Cornucopia of Resources / Guide (read Guide before asking questions):
Persistence is the key to success. You CAN learn Japanese!
When I was leaving Yemen to come to America, things were tough. My dad had just been laid off, and it was a challenge. When I lived in Yemen, I thought America was a perfect place. Everything was bigger and better. I dreamed big. The American dream, you know? You have to work hard for your dream to come true.
Posted in the previous thread but, yeah.
Anyone starting out and having trouble with katakana, here's a fun exercise. Find a japanese release of an album by a band you like (rutracker is full of them) and try reading the scans. What's great about this is if you get stuck on a certain Kanji, instead of looking it up, you can continue reading, recall the name of a certain song or word you know is supposed to be there, and then associate the sound with the symbol. Plus why wouldn't you want the Japanese releases? They always have a cool extra track or two.
How do I know you're not flamebait yourself?
This is the best I've ever done in Anki in my entire life.
I see a couple SNES and PC98 games in pure Katakana, I plan on playing one just to train one of these days.
A lot of katakana like ヌ literally never fucking show up anyway, that combined with the fact that high densities of katakana is relatively uncommon in Japanese text, someone who's otherwise good at reading could easily struggle to fluidly read katakana strings. that said, not sure how much that one image would help in comparison to a whole RPG.
Please don't be mean.
What should I do after learning kana? Or, what did you do?
start with kanji, however you feel comfortable, try out several methods
start reading manga with furigana for now, dragonball is relatively easy and long
start watching drama or anime without subs looking up words by phonetics to train your ears
The only one I actually remember is Phantasy Star and I think that's genesis, my mistake.
Here's an example of a PC game with all katakana, should be obvious by what I meant of good readers struggling: https://vndb.org/v18190
It's not, it's just not an ideal method for everyone so it's a meme to shit on it.
Now Wanikani, that is actually bad, unless it's the free as in freedom anki deck that also lets you go at your own pace and is fully customizable.
It's very good at what it's trying to do (teach you how to distinguish, remember and write Kanji), but it doesn't teach you japanese. People try to use it to learn japanese, end up disappointed when it doesn't work and shit all over it.
The "optimized" part of Core's name is referring to the order of the cards, not the cards themselves. The order introduces kanji in an order that tries to build upon what you already know as best it can, tending to introduce words with kanji you know before words with new kanji (note that the optimization algoritihim wasn't perfect so if you pay attention you'll notice weird quirks). But, all in all it's pretty good, and the first 2,000 words in Core2k/6k (aka core2k) do a really good job of introducing all the uber-common kanji (1,000 to be precise), so if you did a random order not only would you make it harder to learn new kanji, you'd also be pulling words from Core6k into Core2k and that's bad (because Core6k by and large contains more "useless" words than Core2k).
I had known kana for a while already. I started seriously thinking about learning Japanese when I jumped headfirst into kanji one day on an impulse. I just kept studying something around 10 kanji a day without really thinking about what I was doing. The only thing on my mind was learning those kanji for the time being. At first I used memrise (yeah, I was clueless), then I tried KD (Hated it. Learning several kanji with the same radical in sequence made things unnecessarily confusing. Probably why I didn't even try RTK.), then some 教育漢字 anki deck I found... Anyway, I just kept shooting everywhere because every resource seemed to be lacking somewhere. I would always kept learn at least 10 kanji a day though, so it's not as if I was procrastinating or anything. Eventually I decided to make my own deck. I used the kodansha kanji learner's dictionary (a pretty good reference book) as my main reference for that and added kanji based on a frequency list in that book. I also tried adding a few words for every new kanji I learned. That gave me a decent base vocab to start off with.
Almost immediately after I picked up kanji, I also started to read Tae Kim.
I kept this routine until I felt confident enough to start reading, which happened somewhere around 600 kanji and 2/3 of Tae Kim. I also started mining for words then. This is when I really felt like I was starting to make progress. Also, this is when I started using the DOJG (blessed be that book) in full force.
After I had a considerable amount of kanji under my belt (I had long since finished Tae Kim by then) I simply dropped the kanji deck and stuck with mining. Still, I kept a separate deck for words with new kanji because I like to make at least one recall card for every kanji I learn. I finally abandoned this recall deck just the other day. Now I just enjoy Japanese and do a few minutes of recognition reps everyday.
I also started watching raw anime at some point there.
Hope that helps somehow.
Pretty much all "learning Japanese" stories end up with Anki vocabulary + consuming native material. It's nice to see justice and truth prevail.
Just to be clear, I don't think it was a bad thing to start by doing kanji individually. On the contrary. I would recommend for anyone to do the same so that they can focus on understanding radicals and how to at least give a good guess at the stroke order of a kanji. It's just that it's pointless to do all of the jouyou individually.
Like I said, I was reading and mining words before I knew even 1000 kanji. The only thing that made me keep adding cards to my individual kanji deck was habit at that point. Once I realized taking mined words with new kanji and making recall cards out of them was much more effective things became much easier for me. Some people might not even care to do recall, so that's all the more reason not to stick with individual kanji for too long.
I still don't like the idea of jumping straight into core2k though. I get the feeling, based on what a lot of people post here, that people who start just with core decks often develop the habit of just recognizing the "general shape" of the word and don't really learn to identify kanji. I think that's really bad cause it seems like it will compromise your ability to organically expand your vocab later on when you start reading.
