/CofD/ &/wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

>>51578768
>Has anyone here ever LARPed?
only for the last 16 years

Once, DM favoritism and cliches made a shitty experience.

Chronicle of Fagness.

>>51578768
I've run and played in LARPs. I swear they can be fun, but they can also very easily be a god awful intolerable mess of terribleness.

Obligatory request for Night Horrors: Conquering Heroes and Beast Mortal Remains.

Did those pathfags seriously call the path alternatives from the chronicler's guide homebrew?

http://www.mediafire.com/file/dgjtsu22nyaojv9/Hunter_the_Vigil_-_Tooth_and_Nail.pdf

Here you go, peoples.

Has anyone converted Legacies to 2e yet?

>>51579193
I'll be removing this file in a half hour or so off my account but by then it'll be out and about.

>>51579193
Thank you Anon.

>>51579193

Thank you fine Anon!

Any chance you might also have Night Horrors: Conquering Heroes?

>>51579196
A few, it's quite difficult in places however, due to the creation guide rules making it extremely difficult to provide certain Legacies with their pre-existing abilities. For example, for a Reality Stalker to Scry using a reality fracture, they'd need to put that into their Space 3 Attainment at a minimum simply because of sympathy, and even then it'd be there for seconds, have real troubles bypassing the Sympathetic Connection, and take a scene to use.

Also certain Legacies need a near complete re-write due to the changed nature of certain phenomenon. e.g. Clavs and the Bene Ashmadi,.

However if you're making new Legacies there are rarely as many problems.

>>51579384
I want updated Timori and will never stop complaining about it.

>>51579444
Well you're getting sixteen flavors of Tremere and you're going to like it

>>51579480
I PROBABLY WILL ACTUALLY. I hope its in the same direction as Left-Hand Path.

>>51579444
>>51579480
>>51579505

>mfw I realize DaveB will never release the promised Legacy updates, cut antagonist material or Mage FAQ

So what is required for the Bone Gnawers sacred rite of Super Bowl? Chips? A comfy couch?

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>>51579193
Listen to God senpai

If you could have any one Arcanum, what would it be?

>>51579759
1e Awakening Prime. Phantasms for days.

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>>51579090
It definitely read like homebrew. I don't get why it was so needlessly complicated. If all anon wanted was to make a more freeform experience all he has to do is do the One Realm thing, and maybe have the og Realms beomce Lands in that Realm if you want to give it some detail. One Watchtower in the center that everyone Awakens to. The circumstances determine what Land you journey through, but once you reach the top of the tower you can see them all and you inscribe your name in that place where all the Lands meet. This could also be used as kind of a unifying aspect for all Mages. Despite all the differences they may have, beholding the Supernal Realm and its wonders from atop the Watchtower is an all Mages share and one they won't ever forget.

All Arcana are common until you pick a Legacy. Until you do, you have to pay Mana for every spell, but to offset that I would still have Rotes/Praxis/Attainments be free and I would fiddle with Mana a bit, making it a more common commodity and allowing players to hold and spend more of it than in vanilla. And hey, no inferior Arcana. That's a plus.

Characters would be more defined by the Arcana they want to study and what Legacies they choose. For example, A Mage proficient in Death would not be a Moros, but a Necromancer. Maybe he studies Spirit too (the inferior Arcanum for Moros in vanilla) and is seen as more of a Medium who deals with and studies ephemeral beings, ghosts and spirits alike. He wouldn't need to be tied to Matter or Life to achieve this character concept and he wouldn't have to find a way to justify a Path and a Realm around it.

That's just how I would do it. Minimal fuss. No great revampings and upendings of Mage society and total revisions of the Supernal Realms that don't make a whole lot of sense. Maybe anon likes that, more power to him, but I prefer simpler solutions.

>>51579193
So reading the start of this, it makes Beasts out like they might be something cool. But since we know from a few threads ago that Beasts and Heroes are actually stupid bullshit I wonder if I should keep reading. It feels like a trap.

>>51579851
>It feels like a trap.
Because it is one.

>>51579887
Its still the best Beast supplement because its about killing beasts to make super Viagra.

>>51579759
>If you could have any one Arcanum, what would it be?

Forces or Fate.

They are just so damn versatile.

>>51579759
Mind

Adventuring in the Astral and turning both Goetia and people into your puppets is hello sweet.

>>51579759
Life.
Never have to sleep, bitchin' bio-mods, healing and shit, taming animals, creating animals.

It's just so fucking good.

Am I better off recruiting from SA, OPP or here if I wanted to run a game? I had bad experiences with rpg.net and gitp so I don't have very high hopes for online games anymore.

>>51580112
Recruiting for what sort of game?

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>>51579193
Thank you anon.

>>51579090

I get the feeling that people didn't really read Mage Chronicler's Guide. That'd be a shame, that book is pretty good.

>>51580112
If you really want a game, try from all three simultaneously.

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>>51578768
I'm currently in pretty decent larp group right now,
it has around 20+ players give or take.

I'm playing a character from a side family of the Giovanni from Belarus.

Good times, Just became Deputy Keeper of Elysium.

>>51579759
Real talk? Fate. Could you imagine? Your investments pay off, you win at all the gambling tables, you meet just the right women, do just the right things. Luck is the best superpower. This isn't even getting into curses and such.

>>51579759
Either Matter or Life.

>>51580246
Sad thing is though, with Fate everything you're doing is mundane.
Extraordinary, but mundane.
I'm also uncertain as to how happy you'll be when you start to realise that everything that's landing in your lap is doing so not necessarily because of any actual skill or proficiency, but because you're "lucky".

Oh look another WoD where plebs talk about MtA again...

>>51579759
For me, it'd be Time, I think.

>>51580187
If it was in the mega, they might.

>>51580112
SA if you want semi reasonable people but are ok waiting a bit
Here if you want warm bodies fast and don't care about the quality of players
OPP if you want to wait slightly less than you would for SA and are also ok with everyone being fawning sycophants for OPP.

