Language Learning - /lang/

>>76451014

>>76455326
More https://pastebin.com/ZrY22qe0


http://www.effectivelanguagelearning.com/language-guide/language-difficulty
>Check out information about languages and their difficulties

http://lexicity.com/
>An invaluable resource for comparative language study as well as those interested in ancient languages

http://cosmogyros.tumblr.com/post/108962232110/huge-new-language-learning-collection
>A very extensive language learning collection for 90+ languages.

http://www.dliflc.edu/resources/products/
>Similar to FSI, drill-based courses with text and audio issued by the US government.These courses were made for millitary personel in mind unlike FSI.

http://en.childrenslibrary.org
>Lots of childrens books in various languages, categories 3-5yo, 6-9yo, 10-13yo.

https://www.hellotalk.com/#en
>The app is basically whatsapp, but only connects you with people who are native in the language you are trying to learn. It also has a facebook type section where you can share pics and stuff too.

https://www.italki.com/
https://www.mylanguageexchange.com/
https://www.interpals.net/ (Do people use this to learn langauges?)
http://www.gospeaky.net/
https://www.speaky.com/
https://polyglotclub.com/
http://lang-8.com/
>Few more language exchange communities like Hellotalk:


http://www.goethe-verlag.com/
>A mostly free site which offers audio and drill like exercises for 40+ languages.

http://www.languagetransfer.org/
>A free resource with recordings to learn a language.

https://babadum.com
>Flash card game with a focus on vocabulary.

http://context.reverso.net/translation/
>A website like Tatoeba (also has a Firefox extension!)

French feels very discouraging. A language with a vocabulary this familiar (knowing English and Spanish) shouldn't be this hard to understand in it's spoken form.

Portuguese but being lazy and dumb keeps the progress slow.

>>76456781
You don't have to be smart, languages mainly require time and immersion.

>>76456599
French phonetics are a bit fucked up senpai

Bump. Guys don't let the thread die

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For Japanese learners is Genki1 & Genki2 good to get a solid base for the language that can be expanded on?

>>76456781
This, except Italian instead.

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>>76456781
This, except Spanish.

>>76456991
I keep hearing that, but, I'm pretty stupid.

>>76456781
Being lazy is your detriment bro not because you are dumb

t.dumbo

Estou a aprender portugués
I am learning Portuguese

What's a good source of introductory grammar for Russian?

I've been using Duolingo and Memrise but they really only seem good for vocab. Perhaps I'm mistaken but I feel like grammar should come before vocab. What's the point in knowing hundreds of words if I can't actually form a sentence with them? I mean, outside of the basic sentences I memorize from Duolingo not because I understand grammar rules but because of repetition.

I am learning German

Can someone help me find a cartoon? It is in Germany, and it is about these tin soldiers or a tin army. They look like a puppet show

>>76456599
je te reconnais des fils /fr/

est-ce que t'es un americain en grece ou quoi?

meme pour moi en tant que ricain il est vraiment difficile de comprendre les francais lorsqu'ils parlent dans la vie reelle

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I really wanna go ape and do 6 hours a day for a week, but have to finish this other course first.

>>76464012
which language?

>>76455326
esperanto the master language

>>76464518
reddit, pls go

>>76455326
Mind telling me why I should actually bother picking up any new language in general and for what purpose? Finding a native speaker that would be willing to practice with someone as much autistic as myself is barely doable.

>>76463870
>http://www.russianforeveryone.com/
check it out

>>76464715
you need to be a weeabo about a new language. making new friends is stupid

if you like animu, be weeaboo
if you like german heute show, be germanaboo
if you like soap opera, be spanishaboo

Is this excerpt correct ? If not, could someone please correct me ?

"Sto imparando anche l'italiano. Non sono sicuro di essere pronto per parlare con altra gente, ma apprezzerei il suo aiuto e in cambio, mi farebbe felice di aiutarsi!"

>>76455568
>https://www.interpals.net/ (Do people use this to learn langauges?)

not anymore

>>76463938
found it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lO-u-efN_9k

What is the best way to meet a native speaker willing to practice with you?

>>76459961
>I keep hearing that, but, I'm pretty stupid.
What's your biggest struggle when learning? Something specific.

>>76464715
>Mind telling me why I should actually bother picking up any new language in general and for what purpose?
it's not about "should", it's about "want".

>>76467930
Using apps and language exchange meetings, besides meeting people irl are the ones that first comes to mind.

>>76468160
>meeting people irl

>>76468241
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH NOT REAL LIFE FRIENDS
NOOOO

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where should i start to improve my english grammar?, i need to stop feeling insecure whenever trying to type

>>76455326
tried out duolingo with their new Japanese course
complete fucking garbage, no idea why anyone recommends the site

>>76457787
hard to take such a comment coming from a speaker of one of the ugliest fucking languages ever spoken

>>76468254
>>>/g/etthefuckoutnormalfagscum

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>>76468019
Grammar. Knowing when to use alli versus ahi like that other guy, hacer, what the fuck vosotros is, sois, etc.

Vocab. I'll be told a new word, try to memorize it, and immediately forget it.

I'm using Pimsleur, Duo, Lingvist, and Memrise.

>>76455326
you only need to learn english, all the other languages are completely redundant

>>76468544
The Japanese one is known to be the worst they have

And about French, what I said it's true. Regardless of your opinion on Dutch

>>76468479

Practice: read more, write more, review it, then search for the specific rule.

>>76468670
not true

>>76468963
remind me when more than 5% Americans will be able to actually speak a language other than their own

>>76468670
Languages carry a lot of social implications in every country, this means power relationships, intimacy, social adaptability and many other things. Not speaking a specific language in a specific location and culture can and will be seen as a disrespectful attitude, causing uncooperative behaviors and even offenses from the cultural group.

>>76469108
shut up Erasmus

I'm glad President Trump will stop giving gibs to those shitty muh study abroad faggots

>>76470380

I have no interest in living in your shit country with your shit ideologies and shit costumes, I'd rather keep risking my life in Brazil until I can go somewhere decent.

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>>76455379
>>76468588
"allí" and "ahí", which btw, both go with an accent on the letter "i", are adverbs of place, used to indicate different degrees of proximity to the speaker or the present.

>allí
means "en aquel lugar" and it's used to designate an indeterminate place. In certain occasions, it can mean "entonces, en tal ocasión"
>Aquí hay rosas, allí hay claveles.
>Allí hicieron la obra.