Who /forgottodorepsbeforechuggingabottleofrobitussin/ here?
This is gonna be a pain in the ass
>first day of jap 100
>that one white kid who knows a little bit too much japanese
> literally everyone else is chinese and thinks they'll do well because they'll recognize kanji
>they can't pronounce shit
>I have no clue what's going on
>only have to memorize 60 kanji but have to do a fuckton of speaking practice
dis gon b good.
Why not do what you feel is best for you? Not everyone learns the same. I don't understand the holier than thou attitude, unless it's just annoyance at NYR people.
Anki is great, but it can also be really boring. Every DJT thread has people who dread having to do their reps. Tae Kim doesn't really explain things well, but is treated like a godly guide, when there's other pretty great (free) grammar resources available too.
It's the only thing I like but it makes language learning a little strange. Better in some ways (Ability to empathize with the speaker/japanese culture) but it directly impairs your language abilities so it's a bit of a wash.
I'm just starting out and currently I'm just learning Kanji with flashcards by having two sided cards with kani readings and the various meanings on one side and the translation on the other, i.e.
>apply, put on, put against, hold against
>to allot, call on someone
>to make a hit
The way I choose which ones to learn is just going through Tae Kim's guide, taking the newly introduced kanji in each chapter, and adding both the words that are in the guide and all the words labeled as "common" in jisho containing said kanji plus ones I learned previously. It's a slow process but I'm expecting it'll make the jump into independent reading after the guide easier. I wanted to know whether this is a terrible idea or just somewhat inefficient.
Sounds pretty good to me. Are you adding individual cards for all words or are you putting words with the same kanji in the same card?
Also, how many new words/kanji you do a day is a probably more important than any other factor in your learning method, given that you're not doing something that's simply ineffective.
By that I mean, I go into a new chapter of the guide. I find a word containing a new kanji. I add that to the deck. I then go on jisho and search for all other words containing the same kanji labeled as "common", as long as they don't contain any other kanji I don't yet know, and add them too.
Separate card for each word, as in 2 cards for 当てる, 当たる, then another 4 for both of their masu forms, etc. As for the frequency, it varies quite a bit. I'd add a substantial amount some day, and then I won't add anything 'till the amount of new cards per day decreases to something like 60. Reason is back when I had a lot of free time I tried brute forcing a shitload each day, and I'd just find my retention to be awful, so I figured I'd rather take it slower but make sure the new stuff I add actually stays.
>then another 4 for both of their masu forms, etc.
Don't do that. It's no very effective to use anki to learn grammar concepts. Just learn their dictionary forms, then learn how to conjugate verbs.
I can't think of another way of remembering which verbs are ichidan and godan though and I figure this way I simply get the verb come up twice instead of once, helping me remember it better, making it two birds with one stone.
95% of the time you can tell which is which from the verb ending, and the exceptions you will learn naturally. All you need to memorize is the differences between how they conjugate.
I'm not holier-than-thou. I just like noting that people who succeed always end up doing right way, which is consuming native material, whereas the people who fail tend to be those who don't consume native material. Anki may be boring, but the gains it provides also is a big measure of success, and it's not any more boring than the nonsense normies will put themselves through to learn a language. As for Tae Kim, the meme that's it's over-rated is something that really annoys me because it's not true, people recommend it because they used it and found success from it, nothing more; and futhermore, imabi/DOJG and recently Japanese the Manga Way (thanks to you-know-who) are usualyl mentioned in turn. You really don't see pretty much anyone saying Tae Kim is god and the best and the only thing you need, ever. The closest thing to that is people saying "just do Tae Kim and then read", which is a fair statement I think because Tae Kim is far shorter than Imabi and DOJG and therefore optimal for people wishing to read ASAP.
I go for two because I'm irresponsible. Three is absolute NG for language learning. Two makes it more fun but your comprehension obviously plummets. I'd say One is beneficial since you're less likely to mind that comprehension is a pain in the ass but you're not as impaired as you could be.
I think that even though a lot of drugs impair your ability to remember words, it's important to approach a language from as many emotional headspaces as possible.
Well, considering the massive reaction that part of my process got I guess I should delete my conjugated forms from my deck. It would make my reviews quicker, meaning I can add cards more frequently too.
I can connect them perfectly fine. The dictionary form and the conjugated form would have the same other side, except one card would have (dictionary form) at the end, and keep in mind they're double cards, meaning when I get the english side first I have to write out the thing.
Ichidan always end in iru or eru. Everything else is either godan or irregular. There are a few godan that end in eru or iru, but they are not very numerous. It's much simpler to simply know those.
Plus the "speaking practice" tends to be the teacher saying something than the students repeating it. Wow, how helpful. Steve mentions how whenever he meets French students from a language school, he can tell they all have a bad accent in the exact same way they developed from speaking primarily to each other. If you're gonna speak, do so with real natives over Skype or some such, speaking in school isn't going to help.
Huh, I'd have expected you to go for the first plateau. It's been more than a year since I've done this, but last time I did the second plateau I was already rolling around the floor with my friends.
