/HRTGen/ HRT General

Can I drink alcohol while on HRT?

is this regiment per day possibly harmful in any way? i haven't had any blood tests yet.
8mg of progynova
300mg of spiro
200mg microgest

>>8508688
You could, it's not an issue with immediate consequences it's more an issue that it increases your chance for liver disease while on AAs

>>8508681
Is it possible to get on anything besides Spiro if you're "official" in the US?

>>8508698
pissing like a racehorse

>>8508681
pharmacy just tried to charge me $87 for estrogen. is America a wasteland or is there some way I can get a less fascist price on this?

At what month should I begin expecting body hair to thin? I'm on for 2 months now and I'm entering tanner stage 2 with my breasts. The buds are firm and tender and the breast tissue is coming along as expected.

Except my entire torso has male hair equivalent and isn't slowing down, and I'm not in a position to wax or epilate (Financially and out of being unable to pull the strip because low pain tolerance; I tried once. I'd have to pay for waxing done professionally-- In the future, but not in this current point in time)
I see no slow down of my body hair. I know some women get hairy nipples, but this is different thing entirely.

I'm on Cyproterone and Estrofem, as well as Dutasteride and there's no slow down.

>>8508688
4 drinks a week and no more; If you binge (Around 10 in a single day) you can damage your liver to be unable to recover and process medications for around a month.
Alcohol just weakens the effectiveness of your liver processing medications.

>>8509132
Sometimes the hair doesn't reduce much, just grows slower. I'd really recommend just getting used to epilating. It's only painful at the start

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>>8509132
This is gonna be kinda gross but as you can see from the image I have a LOT of body hair. Well, you can see a very clear line where the hair is thinner. I shaved from there down around the day I started HRT and three and a half months later that's all that has grown, and, to repeat, that was around when I started. I'm also 21 if it matters (I know body hair does change until 30s), but I think it varies a lot in this case if I had that change instantly and you still have none.

> Cypro 1 and a half months

still get random boners....when will the pain end?

I finally got Spiro I couldn't find stradiol valerate so I bought conjugated estrogens also I got information where to get stradiol so next weekend I will try to get it... the question is Should I start now with conjugated estrogens and spiro?

>>8511925
yeah go ahead and start now. the conjugated estrogens are better than nothing.

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Question anyone in burger land get prescribed Cypro cause spiro taste like shit if you swallow it wrong and I'm not fond of peeing every minute and the horrible stomach pains when you miss a dose. Reason I ask is due to me passing out in a shower and my mom finding me my parents want me to go legit and I'm pretty sure cypro is not FDA approved so bring on the spiro I guess. But it's temporary till I get a letter for an orchie btw anyone had that done?

>>8511925
conjugated E is dangerous and increases cancer risks

>>8512476
>increases cancer risks
so does regular estradiol, and testosterone, and lots of beneficial medications. the point is that the slightly increased risk is outweighed by the benefits, and she won't be on it for long anyway.

>>8509169
Yeah HRT does thin out hair like that, I noticed the exact same thing as you.
I still epilate though since the body hair simply thinned out a bit, it didn't actually go away. After about a year of epilating it's pretty easy to maintain so I'm pretty happy overall.
I've definitely noticed epilating is more effective on HRT than pre-HRT. My leg and arm hair still grows but it turned into blonde hair ridiculously fast after getting on HRT whereas before epilating kind of turned it blonde but nothing like it is now.

I think you're going to be very very disappointed if you simply sit around waiting for hair to disappear. I'd even argue just shaving is a complete waste of time. At minimum you need to wax/epilate and from there consider laser or electrolysis if your hair still bothers you.
But coming from a former chewbacca epilating really turned things around for me and I have no desires for laser anymore.

>>8512626
Not them but what brand of epilator would you recommend cause there are so many and did you use it on your face too that is my biggest problem area desu.

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I'm going to self med. I have the option to get a micronized 17-beta Estradiol (generic) wich is 28 pills with 1mg of estradiol each one. This means i should take 2 pills, one at night, and one at morning?

Also, there's another version of these pills, slightly more expensive, wich is composed of 1mg Estradiol + 0,5mg norethisterone enanthate. Is it better than the first one?

(I'm going to take cypro as AA if that changes anything)

>>8512751
I've used it on my face before yeah. For face I manually plucked out the hairs one by one for like 20-30mins a day for a couple weeks though just to thin it out. Same with pubes, pluck by hand until you've removed like 60-70% of the hair and then epilate it. After that it's easy to maintain.
Certain body parts like your legs may look quite horrible for like a year because only something like 15-20% of your leg follicles are growing at any one time and it can take up to 1-2 years to actually pluck every single follicle and weaken it.

I use the emjoi emagine 72-tweezer which is good for bulk amounts of hair. But I've been contemplating getting the braun silk epil 7 or silk epil 9 as many people say it's better.

Is it good to take estrogen supplements ( like pueraria mirifica ) in addition to estrogen pills, or will that further increase blood pressure...

I swear that HRT timeline chart is just a meme it took me like a week or two to get most of the effects it says take 3-6 months for onset, like hair, boobs, skin, libido

>>8512803
It's kind of pointless to take weaker estrogens alongside HRT. If you think you're not getting enough estrogen then take more estrogen, don't take estrogenic supplements which are just weaker forms of what you're already on.
Unless you're looking for other benefits that come from certain supplements

>>8512399

Thanks for the answers I'm just hesitating to starting it because I have to work this weekend I wonder if I'd be able to function normally around my coworkers and more important doing my job correctly.

So what to expect the first weekend on HRT I just took spiro and I just notice I'm going to the bathroom more often but it's not a problem I've always go to the bathroom very often even in my job.

Also I read conjugated E might cause hair loss I hope it's only in women...

>>8512440
From personal experience before starting Spiro, I used to pass out in the shower when I was dehydrated and was not eating enough salt.
It also was only an issue when the water I showered under was too hot, because what would happen is the capillaries in my skin would open up and my blood pressure would drop suddenly.

>>8512957
Hmm I was taking a really hot shower at the time so that makes sense I guess and the panic attack I had yesterday was also in hot water mabye hrt made me more sensitive to heat. I'm just kinda nervous of getting off Cypro it's been awesome but I suppose spiro can do the same stuff.

>>8512777
Thanks so much for the advice anon on this one like I use magic shave for my body hair but it just like grows right back. I'm looking at the Braun silk epil 7 it's pretty reasonably priced. I do want to get laser but where I live there are not to many LGBT friendly businesses.

>>8512933
Too much of any hormone can cause hair loss. If you have good levels you wont lose your hair with MTF Hormones.
You'll lose hair if you notice liver pain and head pain that is very visibly painful. If this happens it means you've got too much hormones running around in you (Like doubling up)

>>8513303
>Thanks so much for the advice anon on this one like I use magic shave for my body hair but it just like grows right back. I'm looking at the Braun silk epil 7 it's pretty reasonably priced. I do want to get laser but where I live there are not to many LGBT friendly businesses.
Yeah I was thinking of getting the silk epil 7. The epil 9 is the same thing, just wider head. But actually having wide heads like that is tough to get into tight spots like in your groin area.
The emjoi one is pretty beefy and sure if you have a lot of hair it's like running a combine through a thick field, but for maintenance it kind of sucks.

I've always just been too nervous to go for laser. I really want to though, but I'm kind of boymode and finding lgbt friendly clinics or male friendly clinics is kind of difficult. Plus I don't have the money for it right now.

it's been several months since i last reordered, is qhi still cheapest for estrogen?

How bad is the jump from 18 to 20?
Was just looking at pics of myself from 2015 and I look so much... older now. I have wrinkles, my skins rougher, features droopier, hairlines fucking terrible
Is this normal? In the month past month I've caught 2 new types of wrinkle pop up and in the past 6, lines at the corner of my mouth. My facial hair is coming in insane now, if I don't shave even one day I look horrible. I-is this just t?
I still feel like my skin should be better :\ Definitely have new wrinkles

>>8514343
Well it really depends on the person.

Are you pretty stressed, depressed, etc.? Do you drink lots of alcohol? Drugs? etc.
A lot of things can make you age quickly.
Also make sure you have a balanced diet. Eats tons and tons of antioxidants as well.

is biotin good to take with hrt?

>>8514391
Well it couldn't hurt. I don't know how effective biotin really is though.

>>8514352
My diet is the main thing I think
I've been doing my best to change it but.. I'm still aging I think and I'm not rich so I've been depressed over there not really being any way to reverse it. I feel a lot more masculine and rugged because of the changes and now I'm not entirely sure if I should pursue HRT anymore

>>8514465
Well if you're only 20 that's still pretty young and there's plenty of time to fix yourself up while on hrt as well.

>>8514459
well its for hair and nail health. I just want to know if it interferes with hrt at all.

>>8514470
I dont feel young at all though :( Not with how my face feels lately, at least. Going to try to get hrt soon

>>8514483
It shouldn't, it's a dietary vitamin. It's in a ton of food

>>8514490
You might just feel old because you're fixating on the flaws in your body

>>8514495
Well its because I can see them getting worse and I cant stop them
From just normal grooming in just the past month I've noticed things get a lot worse and genuinely new things pop up, it sucks because I've been changing my diet too
I had enough on my hands to worry about with my hairline yknow?