>ahí
Means "en ese lugar o a ese lugar" and also "en esto, o en eso", "esto o eso"
>Dejó los libros ahí.
>Ahí está la dificultad
>Por ahí puede conocerse la verdad.


TL;DR
In order of closeness to the speaker they go like this:
aquí > ahí > allí

aquí=este lugar [close]
ahí=ese lugar [meh]
allí=aquel lugar [far away]


Los lugares que designan aquí (este lugar), ahí (ese lugar) y allí (aquel lugar) están muy relacionados con la situación del hablante y su percepción de la distancia: aquí indica el lugar en el que está el que habla; ahí, un lugar algo alejado, y allí, un lugar más alejado.


I'm pretty sure my post is very confusing, sorry, I'm a bit busy right now


http://www.fundeu.es/consulta/aqui-ahi-y-alli-701/
http://www.wikilengua.org/index.php/aqu%C3%AD/all%C3%AD/ah%C3%AD/ac%C3%A1/all%C3%A1
http://udep.edu.pe/castellanoactual/alli-y-ahi/

>>76470969
no, helped a lot.

thanks a bunch

I can speak hebrew and french as fluent (i'm native in french), and english as a level intermadiate.

>>76470969
Thank you

>>76464012
>I really wanna go ape and do 6 hours a day for a week, but have to finish this other course first.

I've tried in the past but unless you are already fairly high level (high A2-B1), it's hard to find enough stuff to do without simply spinning your wheels to eat up time in my experience.

>>76471474
Is it safe to say that the amount of valuable practice time increases as you get more advanced? Like to start you have to take it a bit slower (less hours per day) than once intermediate?

>>76464715
It's about having fun. If you're looking for practicality, you're set with only English. You could still post in x language forums and whatnot and communicate with natives in that way.

>>76464458
Swedish.

>>76471474
Not an issue for me, already know a bit.

>>76469108
well said.

>>76463975
Non, je suis grec. Le problème plus grand pour moi c'est que la plupart du temps quand j'écoute des mots que je ne connais pas, je peux pas trouver comment ils sont écrits. Ça n'est pas un problème avec l'espagnol (mais avec l'anglais si parfois).

>>76468588
vosotros = you plural (you guys)
vosotros sois = you are plural (you guys are)
(only in Spain)

It's more of a problem with English not having a plural you, a lot of other languages have it. Honestly since you live in the US you shouldn't even bother with properly learning this form just be aware that it exists.

>>76474131
>It's more of a problem with English not having a plural you

Southern US dialect has y'all

just sayin

I've learned a tiny bit of Russian.

Am about to take a course in Mandarin. Not out of love for the Chinese, but for a job. I hear the Chinese are pretty fucking dodgy, so it sounds like fun.

Once I've mastered Mandarin, I may learn Cantonese, or finish learning Russian. But I don't intend to stop there.

>>76473320
Fuck off we are full

>>76474631
I wouldn't live anywhere else from here, also

kys

>>76468989
That's their loss, not ours.

There're also brain health benefits for those who can speak fluently at least two languages, being bilingual is very good for you, specially on the long run.

>>76476268
I'm going to become fluent in a dozen of them. That's my goal.

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>>76469108
very well said and articulated

>>76471040
>>76471299
You're welcome, if you come up with more doubts or anything just post them in the thread

>>76476268
>brain health benefits
are those bigger if the third language is finnish?
or does one become a spurdo?

>>76477177
Probably yes, because the more difficult the language is for you, the more brain gains

>>76471474
Really?
I'd have assumed the opposite, the lower your level the more you have to learn and practice. The higher your level the less you're "learning" and more you are "polishing" what you know, isn't it?

>>76478194
I've found that when you're a beginner, you have a ton of content you could learn and there is a lot available for beginners. As a more advanced learner, the resources become scarcer and you become confused on what to learn next. Structure is more difficult to achieve.

As a very advanced learner, it becomes easy again. You can just use native content to polish up everything.

It's the intermediate stage that's the worst, and probably why most people give up.

>>76474131
>vosotros = you plural (you guys)
>vosotros sois = you are plural (you guys are)
>(only in Spain)
>It's more of a problem with English not having a plural you, a lot of other languages have it.
Thank you.


>Honestly since you live in the US you shouldn't even bother with properly learning this form just be aware that it exists.
I moved to Miami (hence wanting to learn Spanish) so there is a hodgepodge of culture and language, but the primary one is Cuban. My friend from Spain warned me that if I learn to speak exactly like the Cubans, if I travel I'll come off as very ghetto-improper. He used the analogy of someone speaking English who is from the hood. I want to speak Spanish that is respectful if I travel or speak to someone from Spain. I thought it was just in the slang, which would be easier to be careful of, but my friend from Spain implied it was wider than that. So really not sure what to do. I'll take your advice and just be aware of it, but a lot of the practice material like Lingvist has it.

>>76468989
>remind me when more than 5% Americans will be able to actually speak a language other than their own
I'm not completely defending my fellow Burgers, but, some of this is due to geography. I lived in Germany for a short while and the time it takes me to get out of my state by car, in Germany I could be in another country speaking another language. We also get lazy, even as international business people, because so many people speak English. It is sort of a default for conducting business. If that wasn't the case, I think a lot more of us would be more motivated to learn other languages.

That said, I know quite a few people - including myself - who are eager to learn new languages.

I took Spanish in high school, and I wanted to learn it. But, where I lived there was literally no one to practice with without really seeking them out. I'm a bit older too so the Internet wasn't quite as developed. But I just didn't see any benefit to practicing or keeping up with it as I had no real life opportunities to speak it or have it benefit. Big mistake, as now here I am trying to learn again and I've forgotten everything.

>>76478382
Hmmm, I see, thanks for your input.

>>76476459
Which ones?

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What's your level, /int/?

>English C2
I got the C1 maybe 10-11 years ago and I'm thinking of C2 maybe this year. I have no use for it, but it'd be cool to have it.
>German B1
I hope to reach a comfortable B2 by next spring.

Also I've fooled around with several different languages just for fun, so they're probably A1, but that's just, you know, nothing.

>>76478507
does lingvist teach European Spanish?

>>76477133
Is there a difference between imperfect subjunctive 1 and 2?

I mean are 'fuera' and 'fuese' different?

