranquility, peace, and absence of things. The Triat of Entropy is the demonic Wyrm that threatens all of Creation. Factions aligned with Primordialism are Pentex and Infernalists. The most extreme are the Nephandi, who seek to unbind the chains of Hope and belief that hold up reality. Unlike other mages, Nephandi abhor and cannot use the magic of this reality, so use outside or inverted magic known as Qlippoth. Quippothic Spheres can be thought of as Antispheres, and the approach to casting differs in that rather then understanding how components come together to produce an effect, Nephandi picture how a thing falls apart instead.

Whybalways Thyrsus? No love for Moros cuties? She's sleeping naked on the bones of her dead parents which had been made to be as soft as pillows

>>52247939
What is it with Dave and Komodo Dragons?

>>52249483
>What is it with Dave and Komodo Dragons?

It's the love that dare not speak its name.

Caine > any archmage

New thread when?

Not familiar with Requiem. What's the downside to 'claws of the unholy'? The ability to do aggravated damage with your melee attacks sounds amazing.

>>52250086
Is it opposite day?

>>52250313
Everyday is opposite day for Cainefags

>>52250301

Claws of the Unholy (•)
Prerequisite: Protean ••••
Effect: A Gangrel’s claws are deadly and bestial; yours are
downright unnatural. The vampire allows the Beast out of its
cage and lets it punish all those around her. When wielding claws
borne of Unnatural Aspect while in frenzy, this Merit takes effect.
The weapon modifier for the claws becomes +0 aggravated. These
claws ignore all armor not generated by Resilience.Chapter Three: Laws of the Dead 111
Drawback: You may only use Claws of the Unholy while in
frenzy or riding the wave. Once purchased, this modification
is not optional; the character manifests Claws of the Unholy
any time she’s frenzied

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Previous thread: >>52221634

>Pastebin:
http://pastebin.com/xrKUUi0A

>News
http://theonyxpath.com/release-roundup-january-2017/
https://www.paradoxinteractive.com/en/white-wolf-partners-with-focus-home-interactive-for-a-video-game-adaptation-of-the-world-of-darkness-storyteller-game-werewolf-the-apocalypse/

This week's Monday Meeting Notes:
http://theonyxpath.com/whats-the-deal-monday-meeting-notes/

>Question:
When did you realize Cain is the coolest thing in WoD?

>>52250780

What a failure you are, Cainefaggot.

>>52250780
Never, because Caine and the Generations mechanic were two of the absolute stupidest things to come out of Masquerade.

Can werewolves take multiple Thyrsus Mages as wives?

>>52241337
>Why did they do this to SoE?

In the late 19th century, a combined amalgam of Void Engineers, Virtual Adepts, and Iteration X physicists came up with revolutionary theories disproving the existence of the 'luminiferous ether'. This new theory of relativity was far more mathematically elegant and was more likely to lead to the holy grail of the Technocratic Union's hard science-inclined Conventions-a grand unified theory which would completely eliminate questions about the core building blocks of matter, time, space, and more. Normally, such theories would be accepted as a matter of course. However, the Electrodyne Engineers protested. When the protests became more than simple scientific debate, but a matter of ideology, the rest of the Conventions, save for the Virtual Adepts, voted to sanction the Engineers.

The sanctioning did not go well. In our naivete, we believed that the Electrodyne Engineers were merely too invested in a theory. We did not know that they were plotting treason. Angry at the route the nascent Technocratic Union had taken, or perhaps having fallen into the trap of Reality Deviance with their too-personal investment in outdated theories that good scientists should discard, they fought back with their own weapons, and took what they could to the Superstitionists. This was the first defection. Not all of them left-more than a few of them are still with us, but many did, and even today they haunt us as the Sons of Ether, desperately believing that their single-minded, or perhaps simple-minded, focus on dead theories and pseudoscience is the true route of scientific understanding, rather than a sick parody of a scientist's work.

>>52251126
>Can werewolves take multiple Thyrsus Mages as wives?

Even trying to take one Thyrsus is effectively committing suicide by mage.

Been reading the SF0 and the Shih supplement, the SF0 seem a tad overpowered in a sense and kinda going overboard with all they tech they have.

Seriously which dumb son of a bitch decided to remove the rules for fatigue and carry/lift/push from the 2e core?

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So I'm playing a teenage Thyrsus girl who doesn't get into trouble. Have a bestie sleeper friend who is quite the rebel and she got knocked up by her deadbeat boyfriend. One day I find my friend lying on the floor bleeding. She wanted to keep the baby but the boyfriend didn't and beat her badly. She bled to death before I was able to get any decent healing spells in. However the unborn child was still barely alive. On an impulse I cast a spell to make by womb ready for pregnancy and used another spell to transfer the fetus in me. I am no carrying my friend and that asshole's daughter in me. How will I be able to hide this pregnancy from public? Here am I still a virgin and am pregnant! I still live with my folks and I am an honor student. The bastard is still out there somewhere too.

>>52252120
You're an idiot.
Also that's my fetish.

Anons? Requiem home-ruler here, can anyone help me make this ruling less convoluted?

Bashing Damage: The vampire frame is all but impervious to the minor injuries that so bedevil mortals. When a vampire takes Bashing Damage, compare the amount inflicted to the vampire's unmarked health boxes. For each box that would "roll over" into Lethal Damage, the vampire takes that much Bashing Damage. If the Bashing Damage inflicted would not roll over into Lethal, then the vampire takes no damage from that attack.

And, yes, I know that this makes a full-health vampire all but immune to Bashing damage. But that's the point. Vampires in 2e already downgrade all damage by 1 step unless it's Bane-inflicted; it makes no sense to me that somebody who shrugs off being shot in the head as if it were a black eye would then be bothered by actually getting punched in the face by the local tough.

This idea is intended to amp up vampire resistance for more "high powered" games.

>>52252412
Well I guess it's fine but who bothers with bashing in "high powered" game?

>>52252551
>bashing
>kek
>mage unmakes you