>>8514499
I had wrinkles pretty young, since like 18. I think it was sun damage.
I paid a dermatologist for some high concentration chemical peels. But i do low concentration ones by myself as well. I think it helped a ton.

My hairline also worries me. I think i may need transplants cause hrt doesn't seem to be bringing my temples back, or at least not enough to the point that I'm happy with it cause i want it more feminine structured. It sucks but that's life i guess...

i know that hrt make your cum a clear goo without sperm and a little shrinkage on your dick, but does your penis still, generally work?

im gay but i dont want to transition completely i just want a fem body

>>8514540
I'm pretty NEETly so I assume it was my diet :( I'm a little afraid my face mucles are just shitty and that's why all these new bunch marks on my cheeks are showing up
Someone mentioned phenol peels in another thread, they rly work?

>>8514638
I've heard cypro doesn't kill your balls as much

After 9 months on spiro/estro I can still get erections but I cant cum more than a drop or two

>>8514540
How do you request chemical peels btw? I have no insurance :(

>>8514703
Cypro kills your balls much much worse than anything else on HRT. You're thinking Bicalutamide.

>>8514771
I had mine covered by insurance because at the time accutane was under a lot of legal scrutiny. My doctor made a request to my insurance that told them accutane resulted in excessive uv damage.
I only was eligible for one little treatment though. I think it would have been like $500 or something. But he also injected my acne scars with cortisone i think, or something like that. It shrunk them pretty good.
I buy the solution off amazon and do them myself but i don't have any way to numb my skin so i can't do the really good ones like dermatologists or clinics do.

Where do I find the bloodtests that test for more comprehensive things like E1:E2 ratios, prolatin, etc. along with T and E?

The PrivateMDLabs test just gives you T and E levels.

How the hell do I get my blood tested?

>>8516711
https://www.privatemdlabs.com/lp/female-hormone-testing.php

Use this coupon for 15% off, M73H67

>>8516724
Thankyou <3

>>8516711
Just go to a GP and ask for a blood test. If you don't want to tell them you're self-medding just make something up about thinking you're low T due to ED or something.

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I'm a femboy but i don't feel really comfortable with going full hrt. Still, i don't want to get any more masculine.

But i can get finasteride in my city without needing medical prescription or hiding it from my parents. I was already planning to because i'm starting to lose hair (bad genetics). 1x1mg pill everyday.

Can finasteride help with preventing further masculinization too? Maybe i should take the 2mg pills?

>>8517105
It's a really shitty AA.

>>8517105
the only thing finasteride is even halfway decent for is helping slow hair loss due to mpb
if you don't have mpb, it will only do harm to you
and also this >>8517112

>>8517105
Fina will only help with DHT related effects on the body. You'll have slightly healthier skin (if you have acne then chances are fin will get rid of it), and obviously regrow hair.
It actually increases test though since it's no longer being converted to DHT.

If you're losing hair go for it, better to start early while there is still a chance of regrowth. If you want masculinization to stop you'll need to get AAs and maybe estrogen.

>>8517120
In combination with HRT it'll help not only halt MPB but start reversing it depending on how young you are.

>>8517133
it's not that simple
some people, even if they borderline overdose on fina, will still continue to lose hair
of course, borderline overdosing brings many other harmful things to the table, but that's not the point
truth is, we don't really know what causes the hair loss in mpb, but we suspect it's a certain type of testosterone
while hrt can drastically reduce testosterone production/binding, there are still other factors at play
what exact factors those are is still being studied
please stop spreading lies/untruths/halftruths in the future
i know you won't, but i won't be able to sleep at night knowing i didn't at least ask
good day, anon

>>8517151
I'm getting regrowth on my temples with HRT and Finasteride :^)

>>8517151
I have only ever heard of that occurring with people not on HRT since some men have very aggressive MPB.

Though for people on HRT taking fina if they continue balding it's probably due to low testosterone, possibly thyroid problems, or possibly pituitary problems relating to prolactin.
Once you are on HRT it is no longer male pattern baldness, females don't get MPB and if you have female range hormones it's impossible to get mpb.

Hey /hrt/ just saw my doctor after one month of being on estradiol 1mg and spironolactone 50mg

During the visit she gave me the option to increase the dose or to stay at where I was.

I haven't really experience any changes (didnt really expect after only being on HRT for one month) so I asked to raise the dose and she perscribed me 100 mg of spironolactone and 2mg of estradiol.

Is this a good dose to be on it?

Does anyone have any experience with this medication and have you experienced any side effects?

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is qhi/myorders down for anyone else?

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I'm 17 years old. All of my hair is very thin, especially on the top of my head. I am male, but I feel like my life is over if I can't go back to how it used to be. If it stays like this I will kill myself. Do you think Bicalutamide will help? I don't want to turn myself into a girl but if that's what it takes to revert the effects of this disease I will do it.

pre-everything

cypro > bica or bica > cypro ?
i don't care about my dick btw

>>8517294
cypro

>>8517289
You should finasteride or dutasteride. But you'll need to remain on it for life otherwise the mpb will return. It sounds like yours is especially bad if you're getting it so early in life so you should definitely look at things like your diet, whether you're stressed, etc. and see what you can change.

>>8517303
I'm stressed because of my hair, so I can't not be stressed. My diet could be better I suppose, maybe I should eat a vegeterian/vegan diet.. Idk. I've been taking Finasteride for 4 months now and haven't noticed much of a difference.
I feel so empty.

>>8517353
If you're getting severe balding that young it may just be a particular bad case of MPB. You could nuke all of your T and it'll go away maybe, but it depends.
You might also have alopecia areata.

Generally MPB has a pretty characteristic pattern to it, starts at the temples then usually goes to the vertex, and then from there the two connect.
If yours looks more sporadic and random it may not be MPB but might be something else causing your balding.

>>8517370
Thinning everywhere, the temples are clearly going though.

>>8517415
Well even MPB doesn't really completely remove your hair, usually the sides and back are just fine.
Have you had a complete physical to make sure there isn't something else going on?

It's obviously not unheard of to get MPB that young, and it's also not unheard of for fina not to work on extreme cases, but often it's people confusing MPB with balding from other diseases or conditions.

>>8517185
100 spiro and 2 estradiol was the dose I was started at, I got it doubled after 2 months. I didn't notice any side effects besides just the usual starting hrt for the first time stuff.

Will AAs do anything on their own without estrogen? I want to test getting them shipped into my country so I only want to order one thing in case it goes wrong. It's better to do AAs and not estrogen right?

>>8517831
Well it'll at least stop masculinization and you'll probably get gyno due to low T.

>>8517834
Sounds good. I will get an rx for both in 2-6 months, so stopping masculization for that time is probably a good idea. Thanks anon.

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>>8508681
What happens if you're E levels are above the female range? No horrible diseases other than unnecessarily increased chance of liver failure right?

>>8514703
>I've heard cypro doesn't kill your balls as much
What the fuck bro cypro at a high enough dose is considered chemical castration.

>>8514638
>im gay but i dont want to transition completely i just want a fem body
I know it's not recommended for femboys but I'm on the same boat as you and I'm thinking about getting on spiro soon. Of course for most femboys I really suggest checking out bica unless you want conetits (which I don't mind).

I'm even going the traditional trans route and have got 6 months of therapy (thank God my insurance covers therapy). This way HRT can be covered by my parents health insurance. Are there any other femboys who act trans just so they can get the treatment? I'm really hoping this plan turns out all right.

>>8519616
The femboy hrt thing is just a meme... most of the people that posted in femgen in the past that were on hrt were actually trans they just hated mtfg
If you're on HRT you should have a plan in your future to complete your transition. Cause after 5-10+ years on hormones you will have a difficult time as a male

Does it matter if you have to stop taking everything for a week or two? Will you be able to resume normally?

>>8518912
There is such thing as having too high hormone levels, your hair could fall out. (literally tho)

>>8520116
Same if your T is too low. A lot of people accidentally go below female range T and will have no libido and hair thinning
Gotta stay in the proper ranges

>>8518912
it's not good. probably blood related issues as well as evloping prolactinoma. There is no benefit levels than having higher than normal estrogen levels. you're probably going to fuck up your devlopment

Best site for ordering in Japan? Customs here is insane -_-

What does /hrtgen/ think about vocal surgery?

>>8520631
http://lena.kiev.ua/voice/ try this first

>>8520631
it has very little to do with hrt, so maybe this isn't the best place to ask, but it can sometimes be useful for people who really don't like their voice
the most i know about throat surgery personally is the shaving of the adam's apple to look more feminine
all else i know about voices is about training your voice and not just cutting it until it fits your expectations

>>8520648
I've heard the surgery sucks if you don't first train your voice anyway and that if you don't train before your voice will sound weird

>>8520904
either way, training your voice is relatively easy and completely free so i see little reason to not do it

I got bad cognitive changes on spiro and doctor told me to stop. Which AA has least side effect/complications compared to other AA? I live in USA.