>>76483861
No but fuese is used less often

>>76483061
C2 in Dutch and English, B2 in >Esperanto, B1 in Swedish, and A2 in Japanese and Italian. I really should stop spreading out my learning over so much languages

>>76484443
>C2 in Dutch
>flag
Hmmm

>>76484321
tenks

>>76459755
Not learning Jap myself but almost everywhere Genki is recommended.

>>76484517
If you are a native speaker doesn't that count as C2?

>tfw brainlet who can't trill r's

Is there a worse feel?

>>76483061
A2 Finnish

>>76484699
onu diyor zaten

genelde anadilini bu sıralamalara katmazsın diye biliyorum

>>76484757
nope

>>76484517
>>76484699
does it not? I assumed it did. I'm 15/16 parts Dutch anyway, and Dutch is my mother tongue

>>76484699
That A1-C2 classification is for foreign languages.
Your native language is just "native", it's presumed you're speaking it at C2 level.

Yo nederlanders can you help me? I'm looking for the poetic and prose eddas in nederlands. I already found the prose https://www.bol.com/nl/p/edda/1001004010970833/
, however I would also like the poetic edda.
Amazon is preferred site.
bij voorbaat bedankt

>>76484841
actually it doesn't even have to be a site, just a good translation for namesake is fine.

>>76484766
>>76484839
So you don't count them in, I see.

>>76484757
it's not necessarily a brainlet thing, I was born with a palate problem and I can't do them either
>tfw I have that in my surname
>tfw they're important for my first language and the language I'm learning now (finnish)

>>76484841
I don't know a version of the prose edda in Dutch, but you can find the poetic edda on wikisource
https://nl.wikisource.org/wiki/Edda

>>76484841
>>76485128
as a note, there's some pretty archaic word usage in there, but you probably expected that

>>76474187
New York has you guys as effectively a singular pronoun.

>>76485236
Of course, and yeah I always forget wikisource

Anyone needs help with Russian?

Any of you experience with immense exposure to a language without learning it?

>>76484757
I don't know man

But I know for sure I like rolling my R, I always have, ever since I was a kid, and even today I'd randomly roll my r and change the speed to hear the different sounds

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>tfw learning Esperanto just so I can claim to be trilingual

>>76486430
Hmmm... What exactly are you on about? Expat in the Netherlands that doesn't know Dutch?

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>>76487909
aĉulo

>>76488050
I'm a Somali refugee.

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>>76487909
>mfw Esperanto is going to be my 4th language

>>76487909
>>76488055
>>76488175
Useless

>>76487909
Same. Im fluent in English, Spanish, and Indonesian (somewhat). Just learning Esperanto so I can say I'm a polyglot.

I'm learning dutch. When I'm reading and writing it, I don't even have to try because it's so easy. However, whenever I try to listen to it, I can barely understand it. Any tips?

>>76488390
>Just learning Esperanto so I can say I'm a polyglot.
I'm pretty sure you need 6 language to be a polyglot.

Also
>calling yourself polyglot
That's pretentious as fuck

>>76488376
Don't trigger me, man.

>>76488376
true. pretty fun though. after about a month I could play autismcraft with fellow esperantoautists. I see it as more of a game rather than a serious language one needs to learn.

>>76488492
Anyone who calls themselves a polyglot is a faggot anyways. Most of them aren't above B2 in more than 1 or 2 of the languages they learn.

>>76488492
The common definition of polyglot is being fluent in 4 or more languages. Yes, I know it's pretentious, but who cares? At least I'm not one of those faggots who is at an A1 level in twenty languages and claims to be a polyglot.

>>76488460

Read along with a audiobook.

>>76464720

This is great, cпacибo senpai

>>76488090
And are you ashamed of not knowing and learning Dutch?

>>76487909
Is Esperanto difficult or what? why are there so many people learning it??

>>76488090

Hehe

ITALIANO
T
A
L
I
A
N
O

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>>76489341
It's cool. The rules are simple and most of the words are easy to learn because they are variations from the Romance languages.

>>76489341
It's the easiest language you can learn apart from other meme constructed languages

>>76490172
He doesn't know python

>>76490198
Who does speak Python?

>>76488390
>Indonesian
>Esperanto

Ĝ A N Ĉ U K
A
N
Ĉ
U
K

>>76489341
>why are there so many people learning it??
Because people are easily triggered by it.

>>76491228
not a reason

Quelqu'un peut m'aider avec les connecteurs logiques?
C'est difficile de les apprendre.

>>76455326
I read through some basic ancient Greek grammar in order to have nice shitpost with Greek anons

>>76473195
Yes,just as me do it in this moment

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Cinq secondes à google.
>>76491858

>>76483061
thanks for posting my image

>>76487909
please remove yourself from the face of this planet

>>76492098
Il faut les utiliser dans un essay pour démain.
Mais faut pas seulment le memoriser, je dois savoir les utiliser

Anyone have the infographic that had the different languages and ranked them.

It was something like:

French, Spannish - Easy pussy...
Japanese... - Opens up liteturature inaccessable to most people.
Chinese, Finnish - Mostly good for waifu hunting.

It was something like that. I know english and french and want to learn something else.

italiano, anyone?

I saw in an older /lang/ thread some british guy say that french sounds like it has no interruption. Does it really sound like it? I don't feel like it is. For me it's the same as any other languages

>>76492473
vendredisoir j'airencontré undromadaire quiprenaitd'air dansledésert j'ailuiaidit qu'est-cequetufait pourlasoirée jevaisdanser aubalmasqué avecunefille demonquartier

>>76492473
what do you mean no interruption? Like no pauses between words? That's true of every language

>>76492562
Mynameis fuck myshitup ilike tobefucked bysomepakibois becauseimapurebritishman
same for english and every language, and i'm sure other romance language as well

>>76483777
Yes

>>76492638
I find it easiet to understand spoken English than spoken French.

Is there a resource for modern langauges like lexicity in the OP info? I'm looking for something to compare currently spoken languages and the like. Mainly interested in European languages.

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>>76456599
>>76457787
>>76474131
Ça peut être utile

Is it worth learning German or should I just improve my French?

>>76468479
English is a highly inconsistent language. You just have to listen to native speakers to get a feel about how they speak and write.

>>76492473
It does sound like that when you don't know the language. German also sounded to me like that before I started studying it. Every unknown language sounds like just a series of sounds and you don't know where one word ends and the other begins.