Why is Caine sane?

>>51579759
Space. A lot of space's tricks are of limited use in the real world, but teleportation is too good to pass up.

>>51580504
He isn't

>>51580137

owod, probably wta.

>>51580201
>>51580501

I will take a look. Its hard to vet people you don't know. I will say that SA seems to do pbp but mine would be live, so that may not be an avenue for players.

>been conscious of WoD for a while
>reading some reviews for WtA actually piques my interest
>go wiki-diving
>the garou are totally retarded and weaver did nothing wrong

Am I wrong?

>>51580504

Caine is a lawn chair

>>51580651
The Weaver isn't the force of unfathomable evil and corruption, son.

The Wyrm is.

I suggest doing more research as the Garou from WtA/WtF is amazing.

>>51580707
Caine is a god beyond your childlike understanding.

>>51580811
All hail the divine lawnchair

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>>51580862

>>51580811
I'd still like to play WtA but damn do those garou have a supernatural ability to fuck up
>the creation of the BSDs
>War of Rage
>the awakening of Eater-of-Souls
>killing the Uktena and Wendigo

And then there are the "tribe falls" scenarios from Apocalypse.

>>51579843
Supernal Realms don't make sense anyway so I don't see what that would change

>>51580929
They do have a knack for fucking up but Werewolves are the most powerful Earth primal force.

I played a WtF LARP a long time ago, it was super awesome. I wish I could find another one.

>>That Totem Power though
>>Those natural connections to spirits and primal power.
>>Little physical weakness
>>Can take out a grown Vampire if smart enough.

Werewolves have little weakness in my book other their lack of organization (in most cases) and intellect (in some cases)

>>51580651

>>51580651

>autistic cosmic force becomes sentient when it shouldn't and ruins everything by stepping out of its boundaries

Nah, the Weaver did everything wrong and needs her shit pushed in.

>>51580929
hey, to their credit, the Uktena and Wendigo are still around (a shame, the Wendigo should be dead so that the Croatans could live)

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Damsel is a cute.
CUTE!

So which of the 20th anniversary book are and aren't worth it? I heard that M20 was pretty bad but I've heard nothing but praise for V20.

>>51579193
>>51579217
Can anyone repost it? I missed the download.

>>51581160
V20 and its supplements>W20>>the rest of W20 supplements (with the exception of Shattered Dreams)>a dump of shit>M20

>>51580938
>Supernal Realms don't make sense
In what way?

> I don't see what that would change
What would not change?

>>51581160

W20 core is servicable, avoid Changing Breeds. Book of rhe Wyrm is passable but still read Revised material. Sgattered Dreams should be taken with an IMMENSE amount of salt as its written by a bunch of nobodies with little or no history with wta outside of OPP anniversary products.

>>51581135
Moar of those lucious Leech jugs!

>>51581160
>I heard that M20 was pretty bad but I've heard nothing but praise for V20.

That's the way it should be, OHOHOHO.

No but seriously, M20 could have been awesome, but it turned out like complete shit. Messiest book ever.

>>51581160
>So which of the 20th anniversary book are and aren't worth it?

Well, pretty much anything from the V20 line is worth getting, obviously. Hunters Hunted II is great if you want to play as a regular mortal hunter, and Anarchs Unbound is great if you want a good book that gives some much-needed focus on the Anarchs. I'd also recommend Lore of the Clans, for new and interesting discipline cominbations and new concepts/merits, and also Rites of the Blood because it's a school about blood magic for all the sects (including anarchs) which is always awesome.

As for W20... Well, it's pretty solid over all from what I've heard. Never been that big of a fan of Werewolves, but from what I've read it seems pretty darn good.

>>51581206

This is the best assesment of W20 that I have seen so far.

>>51581268

Oh, and also V20 Dark Ages. It's a must.

And unlike the mess of its predecessors, The V20 Black Hand book is pretty awesome, except for the art (which is terrible).

>>51580811
The Wyrm is also a terrifying son-of-a-bitch. Started to consume entire planets in the ET scenario.

Still not as scary as an Archmage blowing up galaxies at the snap of their fingers.

>>51581520

No one mentioned mages. Stop fishing.

>>51581165
>Can anyone repost it? I missed the download.

Hunter - Tooth and Nail

https://www.sendspace.com/file/5cmjea

Now, can anyone share Night Horrors: Conquering Heroes?

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>>51581539
He's fishing in empty waters.

The Wyrm is the unkillable force of entropy.

>>51581185
So what's so awful about M20, I hear a lot of "it's shit" but not a lot of why

>>51581614
From what I gather it's a jumbled mess of poor mechanics and Brucato's drying crusty semen.

>>51581520

Archmages are pretty fucking beefy. Arete 9 Archmages would definitely maul The Triat relatively easily. Arete 10 is just plain plot device.

>>51581206
Don't know what you're talking about man, Changing breed's (W20th) is a good book, Rage across the world is pretty alright, Velvet Shadow is very useful for giving more wyld focused stuff along with a bunch of places to visit. White howlers tribe book is a bit short but still good for people that wanna relive the glory days or wanna run one of THOSE stories.

>>51581591
Thank you so much.

>V20
>play a Caitiff
>Me: Former ghoul, Childe of Toreador primogen that inexplicably came out wrong
>rest of party all likes me and treat me like any other vampire
>my sire hates me for being degenerate scum and perceived shame brought to her for making me
>nobody else cares what I am because when I was a ghoul I was such a legit motherfucker, so they cut me some slack

I feel like I'm cheating by not getting shit on for my lack of Clan but I also don't want to tell the GM what to do, especially when my request is to be treated worse, that might sound weird.

What do

>>51581700
Tell him you want to be treated like shit for ~roleplaying~

>>51581700
>What do
Talk to your GM so that you can both come to a solution that helps you get more satisfaction and enjoyment from the game.

>>51581668
Can you shut the fuck up and stop samefagging your own post.

Thanks.

Sincerely,
The rest of the thread who's actually on top and talking about VtM and WtA.