Come to think of it, I've only ever approached Japanese while either drunk (did not work so well) or while high on cannabis (took some more concentration, but sitting outside in the sun and reading moeshit manga on a bench while high is one of the comfiest things ever).
Have fun anon.
If I upload a word to a deck in anki through a notepad document, and then move that card to another deck, if I then reupload that same notepad document, will it make a duplicate word in the first deck, as well as keeping the one in the second deck?
As with all languages you can learn to speak fine without specifically practicing it as long as you listen to natural-sounding Japanese for long enough and know what kind of speech is used in your situation, i.e. not using girly speech patterns if you're a hairy-ass man.
It'll obviously take way longer and you'll probably always have an accent, but the odds of people ending up in a situation where they need to speak the language without them seeking out such a situation voluntarily (in which case they probably have practiced speaking) are almost non-existent.
Whenever I want to say something, it feels like my brain access all the Japanese I've read and scans for something to copy/build from. So whenever I can't say something, my conclusion is that I just need to read or listen more. I'm not sure where speaking to people would help in this process.
Consume enough media and it can shape your accent correctly too though
>eastern european uni student
>go to Ireland to make some money to live off of for next year because country is an impoverished shithole
>the Irish people in the workplace genuinely think I'm American despite the groundwork of my learning of the language came from living 5 years in Ireland as a kid beforehand
What's something I can do alongside reading Tae Kim? I understand the grammar easily enough while reading the lesson and doing the excercises, but then completely blank out when I run into it in actual material. My retention for grammar rules is shit.
You just have to keep reading. The DOJG deck can help, you may want to check out "All About Particles" and "Japanese the Manga Way" but seriously, you just need to keep reading.
He's probably referring to either himself, his female dealer or his girlfriend.
It's a common practice in some forums to not refer to yourself whenever discussing illegal drugs, and use some kind of third-person pseudonym instead.
SWIM (someone who isn't me) is probably the most common form, and also the weakest one.
It's a pretty weird and specific thing that probably doesn't help you at all, but I have a mental image associated with every kana so I always take the kana that are used for the grammar and create mental scenarios that include both the associations and the function of the grammar itself.
Of course it requires unwrapping them a bit when conjugations get mixed together but in general I can remember about 80% of grammar rules pretty reliably from the first or second time I learn them. I used to suck at grammar too so I'm pretty surprised how well it has worked, the human brain is a strange-ass thing.
>that "AY" sample at the very start that sounded like Sylvester Stalone
Loving the groove. Then again I am almost as much a little slut for fade-ins as I am for sweet syths.
Hate fade-outs though.
Sounds like a generic EDM radio track with an image of a chinese catoon to go with it. Do you know what either of those buzzwords are supposed to mean?
Well, you're right, but I was literally referring to my biological mother who I live with having a lot of weed. (like wayyyyy too much for a responsible human being to have)
I'm not sure if weed effects language learning, but even if it does, whatever gets you interacting with the language is important and the fact that you'll forget whatever you learn on drugs doesn't matter. Remembering what you've forgotten is easier than learning something completely new
But is it? I understand the idea of remixes, and if they're actually transforming the track in some way, I can understand. But this is just adding a dumb "vapor" beat and someone turning down the volume on the main track occasionally. Can that really be considered music?
>But is it? [...] Can that really be considered music?
Yes, it can. Just because the remix has too little adjustemnts to a music tracks to justify his integrity as an artist in your view does not somehow transform the remix into non-music. I find it a nice touch to the track, comparing the two. Nobody is calling the remixer a genius or a master. It's just a touch that might be something some listeners might like. For god sakes, download a single by deamau5 or something. It will have a radio edit, an off vocal edit, a full edit, a slight remix, a slight remix featuring some other guy. Do you sperg out over that shit too and dismiss it all as "non-music" too?
Should all buttons (hard, good, easy) be at 6.7 months or what? I swear I feel like I can't get any. How was it for those who managed to get blue Kanji without messing with the options?
What is wrong with you? Why do you lash out? Why are you so full of hate? Why would you post something like that? I don't understand. Is there something wrong with you? Are you mad? Uh, do you feel like wolf kabob Roth vantage? Gefrannis booj pooch boo jujube; bear-ramage. Jigiji geeji geeja geeble Google. Begep flagaggle vaggle veditch-waggle bagga?
>cheats the card interval
>still has green kanji
Well my first day of doing a deck for all my suspended cards went well
>tfw gf is bragging me into learning japanese so I can read naruto as soon as it comes out
I keep telling myself it will worth it, but it's so hard
I've been at it on and off for a year and I can't read shit not have finished a single guide. I can merely take joy from the fact that letting other people know what a fucking failure I am gives them hope. Keep at it.
>Cornucopia of Resources
I could coach you people and make you successful at Japanese but in the meantime I wonder what I'd even get from this. It's not like I'd get paid or anything.
I wish I could code and shit, I could make a wanikani-style website but better and earn money for teaching plebs Japanese. Too bad I'm too lazy to learn how to code.
Anki is written in python. Anki extensions are written in python. The easiest-to-recommend source for non-programmers to learn programming teaches python. The teaching habits the author uses are compatible with the needs of ankidrones. Learning programming languages is like learning spoken languages, only like 100x easier. You can learn python, you can modify anki, you can make your dreams come true.