>>76493893
german is pretty cool

>>76464715
You don't need to speak with people IRL. For example, in the past I regularly posted in /lat/ (years ago, before it become the cesspool it is today) and thus my Spanish learning was quite useful.

>>76492098
>Par contre
>Pero sí
??? Pero sí doesn't even exist in Spanish... or does it

Why is Russian pronunciation so hard?

Reading it is easy and writing is somewhat do-able. It's just speaking that makes it so fucking hard.

>>76455326
Osterreich-Deutsch. Ich bin furchtbar. Ok. Ok.

>>76493861
>patte
>pâte

>brin
>brun

no difference in the prononciation

>>76494509
Depends on dialect.

For example in Québec there is, but there are also many other differences which aren't illustrated in that chart, so I don't know exactly which dialect it's based on. Maybe it's a Belgian chart or something.

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>>76474131
>quand j'écoute des mots que je ne connais pas, je peux pas trouver comment ils sont écrits.
that's true, never thought about this
that's pretty elite actually

>>76494482

I like it

some of the consonant clusters can be a literal clusterfuck, though kek

i am still pleb tier in russian, though

Funny question.

Say you were an intermediate Russian speaker (or if you actually speak it natively, that's good too), how easy would it be to learn Farsi or Pashto compared to learners who don't speak much other than English?

>tfw intense desire to learn one of 2 languages and can't decide between them

what fucking do

Which language has a more interesting literature Chinese or Russian? I already know English, Italian, Spanish and Portuguese

>>76491112
Harry Potter

>>76492638
I think it's particularly hard for Anglos.

Our languages are similar but the complete shift of phenology fucks me up.

>>76498137
Not really an answer but,
Chinese translates into Indo-European languages like shit, while Russian translations are still pretty good. The only way to read Chinese literature is in Chinese

>>76498108
TRy out both at the same time. You'll most likely gravitate towards one to focus on. Or you go full wizard and do both at the same time.

>>76498437
there is no time for such things tempting as they are

>>76498456
What languages are they? I'll tell you what to learn.

>>76498640
I bet the answer is spanish

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lerarning rus conference https://discord.gg/recursion

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Ok what know? I still have some months before I go to France and get classes.

Where I can find Japanese dudes to chat with me via Line?

>>76494369
It does.

>>76496916
I don't know how a monolingual English speaker would compare to a monolingual Russian speaker, but if you speak two languages (whether you learned them in childhood or later) just having another language to compare will help immensely.

I don't know if Farsi is more similar in grammar to russian or english, that could make a difference

I'm looking for German resource recommendations (i know about duo, anki, memrise)

>>76504250
Lingvist

http://www.weeklylanguage.com/2016/03/german.html?zx=cc8cf6e3545e5c8d

>>76455326
>>76455568
I like this format senpai.

>>76498361
Translating from Japanese is slightly bearable but Chinese literature in English is just a joke

>>76506379
I wonder why is that, it should depend on the translator habilities not on the language itself
And you can always use TN at the bottom of the pages or the end of the boom

Have been learning German for like 4 months.
Now I can fully understand people who try to learn Russian.

>>76507668
What do you understand about them?

>Spend all weekend thinking about starting Chinese.
>Start reading about the Shia-Sunni conflict and think i should probably learn Arabic or Farsi.

Why is my brain such a cunt?

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>>76510785
>hear someone talking
>like the sound of what they say and how their velvet voice kisses your ear
>I must learn this language

I've seen worse anon...

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>>76488390
Why not just learn another romance language?

So i finaly decided to try learning chinese. I have a3/b1 knowledge of polish and russian and learning languages is not new to me but this is so different.

Can someone explain to me, please, what steps should i take. I already know pinyin and have grasped pronuciation amd tones pretty quick but I know I'll fuck up if I don't grasp mandarin writing/reading at the begining.

My question is - can someone explain how to learn mandaring characters step by step and what should I learn first. What I know is that i can'n learn characters/word because they are not the smallest unit of chinese language but that's that. I know what I shouldn't do but I don't know what exactly I should do. Is there any kind of useful link or infpgraph for starters?

>>76510785
>>76512249
Language wanderlust is the worst

>hear Romanian
this sounds strange, i should learn it
>meet thai neighbors
well hell, time to learn their language
>watch a korean drama
how pretty, i should learn it
>open a /djt/ thread
i want to try these resources, i should learn it
>find out you are 1/8th greek
time to connect with my roots
>remember learning german as a kid
i enjoyed it, right? maybe i should give it a go again
>duolingo releases polish course
i can't let this opportunity go to waste, i should learn it
>friend is obsessed with finnish
i should join her, i should learn it
>get oneitis on a norwegian
this will impress them, i should learn it
>see "made in bangladesh" label on tshirt
i...should learn it

>>76507450
To me, it's really based on the language itself rather than translating skills.

Chinese and English do make us focus on different aspects, just look at their poetry, keep the character and the musical ability aside, how their grammar convey meaning is rather different, I guess even you read Chinese purely in Roman transliteration.

And the grammatical architecture of Japanese somewhat in between of Chinese and English, so it's slightly bearable in English.

>>76514833
Hmmm, Idk but I guess you do have a point.
There's a different feel to different languages and sometimes it can be very difficult to translate
I guess because of my ignorance on Chinese I didn't imagine the structure, vocabulary, grammar and "feel" would be so alien that the translations are basically worthless.

I can't seem to learn the latest vocab on lingvist. Should I make flashcards and study before using it again, or just roll with it and keep fucking up?

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>>76514070
As a Cantonese native speaker which write traditional character, I don't know how much can I transfer my experience into Mandarin but they are related anyway.

This is my attempt, the key of remembering Chinese character is to remember their radical. It's about 200 radical in general. Never never never try to memorize it right away, keep it in mind, you will remember it later. It's quite important to know the original form of the radical, it definitely help you to remember the building block of every character.

The radical is the graphical component usually at the left.
Sometime at top or bottom.
And the rarest case is being surrounded or at the right.
Try to divide the character.

*The most common way is to cut it in half.
集: cut it horizontally
快: cut it vertically

*How can a word is being surrounded?
回: from all sides
虎: from the top left
氧: from the top right
鳳: from the top + left + right
凶: from the bottom + left + right
匡: from the left + top +bottom
The most interesting case is like, 夾
I don't know how to call it in English, but you can divide like a sandwich.
夾 means to hold, press from either side, you can divide into 大 + 人 + 人, as the pic related, it is how this character written at the bronze age, you can clearly see a big man is holding two smaller men.