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>>51581259

>>51581785
>samefagging
People are getting paranoid

>>51581817
Any version without the stupid black bits?

>>51581259

2nd...

>>51581614
father's thrusting cock

>>51581785

Except VtM and WtA is absolute shit

>>51581850

Yes. But not on these boards.

Just go to, like, any R34 site and search for "Damsel" or whatever vamp strikes your fancy.

>>51581884
... Pardon?

>>51581907
meant for >>51581861

>>51581885
I didn't realize that it had a penis in it, my bad.

>>51581840
Dire times we live in. Mage Supremacists around every corner, vampfags being bullied left and right. Now Werewolf is being targeted.

NO SPLAT IS SAFE

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>>51581907

>VtM
>WtA
>Fucking shit games

>>51581928
Have you ever considered that incest would be a good topic for a throw-away line in your opening fiction? Have you ever thought about how the name a tradition has always operated under must be in some way offensive? Have you ever rolled over in bed and had the sudden realization that if you don't put a sidebar in your book then people will play the nephandi and actually turn into murderrapists in real life? If the answer to these is no, you aren't Phil Brucato.

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>>51582012
>taking the bait

>>51580874

The stinky French frog is back

>>51582012
It wasn't aimed at you fucktard

>>51581884
Lets just ignore the retarded magefag and carry on with the awesome VtM and WtA

>>51582070
Quick! Talk about knots and fortune cookies!

>>51582041
Okay you... I've considered none of these, but I'm more interested in the later two, incest isn't a new concept at all to World of darkness.

>>51581983

We all can find common ground in our contempt and loathing for Beasts (and changelings).

>>51582114
Fuck you man, Changeling (nWoD) is great! No idea about oWoD, waiting for there to be any progress on the 20th anniversary edition..

>>51582130
>No idea about oWoD
I know it wasn't very well received.

>>51582130

Changelings only exist to be bullied by Acanthus Magelords.

>>51582106
>knots
Can we not?

>>51582149
>know it wasn't very well received.
other than the people that loved it.

>>51582231
I hear it suffered from tonal issues and some confusion on the nature of uh... Glamour or whatever and whether science was 100% always banal or not. The gameline got axe'd before the glamour book could come out.

>>51582106
How do the werewolf tribes feel about gay werewolves? I know that they have a big thing about fucking tons of humans/females in order to hopefully make new wolf babies

>>51582231
Who were so few Changeling got axed midway through its run

>>51582264
Maybe they'll put that in the anniversary edition

The anniversary edition of Changeling

Changeling 20

The anniversary edition

C20

The one that is coming out before the anniversary edition of Wraith

>>51582337
They don't like the Children of Gaia much

>>51582130
>No idea about oWoD
It's pretty great if your idea of a good time is obsessing over your lost childhood and how psychiatrists are trying to kill your inner wonderfulness.

Are the GURPS versions of the oWoD books any good? Seems like it'd e easier to handle crossovers with them.

>>51582437
I mean as someone that see's a pysch, that seems a lil silly.

>>51582221
Ok, just fortune cookies then

>>51581676

Changing Breeds lacks a lot if lore and intro fiction that made the breedbooks useful and got raped mechanically by Holden.

Just use the Breedbooks from Revised.

>>51582337
I bet the filthy Black Furies are all over it

>>51582337

This is the last chance to put out another generation to participate in the Apocalypse, so its seen as everyone's solemn duty to squeeze out as many garou kids as possible.

If you want to bugger your packmate or kinfolk it will get ignored by most tribes as long you are still pumping out babies abd don't shirk that duty.

Even Black Furies do theur part and reproduce.

>>51581661
Essentially this. I actually don't think it's COMPLETELY unplayable but with as much dicking as Satyr Phil gave it it's really not terribly worth it.

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Updating the Reality Stalkers Legacy to 2e.
How does it look?

Basically here's the Attainments:
1. Detect spatial distortions in periphary, detect the "weight" of someone's mind
2. Scry certain locations (initially only Strong) through a crack, convince people you're unworthy of notice for a few seconds
3. Create a very short-lived portal through a second-attainment scrying window, and read other's thoughts
4. Teleport a short distance through the tiny fractures all across space (not needing a true crack), and impart false sensory information into another's mind (keep using constnatly for longer-term hallucinations)
5. Create a Pocket Dimension inside of a crack for a year (given no spell control, no paradox and no dissonance you could possibly have an almost infinite number of these holding nigh infinite treasures and prisoners), and read someone's mind fully at sensory range, and modify certain memories at will.

Yantras are about surveillance and being a sneaky obsessed fucker, and Oblations are about code breaking, learning secrets, and B&E.

I've been a bit lenient with the Reach in some of the Scrying/Portal spells, but I hope that's counteracted by the fact that Potency is fixed, that you have to scry through a scrying window, and various other factors are heavily limited in the Portal one (e.g. once you go through, you likely can't come back).

>>51580929
Let's not forget that they preferentially yiff.

The only exception is the Red Talons, who exclusively yiff.

>>51582171
>Acanthus nullifies Changeling's Contract
>Automatic win for the Mage
>A fancy new lawn chair

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>>51583065
Did somebody say Lawn Chairs?

>>51583078
>Mandatory Spells

Love it. Love everything about this

What would you do with Biothaumaturgy?

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THE MAGE SUPREMACISTS ARE COMING BACK

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>>51583170
post about werewolves!

Or demon. Demon seems cool but if I understand right lacks a lot of lore? I'm not even sure what they fight or what they do beyond getting people to worship them for power and sometimes trying to find old lucy

>>51583215

Iitc they have big antagonists in the forms of Earthbound demons, Lucifer's traitorous lieutenants, Angels and so on.

Hunters as well. Mmmmaybe vampires but they would trash most non-elders easily.

>>51583264
>Hunters as well
I can't imagine that ever ends well for the hunters

>>51583273
Can you imagine anything that ever ends well for a hunter?