>I could coach you people and make you successful at Japanese
You couldn't coach me at shit. I'm sitting here with a PDF on vectorial and spatial math open at 23:34 with a beer in my hand, having no idea what any of this shit means, and a test coming up tomorrow, which I will fail, and as a consequence will not be allowed to take the exam, which in turn will result in me losing my state sponsored position. Everything I ever try I fail at. You think some coaching of yours will change me as a human being?
But the base argument was that the remix barely differs from the original. How does that make the remix as a track contained in of itself bad? That would mean the original is shit too, and if that's what you're saying, then that's merely your opinnion with nothing to back it and isn't even part of the argument here.
I'll bookmark this but I'll probably never do it. Thanks anyway anons.
Make people's lives more successful is what I do for a living. I could totally make your life better believe it or not. The sad truth is I am not sure it'd be worth it for me to do that for you. I love helping people but I can't help everyone. I'm not Shirou.
>want to try watching an anime raw this season but too afraid of not understanding any of it
Is Dagashi Kashi (4chan being fucky and won't let me post it in hiragana) decent? Maybe I'll feel a bit more confident going into it if I read the source material first.
Damn, I read all of Tae's guide over the course of a week and can't remember any of it. Maybe I should be just used an anki grammar deck and a list of Japanese particles and conjugations.
>over the course of a week
There's your problem. Have you tried taking it slower? Taking notes also helps.
If you're going to do an anki deck do the dojg one. Learning through example sentences is the best way anki can help you with grammar.
I also don't suggest having a list of particles and conjugations by your side. That'll only make you lazy.
I suck at grammar, and kim tae just doesn't help me.
I find it too obtuse for me, I'm not all the intelligent but I do want to get better at Japanese, anyone got any other big grammar reference sites or materials that are clear?
Because I like anime and don't want to miss stuff. If it's something that's mediocre like a lot of seasonal anime is and I read the source material beforehand though then I guess it doesn't matter.
Genki, Manga the Japanese the Manga Way and Visualizing Japanese Grammar should be more accessible. I haven't tried Genki personally though, but I think it's the most comprehensive of the three.
I am the same, I think is because I have this small amount of pride that doesn't stop me from knowing I am terrible at stuff but also goes "You will definitely know you are stupid as fuck if you try your hardest and fail"
You're not watching the anime with the intent of trying yourself or even of understanding everything. You're only doing it as practice. The only way you can fail is by not doing it.
>The only way you can fail is by not doing it.
If you're gonna do it twice I'd recommend the other way around. This way he makes sure he enjoys the anime without having to worry about missing what's going on and still gets a break when trying to listen to the raws later since he already knows what's coming.
It's not the case of feeling shame for me, but rather being afraid of the frustration I will feel once I start putting in effort only to see myself getting no returns due to everything going over my head. Nothing is more frustrating than trying hard and genuinely wanting to learn something only to realise your effort was for nothing after applying what you were learning into practice and being completely stumped.
It doesn't matter if the "meme" annoys you because it's accurate. Tae Kim's grammar guide IS subpar and beginners will be confidently progressing much more efficiently if they were suggested to read Japanese: The Manga Way and watch the video lessons at the Washington university visualizing japanese grammar website, then reviewing with the DoJG Anki deck.
That is a far more practical approach that covers the poor explanations and gaps in the grammar guide at guidetojapanese.org.
You gotta do your best and believe your efforts will pay off. The payoff won't come right away, it will take a lot of listening practice until you can get somewhere, but you can't give up just like that. This >>135805352 kind of attitude is the only thing stopping you from getting better. I'm not even trying to be a positive guy or anything. I just really believe any moron will eventually get used to and feel comfortable with listening after enough practice. It's just a matter of having the will to push through.
Also, don't feel the need to watch something like you normally would. I'd often take over an hour to watch something raw because I'd keep rewinding the video trying to understand what people were saying and looking up words. It's much more efficient to do it this way.
>I'd often take over an hour to watch something raw because
And by something I mean a 24 minute episode of course. It wouldn't be strange to take over an hour to watch a 2 hour long movie.
That's just wrong. Tae Kim is a fine introductory guide. Not sufficient, but more comprehensive than JtMW and those other sources you mentioned. If you don't like Tae Kim that's fine, but it works for a lot of people and it's pretty efficient too. I'm not saying he's god almighty and the only road to Japanese, but it's certainly a reliable road.
What the hell is intermediate hell? What are the requirements? I've been learning for two years now and I still feel like I'm in beginner hell. My vocab is probably at 1500, I know 1000 kanji. But when I turn on an anime or try to read something with long sentences I can't understand a damn thing.
1. 橋本が言っていたけど、中島さんは踊らないって。According to Hashimoto, Mr. Nakashima is not going to dance.
Who is talking? Is it Nakashima who said that he isnt going to dance, then Hashimoto said it to the reader? The って particle at the end.
>who is it quoting?
2. 休みの内によく寝ておきます。I'll sleep a lot during the vacation.
おきます generally means "left as such"? Help me make sense of this translation.
3. 子供が学校に行っている内に本を読みます。I read books while my child is away at school.
Why isnt it the kids that are reading the book? Is it the が particle and not a は particle the reason? Doesnt the 行っている mean while they are heading for school? Isn't reading while walking dangerous?