The radical will tell us what kind of things it's related to(at least originally, Simplified Chinese mixed two or even three radical into one, which made it harder to guess). It is also how our dictionary listed things, for us, pinyin is the last thing we want to know because in most cases, the rest of the component already told us how to pronounce it, all we need is to change the tone(usually).

In our daily life, if there's no dictionary around and we can't write it out? Again, we divide the character.
池 弛 施 地 他 拖, forget one of those? But you at least remember "也" right? Just add the radical and you're good to go.

>>76456599
You need to practise your listening comprehension. I made the same mistake

>>76518067
Movies and tv a good way to do that, generally speaking?

>>76514070
Гдe жe ты нayчилcя pyccкoмy языкy? Tы пoceщaл клaccы или?

>>76517967
I don't know how lingvist works but if you need help memorising something flashcards are very useful, so go use them

>>76518053
Jesus, this looks like a nightmare

>>76518570
what is жe? i keep seeing it and my mom who used to study russian said it's just a filler word

>>76518783
>>76518783
>>76518783
>it's just a filler word
Yes. I see it the same way I see our word "onaj" or "ovaj". These are demonstrative pronouns (meaning: "This/That one" masc.), but it's actually not in most cases. They're used to emphasize something following, or prepare the listener to the next part of the sentence. They're viewed as a sign that the speaker is slow in conversation, outright "dumb" or has a poor vocabulary. All while it's used to give the speaker some time to think about his sentence

"Vidio sam ga jučer. Uskoro ide na put"
(I saw him yesterday. He's going on a trip soon"

"Vidio sam ga jučer. Onaj/Ovaj...(u)skoro ide na put"
"Onaj/Ovaj...vidio sam ga jučer. Uskoro ide na put"

A polite way to interpret "onaj" or "ovaj" is "and..." or "but..." or "whereas..."

>>76518053
>Cont
>How to divide more complex words
坐 is another example for those sandwich, you can divide it into 人 + 人 + 土, which you can clearly see that it's two people on the ground(土), that's why it means sit

look at 施 拖, you can cut both vertically first and then horizontally. Just be aware of the gaps between each component, you will know how to cut it.

Dividing character makes us easier to write and text but it doesn't always represent the literal meaning. Take 氧, it means oxygen, 气 is the radical which related to gas/air and 羊 means sheep, do air+sheep=oxygen? Hell no, the word construction on new ideas usually only borrow the sound, that's why
>in most cases, the rest of the component already told us how to pronounce it, all we need is to change the tone(usually).

I am no professional but do hope I answer something you wanted.

>>76500912
Grats

>>76518740
Is it really that bad? I always thought declension, conjugation and grammatical gender are fucking nightmare tho.

Picking up Afrikaans again

>>76518067
I do practice it by watching French videos with French/English subtitles and listening to France Info/Inter/Culture. I have to admit though that I am not even half as motivated as I was when I was learning Spanish.

>>76519375
Learning the verb conjugations and the genders comes with time, and there are certain patterns you can remember to help you guess the genders. However I can't imagine memorizing thousands of characters or trying to use tones properly in normal speech. Each language has it's difficulty.

>>76455326
>http://www.duolingo.com/
>Norwegian
>Swedish
>Danish
will they never include Finnish
I know it's completely different from the other three, but still
annoying omission

>>76520538
https://www.reddit.com/r/duolingo/comments/5mytff/duolingo_founder_and_ceo_luis_von_ahn_will_be/dc87sag/?st=ixuuvtew&sh=3ebb1360

Luis von Ahn does not see money in it

>>76455326
Bought the full German Rosetta Stone last summer, shit went downhill quick.

I've been too depressed and lazy to continue, from what I've experienced so far, RS is pretty shitty, voice recognition software is damn near worthless.

>>76518570
Я нayчил pyccкий язык дoмa - дyoлингo, мeмpиce, фв, пдф и >4чaн
>>76518053
These are the exact tips i was lloking for. Dude, ypu just saved my life , thank you very much.

>>76516749
The untranslatable is aesthetic behind the language tho, how a culture prefer certain ways but not another which i guess "the feel" you mean?

For instance, it is silly to compare Li Bai and Shakespeare under the same category because they both are poets. Chinese don't write sonnets and British don't write Jueji, although both sonnet and Jueji have restriction on rhyme scheme and specific structure. These restriction will make the musical ability behind the language more obvious(not just grammar).

I can only hold my statement based on these lost art tho, Modern Cantonese is basically English with a Chinese skin

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>>76519375
To answer your question. Characters are much complicated thing because it seems you always have to use it conciousely, declensions, conjugations and etc... Imagine it as a breathing. They doesn't have logical rules but arbitrary ones - and once you practice it you just use it subconsciously. You think which declension to use as much as you think how to breath, you are just doing it automaticaly.

>>76519265

Seriously , you really helped. Your explanation should probably be archived and saved for intro for /sino threads but I am newfag so I won't even bother

Hope I will see you around here , later , when i will have actually smart questions.

>>76500912
watch movies, chat with natives, play games. having fun is the best way to learn after you've reached a certain level

>>76470518
go fuck yourself, you deserve to be shot for living in Brazil and having the audacity to call the United States a shit country

>>76520449
> Each language has it's difficulty.
I guess so.

I had a culture shock when a white guy asked me about spoken Cantonese, why there is a word, the character, the pronunciation, the tone is the same, but it can be a predicate/complement/conjunction/aspect marker at the same time, the only difference is word order.

My first thought, "...there is?" he told me it's the word "定" and I was deeply ashamed because I don't know, our education system never tell us how to write in Cantonese and the grammar behind it, all we know is how to write in a Mandarin way.

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>>76521095
Is there one of these flowcharts for Spanish?

>>76522036
I have only seen this one and have been happy enough to catch it.

Hope there will be this flowchart of every language possible.

It actually really helped me.

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>>76522036
We only have three so far, /lang/ is really lazy when it comes to making shit happen.If everyone made one for the language they were learning it would be really cool but that won't happen anytime soon sadly.