>>8521662
If you're in the US you'll have to order cypro or bica online as they're not approved in the US.
But given that you cannot take spiro you have legal permission to do so if your doctor prescribes it
https://www.fda.gov/aboutfda/transparency/basics/ucm194904.htm

>>8521666

I thought bica was not forbidden in states? So, should I tell my doc to import cypro or bica to me or do I have to do own own research and do paperworks?

Better to take one aa and e in morning and at night or two of both at once in the morning?

Forgot to add it's spiro so short half life.

>>8521676
You have to buy it and import it into the US yourself.
No clue how insurance works in the US since I don't live there. But where I live for unapproved cancer meds you just have to have your doctor fill out a form for your insurance that notifies them that no suitable alternative exists in the country.

>>8521687
Def space them out as much as possible

I've been on 9 months HRT (last 3 have been 200mg spiro/.2mg transdermal est per day) and while my body has reacted beautifully my face feels just as masculine...

How long before my face will actually start looking feminine? Doesn't need to be perfect but rn it's so fucking manly that it doesn't fit with my body anymore

Does this mean I need FFS?

>>8521688

I am working without insurance. Should I need to find foreign pharmacy myself and tell them to contact my doc?

>>8521718
I'm not sure the whole process, here's some pages that covers some of the information:
https://www.cancer.org/treatment/treatments-and-side-effects/clinical-trials/compassionate-drug-use.html
http://www.webmd.com/healthy-aging/features/letter-and-spirit-of-drug-import-laws#1

>>8521767
Thanks a lot!

>>8521697
Put on weight

>>8521697
face and hips take longest. Be on it for like 3 yrs before you decide on FFS

>>8521898
There's some stuff that is usually pretty obvious though. Like if your nose is fucked it's not going anywhere so might as well get a rhinoplasty.
I've heard getting nose jobs from FFS surgeons is a bad idea anyway and it's better to get it done on it's own at a doctor that specializes in it.

>>8521886
Is this actually the secret???
I've been on HRT for three and a half months but I've been dieting the whole time. I already stored a lot of fat in my thighs beforehand but I guess I might have to start gaining weight soon since I'm like 117 lbs at 5'3"

What should I take to see if hormones will make me feel better without fully committing? I'm 70% sure I'm trans, but I want to test the waters first.

>>8520647
>>8520648

Doesn't work been trying for months

>>8522056
what are you trying? did you read the mtfg guide on it? i thought it was pretty good, if a bit basic

>>8522082
Basically that guide and the video of the girl who tried to explain it and has a great voice

>>8522090
if you have really been trying for months and it hasn't been successful, it's time to try something else

>>8522110
What then?

>>8522112
it would depend on what the problem is
why isn't it working?

>>8522121
I don't know I just don't sound right at all and can't maintain for more than a few minutes. I practice 20-30m 5x a week
>>8517355

>>8522127
it's not bad at all, though there does seem to be a problem with dipping
what i found to be personally useful was making my voice more breathy, if that makes sense, so you're less reliant on vibrating your vocal chords and more reliant on changing the shape of your throat to produce higher pitched sounds
though my body structures are likely different from yours and i go for more of a cute voice rather than girl voice, so results may vary
but the beginning of the clip definitely sounds like a girl to me; no need to be so hard on yourself
my advice would be to just fiddle around with the different variables that produce speech (throat contractions, larynx placement, etc.) until you find something you can maintain that sounds good
also keep in mind that the way you perceive your own voice is different from how others hear it, due to both psychological and physiological phenomena

>>8522160
>due to both psychological and physiological phenomena
Different girl here. Is this true for ~recorded~ speech also, or did you mean only for spoken?

>>8522190
for recorded as well, but to a lesser degree since there isn't as much physiological interference when you're just just listening to your voice like any other person would
that's what the psychological part was about, but the severity of it will vary between people of course
it's kind of like how you perceive yourself differently in photos (especially if that photo is reversed) than others do, but with audio instead
recorded is likely the best bet, assuming at least decent quality recording equipment is used, as playback audio distortion can be pretty high on low quality equipment

>>8508681
what the fuck is lupin estriadol

a week ago i got prescribed it after talking to a doctor about my self medding and it's really different from what i usually took (progy/estriadol valerate) and while prog actually made me feel different from when i wasn't on mones, this shit is making me feel more high t than i was before i even started just cypro

pls help

>>8522324
Do you mean lupron?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuprorelin

>>8522160
Alright I guess, do you have any other pages I can read or something? I mean I don't even know what throat contractions happen, and I try to hold up the larynx and bring it in but idk

>>8522342
>https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leuprorelin
accorting to wiki its better than cypro and spiro. Why? why dont us self medders use it

>>8522428
It's usually not recommended except for very early transitioners. Never bothered to look into the reasoning.
Personally I don't use AAs, was low test pre-hrt and didn't need them.

>>8522565
so is>>8522324
underage or is she just has a shit doc

>>8522610
It works just as well in adults. I'm not sure why it's not more common. I assume due to side effects

>>8522696
it's just expensive as fuck due to patents i think. plus zero incentive for improving tranny healthcare

>>8519935
Yeah I think most of us femgen posters know deep down were just easing ourself into the transition process without wanting to mentally commit to it.

However as a dude I don't want testesterone to wreck my features that I like and I'd rather fuck it up with estrogen. It feels similar to AGP except I'm not really sexual about this. Avoiding effects of testesterone shouldn't be much to ask for. Either way I guess you have to pick which hormone will fuck with your body as you get older. I just find estrogen much more appealing and less scary than testesterone.

>>8522718
>It feels similar to AGP except I'm not really sexual about this.
AGP doesn't have to be sexual. But in what way does it feel similar more precisely?

>>8508681
Is it possible to mess a dose up by taking it sublingually?

I've been on HRT for about 6 months, took 2 mg to start and now I'm on 4. I haven't had access to an Endo but have had my GP order labs for me and checking my levels. She's been telling me that everything is good so far.

I actually got a copy of my labs yesterday and my Estrogen and Estradiol are mega high (Estrogen Total: ~1400, Estradiol: ~ 800)

I looked it up and saw that I should be in the normal female range which is much lower. Have I been hurting myself by taking too much? frankly I don't care about "health" side effects but is this gonna hurt my transition at all?

I'm seeing an Endo for the first time next week, hopefully they can help, but I'm still freaking out about it.

Also I already went back to taking only 2 mg a day

what happens if i switch to cypro? I'm six months on spyro.

So, how much dangerous is DIY HRT? I am planning to use inhousepharmacy to buy bica. Is it safe? I am planning to find legal route as soon as possible, but this is taking too long and I can't take it.

Also, if you use Bica, I heard that your T level stays same as cis level since Bica doesn't stop T production. How can you make sure Bica is working while doing a blood test?

>>8525048
>Is it safe?
No HRT is safe. That said, it's an additional level of unsafety to do things yourself if you don't already have knowledge of how HRT works.

>>8525059
>>8525059
>How can you make sure Bica is working while doing a blood test?
You can't

>>8525059
You spend $5000 and get a gcms test

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I have been thinking so much recently, and I think I have some sort of repression. For example whenever the topic of transgenderism comes up I get really uncomfortable, and really anxious. I really can't afford to transition for social and financial reasons so what could I do to stop the anxiety, or make myself feel more comfortable without any permanent change? I may continue to a full transition later in life if my situation gets any better.

P.S. Yes I did post this in it's own thread but it hasn't gotten any traction

>>8525083
>>8525087

So, what does the people self-medicating on bica do? Just guess and take the dose? I am only college student with small amount of money so gcms test is not an option.

>>8525296
If you're on estrogen it should downregulate T inevitably.
But otherwise you just test your liver, thyroid, and pituitary gland to make sure you're not dying.

>>8525371

Is HRT really that dangerous? I know it might have some side effects, but all of these HRT might do to my liver kinda scares me. Probably need to do it for my own sanity though. Thanks.

>>8525432
HRT isn't dangerous no, if you take a standard dosage and don't do anything crazy then you should be just fine like everyone else.

>>8525432
It's really only the AAs that pose any danger but even then you simply get those tests because that is just the standard with any medication that is heavily processed by your liver. Testing your thyroid and pituitary gland is normal for any medication influencing hormones

>>8525272
You have to try everything in order to get at least on a potent antiandrogen. People around you will likely not notice anything, but futher androgenization will be stopped. That is the least you should do.
I don't know where you live. But it should be possible to order AAs online. Consider getting Cypro and take 12,5mg daily (1/4 of a pill). By doing that you get the most for your money.

The more I look into trans timelines and shit, the more Im starting to believe mtf HRT does absolutely nothing physical at all other than grow your tits a little. Some people say it lightens the skin but all the pics where that's true are like pre-hrt no makeup boymode and post with tons of makeup on and best lighting/angles. Other than that, I cannot see literally any difference in people taking estrogen/AAs unless they've had severe acne or something prior. Is there even a point?

Age 25 been HRT a full year now. 5"10, 120 LBS


I was prescribed 100mg/5mL (20mg / ml) estrogen 1.5 months ago. I was told 1 ml per 2 weeks. Instead I've been doing .5ml every week.


This seems low. I want more. Is that safe? What are you ladies on.