>My vocab is probably at 1500
>I know 1000 kanji
And you're still wondering why you can't understand shit? You'll be in intermediate hell once you can generally read shit but you never stop running into words you don't know and less frequently, but still very often, into kanji you don't know.
Also, those numbers are very low for 2 years. You should start putting in a little bit more effort.
Yea I've been off and on. I only really study during breaks in school. But now I'm gonna try to keep it up through the semester. Need to succeed this time to impress my Japanese friend.
Can we stop meming for once? Why does that shit need to mentioned in every other post.
Summer vacation right now.
I get up, read, eat, and give myself an hour of 4chan a day before going back to sleep.
Before starting the next term I'd like to increase my vocab by at least 10,000 words.
Intermediate hell is when you see no noticeable improvement in your grasp of the language no matter how much effort you put in. The improvement is there it's just not noticeable compared to the huge mountain you need to climb.
A beginner will feel like a fucking hero after the first volume of manga. Someone in intermediate hell can finish 10 VNs and still feel no closer to fluency
>try to read without a crutch
>scenario A: you struggle through and continue
>scenario B: there's something that you don't know, so you plug it into an aide, like Rikai
>sometimes, when you're really tired, you just jump straight to scenario B, which can turn into a glorified machine translation if you're not careful
>scenario C occurs: you read it intuitively without really giving it any thought
>mind reacts like you've just used a glorified machine translation, because it was zero effort
>think for a split second that you need to remove the crutch and focus on the real text
>you were focusing on the real text
Download Genki 1 and do it all, one chapter a week will be a good pace afer hitting chapter 3
Write Kanji all the fucking time but Grammar at the beginning of each chapter is just as important. READ IT, and TEST YOURSELF!
If there is anything you do wrong after checking your answers, read more and redo
till its 100% correct 100% of the time
Thats what I did at least
988 reviews. I haven't touched anki in about two months. Luckily a lot of cards still haven't shown up for review because they'd been that mature. Since anki only shows 1000+ due I assumed I'd have over 3000 reviews waiting for me. Then I did twenty or so and I was pleasantly surprised. This is pretty doable.
He only talked about the dark side of intermediate hell. The bright side is that most of the content that you might take an interesting is pretty accessible to you. It's not as if you're just working for the day when it's all going to pay off. You're enjoying the pay off then and there as you work.
When applying the discount code "wanikani heart textfugu" on a year subscription on Wanikani, it brings the total down to $50 for a year. However, it also has a category labeled "Good for" with "forever" being the value. What exactly does this indicate? Does it mean that in 1 year, should I decide to renew, that it will again be priced at $50 for a year?
this so much
i found myself reading some text and not needing to internally translate it into english to make sense of it.
shit sneaks up on you. i thought reading with rikai (w/anki reviews after) would turn me into a rikaibot but it actually works.
Here's a pretty extensive description of all the different おく usages. Even if you don't feel like reading the whole thing you can benefit from looking at the example sentances and the surrounding comments.
>3. 子供が学校に行っている内に本を読みます。I read books while my child is away at school.
Why isnt it the kids that are reading the book? Is it the が particle and not a は particle the reason? Doesnt the 行っている mean while they are heading for school? Isn't reading while walking dangerous?
Reading this quick jsut going before bed, I'd say it is because は not being present and therefore the topic of the sentece defaults to what is implied, which is often and in this case, the person saying this.
This being implied
The kids are heading to school (right now)
内here means "my home", can also mean "my family" or even "me" when used by kawaii gals
Im sure you already knew this not sure why I wrote it, fuck
Basically, が is not replacing は as a particle, the topic (which は is used to point to) is implied in this sentence. Get used to this, as whoever and what you are talking about will almost always be implied as long as the topic does not change. And coincidentally: just blurting out 「本を読みます」implies that YOU (the person saying it) does/will do so... And if it was a question it would be implied the reciever of the question is the implied topic, and yada yada yada...
Sorry that became long
What are some games which you played in Japanese? It might not help my studies all that much, but it's cute.
Anki: 30 minutes. Used to be 60 but I'm never going that high again I hope.
Reading: At least 15 minutes lately. Sometimes several hours. I'd like to get it to at least an hour consistently.
Listening: Nothing really, but I'm trying to listen more when I watch subbed anime.
内に means "while" or "during" in this case, indicating the span of their being at school. うちに when referring to one's home or family is much more often written 家に if written in kanji.
As >>135809702 said, the 行っている means they went, and are currently there.
So now equipped with my glorified rubber domes, I've made a small amount of progress on the guide, but I've also reached one of the most crucial parts (one of the reasons why I even decided to write a new one): Learning Kanji (vs. Learning Kanji through vocab)
I'd be glad to get some feedback on that part since I'm not really sure if it's extensive enough or even comprehensible.
You'll find it towards the end of the document, as always, feel free to comment right here or in the document. Your feedback is highly appreciated.
Core 6k: 30-60 minutes
Reading: 15 minutes to 5 hours
Listening: Just what I get from subbed anime, for the most part. I'm not going to pour a lot of effort into listening until my vocabulary passes the 10k mark.
Writing: Just started production practice yesterday, so it's too early to say
I only started a month or two ago and I've almost maxed two classes. I haven't been playing much at all recently though because I've been studying and watching anime. I don't know what shit they added since launch but it seems to be pretty tame as far as grinding goes though it is an MMO at the end of the day.