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>>76522337

>>76522219
>>76522337
Thanks. Well, I'm just starting but when I finish I'll make one...so, two years? kek

>>76521536
Thx for the kind words anon, /sino looks weird so I don't bother to post there, I guess something obvious for Chinese is alien to foreigners(No, even as a Hongkonger, I never understand the Chinese above Shenzhen river).

>I am here to shitpost (originally) because I am feeling shit about decoding sanskrit /w sandhi+devanagari

Any sources for Pennsylvania German? There is this smug Amish family that I live next to, they're always talking shit about Non-Amish people in their language. I want to strike up a conversation with them so they can't talk shit around me.

>>76522993
Isn't it pretty similar to standard German? Maybe learning German might get you part of the way there. It would be more useful too.

Not sure I'd be too concerned about Amish people making fun of me desu. That's kind of like getting rustled over a retarded kid calling you stupid.

>want to learn Russian and tour the last true wilderness on earth
>keep quitting because I will never have the money to go

How do you stay motivated?

>>76522993
It's a form of low german, more easy to understand if you take your base there rather than standard german.

>>76524329

Same here, lad

I just keep telling myself that I'll go some day.
Plus, actually starting to understand more is really enjoyable to me
feels like the work is paying off, even if I can't speak for shit

>>76519265
>a minor addition
>because I have shit memory

>*How can a word is being surrounded?
>回: from all sides
>虎: from the top left
>氧: from the top right
>鳳: from the top + left + right
>凶: from the bottom + left + right
>匡: from the left + top +bottom
but also 超: from the bottom left
>pretty confident about nth come from the bottom right
addition example for sandwich 街 (彳+ 圭 + 亍)
Single component (木, 火)-> Twins component(林, 炎) -> Triplet component(森, 焱)
>The above construction used to have a quantity difference, generally lost in modern chinese and mean various things

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>tfw learning Chinese and already know Chinese characters from learning Japanese
Such a good feeling
Alphabet-only plebs will never understand

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>through the 8th section of Duolingo
>every 24 hours like 4 pieces of the 8 become not golden
I'm doing Pimsleur and Lingvist too, I just want to do a bit of Duolingo per day but at this rate won't make much progress since having to review shit I already know. I guess it thinks I don't.

>>76525562
saved, based anon.

Already started digging radicals and it's so great to recognize them so easily after all in characters.

Like I said, i am using "duolingo" like app for chinese but infinite times better with a lot of examples, and really helpful grammar/cultural tips. I am using pinyin/hanyu writing right now.

P.S. I've heard that the end goal is really to abolish characters in writing and use only pinyin but in order to do that, everyone has to be able to speak and write simplified/official chinese.

>>76527297

ignore reviewing it because it's not gold. Just go to the end and review it all only once and that's that. Then you can start full immersion challange and learn intermediate things

Anyone learning Korean? Any recommened resource? I'm using TTMIK / Memrise / KoreanClass101 mainly but was wondering if there were some text based sources out there that include audio .

감사합니다

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>>76527377
I'm an actual diagnosed autismo so it's hard not to have the tree perfect. If I leave them will they all go completely drained?

>>76519375
I think that highlights how different our languages are, anyway, great respect for you anon.
I'm growing to appreciate and respect more and more people who have an asian language as their mother language and learn a romance language or english.

I hope I'm not sounding condescending as fuck.

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>>76527607

Does anyone know what BRs mean when they spam "sopa"?

>>76527902
So when you get to upper levels wouldn't it be impossible to keep your tree golden? I mean if half of them drop a tick each day that's a lot to do

>>76527938
I think it takes more than a day for them to get down. But yeah, it would take a lot of time to keep the whole tree golden all the time. You could spend that time doing the translations in Duolingo or doing something else to further your knowledge. No need to waste time refreshing the basics you presumably already know.

>>76528075
Okay thanks

>>76528075
Do you use Memrise too? Is that worth using along with Pimsleur? It's kind of annoying memrise is always asking for 60 bucks...

Have taken some German courses at uni and have amassed quite the amount of notes. Going to be typing them up for review for myself and for future reference. Anyone here interested in the PDF when it's finished?

>>76529534
also
>bettynho zirigdum

>>76527299
Weird, why learn sth when you want to abolish it.
Where did u hear it from?
Anyway, it's more common for the PRC and Taiwanese use pinyin for typing, Hongkonger usually prefer Cangjie on computer or stroke orders on phone.

Going to try a vocab binge experiment and see how it goes, will report.

>>76527876
Neh, most Hongkonger are built-in bilingual (Cantonese and English) mainly because of our colonial past+education system.
We learn these two since we are 6 but most Hongkonger didn't speak good English because 90% of our population is Chinese, so u don't get much chance to use it daily (unless u go to some expensive private school some of them even teach in French), so it's more like an academic thing for us, most uni in hk teach in English, so yeah, if u want a degree, learn English (unless you're going to study Chinese literature/history).

So English isn't that alien to us but the romance languages do.

>>76530689
Well, I didn't say I want to abolish it.
And even if I wanted, I am not learning chinese for the language itself, let alone for the writing style. I am learning it because I want to learn about chinese culture and way of life and it's is far bigger then just language.

As for the abolition of characters it won't happen for decades probably, if ever.

>>76468479
I hate this feel,first and last germanic language that I attemp to learn.

I wonder if german is less irregular.

>>76532735
>german is less irregular
AHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHHHAAHHAHHAHHAHAHHAAHHAHHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHHAHA

>>76532752
That feel when you don't have figure out a new word and its pronounciation.

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Is there a better interactive resource for Hungarian?

Help, I can't decide. Should I learn Russian or Korean? How hard are they in comparison to other non-Germanic languages? e.g. Japanese or Spanish.
I studied Spanish for 4 years when I was in high school but I was impatient and only learned it because I had to pick something. Doubt it gives me an upper hand at these 2 though...

>>76534002
No idea on Korean, but I'd recommend Russian personally.

>>76534002
Learn korean if you want to know what your tv it's really doing.

>>76455326
J'ai étudié français vers quatres anées.
Discebam lingua Latinam per quattuor annos.

>>76534211
>recommend
Because of its uses or is it a fun language to learn? 'Cus if it's for uses; I'd rather pick up Spanish again as most of South America speaks it.
>>76534243
qué

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>>76530824
>>76531153
Thanks for this.

>>76490172
>>76489341
>>76488175
>>76488055
>>76487909
Anyone else lament the complete lack of Esperanto presence on 4chan? Occasionally I see fellow (aspiring) Esperantists in these threads but that's it.