>>8526572
Well I know for sure it changed my skin because I'm still boymode and like every single person I know comments on how smooth my skin is and how healthy it looks lately.

>>8526572
it works pretty well if you take it before puberty
the vast majority of people incorrectly attribute or largely exaggerate features to it, as well as the placebo effect and similar issues ranging from incorrect self-assessments to not acknowledging biased sources

>>8526602
>>8526603
Alright, I guess I should go on it to stop further masculization anyway. I'm very recently turned 18 so I think I missed any good chance at seeing changes, but I might as well start as soon as possible anyway.

>>8526606
if you're sure you want to go down this path, then go for it
do understand the risks though

>>8526623
yeah Im absolutely sure I want to transition, if that's what you're referring to. I was just questioning the legitimacy of hrt. I already could pass I think, I fail boymode frequently, but I know age might destroy that.

>>8526606
You'll see plenty of changes at 18
You can always get stuff like FFS later.

>>8526628
HRT is a pretty long term thing. Hormones don't directly cause any changes, they only alter the changes your body was going to do anyway. Things like skin don't occur immediately because estrogen only changes your skin as it undergoes cell turnover like it normally does.
The mental changes are mostly memes though. It's just placebo effects but some people are pretty susceptible to placebos.

>>8526628
well i'm glad you're sure about it, and good luck with it!
hrt is likely the most legitimate form currently available for transitioning, at least that i know of
>I already could pass I think
then you're already far past the majority of people i talk with, at least in terms of positivity
bone structure (jaw, shoulders, hips, etc) is one major thing that is a real thorn in the side of transitioning, but if you're good on that front you're probably in the clear

>>8526591
1 ML every 1-2 weeks depending on your levels I believe is the standard

my appointment for hrt is on monday, i hope i don't get a meme dose. not having to pay out the ass for self medding anymore would be cool.

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what's a good Bica dose, the ones I got are 50mg, I've been cutting them and half and taking 1 every day, is that bad

>>8526729
Good luck! Remember not to appear too insane, like I did

My nips are budding, how do I make sure I grow full, round breasts

what's the deal with patches for estrogen (rather than pills/injections)? worth the hype?

>>8527196
slaughter a pregnant lamb and bathe in its blood

So I have to take two sublingual estradiol twice daily, do I take them at the same time?

>>8527196
have the right genes

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tfw take bica to thicken my hair but its making it all fall out

>>8529580
bica does not thicken your hair
bica does not cause your hair to fall out
sometimes it can cause shedding in the early stages, like with most hormone changing drugs, but this is temporary
doing even cursory research can really help you out in the long run

>>8529580
Bica actually doesn't compete with dht exceptionally well.
I'm not sure how effective it is with fina or duta but you could try that. It might not do anything though because bica ramps up your testosterone
But cypro+E+fina will regrow your hair for sure. I'm not sure where the "bica grows hair" meme started but it's not really true.
The FDA lists hair loss as a side effect of bica, not hair growth.

>>8508681
Do mtf hormones make your legs girlier too? I'm stuck with horrible man calves. [spoiler]Can they make you more prone to face freckles?

>>8529630
I'm a cismale on finasteride too. Do you think I should stay on or go off bica for hairloss?
I'm only taking 12.5mg daily.

>>8530104
my hair is definitely shedding on bica, but will it grow back better and fuller if I leave it?

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>>8530104
If you're okay with growing tits and all the other side effects of bica go for it I guess. I don't think it's a good idea for cis men to use antiandrogens though unless you have cancer.
Bica isn't anything amazing for hair growth though. It actually has less binding affinity to androgen receptors as DHT, and due to the fact that it drastically increase T which in turn drastically increases DHT it's not actually that effective for hair loss on it's own.
I'll post a snippet from this research article that explains it a bit better.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12496872
Just see my screencap here (copy-pasting doesn't seem to work)

From searching around on hair loss forums most people seem to report that bica on it's own is not effective at preventing hair loss, and most people report it caused further hair loss which seems to confirm my suspicions about what would occur when you ramp up T and DHT even with bica binding to androgen receptors.
Bica + Estrogen is effective for hair loss though as estradiol is a natural 5-AR inhibitor in it's own right, and it also downregulates T production. Plus over time estrogen atrophies your testicles of course.

In my honest opinion, bica does not reverse hair loss on its own, if anything it will accelerate it according to all the research on it. As I said, hair loss is a listed side effect of bicalutamide.
However in some studies bica + dutasteride reversed hair loss, similarly bica + estrogen reverses hair loss, and bica + fina/duta + estrogen will definitely reverse hair loss.

>>8530224
OK so I should stop taking it?

>>8530251
Are you on E or fina/duta?

>>8530251
I just don't understand.. On the image in the OP of this thread it says bica helps at blocking DHT. Surely it shouldn't be making my hair fall out
>>8530260
I am on Finasteride, I'm 19 and cis, I'm taking all these drugs for hair loss (its bad). I don't want to cause gyno so I don't want E or anything like that.
I don't know what to do

>>8530269
Bica has less binding affinity than DHT, period. There's no research articles out there saying otherwise.
In cases of prostate cancer bica is combined with dutasteride to account for the increase in DHT and the fact that bica cannot out-bind DHT.
You'll get gyno on bica as well though just so you're aware.

I've talked about it in another thread on here as well about using PDG2 blockers and EGFR inhibitors for hair growth alongside microneedling. Typically EGFR inhibitors are used for breast cancer and PDG2 blockers are somewhat similar to fina/duta except further "down the line" in the process since it's thought DHT causes an increase in PDG2.
For using EGFR inhibitors you need to use it on damaged scalp skin, in studies they would either use 1.5mm microneedles, they'd burn the skin, or they just scraped away at it, or just otherwise had a way to actually damage it. Then they applied EGFR inhibitors onto the damaged skin. The study I posted about in the other thread used genistein and gefitinib with 1.5mm needles.

But for cis guys it's pretty difficult cause obviously the easiest way to get hair back is just to nuke T. If you're not willing to basically chemically castrate yourself you're fighting an uphill battle, and chances are you'll lose given that you're getting MPB at only 19.

>>8530300
OK so, should I stick with bicalutamide despite the hair loss I've experienced on it? Or should I push through this in hopes of a brighter future for my hair?

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>>8530415
I'm thinking about Spironolactone (50mg) / oral minoxidil (Loniten 5mg) now. Apparently Loniten should be taking with a diuretic to prevent fluid build up. How often do you have to go to the toilet on Spiro?
I don't want to disrupt my life too much, even though it clearly is.

>>8530415
Well there's a few issues in what you're doing. You're cis meaning you're probably not going to be getting an orchiectomy I assume? You can't stay on AAs for your entire life and MPB isn't just going to disappear.
I don't know long you've been on it but long-term use of bica will eventually give you gyno and it may have other serious consequences on your liver. Long-term usage isn't really something that gets studied much as it is a cancer medication, not something you should use for life. I'm also not sure what the long-term effects bica would have on your testicles.
>>8530427
I've never taken spiro myself, but oral minoxidil sometimes causes hair growth in weird spots. Some people report getting bushier eyebrows, growing unibrows, etc. so just make sure you know what you're doing.

>>8530450
I have no clue what I'm doing that's why I'm posting here. I just want to last till I'm like 25 at least. I can't believe I've lost this much hair at this age.
I'm going to college this year and I'm going to look like a complete freak.
I'm going to try oral minoxidil and a low dosage of spiro and hope for the best.
And no I'm not going to get an orchi, I did actually notice decreased libido on bicalutamide despite the promises that it wouldn't happen.

>>8530482
Bica reduces libido yes, the only thing bica tends to differently than other AAs is that there is not much risk of sterility. You'll get all the normal effects of an antiandrogen though.
Have you tried dutasteride yet as well?

MPB is pretty easy to beat if you're willing to fuck up your hormones though. Could always go femboy-mode lol

>>8530530
How am I meant to beat MPB and be able to still get erections and not have weird side effects which only add to my depression..?

If you can give me a definite answer to that then I'll be the happiest I've ever been.

>>8530548
Well if something like that existed then whoever created it would be immensely rich lol

You could try certain diets that cut out things like saturated fats, and you could try adding things like flax lignans and other phytoestrogens to your diet to maybe give you a little bit of an edge over testosterone. But at the end of the day to beat MPB you need to fight T and DHT.

Personally I use pgd2 blocker and egfr inhibitors in a lotion that I mixed myself. I microneedle with 1mm needles, wipe the blood off, then apply the lotion directly on top and I also added minoxidil recently. I've seen probably 50-60% of my hair reappear since I started.
But I'm on cypro. I have no idea if the above would even be worthwhile if you're not blocking T because I am not actually losing hair anymore so the only thing left for me to do is regrow it.
I've seen some people report that oral pgd2 blockers were more effective than fina for them, not sure which drugs they actually took though.

Have you thought of maybe talking to a therapist about your balding? I know even for cis guys losing hair is a really stressful thing, sometimes even the stress of it actually can make you lose hair even quicker.
Also are you gay or straight? I think for gay guys it might be a little easier cause men aren't as judgemental about MPB being that they are men themselves.