>>51583065
Niggah that ain't happening, you cant just nullify their deal with the wyrd.

>>51583427
You most certainly can. Almighty David Brookshaw said so!

>>51583439
And this is why nobody can take Mage seriously.

http://vocaroo.com/i/s0xcSVIVwgGH

>>51583439
Fucking show me, hombre

>>51583215
>Or demon. Demon seems cool but if I understand right lacks a lot of lore? I'm not even sure what they fight or what they do beyond getting people to worship them for power and sometimes trying to find old lucy

Earthbound demons are the main antagonists, alongside the fuckheads that worship them (ie, the Baali and Dark Thaumaturgists) or the ones that get manipulated by them into attacking the "regular" demon-possessed folks.

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>>51583457
Can you handle the Supernal Truth?

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/1009776-how-do-changelings-and-mages-feel-about-each-other/page2

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/changeling-the-lost/1017490-a-matter-of-iron/page5

>>51583339
Yeah man, most neonate hunts, dealing with pyschics or anything that isn't about to rape you.

>>51582337
>How do the werewolf tribes feel about gay werewolves?

Most don't care, though being 100% unwilling to sire more werewolves is seen by many to be both stupid and unethical, considering they have a duty to sire offspring in order to SAVE THE WORLD.

If you can't man up/woman up enough to sire a child for the benefit of the Garou nation, then the Garou nation will most often tell you to fuck off.

They're not saying you gotta love the idea of it (or well, some of them might, but those are assholes), but the tribe (and the nation as a whole) is heavily in love with the idea of sacrificing yourself for the betterment of the world.

So yeah, sure, it's not an optimal situation, but it's either suck it up and live with it, or get branded as an outcast.

>>51583481
Niggah that says Changelings cna fuck up Acanthus magic as well as it takes a Adept of fate to do this shit. That's 3 gnosis and 4 fate my dood, that's 14 exp at the very least if you started the game with 3 Fate.

>>51583427
>Practice of Unmaking can't unmake a Fate contract
Fuckin' watch me mate

>>51580059
>Never have to sleep

that's a mind effect though

>>51583579
>Denial

>>51583579
Actually it's 4 XP, as you can trade in 10 starting merit points for +2 Gnosis.

>>51583481

So according to Dave, Mages are the absolute worst things Changelings, Demons and Werewolves can face. Realistically, I believe him.

>>51583170
>THE MAGE SUPREMACISTS ARE COMING BACK

KNEEL BEFORE ZOD, ERR.... MAGES!

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>>51583602
Nope.

>>51583594
Good luck getting up to gnosis five fate five you kike

>>51583615
chargen merit points are just EXP man, come on, they work exactly the same as exp, this ain't starting dots from 1e.

>>51583579
>Changelings can fuck up Acanthus magic

Not really. No, not really. It has always been the other way around. So sayeth Dave.

>>51583637
Well yeah.
Two of those three are about hiding from horrible shit, and Mages are all about digging stright into your personal life with an ice pick.
And the third is about trying to maintain control of an Ecosystem full of frequently quite alien Spirits, which Mages can't help but want to bend to their will and stick their dicks in.

Mages are assholes.

>>51583648
>chargen merit points are just EXP man
No they fucking aren't, you can't spend them on anything but merits and gnosis.

Also the fact that from character creation PCs can't do something, or that it's hard to do doesn't mean it's irrelevant.

Mages are capable of destroying Changeling contracts.
Changelings are capable of turning Mages into babies then throwing them into pits full of spikes.

Stop getting so butthurt.

>>51583637
>Mages are the absolute worst things Changelings, Demons and Werewolves can face.

And vampires, prometheans, beasts, hunters, etc.

When a primary theme of a gameline is the corrupting influence of super-reality bending power, problems are to be expected in crossover.

I'm curious if OPP intends to somehow artificially limit mages in the upcoming Crossover Chronicles.

>>51579759

Probably Mind. It seems like it would be the one that let me do the most good for the world and still be a good time personally speaking.

Boosting, say, every member of the US Congress to ~logic 10 wits 10 ought to have a pretty profound impact.

>the magefags have come to jerk off again
well it was fun while it lasted

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>>51583670
Yeah, he said what I just said you fuck, quoting him directly here.

>>51583706
Ah you're right, sorry I'm not sure why I thought you could spend merit dots on attributes or skills, I might have been confusing it with freebie points in oWoD.

>>51583706
>doesn't understand ear marked funding
merits function almost exactly like exp. Anon point still stands. it costs mad money to specialize in fucking changelings

>>51583579
>Changelings cna fuck up Acanthus magic

No. Unlike changelings, mages aren't reliant on fate/Wyrd/etc. for their power. An Acanthus or any mage proficient in Fate can wreck a changeling's life (and the other Arcana are also not shabby in the event of conflict)

>>51583766
>What is reading comprehension

Dave was referring to the Acanthus, you moronic fucking moron. Mages are dicks and will fuck you over even after they help you.

>>51583579
>>51583615
>>51583706

Don't forget that in additional to regular XP, mages also simultaneously gain Arcane XP that can be devoted to Gnosis, Arcana, Attainments, Rotes, etc.

They can also use magic to give themselves conditions to resolve just to gain XP.

>>51583774
Are you going to explain that using the detailed mechanistic or are you just going to meme like all the other anons?

>>51583768
>It costs mad money to specialize in fucking changelings
Fate 4 is far from specialising in changelings specifically.
With it you can fuck with swarm behaviour in ludicrous ways, encourage/forbid certain behaviours from people, cause happenstance to lead you to certain results.
Plus all your earlier Fate spells, which are also extremely potent, just got one step stronger.

>>51583766
An actual Dave quote stating an Acanthus will fuck over a Changeling if it suits his whims.

Nice.

>>51583427
>>51583594
>>Practice of Unmaking can't unmake a Fate contract

Not only can the Fate Practice of Unmaking completely nullify a contract, it can obliterate a changeling (and most anything else).

Mages are scary, Masters mages are friggin' terrifying.