Ik kan Nederlands spreken, hoor!

nice thread

>>76468544
Been studying for 2 years and I tried it for fun.

Got shit wrong for mistakes like
>Today I will eat
Where the correct answer is
>I will eat today.

That and the use of you, I, the, at, etc. are so unnecessary and kind of confusing to someone just learning.

Plus the fact they don't teach you any rules or anything, just jam in down your throat.

>>76468588
I like Pimmy, good old Mr. Johns, esteemed world traveller.

>>76527079
What the fuck? As soon I saw how different just the days of the week were from Japanese, I don't even want to bother.

Plus all those characters meshed together look awful in my opinion.

>>76532997
Miért tanulsz magyarul?

>>76534002
I'm learning both!

It depends. Russian will be easier purely because it's indo-european like Swedish. The structure will be much more familiar and some vocab will inevitably be similar.

Korean has a very easy alphabet that can learned in a day. The grammar is VERY different to European languages (except maybe other agglutinative langs like Finnish or Turkish. The vocab is completely different except for the borrowed and Koreanized words (e.g. juice = 주스 (ju-seu), computer = 컴퓨터 (keom-pu-teo)).

I will say though that Korean is much more fun to learn. The contrast of an easy alphabet + very different language makes you feel like a genius each time you write something. The resources to learn are good (howtostudykorean.com, TTMIK, and Evita's Anki decks are brilliant) and there is a metric ton of media to practice with (addicting dramas come out every day).

Plus Korea is becoming more important these days (both Koreas) so knowing Korean will put you at an advantage job-wise. There are already tons of people who are learning Russian for business or who are native Russians. Not so with Korean.

People will tell you Korean is insanely hard. It's not, it's just different. It will take you a few months to get used to this difference but from then on it feels much more familiar.

If you need any tips please ask, I love talking about this. I might sketch up one of those resource charts when I free up some time. Here's a list of resources in the meantime:
http://www.weeklylanguage.com/2016/04/korean.html

>>76530824
>>76531153
Seems so easy.

What does Esperanto sound like spoken? I've only heard learners speak it badly. I'd guess it'd sound like of like Latin.

>>76527079
Aren't they different in context?
https://www.quora.com/If-you-can-read-Japanese-can-you-also-read-Chinese

>>76527528
howtostudykorean.com is best and it's structured well. Each sentence has audio.

For vocab search for "Evita" Anki decks, she has made two, one is grammar sentences, the other vocab. They're very very good. They both have audio.

>>76538047

Thanks, I'll look up the second source.

I'm actually a bit biased towards the first website, the first time I looked at it the guy just sounded so pretentious in saying you could learn an entire language from a single website (that doesn't even have audio...). Would rather learn from different sources.

>>76537972

Those are actually the same languages I want to learn at the moment. Korean first, Russian after.

I'm only at a beginner level right now (I know hangul, some beginner words/phrases and a tiny bit of grammar like object and topic markers).

I'm planning on building a basic foundation of vocab/grammar/speaking and then move straight into immersion.

I'd start by both passively consuming and studying children's songs/tv shows/literature and then move onto more advanced stuff.

You happen to know a source for extremely basic children's cartoons? Maybe even educational ones like Dora the Explorer, seems really good to learn imo.

Hope you don't mind the blog post, but you said you love to talk about this.

>>76534392
Quid linguae latinae studes?

>>76537995
>What does Esperanto sound like spoken? I've only heard learners speak it badly. I'd guess it'd sound like of like Latin.
Check out this guy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2R6CkjEDDs
He's kinda annoying sometimes, but I think he speaks it alright. To me Esperanto sounds like a mix between Spanish and Italian.

>>76532549
Well the PRC government did try to abolish the character at the 40s and write purely in Latin characters, if I remember it right, I guess mainly due to they were so eager to westernize at the moment but it didn't work at all and the Simplified Chinese kinda widely accepted at the 60s(yes, Simplified Chinese had short history and if they want to read anything come before the 60s, they need to have some understandings on traditional characters).

Pinyin is the relic of that moment tho it's just a teaching tool right now, maybe the traditional character will die out one day, who knows.

>>76518190
Yes, depending on your level it would be good to add subs in the spoken language too

I know this is a stupid question but I'm going to ask anyway:
Is it possible to learn a language really lopsidedly so that you can read/write/maybe-listen but not speak? Is it any faster to do it that way?

I have no real use for speaking but I'd particularly like to be able to read and write in other languages (even in English it's how I do 90% of communication), listening to foreign media would be a bonus.

>tfw my worthless attention span has left me able to phonetically read russian, japanese and a good amount of chinese without understanding a word

>>76519375
In Spanish for example words have gender and the rule is that if it ends in "a" is femenine and if it ends in "o" is masculine, there're exception though, like "día" which means 'day' and is masculine
>el día

>>76537972
Why you are learning Russian?

>>76541552
Genders are not need. All Indo-European languages have gender, but English haven't gender and it's good!

>>76523452
I've only heard it on tv so I don't even know if it's a accurate portrayal but to me it sounds a lot like the standard German, mostly from the westert part.

>>76534818
Are you that one Chilean using Duolingo? I've seen one on Reddit.

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Learning language sure is comfy. I'm really enjoying the process and I'm absolute shit at it. All these comfy apps, this comfy thread, comfy pimsleur torrents.

>>76540396
I agree the whole "everything you need" thing on the website is annoying but if you can get past that it's a brilliant resource.

>>76540640
Yeah the grammar from howtostudykorean.com is good for starting out, then moving on to Evita's grammar sentences as it's sentences people regularly use with proper construction and it's a good way to immerse yourself while still learning. All this while watching dramas or something. Don't do only grammar like I did at first because you'll end up with a good knowledge of how the language works without actually knowing enough vocab to prove it.

YouTube search for "어린이 만화" for kids shows.
This is a cool cartoon I found: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7U4Mdv9tm38hRvUjw_JFFg/featured
On the sidebar you'll see related channels and that's a good way to discover them too.

>>76541765
I'm Bulgarian so it's easy for me. My parents speak it so I can use them as practice. Sounds pretty cool too.

so what is anki and how can I use it?
and would you advise it?

>>76532945
German has more consistent pronunciation but you'll have to deal with declensions genders conjugation and a way different vocabulary (60% of English is Latin/French). It's also infinitely less useful compared to English.