>>8530577
Can I speak to you outside of this? Post contact details if yes

>>8530577
Where do you get the ingredients to mix this lotion?

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I'm in the same situation as the cis guys taking AA's to prevent MPB. If anyone got advice, please:

MPB is starting. My temples are slowly getting affected and if i'm the same as my father and his family, by 21 i'll be bald (i'm 18 now). I'm not sure about the side effects. Tbh i'm even confused about gender but i can't make a choice for now.

But what i know is that going bald = i'll surely kms to prevent ending my life in drugs and depression. I could live as a femboy desu, and i don't know if that's my agp talking for me but i don't mind gyno/boobs physically. I'm REALLY scared of them because of social awkwardness but i myself don't mind having them. Side effects are ok for me (better skin, slower body hair growth, sterility etc) and i'm a bottom so idc about my dick.

I was planning to get cypro + low E dosage + finasteride. I always give up at the last moment about ordering E + cypro, but i'm going to start finasteride tomorrow to prevent further destruction.

But... can hrt grow temples back? If not it would not be worth desu.

Just a PSA bicalutamide doesn't magically avoid aa consequences because it's an aa. After a year on bica my balls shriveled and I cum blanks. Don't take it if you're not prepared for the consequences

>>8530596
I emailed chemical companies on alibaba but there's also occasionally companies in the US and Europe that will also do it.
It's nothing too special, just plant extracts. But obviously the concentration of them is way way higher than what you'd ever be able to get if you just ate the plant so the pharmacokinetics of the chemicals themselves are different than the plant.
I use genistein and puerarin. The genistein came as a 99% powder and the puerarin came as a 60% powder. I believe the genistein came from soy and the puerarin came from kudzu root but it really doesn't matter much since they're extracts so which plant it comes from is irrelevant as long as the chemicals are the same. Puerarin is a PGD2 blocker and EGFR inhibitor, and genistein is a PGD2 blocker, an EGFR inhibitor, and a 5-AR inhibitor. Covers all the bases lol
To actually get them to absorb you need to microneedle it in though, they have poor absorption on intact skin. Not to mention EGFR inhibitors don't really do anything to healthy skin. To regrow the follicles you have to damage the skin and the EGFR inhibitors mess around with your body's repair mechanism by messing with WNT signalling which theoretically causes a follicle to grow rather than skin cells.

Also I can't be 100% sure it even does anything at all haha
I'm just mimicking research done where they grew some nice long luxurious locks of hair on bald pigs lol
There's never been any human trials doing what I am doing, I basically am just volunteering myself as a human guinea pig I guess. I also didn't have a ton of hair loss, just a bit of temple hair.

>>8530592
Well I'm probably not the greatest therapist if that's what you're looking for lol

>>8530609
If you catch it early enough you'll get regrowth. Is there vellus hair around your temples?
I had regrowth from cypro and E by itself I just want to ensure I get maximum regrowth cause I think I may have waited too long.

>>8530685
You seemed to know a lot, it's ok anyway

>>8530800
Well you can just ask questions here.
As far as hair goes though I don't think I can help you a ton more. It's difficult to stop MPB without removing testosterone
If fina and duta don't work for you, then you might just be out of luck. You can of course dump money into topicals and use topical 5-AR inhibitors and minoxidil but MPB doesn't go away so you'd be using that stuff for your entire life.

Also I believe you said you're 18 and 5-AR inhibitors like fina and duta seem to have more side effects the younger you are. DHT is used a lot during mens development so blocking it can cause issues like sexual dysfunction. The older you get the less your body needs DHT though.
Plus being so young and getting MPB means you probably have a very aggressive form of it. Sometimes at best you can only slow it or temporarily stop it, not necessarily get any regrowth.

LOL okay so never in my life have I had hair problems....I've had bad growth issues and bad managed/dry hair in the past but it was all self inflicted. When I started taking care of it I had no problems. Since I started hrt coming on 2 months 7 days from now I JUST noticed *really started 2 weeks ago* that the top of my head...the very top has an almost bare spot and is somewhat sore.....

What does this mean? I'm on cypro and estrofem and have never ever had anything close to male pattern baldness and it doesn't run in my family at all. My dad didn't start losing hair till fucking 45....

My temples have actually more hair than ever before and my hairline is perfect. These problems all started happening on hrt. With is happening? Will I be okay? I'm really scared.

My hands and arms are really bothering me

wat do

>>8531846
i mean, you could cut them off
then they couldn't bother you anymore

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>>8531860
I knew the first answer would be that.

Now tell me how to make them look girlier

>>8531867
you know me so well anon
anyway, what about them bothers you?

>>8531867
Nothing you can do ... Maybe if you spent less time at a keyboard your hands would become more fem

>>8531753
Check your levels

>>8531753
You could be low T.

>>8531886
They look too manly. Fat, skin too rough,

>>8531895
But there's a lot of females who expend a lot of time at their keyboards.

>>8531916
if it actually is just fat and rough skin, then work out to lose fat and use lotion and sunscreen when outside to decrease roughness
not using your hands too much also helps with roughness, at least not doing things where the skin stretches a lot and gets scratched and the like

forgot to press post

>>8531954
How do you work out to lose mass on hands and arms tho? i'm already like 130lbs and everyone around me is already annoying me about needing to eat more.

Also I don't go out a lot.

>>8531964
tl;dr: do normal workout routines and the fat in your arms and hands will very likely decrease
lotion really can help though, as well as gentle exfoliation from time to time
try not to touch harsh chemicals or use hot water when bathing or let the skin wrinkle/deform
these are just some basic things to help with skin care
more advanced things will need to be specialized to your skin personally
like, for me i have very dry skin so i have to do different things than people with super oily skin
if you're looking to change the musculature or skeletal structure of your arms to be more feminine, i don't currently know of any safe method of doing this
letting your arm muscles atrophy from less use will make them smaller, but there is a limit to how small they will get

>>8531902
>>8531908
HOW low is too low? I mean I'm on 50 mgs of cypro. What do? I guess I go to 12.5 after I check my levels??? I didn't think 50mgs of cypro would wreck me.

Is it also possible this is a temporary thing???

>>8532376
>>8531902
>>8531908
MY testosterone levels last month were only 6ng/dl....what mean??

>>8522324
Since no one knew what you were talking about, I should chime in. I felt the exact same way as you when I was on it, and I've never found anyone that said otherwise. Rather, people seem to get menopause (low estrogen) symptoms from it.

It's non-dissolvable (non-micronized) hemihydrate. You can't dissolve it under your tongue for higher bioavailability like you can with Estrace, and it doesn't have the long half-life of Valerate. It literally combines the worse aspects of the two oral medications puts them together.

If your doctor gave you a script that said 17b- estradiol, estradiol hemihydrate, or Estrace, then you can go back to the pharmacy and ask for real Estrace (your country likely sells Estrace instead of Progy). They gave you a crappy generic, but the real stuff is still available to you

>>8529166
No, you spread them through the day

how long do e-checks take to process on inhousepharmacy? kind of wishing i would've just paid with bitcoins

>>8523965
Different anon but interested in this. What can happen if your E is too high?

My endocrinologist just started me on spiro, she’s waiting a few months to start me on any E tho because my parents think I’m gonna kms because of hormones. I asked her about the risks of just being on spiro and she said I’d be fine since I’m still young.
Will I be fine? What should I do? And what should I expect to happen from just being on spiro?

>>8532424
Congrats you're low T. Lower your AA dosage and get within female range T and your hair should come back and you'll most likely have normal libido again.

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I'm a skinny guy with some androgynous chin/face features but a proeminent brow ridge (not like Nikolay Valuev but extremely noticeable)

What can i expect by going on HRT and trying to be feminine? Will anything happen to make my face maybe more androgynous? (Not worried about consequences like testicle atrophy)

Btw i don't shape my brows so i can still work with them if there's a way to help with this esthetically. But i'm worried my ridge will make me look too manly or out me if i decide to go fulltime later. FFS is not an option for now, but i need it right?

>>8533501
thank you anon. halfing my dosage. will check again in 2 weeks

Considering raloxifene to prevent tit growth. How should i take it? A 60mg pill every other day?

So I've been taking 50mg cypro for a few weeks now, to pretty good effect, 25mg twice daily (I cut the pills in half), but I notice that a lot of the time, the pill will break unevenly and half of it will splinter. I am using a pill cutter, but I'm wondering if it'd be better to just take the whole pill once a day? Cypro has a pretty long half-life, right?

>>8535025
Even if it's not a perfect cut it's not a huge huge deal.
Like a difference of 1-5mg/day isn't a huge deal.

>>8533435
Well you're not going to get any more masc. There's no problem in taking AA only for some months.

Why so many people experiment better results on conjugated estrogens that valerate stradiol? Like a better ass and hips I wanna try it myself Would it be a good idea?

>>8535426
lol based on what? i haven't heard of this. Basically synthetic estrogens?