>>51583812
>what are Blood beats
>what are power stat beats?
That's not special that's been being integrated into the system for a while now.

>>51583841
>it can obliterate a changeling (and most anything else)
The Changeling part I could get, they're literally made partially of Wyrd now, having had to bargain with the Wyrd to survive in Arcadia.
Remove that, and they fall apart like a bag torn at the seams.

But everything else? How?

>>51583843

Did you miss the part where mages can easily give themselves conditions to (also easily) resolve with magic that generate beats, and it's entirely consistent with the setting?

>>51583879
Aren't they protected from that kinda shit by the Wyrd? Like how woofs are protected by Luna and Vampires are protected by... BLood gods? Whatever those are?

>>51583889
No decent ST would allow that

Is Lady Gaga a changeling?

>>51583911
No, she's a beast.

>>51583896
That only works on Archmasters using Imperial Magic. The "sponsors" don't give a shit otherwise.

>>51583896
Changelings have an innate connection to the Wyrd, so I imagine they could contest that power with a Clash of Wills, probably Embracing the Wyrd at the same time.

But Werewolves and Vampires don't really have a main-line connection to their patron force. So I'm uncertain if they would get a Clash of Wills.

>>51583879

Mage, p. 124.

"Unmaking spells annihilate subjects under the Arcanum’s
purview entirely. Life can be snuffed like a candle
(Life), two locations can be forced into each other by
destroying the distance between them (Space), even Hallows
and Verges can be wiped from the Earth (Prime).
Unmaking spells are beyond inflicting direct damage
with attacks; a successful Unmaking destroys the target
altogether."

What do you think happens when you completely remove a target's connections to fate and fortune. It will not be pretty.

>>51583823
>Adepts of an Arcane are powerful
congratulations woot good for you. you want a cookie kid? it's like specializing into Death just to fuck over vampires. it's always been a tradeoff.
>what are opportunity costs?
you can't be great at everything, and you'll always have blind spots.

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>>51583900
The book addresses that, actually.
Also remember, to get that beat you've got to actually resolve the condition.
Which will likely make the game more interesting.

Also if it rustles your jimmies that much, introduce Group Beats.
Even if one person's kicking up a stink with rampant beat whoring, all of a sudden he only gets 1/4 or perhaps 1/5 of those Beats.

>>51583930
Wouldn't the tattoo's they get seared into their flesh and soul, as ordained by luna, count as a mainline protection for werewolves?

I don't even get the blood gods, who the fuck would protect vampires.

>>51583930
I highly doubt that Clash of Wills will come into play. But, it IS up to the ST.

>>51583936
>It will not be pretty.
I would have more thought that the world would just completely ignore them.
It's not immediately terminal, but I wouldn't discount the odds of suicide after about a month or two.

I just beat V:TM Bloodlines for the first time, as a Toreador. Is it worth going through again?

>>51583951

It was suggested/implied that an Archmaster of Death created the Kindred. So a super-wizard protects them if you believe that.

>>51583951
I don't really know much about Woof woof the Woofening, so quite possibly.

Also nobody cares about Vampires.
The mosquitos probably wouldn't get a Clash.
Hilariously though, Unmaking Death on a Vampire could possibly just return it to life.

>>51583900

Dave discussed how creating and resolving conditions is entirely consistent with the setting. It's little more than a mage (obsessively) confronting and practicing with his Arcana.

>>51583936
>completely remove a target's connections to fate and fortune
He becomes his own man. His destiny is unwritten and he can choose new paths in his life

Why can't Prime unmaking destroy a mage's template ?

>>51583981
It's also suggested they were created by the Stryxis, or they were just garden variety assorted bloodsuckers until they all banded together, and various other explanations.

It's something for the ST to decide, if they care to.

>>51584008
>>51583950
You guys must be a blast to play with

>>51584014
Are you saying a Master of fate made MGTOWs?

>>51584017
Actually I'm well fucking aware of how retarded it can be, and have enough social fucking grace to know where and when it's appropriate.

But if someone wants to use Mind Magic to laden down their character with a crippling cocaine addiction so they can improve the story, and get beats in the process, I'll fucking let them.

>>51578768
It was my first time actually playing WoD. In high school most of my group turned their nose up at VtM. Even the guy who came to our D&D group as a WoD player decided to keep the school roleplaying club pure D&D after some of the more eccentric fans approached our members about doing a Vampire game. Sometimes I think back and wonder if we should have let them in and done something with that. Years later that same WoD cum D&D player invited me to a VtR LARP. I had fun, met some great people and got to play in the last four games they had. Didn't come in a great time, I guess. I had been checking out the Exalted General just as that began and then looked into other nWoD games through the years. Geist looked interesting, but as everyone's mentioned it had nowhere to drive the story. I do have some hopes for the 2E. I didn't buy any books until the Demon Kickstarter.

>>51583981
Imperial Mysteries pg 36

>"rumor has it that archmages of Death have infl icted the curse of vampirism in the past"

>>51584072
Exactly, that's:
1. Rumor
2. Bestowing Vampirism, not creating it

>>51584087
>never said bestowed

>>51584087
Calm down biased Vampfag. You're stating the obvious. I bet you're sweating in fear.

>>51584014
>Why can't Prime unmaking destroy a mage's template ?

A Prime Unmaking spell cast on a mage would be 'interesting,' and I imagine very 'uncomfortable.'

>>51584125
I'm actually a Magefag.

>>51584014
>>51584128

You can't delete Templates until Archmastery. There's a difference between nullifying a Changeling's Contract and all-together turning them back into a normie.

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>>51583972
>I just beat V:TM Bloodlines for the first time, as a Toreador. Is it worth going through again?

Yes, most definitely.

Nosferatu and Malkavian are both worth a playthrough: Nosferatu will force you to rely on stealth and will get you a lot of remarks about your appearance from... well, anybody you meet.

Malkavian will change *every* single line that the player can use in dialogue with other people.