So I noticed something today after my reps.
Both the "Nihongoshark" and "Japanese Dark" systems advocate placing furigana (and even audio) on the front of vocab cards, with only the english definition and example sentence on the back.
What are the drawbacks of this, vs. the "only kanji on the front" default method of Core?
Could it be that it's a better way? What do you think, /djt/?
If I start studying like, right now...
How long will it take me to reach, say, N5-level proficiency?
Setting up IME on
Really like how it shows hiragana and katakana in-line with my other languages.
Is there a difference between standard QWERTY (U.S. in pic related) and Romaji? Would it make sense to disable either U.S. or Romaji in the settings? Would that affect things like spell-checking when I am writing in English?
I imagine it'll make doing your reps and reading material with furigana easier, while making reading material without furigana more difficult. Reading material with furigana is pretty painless to begin with so that's not what I would focus my attention on.
Romaji uses a different encoding. They're English characters, but use the same spacing as full-width kanji.
I just disable Romaji in my settings. Saves headaches with encoding.
Pic's my JCAT after doing literally nothing but english-subbed anime for a year, then starting to "learn" japanese and failing very miserably.
That makes sense.
Looking at it some more, it seems they provide not just the reading but also the meaning of all kanji on the front as well. Thinking about it, those "systems" also feature RTK-style dedicated kanji study (meaning to kanji), so maybe they believe that will make up for it?
I was struggling with core 2k because I could remember the meaning of the kanji in english but could'nt spell it. Then i tried wanikani free trial and it does'nt even show me the reading. Am I supposed to just memorize the meaning and go to the next one?
That's a good reason to keep that shit disabled then, thanks.
Kinda confusing to go from two keyboard layouts to 5, not to mention actually typing kana.
ｂｕｔ ｏｎ ｔｈｅ ｂｒｉｇｈｔ ｓｉｄｅ ｉ ｃａｎ ｈａｖｅ ｔｈｅ ｍｅｍｅ ｌｅｔｔｅｒｓ ｎｏｗ．
Aren't you still on the radical section? On each level you have to pass the radical section before advancing to the kanji section, which you have to pass to advance to the vocabulary section.
Please don't actually stick with WK, it might be tempting at first but at the end of the day you're going to have just as many reviews as core but be going slower because its SRS system is worse.
Do something that forces you to use a lot of numbers. Try doing math in Japanese. Try telling the time in Japanese every time you look at the clock. Try saying every number you run across in Japanese, even if it's just in your head.
Motivation Lost! I have been working on Japanese for 3 years. Only about 30 minutes per day. I took the JLPT N5 last year and failed. I recently starting taking practice tests for the N5, and I have been doing just as poorly, so it seems like I will fail again. My motivation has completely left me. I feel like I haven't made any progress, even though I had a great trip to Japan where people actually talked to me in Japanese. I was hoping some of you would be willing to share stories of your own pain and redemption along the path of fluency. Advice would be most welcome too.
Anyone who's done pure self-studying for a while here?
I'm thinking about starting but I don't know how successful I can get by myself. Don't really know anyone to practice with.
I took Jap 1 for fun a couple years ago but only know half my kana now. Any tips not on the stick links?
Can you read in Japanese? I mean. If I gave you a baby tier LN like Oreimo would you be able to just sit down, follow the text and understand what's happening? Even if you came across many unfamiliar words here and there and maybe had to check the dictionary occasionally, would you be able to just look at the text and read it?
If the answer is no. What the hell have you been doing these three years? I wouldn't tell you to give up because you've clearly been doing something wrong, which means you still have a chance if you start doing things right.
>Anyone who's done pure self-studying for a while here?
I suspect the majority have.
>I'm thinking about starting but I don't know how successful I can get by myself.
As successful as you care to get. Learning langauges isn't difficult, it's just a matter of putting enough time in to get used to them.
It's implicit that you had no choice, and since you had no choice you must've been bothered by it because otherwise you would've structured your sentence in such a way that didn't include you.
You have to realize that out of all the possible ways to say tom called maria, that sentence specifically makes light of the fact that you weren't involved in the action, and why would you do that if not for your annoyance/lack of control?
The japanese are vague bastards, that sentence structure is the closest you can get to saying you're pissed off while not offending anyone directly.
>asking other people what order to do the routes in
Fucking stupid. It pretty much never matters. You need to do all routes to get the complete story, anyways.
Blonde (as usual) > Flower hairpin > Ponytail > Redhead > the other two
People who sincerely believe this piss me off because the standard of living here is quite high, at least show some respect to the billions born off worse by not cursing, what, poor health care? Be glad you're born in a country that even has function hospitals, holy crap.
What's baffling are those people who use machine translation routinely, but don't take the extra step to just learn Japanese. I've literally seen people in the VN threads on /vg/ brag about their machine translating skills.
It's like "You realize that what you do all the time is literally almost all that you have to do to learn Japanese, right? Just spend a month getting through kana and Tae Kim, and put a bit of effort into remembering what you see." I mean, you really should be using anki, but just using a text hooker properly will get you there eventually.