>>8535426
Well I guess technically there are SERMs in premarin which maybe somehow cause different effects but overall it's still mostly just estrone, which is a bad thing.
I wouldn't trust random anecdotal reports, especially considering the negative health effects of conjugated estrogens.

so i'm on 6mg estrogen and ~7 months right now and i've noticed my boobs are growing pretty well
BUT i'm pretty sure if i keep this up i'll be off estrogen for a few weeks
would it be a good idea to go back down to 4mg or ride it out when i run out?

>>8535764
6mg sublingual estrofem or like progy? be more specific...honestly 6mg estrofem seems like always way too much

>>8535778
Not that anon but 6mg can be good, all depends on how your blood is. I upped mine to 8 because it was on the lower end on 6.

>>8535785
what are your people's levels at??

i'm only on 2mg estrofem (1mg every 12 hours) and my estrogen was 180 pg/ml. In the female range

>>8535778
6mg progy

>>8508681
I'm thinking about increasing my dose from 4 mg estradiol a day, to 6 mg a day. Estradiol is 136 pg/mL and my breasts stopped growing.

>>8535426
What? premarin is shit
Ethynyl is more potent but way more dangerous - high chance of blood cloths

cis guy here tbqh

im on:

spiro 100mg daily
dutasteride 0.5mg daily
raloxifene (to prevent breast growth)

im planning on replacing spiro with bica so i can get hard etc.

I'm doing this solely so I never go bald coz:

>No T binding to receptor due to Bica
>Any DHT that some how exists is nuked by dutasteride

what should my bica dose be?

I just took my first dose of cypro and E last night before bed, woke up and had pretty bad nausea, I've always woke up with nausea but this is like 2x worse, is that normal, should I take the stuff in the morning instead? On the upside my face almost completely cleared of acne over night.

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Have to wait a month for cooling off period before HRT. Doc also said my thyroid and liver readings are high :/

>>8536511
don't wanna scare you, but I'm a cisguy too and 25mg of bica made getting erections much more difficult.
Bica also made my hair shed a ton.
If you still want to take it, I'd take 12.5mg per day only.

>>8533907
DESU seems like your biggest problem is your hairline, your brow isn't ideal but with a slightly lower hairline it won't look as prominent.

FFS if you want but I don't think you'll need it to pass

>>8536812
Why does desu change to desu?

I'm no fucking weeb

i've noticed dimples on my face when a smile in the past few weeks. is this because of hrt?

>>8536669
Nuw2uNkZFs #scarlet

http://2ch-trip.xyz/2/5330.php?table=5330320230

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>first week on HRT
>be skinny and healthy
>people claim changes after first week

It seems like my body already adjusted to it I can't feel anything anymore I feel like well.. the fucking same this is boring lol the only changes I got are probably getting tired more easy now. Spiro doesn't even makes me go to pee often like the first day. What the fuck is happening.

>>8537597
>people claim changes after first week
Lol, those are called placebo..
Give it a few years anon, well at least a month or two for starters..

>>8536824
t b h = desu

>>8537740
If you already have gyno pre-hrt you'll easily notice it within a week, probably you'll notice the breast pain within a couple days

>>8534096
Raloxifene has a 28 hour half life, so every other day won't work well. 60mg daily or 30mg twice daily is a typical dose.

>>8536511
wtf. are you really that scared of going bald? just take dutasteride, you don't need spiro, bica, or raloxifene.

>>8538283
well yeah, coupled with the fact i hate my hairline and am getting it lowered via transplants.

So I'd hate to end up going bald in the future with that done

my logic, and many others i've read is:

bica/AA = no test to bind and thus create DHT
dutasteride = any residual dht is nuked

>>8539564
You should read earlier in the thread where I discussed bica and hair loss. It does not do at all what you think it does.

>>8539571
>it does not do at all what you think it does

it prevents testosterone from binding and thus converting into DHT

thats exactly what i think it does, because it is exactly what it does.

>>8539588
Lol no it doesn't. Bica has less binding affinity than dht and it is not a 5-AR inhibitor
But best of luck to you. I posted links to journal articles above if you scroll up

>>8539600
you do realise that taking spiro or crypro to the point where your test levels are in the female range means you have as much chance as balding as a cis woman does?

whats so different about bica

>>8539620
Bica does not reduce T. It increases both T and DHT.
Do you even know what bica does?

>>8539622
and it does the same job as spiro/cypro

bica = T in your body, just not doing what T is meant to do

spiro/cypro = T just straight up not in body

my original point is, im not even balding in the first place, but im taking dutasteride and spiro anyway so that it never starts

>>8539644
Well sure but bica has less binding affinity to androgen receptors than dht so ultimately it makes balding worse since it increases your dht

just got my results back and my T is literally nuked to shit BUT within the past week or two when I cum it's completely dry... like orgasms still feel good but I can't /cum/ so like wtf do I do? Should I go off spiro for a lil and see how it goes ?? or should I just say fuck it?? because I know I don't want to ruin my progress. I'm on 200mg btw and was recently upped from 150, so idk if dosage is too high.

>>8539973
its completely normal. you can now jack it with no mess at all.

>>8539973
That's supposed to happen...
My jizz turned watery and clear and there's hardly any of it. Still have precum though

>>8539973
that's what nuking T does though? Seems normal

>>8540038
They've been looking at too much futa porn

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>>8540044

>>8539818
so i should just take spiro and dutast or just dutast by itself? no bica?

>>8540331
Why did you want to switch? You said you were taking raloxifene as well so if you're getting a ton of ED or anything that's probably what would be causing it. Although like the other person that responded to you said, bica would cause some ED as well, and so does spiro.
There's only currently one study I believe on combining bica and ralox in men, it was for prostate cancer.
http://www.clinical-genitourinary-cancer.com/article/S1558-7673(16)30260-9/fulltext
They're reported side effects were:
>The most common adverse effects graded as possibly related to study treatment were hot flashes (44.4%) and erectile dysfunction (27.8%) (Table 2). No fatal adverse events or thromboembolic disease was observed. None of the 18 patients required dose reductions, with 2 patients (11.1%) completing the 6 planned cycles (Figure 1). The most common reason for discontinuation was PD.

>>8540414
meant their* oops

around how long does it take for your fertility to become fucked/is there any way to temporarily reverse hrt induced infertility? i've been procrastinating hardcore on getting prescribed shit because i'd like to have a biological kid in the future and don't really know how to approach that cause sperm banking sounds xxxpensive

>>8540507
Banking is expensive, and afaik the sperm is only useable for 10 years..
As for regaining fertility, depends on your luck and how long you've been on hrt, it could come back in a month or maybe a year after you stop the meds, or never.

>>8540595
Sometimes you can get stuff like in vitro fertilization done if they have a tiny bit of sperm to take, even if it's low motility and whatever else

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Curious what people's results have been with progesterone. I've been on .2 mg/hr transdermal estradiol and 300mg per day of spyro for two and a half years. I'm wondering if there's any real benefits to adding progesterone to my reg at this point. all the reading I've done so far has pretty much contradicted it self so I'm curious what ppls experiences are on here.

>>8540414
yeah but what im asking is, should i take dutasteride by itself instead of combining it with an AA?

im not balding to begin with, it's just dutasteride and an AA is a surefire way to not go bald...

do you reckon dutasteride by itself prior to what i assume in my case will be an inevitable onset of MPB will be enough to prevent it from happening in the first place? coz i know for certain that dutast and an AA would be...

I'm on a very low dose 2mg e /25mg spiro and while I first started feeling the effects last month the dysphoria is back and I dont feel like myself again. Will a higher dose change this? What is typically a good dose?

>>8540949
I take Femoston which consists of micronized 17beta-estradiol and dydrogesterone (synthetic analog of progesterone). Just 1 month. I've spent much times to find out how it works on breasts for mtf, but there are no proofs or researches so I take it blindly. Hoping my breast will be fine.

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Has anyone here taken bica + ralox for 6+ months? Any notable changes?

just got perscribed 1mg estrace, take 2mg next month if i'm fine
waiting 2-3 weeks for insurance to answer on lupron which is what the doctor wants me to take
am i getting jewed or is everything fine

My testosterone is still 169, but it's consistently dropping even on the same Spiro dose(5 months hrt, past month has been 150mg). My endochro says I should just keep the same dose and let it drop on it's own, but I'm skeptical it will get into cis ranges without a higher dose. Wat do?

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progynova vs estrofem..
Im a femboy and progynova is a hell of a lot cheaper, and i dont necessarily need maximum potency
>inb4 hrt femboys are trannies in denial
>pic unrelated

>>8541177
I've only ever heard of fina and duta not working if you have aggressive MPB and start balding at an early age. If you're like 19/20 or older and have no signs you should be just fine on duta alone.
Even if you do start balding if you catch it early and treat it you'll get all your hair back.
Like in people that start fina after they start balding it tends to regrow hair that fell out from the past year or so if it's temple hair and up to 5 years for crown hair.
Considering you're not trans you shouldn't be using AAs

is duta similar to bica in how it works? I was considering getting on bica very soon but the hair loss issue has me concerned.
I'm 21 and don't have any signs of hair loss yet.

how less effective is progynova compared to estrofem? its hella lot cheaper and would allow me to start now but im scared that the effects may be weaker and fuck up my chances for the rest of my life

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Hey guys! We got a cute discord server going :3
Come hangout in voice, play videogames and watch anime together? Or maybe use the nsfw channels and post lewd stuff or just enjoy it.