Whereas a normal Vamp might say "Oh, hello, so your name is Jeanette? Nice to meet you!", the malkavian PC will immediately go "AH, THE WHITE DAUGHTER OF JANUS!" before Jeanette even has a chance to introduce herself.

Even hardened and old NPCs will give you a wide berth if you play as a Malkavian, and you'll get a lot of insight-moments. When you talk to Ming-Xiao she almost immediately goes "What wretched, cursed strain of Caine is this?!", and normal folks will just freak out, heh.

>>51584008

And just like phil the goatboy when he tells us where to eat any self respecting DM is gonna ignore him.

>>51584140
However you can wind back the clock to when they didn't have their Template with Temporal Summoning.

According to DaveB.
At least, for Vampires.
I don't know about most of the others.

>>51583950
>Also if it rustles your jimmies that much, introduce Group Beats.

What Arcana control jimmie rustling?

>>51584182
Life or mind.

>>51584141
>Nosferatu will force you to rely on stealth
That's what I was already doing as a Toreador. Stealth is ridiculously easy. Even with just 5 I could bump into people and not get noticed. Cranking it up to 7 or 8 with Bloodbuff was just too good.

>Malkavian will change *every* single line that the player can use in dialogue with other peo
Oh wow. Yeah I'm doing that.

I'll have to suffer through the Warrens again, though... That section was about 3 times longer than it should have been.

>>51584045
Basically the whole lack of specifics when players apply their magic leaves the ST to just do whatever they want.

I seriously doubted the Mage supremacist argument until I read the later part of this thread.

Perhaps Dave loves his wizards a bit too much?

There a Fate 5 Unmaking spell in the core, p. 139-140 - Pariah.

It doesn't obliterate the target, rather it's a terrible curse which will almost certainly result in the target's slow and horrible death.

Acanthus are terrible people.

#TeamObrimos
#EverybodyLikesAngels

>>51584253
There's an Acanthus Legacy that inflicts devastating punishment on the cruel and bestows good fortune on the deserving.

They're not all bad.

>>51584249

These threads have served a purpose at least; utensured I will never run a Mage game, much less play in one or even with one in a crossover.

>>51584253
What level of Prime do I need to rip the mana out of people

>>51584249
>perhaps Dave loves his wizards a bit too much?

Possibly, but Mage's themes predate Dave.

Mage is about the corrupting influence of humans suddenly possessing great power and virtually no boundaries.

If the power wasn't really great, the setting wouldn't work.

Given that mage's adversaries are top tier, the power levels work within the gameline. While crossover is mechanically possible, thematic incongruity will always cause problems.

>>51584268
>Acanthus are not all bad

Tell that to changelings (or other mages).

>>51584268
Not all people are bad. that is a meaningless statement mage are people and have the capacity of good and ill. the only difference is the ease of which they can flatten and project their ire. In a room of knife fighters the mage has the only gun

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>>51584332

YOU'RE JUST JEALOUS

>>51584305

Channel Mana - Prime 3.

It's unclear what practice is required to *convert* people to mana to absorb.

>>51578768
I have been for the past 13 years. I am also currently running a Masquerade LARP with an average of 25-30 people.

>>51584353
>In a room of knife fighters the mage has the only gun

In a room of knife fighters, the mage has the only *thermal detonator*.

FIFY.

>>51584363
>It's unclear what practice is required to *convert* people to mana to absorb
Death Fraying, "Devouring the Slain".
Cause lethal damage to people to gain an equivalent amount of Mana.

Fun fact, the damage caused is not resistant, so you can heal them back up and do it again.
Of course, this is a horrifying torment-based battery for Supernal Magic, and horrendously destructive to Wisdom.

Unless you base a Moros Life Legacy, or a Thyrsus Death Legacy on it.
At which point you can do it all you like, on Sleepers, without Paradox, without risking Wisdom loss.

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>>51584141
Oh yeah, this is off to a great start.

>>51584354

In the fiction anthology, didn't Lucy Sulphate die of cancer because she and her friends foolishly never studied Life?

#FateCantDoEverything
#NotSoSupremeNow

Oh God I don't have Bloodbuff
I won't be able to pick any lock now

>>51584490
Oh wait yes I do, disregard me I suck rats

>>51584428

Prime should be able to directly convert people (or objects) to mana without all the baggage required of Devouring the Slain.

My guess it would require Prime 4 Patterning or Unraveling.

It would also probably be a very big hit to Wisdom to do it to a person (which probably wouldn't include sleepers if you asked any Mystagogue).

>>51584468

But you can live a cancer free life using Fate... ... ...

>>51584522

Someone obviously forgot to tell Lucy, or she's just an Acanthus embarrassment.

>>51584604
Lucy also didn't know of any Life Mages? Not even a Thyrsus? Yep, embarrassment.

>>51584515
That would also require Life 4, because you're radically transforming biological matter, rather than channeling the simple symbology of Death.

Also yes, Mystagogues can be cunts, but honestly I don't get this "all Mystagogues think Sleepers are worthless Abyss-Monkeys" Meme. They're not all Daksha.

>>51584632
I mean, bare minimum? It seems Fating the treatment to be successful would be the first thing that comes to mind.

>>51584249
Usually I don't get involved in this kind of discussion because I think it's dumb, but I don't want Mage Supremacists souring people on the game itself, although it is sadly understandable when you have retards shoving how badly their favorite splat can fuck your favorite splat in everyone's faces.

My favorite splat is Mage. Not because it lets me become a ridiculously powerful wizard that can bully Changelings hardcore, but because I've always loved magic in fiction and I love Mage's themes of mysteries and hubris. That's the allure of the game for me. Doing cool shit with magic, using it creatively to investigate and problem solve, and struggling to maintain a connection to normal life as your power grows (or letting go of normalcy altogether). That's why I like to play Mage. It's fun.