If you look through their bragging veneer you'll see the truth. Firstly, they don't know any kanji, and that's always the big obstacle to someone starting Japanese. Secondly, the tend to just look at translated english in the texthooker, so it's not like they're looking up words. Thirdly, most of the bragging comes from knowing some sex words like イク, ちんぽ, まんこ, etc. and thereby being able to navigate through sex scenes without needing a texthooker.
It's doubtlessly faaaaar less work to stick to something like that than to seriously tackle Japanese.
>Thirdly, most of the bragging comes from knowing some sex words like イク, ちんぽ, まんこ, etc
Slightly colorblind but I think I know who you're referring to.
Blue is the worst because she's a reiclone aka she speaks like an idiot if she speaks at all. completely ridiculous considering she was marketed as the main heroine.
Black is indeed the best heroine, tied with Blonde.
Red is kind of unusual, she's basically a delinquent character who's not hostile. I put her in the middle too.
Pink is obsessed with taking photographs but her energy is nice. Seeing her excess genki in a relationship was nice.
Blonde is tied for best girl, she's a motherly senpai and has god-tier sex scenes and dere. Black is the only one who's better at dere.
Orange... eh. She's boring, that's all there is to say on the matter. Childhood friend, nice swimsuit, nothing really interesting.
Yea, the practice test had a section on it. One question wanted the English equivalent of いく and a few questions later it wanted the English equivalent of ゆく.
I originally thought いく = live, because ゆく = to go. Turns out they both were supposed to be "to go".
Electricity - check
Internet - check
Can leave home without fear of death - check
Zero chance of starving due to prevalence of soup kitchens and food in general - check
Passes all my checks
Machine translations are miserable, though. It's like drinking rum into you pass out (minus the deliciousness and the pleasure of being drunk), sleeping just long enough to become severely hungover, and then trying to engage in some sort of mentally challenging task. You're stumbling blindly through a fog-covered forest with a massive heachache, trying think of how to move forward without having the mental faculties to do so.
Kanji can be learned from the text hooker method. Again, you just need to pay attention.
When talking about the net sum of effort and enjoyment, learning Japanese is undoubtedly more cost-efficient. It's more work in the beginning, but as you approach maybe 1k kanji and 2k words, the ease will begin to overtake the effort, and it'll only improve from there. This isn't even accounting for the satisfaction of increasing your knowledge in the language.
Im not making any claims that Japan is better, and I dont dismiss the importance of gratefulness, but if you can't look for better things and strive for it then I dont know what to say.
Sorry for being unnecessarily rude to you.
The JLPT N5 doesn't have sections like that, it has vocab, grammar and listening. Whether or not you get the vocab words served as english, kanji or kana is pretty random.
The いく、ゆく thing: Don't overthink it. Look at the context of the question. If you look at the practice tests here, there really shouldn't be a question where the meaning is ambiguous. http://www.jlpt.jp/e/samples/n5.html
Sure, but you're underestimating how far people will go to expend 0 effort on something even if it makes their lives shittier.
Even if they paying attention starting now it would still be like a year, probably two / three years before they could read comfortably without assistance. That's too long for them.
He didn't say anything not wanting improvement. It's just yourwith third world countries is ridiculous. Your standards of living are comparatively some of the best in the world.
Has anyone else been using loadbalancer and notice their mature retention rate dropping? I've been using it for around two months and my mature retention rate has plummeted a little over 10%. I'm thinking it might be maturing cards too fast. Pressing hard doesn't seem to space them that far from good.
I decided to play through the その花弁 series and I started taking notes towards the end of game 2. Just started game 4. For some reason I skipped taking notes regarding 珠玉 but that collection starts now!
anyone else here /devo/ from 600 usd gold shekels for my VR waifu® laifu™
>buying gen 1 VR
I'll just wait for gen 2 or 3 and get it for half the price at higher resolution/frame rate and a bunch of new tech
Or get one of the other VR headsets when they are all released
>he thinks they'll be a gen2 with this launch price
>no more language barrier
You can translate but that's no substitute for cultural knowledge. But for that you'd need to be educated which this creepy faggot clearly isn't.
I wonder how many shots were edited out of them running away and looking disgusted.
its ok they might sell to the simulator crowd or the plebs that rushed out and bought tablets
incidentally i just past 大丈夫 in anki the other day and read that without thinking, creepy
Remember that a dose of WaniKani a day will keep dekinai in check.
>1 month ago
>"Gee, I wish the RTK shitposting would stop."
>1 month later
>RTK shitposting has mostly stopped
>Wanikani shitposting/shilling is at an all time high
Be careful what you wish for.
Either they've single-handedly created true neural network AIs and miniaturised them into pocket form, or it's a glorified Google translate combined with Siri style voice recognition and a voice synthesiser, something you could whip up as an app for your phone in about 5 minutes.
The translations are completely fake. There's absolutely no way you could get something like that in this day and age. There's a small chance they didn't just hire some girls to act amazed while a man with a Go-pro strapped to his head pretended to talk to them.
Given how they didn't react at all to the guy saying "kiss", and then flipped out about "キッス" 2 seconds later, I'd guess it's totally fake.