Join in now!
https://discord.gg/mQaKyG5

>>8542263
join
see no hons
cool

>>8542140
No they're two completely separate things.
Bica is also unlike other AAs in its mechanism since it's a non-steroidal AA. It is similar to flutamide.
Duta and fina are 5-AR inhibitors, not broad range antiandrogens.

Is hrt 100% needed to be cute without it

>>8542295
>Is hrt 100% needed to be cute without it
what did he mean by this

>>8542295
What do you classify as cute? Feminine? Young?

>>8542305
feminine. Im already young

>>8542312
Are you trans?
You shouldn't go on hrt just to satisfy your definition of "cute" because many people comsider fully grown men cute. You need to consider why you're doing it in the context of how you see yourself aging and such.

>>8542215
How would it fuck anything up more than not starting anything at all right now? At worst the result would just come slower..
It's probably gonna be months with blood tests before you are in the right range as well anyway.

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>>8542329
Not the same Anon but... I want to look cute and i'd rather kill myself (i'm serious) than age as a man (get more body hair, MPB, get uglier, etc). I'm 18 so there's still a long road for me. And i'm suffering everyday with the inevitable fact that T is going to poison and deform me even further. I'm noticing every change and hate every of them, sometimes i can't sleep because i have the retarded fear that resting will give my body time to deform itself.

That said, i'm not sure if i would live as a girl, i think i can live as a femboy, but anyway without considering if im trans or not: Is my reason for HRT bad?

>I don't enjoy sex and i haven't masturbated in the past 5 months so i don't really care about testicle atrophy or things like that

>>8542389
I don't know if this is really the right thread for this. I remember there used to be a general for this kind of thing actually.

But it sounds like you might be kind of trans. But obviously that's just one post, I'm not going to actually say go for it and transition off that alone.
I have heard of some men being so stressed about mpb that they resort to full blown hrt. While I personally do not believe in restricting anyone from getting hrt if they desire it, getting help for your issues is probably an easier path in life ultimately.
After 10+ years of hrt your body will have drastically changed and femboy mode will probably not work.
Therapy can sometimes help but of course if you go in with a goal you will achieve it even if it's not a true diagnosis. It's like people seeking out oxy or xanax, eventually if you go to enough doctors you'll get the diagnosis and drugs that you want. At the end of the day you need to make the call. Some people feel reassured when therapists diagnose them but really the medical industry is kind of fucky lol

>>8542532
it called /femgen/

>>8542389
I feel the same way. I'm 21 and just sort of twink/femboy status, hate the thought of aging on testosterone and not being able to feel cute. I plan on starting bica on its own within the next year.

My goal is to be androgynous going forward. havent masturbated in two months and I've been obsessing about lowering testosterone to the point I've decided to just start antiandrogens.

>>8542532
Therapists can only go off of what you tell them. You can't expect them to assume you're lying to them about symptoms, even though some will do that in practice.

>>8542987
Yes, but if that person has the preconceived notion that HRT is correct for them then chances are that is what they will get.
Similarly if they have the notion that HRT is wrong for them, then there is a higher chance they will not get HRT.

I don't think I've ever heard of a therapist actually working from a blank slate. They usually start with what you think is appropriate and base their decision off that because it serves to avoid lawsuits for one, and the patient is happier with the results since it's what their original intentions were.
If you go to a random therapist and shotgun spray a bunch of random info at them and never once mention your intentions of wanting to transition, or not wanting to transition, chances are they'll just diagnose you with something random like depression or anxiety.

Basically what I'm saying is you cannot rely on someone else to diagnose you as trans, you have to do it yourself. Your therapist is just there to maybe see if your decision is based off a complete fuckup in your life, but your therapist's decision is also influenced by their political and religious beliefs, not necessarily medical beliefs. There's a lot at play when it comes to therapy regarding trans stuff. With things like schizophrenia, bipolar, dementia, etc it's more cut and dry. Like if you're schizo your life is probably messed up in some way, you might have hallucinations, etc. so there's no real wishy washy decisions to be made like there is for trans stuff. There's no "feelings" with most mental problems, but trans problems are 99% feelings.

Anything I can take in Australia without a prescription? Preferably legal and not off a market or something.
Anything I can do while waiting around to get a prescription like certain exercises and foods or maybe over-the-counter basic stuff?

>>8543214
Well there's certain diets that can help.
Like go for a mostly vegetarian diet, obviously make sure you get the appropriate vitamins. Cut out saturated fats as much as humanly possible from your diet. Increase your dietary intake of omega-3 fatty acids as much as you possibly can, specifically DHA and EPA from fish oil, don't use ALA from flax cause it's a shitty omega-3.

As far as OTC stuff there's supplements but you'd be retarded to buy them from a drug store and you would not only see no effects you'd be paying huge huge huge premiums for rice powder basically. Order actual plant extracts in bulk powder form online and put them in capsules yourself. Stuff like lignans, isoflavones, prenylflavanoids are all good. Astaxanthin and resveratrol are kind of okayish 5-AR inhibitors as well, they'll help your skin and liver though.
Plus if you want to experience something really neat take high enough dosages of astaxanthin and you no longer need sunscreen and you'll never tan. You can remain perma-pale for life no matter your sun exposure.

But it really depends how close your prescription is. It's usually way more work than it is worth and fugging around with supplements usually requires some chemistry/biochem knowledge otherwise you could risk your health (at least with actual powdered supplements, not ones from drug stores which are too low dosage to do anything and are mostly rice powder)

>>8543257
>you no longer need sunscreen and you'll never tan. You can remain perma-pale for life no matter your sun exposure.
I know nothing about biology or health, but wouldn't the risk of skin cancer still be there?

My prescription will probably take at least a year at best. I guess I will just diet and exercise and just do general good health shit until then.

>>8543367
Astaxanthin is a chromophore, it absorbs UV radiation supposedly. I've never actually tested the limits as to how much it works though haha

You could still try buying stuff like soy isoflavones, red clover, and hops pills from the drug store. But I'm not sure how effective it would be. I think the dosages are too low or you'd have to eat too much plant material every day for it to be worth it.
When I was pre-hrt I ordered extracts online and I managed to nuke my T quite well. Turned my semen pretty watery and after about 4 months I very rarely had morning wood, but I could still get hard if I fapped a lot. I think it also helped regrow a bit of my hairline that I had lost.
I did do quite a bit of research on the things I was taking since I was using very high dosages of everything, I haven't actually ever seen anyone else online do what I did which is kind of surprising.
I've seen posts on Susans of old hons taking like 5-6g of hops a day and things like that. But I've never seen people actually using the extracted chemicals themselves. Plus from what I saw most people attempting to use supplements to transition didn't even know what chemicals they were taking to begin with, they'd just read random clickbait articles about estrogenic plants. But there are research articles using megadosages of phytoestrogens for things like prostate and breast cancer so I felt comfortable that I was well within safety ranges.

>>8543030
You would think schizophrenia and bipolar would be cut and dry but it's not so in practice. Bipolar is the most misdiagnosed condition in the clinic and schizophrenia is not far behind. Mood swings can come from a whole litany of conditions some physical and some mediated by lifestyle or environment. Hallucinations and some lvl of thought disorder can occur in the sane. Some psychoses are brief, triggered by life events, and some last for a lifetime. Some people are just weird/schizotypal and antipsychotics would have limited benefit unless they deregulate further. None of this makes the prescribing physician's decision in the clinic any easier, esp. if the person chooses to leave out embarrassing details of his life history or suicide attempts or what others think of them.

You say there's no feelings with most mental problems, but I find that it's 80-90% feelings and instinct based on experience lvl of the doctor. Most people do not fit into a cut or dry pattern like the DSM desires and their illness courses are variable as to both the severity of their symptoms and toward how much it impacts their functioning in society. A lot of judgment calls are made even after the first session that shape both the rapport and the course of transference/countertransference between client and practitioner. Of course, the treatment options as well. You have to come to a decision about how fucked up you are on your own. A doctor can help you, but they can only ultimately help you help yourself. When it comes to all mental conditions! Some people can function to a high degree even with limited psychosis in their life, and they can fool a doctor by not admitting their symptoms. Some people can fool a doctor into thinking they're psychotic when they're not like the famous Rosenhan experiment attests. Neither are conductive to the long term sanity of the patient.

>>8543485
Well I was mostly thinking in terms of "subconscious biases" when it comes to therapy, rather than straight up conscious lying.

Like say you had depression, but you legitimately didn't know what was going on, you'd go to a therapist and tell them stuff like you're sleeping 16 hours a day, have no motivation, you're more emotional lately, etc.
So there's very obvious physical signs from a mental condition and your therapist will most likely recognize it right away as depression.