>>76534702
Because they got bullied every time they tried.

>>76543954
a SRS program
read the website
very much

>>76530824
>>76531153
Made this little link list for beginners

>Lernu - free courses with exercises, overview of the grammar with examples, an active forum, a multimedia library and a dictionary
https://lernu.net/en

>Duolingo course and a discussion forum
https://www.duolingo.com/course/eo/en/Learn-Esperanto-Online

>Kurso de Esperanto - downloadable multimedia program for leaning Esperanto
http://www.kurso.com.br/

>Forvo - Esperanto pronunciation dictionary. Type a word and hear how it's pronounced.
https://forvo.com/languages/eo/

>Esperanto at Memrise
https://www.memrise.com/courses/english/esperanto/

>How to type Esperanto characters on your system
http://en.esperanto.org.nz/how-to-learn-esperanto/how-to-type-esperanto-characters

>An add-on for Chrome which allows you to write ĉ, ŝ, ĝ, ĵ and ŭ by using the x-system (for example typing "cx" will produce "ĉ")
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/anstatauxi/geffaabblpcfabmjdoipmfplglceofgj

>>76541477
I don't think there is, or even if there is it wouldn't be much different from learning it like how you would learn it without that goal in mind.Do you speak a second language?If you don't then you should know it takes a really long time to go from understanding a language to speaking it(not necessarily to write it that's a bit easier).

>>76545706
Looking at that hat I wonder how a stereotypical American would pronounce Esperanto

Ass-purr-ran-tow

>>76455326
I've been learning English for like 4 years but it seems like I stopped making further progress since like a year ago... It feels like I'm stuck at a certain level and have a huge problem breaking out of this trap and moving forward... What should I do? I've been mostly learning it on my own so I wonder if it's the problem that I don't have an English teacher...

>>76527528
You can make some Korean friends. I'm sorta certain many Koreans will be willing to help you with Korean.

>>76494482
What is it that you have trouble with? Do you find certain letters hard to pronounce?

I'm learning chinese, does anyone have tips for remembering 4000+ characters?

>>76546796
Can you travel to America or Britain? Maybe could take a trip for a few weeks? I have to imagine being in the thick of it would be the most help.

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>>76546796
Be happy since in Korea they don't focus on communication with English learning.

Listen more, talk more and learn some vocabulary.
hwaiting

>>76547282
Yes, start from childhood.

>>76547282
Print them out and stick them on your wall.

any good source for learning the basics of written chinese?

i got some flash cards, but they are very basic and not enough to construct sentences with.
using stuff like archchinese is a pain as there is too much and the search function sucks.

*lurks thread*

>>76518053
is there a good page or book for learning said 200 radicals based hongkongren?

>>76527299
link to or name of said app?

>>76549799
Not that guy but 'hellochinese'

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>>76549799
If you want to learn traditional Chinese characters rather than simplified Chinese characters, pic related offers some good ressources. The pic is a bit old now though so I have no idea if the links still work, but it's worth a shot.

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>>76549799
>>76550759
Also, pic related is a short summary of some factors that could help you decide if you want to learn traditional characters or simplified characters.

>>76459755
yeah genki is the best

>>76521088
please teach me canto, anon x

>>76546101
es-puh-ran-toe

can you believe i used to think the typical american accent was attractive.

>>76547282
We never remember the whole thing, we only remember the sound, a blurry image of its structure and the radical

>>76554124
So concerning learning how to read and write, did they teach you all you need to know in the first grade then you added on to that through time or did your education system spread the proccess through a different way.I don't know how it works over there so I'm basically trying to ask how long it took them to teach you all the characters or if you learn them on your own through time.

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>>76519862

>>76521946
>our education system never tell us how to write in Cantonese and the grammar behind it, all we know is how to write in a Mandarin way.
how different are Cantonese from Mandarin?

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>>76527528
Check also this post
>>>/t/746378

And the app PopPoppingKorean for pronunciation

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>>76549799
I can share some of my experience when I was a kid, most of us work on these workbooks as pic related, all of them are boring, prob similar to how arch chinese work.
A: focus on simple words only
B: too calligraphy-focused
C: copy boring "great work"
(I do build a hobby on copying various chinese poems, but it's like when I was 15,16, mature enough to understand it)

>>76550759
Wow the progressive exercise do cover the radical, here's the link to all of you
https://archive.org/details/progressiveexerc00bull

Just took a brief look, the text looks kinda awkward, idk, like someone is trying write some ancient chinese in his early age, but hey, you're trying to grasp some new word.

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I have such a hard time with seguir.

sigo, sigues, sigue, sequimos, seguís, seguen. I always fuck up the switch over from i to e after s. Then the i into sequimos fucks me up too.

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>>76529534

>>76530870
do so

>>76555295
Wait til you get to stuff like "me gustaría que supieses"

>>76537972
>>76540640
What did you use to learn the alphabet?
And what's the thing with Korean grammar??

I'm back with another Turkish question or two.
Can someone tell me why Uyumak and Uymak conjugate the same when talking about an object? It took me a long time to realize someone wasn't saying the shirt sleeps but rather that it fits,

>>76555295
sigo
sigues
sigue
>seguimos
seguís
>siguen

>>76544144
>Because they got bullied every time they tried.
This.

Pretty much everyone bullies the Esperanto threads/guys because is a meme language and most people think it's for super nerdy freaks, so they just give up.

Having your thread being shit all over ain't nice.

>>76556174
You are asking why it's like this for example?

Gömlek bana uyuyor.(Shirt fits me)
Kardeşim uyuyor.(My sibling is sleeping)

>>76546796
What issues do you have?
Vocabulary? Getting fluent? Pronunciation? Grammar mistakes? Polishing the edges, as to speak?

Have you tried reading english literature? Not bs books like Harry Potter, something harder.

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>>76554124
>we only remember the sound, a blurry image of its structure and the radical
But then how do you write? How do you read?
I feel like a stupid for asking, no offense bro.

>>76546796
Want to do do some sort of language exchange kinda thing? I'm learning Korean at the moment and could do with having someone I can ask some questions to. I'm a native English speaker and I study English literature so I may be able to help you with any complex questions you have. Reply to this if you're interested and I can give you my kik or something

>>76556432
Yeah, every time I saw the first example I was confused thinking they said the sleeps. The examples I saw excluded bana though which might have helped.