But I enjoy other games too, like Vampire. My group ran Werewolf a few times too and it was fun. When Changeling 2e comes out I want to give it a try. These games all have their own merits, and they aren't lesser just because Mages have a higher ceiling and more room for flexibility power-wise. That's their bag. The other splats all have their bags. Please note that I said "have a higher ceiling" instead of "are always stronger", because Mages aren't always stronger, despite what some jackasses in this thread want you to think. Mages can be beaten and killed like anyone else, especially if they have as much hubris as your average Mage Supremacist.

Blog post over.

>>51584522
How much fate to cure the incurable?

>>51584694
so the treatment has about a 10% to work. but you've got to actually have that chance for it to work. Fate lets you choose which road to go down. But if all the roads lead to dead ends what do?

Over the past few weeks I've been working through the Mage 2E core book. Trying to get a balance of reading through it page by page and bouncing around to relevant parts. In the section describing Tools it goes into 'Path Tools' and lists Coins, Cups, Mirrors, Rods, and Weapons, but doesn't list which they correspond to. I'm missing something here, I think. What are, say, Obrimos Path Tools?

>>51583673
Mages still can't pierce Cover or Concealment Infrastructure with Magesight or Unveilings.

>>51584867
Source for that?

>>51584867
>>51584934
I'd be interested in that too since I'm running a game where that is about to become relevant.

>>51584856

All mages can use any of the five Path tools for spells appropriate for such tool.

The catch is that in order to use the tool as a Yantra, it needs to be of the appropriate type or material.

For instance, an Acanthus would need a crystal or silver wand or cup, while an Obrimos would need a gold or steel wand or cup.

>>51584856
>Obrimos Path Tools?
A religious Book(truth) or a remote (electrical signals)
forget what the book says and crack open a book of symbolism. work from there

>>51584960
Interesting. Seems to me that steel makes the Obrimos requirement on weapons kind of easy. Does this mean I can turn a Gerber pocket knife into a path tool?

>>51584867
Gonna need a source for that, hombre.

>>51584867
I agree with >>51585053 we will need some proof.

Magefags can back their shit up. Can you?

>>51584867
They can pierrce Cover... provided the Angel or Unchained flubs their Spoof roll.

>>51584468
Seriously? That's hilarious. I only know her through appearing in the Mekhet clan book when Frances ran into her but I honestly hated her more than her Mastigos friend who was clearly meant to be the hateable mage.

>>51585104
It also makes no sense, whatsoever. Fate is enough to deny cancer from ever coming up The average life-expectancy for the Awakened is well beyond ninety, due to the various ways of prolonging pristine health.

>>51584735
That all well and good until the Crossover Chronicle comes out and outright endorses Mage Supremacy.

For my part, while I was mostly 'meh' with regards to MtAw 1e, I've found 2e to be an outright turn-off. Mechanics, themes, fluff, it all combinds into a game that I actively dislike. The supremacy fags are slowly transforming that dislike into loathing though. I suspect once the CrossChron hits slide into an outright hatred.

>>51585292
To me it's mostly that Awakening 2E just doesn't feel like a horror game.

>>51585292
>The supremacy fags are slowly transforming that dislike into loathing though. I suspect once the CrossChron hits slide into an outright hatred.

I agree, this threads have taught me that games should keep the splat separated.

Oh great. I thought the only difference was between oWoD and nWoD, but apparently 1e and 2e oWoD are both different things too.

>>51585163
She clearly didn't think to cast those spells. What else would you expect from a DJ turned wannabe manipulator mage?

>>51585369
She could have just contact one of the many Life Mages. See what I mean? It's like she never once considered the existence of a Thyrsus.

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>>51585292
I can imagine the butthurt

>When a party of supernaturals come together the Mage is more likely to lead them since they are the strongest and most wise on top of that they fight the most dangerous enemies the world has ever seen daily and since they are humans they have capacity for being the most monstrous but also being shining beacons of hope and everything in between because mages are the end-all be-all the other supernaturals only live to serve them

>>51585337

That's what happens when the only antagonists the PCs can't steamroll are other mages. If the opposition doesn't have countermagic capability, well, then it's not really opposotion at all in a 2e mage game.

>>51585351
There are three editions of oWoD man, two editions of nWoD. Though to be honest you could argue 20th anniversery editions is 4e and that the new white wolf ones are 5e so.... ya know. There's a lot of oWoD

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I FUCKING LOVE PHIL BRUCATO

>>51585392
>>51585369
>>51585163

Lucy apparently was not a very impressive mage, nor was she well liked among other local mages.

She neither had the magical proficiency to cure or delay the cancer, nor anyone willing to help her at a reasonable cost.

Also, the story with Lucy's cancer is "Imaginary Skin," by Wood Igham (Malcolm Sheppard), and it's in the Mage Fiction Anthology,

>>51585419
>three editions of oWoD
Varies by line. Vampire has five, Werewolf and oMage have four, VDA has three, the rest have one or two.

>>51585469

God, Brucato is such a enormous douche.

>>51585469
I didn't know he was part of the Cult of Ecstasy

But it makes sense with the whole satyr thing

>>51585418
>when the only antagonists the PCs can't steamroll are other mages

Huh? Are you just forgetting the Abyss and its anti-reality horrors, not to mention various other top tier spirit, ghost, lower depth, etc. antagonists, various and sundry.

Mages fight antagonists on their level and above within their own game line. It doesn't worry about crossover, just like every other gameline except Beast.

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>>51583013
I also just tried to update The House of Ariadne.
Thoughts?

Is it possible for a mage, a demon, a werewolf and a vampire to be friends?

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>>51585576
With benefits?

>>51585604
Just between the werewolf and the mage

>>51585576

No, jealousy of the mage will cause too many problems.

>>51585576
Yes but everyone is just a little bit of a douche to each other. Also the Demon is terrified that the others will get their minds read by a hunter angel.

>>51585471
Doesn't say she died of cancer.

>>51585471
So she's an unliked social character who doesn't even use her magic to help herself in the most dire circumstance.

Actually thinking on it, the one in her story who helps Frances out is her friend too. All she does is see through Obfuscate and then do fucking nothing. Lucy is fucking useless

>>51585613

Mages confirmed for loving the knot.