With trans stuff if you were to tell your doctor you're worried about your hairline, you don't like your shoulders, you think your hips aren't good looking, etc. they'd probably assume you just have anxiety and BDD. Most doctors would not think of trans stuff and there's no actual physical manifestations relating to the condition. Like you might have depression and anxiety symptoms due to being trans but you'd get the depression/anxiety treated and not the trans stuff unless you specifically focus fired on the trans stuff with your doctor. But if you did that then you'd have a subconscious bias. You'd either go in there with the idea that you're going to prove to your doctor you're not trans for repression purposes or you'd go in to prove you're trans so you can get HRT. I highly doubt anyone actually goes to therapy for trans stuff without a bias, because why would your average person even do that?

>>8543532
>you'd go to a therapist and tell them stuff like you're sleeping 16 hours a day, have no motivation, you're more emotional lately, etc.

These are all not just symptoms of depression but sleep apnea and certain brain tumors and thyroid conditions all of which can manifest in depressed emotion. You see how hard this is? Symptoms blend together. What can seem to resemble one condition is in fact an entirely different hidden condition that requires the work of multiple healthcare services to understand, resolve, and treat properly. You'd expect doctors to keep in touch with doctors but in practice it requires the patient to deliver their medical history to all of the healthcare workers they deal with and oftentimes they don't, which leaves their therapist in the dark. Oftentimes you just have to make judgment calls based on what your client chooses to tell you. Sometimes those judgment calls are as wrong as anybody else's, hence misdiagnosis. And you really, really, really don't want to learn after trialling two dozen antideps and mood stabilizers over a year or two that your patient needed thyroid drugs or a sleeping mask all along. This is even more critical with life changing decisions like transitioning to the opposite gender... Getting this shit wrong means years or even decades of added suffering.

What kind of psych evals do I have to pass to get HRT? How do I get on it if I'm military?

>>8543589
Seconding this, I would like to know how exactly I need to answer to get it. I can post a brief summary of my mental state and feelings in regards to MtF stuff if anybody can give me an estimate on whether that will fly with the doctor or not.

>>8543581
Usually before starting treatment with drugs you'd get a full-panel blood test though. Or at least fairly soon after starting any drug usage. But I guess it depends on the doctor.

I wasn't trying to say therapy can't be useful. But for the people that are on the edge about hrt is therapy actually going to stop them? If someone is freaking out about a receding hairline and whatever other features of their body even if their therapist tells them they aren't allowed hrt and that they're not trans chances are they'll seek out another therapist or just self-med like the couple of cis guys in this thread that posted above that are self-medding just for hair loss.
At least in my mind gender therapy doesn't seem to actually accomplish anything. It gives people a space to vent their issues which is nice, but the way it's being used nowadays is pretty dumb with the whole gatekeeping thing. It only prevents those that aren't knowledgeable of the internet or those that aren't motivated enough from getting HRT.
Personally I think people just need to consider the effects of the drugs themselves, and it would be nice if doctors assisted people since like earlier in the thread there was people that had no clue what the difference between spiro and bica was. But instead of doing that we use this bizarre system of therapy for gatekeeping which doesn't actually diagnose anything. If someone is 100% perfectly fine with the effects of HRT, even if they're not trans, they should get HRT because said person will find a way regardless.

>>8543729
>Usually before starting treatment with drugs you'd get a full-panel blood test though

Hahaha, no. Blood panels are usually only done for HRT or lithium.

>but the way it's being used nowadays is pretty dumb with the whole gatekeeping thing

Gatekeeping is a myth outside of the glorious nationalized healthcare shitholes that exist in Europe. If you found a physician that wouldn't give you HRT after the first session you found the wrong doctor.

What is the the realistic cut-off point for deciding to come off HRT and stay as a normal male? Or even a male with kind of swollen nipples or something?

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>>8543742
>glorious nationalized healthcare shitholes
i love how people repeat their country's propaganda with such enthusiasm and a total disregard for the facts!

>>8543742
It's still a thing in most of canada. Most provinces make you do a year or two of RLE unless you're self-medding. If you're self-medding you only need to see a therapist to get doctors notes for things like orchis, srs, etc.

>>8543755
>>8543742
>>8543729
When people say "therapist" do they mean a regular mental therapist or a dedicated gender therapist?

>>8543767
Well gender therapists are who are the ones that usually get you started on transitioning.
But personally I self-medded and was referred to an endo rather than a gender therapist, and I don't believe I actually need a therapist for anything other than doctors notes for surgeries. I get my prescriptions via my GP as well and I only actually had to see my endo like once. Endos have pretty big waiting lists and are very busy themselves just like gender therapists.

do anyone of you have experience on losing muscle mass on HRT? if so what dosage and how long it takes to be noticeable I'm skinny but also have muscles I want to lose.

>>8543777
I didn't think you could get prescriptions for HRT medicines from a GP. What exactly is the difference between self-medding and getting diagnosed as gender dysmorphic at that point if you are being prescribed the medicine anyway? Being able to self-med sounds more ideal to me, if I don't need to do any convincing and also not have gender dysmorphia or a sex change on my records in case I decide that it was all a huge mistake and want to back out.

>>8543767
>"therapist"
>therapist
>the rapist

can't unsee

>>8543810
Self-medding is just for before you have a legit prescription, but doctors usually take it as a sign that you're serious about transitioning so they'll let you skip the whole therapy process typically and just send you straight to an endo. Usually it's the endo that gives you blood tests and prescriptions but in certain countries your GP will be fine doing both.

If you're worried about things going on records than you most likely wouldn't be able to go to doctors though. That could be kind of troublesome in getting blood tests done. I may not have gone to a therapist but all my trans stuff is certainly on my medical records now.

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>>8543818

>>8543842
awww, i miss that show!
what is david cross doing these days?
he was always hilarious.

>>8543869
Mostly stand up and a few movies, looks like.

>>8543840
I'm not too worried about it being on record, it would just be easier if I didn't have to have"TRANSGENDER" in big letters on my medical record in case something doesn't go to plan or I decide I want to quit, and I don't plan on legally changing my gender. I'm still not too sure about the whole thing, but I can't find anywhere that will answer my questions and I don't trust the doctor to answer them (as stupid as that sounds) when they are so uptight about the whole thing and giving out HRT.

>>8544000
You can still go talk to your doctor and if they gatekeep you there's always self-medding.
Some therapists have a weird god-complex and like to think of themselves as "the decider" but really, it's not the 70s anymore, we have the internet, you can order whatever drugs you want without permission.

>>8544015
I do feel it's silly that they guard this easily accessible drug that could potentially make people happier so closely when I'm told that it is actually fairly safe and easy to come off of with help, with minimal lasting effects if you haven't been going for too long.

>>8544032
It really depends on where you live. Like the local political climate makes a huge huge huge difference.
If you're in a liberal city in the US or Canada you'll have no issues at all with gatekeeping.

>>8544052
I live in a medium sized town in Australia. Should be fine. Wish me luck.

>>8543786
its been about 3 months for me and a good amount of my muscle has melted away. I was pretty naturally muscly too which was a big part of my dysphoria.

>>8543786
>>8544106
low dose 2mgE/25mg spiro because I have hepatitis

>>8544106
After about 6 months all my muscle basically melted away and everyone keeps telling me I'm too skinny now....

>>8544095
You'll probably be just fine in Australia. Besides, worst case scenario, self-med lol

>>8542389
>>8543030
I like your line of thinking. This actually made me question myself for 3 whole years. I always wanted to go to an therapist (did it, but for other reasons like depression) and i'm always thinking that "What if i'm being meme'd into it or i'm just crazy/retarded? If i tell them what i feel they'll put me on mones. Therapists don't exactly diagnose you with success, they diagnose you based on what you tell them"

I think i'll just do it tbqh.

>>8542949
Same, after a long time thinking about that i'll just stop thinking and do it, otherwise i'll wait until i'm 25 and i'm scared to regret not doing it earlier.

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>>8544469
>Also sorry for posting something like this in /hrtgen/, now i want to ask some help related to HRTgen

What is the best meds to take in my case?

>Really scared of aggressive changes of cypro on my body, i always overthink and give up before ordering it
>I like to eat bananas and don't pee everytime so spirolactone is a no
>Bicalutamide is REALLY expensive where i live but... idk maybe i can work for it
>Already on 1mg Finasteride to reduce DHT

Should i just get Cypro anyway?

20 pills of 50mg cypro = $15 (i can split them after some months anyway)
30 pills of 25mg bicalutamide = $65

I don't know the prices in inhousepharmacy etc because i can't order from another country, i need to order them here and the minimum wage is like $250. I still have to find the E and save up for laser.

>>8544095
its easy senpai, i live in australia, just selfmed

you can get spiro and E without a script from inhousepharmacy - its an online pharmacist based in new zealand and it gets through customs fine

>>8544873
So if I go see the therapist and he doesn't seem willing or he will only give it to me if he finds out I'm "really trans" over a bunch of visits, should I just tell him that I have access to and plan to use these selfmed drugs to skip past the bullshit and get an easy prescription, or at least some access to bloodtests and healthcare een if I keep having to buy online stuff?
As helpful as you guys have been, I don't want /hrtgen/ to be my doctor and sole source of medical information.

>>8544900
no.

Get the meds first via inhousepharmacy

THEN go and see him and inform him about what you want (dont tell him you have the meds yet) if he is reluctant THEN tell him you have the meds and will self-med unless you are prescribed them legally