>RTK is useless
>WaniKani is useful
This is key
So, I've started Core 2k/6k a month ago but I have some question about anki:
1. What does review limit 9999 do?
2. Should I use the 'review ahead' options?
3. Is cramming bad for long-term memory?
4. What is loadbalancer and what does it do?
1 - stops reviews from being limited to 100. In short, you do ALL the cards you need to WHEN you need to, instead of pushing them off and accumulating a ton of work you'll never be able to finish.
2- No. If you want to do more work, do "review forgotten cards" - it'll improve your retention for the next few days and target words you struggled on.
3 - Debatable.
4 - Ignore it, if you don't quit anki and build up 20000 reviews, which of course is a huge fuck up, it's irrelevant to you.
>1. What does review limit 9999 do?
Increases the amount of reviews you can do per day to 9999
>2. Should I use the 'review ahead' options?
If you want to
>3. Is cramming bad for long-term memory?
>4. What is loadbalancer and what does it do?
Useless addon to anki. Moves reviews around so you don't sometimes get days where you have 50 more reviews than usual
>1. What does review limit 9999 do?
your cards will pile up based on how you set the time in anki (again, hard, good) and won't pile up over time if you complete the deck. this helps retention immensely.
generally, expect a little over 10 times the amount of new cards per day in reviews.
>2. Should I use the 'review ahead' options?
>3. Is cramming bad for long-term memory?
>4. What is loadbalancer and what does it do?
it supposedly eases the load of anki decks. i personally have had very bad luck (>>135817480) with it with regards to my retention. don't use it.
Anon who has done Mayuri, Amane, Kururi and Sakurako's routes here.
I read Yui's entire route today. It took a lot of focus, but somehow I managed it. It was a pretty good route and I definitely see why it's recommended to save for last. I think if I liked Yui more and Sakurako's route didn't resonate so strongly with me then it would've been my favorite route so far. It also confirmed a couple more of my theories and is beginning to tie up the story/mystery, but there are still some questions left unanswered. Onto Suzuno's route tomorrow. Looks like I'll be able to finish Flyable Heart tomorrow or the day after.
>Only about 30 minutes per day.
Here's an interesting idea: have you considered doing more than that?
Please, someone translate this for me. The manga condition is set as Collectible - Good
Google translate says something about wound with burning the body
Tae Kim's guide is in no way more comprehensive than JtMW and VJG. Look up what the word means. Fucking fanboys.
You know the reason why the same collection of basic problems are posted over abd over again? Because people use TK's grammar guide as their only basic resource.
It is a far les reliable road to take than the alternative mentioned. Imabi is better for beginners than TK.
It has little to no text and is mostly out of print. Hard to get.
Im learning japanese and someday I will know what is says.
Try actually putting in the work.
Literally the only way to be that bad after three years of study is if you're not putting in a proper effort. A Narutard screaming sand jutsus in his Naruto headband and who looks at raw manga chapters once per week without understanding what's going on could pass the N5. It's basically nothing.
>30 minutes per day
Either you were doing something completely retarded, or I'm calling bullshit. You put in 30 minutes per day twice per week, or you haven't been doing the 30 minutes per day for the entirety of those three years.
Aha. This is the photo attached to it.
>Please, someone translate this for me. The manga condition is set as Collectible - Good
>Google translate says something about wound with burning the body
it says:" The pleasure to be cummed inside"
ok srsly. "The cover is mostly in good condition. There are some volumes with yellowish stain but readable without problems. please rest assured and buy our shit"
>Can you read a book?
depends on the language
>can you take a pic out your window
I opened a LN and read some of it.
I opened an anime and watched some of it.
I opened a VN and read some of it.
I opened a JRPG and I played some of it.
I didn't struggle.
I think, for the first time in close to two years, I'll spend my day playing video games and just having a good time, instead of studying. Maybe I don't have to study anymore.
I've recently finished learning all the kana and began reading Tae Kim for the grammar. I'm just sort of wondering what exactly the best way to go about using Anki. Should I just jump right in to the core deck, or should I be using a deck that goes with the book I'm using for grammar? So if anyone has any Anki advice as far as decks go, it'd be really appreciated; I just want a deck I can see through to the end and actually learn alot from and I'm feeling overwhelmed by the options.
(Also, is KanjiDamage actually awful? Because I've seen it being shat on, but I was also considering using their Anki deck along with my main deck if I find I have the time, which I probably won't.)
>Who is your favorite girl?
You are right, I am extremely shameful, I typed it out while listening to
To make sure I got the quote right. I also forgot the やがる. I did not do a good job. Are you finland?
I have somewhat deified you as someone who knows what they're talking about. So when he corrected me and was wrong (to some degree) I thought "has Finland finally snapped and been wrong about something?", but not it was not you. Your legend lives on in my heart for another day.
I usually just correct simple things I'm 99% sure about. I also never explain grammar since I don't know the grammar rules
I thought about pointing out the だ but got busy shitposting elsewhere
Sakurako over Yui? I've never seen such shit taste. What the fuck is wrong with you? Yui is the most amazing, beautiful, cheerful girl ever, while Sakurako is nice I guess but pretty boring and the first half of her route is crap. Screw you.
>digging through 2ch threads to see what the Japanese fans are saying about things
>they're about as boring as people who bring back information about Japanese fans would lead you to believe
>find myself wondering why I'm not just reading VNs
jesus, even when the japs kill themselves they're cute