>>51585647
>mage just retcons hunter angels from existing
I dont seen an issue

>>51585654

I hate werefags with a passion

>>51585649
>Doesn't say she died of cancer.

It's implied after she doesn't get the knife.

>>51585682
You wouldn't be able to do that in a crossover, ya dumbo, at least try :^)

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>>51585744
Shut up and bend over

>>51585613
Shut up McKenzie.

>>51585782
>cast Repel with a werewolf knot modifier
Not today bb.

>>51585744
Great, now imagine you are the werefag and the rest of the thread is you in this scenario and you'll have a good idea how the rest of us feel about Magefags

>>51585809
Aww your no fun

>>51585826
>Werefags
>Magefags
>Vampfags

THEY'RE ALL THE SAME FUCKIN' THING

>>51585471

>Wood Ingraham (Malcolm Sheppard)

I'm probably reading this wrong but just in case: those are two seperate writers and not the same person.

>>51585861
>Wood Ingraham (Malcolm Sheppard)

Same person, just a pseudonym.

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>>51585852

Don't you fucking DARE compare me to those fat goth vampfags. You think werefags are any better?

>Mage supremacy

>>51585888

No, they're two seperate people.

>>51585852
But Anon, Magefags are better in every way, haven't you heard?

>>51585904
Have you ever seen them in the same room at the same time?

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>>51585902
Werewolves are cool, fucking nerd

>>51585961

My god, we're beyond the looking glass!

>>51585528
Things that use the Ephemeral Being rules have Withstand ratings equal to their *Rank* rather than their Resistance, which makes them pathetically easy to neutralize.
Again, if it ain't a mage, or some sort of Supernal critter that can also do Magic, then it's a speed bump at best.

I wonder how long /CofD/ would last if every Anon here had turned into their favorite supernatural.

Not that it wouldn't be an epic end.

With Mage winning.

>>51586021
>with mage winning
Why would we even fight?

>>51586027
So you would just watch in amusement as the raging werefags and vampfags killed themselves over a disagreement between knots and goth makeup?

>>51586021

>Get turned into a Promethean

Well, I guess I'll go a hobo journey.

>>51586004
>Things that use the Ephemeral Being rules have Withstand ratings equal to their *Rank* rather than their Resistance, which makes them pathetically easy to neutralize.
>Again, if it ain't a mage, or some sort of Supernal critter that can also do Magic, then it's a speed bump at best.

This.

its basically Mage vs Mage. Mage vs abyss critter. Or gtfo.

Personally i got a lot mileage as DM out of Mage vs mage in a world were they are the only splat in existence. Humans being a threat only in the most insignificance or contrive of ways. And ghost/spirits been a threat until the thyrsus/moros show up and made them into the spirit/ghost of a lawnchair.

>>51586021
Magefags turning into real life Mages?

Don't even joke about that.

>>51586021
Doesn't that depend on the level that everyone starts at?

>>51586047
If we were all newbie versions of our favorite splat wouldn't the demonfags murder the fuck out of everyone?

>>51586095
Demonfags don't exist, anon.

How much would change if one got rid the 'ignore Withstand on Exceptional Success' option?

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>>51586095
No rules were given. I automatically become an Archmaster and shit on ALL of you.

>>51586077
>>51586095
Yeah wouldn't the demonfags and mummyfags or hell even the werefags be better at low level?

>>51586122
A lot of Magefags running up to DaveB crying and looking for guidance.

>>51586128
werefags would murder the fuck out of vampirefags and magefags but unless im wrong mummy would be the overall winner since they start out at their strongest point

>>51586168
See >>51586123

>>51586122
>How much would change if one got rid the 'ignore Withstand on Exceptional Success' option?

Not that much. Potency usually is equal to Arcanum level, and adepts and masters have very large dice pools, particularly with rotes, praxes and use of additional yantras.

All that would likely happen is that mages would be sure to take an extra direct attack rote or praxis.

>>51586122
Praxes would be a hell of a lot less useful.

>>51586177
Shush no ones talking to you

>>51586021
How long the discussion would keep going if we all turned into our favorite splat or how long we'd survive? I think I could do well as an Unchained. Would that mean the I became the Demon or the Cover?

>>51586319
I'd probably just get really pissed and smash my computer then go murder a bunch of people in a fit of rage

>>51586118
I believe here's where I go all notice me senpai, if I'm right on the memes.

>>51586319
I'd be kinda fucked, I mean, I'd be a changeling and that'd mean I was raped and even more mentaliy disturbed than I alredy am.

>>51586344
>outing yourself to the god machine, whatever the actual demons fight
good job

>>51586355
Never Here

>>51586183
But that's still a fair chunk of exp devoted to raising Gnosis and just one Arcana, so that's not something that'll be an issue right away.

>>51586355
Also, if you're wondering, when the Unchained have to do serious fighting it's generally against Hunter Angels designed specifically to bring in rogue operatives.

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>>51586177
The Storyteller has more power than you'll ever have! He gave you your power, he could take it away!

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>>51586437
Nnnnooooooooooooooo!!!

Real talk, why hasn't there been a WoD game about Genies?

>>51586632
Genies lack free will

>>51586122

The alien concept of "difficulty" gets introduced in mage. Which is of course agaisnt the themes of Awakening of everything should be easy and power corrupts by being as heavy handed as archmagely possible.

>>51586639
Not so, to my knowledge, in Arabic or Islamic mythologies, which seems like the source to go to first.

>>51586632

Meh, genies are just spirits of fulfillment with delusions of grandeur.

>>51586769
>>51586805
>Djinn: the Conjuring
>Protagonists have actually been possessed by the Djinn in question as opposed to the three wishes schtick, their personality completely supplanted by the Djinn
>The wish fulfilment angle comes from their ability to summon Goetia and entire locations from the Astral Realms as well as freely travel there.
>Astral based magic and and schtick

Thoughts?

>>51587208